Though Dan’s post on Rick Perlstein’s “Getting Past the ’60s? It’s Not Going to Happen” made me chuckle, I was struck that the same newspaper also ran “The Boomers Had Their Day. Make Way for the Millennials” by Morley Winograd and Michael D. Hais on the same day.
(The latter, incidentally, parallels the generational studies of Strauss and Howe, should you require some background to grasp the Winograd-Hais jargon.)
The point of agreement between the two articles is the degree to which The Narrativeâ„¢ misrepresents the Boomers’ coming of age in the 1960s.  Perlstein writes:
The pictures people take and save, as opposed to the ones they never take or the ones they discard, say a lot about how they understand their own times. And in our archives as much as in our mind’s eye, we still record the ’60s in hazy cliches — in the stereotype of the idealistic youngster who came through the counterculture and protest movements, then settled down to comfortable bourgeois domesticity.
What’s missing? The other side in that civil war. The right-wing populist rage of 1968 third-party presidential candidate George Wallace, who, referring to an idealistic protester who had lain down in front of Johnson’s limousine, promised that if he were elected, “the first time they lie down in front of my limousine, it’ll be the last one they’ll ever lay down in front of because their day is over!” That kind of quip helped him rise to as much as 20 percent in the polls.
It’s easy to find hundreds of pictures of the national student strike that followed Nixon’s announcement of the invasion of Cambodia in the spring of 1970. Plenty of pictures of the riots at Kent State that ended with four students shot dead by National Guardsmen. None I could find, however, of the counter-demonstrations by Kent, Ohio, townies — and even Kent State parents. Flashing four fingers and chanting “The score is four/And next time more,” they argued that the kids had it coming.
And Neil Young didn’t write a song about them either, but I digress. Winograd & Hais struck a similar note:
It may surprise some to see baby boomers, so often represented as a generation of peaceniks and civil rights activists, producing this Republican realignment. But boomers were — and still are — a highly divided generation that actually tilts a bit to the right. On the college campuses of the 1960s, there were twice as many members of the right-wing Young Americans for Freedom as of the left-wing Students for a Democratic Society. It’s no different 40 years later. A survey done last month by the media research company Frank N. Magid Associates found that twice as many boomers call themselves conservative as liberal. The only thing that unites this generation are its members’ efforts to impose their diametrically opposed ideals, values and morality on everyone else through the political process.
Indeed.ÂÂ
The Narrativeâ„¢ regards the right half of this picture — particularly its coarser elements — as “reactionary.” The Narrativeâ„¢ generally does not consider that a reaction necessarily implies an action. When it is considered, The Narrativeâ„¢ dictates that this was a reaction against the civil rights struggle, the feminist movement, etc. so the reaction can be dismissed as beyond the realm of conventional political discourse. Moreover, The Narrativeâ„¢ on this point endures because there is a kernel of truth to it.
What The Narrativeâ„¢ attempts to airbrush from the national memory is that the backlash was also against the New Left. It is fair to say that a movement born from Khrushchev’s criticism of Stalin is going to be fairly extreme, and the the New Left does what it can to meet that expectation. In the US during the 1960s, it shattered the the traditional notion that policy disagreements stop at the water’s edge. The New Left characterized our troops in Vietnam as crazed killers; its celebrities openly supported the enemy. A minority movement, but large enough in the context of a difficult war to drive LBJ from seeking reelection, and to move the Democratic party from nominating Hubert Humphrey in 1968 to the the dovish George McGovern in 1972 and the batty Jimmy Carter in 1976.
The nomination (and election by plurality) of Bill Clinton, who famously evaded the draft and led antiwar protests overseas, was a continuation of this trend. Former Goldwater girl Hillary Clinton chose law school over interning for New Left icon Saul Alinsky, but found herself comfortable in the McGovernite party that people like Alinsky influenced from the outside. Their current struggle with Sen. Barack Obama (himself a former community activist in the Alinsky tradition) for the presidential nomination is riven with the identity politics birthed by the New Left.  Though the race is tightening, Hillary today remains the most likely Democratic nominee. And the direct descendants of the New Left can be seen trying to evict the US Marines from Berkeley and smearing the troops from the pages of the New York Times.
On the GOP side of the race, former Vietnam POW John McCain is currently favored to become the nominee — and should he secure the nomination, will owe more to that biography than his stands on the issues.ÂÂ
The Millennial generation will remake our politics. The odds currently do not favor them doing so this year.
