“Obama Administration Wants Judge to Toss Embassy Hostage Suit”

They were “Guests of the Ayatollah,” Jeff.

Musn’t stir up the hornet’s nest, old boy.Pip, pip!

Reparations for those directly involved, denied!Perhaps their descendants can extract some justice.

hey brown people don’t torture please understand their culture

Didn’t they already lose this case before?

The ever-increasing surreality of civil war II, as of yet non-violent.

The posters on the Fox board are speculating that Obama’s desire to toss out the Embassy case is a quid pro quo for Saberi’s release (the NPR reporter who thought it was a brilliant idea to confess to the Iranian government that she was a spy). I, on the other hand, suspect that Obama just enjoys making America’s enemies happy with no expectation that anything good will happen in return for the United States.

Also on Drudge: NYT advertising down another 27%

This is so friggin good I don’t wanna say anything.

Might jinx it and screw it up.

So much for “petition the government for redress of grievances”.

Didn’t they already lose this case before?

Don’t you ever read the links?

“The posters on the Fox board are speculating that Obama’s desire to toss out the Embassy case is a quid pro quo for Saberi’s release (the NPR reporter who thought it was a brilliant idea to confess to the Iranian government that she was a spy).”

“The posters on the Fox board are speculating”…. A great way to start a comment.

The deal goes back much further:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algiers_declaration

Upheld by Rehnquist:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dames_&_Moore_v._Regan

And lots of others:

http://uniset.ca/terr/news/wp_iranhostagedamages.html

But for real if the country is ever attacked again and for a brief moment the 70% of the country not consisting of radical marxists and diehard dems has the epiphany that radical soros-funded transnationalists basically control the levers of defense policy in congress in the media, there will be one of the greatest eruptions of rage the country will have seen domestically in 150 years. IMHO.

hey brown people don’t torture

Especially since Persians are right there next to the Caucacus mountains, IYKWIMAITYD.

Wikipedia on politics is like Alex Jones, on, well, politics. I think the realm between conspiracy and reality has been blurred in a similar way that trolls like Gordo cannot be distinguished from parodies.

The point is meya, that this was somehow important to the administration of whatever lever. Why now and for what purpose? It certainly is consistent with the myriad iterations of Obama selling out his countrymen.

Oh* at whatever lever of power

there will be one of the greatest eruptions of rage

It will always be Bush’s fault. He kicked the hornet’s nest, so anything that ever happens to us from now on will be Bush’s fault. It all happened when Obama was seven, dontcha know.

People who didn’t wake up after 9/11 won’t wake up after a thousand of them. They’re just that obtuse.

Any one else notice how meya sees the Constitution as totally flexible but all court decisions are cast in fucking stone?

“The point is meya, that this was somehow important to the administration of whatever lever. ”

Probably the same thing that has been important to other presidents upholding this power: keeping the executive power large in the area of foreign affairs. However this time, it is the turn of a democrat to do it, so we get the added benefit of fueling the whaaaaambulance.

I never understood how someone could type something like “whaaaaambulance” without realizing they’re coming off like Vic Morrow in Bad News Bears.

Any one else notice how meya sees the Constitution as totally flexible but all court decisions are cast in fucking stone?

Judges have more education than those silly founders, who are all dead anyway.

It’s the juxtaposition that makes the post, meya.Enjoy.

“Any one else notice how meya sees the Constitution as totally flexible but all court decisions are cast in fucking stone?”

As long as it’s international law and to her liking.

Precedent!

fueling the whaaaaambulance

Gosh, an(other) ironically ironic comment from meya, who wouldn’t admit O!prompta, still (and eternally?) wet behind the jugears is paying off entirely political debts before having a clue or a concern what the repercussions might be.Yeah, fueling that whaaaaambulance in costs that won’t be calculated for months if not years.

By the way, if meya actually HAD read the piece, she’d have seen this:

A similar lawsuit brought by the Iranian hostages was dismissed in 2000 after the government successfully argued it was banned by the Algiers Accords. The hostages argue that legislation passed by Congress last year and signed into law by President George W. Bush gives them the right to bring private lawsuits.

But the Justice Department argued that the law does not mention the Algiers Accords, much less explicitly repeal them.

Which would make the linky linky two-step in the comments above moot.

Any one else notice how meya sees the Constitution as totally flexible but all court decisions are cast in fucking stone?

It has to do with her sense of her own importance.Which clearly displaces her sense.

Any one else notice how meya sees the Constitution as totally flexible but all court decisions are cast in fucking stone?

penumbras are made of stone who knew

Like I said in another thread, meya is really just Magic Puppy and Gordo, without the bombast.It is equally mendoucheous.

“However this time, it is the turn of a democrat to do it, so we get the added benefit of fueling the whaaaaambulance.”

Fueling it to do what?

Honestly.

To do what?

You have a tentative audience. Lay it out for us.

Show us where we or the country gets well in all this stupendous spending bullshit that is 100% on your boy and your party.

Just tell us.

“As long as it’s international law and to her liking.”

If you follow the links you’ll see that the case is about a domestic law.

Please J, give us the “jeffersonian” view on this one.

“The opinion which gives to the judges the right to decide what laws are constitutional and what not, not only for themselves in their own sphere of action but for the Legislature and Executive also in their spheres, would make the Judiciary a despotic branch. … “

Oh, I’m sorry, meya.That was Jefferson on you, wasn’t it?

I’m not so sure dicentra. I think maybe we underestimate the pernicious effects of 7 years of Bush bashing, apocryphal accusations and so forth even though we are the group most acutely aware of it. From what I have seen, at least, of apolitical people in suburban Jersey, particularly in a town where a lot of people commute to NY for work and with several families losing people in the towers, there is a genuine agreement with strong national defense when the facts are explicitly laid out. Otherwise they revert to what we call leftwing talking points, which indeed they are, but which have been so ingrained by virtue of monolithic presence.

