Correlation is not causation, Mr. Carney. And it’s best such distinctions be made. Just so we’re clear.
— And just so’s we keep happy’s head from rudely exploding.
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Recent Comments
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Too late. His head exploded without even reading this. Somehow, he knew.
The only conclusion that someone who is paying attention could arrive at is that Tea Party types are primarily worried about the rate that money is getting spent. They are also small government types, but that is most likely tied to spending; a smaller government simply will not spend as much money.
I’m sure there are plenty of social cons in the mix, but I think most realize that you have to fix the spending issue before you can even think about side issues. I think the most you might get now is a call for a stop to public funding of abortions, and I also think that’s about as much as you’ll ever get.
Correlation is not causation
I’d say not. I’d say the correlation is actually between pro-abortion groups and pro-big government groups.
Is it just me, or it that inexcusably shoddy writing followed by inexcusably shoddy editing? Why state it as fact if it ain’t true, just to then point out that it ain’t true?
I’m sure there are plenty of social cons in the mix, but I think most realize that you have to fix the spending issue before you can even think about side issues. I think the most you might get now is a call for a stop to public funding of abortions, and I also think that’s about as much as you’ll ever get.
It think the way Mark Steyn put it is the problem with most government programs isn’t that they’re too expensive, it’s that they’re things the government shouldn’t be doing in the firstplace. That’s an idea that most social conservatives can get behind.
I’d say there’s a fair amount of causation there as well.
Undeniably staunch.
Who is this side-show barker fella Mr Carney?
It seems good people are, well, good people, fiscally and socially.
The whole thing is shoddy, Pablo. What the article shows is that pro-abortion groups give a shit-load of money to big-gov’t liberals in both political parties. Abortion in incidental to the primary losses of Murkowski et. al.
I told you this would happen and now the toothpaste and the tube are a lot unreconcilable
He’s the examiner’s senior political columnist, serr8d. This is a rebuilding season for the Examiner. I understand the J-V show’s some potential, however.
He’s certainly not Dr. Jack Wheeler.
Heh.
I agree, Ernst. I was just addressing the abortion issue, but I would hope that most would be satisfied simply with the government not doing things they shouldn’t be doing, and not trying to change behavior by making illegal things they do not approve of. In any case, a lot of behaviors can be changed by removing the economic incentive, or by just making it so everyone has to pay for the consequences of their actions. Again, I think that will be enough for most of the social cons, as opposed to the caricature of them that usually gets paraded around.
happyfeet, maybe you should consider that the article was written to promote the very reaction you’re having. Oh noes! lifeydoodles! Now I have to stay home!
So they show their equal opportunity hiring processes by showing off a moron huh? See, we’re fair, we hire eeeequally. Now get in our big tent.
14 was for 4.
cranky, my sense of it is that, broadly speaking, they’re too kinds of social conservatives. One kind want the government to leave them the hell alone, and they’re pushing back against the gov’t sponsored (usually via the courts) ubiquity of liberal/progressive “culture” into damn near every aspect of their lives. The second kind, the Huckabee and Buchanan kind, want to use gov’t the same way the liberals have. While their values may be traditional, I don’t think they’re conservative so much as populist.
The Senate ringleader of this rowdy bunch is DeMint, a passionate pro-life conservative.
I think he fancies this to be true. Whether true or not I think the fact remains that this white trash christer 80’s-throwback moral majority DeMint piece of shit shows every sign of wanting to hijack the Tea Party for Jesus.
Just you wait until they start calling ’em racists.
I smell unstaunched hatreds.
I think DeMint just wants to beat back the progressive statist onslaught and he’ll work with anybody he has to do that –even confuzzled Christophobic pikachus.
I’ve long held that 9 out of 10 ‘social issues’ are really fiscal/scope-of-government issues. Scale back government and they cease to be issues.
Pretty much all of the time, these social issues rise in response to governments attempt at top down social engineering.
Get the government out of judicial activism and abortion becomes a local state issue.
“Whether true or not I think the fact remains that this white trash christer 80?s-throwback moral majority DeMint piece of shit shows every sign of wanting to hijack the Tea Party for Jesus.”
Here we go…
It’s a Tea-Party hijacking troika of DeMint, Palin, and Glenn Beck…
Carney isn’t completely off his gourd:
“[P]arty loyalty is a lie used to make conservatives more obedient.”
and O’Donnell, Mr. Reed… she’s done a lot of the heavy lifting past couple weeks
If it gets all Jesus-fucked I’m a shake Tea Party off I’m a get up on this horse I’m a ride off to the sunset look back with no remorse.
And millions of others will do the same.
I think Michael Jackson said it best when he said:
Beat it. Beat it. Beat it.
No one wants to be da fetus.
Human or monkey, ‘choc-late or white.
It doesn’t matter, ‘bortin’ is right.
Just beat it.
Couple mods, that could pass for a Nishi sentence. Are we sure ‘feets isn’t who we think he is ?
abortions are wholly and utterly irrelevant to arresting the failshit death spiral what America has launched herself into… totally not relevant at all at all at all
serr8d that’s CocoRosie not nishi it’s from a song about how something innocent and good was defiled
‘feets, study @23 Mr. Entropy’s comment. Carefully, if you would.
This is the next attempt to marginalize the Tea Party. Make people believe they are just social cons and you alienate not only independents, but those within the ‘big tent’ that despise the social cons. Something tells me that establishment types will swallow this hook, line, and sinker. Look for this angle from all media outlets soon. I predict they’ll enlist some new/old allies in the form of primary losers to push this.
abortion as a province of the state is not the fucking promised land – white trash christers growing the fuck up and crediting people with the ability to think and decide about abortion and other issues for themselves without federal or state government coercion is what’s consonant with the liberty America promises.
as a province of the *states* I mean
abortions are wholly and utterly irrelevant to arresting the failshit death spiral what America has launched herself into… totally not relevant at all at all at all
In the sense that abortion is a cancer in our body-politic and the out-of-control spending is hemorrhaging us to death, I happen to agree. Gotta stop the bleeding before we can treat the cancer.
Not me. If small government fiscal conservatives get elected and succeed in beating back spending, onerous taxation, and the reach of government, they can wear eyeblack with Bible verses and do themselves a TD dance for Jesus, for all I care.
If after having done that they wish to set about telling me that I then have to close my liquor store on Sundays, we’ll have a big problem.
Thing is, those types are either cartoons or, when it comes down to it, statists. Who’d do well to take the pulse of the country before moving forward with social programs of any stripe that make demands on the electorate.
If it gets all Jesus-fucked I’m a shake Tea Party off I’m a get up on this horse I’m a ride off to the sunset look back with no remorse.
Then go already – your emotional tantrums when you don’t get your way are boring.
Mr. Jeff I think at this point of the game the white trash christers just want to feel validated and relevant… the central arguments in American political life have absolutely nothing to do with their bullshit agenda, and they’re starting to feel marginalized.
Nothing would suit me more than abortion becoming a state-level issue. That way, we could bleed some of these bloody murderous sorts out of Red (see what I did there?) States and confine ’em to California, New York, Illinois, in whatever hotbed of disgrace they want to live in. States should be ideologically different like that; this Federal idea of ‘every state must behave the same’ isn’t what the founders had in mind. I don’t want to live in a blue state or a blue city; if this keeps up, there will be no ideological distinctions, just a common level of unacceptable lackadaisical soft-gels from coast to coast.
It is possible abortion related votes contributed to their losses, but I do not recall much discussion about abortion issues in any of these primaries. Did I miss it?
Most of the debate was about fiscal conservatism and limiting government.
Honestly, this lifeydoodle stuff is just silly. Abortion ain’t going nowhere. With us to stay. it’s just hysteria to get upset that a few candidates are prolife.
Cupcakes. have a few cupcakes.
And, as mentioned up there – if small government types decide they want to extract $$ from abortions/funding, that is consistent with the philosophy that “I” shouldn’t have to pay for “your” abortion.
Your own body. Your own conscience. Your own dime.
(but, as an aside, since kids are now kids until they’re 26th, perhaps we should extend parental notification laws to extend …)
I think that if the MFM or happyfeet want to tie Tea Partiers to an anti-abortion position, they should probably wait until actual Teapartiers are out running around screaming about the abortions. As is, this is but rank speculation and projection from those that wish to portray them in such a manner.
26th=26.
Even if Roe was reversed today, I doubt many states would ban abortions significantly.
