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Hizballah West?

Andrew Sullivan, man of nuance:

If you’re a Republican in Tennessee and you are in a tough race, what do you do? Hey, your party isn’t a political organization; it’s God’s Own Party:

A Christian prayer group is hoping to provide Republican gubernatorial nominee Jim Bryson with some divine assistance during his campaign. The “Bryson Prayer Force” is inviting Christians to join its current 80 members in praying regularly for Bryson, his family and campaign staff. An e-mail sent out by the group included some suggested prayers. Weekly prayers are to be sent to those who have signed up to be part of the group.

“Pray for an open heaven over Jim and his team in each Tennessee county they visit, that the gates of each county would open to him and his team, and that the Lord’s divine favor will be granted to him everywhere he goes,” reads one example. Blair Morgan, an attorney and vice treasurer of the Davidson County Republican party, is serving as state coordinator of Bryson Prayer Force.

Another part of the message:

“Pray for patience, endurance, stamina and joy to be experienced by all those on and participating in any way in the Bus Tour. Pray for a warring, Angelic Guard to go before them, clearing the way and surrounding them, and being their rear guard as they move throughout the State.”

Do the Republicans know that the “Party of God” has already been trademarked? By Hezbollah.

Praying for an outcome you find favorable is, of course, not really all that close to firing Katyusha rockets into Democratic Party headquarters or eradicating homosexuals systematically without even the benefit of placing them in a nice warm oven first—but what the hell, Andrew can’t be expected to resist turning an arbitrary semantic similarity (just as a reminder, the overwhelming majority of devoutly religious “Christianists” and missionaries have not, of late, been given to calling for conversion by the sword, nor have they announced a desire to see, say, San Francisco pushed into the sea) into the suggestion of a tawdry and revolting equivalency.

Sullivan should be ashamed of himself.  But like all true believers who are no longer bound by anything other than their own selfish pragmatism, Andrew is willing to lay rhetorical waste to any of those whose convictions stand in the way of his own political / social desires, and he is willing to do so in such a way that attempts to demonize entire groups of people with one giant stroke of his ever-expanding broad brush.  That he does so behind a shield of Catholicism that is at odds with, well, the Catholic Church itself, just goes to show just how cynical, conniving, and self-centered he has become.

In fact, I daresay that among conservatives and classical liberals, Sullivan’s tactics over the last several years have done more to set back the cause of gay marriage—the genesis of his hyberbolic animus, and the driving force behind his attempts to demonize single-issue political opponents—than a hundred gay pride parades and a thousand episodes of “Queer Eye for the Straight Guy.”

(h/t Allah)

100 Replies to “Hizballah West?”

  1. DrSteve says:

    Hysterical.  Andrew, that is.

  2. Dan Collins says:

    St. Andrew of Quibblefield, Founder of the Brotherhood of Stigmatized Assholes

  3. George S. "Butch" Patton (Mrs.) says:

    Wait a minute:

    We’re not supposed to shoot Katyushas at Democratic campaign offices?

    Gotta make a phone call.  Back soon.

  4. Lou says:

    Sullivan is more concernd with is cock than a 13yr old.

  5. MarkD says:

    I thought the Democrats had the monopoly on shooting up the opposition’s campaign headquarters.

    I spewed when you refered to St Andrew as a true believer.  The man’s a heretic, at least according to the catechism I learned as a lad.  I pity the guy.  He’s a talented writer, but his obsession with homosexuality is boring.

  6. ken says:

    I assume prayer isn’t covered in McCain-Feingold. Yet.

    Unless of course you want to pray for legalized homosexual marriage. Then it would be OK with Andrew.

  7. Sharkman says:

    Like I always say, if Excitable Andy ever stops viewing the world through his cum-colored glasses, he might actually be so embarrassed by the drivel that he’s passed off as commentary the last few years that he’d finally put down his keyboard and retire.  As it is, everything he writes carries about it a faint whiff of bread dough.  Yuch.

    “Stigmatized” assholes.  Is that what we are calling that, now?  I think I like the old fashioned term “fucked” better.