I’ve converted a few of my friends who now mock the remaining Obama supporter among us when he trots out the talking points, but initially when I tried to explain the nature of reality to them, I hit a wall of silence. They looked down,knew something was a bit off and when moved onto other topics.

So anyway.About Obama and recklessness again.

Please J, give us the “jeffersonian” view on this one.

To be honest, I know very little about this or the law behind it.I’m staying quiet until I know more.

Any one else notice how meya sees the Constitution as totally flexible but all court decisions are cast in fucking stone?

Uniformed men with absolute power make her wet.

If only Obama would start wearing one of these Hugo Boss numbers, she might even be able to finally achieve orgasm.

“The opinion which gives to the judges the right to decide what laws are constitutional and what not, not only for themselves in their own sphere of action but for the Legislature and Executive also in their spheres, would make the Judiciary a despotic branch.”

Awesome one. When in doubt, strike at the heart of Marbury.

Regale us on law, meya.Please.I mean, it’s yet another pw thread we have here, isn’t it?

*hey brown people don’t torture*

they skip past that to the beheading part.Muslims are not big on foreplay.

Barack’s momma raised a coward to the extent that she bothered to raise him at all I think.

Dash,

Be happy.America has gone through much more than B. H. O. America is the shining city on a hill.The world sucks.Our shared human nature is why.

It’s a long fight; bigger than all of us.

Believe me, Sarah Palin feels much more pain than you because of her beliefs and ambitions; therin lies, amongst other things, hope.

“The opinion which gives to the judges the right to decide what laws are constitutional and what not, not only for themselves in their own sphere of action but for the Legislature and Executive also in their spheres, would make the Judiciary a despotic branch. … “

Well, there’s that, but I’m not sure how it gets applied here.

Awesome one. When in doubt, strike at the heart of Marbury.

where is the penumbra in the constitution?

When in doubt, strike at the heart of Marbury.

Like clockwork.She sure does love her some Marbury.

Completely off-topic, Leahy and Soros and Clinton and Barcky trying to destroy intelligence as a whole.This whole witch-hunt makes me livid.

Marbury only matters to her when the court is stacked with judges nominated by Democrats. So yeah she is in favor of despotism.

This is the culmination what the neutron star of scumbaggery what is Soros wanted. He doesn’t want the CIA to be effective and he gets to make what was my nice little country (ht hf) look like a banana republic.

“Marbury only matters to her when the court is stacked with judges nominated by Democrats.”

The court is 7-2 republican now. I’ll have to wait a few years for marbury to matter then. Y’all don’t worry.

The SC is 7-2 Republican?Bull fucking shit.What a lying douchebag.Being appointed by a Republican does not make a Justice a Republican, or even a conservative.

You sure this isn’t actus/monkeyboy/sniffles.I keep waiting for the balloon fence and the mile high dirt berm …

If it’s not in the Times, the CIA didn’t want it there.

Recalibrate your sensors.

Well in her defense JD I did type “nominated” even though that is not what I meant.

I knew what you meant, Mr. Pink.She is being a douchenozzle.

When in doubt, strike at the heart of Marbury

b/c mcgay feinfool is like totally constituional

Anybody but me got the douchechills?

Wait, they might be reverberations of the flu I’m getting over where I…okay, no grisly details.

No, come to think of it, meya gives me the douchechills.

Anybody wanna get localish?

OT:Turtlepost for happyfeet and U.Md fans: Diamondbacks at Maggie’s

I do not do enough for to replenish the turtles in nature. That would be a life well lived but you can’t get there from here.

psycho is right except also he forgot to say that if it’s the faggot pansies what are drawn to work at the CIA what stand between us and terroristical doom and property damage and ow that hurts then I don’t like our chances. These homos were always more concerned with getting Bush than getting bin Laden. The CIA is beyond corrupt it’s actively traitorous and working with our enemies I think more than they are working against them.

I love happyfeet, in a totally not at all Sully/Gleeens kind of way. NTTAWWT

58
Yeah me too. If this website ever gets shut down for whatever reason I just hope I find out where HF and a couple other people here start hanging out on the Internet and I will be there.

These homos were always more concerned with getting miss ca Bush than getting bin Laden.

“Well in her defense JD I did type “nominated” even though that is not what I meant”

Well that helps. Does that mean Marbury matters to me now or no? What’s your take on the numbers?

Does that mean Marbury matters to me now or no?

what does marbury “mean” to you?what does roe “mean” to you?

It’s turtles happyfeet wants?Sure!

61
Screw the numbers of SC judges, Marbury, precident, or whatever you are talkin about, I want as much individual liberty as possible, with as little tyranny as necessary. Tyranny being defined as people being able to tell me or anyone else what to do, or take my money away.

thank you but if this website ever gets shut down I for real wouldn’t find somewhere else. Not soon and then once you stop doing this sort of thing I think not ever becomes entirely plausible. These days it’s kind of a moot point cause I can’t think of a place where I wouldn’t get banned. Banning is the new killer app I think. Who needs commenters when you can have dozens of pets instead.

clearly turtles are still evolving which makes them different from global warming people and those ones what hate Wal-Mart

Now I feel bad about banning Magic Dog.

Jeff walked into a sports bar around 9:58 pm.He sat down next to meya at the bar and stared up at the TV.

The 10 pm news was coming on.The news crew was covering the story of a man on the ledge of a large building preparing to jump.

meya looked at Jeff and said, “Do you think he’ll jump?”