It is possible abortion related votes contributed to their losses, but I do not recall much discussion about abortion issues in any of these primaries. Did I miss it?
Well, doesn’t matter. If they’re lifeydoodle, they’re lifeydoodle.
Growing the fuck up (as you put it) and accepting adult responsibility for participating in grown-up procreative activities instead whining about how unfair it is and demanding a do over is how most of us white trash christers look at happyfeet. You can’t have liberty without responsibility, or so it seems to me.
Mr. Jeff I think at this point of the game the white trash christers just want to feel validated and relevant… th
Do you know any white trash christers?
I mean, I *think* I know some of the folks/types you’re talking about (middle to lower-middle class religious folk)- and believe me, they aren’t talking about abortion right now. At. All.
You know that has never gotten in the way of things, Angle, O’Donnell, Paul, are resolute on the spending issue, that’s what they are running on, the other part is just a proxy.
Almost as if some party intended it that way, huh?
JD I want the Tea Party to resist being hijacked by lifeydoodles. But the perception is definitely growing that this is what has happened. You can tell just from talking to people. We’re at a point where the Tea Party needs to respond in some way. They had an up with people rally when they were accused of being racists. What will they do in response to being accused of fronting for white trash lifeydoodle Christers?
Me I’m curious to see.
Comment by Carin on 9/23 @ 8:47 am #
They’re the cartoon villians that populate his bigoted mind. Rent free.
Carin I think you’re right that most lifeydoodles have their head square in the game… I think the House pledge thingy is sort of a nice testament to that.
‘feets. Lifeydoodles ARE SYNONYMOUS WITH Tea Partyers. Isn’t that the entire point Mr. Carney was attempting to make? There’s no real push right now, anywhere, to make this a front-burner issue. Except in yours, and others of similar hatey minds, of course.
What will they do in response to being accused of fronting for white trash lifeydoodle Christers?
See that comment for a nice example of class, race, and religious bigotry.
Good going champ – your campaign to alienate everyone who agrees with you on fiscal policy continues unabated.
It is outrageous, though that these white trash lifeyddodle Christers actually think they have the right to free speech, isn’t it?
I mean, who do they think they are, citizens? We all know they’re sub-something-or-other.
You can tell just from talking to people.
Huh. that’s funny. Cause when I talk to people, I find that half of them don’t know what the fuck they’re talking about. I usually try to set them straight.
Some guy told me the other day how impressed he was with the recent town hall; that they had asked Obama “hard questions” and that the audience appeared to not have been hand selected. He thought he knew. But, he was completely wrong.
See. Talking to people doesn’t tell you shit.
Lifeydoodles ARE SYNONYMOUS WITH Tea Partyers.
um. No they’re not. Or at least they didn’t use to be.
Carin I just mean that among their misperceptions are many ones about what the Tea Party stands for.
Heh. You just haven’t polled enough of ’em I don’t think.
Other than Timmy Carney, the only person who seems to think the Tea-Party movement is being hijacked is you. Why is that?
This morning I heard the CBS spokescritters for state-run media saying that the GOP plan for American or whatever Boehner et. al. are calling it, doesn’t go far enough for the Tea-Party people. I bet ABC and NBC did too. Any thoughts on why they would report that?
white trash lifeydoodle christers can bibble babble all they want Mikey nobody’s trying to take away their speechings… they just don’t get to do it in the Tea Party’s name and if the Tea Party allows them to do so then they Tea Party will have to own that
then *the* Tea Party will have to own that
I want the Tea Party to resisk being taken over by bigots like happyfeet.
Ernst Mr. serr8d seems to think that lifeydoodles have a lot hijacked the Tea Party. I don’t think it’s one of them fait accompli things yet.
I could give a flying fuck about the perception. Are you going to only accept pro-choice fiscal conservatives? Who gives a shit what they think about abortion, it is not part of their platform of issues, so why indulge the MFM and make it one? How does the “Tea Party” respond to a demonstrable lie about the racisms or the abortions? The only way these get conflated is if you all them to.
and
http://thebulletin.us/articles/2010/09/18/top_stories/doc4c95680fc2ee3861831178.txt
http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2010/sep/10091512.html
http://lifenews.com/state5468.html
Shahada 2.0: There is no staunchiness but “ABORTIONS FOR ALL!”, and happyfeet is its prophet.
Well it probably doesn’t it’s like O’Douls with less flavor, which goes to show you, that Powerpoint is the Devil’s Tool. ‘palm pilots’ work better
they just don’t get to do it in the Tea Party’s name
Other than you and nishi and Carney, where is a lifeydoodle preaching the abortions in the name of the Tea Party?
We might could’ve used those 52 million additional taxpayers to pay off some of the debts incurred by baby boomers retiring. Unless of course they all would’ve became moochers, in which case, I should rethinky my lifeydoodleness.
/sarcyness
I’ll only accept pro-choice fiscal conservatives if we’re talking about limited government being the ultimate goal. I’ve been under the impression that the Tea Party is about limited government and liberty. People who think the government should be imbued with the moral authority to tell people whether or not they can have abortions are not working towards a goal of limited government.
Comment by Ernst Schreiber on 9/23 @ 8:57 am #
Other than Timmy Carney, the only person who seems to think the Tea-Party movement is being hijacked is you. Why is that?
I would think it would be hard to hijack something that has no leadership or organization. i thought it was a bunch of people who agreed that fiscal policy needs to be changed, and other issues weren’t as important. Seems I was wrong, Ernst. It seems that they have to unite on fiscal policy – and have the exact same stance on all other issues like happyfeet or he gets all emotional, teary, and passive-aggressive abusive.
He has sort of an ‘Ike Turner to Tina Turner’ relationship with others who don’t believe exactly the same way he does and have the gall to state that difference in public.
Needs to mature a little bit more I think.
where is a lifeydoodle preaching the abortions in the name of the Tea Party?
JD serr8d is doing just that right here in this thread
‘feets, government became involved in 1973. Do you not see a problem with that ?
Yeah, ‘feets, I am MR TEA PARTY INCARNATE. Hear me ROAR~!
No I do not.
Where has the Tea Party, not nishit not some MFM person not you, but where has the Tea Party indicated that they have expanded their focus from fiscal issues, limited government, and liberty? Give examples.
Any motivated person with a soap box and an audience can create a particular “perception” of the Tea Party and what it’s about.
Me, I haven’t heard a peep out of the movement about abortion. That some who agitate for small government and responsible spending happen also to be pro-life is as incidental as the fact that many of them happen to be pro-choice, as well.
serr8d speaks for himself. I did not realize that individuals get to speak on behalf of a wildly diverse group of people nationwide. Congrats on the promotion, serr8d.
I’ll only accept pro-choice fiscal conservatives if we’re talking about limited government being the ultimate goal.
Sounds like your tea party is going to consist of you and a half dozen stuffed animals. Me? I’ll go along with my fellow citizens who do not believe exactly like I do on everything.
That’s because I grew up and stopped being a petualnt brat who would throw a tantrum when everything didn’t go my way.
But suit yourself bigotfeet.
So, Mr. ‘feets, how many other issues do you think that Government should attend to? Given your
and all.
I have no examples JD. This is just a test of the defcon 4 lifeydoodle encroachment early warning system. If this had been an actual emergency then the Tea Party would be a lot screwed.
Yes, JD, and my first decree will be a Titans win against the foul NY Giants on Sunday.
Let me think on the Colts…who they playin’?
You have no examples because it is not happening outside of a subset of people who appear to want it to happen.
serr8d I think the government should deal with a very limited set of issues
You have no examples because it is not happening outside of a subset of people who appear to want it to happen.
Exactly.
Quelle surprise.
except exactly wasn’t supposed to be italicky
So do I, ‘feets, so do I. You seem to approve of more government involvement than I do, though.
We are playing @ Denver. I hope Teblow plays ;-)
hello?
If we wait for examples it’s too late.
That small subset of people I was referring to included the MFM, happyfeet, and nishit.
The Broncos should hire Jim Hoft as their new head coach.
We have Denver Oct. 3. Wear ’em down for us a bit, huh? )
I take that you approve a preemptive strike against lifeydoodles, ‘feets?
You’re losing me here.
here is good news for the Party of Tea
it goes on…
‘feets, Colorado is blue blue blue. Reminds me of an overly large Sedona.
still Mr. serr8d I think this is good news
You’re supposed to have a ‘decent interval’ after you’re elected to go squish
And if you’ll squish over that, you’ll probably squish over tax increases as well. Hey, that debt isn’t going to pay itself down you know.
