Not because ACORN has been tied to a specific political party and movement, and has a recent history of hiring people who — coincidentally, of course — are thereafter indicted for voter registration fraud.
Those are merely anomalies.
And not because the census has moved under the Executive, and Obama has a teeny-weeny tendency to allocate which people should be getting whose money.
No, this is because she’s a wild-eyed extremist who sees left-wing conspiracies in the creamy center of her deviled eggs.
Probably doesn’t even believe in trying to save the earth’s delicate ecosystem from the vile pestilence that is human life and activity. The bitch:
Outspoken Republican Rep. Michele Bachmann says she’s so worried that information from next year’s national census will be abused that she will refuse to fill out anything more than the number of people in her household.
In an interview Wednesday morning with The Washington Times “America’s Morning News,” Mrs. Bachmann, Minnesota Republican, said the questions have become “very intricate, very personal” and she also fears ACORN, the community organizing group that came under fire for its voter registration efforts last year, will be part of the Census Bureau’s door-to-door information collection efforts.
“I know for my family the only question we will be answering is how many people are in our home,” she said. “We won’t be answering any information beyond that, because the Constitution doesn’t require any information beyond that.”
Shelly Lowe, a spokeswoman for the U.S. Census Bureau, said Mrs. Bachmann is “misreading” the law.
She sent a portion of the U.S. legal code that says anyone over 18 years of age who refuses to answer “any of the questions” on the census can be fined up to $5,000.
The Constitution requires a census be taken every 10 years. Questions range from number of persons in the household and racial information to employment status and whether anyone receives social services such as food stamps.
Mrs. Bachmann said she’s worried about the involvement of ACORN, the Association of Community Organizers for Reform Now, in next year’s census.
To be fair, the article is a bit sloppy — which may render it a bit misleading. For instance, who is the “she” who “sent a portion of the U.S. legal code that says anyone over 18 years of age who refuses to answer “any of the questions” on the census can be fined up to $5,000″ — Rep Bachmann or Census Bureau spokesman Shelly Lowe?
And the $5000 fine? Not so much:
CHAPTER 7 – OFFENSES AND PENALTIES
SUBCHAPTER II – OTHER PERSONS-HEAD-
Sec. 221. Refusal or neglect to answer questions; false answers-STATUTE-
(a) Whoever, being over eighteen years of age, refuses or willfully neglects, when requested by the Secretary, or by any other authorized officer or employee of the Department of Commerce or bureau or agency thereof acting under the instructions of the Secretary or authorized officer, to answer, to the best of his knowledge, any of the questions on any schedule submitted to him in connection with any census or survey provided for by subchapters I, II, IV, and V of chapter 5 of this title, applying to himself or to the family to which he belongs or is related, or to the farm or farms of which he or his family is the occupant, shall be fined not more than $100.
(b) Whoever, when answering questions described in subsection (a) of this section, and under the conditions or circumstances described in such subsection, willfully gives any answer that is false, shall be fined not more than $500.
(c) Notwithstanding any other provision of this title, no person shall be compelled to disclose information relative to his religious beliefs or to membership in a religious body.
Refusal to answer question can lead to a $100 fine — presumably per question refused — so this is still a problem and a potential financial burden, especially given that the Census these days includes questions concerning race, social service receipt, employment status, etc. And this is precisely the kind of information that, in the age of identity politics and interest group panders, should not be provided to a group like ACORN, which has close ties to the President and to a particular political affiliation.
Me? I’ll let them know how many people are living in the house.
Beyond that? I’ll let them know how to make a really creamy deviled egg filling, nothing more.
From what I’m reading across the blogosphere, we may very well see civil disobedience on a national scale with the census.
Which would be a nice adjunct to the TEA party movement.
Um, why does the government want to know what my
volkrace is?Wait — I still have readers?
SWEET!
Bitch needs to get a sense of humor. Or so I’m repeatedly being told.
I love deviled eggs. I want one of those antique deviled egg plates. That’s kind of gay isn’t it?
paprika!
Race? Wigger.
I’m not very enthused about the census to where it’s hit or miss that I’ll get around to filling anything out. It’s getting to where it’s embarrassing to say you live in California.