Jeff said, “You know, I bet he’ll jump.”

meya replied, “Well, I bet he won’t.”

Jeff placed a $20 bill on the bar and said, “You’re on!”

Just as meya placed her money on the bar, the guy on the ledge did a swan dive off the building, falling to his death.

meya was very upset, but willingly handed her $20 to Jeff, saying, “Fair’s fair.Here’s your money.”

Jeff replied, “I can’t take your money.I saw this earlier on the 5 pm news, and so I knew he would jump.”

meya replied, “I did too, but didn’t think he’d do it again.”

OT: evariste, the proprietor of Discard Lies, finds the torture memos a bridge too far.An unusually lengthy and passionate comment thread (for them) ensues.

it’s okay. When you get to missing Mr. Dog and your thoughts turn to what could have been I give you this to help you remember

I say we dig up Daniel Pearl’s head and ask it if it thinks we were too hard on KSM, TSI.

marbury?what about dred scott? you think ivy league losers have wisdom?

What’s your take on the numbers?

fdr: pack the court

McCain suffered worse than KSM but NPR was a lot less sympathetic. Me too but that’s not the point is it no it’s not.

I’ve just read through the comments thus far and apologize in advance if anyone has already made this point–I travel back in time right now to give them credit for an insight:

Do not misunderstand.The Obama Administration must take this position vis-a-vis the lawsuit of the 1979 American hostages of Iran.

He has just released memoos from the CIA and has used them to admit to the world that the Bush Admin. practiced torture.

Opening up the U.S. to lawsuits to denizens of Gitmo to lawsuits arguing torture and requesting remuneration for same.

So, if the Iran-Hostage class-action suit is allowed by the Justice Department it go threw, that puts the Obama Admin in the uncomfortable position of . . .

Defending the Bush Administration (i.e., in as much as the Justice Department is responsible to be the voice of the U.S.).

See?

Um, “through” not “threw”.Sheesh.

Oh, and I like “memoos” so that remains.

I’m against waterboarding if it proves to be ineffective.If it works and we bag terrorists and save lives because of it, glug, glug.

Nothing beside remains round the decay of that colossal wreck, boundless and bare, the lone and level sands stretch far away. Except for some memoos I mean.

Waterboarding is none of my business. I just don’t need to know. I don’t care how Lost ends either.

How about Canada getting all pissy about Janet Napolitano.

Acutally none of the 9/11 highjacker murderous terrorists came from Canada, although in defense of Janet, we did have Millenium Bomber who tried to come in from Canada (and got caught at the Washington State border crossing) and was quickly dispatched by some of these individuals that the U.S. has entered a secret treaty.

Okay, I made that last part up.But don’t tell Janet.

I’m against waterboarding if it proves to be ineffective. If it works and we bag terrorists and save lives because of it, glug, glug.

Somebody noted earlier that these numbers are inflated in that they count as “one waterboarding” each time water goes on the face.

Anybody want to follow up on that?

So, if the Iran-Hostage class-action suit is allowed by the Justice Department it go threw, that puts the Obama Admin in the uncomfortable position of . .

hi i’m the teleprompter jesus and you can get hugo’s book for only $19.95 ..
buy now and get the danny O!’s book “killing indians and laughing at leftards in the US” free

Blackfive says no torture.

Still, would like to know about how waterboarding was entered into the ledger.

You are absolutely correct, Jeff.I am on my Blackberry, so I cannot quickly look up the link, but the actual number of waterboardings is slightly higher than Gordo’s IQ.Single-digits, if my memory serves …

183[Jonah Goldberg]

From a reader:

Hi, Jonah. There seems to be a great deal of disagreement over what constitutes a single instance of waterboarding. KSM himself says he was waterboarded on five occasions, all during his first month of captivity. Each session lasted about an hour, and during each session, he was repeatedly waterboarded. And apparently yes, 183 is the number of times he was waterboarded across those five sessions, always for less than 40 seconds at a time and apparently usually for less than 10 seconds each (more on that in a moment). But calling that being waterboarded 183 times probably suggests incorrectly to many readers that on 183 occasions he was taken from his cell and subjected to a session of waterboarding.

Blogger Marcy Wheeler first pointed out the high numbers, including 183 for KSM, and she and others on the left seem to be having trouble with the math. The guidance for the employment of waterboarding restricts its use to one 30-day period, in which it can be applied on no more than five individual days. No more than two sessions are allowed in a 24-hour period, and each session may last at most two hours. Within a session, there may be at most six applications of water lasting 10 seconds or longer. No water application may last longer than 40 seconds. The total water application time may be no more than 12 minutes in a 24-hour period.

Wheeler and others are claiming that the 183 tally blows through the above limits, as even two sessions a day, times five days, times up to six 10-second applications per session, totals a maximum of 60 applications of water. And if KSM was in fact only subjected to one session per day on each of the five days he was waterboarded, then he should have maxed out at 30. But Wheeler and such simply aren’t reading the guidelines correctly. The limits of six applications of water is for applications lasting 10 seconds or longer. There is no limit on shorter applications, except for the cumulative 12-minutes of water per 24-hour period, toward which each short application would also apply.

So it’s more than possible to have 183 applications of water while still adhering to the guidelines, with applications under 10 seconds making up the great majority of the 183.

Now the above numbers don’t necessarily make me okay with waterboarding; I share your doubts. But the case against it should be built with the correct numbers.

[Name withheld]

May 30, 2005 Bradbury memo

Marcy Wheeler’s blog Empty Wheel

Khalid Sheikh Mohammed waterboaded five times

?

You are all just a bunch of sadistic homophobes that get your rocks off and satisfy your bloodlust by torturing minorities.