This was fairly disturbing, Karl:
“Unlike the young baby boomers, millennials want to strengthen the political system, not tear it down. According to a study last year by the Pew Research Center, most millennials (64 percent) disagree that the federal government is wasteful and inefficient, while most older Americans (58 percent) think it is. A 2006 survey by Frank N. Magid Associates indicated that millennials are more likely than older generations to believe that politicians care what people think and are more concerned with the good of the country than of their political party.”
Good luck with that, Millenials.
Millennials, like generations before them, will get jobs and get married — at which point many of them will grow up. The disillusionment they will feel, either at the end of the Dem campaign, the general election, or even after the election, when things stay pretty much the same, will be one step on that journey.
I should note that both of these authors have new books to flog.
and Karl beats me to it. anyhoo, RTO often mentions that he thinks McCain is a poor choice because of his age. We’ve had two Boomer presidents and the U.S. has never elected anyone from an older generation.
older generation than previous presidents. I can’t make this make sense today. ugh.
maggie,
I generally agree with that. However, in the course of researching a post I abandoned (for now), iirc, some folks in the Strauss-Howe forums did have some exceptions (perhaps proving the rule, or perhaps suggesting our data set is too small).
I would also note that in general, that pattern suggests that we elect older and older folks until a big — usually generation-skipping — leap is made, as with JFK and Bill Clinton. McCain’s ID as a POW might qualify him as Boomer by proxy; Obama could be a member of a generation that will produce no presidents. Or not; it’s an interesting parlor game.
Don’t trust anyone over, under, or exactly 30.
that thought has crossed my mind. spooky. iirc, if the pattern holds up, there won’t be an GenX Prez, right? I haven’t ever read the book, but RTO was all over it many years ago so I’m working off my, ahem, “over 30 year old’s” memory. RTO’s also predicting a larger military conflict, ala WWII, around 2012(!). who knows, but it’s come up lately in our discussions. probably something to add to the reading pile.
Berkeley
Nuke ’em from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.
The question I have about the boomers, of which I am one, is where the reactionary leftist/communist/fascist infection came from that so many college students ended up getting?
Maybe I ought to e-mail to David Horowitz.
And, via LGF, treasonous cocksuckers in action:
http://www.zombietime.com/berkeley_marine_corps_2-1-2008/
Treason I said, treason I meant.
Karl beat me to it as well, but he’s right in any case. The disillusionment will likely be extreme, just as it was for many of the boomers.
Also, the “millenials” are going to have to wait their turn before taking over the levers of power, just as the boomers did. Remember all the mewling, particularly from the feminazis, starting back in the 1970s about the “glass ceiling” and the like?
What those stupid boomer cunts and others of their ilk could not wrap their little pea brains around is that the WWII generation did not start retiring in large numbers until the mid 1980s.
Did they actually think that the previous generation was going to step aside after busting their collective balls for 20-30 years to acheive the top positions in business, industry and academia just because some bunch of spoiled twats come along and waved their politically correct sex organs/skin color/hat size/whatever around and demanded they move aside?
Not gonna happen. Not then and not now.
So all the “millenial” Gen-X/Y/Zer, etc can just cool their thrusters and wait their turn, just like the boomers did.
Good points about the boomers and the Left. If anything, the percentage of boomers who bought into the New Left orthdoxy was in the minority all along. It was just that, like all proggies, regardless of generation, they were just noisier than the rest of us, and hence got more attention; “squeaky wheel” and all that.
Plus the boomer proggies have a really bad case of believing their own press just a tad too much…
Also Heath Ledger was a millenial. They’re kind of flighty.
happyfeet,
“Flighty?”
PHOBE!!!
No no. Just they have sort of extreme reactions to adversity is all. They’re like those pure-bred little dogs that go to Westminster. You can’t leave the gate open cause if they get out it can be a little traumatizing at best.
Karl. dude. Couldn’t agree with you more. I saw much violence from the right against antiVietnam protestor types but never any violence other that chanting and sign waving from the left. In Wyoming at a restaurant some turd of a cowboy tried to punch me while I was eating speghetti cause I had my hair past my ear and was with some jack Mormon BYU hippy girls. ..(Yeah, I knew them both!) Hey, I ducked and his fist bounced off my hard forehead probably hurting his hand. I just laughed as the waitress threw him out. There were more people perturbed at the nonconformists than in love with them. I could go on about how fucked up and violent the returning Vietnam vets were, how’d they rape the hippy chicks and hippy chicks would let them as they felt sorry for the bastards…..but you wouldn’t believe it.
not sure what happened to David Horowitz…but I know as editor of Ramparts HE most of all was conducting a campaign to elevate the most violent and sexist of the Black Panthers to cult status. He regretted the Panther’s murder of a particular woman as a result of his own prurient desire to elevate them in status. Many of the Panthers who were shot by Chicago’s finest had good intent but Horowitz defended the worst of them. His turn to the right is some sort of amends for his own nasty behavior while at Ramparts, a nonthinking political cult rag that I didn’t take seriously anymore than I thought Eldredge Cleaver was a righteous leader. Just a thug, a rapist, and multiple turn-coat who could write (Soul on Ice).