I’d still vote for Buck. I don’t need purity of vision. I’m not staunch like that.
This is just another sad attempt to identity group a grassroots movement that contains elements of all the previously constructed identity groups. This attempt won’t work either.
” Who’d do well to take the pulse of the country before moving forward with social programs of any stripe that make demands on the electorate.”
This is the problem with the whole abortion issue. It was imposed by men in black, instead of men in congress, acting as representatives of the people.
Forgot to take the sock off.
This is just another sad attempt to identity group a grassroots movement that contains elements of all the previously constructed identity groups. This attempt won’t work either.
I hope you’re right cause the Tea Party is the last best hope for mankind.
Not Glee?
Just to test the hypothesis, give me a prochoice senator that’s solid on the spending and tax issue.
probably also Glee
give me a senator that’s solid on the spending and tax issue
If we wait for examples it’s too late.
So we should just put a .45 through your skull now? I mean, someday you might attempt to kill someone, and if we wait for examples, it’s too late.
Idiot. Go fellate Patterico some more.
DeMint probably is the best on spending and taxes you’re right
Comment by george smiley on 9/23 @ 9:39 am #
Just to test the hypothesis, give me a prochoice senator that’s solid on the spending and tax issue.
I think happyfeet’s right as far as the Senate goes, I don’t think there is one who’s both pro-abortion and anti-tax ‘n spend. In the House, maybe Ron Paul, but I don’t know where he is on the Life issue.
On the other hand, if it’s next to impossible to find those solid votes on taxing and spending, what does that say about the value of the “fiscal” conservative label? At the end of the day, it’s got to be about the scope of government’s proper role. Otherwise, we’re just debating the best way to pay for the social-welfare apparatus.
Judd Gregg is pretty good on fiscal issues, but he’s bugging out.
“Mr. Jeff I think at this point of the game the white trash christers just want to feel validated and relevant…”
But you don’t see it that way regarding gay marriage versus civil unions, right?
How about we just make sure that the Feds aren’t paying for abortions? That they stop sponsoring the culling of the herd.
I don’t see what’s wrong with letting the states decide something that’s probably shouldn’t be in the federal purview anyway. YMMV.
The real bottom line is that no one is “banning” abortion. As Ric often notes, astutely, that goving the feds that power begs for the same level of power to be abused anither time in a way you possibly may not agree with either.
Pah. Numbah One: there is no Tea Party with capital letters and charismatic leaders and an organizational hierarchy and all that. This is deliberate. The fictional character “Miles Vorkosigan” notes that leadership is generally a matter of finding a parade and getting in front with a baton. Perhaps I’m the only one who’s noticed that people who do that have consistently gotten shot in the back as soon as they turn around and start prancing. The One Who Must Not Be Named (in order to keep happyfeet from hyperventilating) has carefully avoided claiming such leadership; she claims, and acts on, alliance but nothing else.
Numbah Two, with a bullet: It has been Christian doctrine ever since the rise of Protestantism forced the Catholic Church to be a religious organization instead of a political one that you cannot prevent sin, especially by using force. Sin is a matter of intent; not everybody adopts the Catholic notion of “two sins for the price of one”, but those that don’t regard the act as nothing more than the visible part of a sin. The correct way to address the matter is on doctrinal grounds, most especially not by issuing insults such as “lifeydoodle”, which will merely get backs up and reinforce previous positions.
The murder thing is a nonstarter. Murder is a State matter because it reduces socioeconomic activity — you cannot have either good business or effective debate if the People are afraid to get out in the street. The only thin wedge along that line of reasoning that allows State intervention is the notion that the aborted babies might grow up to be taxpayers, and if that’s your argument you are standing shoulder to shoulder with Mr. Orszag, who proposed that tax cuts be left in place until the people they’re addressed to accumulate enough to be worth stealing.
I can testify from personal experience that that line of reasoning, and others parallel to it, works on “lifeydoodles” where insult and dismissal do not, and in fact are a good-sized part of the impetus behind tea parties in the first place.
Regards,
Ric
How about we just make sure that the Feds aren’t paying for abortions?\
ok that sounds good but as a % of the budget maybe not the biggest deal in the whole whirl
I don’t see what’s wrong with letting the states decide something that’s probably shouldn’t be in the federal purview anyway.
shit it’s 9 and I haven’t showered
“This morning I heard the CBS spokescritters for state-run media saying that the GOP plan for American or whatever Boehner et. al. are calling it, doesn’t go far enough for the Tea-Party people. I bet ABC and NBC did too. Any thoughts on why they would report that?”
I’m shocked, SHOCKED!, Ernst.
Unfortunately, while running a few errands I also heard Glenn Beck saying essentially the same thing. I guess he’s the arbiter of all things Tea-Party too.
I’m thinking that after the elections, the New Congress will be taking up a lot of Paul Ryan’s suggestions; and not any abortion banning.
“We might could’ve used those 52 million additional taxpayers to pay off some of the debts incurred by baby boomers retiring. Unless of course they all would’ve became moochers, in which case, I should rethinky my lifeydoodleness.”
There’s a lot to be said for this serr8d.
Man. I never get to be Ringleader. It’s not fair!!
“…taking up a lot of Paul Ryan’s suggestions…”
To take this one issue aside for a moment, apart from the abortion questions, I’m not so sure whether this is going to have legs, though for reasons having to do with the stance of the Democrats, rather than the stance of the conservatives. My sense is the only way serious changes to the entitlement regime comes about is in a grand compromise between the two parties. In other words, it won’t be sufficient to have only the one party in favor of acting, which is why, I think, Mitch Daniels proposed his “truce” — that is, he did it with a view to bringing the nation together to address what he sees as a universal difficulty, one which must surmount any partisan divide.
The truth is Bob, that it probably does come up short of what it could be. Spending Freezes aren’t sufficient, we need spending cuts, but that’s a damn hard sell. Especially to the politicians who’ve been beat up for wanting to starve childrens and oldsters and poor people. But Repealing ObamaCare and cutting taxes are good, so let’s not make the perfect the enemy of the good.
You have a point sdferr. Personally, I think there’s going to have to be some grand unified compromise by which a series of measures are passed in succession, reforming entitlements and adopting a flat tax system.
I like Ryan’s roadmap plan and believe it to be a workable solution. Will I like the cuts in defense spending? No, that goes against my knee-jerk hawkish national security oriented instincts-for a variety of reasons.
Number one being an ascendant China, and number 2 being a resurging Russia.
But, overall, his plan is the only one I’ve seen that seems viable. And you’re right, it will take bi-partisan agreement to enact it. Otherwise, the usual cheap demagoguery may kill it off.
I agree Ernst,
But the toughest nuts to crack will be the entitlements, which dominate the budget monetarily.
Hell, I’d like to see spending rolled back to 1998 levels! Maybe even further, except, as I said to sdferr, I fear that slashing defense will have a disastrous consequence down the road.
For instance, we’re currently shrinking the size of the blue-water Navy at a time when China is expanding theors; on the back of our trade surpluses that they enjoy. I realize that, currently, no one will challenge us except assymetrically. But, if we slip far enough, just as in 1941, we may arrive at a rude awakening where we can’t protect our interests suddenly; in an era where the time available to “gear up” for a conflict will be measured in weeks and days, instead of years.
It’s just a for instance regarding a pet issue of mine, but it’s a direction we;ve been heading since Mr. Clinton’s forst term. A direction I’ve never liked, nor thought prudent. YMMV.
/end of OT military spending rant
And it appears, if we here are correct, along with Paul Ryan himself, it appears I say, that no grand unified compromise can be possible under the diagnosis we have drawn, namely, that the ongoing argument between the parties is an argument over ends, not means; that until such time as that argument has been won — one way or another by one contestant or the other — no compromise over questions at the heart of the divide can possibly be decided. So we will have to await the outcome of the more fundamental fight at hand.
That makes sense sdferr. Unfortunately, I don’t think a truce would bring the Dems to the table in any meaningful way. The entitlement regime is a matter of social justice, the ultimate social issue. They’ll insist that cutting entitlements is off the table. That means the only way they’re going to come onboard with the program of returning to constitutional principles of limited government is by means of a drubbing at the polls greater than that recieved by the GOP in the 1930s. The Democrats are going to have to become the me too!, just not so fast, or as small! party before what you want to accomplish comes about.
this thread is devolving into a serious discussion of the ideas of Mr. Ryan and Mr. Daniels
that’s kinda neat
Paul Ryan on the “Pledge”
http://twitter.com/RepPaulRyan/status/25322084999
Actually a link to his link.