The $5k ref sounds like a scare tactic. Kinda like standing in front of a polling place with a club, or calling a lawyer and telling him he has an hour to resign.
Revenuers enthused.
So, say 50 questions unanswered x $100.00 fine per unanswered question =
$5000.00 per person x Mass Movement refusing to answer the questions numbering, say, 100,000,000 people =
$500,000,000,000.00 =
a little less than halfway to covering the nominal one-third Obama Universal Health Care Plan projected.
And no new tax required.
Revenuers, what’ll they think of next?
It’s getting to where it’s embarrassing to say you live in California.
Getting? I’m pretty sure we’re already there.
I am going to seriously fuck with the census taker when he/she comes ’round. I am going to let the census taker know that I am fucking with him/her. I am going to tell him/her the reason that I am fucking with him/her is because Barry Obozo and his posse are fucking with us.
Stupid??? Maybe…but it’ll make me feel better.
From Article 1, sec. 2 of the US constitution, at http://www.usconstitution.net/xconst_A1Sec2.html
“(Representatives and direct Taxes shall be apportioned among the several States which may be included within this Union, according to their respective Numbers, which shall be determined by adding to the whole Number of free Persons, including those bound to Service for a Term of Years, and excluding Indians not taxed, three fifths of all other Persons.) (The previous sentence in parentheses was modified by the 14th Amendment, section 2.) The actual Enumeration shall be made within three Years after the first Meeting of the Congress of the United States, and within every subsequent Term of ten Years, in such Manner as they shall by Law direct.”
Now, I’m pretty sure that the Pelosi-Reid congress never passed any law giving the executive authority to oversee the census; especially since Booooosh! was still President until a few months ago, and no law has been passed since the O!ne ascended to the throne…
In fact, this is precisely the kind of executive “power grab” that would have led to giant paper mache head marches, burnings in effigy, and a complete, utterly breathless, hand-wringing session among the left wing of the blogosphere and MSM, not to mention the nutroots heads exploding everywhere…
But when Obama decides to sidestep the constitution; no problem, after all his Judgement!, Ethics!, Brilliance!, and motivations are beyond question…
But even if that were all true, ACORN’s most certainly are not. They are under investigation in 12 or more states for voter fraud, and we’re going to let them anywhere near the means of gerrymandering congressional representation in favor of the democrats for years to come?
I don’t think so…
It’s high time someone sued the administration over this grab and send the matter to the suprememe court-before the balance gets shifted to the left; and stop King Obama from appointing yet another czar to afford his skirting the constitution…
Could this be what Godel was referring to in the link geoffb posted on another thread; the way to legally install a fascist state where none was intended through the perversion of our system?
Sounds very Alinsky to me…
Is there a check box for “Get the hell off my porch”?
Yah know, I ran across and article where an IRS manager admitted they were having some difficult conversations with people about their taxes, because, inevitably, the audited would mention “Tim Geithner.”
So, I wonder if dropping “Michelle Bachman” into the conversation would have a somewhat chilling effect on those who would seek to impose penalties for refusing to answer questions beyond “there are X number of people living in this household…”
Yeesh…should read: “I ran across an article…”
You’re posting? I’m sorry, I only read people on Twitter now.
Because I now have the attention span of a crack-smoking gnat.
Well, some of Jeff’s sentances are more than 140 characters!
I now have the attention span of a crack-smoking gnat.
It’s really not cool to post under other people’s names, nishi.
How many people even know about this unprecidented move by the Executive Branch of Government taking control of the Census and handing it over to a partisan hackjob if the press doesn’t report it? MSM outlets obviously do not care they are too busy panting breathlessly comparing him to God and writing 5000 word stories on him swatting a fly.
#20
Ouch. I felt that one over here.
tWitr rUlZ!!! eleventy!!!
That’s the most fucked in the head thing I’ve read in many many moons. Would love to see Bernard starve to death under a bridge I think. I think that would be beautiful and very very noble of him.
How about “taking the 5th” seeing almost any information they garner could be used for prosecution in the eyes of our “carbon neutrality” overlords…
Just come to the door in a hockey mask – have a chain saw running in the front room and tell the Census taker – “sure, would you like to come in and get my answers?”
