TalkLeft’s Jeralyn Merritt passes along an e-mail from from the DNCC:
To kick-off Convention week in a spirit of unity, the DNCC, in conjunction with the Democratic Party’s Faith in Action (FIA) Initiative, will host an interfaith gathering on Sunday, August 24th, beginning at 2:00 PM at the Wells Fargo Theater located in the Colorado Convention Center.
This is the first time a celebration of this nature has been part of a Democratic National Convention and is symbolic of the Party’s desire to bring multiple communities together under its “big tent.” The gathering will include clergy of different faiths, Party leaders, elected officials and local community leaders. Speakers and musical guests will be announced later this summer. The event will be open to the public.
Yet in 2004:
The Kerry-Edwards campaign stepped up its outreach to religious constituents at a “People of Faith” luncheon. Prominent religious leaders from across the spectrum attended…
***
The efforts are mainly aimed at political and theological liberals. Mainline Protestants and black church leaders were visible at many convention events, including an interfaith rally encouraging more political attention to issues of poverty and hunger. White evangelicals and Catholics had a much lower profile.
On July 28, 2004, Beliefnet’s Steven Waldman blogged from the Democrats’ convention:
There were three separate events today geared toward breaking the Republican monopoly on faith. The DNC organized a “People of Faith caucus,” attended by about 100 clergy and activists. In opening the luncheon, Leah Doughtry, chief of staff for the party (and a Protestant minister in her private life), declared, “This is historic. This is the first time in the history of the Democratic Party that we’ve made space for people of faith” to hold a meeting like this.
Waldman had earlier written:
[W]hat we did see again throughout Tuesday night’s speeches was a persistent Democratic yearning to disrupt the public association of the Republican party with faith and morality. Helping with this was Barak [sic] Obama, the Democratic candidate for Senate in Illinois. “It’s that fundamental belief–I AM my brother’s keeper, I am my sisters’ keeper-that makes this country work,” Obama said, an allusion to the moment in Genesis when Cain asks, “Am I my brother’s keeper?”
One of the emotional highpoints of the speech was when he declared: “The pundits like to slice-and-dice our country into Red States and Blue States; Red States for Republican, Blue States for Democrats. But I’ve got news for them, too. We worship an AWESOME God in the Blue States.” A pretty direct rhetorical assault on the Republican ownership of God.
John F. Kerry’s biopic and acceptance speech were also peppered with religious references, declaring: “And let me say it plainly: in that cause, and in this campaign, we welcome people of faith.â€Â
Waldman later compared the Democratic convention with its GOP counterpart:
Just when you think you’ve got it all figured out. The Democrats were supposed to be uncomfortable with religion and yet speaker after speaker in Boston got up and quoted the Bible and praised the Lord. Since Republicans actually love God-talk, it stood to reason that their convention would be a veritable revival meeting.
Instead, it’s been more like an ACLU retreat, at least in terms of the use of religious rhetoric from the top speakers. None of the marquee acts on the first two nights so much as threw in a Bible passage. Democrats Bill Clinton and Barak Obama were downright Pentecostal compared to John McCain and Arnold Schwarzenegger. Laura Bush didn’t even talk about her husband as a person of strong faith. Given that today’s theme was “compassion,” I thought they’d surely hit hard the President’s “faith based initiative.” None of the prime time speakers did so.
So this is hardly the first time the Democrats have tried to get down with the faith-based crowd. They may be more successful in demonstrating their faith this year. But they will want to avoid having their convention turn into a worship service for the Obamessiah. And the presumptive nominee can talk about the AWESOME God of the Blue States, but he will have to Hope he can Change the image folks have of him spending 20 years worshipping at the Church of the Poisoned Mind.
The other side of the coin is that when Obama meets with religious leaders to raech out to the faith community, some may grumble about it on principle, which raises the question of whether such efforts turn off more of the non-observant voters that became an increasing part of Obama’s base in the primaries than he wins among the observant.
Update: There’s more at Memeorandum.
So much for the separation of church and state, you hypocrites.
I think it will be wonderful to see the Revs Wright, Moss and Fleger together in Denver, opening the convention with a strong “Smite Whitey, Dearest O!” invocation. Who could object?
But they will want to avoid having their convention turn into a worship service for the Obamessiah.
Why? Think of the money they’d save on bread loaves, fish, and arugula.
We loves us some religious folks, when we are not making fun of them, condescending towards them, or mocking them. Every 4 years, we want them to think that we care.