But the left wing folk all eventually got jobs, married, had kids, pay taxes, and enjoy nature but their criticism of war, corruption, pollution, environmental degradation will never go out of style. Embracing the beauty of nature and living at peace isn’t a generational thing.
now sing Kumbaya will you? Or embrace a former Goldwater girl from Wellesley?
I could go on about how fucked up and violent the returning Vietnam vets were, how’d they rape the hippy chicks and hippy chicks would let them as they felt sorry for the bastards…..but you wouldn’t believe it.
You’re right there, Dave. I really, really can’t think of anyone who would believe it.
Well if the toll of violence against anti-Vietnam protester types is any measure no wonder we lost the war.
“that millennials are more likely than older generations to believe that politicians care what people think and are more concerned with the good of the country than of their political party.â€Â
that’s it! There’s the hope. Read that over, folks. That’s why my smart 15 yo. loves Obama! It’s the parenting.
Parents of the last two decades parent their kids as if they (the parents)”care what the” kids “think and are more concerned with the good of the” family “than of”the parents. I didn’t get the impression that Baby Boomers parents gave a damn about what the kids thought…there was so many kids anyway and we could even play after dark out on the streets and the parents didn’t even notice it. Imagine that happening now?
their criticism of war, corruption, pollution, environmental degradation will never go out of style.
Does that mean Sharia law, terrorism, higher taxes, lower wages and economic over-regulation are IN style?
I don’t believe returning Vietnam Vets were raping hippy chicks–hippy chicks are smelly….
IO. one particular individual i knew and was working with us in Jackson Hole and he got fired over his many transgressions. I guess it’s not rape if she didn’t call the police but…..forced is the word. She felt sorry for him but he was alcoholic violent and crazy. Knew a few, and if they saw action they weren’t too pleasant to be around.
uh yeah, happy. swift boaters and black flags still aflyin’
“that millennials are more likely than older generations to believe that politicians care what people think and are more concerned with the good of the country than of their political party.â€Â
WAHAHAHAHAH! That is completely wrong. They politicians don’t even care about the party, all they care about are themselves!
that’s it! There’s the hope. Read that over, folks. That’s why my smart 15 yo. loves Obama! It’s the parenting.
The parenting that over-protected the little dears so that they believe nonsense.
It’ll make the disillusionment even more painful!
Everyone doesn’t win in this world. The only thing Obama is for is Obama. He’s using bullshit leftist populism to gain power for himself.
What’s going to happen when your ‘smart’ 15 yo hits the real world? So far, the millenials aren’t performing so well out here….
Does that mean Sharia law, terrorism, higher taxes, lower wages and economic over-regulation are IN style?… Hmmm, you mean is that what Republicans Want to be in style? Wow. You hit the Bush Agenda on the head in a few words or less.
Step aside for the Millenials? Well that’s about par for the course. I’ve had kids fresh out of college furious, furious that I’ve offered them an entry-level position when clearly they deserve to start out in senior management. Grad school? Experience? Phaw! They want it all and they want it Now! I don’t know where they’ve gotten such unrealistic expectations — couldn’t be an education system that values self esteem over achievement — but it’s no surprise that the post-graduation reality check leaves them bitter and angry.
It’s Sven Sveenwald!
Gray, I guess they’ll throw the Republicans out of power. They’re already pissed and that’s good.
He loves Obama cause Obama is lovable. He’s like a My Buddy, really. I think your son is just going to have to work through this on his own.
Wow. You hit the Bush Agenda on the head in a few words or less.
I see that you are a “True Believer”….
So, you still enjoy slandering veterans as murderers and rapists? I guess some things never do go out of style.
Gray, I guess they’ll throw the Republicans out of power. They’re already pissed and that’s good.
They’re pissed that they aren’t famous and rich already.