I love military spend Bob, Everytime I see video of a missle or a smart bomb blowing up some terrorist sonofabitch who desperately deserves it, I get the satisfaction of know that in that instance, my tax dollars have been well spent.
Good point sdferr,
Perhaps this election will, in part, answer the question of what the public’s ideas of those ends are based on who they send to Wshington and their respective state houses.
that was supposed to be spending. Have a mentioned that I like to annoy my liberal acquaintances by telling them I’m an unreconstructed Cold-Warrior?
part of the unavoidable price of American profligacy will be a less free and less safe world I think
“Unfortunately, I don’t think a truce would bring the Dems to the table in any meaningful way. The entitlement regime is a matter of social justice, the ultimate social issue.”
I am not sure whether the gesture would be meaningful to the opposition in the end or no, though I do think Daniels is well aware of the various possibilities. I think though, from Daniel’s point of view that he believes it would be well to sheath as many knives as his side can safely sheath, so the to better entice the opposition to the table to see whether a discussion of the apocalypticity (new word! yay!) of the entitlement programs can even be had. Is how I read it.
The reason I’m unperturbed about this is because the Tea parties are a direct response to something. What was it? Was it that abortion just became legal or it’s occurrence just spiked to crazily high levels? Nope. Rick Santelli wasn’t complaining about abortion from the trading floor.
What happened was the progressives went crazy with new spending and new programs. And the Tea parties are the response. Cause. Effect. If the stimulus wasn’t so clear cut the hijackings and the conflations might make some inroads. But that’s not the case.
That’s true sdferr, and that means the argument is never going to end, because their end is Utopia. And we need to convince our side of that first, before we can start convincing the middle and the soft supporters of their side. Because compromise with the left will literarally get you NOWHERE. So the only option left is to defeat them.
I’d like to hear more high profile discussion of Daniels ideas, by Daniels himself of course. But we need the “truce” he spoke of; not only from “lifeydoodleness” but also from the latest “more-conservative-than-thou” fratericide.
Sometimes it seems like one-upmanship to me, and others the zeal of recent converts. And that zeal is OK really, but speaking as one who has been “staunch” since the late 70’s, I’d prefer not to be lectured on proper conservative thought by folks that languished about doing bong-hits and make faux-philisophical excuses about “their vote not really counting” to explain why they never paid attention up until now.
At the risk of being God-bothery, I want the whole tea-party movement to be in the vein of Matthew 13:8 and not 13:5 and 13:6
Translation for the non-God-Bothery: I want these seeds to have been sown on deep, rich, soil to foourish, and not on rocky, or shallow soil, to burn brightly but for only a short time.
“The Democrats are going to have to become the me too!, just not so fast, or as small! party before what you want to accomplish comes about.”
I agree about this. Very much in fact. However, the problem I think I see is that the Democrats who will remain standing are precisely the Democrats least apt to change, or to say another way, the Democrats most ideologically hide bound and protected in their hideboundedness by their equally hide bound constituencies.
– It’s interesting as hell, watching all the attacks and attempts to hijack the T-party movement, and every damn one has failed miserably so far, and every one will continue to do so.
– It all started with the NAACP thinking all they had to do was scream racist, and the T-party would fade away to yesterdays news.
– That went well. They ended up with one of their own jumping the hark so badly all they wanted was for it all to go away. What have you heard from them lately?
– The Left is so desperate at this point they’ll try anything, and nothing is going to work. My only concern, and I’ve seen it underneath some of the PW contingent comments lately, is that as the frustration grows, and the realization this is real and there’s no stopping it, violence will erupt.
– The soft underbelly of America, the griefer.grey market/victimhood cults are not given to going quietly.
– feets and others are having a hard time believing and not getting distracted.
– Doesn’t matter. This express will roll on.
– You saw what the one lady said at the phony rally against Brietbart the other day. “November is coming…..this is about Novembers elections….”.
– The marginal free lunch crowd is shitting their pants, along with the Unions. Anyone with a ticket to ride is scared blind of what will happen if/when the power changes hands.
– Personally I don’t blame them.
Ernst @129.
Me too. That’s why I was happy, in a sense, when Obama’s ideological leanings allowed me to use the word “communists” again, freely, as a term of derision.
Oh, on Daniels’ truce, I don’t think it would bring the progressives on board. I think it would split the progressives from the rest of their party.
Yes, they believe entitlements are about social justice. But, they’re only a wing of that party and aren’t represented amongst the independents/moderates at all.
oh, I didn’t refresh to see Ernst’s 133 before producing the now redundant 135
freedom I won’t let you down I will not give you up
So since we here pretty much agree on the course of events, it only remains to figure out how small the ideological remnant must become until they, like the king supporting Tories of old, choose to pick up and get the hell out of Dodge, to pluck from another era.
“…but also from the latest “more-conservative-than-thou” fratericide.”
Didn’t Jesus also have a saying along the lines of “the assholes you will always have with you, but my time here is short.”?
bh, I think it’s going to be very hard to split the Democrats, simply because the Democrats to get won’t be there to get because they’ll arlready have been got this November. So to speak.
“…get the hell out of Dodge…”
– The tickets have already been printed and are available for the noon stagecoach.
– Bumbblefucks cabinet of thieves and Social enginner’s are all haggling over departure times and seats near the emergency exits.
Good point sdferr.
You must not have listened to Elisabeth Warren on Squawk this morning BBH.
– The Dems (that group that represents all the hard left types like Proggs, Marxists, etc, will not be split and don’t need to be. What will be split from the Dems is the Imdependents and moderates, the groups that the Left used to achieve this cluster fuck in the first place.
sdferr, I’d guess they need to be reduced to a rump of about 100 – 150 members in the House and 30 -40 in the Senate, and unable to win the White House for 5 or 6 cycles. And at the state level, reduced to the Northeast and West Coast, splitting the rust belt states around the Great Lakes.
Oh, and I suppose MN as well. Too many fucking Scandis.
There is something to that, Ernst. Yes, it does matter what those numbers look like going into 2012.
– No I did not catch that sdferr. In brief what did she have to say?
I don’t know MN politics but it seems that Wisco turning bright red would be a very encouraging sign for your prospects.
“In brief what did she have to say?”
In brief she said: “I am the Queen of you. I am here to fix all your earthly woes. Trust me.”
It would be bh, since WI suffers from the same scandi affliction as MN. All those early 20th century progressive ideas that clog up the mind like crisco clogs arteries.
Fucking Hegel.
She thinks the 1st Amendment, has gotten out of hand, specially the right to redress of grievances, and should be dialed back
Don’t let the worldspirit hear you say that!
Seriously, I’m not following your point.
early 20th century progressive ideas –> German idealism my brother
– Well then she’ll be thanked curtiously and then left to her own devices.
– The T=party is not a party. It’s an idea of individuality and self determination, and regaining that power and respect for American values through individual action, the vote.
– Maybe by November 3rd everyone will finally understand that, including feets and all the would be “leaders”.
She thinks the 1st Amendment, has gotten out of hand, specially the right to redress of grievances, and should be dialed back
When leftists like her start insisting on an absolute interpretation of the 2nd, because they’re afraid conservatives will come for them in the middle of the night, then we’ll know we’re winning.
German idealism. Gotchya. Might as well damn Plato while we’re at it then.
Social Conservatives “Applaud” “Enthusiastically Support” the GOP Pledge, says the headline.
I don’t know why I’d do that Ernst.
And at the state level, reduced to the Northeast and West Coast
In other words, you’re leaving some of us behind enemy lines in occupied territory.
How the hell are we supposed to start a proper resistance with the likes of the staunchless cupcake consumer?
“What happened was the progressives went crazy with new spending and new programs. And the Tea parties are the response.”
Exactly.
I’ll add that the people in the Tea Parties aren’t new, what’s new is they are getting out and engaging. There is no charismatic leader, no new concepts. They are working Americans with common principals of government that clearly see and are alarmed by a purposeful, dangerous assault on those principals.
The Tea Parties aren’t about race, abortion, gay rights, or any other peripheral issue the establishment tries to assign. Even fiscal policy is not the core, it is the current battlefield.
The war is no less than a fight for American individualism and Constitutional governance against fascist dictatorship.
sdferr, isn’t there something, well Platonic about German Idealism? I’ll admit that I’m venturing out my depth when it comes to intellectual history, where I’m like wading pool shallow.