That or just mutter about chianti and fava beans…ffffff!
I’ll tell them my ethic background.
Me: I’m native American
Census taker: You mean you are an American Indian
Me: I am not currently an enrolled member of any Federally recognized tribe but I am a native American.
Ad Infinitum.
NOYFB is a handy acronym for nosy bureaucrats.
We should all lie in the hopes they fuck up the re-districting.
Here’s your script:
Household: 13 of us live up in here, but don’t tell the landlord or I’ll kill you.
Race: I’m half black just like our lord, savior in cheif. Voted for him six times last November. Got paid like a mothafucker. Love them ACORNs baby!
Government subsidy: Hell yes I’m on welfare. Shit. I have 12 baby mammas! Could you pass me dat pack of Kools over there? Them just like the ones Obama smoke.
Occupation: Just layin back in the cut right now. I had a job, but them crackers and
JewsZionists laid a brother off.Health care: I join a union, I get to keep my Medicaid?
Denounced and all, but that shit could work. New “blue” districts voting red all over the place.
We went through the same thing a while back. For some reason we always get picked for the “tell us your life story” followup. The little twirp assigned to us would stand outside and bang on our door until he finally gave up. A friend who had worked for the census told us to ignore it, but Mr. Twirp threatened us with the 5,000 dollar fine. He was a little taken aback when my boyfriend asked to whom we should mail the check. In the end, I called the Bureau and the (very, no sarcasm) helpful lady told me to answer the questions that didn’t seem intrusive to me. I did, and that wasw that. I might add that I made the argument mentioned above; the purpose of the census is to count people. It’s not to find out my ancestry, my income level or how many bathrooms I have.
I’m generally in support of the Census. It provides tons of useful information, not only for the government, but to private industry and academia as well.
And most folks who work for the Census are not some hippie ACORN types. They’re just folks looking for a job.
Having said that, I’m deeply troubled by the White House’s “oversight” of the Census, and strongly suspect they will try to massage the data, and I’d hardly be surprised to see a backdoor attempt at statistical sampling.
Oh, I’d pretty much guarantee they’ll try the old “statistical adjustments” routine. That’s a big lefty fave.
Like the man said, “Lies, damned lies and statistics.”
“Like the man said, “Lies, damned lies, statistics and Democrats.â€
TFTFY
[…] ACORN. Speaking of Tom Petters, here’s a quick sketch I did on Tuesday of Tom Petters “Minn. lawmaker vows not to complete Census†– proteinwisdom.com 06/19/2009 Not because ACORN has been tied to a specific political party and […]
On race — I look Caucasian, but I haven’t checked anything but “multiracial” or “mixed” or “other” for years. And if those aren’t available, I write in “Human.”
…we may very well see civil disobedience on a national scale…
Sometimes you have to stand up, people.
“ALL questions must be answered truthfully!”
“I asnwerd all the questions.”
“No you didn’t! Most of them have ‘NOYFB’ written in!”
“Yeah, that’s the answer, and it truly is ‘none of your fucking business’…”
This might be another one where I invite the ACORN/Census takers in, cook them frittatas while trying to convert them to scientology or Ron Paul or something, excuse myself to take a leak, come out of the bathroom nude, and then ask them off hand to help me move a dead body up from the basement.
What?
It works. Those Mormon door knocker kids ain’t been back.
Over at LGF, most of the commenters think Bachmann is a moron. Still, they are somewhat disturbed.
I mean about the census.
Everybody knows Mormons don’t like frittatas, LYBD. Jeez.
“Sometimes you have to stand up, people.”
Huh.
I thought Rosa Parks sat down.
Either way, Obama will swat you like that fly.
Poor fly. PETA was right. Wasn’t the fly’s fault. Flies are just instinctively attracted to bullshit.
You can get anything you want at Alice’s restaurant … except Alice.
Title 13 indicates a maximum fine of $100. However, “Title 18 U.S.C. Section 3571 and Section 3559” “effectively” raises this to a maximum of $5000.
Deputize the New Black Panther Party and let them impose the fines…
that should end well
“Over at LGF, most of the commenters think Bachmann is a moron.”