  8. noah says:

    Its Wretchard’s “moral equivalency operator” running amok in Sullivan’s unfortunately AIDS ravaged brain. Unfortunately because he used to have a brain.

  9. TODD says:

    “Sullivan is more concernd with is cock than a 13yr old”

    Nice Lou, real nice……Don’t you have some diapers to change?

  10. Eric says:

    Stigmatized Assholes

    Not that there’s anything wrong with that.

  11. ken says:

    Praying for an outcome you find favorable is, of course, not really all that close to firing Katyusha rockets into Democratic Party headquarters or eradicating homosexuals systematically without even the benefit of placing them in a nice warm oven first…

    Well, you know, terms are becoming so relative. Moderate Muslim–doesn’t believe in mass murder. Moderate Christian–doesn’t publicly say grace at the local cafeteria.

  12. SmokeVanThorn says:

    I’m surprised he regards “Hezbollah” as an insult.

  13. Benedick says:

    Frickin’ ouch, Jeff.

  14. topsecretk9 says:

    The thing that bugs me about Andrew is not so much he’s a one issue wonder who put on anti-bush colored glasses in order to feel good about his shallow sell out, but that he tries sooooo to pretend it’s not true.

  15. Scape-Goat Trainee says:

    The thing that bugs me about Andrew is not so much he’s a one issue wonder who put on anti-bush colored glasses in order to feel good about his shallow sell out, but that he tries sooooo to pretend it’s not true.

    Eh, the guy’s a clown.

    He pretends as if the Christian Church just somehow discovered that they aren’t exactly enamoured of Homosexual Marriage, like they just changed under the regime of Bush, became less tolerant or something. Funny, I grew up in a Baptist Church and I gotta say, I don’t recall seeing any boys marrying boys. Maybe it was happening but nobody was talking about it. Yeah…that must be it.

  16. marcus says:

    As a Christian I can say that no Christian worth his salt thinks that any political party or candidate has a “monopoly” on God or God’s favor.  As a matter of fact, Paul admonishes us to pray for our leaders no matter what their affiliation.

    Having said that, I can say Jeff is correct in saying that there is nothing wrong with praying for a favorable outcome in an election.  I’m sure Democrats who are Christians pray for victory as well.

    Unless of course you want to pray for legalized homosexual marriage. Then it would be OK with Andrew.

    Nailed it, Ken.

  17. The Ace says:

    Hey, your party isn’t a political organization; it’s God’s Own Party:

    And of course the actual substance of the article doesn’t support this assertion.

    The one true blessing of the Bush Presidency is that it has driven these people insane.

    TW: “got” Got God?

  18. Sean M. says:

    Man, what happened to that guy?

  19. gahrie says:

    What I love about Sullivan is his insistence that Homosexuals be allowed to get married, paired with his insistence that of course you shouldn’t expect gay men to be monogamous.

  20. The Confused One says:

    Now now folks, we have to remember the rules here.  If a group of people pray for a Republican than it’s the sign of the apocolypse.

    Now, if a Democratic candidate just happens to climb into a pulpit and give a campaign speech, errrr…sermon, then that’s just reaching out to the common man.

    TW:  pressure, too much pressure applied somewhere I guess.

  21. BoZ says:

    Sullivan’s an unfortunately hilarious illustration of something I (hate to) think is universally true: Issue-level politics are poses assumed to satisfy unrelated irrational obsessions via subsumption of personality.

    Okay, that’s indecipherable.

    Take Sully, once conservative. For reasons that don’t matter, he grows obsessed with gay marriage. He says so. Again and again. His saying so again and again eventually strains his relationship with the few conservatives who actually care about that shit (whom he comes via external encouragement to regard as representative, though he used to know better), and it creates a tenuous bond between him and a large, suddenly welcoming band of progressives who seem to share his obsession. Because at least they cheer it. He thinks he has new friends.

    Because issue positions outside one’s obsessions/axioms/whatever are reached via pressure/desire to lose oneself in a group that offers satisfaction of that obsession—whether that group’s position re: that obsession is equally defining to that group, or itself only a contingency/pose resulting from of a mess of other pressure/desires (which yes)—wham-bam, Sully turns Kossack, and over the course of a couple years changes all his non-obsessive positions to match his new friends’.