I don’t think they’ll throw anyone out of power. I think they will fold when they hit the real world away from their dippy self-affirming parents….
datadave, dude. The cowboy probably punched you because of your execrable grammar and spelling.
ha, the kid’s probably could have been a republican or a libertarian as he Loves Business and paid for his own Mac Pro with money he earned, dude, while he was 14. But he’s Liberal as he likes blacks and whites in equal measure and can’t stand the race baiting that’s coming from the Republican side. In general, a very “open-minded” generation and very savvy and aware of technology.
Probably shouldn’t get too personal and all that….don’t want some Jeff incident or something: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Goldstein
I’d best keep off the personal family anecdotes. eh?
that’s it! There’s the hope. Read that over, folks. That’s why my smart 15 yo. loves Obama! It’s the parenting.
I just wanna savor that little nugget there again….
The best part is: He’s serious!
He thinks it’s a good thing that his kid mistakenly believes that politicians care about him and his needs!
ah ha….no I was trying to stuff my face. That was the beauty of it. I only got mad maybe after the waitress showing up, after laughing at the fart. Hitting a guy with a fork in his mouth is gotta be pretty lowdown mean and cowardly.
Comment by datadave on 2/3 @ 5:15 pm :
Cuz, like, you know, those Panthers were rightwing fascists and all…
DD, how early did you start drinking before kickoff?
If you reflect I think you’ll find that Mac Pro was heavily subsidized.
well, shouldn’t they? are you cynical and anti American of something? You hate It’s a Wonderful Life or Mr. Smith goes to Washington and Frank Capra. Not enough back rooms and cigar smoke or Pottersvilles for you?
Probably shouldn’t get too personal and all that….don’t want some Jeff incident or something: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Goldstein
I’d best keep off the personal family anecdotes. eh?
Wow. What a nasty passive-aggressive bastard.
Somewhere in Wyoming, there is an old cowboy I’d like to buy a beer for an incident long ago in a diner….
Personally, I would like to thank dave for confirming my boomer stereotypes.
But he’s Liberal as he likes blacks and whites in equal measure and can’t stand the race baiting
How did you explain Bill Clinton to him?
happy, the rent and all. yupp. He’s like a Chinese kid. the one and only.
Jealous much?
hey, Darleen, Republicans made that Clinton Impeachment into a porn show. He hates porn. Me? ha that’s my education.
gray, weren’t you the governor of california?
The Chinese kids are in Hillary’s camp though, but I get what you mean.
I don’t think it’s right to put Chinese kids in a camp.
Take that up with Michelle I guess. But think of all the lanyards.
DD
Who’s talking about impeachment? You made a claim that your son is “Liberal” because he doesn’t like race-baiting.
The only recent race-baiting has been coming mostly from Camp Clinton. Though Obama himself has engaged in it while hanging out with La Raza (The Race) in East Los Angeles.
Hey, maybe your kid is a hypocrit! That would qualify him as a “Liberal”.
passive/aggressive….i endorse that!
enjoy the game (eh, Fox moonopoly)
…. lol, that ball’s got pig grease on it. Wonder what the Chinese make of football…kinda like how a northeastern liberal sees Nascar?
I always wonder what the Chinese think of all those tacky holiday decorations they make for us.
hypocrit
? he’s pretty critical. I ran out of the Irish Cream better get the beer next.
Nah, Democrats are only pointing out what Paul Krugman’s been saying: Republicans only win national elections if they get the solid South behind them.
Wait. He hates porn? Boy ain’t right.
ah shit, happyfeet. You got a real imagination. I appreciate your wonderment and all.
I put my mind on that question too. They probably think we’re wacko…but then they are too. burning money at funerals and all.
Nothing like the solid Northeast, I guess. Because it’s racistier, which is proved by how much better Obama’s doing there than in the South.
“Wait. He hates porn? Boy ain’t right.”
If you are referring to “dataless dave”, you are correct. “Clueless” does not begin to cover that one…
let him alone….it’s healthy rebellion. We didn’t have TV with that impeachment crap….but it must have seeped through about the retarded and nasty baby boomers. Ick!
that ball is slippery, yikes
dateless, not dataless.
“dataless”, definitely.
Crap. The new turtle lamp just blew. Now my question is would it be stupid to use a credit card at the “Grow Your Own” store down the way?
But he’s Liberal as he likes blacks and whites in equal measure
How’s he feel about browns?
the race baiting that’s coming from the Republican side
!!!!
just smile and nod, guinsPen, smile and nod.
“I saw much violence from the right against antiVietnam protestor types but never any violence other that chanting and sign waving from the left.”
You’re either totally ignorant or a liar.