Well, she has said some incredibly stupid shit. She’s more over the top “Christian” fundie than Huckabee. I’m a Christian and I’m fine with personal doctrine governing decisions, but confine your hyper-judgmental, finger pointing, caterwauling, Maud Flanders beliefs to your personal life and out of government.
She tried to outlaw online poker for Pete’s sake! For the greater good… of course. She can go pound sand right there.
“However, “Title 18 U.S.C. Section 3571 and Section 3559″ “effectively†raises this to a maximum of $5000.”
d.k., are you a lawyer? (not being a smartass at all, asking for a reason).
There seems to be a constitutional issue with this, so where the fuck is the ACLU? Oh yeah, too busy protecting 2nd Amendment rights!
The Constitution allows for a Census for the purpose of allocating Representatives and certain taxes (in practice I don’t believe the latter applies anymore). Therefore, the only information the Census Bureau is constitutionally authorized to collect is the number of people living in a place, and whether they are members of Indian tribes not subject to taxation.
Or is this one of those interstate commerce clause deals, where Congress can pretty much write a law to say anything?
“I am a meat popsicle.”
– Corbin Dallas
“Or is this one of those interstate commerce clause deals, where Congress can pretty much write a law to say anything?”
That’s why I asked if d.k. was an attorney. The Census Bureau is legally tasked with exactly what you said; How many in the home, and age of those occupants. That’s it. Any other questions (race, employment, healthcare, etc) can be construed as a violation of the individual’s right to privacy. While the right to privacy is not expressly mentioned in the US Constitution, four generations of precedent coming out of USSC case law decisions stipulate that both the 5th & 9th Amendments specifically protect the individual American citizen’s right to privacy as it pertains to any government entity.
Apparently only criminals have the right to remain silent now. Strange times.
Census time? I love the Census!
And ACORN rocks too! Men, women, babies, children, grandmas, everyone loves ACORN.
Only sheep, dogs and cattle don’t get counted in the Census. I hope that’s not you.
“Love the hat.”
— Corbin Dallas
Amendment 4 – Search and Seizure. Ratified 12/15/1791.
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Amendment 5 – Trial and Punishment, Compensation for Takings. Ratified 12/15/1791.
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
Stupid flawed document.
Read “seizures” in bold, too.
Well, I think everyone who believes in the theory of evolution should check the “black” or “African American” option when it comes around. Due to the one-drop rule that we follow in this country, you would be telling the God’s honest truth, even if every ancestor you can find a record of hailed from Scandinavia. Of course, for those of you who don’t believe in Evo… well, do it anyway. Adam and Eve were probably black. Yeah, that’s it.
One drop rule?
Do you have a cite for that?
Fire in the hole!
lee, I most certainly hope that you are not needing a reference for the cultural practice of labeling someone who has, say, three white grandparents and one black, as black, instead of white. But, if you are needing one, there’s a wonderful tool called “the Internet” which would allow someone who is curious about the matter to run a “search” on a “search engine.” Now, I know it’s a bit confusing, but this isn’t a physical engine, like you have in your car. I mean, technically, you could use such an engine to aid in a search, but starting it, driving around, and looking at the scenery until you happened to see a billboard advertising information on the one drop rule. However, that wouldn’t be efficient, and with the price of gas these days (it’s over a buck! Can you believe it?). So, I suggest you go out there, get yourself some of this Internet, and try one of those search engines out. It’s really simply, you just type in “One Drop Rule” and these things called links pop up which take you to these other things called webpages that have the information you need. It’s great. Al Gore invented it.
Umm, I was mostly referring to this “we” you stated…as in: “the one-drop rule that we follow in this country”.
Since I am not included in this “we” you speak of, I was wondering what group you identify with that takes the one drop rule as something to be followed.
On the other hand, due to the dripping condescension of your last answer, never mind.