    If it seems like he speaks of “Christianists” et al with the idiot stridency of a cult convert, it’s because that’s what he is. He was a much better pose-conservative. The greater rhetorical restraint that that group requires kept him sane(-sounding). Too bad.

  22. The Ace says:

    PAGING ANDREW SULLIVAN!!!!!!

    To a standing-room-only caucus of women Democratic leaders, Dean urged them to learn to talk and cooperate with people of faith. “People of faith are in the Democratic Party, including me,” Dean declared.

    In response to a question from CT, Dean said, “We are definitely going to do religious outreach. Even in my campaign I was interested in reaching out to evangelicals.” Later, Dean tactfully expanded his remarks, noting “our religious outreach will not solely be to evangelical Christians but to Americans of all faiths.”

    Hypocrisy is a virtue for these people.

  23. Great Mencken's Ghost! says:

    IS there a Gaybollah?

  24. Lost Dog says:

    Sully’s lost it. He is no different than the prayer group he insults. It must be tough to be so obsessed with male butt that you can’t make enough room in your world for anyone who is not obsessed.

  25. B Moe says:

    I wonder what he thinks Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson are praying for when they show up at Democrat functions?

    Okay, maybe not the best analogy.

  26. Pappy says:

    Andrew’s been in an intellectual death-spiral for three years now. How long do those damn things last?

  27. RiverCocytus says:

    Maybe we should do the Christian thing and pray for Andy? If anyone needs it, its him.

    And Dean.

    You don’t have to pray for them to win. Pray for God to snap them out of whatever mania they’re fixed on into…

    But it may be crossing the line to pray for them to quit politics. Though to be honest, I don’t know. If its for the best, I suppose it couldn’t hurt.

    Andy just loves sneering at people of faith– its a sign of bitterness of spirit… when was the last time he went to confession, I wonder?

    TW: be careful what you ask for…

  28. Meg Q says:

    Thanks, Ace. You posted the Dean stuff so I don’t have to.

    TW: force. May the Force be with you. And also with you. (Sorry, Catholic joke . . .)

  29. duncan says:

    IS there a Gaybollah?

    An excellent question to ask the blogosphere.

  30. MikeD says:

    I think you have nailed it Jeff.  The question becomes, do you think Sully will ever finally realize most people just don’t give a shit anymore about what he thinks?

  31. The Ace says:

    Thanks, Ace. You posted the Dean stuff so I don’t have to.

    You’re welcome.

    I won’t even bother with the “Dean says marriage is between one man & one woman is in the Democratic platform” (on Pat Robert’s TV network no less!) as Sullivan has been destroyed here.

  32. ahem says:

    I was going to write something about how Sullivan is clueless about the beneficial power of religion, but I’ll just say he’s a vicious little asshole and leave it at that. He likes his cliche’d vision of reality. Let me not disabuse him.

  33. SteveMG says:

    In the cause of fighting (perceived and even real) dogmatics, Sullivan has slowly become one.

    Not that there isn’t – as we all acknowledge – a danger from religious (or secular) absolutists having political power; it’s just that it’s happening over there and not here.

    Unless one engages in defining theocracy down; which Sullivan loves to do.

    SMG

  34. ShoreMark says:

    I do think Andrew makes some good points from time to time on a variety of subjects. It’s just that the variety doesn’t seem as, well, variable as it once was.

    That, and I’ve long since grown weary of wading past the waterboards (as if people that live in the desert would object to copious quantities of fresh H2O) to find any errant gems of wisdom.

  35. Sean M. says:

    Unless one engages in defining theocracy down; which Sullivan loves to do.

    St. Andi loves to define down anything that he’s not particularly fond of.

  36. It is really unfortunate that “live and let live” seems to have fallen from Andrew’s philosophy of life.  Unfortunate and, well, hypocritical, isn’t it?

    Turing Word: father, as in, I will be your father figure, put your tiny hand in mine, I will be your preacher, teacher, anything you have in mind…

  37. Karl says:

    I anxiously await Sully’s take on the revelation that the immediate trigger for last week’s massive terror bust was the arrest and torture of a key player in Pakistan. Sully has been denied the chance to watch nine airliners explode over US cities from his lofty perch on the moral high ground.

    tw: girl. Uncanny.