I’ll leave the options for the audience to decide.
“not sure what happened to David Horowitz”
Sanity, brought on by those non-violent, wee-intentioned murderous Black Panthers.
dd, dude, you are one fucked up character.
the “Grow Your Own†store
Grow your own what?
would it be stupid to use a credit card
It depends. Whose card is it?
“…can’t stand the race baiting that’s coming from the Republican side.”
Another lie.
“Nah, Democrats are only pointing out what Paul Krugman’s been saying: Republicans only win national elections if they get the solid South behind them.”
Another lie.
How many states did Ronald Reagan win?
Ummmmmm……49.
“Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance or conscientious stupidity.”
-Martin Luther King Jr
Oh. That’s exactly what it’s called. The Grow Your Own Store. You’re supposed to just kinda know the grow your what own part yourself. But they should have lots of UV lighting options I figure, and turtles need lots of UV for proper shell maintenance. It’s a turtle thing. I just don’t want to get on some kind of list.
That was just mean, dave.
Grow your own what?
catnip. right?
Just when I think nobody could be that teeth grindingly stupid, I think ‘monkeyboy’ and realize, that lot is COMPOSED of folks like dave. Makes me crave the company of special olympians. Who, at least, every day operate to the limit of their capacity.
Grow your own store.
Regards,
Ric
I bet I could do catnip just on the balcony really. That could be a fun thing to do this spring I guess. I only know one cat though.
“that millennials are more likely than older generations to believe that politicians care what people think and are more concerned with the good of the country than of their political party.â€Â
Wahahahahaha! Oh, I will savor the disillusionment….
Not since Prince Gautama saw a leper over the palace walls will such innocence hit the horrible world head-on.
that’s it! There’s the hope. Read that over, folks. That’s why my smart 15 yo. loves Obama! It’s the parenting.
Oh. Man.
“It’s the parenting.” he cooed proudly as his little gosling got ripped from the nest and devoured by a gyrfalcon.
Sorry, I just had to get it out to play with it again.
I bet you’d get to know more if you grew some catnip. I tried growing some once, but the kitties ate the little shoots as soon has they broke the surface. same with grass.
If datadave could pull his head out for a moment, he would discover that David Horowitz turned after realizing the Black Panthers he was hanging with were murderers. And how ’bout that Weather Underground — what’s a few bombings here and there? Dave, why was the National Guard at Kent State in the first place?
[…] Dead. I suppose this is a daring raid onto Clinton turf, but let’s count it as one in the “Getting Past the ’60s? It’s Not Going to Happen†column. Posted by Karl @ 9:18 pm | Trackback Share […]
Parents of the last two decades… care what the “kids” think and are more concerned with the good of the “family” than of the “parents.”
POTL2D: What should we have for dinner tonight kids?
TK: ICE-CREAM !
POTL2D: That wouldn’t be very healthy. Any other suggestions?
TK: PIE !
POTL2D: Neither would that. Why don’t we try (—) instead?
TK: You never think of anybody but yourselves. Just for once, can’t you do something FOR THE FAMILY !!!
POL2D: You’re right, kids, We’ve been selfish. How about ice-cream and pie?
TK: That’s better. Now, chop-chop, cue-ball.
Baby Boomers parents [didn’t give] a damn about what the kids thought…there was so many kids anyway and we could even play after dark out on the streets and the parents didn’t even notice it
BBP: Too many kids, as a matter of fact. And the devil of it is that they were too thick to take the hint, but smart enough to keep finding their way back home. Go figure.
TK: Are we there yet?
okay, good game. now back to reality: Wow! We’ve hit the jackpot: http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/04/washington/04military.html
Military spending hits highest level since WW2!
So you wackjobs still complain about the govt. But you want to have wars. Who do you think does wars? Government. You most have real twisted brains or something. I like the crazy folks here…not to be mean Slart….but still I feel comfort with crazy funny people so that’s just my peculiarity. But the logic isn’t being bought by the hard working nose to the grindstone types who see their stagflation wages being eaten up by this Administration’s war all the time policy.
Cut taxes, Make war. Oh…that makes a lot of sense. Now remember WW2 was won by raising taxes and engaging the whole country in the effort…but you want play war and pretend Freedom is Free.
Clowns, in case you haven’t noticed, We have now passed Vietnam war costs..in fixed dollar amounts and soon will reach the big One: 4 and half Billion bucks there abouts for WW2.
okay, I’ll balance it out in that military spending has been eclipsed by the huge increase in health care spending…in fact a flip of one to the other Health care used to be like 4 to 6 percent of gnp and military spending was in the teens.. now it’s reversed: military is 4 plus iraqi expenditures…but then we’ve cut taxes much lower than in the 50s on the high marginal rates.