No
Though, to say more, I do believe there is something (a smallish something, admittedly, but something nevertheless) Platonic about the American founding. Which, YAY!
How the hell are we supposed to start a proper resistance with the likes of the staunchless cupcake consumer?
Now now. Just as every Black Hand needs its Gavrilo Princip, every OUTLAW! Wild Bunch needs its Crazy Lee.
Plato, he’s the one that came up with the idea of philosopher kings, so no. Although the Allegory of the Cave does convey the modern mediascape
Don’t you mean Jayne Cobb
“Plato, he’s the one that came up with the idea of philosopher kings, so no.”
So no what?
“Didn’t Jesus also have a saying along the lines of “the assholes you will always have with you, but my time here is short.”?”
Heh, I think it was “poor” instead of “assholes”. If memory serves, it was in response to Judas complaining the expensive oil being applied to Jesus in preparation of his death could have been better used by selling it, and the proceeds given to the poor.
I don’t know if that effects the point you were making.
And yeah, I know that’s thin gruel, weak sauce, etc.
Plato, poor fellow, can’t be held responsible for Hegel’s poor interpretive acts. Is all I got to say about that. Or, This is not the Myth of the Cave, to be plainer about it.
– Wonder what Plato would have thought of the Proggs, both mindless and soulless. Something like narcissism rising through all the levels of arrogance?
“Didn’t Jesus also have a saying along the lines of “the assholes you will always have with you, but my time here is short.”?”
Heh, I think it was “the poor”, not “assholes”.
If memory serves, it was in response to Judas complaining the expensive oil being applied to Jesus, in preparation of His death, could better be used if sold and the money given to the poor.
I don’t know if that effects your point.
I might’a made that one up Lee, but maybe there’s a parallel too anyhow.
– Sometime during the middle ages, prominent theologians of many faiths labored over the list of mans sins and decided false pride (their words for uncontrolled narcissism) was the worst, since all other sins of and against man seem to flow from that spring.
– Very possibly, seeing the conditions of society today, they may well have been onto something there.
feet’s : We’re at a point where the Tea Party needs to respond in some way. They had an up with people rally when they were accused of being racists. What will they do in response to being accused of fronting for white trash lifeydoodle Christers?
You say that as if being called racist is the exact same as being called pro-life. Maybe in your world they are, but for some , one is a slander and the other is a badge of honor, funny you conflate the two as equal.
What should the tea-partiers do to ‘win’ your ‘support’? Hold a down with people rally? Isn’t that the more the forte of the left and their ‘people are a virus on the earth’ ilk?
I might tend to discuss (vs dismiss) happyfeet’s problems a bit more if he’d in turn use words that mean something more often than not.
lifeydoodle doesn’t mean anything. Ditto christers and cumslut.
Too bored to make a more complete recounting, just now.
Oh, also: sometimes it’s like having a conversation with a parrot. You say things to it, and it says things back to you, but you’re never left with that feeling that you’ve had anything like communication happen between you.
“You say that as if being called racist is the exact same as being called pro-life.”
Exact same? Are you really certain you’ve captured what happyfeet was getting at? And if not, that is, if you are purposely warping his meaning or ignorantly doing so, then are we permitted to ask why that would be? Are you intent that the Tea Party should be identified with Social Conservative views of politics as opposed to fiscal Conservative and Constitutionalists views?
between racist and lifeydoodle which do you think the Tea Party is more vulnerable to being tagged with in a way what will stick?
That depends on who’s doing the gluing. Smart Tea Party haters would avoid doing it. You, not so much.
I like the Tea Party a lot
I don’t really understand your point with the polling data
a girl in trouble is a temporary thing, Pablo
sdferr, I am content to let the tea-party be what ever it wants to be, mostly because I see it as individuals who have diverse views and ideas, but mostly arranged around the arrogance of our ‘representatives’ acting more like royalty and not representing , but ruling. And getting more than a bit churlish when called on it. There is no ‘leader’ such as the great O! in the tea movement to chain their ‘hopey’ and ‘changy’ stuff to, and that is a feature, not a bug. Their hope is that the people can change the country for the better if the ‘elites’ would just stick to hooker and booze parties as opposed to ‘social justice’. Go ahead define that one for me.
If those like you and happy to need to ‘identify’ and tar and feather the tea-party movement as if it is a single monolithic entity, feel free. Or am I again missing a point altogether?
I am not content to let the tea party be “whatever it wants to be”… I’m a lot particular that it needs to be about the spendings.
Let’s review:
What happened was the progressives went crazy with new spending and new programs. And the Tea parties are the response. Cause. Effect.
Given the really dismal success rate of your persuasive efforts here in comments, I’m not optimistic that you’ll wind up getting what you want in this regard.
Speaking actual English might be a good start. You and nishi seem to have this dysfunction in common.
America is not terribly enamored of abortions. Screaming “LIFEYDOODLE!” is not going to be a terribly effective political gambit aside from the preaching to the choir aspect.
When does your Tea Party group meet?
Speaking actual English might be a good start. You and nishi seem to have this dysfunction in common.
At least they don’t speak Klingon here like they do at their lunch table.
“I am not content to let the tea party be “whatever it wants to be”
Yeah, you and this Carney fella…
Happy? : ‘I am not content to let the tea party be “whatever it wants to be”… I’m a lot particular that it needs to be about the spendings.’
Then you have a lot in common with our ‘betters’ who also think they should be able to tell the populace what they can and cannot do, for the ‘social justice’ and all that crap. Because you, like them , are just so much ‘smarter’ and ‘wiser’ than everybody else?
I don’t think independents find white trash christer ideology very compelling and I think a political movement what embraces it will ultimately fall short of the critical mass required to enact the Really Big Changes our little country needs to free itself from the failshit vortex in which it’s trapped trapped trapped… the Tea Party so far has been at best a lot agnostic about you and Jesus and whatever dissatisfactions you and Jesus may have with American society.
I think it needs to stay that way.
“If those like you and happy to need to ‘identify’ and tar and feather the tea-party movement as if it is a single monolithic entity, feel free. Or am I again missing a point altogether?”
Care to show me where I’ve tarred and feathered the Tea Party movement? Care to show where I’ve insisted it be identified as a single monolithic entity? Or are you again missing a point?
….in a way what will stick?”
– D) None of the above.
why are now conflating me and jesus? For real??
’cause stereotyping isn’t only for jerks?
What gives you the impression I am a bible thumper?
– The T-party, or movement which is a better label for it, is a lot of normally quiet uninvolved people that generally keep to themselves and avoid politics as long as it doesn’t completely fuck up their lives. letting each other know they’re out there and their vote is a powerful palpable thing that can put things right if they exercise that power in unison on November 2nd.
– The rest is just media hype, goaded on by the desperate Left, and basically just sells papers and gives the TV talking heads something to yammer about.
196 was for Pablo big breast person
you kinda make them sound like serial killers Mr. Hunter
– If they’re killing Marxists/statists, and all sorts of social government teat suckers, then they have my vote.
mine too Mr. Hunter
– Call it “Buffy the Progg Killer” for all I care.
I find it curious that a mumbling failshit what talks of the future of politics like a slightly effeminate soothsayer is so mired in dated left wing meme pimping.
Followed by:
Which brings us all the way back around to:
….sometimes it’s like having a conversation with a parrot. You say things to it, and it says things back to you, but you’re never left with that feeling that you’ve had anything like communication happen between you.
That was a lot more eloquent than my utterances. But what can I say? I was a frat boy. MEAN PEOPLE SUCK!!!
– Just imagine what the Parrot must think of the situation.
Polly want a cracker?
The “spendings” are the symptom, not the problem itself.
“….What in the hell is this big ugly wingless creature doing making noises and funny faces at me????? All I want is some nice bird seed and a warm place to perch…..Is that too much to fucking ask for?”
http://www.therightscoop.com/paul-ryan-grilled-about-new-pledge
Paul Ryan lays it down to Stephanopolous, who, like others today, leeps insisting that specific legislative action be outlined, in detail, regarding going from A to B…
Gee, I wonder why he never grilled the Dems that in 2006, nor Obama during the 2008 campaign?
Sdferr , challenging the tea-party to be only what you and /or happy wants it to be is not he same as tar and feathering it . I retract the statement.
I would say you can’t control what is non-centralized, and so one has to have a bit of tolerance as to the diversity of thought that any large group of people will inevitably contain. To insist that the ‘group’ always respond as you wish it would is folly, and bound to disappoint.