  38. SteveG says:

    Why would whatever 80 people decide to do with their prayers concern Andrew?

    It’s not like their prayers are influencining them to strap explosives packed with ball bearings and wire to themselves and then explode themselves at the body painting booth at the gay pride festival.

    Geez.

    Every Christian I know (and I know thousands) would turn in anyone who behaved like a jihadi.

    tw” *what* WTF?

  39. Pablo says:

    Do the Republicans know that the “Party of God” has already been trademarked? By Hezbollah.

    Sorry, Andy. Those Republicans used it first, no doubt. Reverend Sharpton probably did too. Hezbollah is the new kid.

  40. McGehee says:

    Why would whatever 80 people decide to do with their prayers concern Andrew?

    Because they’re asking for something of which Andrew disapproves. Obviously he believes God listens to prayers, and deep down he fears that God is more interested in listening to those other people’s prayers than to his.

    No amount of self-justification and rationalizing can overcome the deep-seated guilt of a Catholic who has taken a path in life that his faith warns against. Andy wants to drown out everyone else’s prayers with his histrionics.

    He knows it won’t work, and that only makes him yell louder.

  41. Jeff Goldstein says:

    Hey, lookit!  I got first mention in the list of unthinking bloodthirsty neocon Bush lapdogs posing as “libertarian”!

    Forget the fact that anyone who wishes to go back through my site will find me railing against nannystatism and social engineering.  The fact that I support a muscular foreign policy and am interested in a conservative reading of the Constitution marks me as a GOP apologist.

    Mona is not Greenwald’s sock puppet, but only because he didn’t need to invent her.

    In all other ways they are one and the same.

  42. So Jeff,

    How is Andrew going to get over his Messiah complex if you keep nailing him to crosses like that? Yeow.

    I quit reading Andrew about a year ago. I just couldn’t take it anymore. I’m simultaneously angry and embarrassed for Sullivan. Years ago, he helped inspire me to flesh out my ideas for a new political party. Watching him melt down after Bush first mouthed support for the Federal Marriage Amendment has been unbearable. He let his pride be engaged, and pride cometh before a fall I guess. It’s such a shame. Back in the day, Sullivan was frequently a strong thinker and a brave writer. Get well soon Andrew.

    yours/

    peter.

  43. Karl says:

    Forget the fact that anyone who wishes to go back through my site will find me railing against nannystatism and social engineering.

    They can’t because the Neo enrages them much more than the Con.

    There is no spoon.

    tw: march. It’s 2 for 2 tonight.

  44. Sean M. says:

    I agree, peter.  Sullivan was one of the people who got me interested in bloggers ande blogging.  His old blog was a daily must-read for me, up until his meltdown over the FMA.  Since then, it’s been sad to watch him spiral into hysteria and BDS.  His dishonest waffling on the 2004 election was troubling, and when he wrote his piece on Kerry being the true conservative choice in that election, that was it.  If he could’ve articulated honest reasons why he wanted to vote for Kerry (or some third party candidate), I could’ve respected that.  But what he wrote was ludicrous.

  45. ShoreMark says:

    I recall, way (way, like 60s or 70s way) back when, when Time was fretting over how a minor typeface/format/cover change would affect their readership.

    Today, they hire Sullivans and Wonkettes with abandon; and they wonder why their readers abandon them?

  46. SteveG says:

    My spelling is the worst… influence… OK.

    I have sme very dear gay friends who are in a long term monogamous union.

    I’d kill for them. If someone were to abuse then for being gay, I’d attack… but since they are kinda muscular they don’t likely need me for that.

    I have a good friend who is lesbian. She is also in a long term relationship.

    Both couples would love to have their union sanctioned by the state as a marriage.

    I disagree and feel there should be a distinction between the way society recognizes traditional male/female unions and same sex unions…. based on biology and procreation, not upon religion.

    And I am very religious.

    I pray. I believe God speaks to me. I think I am unique in God’s eyes. I make decisions based on what I perceive to be answers to prayer.