“Overall since coming to office, the administration has increased baseline military spending by 30 percent, a figure sure to be noted in coming budget battles as the American economy seems headed downward and government social spending is strained, especially by health-care costs.
Still, the nation’s economy has grown faster than the level of military spending, and even the current colossal Pentagon budgets for regular operations and the war efforts consume a smaller portion of gross domestic product than in previous conflicts.
About 14 percent of the national economy was spent on the military during the Korean War, and about 9 percent during the war in Vietnam. By comparison, when the current base Pentagon budget, nuclear weapons and supplemental war costs are combined, they total just over 4 percent of the current economy, according to budget experts. The base Pentagon spending alone is about 3.4 percent of gross domestic product.”
dataless dave, do you realize that this undermines your argument:
About 14 percent of the national economy was spent on the military during the Korean War, and about 9 percent during the war in Vietnam. By comparison, when the current base Pentagon budget, nuclear weapons and supplemental war costs are combined, they total just over 4 percent of the current economy, according to budget experts. The base Pentagon spending alone is about 3.4 percent of gross domestic product.â€Â
We can economically afford lots more war.
We can stop fighting the war when we can print funny cartoons of Mohammed and stop taking off our shoes to get on airplanes, so Man Up you hippie puss!
“But you want to have wars.”
Who “wants” to have wars datadave? Got a link?
“that ball is slippery, yikes”
Put your ball down datadave and dry off your hands. Then dry off your crotch and start over.
“But you want to have wars.”
Another lie.
Pitiful, just pitiful.
” stagflation ”
Another lie.
“….but you want play war and pretend Freedom is Free.”
Wait, I thought we wanted to have real wars?
Which is it dave?
“Clowns, in case you haven’t noticed, We have now passed Vietnam war costs..in fixed dollar amounts”
So?
“and soon will reach the big One: 4 and half Billion bucks there abouts for WW2.”
So?
You do realize, do you not, that that is a stupid remark.
I’m talking weapons grade stupid, here.
It’s like comparing apples and quarks.
did you like the game karl? I am not a sports guy but that qtrback Eli Manning whew and those guys had us down to the wire…thought NE had it but wth:……david horowitz was a writer at Salon and major neofascist whacko… paranoid. like a few pointy head nonmartial artist, liberal professors would take over the uSA like he says…. he’s more like General Funston:
“I personally strung up thirty-five Filipinos without trial, so what was all the fuss over Waller’s ‘dispatching’ a few ‘treacherous savages’? If there had been more Smiths and Wallers, the war would have been over long ago. Impromptu domestic hanging might also hasten the end of the war. For starters, all Americans who had recently petitioned Congress to sue for peace in the Philippines should be dragged out of their homes and lynched.” [1], [1]
Mark Twain, a strong opponent of US Imperialism, published a sarcasm-filled denunciation of Funston’s mission and methods under the title “A Defence of General Funston” in the North American Review.
Funston was considered a useful advocate for US expansionism, but when he publicly made insulting remarks about anti-imperialist Republican Senator George Frisbie Hoar of Massachusetts, mocking his “overheated conscience” in Denver, just before a planned trip to Boston, President Theodore Roosevelt denied his furlough request, and ordered him silenced and officially reprimanded.
Funston was a little man, and an early proponent of fascism. He fortunately died relatively young after killing all those patriotic brown people fighting for independence from both Spain and the US. “Funston was relaxing in the lobby of a San Antonio, Texas hotel, listening to an orchestra play The Blue Danube Waltz. After commenting, “How beautiful it all is,” he collapsed from a massive painful heart attack (myocardial infarctus) and died” at age 51. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colonel_Funston
adjusted dollar amount… adjusted for inflation. good going, keep it up nan.ob.
u be play war. WW2 that’s a real war! what 100 million dead? But we’re spending the same amount of money…holy shit that Eric Prince is making a shitload! now, that boy already inherited 2 billion from his right wing dad who donated a few million to the RNC.. and he makes play war fun and profitable.
so?