‘The “spendings” are the symptom, not the problem itself.’
Yes, yes, Ersnt gets it.
I am as inured to disappointment as you are to your large pendulous breasts
“challenging the tea-party to be only what you and /or happy wants it to be is not he same as tar and feathering it . I retract the statement.”
Gee, thanks, while you continue to write “what you and/or happy wants”. Cripes.
“Gee, I wonder why ….”
– Why. Because what was left of Republican leadership had by 2008 completely seeded all control to the Donkeys, following up on the 6 years before 2006 of weak wristed listless legislative meandering with no real purpose or goals with complete lethergy.
– Now some are just beginning to see the train has reversed direction and are trying to “sort of” get aboard, but they still are unsure and don’t have a clue to just how overwhelming and powerful that freight train really is. They’ll learn soon enough.
– Yesterdays “contract” was an indication, but even it doesn’t state the depth of correction its going to take.
ace explains why.
Stephanopolous understood and uses the same tactical approach Stossel found Obama taking. It is what they’re going to do.
– I just did, and in a hell of a lot less wordage.
sdferr
Gee, thanks, while you continue to write “what you and/or happy wants”. Cripes.
Happy stated he wanted tea-party to respond to critics who say they, (however the hell they are) the tea-party are christers.
I will cheerfully leave any mention of you from any further comments.
– I just did, and in a hell of a lot less wordage.
Yeah, but ace’s wordage explains why some calculated equivocation might not be a bad thing, tacticlly speaking.
Yeah, I saw that Ernst,
That’s why I threw out that snarky rhetorical question. I have a bone to pick with Snuffleuppegas from way back; from tjhe 1992 Presidential campaign. I recall one of the “debates” that took the form of a telephone, and live, town hall.
Somehow, miraculously, the first “random” caller happened to be George-boy, who, after essentially delivering a mini-diatrabe about bog Bush being “out of touch” with Americans, let fly a barrage of questions such as, “How much is milk these days”, “What does gas cost”, and, “how much is a loaf of bread”; he must have asked the last one 10 or more times, repeatedly innterupting bush to restate it each time big Bush began to answer.
And the whole time, Bernard Shaw, and the other CNN televosion reporters sat their looking idly at their manicures like George’s “performance” was neither indecorous, out of the ordinary, or unfair on a fundamental level (remember, at the time, he was a major player in Billy Jeff’s campaign-communication director or something).
After a moment of silence, Bernard Shaw looked up and said, “Well, how about it Mr. President”…
Allowing all of the desperate Dems a moment of glee, and cementing a fallacious notion in the minds of millions of casulal/low-information voters; people who wouldn’t reflect for a moment on how ridiculous a notion it would be that a man who had been at the highest levels of government for the prior 12-20 years, as CIA director, veep, etc, and had probably put in 12 to 18 hour days during most of them, wouldn’t be doing his own shopping anyway, and therefore would rightly have no clue what a loaf of bread cost.
Will we ever see anyone badger Oba,a in a similar fashion-no chance; it would be RAAAAAAAAACIST!
Strategically, the main thing is to be on the record opposed to the remainder of Obama’s agenda as well as committed to reversing as much of it as possible (which won’t be much given that he wields the veto and we’ll fall well short of veto proof majorities, but we’ll see who pays for that in 2012, won’t we?). That way, when the Democrats demand bipartisan cooperation because “the people” expect us to work together to get things done –things like a VAT and Cap’n Tax, we’ll be able to point to the 2010 elections and say no, no they don’t.
I ran into William Colby at the Georgetown Safeway Bob, doing his own shopping. ‘Course, he’d been “retired” for a few years by then. heh.
– If it was calculated equivocation based on some political goals, that can be a useful tool, “never interrupt the enemy when he’s busy fucking up” comes to mind, but this was just plain poor leadership and lack of political will, born in the political vacuum in the wake wake of 9/11 and the program of 24/7 agitprop onslaught practiced by the left.
– The Left saw 9/11 as the perfect opportunity to grab power in that vacuum, and unfortunately for them and all the rest of us they did.
– Their grand experiment proved for the umpteenth time proflagate Socialism is unworkable in a Democratic Republic.
– The bad news is we’ll all be paying for that experiment for a long time to come.
– The good news is Progressivism will be shelved as a concept that anyone wants to be associated with for a good long time also.
It’s amamzing who you run into in DC, eh sdferr?
I spoke with Bob Reich many times on the DC metro while he was labor sectetary. I differ on many ideas from him, politically speaking, but admire and respect him for not thinking too much of himself. I asked him once why he was on the subway, instead of a government car. His reply was along the lines of, “Who am I to be riding in a limousine, instead of taking public transportation like everyone else?”. You gotta admire the man for that at least. Kind of like Herbert Hoover riding the bus from The Woodner apartment on 16th street to confer with Truman at the White House.
Anyway, after all those years locked away at the grindstone, I’ll bet Colby enjoyed doing his own shopping :)
D’ja ever eat at the great Italian restaurant that used to be in the basement of the Woodner Bob?
brender an eddie were the popular steadies and the kind and the queen at the prom
*king* and the queen I meant
There is a rather obvious flaw in Ace’s argument. I believe it comes about because he sincerely believes the following:
The things we need to do in this country are not currently popular and we don’t have all that much time left to get our house in order. If we win elections but then can’t enact our policies because we decided it was too politically costly to convince the voters of their necessity, hey, that is also a loss.
Remember Bush’s push on Social Security? We won the elections. We didn’t fix the problem. That’s still a loss. But, hey, maybe winning the elections helped Ace feel “psychologically validated”.
On 9/11 , failure of political will, failure of leadership and Democrat opportunism:
I’m not sure that’s what happened, but if you think that’s what happened, Blame Bush for it. I think our problems started after the ’98 election. 9/11 froze things up through 2003, and then everything fell apart after the 2004 election.
On the unworkability of profligate socialism:
The only qualifier to that I’d add is that the dirty socialists have done a good job of making it seem like it works by virtue of the fact that American capitalism subsidizes European socialism. If we go socialist, how are the socialists going to afford their socialism?
I hope your right about progressivism falling into permanent disrepute, but the problem with scoring based on intentions, is that results never count against you when your intentions are good.
I’m perfectly happy spouting cant and rhetoric without feel psychologically validated.
That’s what givers do.
I see what your getting at bh. I can’t remember where I saw it, maybe ace’s, maybe somewhere on pajama’s media, but somebody was arguing that progressivism advances in part by offering false and misleading choices. You ask people do you want to clothe the naked, feed the starving etc., and naturally they say yes. Voilia! Massive government. You try to cut gov’t and your for starving naked people. Nobody thinks to ask, do you want to do all this stuff a) when it’s gonna cost you 50% of your income and your kids 75& of theirs; and b) there are alternatives to gov’t programs.
My point being that when libs offer false choices to people, we should call them on it.
Kind like calling ace on that false choice of his. Why can’t we have “cant and rhetoric” in order to “enact real positive tangible change,” and thus “feel psychologically validated” for proving our cant and rhetoric was right all along?
You’re getting some kind of psychological validation from your cant and rhetoric happyfeet. Even William Yelverton does what he does for psychological reasons.
mrs.O! says have cant and rhetoric with carrots
sdferr,
No I never did; probably not well heeled enough at the time. I couldn’t even tell you thename now. Was it AV’s, that later was at 6th and New York ave across from the DC police special ops?
My favorite, for many years until they closed, was Gusti’s at 17th and M NW (northeast corner). But they departed some time back when their real estate becoame so valuable they could no longer refuse to sell.
I often wondered why they didn’t do what “Blackie” Auger did, and demand prime space in the new building as part of the deal.
Sort of here Ernst.
Yes, that’s right, Ernst.
I loved to eat at AV Bob, the whole staff of the Italian restaurant I worked at did. The place in the Woodner was called Fio’s, and really, wasn’t all that pricey, just dependably good time after time. It’s closed now, though I don’t know when that happened.
Bad link Ernst, sorry.
I’ll have my cant and rhetoric with a scotch and a cigar, thank you very much!
bh,
I see what you mean about Ace’s post, and tend to agree with your social security example; it’s one of the reasons I was excited to re-elect him in 2004.
But I have to say, I really believe what ultimately stopped him was a combination of the electoral cowardice of some congressional Rethugs! as well as the Democrats unwillingness to play ball, coupled with their determination to demagogue the issue (starving kids, old people, etc.).