    So what?

    Am I dangerous? (geez. I hope so on some level) but no.

    Do I follow my heart? So…?

    It is neat and tidy to categorize religious people as Flat Earthers who think the world is 6000 years old and all of evolution is a sham, but that does not begin to explore the diversity within evangelical Christianity… let alone within Catholicism and its Protestant offshoots.

    (By the way, outside of the nonsense in Ireland, … and even including that violence… the differences in opinion about the “nuance” of religion never rise to the level of hatred and violence that seems routine between Shia and Sunni, or from Muslim upon Christian and Jew… even if only by birth rather than faith)

    I pray for GWB and I prayed for Bill Clinton. My church regularly prays for the leadership of this country. Currently I think the bulk of the values of our majority are more aligned with the Republican party… although many of my Christian friends are anti war… but suddenly we are Hezbollah?

    I love the 1st Amendment so I rarely take umbrage over assaults on Christianity… but Hezbollah? That is hate speech… it isn’t true, it is intended to inflame and it attacks people who as a rule will not fight back.

    tw Andrew is on my shit *list*

  47. Some Guy in Chicago says:

    I agree, peter.  Sullivan was one of the people who got me interested in bloggers ande blogging.  His old blog was a daily must-read for me, up until his meltdown over the FMA.  Since then, it’s been sad to watch him spiral into hysteria and BDS.  His dishonest waffling on the 2004 election was troubling, and when he wrote his piece on Kerry being the true conservative choice in that election, that was it.  If he could’ve articulated honest reasons why he wanted to vote for Kerry (or some third party candidate), I could’ve respected that.  But what he wrote was ludicrous.

    for me it was his Katrina coverage (I missed most of the Kerry stuff, I guess) that pushed me away.

  48. squid vicious says:

    Wow, the amazing thing isn’t just that Mona’s point is way off base.  What’s amazing is that she simultaneously has her head way up both Glenn’s and Scott’s asses at the same time. She should take that act on the road.

    Also, I think if anyone ever accused me of embracing “death and other nasty things,” I’d just laugh.  Honestly, how old are you Mona?

  49. topsecretk9 says:

    Mona is not Greenwald’s sock puppet, but only because he didn’t need to invent her.

    OH, and here I thought J.K. Rowling’s did!

  50. Rob B. says:

    shut eye

    Dear 8lb 6oz baby Jesus, in your little gold lined diapers, watching your “Little Einstiens developmental videos.” You don’t even know a word yet, just lying in your baby Jesus bed. Please smite Andy Sullivan for his prancing and non-hetro ways and for making fun of your politically chosen. Nothing dramatic but a little baby Jesus smiting, just to straighten him out. Thank you baby Jesus and due sponsorships requirements that require me to include Powerade when I say grace, thank you for Poweraide and the new flavor Blueberry blast. Amen.

    That should cover it for this Christianist, lets go read some tracts and watch Davey and Goliath. He should have neve figured us out so well.

    /Sarcasm off

    cheese

  51. squid vicious says:

    The thing that bothers me about Andrew, and which I think was the eventual source of his meltdown, is his seeming obsession with being an iconoclast.  Beneath his tortured posturing, there is this hectoring voice yelling “hey, look at me, I’m a gay consevative!!  Can you believe it?  I’m so unconventional, I’m a gay, christian, conservative even!”

    And, basically, everybody was cool with it, except maybe Michelangelo Signorile and and a few other assorted assholes.  But somehow, that wasn’t good enough, so he had to one-up himself by proving that he could be a gay, christian, conservative, yet support a bunch of total assclowns in the loony left, Kerry being only specimen #1.  His convoluted justifications in doing so only served to prove that, dammit, he’s just so unconventional, and if you don’t get it, then you’re not as smart, thoughtful, and sensitive as Andrew.

    Also, Andrew, if you’re reading this, I want my $15 bucks back from your shitty little pledge drive.  Even better, keep the money, just promise to never tell anyone that I got conned by you for any amount of money.  Assclown.