“I saw much violence from the right against antiVietnam protestor types but never any violence other that chanting and sign waving from the left. In Wyoming at a restaurant some turd of a cowboy tried to punch me while I was eating speghetti cause I had my hair past my ear and was with some jack Mormon BYU hippy girls. ..(Yeah, I knew them both!) Hey, I ducked and his fist bounced off my hard forehead probably hurting his hand. I just laughed as the waitress threw him out. There were more people perturbed at the nonconformists than in love with them. I could go on about how fucked up and violent the returning Vietnam vets were, how’d they rape the hippy chicks and hippy chicks would let them as they felt sorry for the bastards…..but you wouldn’t believe it.”
I have put up with you as an ignorant but innocent amusement up until now, dave, but that is a ridiculous stack of bullshit right there and you are a lying son of a bitch. Thankfully, your limited intellect and imagination doesn’t allow you to invent anything but readily transparent caricatures. That doesn’t make you any less vile. Fuck you.
*sigh* where’s the TYPING TELEPHONE POLE beacon? I’ve tried, but you morons keep engaging it. ;D
Makes me crave the company of special olympians. Who, at least, every day operate to the limit of their capacity.
Perfect.
“…in fixed dollar amountsâ€Â
“adjusted dollar amount… adjusted for inflation. good going, keep it up nan.ob.”
Which is it, doooood. Fixed or adjusted?
Because you posted “…in fixed dollar amountsâ€Â.
And that would make for, you know, different amounts.
Can you follow this?
“what 100 million dead?”
The approximate number murdered by your beloved Marxist states over the course of the 20th and 21st centuries.
And who is Eric Prince? And who gives a flying fuck about him?
Except idiot reactionary leftists.
Which means, you know, fixed dollar amounts.
Fucking idiot.
maggie, you be cute
I think the pole’s up on the left side. oh well, it keeps the hits aggrowing and Jeff getting ad dollars..hey where’s the google ad?
David Warren on Tet:
“Then, enormous mass graves of women and children were found. Most had been clubbed to death, some buried alive; you could tell from the beautifully manicured hands of women who had tried to claw out of their burial place.
“As we stood at one such site, Washington Post correspondent Peter Braestrup asked an American TV cameraman, ‘Why don’t you film this?’ He answered, ‘I am not here to spread anti-communist propaganda’.”
The Tet Offensive ended not only in a huge allied victory in the field — some 45,000 of the Communist soldiers had been killed, and their infrastructure destroyed. It was victory after an event that showed sceptical South Vietnamese, and should have shown the world, the nature of the enemy our allies were fighting.
Walter Cronkite, the famous news anchor of CBS, led the American media reaction. After a very brief visit to Saigon, in which he got himself filmed wearing flak jackets, he returned to the United States, declaring before his huge prime time audience:
“It is increasingly clear to this reporter that the only rational way out will be to negotiate, not as victors, but as an honourable people who have lived up to their pledge to defend democracy, and did the best they could.”
Teh Stooopidâ„¢ must be contagious.
nanny…do you ever Google? as in verb? founder of Blackwater: Eric Prince and always check out Wikipedia for summaries of famous folks: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Prince that’s just the tip of the ice berg where the monies going…. perhaps check out for future employment of retiring marines etc. These are the main growth industries currently in America.
Democratic presidential candidate John Edwards has characterized Prince as one of George W. Bush’s “political cronies.
Well there you go.
…that’s just the tip of the ice berg where the monies going….
So how much monies, you think? Because I can’t really find it on Google.
yeah, cause Wikipedia is reliable.
to be fair, if it’s on the internets it must be TRUE! am I right?
perhaps check out for future employment of retiring marines etc. These are the main growth industries currently in America.
Well it’s better than spending all their time raping hippie chicks like their predecessors….
u be play war.
I have a theory that eventually, everyone sounds like Happyfeet. But not as cute.
but then how would we get more dd’s?
fixed at certain point adjusted for inflation..you need a base to compare with like 2000 year dollars or 2007 year dollars fixed at that point and adjusted for inflation.
Noel…yeah, war’s ugly. the Vietnamese had to do what they could against the most powerful nation on earth…but then are we so good: that grave had approx 2000 people in it but over 3 million Indochinese died over all with only a small portion Americans. Operation Phoenix killed about 40000 suspected civilian viet cong sympathizers. in a similar fashion to the famous event you mentioned central VN. Hue. These atrocities are relative unless you’re in the tight spot as the combatants and victims were.
If your quote is true They (journalists) perhaps didn’t want to wave the bloody flag for a conservative movement bent on ‘cleansing the campuses of radicals’ and ‘lynching ’em’. We are always at threat by the right wing neofascists such as those that bombed Oklahoma city and still to this day threaten any who disagree with them . Nothing worse than a returned combatant coming back from a losing war..e.g. German Frei Corps, Hitler or Timothy McVie. Or the Bolsheviks.