I know this threads about played out but I guess I got a hot need to write this anyway on behalf of the “Christian fundie” who happens to be from my state. I’d like a little more examples of the “stupid shit” she’s said in the past. Sorry about your poker game buddy. I’d stand and fight for your right to keep that someday, but right now I’d like to keep my f**&’n country. Yes, she’s driven by her faith, and yes she can be annoying, but I recognize her as a warrior on the font lines of this fight. She is not stupid. She’s an accomplished tax attorney and she knows her shit. I landed on a local talk radio show on my way to work this week and stayed because they said she would be up next. The host gave her at least ten straight uninerrupted minutes because I think he was as stunned as the rest of us at what she was trying to get through to us. She was talking about the takeover of our country by this regime, the car companies and the massive loss of businesses and jobs by the closing of dealerships. She was fighting for a 90-year-old family owned dealership in her district who had turned a profit EVERY YEAR they’d been in business and yet they are losing it to Obama. She explained many things in the time she was given about what is going on behind the scenes,the dirty deals w/ the unions and the screwing of the shareholders. I parked my car and sat in my car staring straight ahead, stunned and sick. We are in some deep shit here people.
Bachman has gotten very similar treatment in Minnesota as Palin got from the rest of the country. She has actively opposed the radical gay agenda which makes a lot of people squirm and/or angry. It’s not necessarily my thing – although I recognize, as she does, the radical elements as part and parcel of the leftist fundies in power. There are people that are hired to listen to every word that comes out of her mouth and then they pound her reputation with it. While I can understand people opposing her social-con agenda – I will vouch with everything I have for her devotion to preserving our constitution. After I listened to her this week I floated her some money (yeah, Jeff, your dough’s coming on pay day). We need our warriors that can look Geithner in the face and say, “That’s not what I asked. I asked you if it’s Constitutional.”
She got her start in politics like Palin, as a Mom, who recognized the beast in our school systems called “Profiles of Learning” which was a mandatory K-12 curriculum saturated with leftist agenda. She attacked it, chipped away, presenting proof day after crappy day directly from the curriculum, intelligently and with conviction. Most of us never thought there was hope of extracting that abortion from our public schools – but I credit Bachman for getting it done. She is a warrior. And I am grateful she is out there, flaws and all.
Get a mean looking dog and ACORN will not come on your porch. ACORN people hate dogs.
Oh wait, I am supposed to like ACORN! Well I do not, not in my neighborhood anyway. Tipper says they look at her butt lewdly (and I think she likes it).
Don’t forget that they are tagging every house with GPS coordinates as well. I mean, what could go wrong with THAT?!
The Census Bureau was after me for more than 6 months to fill out a detailed survey a couple of years ago. They mailed it to me several times, insisted that I do it and called a couple times. I ignored it, thinking it was no big deal. Finally, they sent a local employee to my house with a laptop and she insisted (in a nice way) that I complete the survey, which included my annual salary, number of persons living with me, etc. Just out of annoyance I complied and we sat in lawn chairs in the shade, she with her laptop, and I answered the questions.
Steve – if they want GPS coordinates, all they need to do is type an address into Google Maps.
Back in 2,000 they expected all kinds of information that they have no business asking for. The insert with the form claimed it was for dealing with expenditures and the like.
Last I knew, equal protection didn’t allow them to use racial and demographic data to target taxes and spending.
So I answered the questions about how many adults were in the house.
I never heard back about any fines.
The tagging with GPS coordinates is what allows your GPS device to work. Life is a tradeoff. Since I don’t plan to answer any questions beyond numbers, meh.
Oh, and I’ve found that conducting a rite of worship to Cthulhu will discourage Jehovah’s Witnesses. Permanently. I’ll have to try it on the Census takers. Of course, I can also ask if Hounds of Tindalos count, if they don’t come out of the corners.
Are they really going to GPS tag the front doors? I really hope I am home when the ACORN/census people show up at my compound.
. . . so, now, I guess Barry knows right where to get me when they decide to round up the right wing extremists. Here I am, BO, nice dog, don’t bite me. Just take me away for a rest, a rest from working 60 hours a week to make enough dough to pay bills in the Obama (and Bush) economy. Put me i a nice 6×6 cell, give me 3 hots and a cot and a nice stack of novels to read. Ahhhhhh, relaxation. And if they have to be lefty novels for my re-education at least make them somebody entertaining, say John Grisham. No Gore Vidal, please.
I am not sure how many friends I have living with me, some of them keep telling me the others are imaginary and I’m not sure who to believe.