  52. topsecretk9 says:

    Eyeya like grown-up Jeezsus, with a beeyerd Jeezsus,,,if you don’t mind… rasberry

  53. topsecretk9 says:

    Like I said earlier, I don’t care if Andrew has a need to abandon what he once believed because he’s a one-issue gay marriage wonder, it’s the obsessive pretending to prove that what he once believed abandoned him.

    Andrew is on a mission, and it’s within. He’s embarrassed he abandoned years of thought on one issue and is desperately trying to prove it’s not true—tearing down others. Deep down it must be enormously embarrassing– especially in front of peers who smell this from a mile away– if you believed you were a bigger thinker and find in all those years, what you said looked like utter BS.

    Have you ever heard a Gay favorite to straight guys?

    Dump the bitch and make the switch!

    That’s sorta of feel about Andrew.

    (Also, to be fair….really sick of all these “conservatives” who spout off the most anti-Semitic, anti-american screeds under this convenient cover that’s is just so much BS)

  54. Scot says:

    Sullivan is commenting on the role of religion in politics. He’s not making a case for moral equivalancy.

    That’s your interpretation.

  55. dog8myhmwk says:

    Praying … yeah, that’s an evil concept. In my denomination (Episcopal) we pray for the leaders of government and we pray for the safety of our troops. It’s not meant to be a Republican or Democratic prayer, but a heartfelt appeal for God to watch over and be with everyone because we can all use His help. (Amazing how that tw fits here.)

  56. topsecretk9 says:

    Do the Republicans know that the “Party of God” has already been trademarked? By Hezboll

    Yeah Scott, no moral equivalanc here….

    What does he mean by this then?

  57. Scot says:

    He’s not comparing the republican party to Hezbollah. He’s using Hez as a vivid, if extreme, example of why politics and religion don’t mix. That’s my interpretation.

  58. Meg Q says:

    Nothing dramatic but a little baby Jesus smiting, just to straighten him out.

    I’m a cranky (sometimes very cranky), old-school, practicing Catholic, but I gotta say, that’s funny.

    TW if only Andrew would be serious.

  59. wishbone says:

    why politics and religion don’t mix.

    OK, scot, now you’re just being dense.  6,000 years of human history pretty much add up to them mixing, so let’s stop with the artifical “wall” crap, ok?

    Sully’s point is pretty straight forward and if you can’t see the anti-Christian bias then you are, as I said, just being dense.

  60. Sean M. says:

    Jeez, scot, if you can’t cop to Sully’s moral equivalence, can you at least acknowledge that he’s engaging in a passive-agressive smear?

  61. marcus says:

    The blog known as “SullyWatch” hasn’t been updated since June 2nd.

    Of course, there’s no need to; he’s one of them now.

  62. Seerak says:

    OK, scot, now you’re just being dense.  6,000 years of human history pretty much add up to them mixing, so let’s stop with the artifical “wall” crap, ok?

    Cars are “artificial” too… do you walk everywhere?

    The separation of church and state hasn’t been around for 6000 years (unlike, say, tyranny and slavery).  Neither has the Internet.  Both are relatively recent advances.

    tw: Stupid is as stupid does.

  63. Rob Crawford says:

    Scot, the phrases “God’s Own Party” and “Party of God” did not come from the article Sullivan referenced. He added that in order to smear people who were simply praying for what they believe is the better outcome.

  64. dog8myhmwk says:

    Anyone want to join me in a prayer for the world this morning? No politics necessary.

    Anyone?

  65. oseaghdha says:

    Anyone want to join me in a prayer for the world this morning? No politics necessary.

    Dear God,

    Please kill those who need killin, spare those who need spared.

    Amen

  66. RiverCocytus says:

    Politics and religion mix. Especially when that religion is atheism.

    Need I say more?

    TW: What were we talking about again?

  67. DrSteve says:

    He’s using Hez as a vivid, if extreme, example of why politics and religion don’t mix.

    Like all those pesky abolitionists.  What a bunch of freaks!

    Look, I used to love to read Andrew, I’m an agnostic, and I support gay marriage (full stop, no half-measures)—I’ve never seen a real public policy argument against it.  But if Andrew doesn’t have the self-restraint to keep from going off like a pet-shop cockatiel when he reads something like that piece, he’s less of a public intellectual than he was even a year ago.