And let’s not forget that there were veiled threats to stop funding the Iraq war, where the left was gaining traction with the, “Bush lied, people died!”, enourmous paper-mache-head protest, memes, if he insisted on pushing at social security reform.
The growing unpopularity of the war exacerbated the cowardice of some congressional Rethugs! and the issue went nowhere.
Instead, we ended up with effin’ medicare part D!
So instead of shrinkng entitlement obligations, we expanded them.
But that, in a nutshell, explains most of the Bush presidency’s failures; in order to get the Dems to vote for the war funding he had to cut all kinds of nasty deals. And the Dems were so successful at demgoguing the war that many Rethugs! in congress ran scared…
A sad time indeed.
that would be it sdferr! thanks for the link (again)!
but don’t question their “patriotism”
If I remember right Bob, medicare Part D came before S.S. reform didn’t it? The larger point is spot on, however. Republicans try to cut deals where Democrats get half a loa,f and they take their half a loaf and then tell us to bugger off when it comes to our half. It’s like that other Examiner editorial I linked earlier. Moderate to Liberal Republican won’t support Conservatives. And Democrats won’t support for Republican legislation (not on the meaningful stuff, anyway). This is why bipartisanship is a joke. The drift ever leftward continues. Sometimes faster, sometimes slower.
Instead of standing athwart history and yelling Stop! I thinks it’s time we start yelling Turn Around!
the Dems were so successful at demgoguing the war that many Rethugs! in congress ran scared…
I think the biggest mistake the Republicans made in ’06 was NOT making the election a referendum on the war. I guess they didn’t realize that running away just makes it easier for the other guy to shoot you in the back.
You may be right Ernst, I’d have to review the videotape :)
And it’s darn sure well past time to turn the ship of state around. Way past due. But, the turn may be coming this fall; it depends on the magnitude of the electoral victory.
well, I gotta say I certainly expected grieferfeet to wallow orgastically in his Christophobic racism.
he sure came through eh?
and I don’t know if anyone else offered this bit but identifying as “pro-life” does not automatically translate into “THROUGH THE SLUTS IN JAIL” legislation.
One can recognize the biological reality (hey, it’s science!) that fertilized human eggs will, left alone, mostly become human embryos then human fetuses then human babies. The salient term here being HUMAN.
Induced Abortion is always a tragedy, regardless of reason (from convenience to necessity).
That griefer puts himself in the Abortions?Fuck YEAH! crowd actually puts him in the minority. The vast majority of Americans do not like abortion, even if they want it to remain legal in a more narrowly defined way.
Even the CristerLifeydoodle Palin refused to get involved in trying to legislate against abortion in AK.
But griefer and ilk want them all to SHUT UP SHUT UP SHUT UP.
You may draw your own conclusions on what animates such over-the-top-hatred of people who don’t think turning a uterus housing a unique, nascent human being, into an blender is a thing to celebrate.
(oh god … I was at work very early this morning and my grammar-spelling-fu seems to have wandered away)
mrs. O! says eating carrots helps to prevent typos
http://minx.cc/?post=306071
blah blah blah abortion blah blah it’s about the spendings Darleen if you want to talk about your abortion issues you need to talk about it apart from the Tea Party cause the Tea Party doesn’t give a shit about your angsty issues with other people’s fetuses
griefer
YOU are the one that can’t help but down a few viagra and ride that abortion hobbyhorse.
Face a few facts, fuckface, the TEA Party is made of small government people who want our American principles back … and that includes people you want to burn at the stake for having the audacity not to SHUT UP.
Tea Party isn’t about abortion, but Tea partiers include pro-life people who are putting fiscal stuff first. That doesn’t mean they have to lick the ankles of pro-aborts like you.
You might want to stop channeling
LindaLISA Murkowski, your staunchiest.hey that’s lita murcowski: get it right
Tea Party isn’t about abortion
No it sure isn’t is it? Not at all. People don’t get all excited and take to rallies and defeat primary candidates cause of abortion these days. People seem to have an innate sense that that sort of retro-80’s moral majority-style self-indulgent moral masturbation is a luxury our rat-fucked little country can no longer afford. That’s kind of neat. It’s hopeful in and of itself. But there are definitely those who will try and paint the Tea Party with the abortion brush and we must be vigilant against such mischief for so everyone can keep their eye on the spendings. You can count on me to do my part.
– Earnst, I purpsofully left Bush’s most excellent contribution to the Republican decade long political slumberfest to keep it merely medium winded instead of long winded rampese.
– Sure thing feets. They’ll have their abortions one way or another, I’d just rather tax dollars didn’t pay for the coat hangers.
yes Mr. Hunter tax dollars should never pay for abortions ever ever ever cause that’s a Bad Policy.
but if government pays for every goddamn thing else, money being fungible and all, the whole point becomes a lot academic it seems to me
People seem to have an innate sense that that sort of retro-80?s moral majority-style self-indulgent moral masturbation is a luxury our rat-fucked little country can no longer afford.
You truly are fucked up, griefer. So someone dare saying “you know, abortion might not be the bestest thing for you, and it is especially pretty fatal to the baby” is RETRO morality and self-indulgent?
Please never reproduce. The juvie system is strained enough already with kids “raised” by parents who think moral principles are passe.
oh blah blah blah like people are just dying to hear some lifeydoodle express about abortion in 2010. That’s so old and busted. The spendings is the new hotness Darleen. You have to stop letting life just pass you by like this.
Well, griefer, lets see if you will applaud Gov Christies defunding of NJ’s abortion clinics.
– Personally, I’m still somewhat baffled by the path of twisted logic of whatever mental midget thought that writing a blank check so people could fuck with immunity, and then sweep all responsibility into a HAZMAT trash can, ever came about in the first place.
Oh wait, now I remember; It says it right in the Constitution, the ‘living part’ I mean, where anything a bleeding heart Leftist wants can be found. Irresponsibility is one of our sovereign rights. I forgot.
yes that’s nice of Chris Christie to defund the NJ abortion clinics what took him so long?
griefer
that’s exactly where Tea Party pro-lifers are … stop being a PRO-abort country which uses tax dollars to enables, among other things, pedophiles and ephebophiles to get rid of the evidence.
Chris Christie did that? A good man. Groom him for prezzidint.
the Tea Party must be ever watchful of the pedophile menace
– NAMBLA is going to get you for that feets.
Two-thirds of Tea Paryters are not pro-abortion. We’re working on the rest of ’em; we’ve a head start, because at least they exhibit some sensibilities, being attracted to the Tea Party in the first place.
yeah right hf, cause you like have 12+ years in law enforcement and know what is going on out there, right?
Two-thirds of Tea Paryters are not pro-abortion. We’re working on the rest of ‘em; we’ve a head start, because at least they exhibit some sensibilities, being attracted to the Tea Party in the first place.
I really don’t understand why anyone would think that anti-abortion activism – which is the right wing cause which most typifies the left’s mindset with regard to most everything else – has some sort of natural connection to smaller government advocacy.
serr8d – Get the fiscals completely back under control and the rest will shake out sooner or later.
– You’re not going to be sending known Islamic extremists on fake good will tours to raise money for victory Mosques, or killing nearly as many babies indiscriminately, or paying fake farmers for not growing weeds in their driveways, if you don’t have government subsidy’s.
I’m sorry if Orange County is teeming with the pesky pedophiles but that’s really not a Tea Party issue Darleen
maybe if they masturbated more frequently?
oh wait
the gay lobby kinda like demonrats: f**k up every institution in the gramscian long march to killing alot of people
– If we manage to get through this and survive in one piece a hundred years from now historians will call this the era of the “Big Government Free Lunch”, and the most common question will be: “But how in the world did they ever get hard working people to agree to pay others to sit on their asses.”
– Personally, I’m still somewhat baffled by the path of twisted logic of whatever mental midget thought that writing a blank check so people could fuck with immunity, and then sweep all responsibility into a HAZMAT trash can, ever came about in the first place.
Oh wait, now I remember; It says it right in the Constitution, the ‘living part’ I mean, where anything a bleeding heart Leftist wants can be found. Irresponsibility is one of our sovereign rights. I forgot.
Pretty much.
If you look closely, you can see that the “progressives” support your rights so long as those rights don’t interfere with their ability to, well, make you their slave. Fuck all you want. Murder the issue — hell, they’ll even find a mentally deficient to tell you it’s moral to murder a child up to a year or two after birth!