Thanks router.

I concur with the above based on the memo.

If you get a quick feel of the guidelines and number of instances, it seems hard to imagine that they would be able to achieve those numbers unless they were counting each application of water as a distinct instance.

I’m still amazed that the left is this upset over how we used techniques we use in our own military training against a guy who planned the murder of 3,000 of our civilians.

And I wonder if, before Khalid Sheikh Mohammed sawed off Daniel Pearl’s head he paused to think, “Gee, if I do this, maybe if I’m captured the Americans might pour water on my face.” I doubt it. I doubt he paused at all. I think he was so hopped up on bloodlust he probably came in his pants.

But what the hell.

Ya know, I bet Obama’s really not going to let anyone be prosecuted. I think he gins up something every week or so to distract people from what he’s really doing — or not doing. He either gets his sycophants on the left riled up that they’re finally gonna see some “rethuglican” heads roll, or he pisses off the right about something. Either way, he tosses out a balloon fence and no one pauses to see how badly he’s fucked things up.

And, hell, so long as we’re talking about this, we’re not talking about the way his apparatchiks are looting TARP.

Page 37 of the memo if you want to look.

no one pauses to see how badly he’s fucked things up.

Oh, the word is starting to get around, as you can see by the trends. The press can only cover for this dullwitted con man for so long.

Oh, and following on the heels of such legislative success as CPSIA and that wunnerful bill that’s gonna let the FDA and USDA inspect your backyard garden, we have the “Nonnative Wildlife Invasion Prevention Act” (H.R. 669) coming up.

If H.R. 669 passes, the US Fish and Wildlife Service (USFWS) would be required to conduct a risk assessment for each nonnative wildlife species to determine if it is likely to “cause economic or environmental harm or harm to other animal species’ health or human health.” In order to be on the “Approved List” it must be established that the species has not, or is not likely, to cause “harm” anywhere in the United States. Species that are considered potentially harmful would be placed on an “Unapproved List.”

Under H.R. 669, species not appearing on the “Approved List” could not be imported into the United States or moved interstate. Legal trade in all such unlisted species would come to a halt, possession would be limited, and all breeding would cease. Exceptions are limited and would not be available to pet owners across the nation.

Better hope your turtles don’t piss off a federal bureaucrat, ‘feets.

Apparently I’m no lover of liberty. The discarded lies person said so.

reading @86 it will be fun with the proggs and co2 emissions.

Wild Irish “Hitting the Jameson too hard” Rose quotes Little Green Footballs about the alleged plot by the right wing to deport all Muslims from the United States:

I’ve posted this many times, but apparently it needs to be said again:

If you argue that it’s vitally necessary to deport the entire Muslim population of the United States, you are ADVOCATING MASS MURDER.

Yes, I’m shouting.

There is no way in hell that you can uproot millions of people, most of whom have done nothing wrong, and throw them all out of the country, without committing mass violence. People will resist this with all their hearts.

And not just Muslims. No decent American would stand for it.

It’s a stupid, empty, meaningless fantasy that will never happen, and when you start ranting about it at my site, you achieve nothing but to drag everyone here into the muck, and make us all look like extremists and fascist assholes.

I have been on conservative sites since 9/11 and I cannot recall anyone serious every saying deport all Muslims from the United States.I have seen plenty of conservatives say deport all illegal aliens from the United States, but of course most of illegal aliens here are not Muslims.In fact very few are.Muslim illegal aliens exist (I am sure) but they are a small minority.Most American Muslims are native born converts, followed by legal immigrants or native born children of legal immigrations.The American Muslim community is mostly assimilated and really not a major problem like it is in Europe (where you have immigrants who are not assimilated and who are openly hostile to European values of five weeks paid vacations and topless beaches).Okay, they like the five weeks paid vacations and secretly like the topless beaches too.

But back to the point.I have never heard any conservative mainstream blog, be it Townhall, Weekly Standard, NRO, Powerline, Pajamasmedia, Rush Limbaugh, Hannity, Glenn Beck, Fox News, Instapundit, Ace, Protein Widsom, Patterico, or anyone else even suggest deporting all Muslim Americans.

I think that is even too friggin bat shit crazy for Michael Savage.Hell that is too bat shit crazy for Lou Dobbs!

These crazy over the top comments by Charles Johnson/LGF and his legion of reptilian brained followers are an orchistrated agenda of the left.It has to be.That quote is so Daily Kos it makes me feel itchy reading it.

This is the LGF Johnson quote:

I’ve posted this many times, but apparently it needs to be said again:

If you argue that it’s vitally necessary to deport the entire Muslim population of the United States, you are ADVOCATING MASS MURDER.

Yes, I’m shouting.

There is no way in hell that you can uproot millions of people, most of whom have done nothing wrong, and throw them all out of the country, without committing mass violence. People will resist this with all their hearts.

And not just Muslims. No decent American would stand for it.

It’s a stupid, empty, meaningless fantasy that will never happen, and when you start ranting about it at my site, you achieve nothing but to drag everyone here into the muck, and make us all look like extremists and fascist assholes.

Blackfive needs to give “pluck” the magic-dog treatment.

American attitudes were very different. “With some exceptions, American leaders believed that quarter should be extended to all combatants as a matter of right. … Americans were outraged when quarter was denied to their soldiers.” In one egregious incident, at the battle at Drake’s Farm, British troops murdered all seven of Washington’s soldiers who had surrendered, crushing their brains with muskets.

well americans changed then their attidudes were to bomb the f77K out of dresden and nagasaki and hiroshima

That New Ledger piece is outstanding. Who are these people?

Ah, the youngsters. I like it.