  68. goddessoftheclassroom says:

    Funny enough, I just want the best possible leader elected–that’s what I pray for.

    Naturally I believe that my candidate is that person, but I trust to the Lord.  Somestimes the winner is a great disappointment to send us a lesson on what NOT to vote for.  Sadly, some people don’t learn that.

    I would love Joe Lieberman to be the Democratic candidate because then I would feel America would have a good president no matter what.  In the last two elections, I was very worried about the Democratic candidate and very relieved when President Bush won.  No one has ever convinced me that Gore or Kerry would have been better.

    TW:  The boys can go home; the real man won.

  69. Parker says:

    A point – ‘separation of church and state’ is an extra-constitutional phrase. The two mentions of religion in the constitution say that (1) you can’t impose a religious test for holding office and (2) congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion.

    I’ve always taken the establishment clause to simply mean the feds can’t set up a national church.

    Hearing people squawk the phrase ‘separation of church and state’ like a mynah bird, with no understanding of the history behind it, makes my teeth itch. Especially when it is applied as a club against Christianity, as it most often seems to be.

  70. wishbone says:

    Cars are “artificial” too… do you walk everywhere?

    The separation of church and state hasn’t been around for 6000 years (unlike, say, tyranny and slavery).  Neither has the Internet.  Both are relatively recent advances.

    If Verc were here Seerak, he’d use his patented “How about shitting a point sometime soon?”

    Let’s see…by my count you’ve got two nonseqs and a total misreading of the Constitution there.  Just so I know where you stand, let’s do the check list:  Prayer = Hezbollah.  Got it.  And tyranny and slavery = politics + religion.  Note to self:  Check on the whole Marx opiate of the proletariat thing again.

  71. wishbone says:

    And just to be clear, as I have written before numerous times on PW: I have no problem with gay marriage.  None.

    But those of Sully’s ilk who paint the GOP as Taliban on gay issues are overlooking the political power and economic wealth of what is supposedly an oppressed class.

    Try a little perspective and a little less equivalency and maybe I won’t be quite as pissed off.

  72. Senor Juevos says:

    I remember when Sully was a pragmatic gay conservative. Now he’s just a crazy moonbat turd-burglar.

    TW: Social, as in “They won’t be happy until this entire country is social…ist.

  73. Slartibartfast says:

    engendered contentious internecine

    My spamblocker rejected this.

  74. natesnake says:

    Mmmmmmmmm, Catholic self hatred.  It’s almost as delicious as a Shoney’s Breakfast Buffet.

    “I’ll have the sausage links, pancakes, and melon slices.  You can keep the denial of gay marriage and prayer for world leaders.”

    “It looks like you’re running low on the cheese-grits.”

  75. Rusty. says:

    OK. That crack I made on the other thread? The one about your searsucker suit being gay? I take that back.

    TW married If I had to do it over again, I’d never get married.

  76. csr says:

    Dear God,

    Please kill those who need killin, spare those who need spared.

    Amen

    I remember reading somewhere that it’s a reliable sign you’ve created God in your own image when you notice that He hates all the same people you do.

  77. Major John says:

    Stigmatized Assholes

    Man, I remember the night they played at the Emerald Isle – I was working door.  I never thought my knuckles would heal after all the punches I threw…

    Squid – $15?!  I gave that dude $50 right before I left for Afghanistan.  He never even responded to my offer to send pictures and reports.  Glenn Reynolds did, however, and I became his Afghanistan Correspondent for a year.  I didn’t even have to give him money so he could lay around in his hammock and not work for a month.

    He lost me in mid 2004.

  78. See the problem with getting a bunch of people together to pray for a political canidate is you never know exactly what those people might be praying for.  How many libs prayed for… opps nevermind… didn’t think that through…

  79. Slartibartfast says:

    searsucker suit

    Um, that’s seersucker.  AS in:

    My jacket’s gonna be cut and slim and checked,

    Maybe a touch of seersucker, with an open neck.

  80. Major John says:

    I remember reading somewhere that it’s a reliable sign you’ve created God in your own image when you notice that He hates all the same people you do.