But don’t you dare even think that the “emanations from the penumbra” that created a “right to privacy” so strong it includes partial-birth abortions might maybe somehow extend to your financial life. Especially if you’re self-employed or running a business!
it is serious: interior decorators in o!s amerikkka are being rounded up
the ghey guys are stupid evolutionary according to the darwinists but mrs. o! says carrots cure that
now griefer is making child molestation “jokes”
Roman Polanski applauds you.
entering into a conversation about what is and isn’t within the purview of the Tea Party and shrieking about pedophiles is eminently mockable I think Darleen
you’re a loon
“….but mrs. o! says carrots cure that.
– I thought that’s how it all got started – with carrots….
*rim shot*
Then there is the other leg of the stool: has anybody mentioned P.J. O’Rourke’s article on the foreign policy views of the Tea Parties?
a lot of pedophiles flee overseas Mr. sdferr
so you own the Tea Party now, hf? YOu get to dictate what are the proper thoughts any member must hold to be a part of the movement?
Not one TEA party rally has ever brought up abortion, but there are a lot of pro-life people there that, if asked, will say they are pro-life. You are the one that has gone all Christophobe, racist to even want them to be on a public street let alone stand next to you.
You might ask yourself WHY the fuck would more small government people ALSO question the wisdom of partial-birth abortion and THEN figure out which is a truer Tea Partier … them, or a “if they are old enough to poke, they are old enough to scrape” person like you.
If the Tea Party movement, so-called, achieves “small, effective government with low taxes and free enterprise,” America will be a much richer nation. A much richer nation will have a much more powerful foreign policy, whether it means to or wants to or not.
I think we have plenty of time to ponder.
that first paragraph was supposed to be blockquotey
I do kinda wonder though what lessons are to be taken from how adroitly the dirty socialists used war spending as a rationale for raping the treasury.
Darleen abortion has fuck all to do with the Tea Party.
You might have to do the full Kubler-Ross to come to terms with this.
– If that’s true feets, their prospects aren’t very good. Most countries just hang pedophiles outright, unless you’re in a Muslim country of course, and you have a harem of 12 year old wives, or Holland, and even there the authorities are cracking down. Their 12 year old wives are pestering them about the foreign ‘competition’.
live free or die
This is nice. I hadn’t seen it, so sorry if someone already linked.
Ummm…just goes to show, some people never even come in by the front door~!
Upset that the squishbot isn’t welcomed when she shows up to stir up shit, carpyfeet is taking up her slack.
That’s good for another appointment with the TrollHammer, hf.
its all christer, abortion, fags to victory stuff(“patton” i should have kissed the sob) all the time. go hump a tree
I explain as good as I can
oaks or maples or redwoods
Pardon my rant here a moment please, but I’ve heard said and seen written over and over today that the Republicans unveiled their Pledge at a hardware store in Sterling Va. I used to patronize Tart Lumber from time to time, and folks, it’s no hardware store. It’s a high-end full service building construction supply house, specializing in millwork, even running mouldings on-site if custom moulding is your deal. Anyhow, just a word for the place, they’re really good at what they do.
“….Damn him…..I told him telling the truth in politics just gets you in trouble.” – Joe Kennedy Sr., 1962
feets — I’ve invented an auto polish that not only looks great, but increases a cars MPG. It is made out of “non-required fetuses” so the God-botherers are in the way. It would add to the U.S. treasury, so I can’t understand why people are against it. If you can figure out a way to utilize the Non-producing elderly, I think that we can make a bundle. It would be good for the country and I have no doubt that we would receive medals of some kind. — You up for it?
‘feets, do you sometimes wish your parents had aborted you ?
I just don’t think abortion has anything to do with the Tea Party serr8d.
So your parents were Tea Partyers? Explains much.
Glad you made it~!
Except happyfeet, that the Tea-Party does have something to do with abortion, even if the abortion is a secondary or tertiary one. Tea-Party supporters are significantly more pro-life than the population as a whole, as serr8d pointed out up above:
The article that Jeff originally linked shows a link between pro-abortions groups and pro-big government statist politicians. The former fund the latter, whom the tea-party works to defeat –with some notable success it seems. I think the “lifers” in the tea-party movement are animated primarily by the same cause that animates you –get the big spending “courtiers” out of government and out of our lives. That they also happen to be knocking off abortion supporters is just a bonus.
Abe wrote earlier:
no Ernst the Tea Party is not an organization what has any bearing on legal or illegal abortion whatsoever no matter how badly christers want to claim the Tea Party for Jesus
*the abortion issue* Crap.
Someday, I’m going to write something so insightful, brilliant and persuasive that all the problems in the world will be resolves and everyone will agree with me.
And it’s going to so full of typos and grammar errors that instead of agreeing with me, everyone will just laugh like the fat kid in the Simpsons. It’s my version of the showing up to your first day of school in your undewear dream.
Actually, feets, if you go back, and, you know, read this stuff. It’s the anti-tea-party people who want to make the tea-party/christer connection. Any idea why that might be?
because white trash christer ideology is repugnant to independent voters I’d guess
Look what Dr K has done with the Tea Parties this morning, making the Beck rally into them.
It is perceived, in the cartoon reality that the left’s group mind runs on, as repugnant.
Which is sort of double weird isn’t it, since that rally was explicitly non-political, whereas the Tea Parties are all about politics I thought?
Let me try putting it this way. I’m a Vikings fan and I lurv my Vikings football. I hate the Green Bay Packers with a white hot hate, despise the Chicago Bears and scorn the Detroit Lions (although if Sunday goes the way I’m afraid it’s going to go, I might have to move them out of the scorn column). If I find out that 2/3s of the Tea-Party’s self-identified supporters are fans of those three teams, should I abandon the tea-party movement?
that instinct people have to conflate the Tea Party with extraneousness seems irresistible Mr. sdferr… here is my question –
Does Obama want to wait on demonizing the Tea Party until 2012 – particularly maybe after Sarah Palin has safely pocketed the nomination? They’re so readily conflatable that if he attacks either with any of his characteristic nastiness now he’ll have peaked too soon on the meme come 2012.
Ernst if you want to keep drumming the statistic that the Tea Party is 2/3 pro-life have at it I guess
hf, are you primarily or mostly concerned about the impressions to be built in presumably weak-minded members of the political “independents” who don’t pay attention much, don’t participate in activism themselves, don’t have direct knowledge of the political things they’re told of and hence may be susceptible to easy persuasions of various falsehoods about the movement, and yet may turn out to vote based on these mistaken beliefs?
gisting, that is?
that and subsequent blurring of mandates
These are the type of “Christians” that should be feared.
And here’s Mr. Krauthammer’s answer:
so then come 2012?
So long as tea-party ralliers resist the temptation to go burn down an abortion clinic, I don’t think you have anything to worry about happyfeet. And as for, mandates being blurred, the Democrats are going to attempt to do that regardless.
The Most Important Issue to Independents.
people who would otherwise support the Tea Party won’t if they think it’s a pro-life front group, burnings or no burnings
that’s very cheering news Mr. geoff
people who would otherwise support the Tea Party won’t if they think it’s a pro-life front group,
The only person I know who thinks the movement is a pro-life front group is you. 2/3rds of the people who support the goals of the tea-party just happen to be pro-life. Just as a majority of the tea-party’s supporters happen to be white (I have no idea what the percentage is but it’s probably higher than 2/3rds). The tea-party is no more a pro-life front group than it is a front for the Klan. Why is it that you can see through one media distortion and not the other?
can’t we just end on the cheery news note Mr. Ernst?
Yeah. Some people love conflating, and tend to do it all willy nilly. You know, like this being a Team R production and hatehatehatehatehatehatehatehatehate.
I’m still waiting for the backlash from that one.
How big is that group, I wonder?
…because I have these earwaxerasers that will deny deny deny all those uncomfortably uncomfortable anti-donut numb3rs.
‘feets, you are afraid of ‘Christers’; this fear is not a fear based on your political uncomfort but on your own raging inner demons. You are seeking a Catcher.
what the fuck does that even mean?
I’m just an unfrozen caveman history üvber-geek. Baseball metaphors frighten and confuse me.
why is Catcher capitalized? I thought it was a Salinger thing maybe.
I think that’s right happyfeet. Which makes you Holden Caulfield I guess.
that’s confusing
Why are y’all conversing with a parrot, again?
Why are y’all conversing with a parrot, again?
WTF?
No one even tries to talk to me.
I mean, fuck, what am I — chopped liver?
Hey, fuck you too!