Oops. Stupid sockpuppet.

make us all look like extremists and fascist assholes.

let’s nationalize the banks that is so free market

at 101:One of ’em was set to get me a book deal, once upon a time…

Does that mean that what Hitchens underwent counts as “one” ?

yes b/c they should have taken the lousy socialist and did 10 times in 2 minutes and fulfilled the regulation

Am I to take it that you now believe Hitchens is infallible, meya? Because if so, I can drag up some of his previous columns for you…

97.Comment by Joe on 4/22 @ 8:54 pm #

This is the LGF Johnson quote: blah blah strawman I bravely strike down with righteous fury! blah blah look-a picture of a tree blah blah creationists suxxor! blah blah let’s play six degrees of separation starring some obscure European politician and TEH NEO-NAZIS!

LGF is becoming little more than an updated version of The Harlot’s Progress.

P.S. He has removed AOSHQ from his blogroll.

I don’t care how Lost ends either.

Who says it does?

If you argue that it’s vitally necessary to deport the entire Muslim population of the United States, you are ADVOCATING MASS MURDER.

No, you’re advocating religious cleansing. Deportation is not murder, unless we’re deporting them to the moon.

Who in same hill is advocating that anyway? In the U.S., I mean.

oh this is fun:

Re: Clinton & Cheney[Andy McCarthy]

K-Lo, If the Secretary of State really doesn’t think Vice President Cheney is a reliable source, she is smart enough to know the obvious thing to do:declassify and disclose the intelligence reports he’s talking about so all the world can see exactly how unreliable he is.Here’s her big chance to put her money where her mouth is and truly embarrass the guy she so effortlessly trashed in a public hearing today.

Gee, I wonder why she doesn’t seem to want to do that?She sure talks a good game.I’m sure it has nothing to do with the fact that every knowledgeable intelligence chief to weigh in on the subject (including Obama’s own intelligence chief) says exactly what Vice President Cheney said:namely, that the interrogation program yielded valuable information that saved American lives.Why would anyone suppose that the CIA’s reports reflect what the intelligence chiefs have been saying and what the Vice President who read them remembers reading?What a crazy, unreliable notion.Let’s get the truth out — after all, as Secretary Clinton assured us, President Obama is determined to get to the bottom of this.

?

Who in same hill is advocating that anyway? In the U.S., I mean.

His readers.

Make that commenters, not readers. And some of them, not all. For now, anyway.

[…] Wisdom comments: “Some torture is more forgivable than others, I […]

pjm bouncing back nice

Hitchens is infalible, but only when you give him a really good single malt.

This is maybe the all hands on deck moment.

[…] Protein Wisdom, Some torture is more forgivable than others, I […]

In response to an unprecedented expansion of federal power, citizens have held hundreds of “tea party” rallies around the country, and various states are considering “sovereignty resolutions” invoking the Constitution’s Ninth and Tenth Amendments. For example, Michigan’s proposal urges “the federal government to halt its practice of imposing mandates upon the states for purposes not enumerated by the Constitution of the United States.”

Cheney video defending interrogations.

Somebody noted earlier that these numbers are inflated in that they count as “one waterboarding” each time water goes on the face.

The same goes for tea-bagging for Anderson Cooper and Janeane Garfalfa.Only it’s balls on theirface and not water.

memoos = interoffice communications you get from your cowworkers.

I’m back to insisting that the problem isn’t “torture: right or wrong.”The problem is that Congress has been negligent in refusing to define torture.I’m thinking that a trial of somoene on this issue might be, in the long run, beneficial if they can get someone to draw that bright line distinction.It’s superfluous of the President ot say that the US does not torture, because we DON’T.

As it has not; waterboarding is not torture.Disagree?Fine, what standard do you rely on in making that determination?

Who in sam hill is advocating that anyway? In the U.S., I mean.

His readers.

Make that commenters, not readers. And some of them, not all. For now, anyway.

Well, those kinds of morons ought to be purged from the Internet. That kind of stupidity drags us all down.

IN-stalaaaaaanche!

#120: ROTFL!

“Now I feel bad about banning Magic Dog.”

Don’t. He and his 3 ring binder of talking points will be shuffled off to work some other blog site under a new, but still assumed, handle. His interactions will be studied by “top”, really “top”, linguists and public relations specialists to determine how best to act and react the next time.

A new shiny blue Protein Wisdom 3 ring binder will be run off and assigned to another Camp Obama graduate student. A random word generator will crank out a new handle. Another random ISP account will be set up. Tommorrow the new guy will arrive.

As for us, hope springs eternal that one day they will assign someone interesting. The daily grind of “Hope and Change” goes on.

If KSM was caught armed with a gun, and refused to drop it, use of deadly force justified.

If KSM was caught armed with information, and refused to divulge it, use of enhanced interrogation justified.

Doesn’t the fact that Hitchens underwent waterboarding disprove many of the absurd talking points beingpresented by lefties about waterboarding? One that it’s not effective. Clearly 20 seconds of waterboarding had fatman sputtering. If anything it’s highly effective and though they don’t want to admit it most likely foiled phase two of Al Qaeda’s operations and potentially saved countless lives.And ten minutes later Hitchens was able to calmly describe the situation to a camera crew. Think when Daniel Pearl gets his throat sliced that camera crews stood around afterwards and interviewed him about whether or not his ordeal rose to the level of torture?