WW2 was won by raising taxes and engaging the whole country in the effort
WWII was won by massive deficit spending. True, revenues increased but those increases were dwarfed by the increases in spending. See here (pages 23 and 24 of the report, 27 and 28 in the pdf, have the relevant data):
Revenues (% of GDP)
1942 – 10.1
1943 – 13.3
1944 – 20.9
1945 – 20.4
Deficits (% of GDP)
1942 – 14.2
1943 – 30.3
1944 – 22.7
1945 – 21.5
Wow. Incoherent just doesn’t do that justice.
Dave, do you actually do any, you know, thinking before you post?
WRT Vietnam, from 1963-1970, the annual % of revenues to GDP averaged about 1 pct. point more than 2003-2006, while the ’63-’70 annual % of spending to GDP averaged just over 1 pct. point less than ’03-’06.
Dave, do you actually do any, you know, thinking before you post?
Nothing worse than a returned combatant coming back from a losing war..e.g. German Frei Corps, Hitler or Timothy McVie. Or the Bolsheviks.
Obviously not. Intelligence or honesty are completely alien to the boy.
#105 should have started “WWII was financed by”
if DD actually has a 15 y/o son, bet the poor boy is embarrassed. Can’t bring his friend around least someone trip over the beer bottles outside the trailer door.
Holy shit.
I hereby apologize for ever engaging that dumb-ass POS lying sack of false accusations.
Let’s all step back and let it wither. Before it goes even more mental.
I reiterate: Holy Shit.
Ever go to the BMV and you’re filling out your paperwork and then all of a sudden a guy starts talking to you like you’ve both been taken prisoner and conversation is the only way you’ll get through the ordeal and you just want him to shut up, but he thinks he knows everything and he rambles on like he had blunt trauma at some point in his life, but you don’t want to seem rude, but then he just will not shut up with his “I once knew this guy..” or “I was eating sketti at this diner and this cowboy…….” and you just nod and smile, but then you stab him with your clipboard and stuff him in your trunk?
I renew my tags by mail now.
Speaking of Wikipedia errors, one day I was helping my daughter research Ponce de Leon, and discovered to my delight that Ponce had, in addition to his more famous accomplishments, opened the very first Charlie’s Taco Stand in Puerto Rico.
Which was undoubtedly very nice for the early settlers, and for those in the native population who could scrounge up two bits for the three-way platter.
Amazing what you can learn on Wikipedia.
…those clipboards hurt.
Nice pdf. I’ll save it…. but what’s your point, numbnuts. My point is that we shouldn’t be spending WW2 levels of money against a neglible nearly nonexistant enemy. 4 Trillion to beat Al Q. Someone’s really screwing the US if we can’t win in Afghanistan.
what your pdf says is that Bush has increased borrowing unheard of since Reagan and WW2:
see pg 310 thereabouts…what pages you getting your info….it doesn’t even have info about the ww2 years.
oh at the front of document…even goes back to 1933 but….hmmmm taxes were low during WW2 and rose rapidly after to pay for said deficits …and the economy boomed.
So your point? Raising taxes increases prosperity. Also shows Clinton did balance the budget and Bush 2 massively increased indebtedness.
wow, Bush deficits of 2004 were 10 times as high as 1944? that’s a good point you’re making…ha and we had a Republican congress then too. Pg 26
why do these PDF pages never match up with the pages on the docu..? must be counting the blank pages at the front of doc.
Clinton didn’t balance the budget, the .com boom balanced the budget. The minute the boom started going bust, the budget started going out of balance. If you look at 1999 and 2000 deficit/surplus, you see the beginnings of that. In fact, the surplus started dying in 1994. By 1996, it was down 50% from peak.
But Clinton inherited a government already in the black, surplus/deficit-wise (ignoring, for the moment, on/off-budget jiggery-pokery). He did manage to finally reduce public debt by about 400 billion from peak, but it increased by a net of half a trillion over his presidency.
Not bad, but not worthy of any major awards.
Sure. Make them 100%, and we’ll all be rich.
Clinton didn’t balance the budget, the .com boom balanced the budget.
Farming out all those military service contracts to Halliburton helped too. Funny how that turned out.
Wow. Dave’s certainly on a psychotic roll in this thread.
It’s a poppyseed psychotic roll, though, so…not bad.
Dave said; “Raising taxes increases prosperity.”
Are the voices in your head telling you to say these things?