All of the concertina wire around the driveway and front door should send a pretty clear message.
JD, maybe they won’t get close enough to see the Claymores have “inert – training aid” on them…
Unwarranted assumption, that the people they send would even know what a “Claymore” is, either kind.
JD,
Could you email me? Here.
About the possible July meeting.
Done, geoffb.
I happen to know someone engaged in the GPS marking for the census. Keep in mind these are government created devices. As such, they tend not to work.
So, I wouldn’t worry too much about GPS marking. What I’d worry more about is the government claiming a “device failure, inaccurate census” excuse so they can get away with using statistical sampling.
So many comments, and no one posts the obligatory “Christopher Walken answering a census-worker” video?
Well, let’s fix that right now…
Nice John Bradley…
U.S.A. Title 13–Census
Chapter 1–Administration
Subchapter 1–General Provisions
Section 6
Subsection (c)
To the MAXIMUM extent possible and consistent with the kind, timeliness, quality and scope of the statistics required, the Secretary SHALL acquire and use information available from any sourse referred to in subsection (a) or (b) of this section INSTEAD OF CONDUCTING DIRECT INQUIRIES.
* capitalizazion mine for emphasis* (no bolding or underling here)
No if you go on to look this up, subsections (a) and (b), all means for the government to get all they information they require is at their hand. They just want YOU to do their work, thereby making you UNPAID agents of the state, that is without compensation to you, which in my book = slavery to the government.
Maybe I should have worded that differently.
…without compenstion you you=involuntary servitude, with cohersion (fines) by the government.
The tagging with GPS coordinates is what allows your GPS device to work.
SDN, what do you mean? GPS requires no tagging AT ALL to work. Are you actually referring to a road navigation system?
Varenius,
I believe that GPS tagging referrs to fixing the position of the houshold being suveyed by longitude and latitude…
Bob, yes, that’s correct. That’s not necessary to get GPS coordinates, however. But I think SDN is just using “GPS” loosely.
Actually, I’m using it fairly precisely. The GPS data that Google Maps, Garmin, etc. use is based on the data gathered by the Census. They may expand on it, but that’s where they start from.
Census calls it address canvassing, and it’s actually most of the way done by now. It’s a separate process, performed before the actual census, and doesn’t involve much in the way of public interviews. Where does this street start, end, and how many buildings are on each side. If they come back next year and find that a building has been demolished, etc. there’s a form (electronic or paper) they fill out to note that fact.
I worked on the back-office software for this for most of 2007 / 2008.
Man, I’m so glad y’all have found another big issue to take up. By all means, lead the charge. Burn those extraneous census pages, or make tea bags out of them, or whatever it is you fellas do.
When do we get our next Dealergate update?
What day are we on for Uighurs in Bermuda Terrorism Watch! Day 9?
SDN, that is indeed a loose use of the term GPS. “Global Positioning System” refers quite explicitly to determining geographic coordinates based on signals from the GPS satellite network. Anything you do beyond that with the resulting data is not GPS. So determining the coordinates of a house (ie. tagging it) can be called “GPS”, but not using the tags to make or correct a map. Yes, people often do refer to things like their in-car navigation system as “a GPS”, but the truth is the actual GPS is only a part of it.
You are right that many services start with Census-provided mapping data for creating their geo-databases, but until now this was based on something called TIGER/Line files, which were not derived from GPS data, but rather pre-existing paper maps from the USGS. The Census has been improving these very recently using GPS, but it’s by no means the necessary way to do it. So if GPS tagging were required for a “GPS device” to work, Garmin, etc. wouldn’t be able to use TIGER/Line in the first place. Do you see why I was confused by your comment?
I am too lazy to read if anyone else has said this, but isn’t “My answer to this question is, the Constitution does not compel the Government to gather this information” an answer?
Varenious, I’ll answer that question at greater length if I have time; not sure when that will be.
SDN, only if you really want to. I’m admittedly being pedantic about this — I know what you mean to say, I’m just suffering from a specialist’s obsession with having terms used precisely.
[…] ACORN-ENABLING PAPERWORK– “Minn. lawmaker vows not to complete Census†…. […]