Two, when its brought up that we use waterboarding on our servicemen during SERE training the lefties harumph that “they volunteered for training” so its different. Well of course, Hitchens volunteered to be waterboarded merely as an intellectual excercise and to write an article for Vanity Fair. And Hitchens called his voluntary excercise torture. That begs the question then as to how we can not call waterboarding of servicemen who volunteer torture using that same logic?
I’m not staying up at night worrying about servicemen being tortured while undergoing routine training, nor do I hear too many marines complaining either. And I didn’t hear too many torture absolutists crying about it either until evil George Bush used it on the guy who masterminded an attack on our country that killed 3,000 people in an extremely gruesome fashion. What’s worse? Having to face 2 minutes of waterboarding or realizing that your only two options are to be burned alive or jump off the top of the WTC? Which would Hitchens pick I presume?
It’s always so funny how so many people are volunteering to be waterboarded on camera just to prove its torture. What an absolute farce. You don’tsee many volunteering to have their fingernails pulled out to prove that finger nail pulling is torture do you? If you are willing to undergo it on camera, and if we use said techniques to train people then whether or not its scary or uncomfortorable it probably doesn’t rise to the level of torture that other techniques would. Because you wouldn’t be willing to undergo those to write an article and you wouldn’t subject yourself to such techniques to graduate.

Finally though, the fact that Hitchens went through his mental excercise shows the efficacy of using said techniques to fight terrorism. He would apparently use said techniques simply to write a story and sell a magazine (not to mention force those who waterboard him to actually be in danger or losing their moral souls simply to prove a point to Hitchens readers). Which is all fine and dandy. But if you would use such techniques for something so banal and inconsequential as an opinion piece, explain the logic of not using said technique to prevent people from dying horribly.

Would Hitchens really say that if we had KSM on 9/10 and knew of an imminent plot that would cause the death of 3000 people that he would refuse to waterboard KSM and let the attack go through? Hell if you want to simply think about the terrorists feelings and pain threshold,, think and leave out all the innocent people who will be killed by the terrorists actions, waterboarding them is not even as bad as letting them simply follow through on their plans.Lets see we could waterboard them for two minutes, or have them crash a plane into a building. Which will hurt the terrorist more?

RTO Trainer.

I have to steal that, it’s soooooo goooood.

If only we could evolve faster so that we all become disembodied heads in jars full of some sort of amniotic fluid.Then pussies like Obama would not have to make the terrifying decisions to use nasty physical force in order to get vital information.Because, you know, we’d all be just heads in jars.Just sitting around.At peace.

The TV remote would be useless though.

The TV remote would be useless though.

oh, I don’t know.One of our kittehs really likes to lick it.

I did not think of the poor pets.Damn, this “heads in jars” theory is more complicated than I thought.

and finally as far as terrorists not volunteering to be waterboarded, think about how absurd that is. First, if we have captured them and are now interrogating them because they may have information about future attacks, whether or not they volunteered to be caught is really irrelevant. what terrorist volunteers to be interrogated by the army field manual, let alone be waterboarded? I’m sure they’d rather be elsewhere, like perhaps martyring themselves and killing infidels. But alas, being captured they can’t get to do what they want. Boo hoo.

But more importantly – They volunteered to be terrorists! Who are going to blow themselves up or martyr themselves and kill other people. They volunteered to join an organization who’s sole goal is to plant bombs and attack peoplein extremely extravagant ways and kill as many as possible. And many of them volunteer their own bodies to achieve the objective. Surely if they have volunteered to be blown to bits by their own hand its kind of hard to say that somehow they’d find having water on their face to be more extreme. It would be like a guy who’s about to set himself and others on fire getting mad that someone is going to turn the air conditioning up.

They volunteered to be terrorists!

ALLEGEDLY!/lefty

They volunteered to join an organization who’s sole goal is to plant bombs and attack people in extremely extravagant ways and kill as many as possible.

Now wait.They may have a glee club, or exchange recipes too.

Did you know that recovery.gov has a form for making comments?

I’ve been trolling the government.(woot!)You can too!

It’s been nice knowin’ ya, RTO

Let’s put waterboarding in the next Army interrogation Field Manual.

It’s been nice knowin’ ya, RTO

I’ll keep y’all updated. maybe.

Did anyone ever consider trying jelly-boarding, or chocolate syrup-boarding?How could anything that tastes so good be torture?

Once they seize his computer and go through his hardrive we are all toast.

RTO trainer wrote:
Let’s put waterboarding in the next Army interrogation Field Manual.
Or, Lets interrogate (high level) terrorists using enhanced techniques and call it SERE training.

Once they seize his computer and go through his hardrive we are all toast.

RTO who?

I can’t believe how 9/10 we’ve become, really it’s fucking scary.

If you had asked pretty much any sane American citizen on 9/11/2002 whether or not we could use extreme force to extract information from the architect of 9/11 so that we could prevent a repeat of what happened a year earlier, the answer would’ve been (as they say in Australia) “red is positive, black is negative, make sure his nuts are wet.”

Now we have a president who wants to prosecute the folks who should be celebrated as heroes for stopping the next attack.

It only took seven years. Wow.

Cox and Forkum- “Confronting Terrorism”

Who is this RTO of which you speak ?

You people are upset over the cockiness and hubris of a Democratic Administration at the zenith of its power. I’m not surprised, but I’m disappointed that you haven’t recalled your Vietnam history. It all goes downhill from here for Obama.

First, two critical errors-one of which will tear apart the antiwar coalition that elected Obama.

1. The decision by Obama to go for Show Trials and a Special Prosecutor to go after Republicans will, inevitably, lead to a relentless pursuit of the Bush Cabinet-up to and including Bush, Cheney, and Rice. There is a point at which Obama could have stopped this, but now he has unleashed the Furies and his party’s very angry Base wants payback and revanche for losing the 2004 election. All this will do is cohere the Republican Party into a unified opposition. Democrats will be somewhat divided and uncertain; the older, wiser heads will realize that they have to deal with Republicans to get business done. The Republicans, sensing an existential struggle, will act as if they are the Wehrmacht in fighting retreat on the Eastern Front and pursue a Scorched Earth strategy against Obama and his aims. Obama’s agenda depends on a veneer of post-partisanship. That will end, as will most progress on Obama’s agenda.