    Only if you implore the Almighty to kill those you think need killin’ and spare those who need sparin’.

  81. RiverCocytus says:

    Agreed. He usually makes that decision on His own. I guess it depends on your definition of “Thy will be done”?

  82. Slartibartfast says:

    I think mostly the way people use it is something like: “please give me what I want; so much the better if it was what You intended anyway”.

  83. Terry says:

    He’s not comparing the republican party to Hezbollah. He’s using Hez as a vivid, if extreme, example of why politics and religion don’t mix. That’s my interpretation.

    So Sullivan’s politics aren’t influenced by his ‘gay friendly’ version of Catholicism? He mixes his religion into politics in his blog with abandon.

    And what the heck does Andy, the good Christian, do when a politician who agrees with him re gay marriage runs for office? Pray for him to succeed? NOT pray for him to succeed? How does he untie this gordian knot?

  84. The Ace says:

    He’s not comparing the republican party to Hezbollah. He’s using Hez as a vivid, if extreme, example of why politics and religion don’t mix. That’s my interpretation.

    Um, except they do mix.

    And I suggest you look up the term “divine providence” and pretend you can understand it.

    TW: big

    I’ll just leave that one alone…

  85. Squid says:

    The best Bazooka Joe fortune ever:

    Patience is a virtue.  Seersucker is a fabric.

    Sage wisdom, which truly stands the test of time.  I only wish I’d held on to that comic…

  86. Slartibartfast says:

    Sage is an herb.

  87. SarahW says:

    What Andrew Sullivan wants is health insurance benefits and tax breaks, not marriage, per se.  Plus a redefinition of marriage that gives no edge to heterosexual relationships, even though those are the only ones that produce children as a result of the sexual activity marriage is supposed to constrain.

    OFF TOPIC – Is there some kind of crazy super-secret spyware or cookie deal on this site now?  Because Protein Wisdom, and only PW, is crashing my poor old windows machine most every visit.  Just wondering if something has been added lately.

    I’m using an old Imac now, apparently it can take the heat.

    TW: Hard drive busted

  88. Sidewinder says:

    Herb is my gay neighbor.  Amazing how these discussions all come back around!

  89. McGehee says:

    Herb is a Tarlek.

  90. McGehee says:

    Herb is my gay neighbor.

    You have a Tarlek living next door to you???

    So, what’s happened to property values there lately?

  91. Attention lileks shoppers says:

    Tarleks is a store (…a major discount shopping chain where pundits and small girls buy my little ponies.)

  92. N. O'Brain says:

    Note to self:  Check on the whole Marx opiate of the proletariat thing again.

    Posted by wishbone | permalink

    on 08/15 at 08:26 AM

    No, Marxism is the opiate of the intellectual.

  93. Patricia says:

    Have Bryson’s people started the beheadings yet?

  94. Jeff Goldstein says:

    I haven’t made any changes to the site, Sarah.

    Did have some network trouble last night, though.

  95. Bender says:

    I’ve always taken the establishment clause to simply mean the feds can’t set up a national church.

    Why?  Just because that’s what the “words” in the Constitution “mean?” How paleolithic of you!

    Some of the Founding Fathers owned slaves, man!  Who are they to tell us anything?  Modern judges (like in, say, the Ninth Circuit) are so much smarter than the so-called “Founding Fathers.”

  96. ahem says:

    …going off like a pet-shop cockatiel…

    Beautiful.

  97. Rusty. says:

    seersuckersmearsucker. I only spelled it that way because Jeff did. He’s the english mechanics, grammer, usage, type person. I’m just an extremely intelligent sewage farm attendant.

  98. Chairman Me says:

    Isn’t the Salvation Army a semantic equivalent to Hezbollah? And how dare those Salvation Army folks wear their hearts on their sleaves, right?

  99. KM says:

    Chuck Colson, BC: “Mr. President, we could fire Katyusha rockets into DNC headquarters.”

    Nixon: “But that would be wrong!”

  100. No, Marxism is the opiate of the intellectual.

    No… opium is the opiate of the masses and the intellectuals.

Comments are closed.