2. What’s more important are the similarieties between Afghanistan and the buildup to Vietnam. This will do to the Democrats what LBJ’s war did to them in the late Sixties. Obama has chosen “not to lose” as Bundy and McNamara chose. This leaves the Taliban with the initiative, as the NVA had in the late sities. Like LBJ, Obama wanted to pursue an ambitious domestic agenda. The war won’t allow him to.

Three years from now, things will look very different.

RTO taught me how to make soup that sometimes was tasty when I made it and sometimes not so tasty really. It wouldn’t be a bad idea to take another crack at it this weekend. The food cravings from the quitting of the smoking are gone mostly but that might be cause I caught a cold. But I took some damage. Red velvet cakey damage. I did a taste test between the red velvet cake slices and the red velvet cupcakes. It was a tie! A very tasty tie. oh. RTO. Everything will be ok I think but I will be glad to sign an affidavit or what have you with respect to your good character and the essential truth of whatever it is you told the dirty socialists. What are not scary are pansy dirty socialists and screechy Soros monkeys. Just don’t touch them cause you don’t know where they been.

Afghanistan is about to become a minor sideshow I’m afraid, section9. Pakistan is where the Islamists are on the march and Pakistan is ruled by a corrupt and shaky government in possession of nuclear weapons. Democratic defense policy worries aren’t about Vietnam any longer. After all, the USSR is gone, not to return: the heritors of the socialist ideology we fought to curtail in SE Asia now sit in evident comfort in the White House and the US Capitol.

I’m on Alkins happy.My red velvet cupcakes are filet mignons with cream cheese on top.

#138
Ooooo. I volunteer to reaserch perky young breasts boarding! It’s a damn tough job, but damnit, somebodies got to do it.

You know, I don’t think that I’ve ever had red velvet cake.

If I were to make one, where should I seek a good recipe?

aterboarding is none of my business. I just don’t need to know. I don’t care how Lost ends either.

That’s just kookie talk, Happy.

I have few guilty pleasures. The three tv shows* I watch being among them.Lost, 24, and … well, crap, I guess just two. I watch AI too, but I could give that up any time.

*not a tv snob, there’s just honestly nothing else on that interest me enough.

I think the ‘waterboarding’ numbers are inflated for KSM… that was the number of showers it took to get him clean on the outside.

He will never be clean on the inside.

Strange all those ‘waterboarding are torture’ folks don’t address SERE training or hazing at VMI… or the ‘reporters’ who have had it done to them who are not in permanent psychiatric care, not quivering piles of flesh unable to relate to humanity, but able to grab the microphone and tell you how ‘bad’ it was.But then looking at past history and evidence doesn’t matter if you ‘feel’ something is so very wrong and can’t get evidence or history to back you up on it.Just so long as you can make the world more dangerous for the common man, those that denounce this will feel ever so safe.

Until the knife is at their throats, that is.Then they get all Fisky.

section9, what your #1 will lead to is another Civil War; when one political faction realizes that it will be prosecuted because of political disagreements when it voluntarily transfers power, it won’t voluntarily transfer it; you’ll have to turf it out of office at bayonet point.

Given the Left’s ability to project its’ own actions / motivations onto the Opposition anyway, I have a serious worry that the refusal to give up power will happen in the next 4-8 years.

“Y’all can make Hitchens your god or not.”

You were the one that brought up Hitchens on here so WTF is your point here?

“router on 4/22 @ 9:17 pm #”

Remember, this is the same Hillary Clinton that had to suspend disbelief to even listen to GEN Petreaus re: Iraq… I find her opinions receiving a bit less…weight since that time.

*You know, I don’t think that I’ve ever had red velvet cake. *

Holy crap its fantastic, though the actual cake part is not as important as the quality of the creme cheese icing.

Creme cheese frosting is so good, you can just eat that straight w/o the cake.

Not that I’ve ever done that or anything.

“I find her opinions receiving a bit less…weight since that time.”

Her legs on the other hand…..

WTF is your point here?

For even greater enjoyment, offer meya the opportunity to lay out the very principles of leftism.You’ll have to prod because I hear that’s some good weed, right there.They don’t give it out to just anyone.

Carin, Something from here would probably do.

I have seen people ask her that. Noone ever gets a response.

Red velvet cake is good.

meya could be pilfering thor’s stash, Mr. Pink.I think being a net drain on society is bad for the mind that way.No wonder the left fantasizes about saving earth by extinguishing humanity.

But then nobody really knows where the leftist hivemind’s store of eternal wisdom lies, or what’s in it that makes it so self-evidently valuable.For such a rabidly held ideology, it’s certainly based on nebulous foundations.

“I find her opinions receiving a bit less…weight since that time.”

Her legs on the other hand…..

Don’t be hating on the cankles, bro. Big-legged woman gonna carry me to my grave.

What’s going to become a big, big problem for Democrats is not that Obama is pursuing prosecutions but the crystal clear fact that the entire freakin’ Democratic Congressional Leadership knew it was happening and gave tacit approval.

Maybe they can get the lap dog MSM to spin this in some manner but it won’t be ignored nor will it bode well for the likes of Pelosi, Feinstein and Rockefeller. I’ll stick my neck out and predict that this quietly goes away somewhere down the road when the real consequences of Democratic head nodding to “aggressive interrogation” become apparent.

BJT-FREE!,

I understand that members of Congress cannot be prosecuted for either their knowledge of these interrogation techniques or their approval; is this correct? If so, there would seem to be a slight discrepancy between actions and opinions generated by counsel, and those of Congress.

The left is arguing we are hypocrits for crying about criminalizing the political process when conservatives prosecuted Clinton (well impeached him) for lying about cheating on his wife.

I agree.Lying about cheating on Hillary should have gotten a pass.Hence the reason the impeachment did not work.

But when we are discussing torture and why it was done, it is not exactly the same issue.This was about preventing another 9/11.Now if the left thinks prosecuting Cheney and company will help their cause, bring it on.I was and am against waterboarding, but I know that this will not turn the way the left wants it to turn.

Joe — Clinton was not impeached for cheating, or for lying about cheating. He was impeached for lying under oath.

Also for Obstruction of Justice, ie coaching others to lie under oath.

I’m siding with Teleprompter Jesus on this one, sorry guys.I understand the irritation, but this lawsuit, to me, seems like really bad news.Especially right now, given the second link and the whole Spain thing.

Silver Whistle: Of course they can’t be prosecuted but the sharp glare of the investigative spotlight tends to make congress critters scurry and hide. My feeling is that Pelosi, etal. will not want several months of hearings in which they are constantly asked “What did you know, when did you know it, and why didn’t you speak up?”

That was kind of my point, BJ, but I didn’t put it very well. These balloons can say what they like in the House or Senate, lie about it after, and there is 0, nada, bupkiss in the way of comeback. Counsel to the President offers an opinion in a memo, and he can get prosecuted? WTF?

One wonders why anybody would tackle a legal opinion in any administration if this seen seen through to fruition. Kinda makes you wonder at all of those people who breathlessly told us that Barry “looks critically at all sides of an issue.”

Unless, of course, someone comes up with the “safe list” of legal memo topics or some such.

OT: But worth a noting.

Who was Izzy Stone? How about “Pancake“.

Red Velvet Cake comes dangerously close to the “should be a controlled substance” category. (And probably already is, in NYC.)

Never having had same, I checked out a recipe from Food Network. And did the math. This cake (a Weapon of Ass Creation) clocks in at over 10,000 calories. The icing alone is close to 5,000 cals.

I mean, I like cake and shit… goddamn, do I like cake, but, er… Woah!

One of these babies is the equivalent of a weeks worth of dinners, or 4-5 half gallons of ice cream, or 2-3 dozen donuts, or…

Yowza.

um, you often eat a whole cake in one sitting, Mr. Bradley?

Uuhh, while there’s always a danger of that… no, on the whole I don’t eat an entire cake at one sitting. Any more than I eat “a weeks worth of dinners, or 4-5 half gallons of ice cream, or 2-3 dozen donuts” at one sitting.

Should I start? Am I doing it wrong?

I’m just trying to rationalize my love for red velvet cake and it’s really not soooo bad cause I spread those calories out over a few days.

If I have a whole cake I become possessed of the idea that I need to eat it up to get it out of the house cause I shouldn’t be having cake around the house. This is how I know that red velvet cake is really nice for breakfast. But I remember I think it was SarahW that taught me that red velvet cake is just a chocolate cake with massive amounts of red food coloring. Some people cut back on the cocoa cause the more cocoa you use the harder it is to get the red right. My feeling is that cutting back on cocoa is the wrong road to go down.

Never having had same, I checked out a recipe from Food Network. And did the math. This cake (a Weapon of Ass Creation) clocks in at over 10,000 calories. The icing alone is close to 5,000 cals.

Oh my lord. I guess Red Velvet Cake is a love I will never know.Honestly, you know I never tried smack ’cause they said you’ll get hooked on the first try, so I think perhaps Red VElvet Cake does next to smack in the “Stuff I just should avoid” category.

I mean, I already have a hard time with “Italian Creme Cake” and that one rolls in at 900 calories a slice.

900 calories. And, I don’t think that’s even a large piece. Just a normal-sized, maybe I’ll need just a tidge more later, sized piece.

I’m gathering the world’s best butter creme icing recipe for maggie to use on her next batch of cupcackes. It was developed in my sister in law’s bakery and is ginormously sinful.

Any other takers? E-Mail me at bjtexs at gmail dot com.

oh – there are youtubes of how to make buttercream icing. I like to watch them sometimes.

“WTF is your point here?”

Didn’t you read this:

“I just want to know if it counts as one or more or less in the 183 count. So we know what we’re talking about”

It is a mendoucheous twatwaffle.

The congressional unhappenings.

“Who was Izzy Stone? How about “Pancake“.”

This is good.

“fueled in part by charges by the conservative columnist Robert Novak and the controversialist Ann Coulter that he was a paid agent and a Soviet spy” … “Eric Alterman, a onetime Stone protégé, called the Stone-KGB stories “smears,” “phony,” and “pathetic,” “

Novak and Coulter – 1, Journolist – Zero.

Re: #185,

Pelosi can claim botox related memory loss. The injections froze the muscle between her ears.

Heh, you know what would be funny? If someone did a parody of Pelosi and dressed her up like the mom from “Brazil” – you know when she has her skin stretched ?

Oops, I forgot. There is nothing funny about democrats.

Any other takers? E-Mail me at bjtexs at gmail dot com.

I’m in for the zero-carb recipe BJ.Thanks.

Which is actually just butter.

Hey Jeff

Good one!

Posting under the general heading “Some torture is more forgivable than others.” On this one, we’ll have to wait and see just how forgivable.

[…] SOME TORTURE is more forgivable than others, I guess …. […]