– So what do they use to keep the SecProgs and Faithers from tearing each others eyes out, police dogs and fire hoses. Seems like I’ve seen this movie before. I guess bigotry is fashionable as long as its an xtian, and not because of the race. Since so many of the minorities are among the faithful, how convenient. “Another Left two-fer”
BBH,
My understanding is that the intent is to fuse the two groups by having Wright lead the assembly in a stirring rendition of “God
BlessDamn America”. I wonder if Claypso Louie is coming?– So you have the Proggs and Faithers, including the Obamasmurfs, and layered on that you’ll have the Feminazi’s, ANSWER, code pink, Greenies, and all the other -ists and Orgs. Just your everyday gathering of the Party that CAIRs.
– No one would probably notice anything unusual if the moved it from the Convention center to the County mental hospital.
Sure they would. It would make more sense, for one.
Hopefully, the ghost of Rev. Jim Jones will be serving some Guyana juice!
Maybe you guys didn’t notice, but we don’t care what superstition you want to chase. Liking McCain or Obama and being embarrassed by superstitious loons following ‘ancient rituals” to please sky fairies bothers Chris Hitchens and Barry Lynn only.
We do find it amusing when the denizens of the superstition argue among themselves over which kind of worship pleases their “gods”…well, up until the time they start whacking each over the head or using it race-bait poor, oppressed white folks into being frightened by meanie black people. Then, well, Karl seems to be the kind of guy who drove around Watts in ’66 with a few friends a few rifles, if you know what I mean.
Oh, and Rick, if you don’t, then I don’t really care.
“Then, well, Karl seems to be the kind of guy who drove around Watts in ‘66 with a few friends a few rifles, if you know what I mean.”
Karl’s a Democrat?
Who knew.
“well, up until the time they start whacking each over the head or using it race-bait poor, oppressed white folks into being frightened by meanie black people.”
– Yes, that pretty well describes the situation every time the surrender Donkeys gather. But you left out “class warfare”, and the “nannystate express”. Gotta keep those true believers down on the plantation.
Ron, you seem like the kind of guy who would have been setting Watts on fire. But what makes you think Karl seems like a National Guardsman?
Goodness only knows what you mean Mr. Burgundy? Please feel free to expand on your ideology, as I’m sure everyone would enjoy hearing your thoughts on God, race and politics. You seem to be an open minded individual, and worth a good listen!
I’d like to subscribe to his newsletter.
– BTW PurpleFace, if you were barely out of your diapers, or even born yet, you’d know it was the Cops, mostly Black, and Other brown pwople driving the cars and carrying rifles, waring amongst themselves, Whitey was nowhere to be found in that little “episode” of American civil “justice”.
– But we understand why you need to keep the Narrativeâ„¢ going. Carry on.
BBH, Reginald Denny is proof that there was much more diversity, and tolerance, in the 1992 riots.
– Does the moonbat gaggle never tire of being used like a 2 stall toilet at a truck stop?
I suspect by the time the convention rolls around they won’t have enough Jews left with the campaign to make a minyan. So much for reaching out to people of faith.
Ron Burgundy is a fucking tool, lacking class, grace, and even the most basic of social skills.
I’m thinking of selling “I don’t like matzah ball soup” t-shirts(kosher, of course)!
…or using it race-bait poor, oppressed white folks…
Class-baiting? Jesus is down with that.
The question is whether the Copperhead Express will make it to Denver – Obama has it high centered so badly right now that they can’t get a jack on an axle without crushing one of his disowned buddy’s heads.
Come on JD, I’m looking for some entertainment! I already missed Barbara Boxer on “Morning Joe”!
– I was thinking maybe a consession stand, with a bullhorn to arreaxt the braindead customers blaring out:
“What do we want – THE BALLOON FENCE!
“When do we want it – NOW!
– A best seller shirt would be:
“All Your little boy cranks R belong to US! Che!”
Jd’s just mad that I called him out yesterday. I am proud of him, though, since most people in the group home can’t string together written profanity that well. Maybe next month his counselor will help him string together sentences to express a coherent thought. But, don’t you worry, JD, you’re on a journey and I’m sure someday you’ll be a full-fledged member of society.
PS I really doubt that, but I do like to give the disabled hope.
“PS I really doubt that, but I do like to give the disabled hope.
– Self healing?
It’s nice that Ron is so self confident that he feels no need to hide his opinions behind some supposed group consensus by using we instead of I. That he happens to have not a clue about what he speaks should not distract you from his overflowing sense of self. I think he deserves some sort of recognition for his efforts, perhaps a nice plaque or a little statuette.
“…or a little statuette.
– He already has one of those, you just can’t see it because it won’t stand up anymore.
They have pills for that sort of thing, so maybe he should consult a physician.
He’s part of a mental collective(multiple personality disorder), and I maybe he(they) must have a non-compete claus, so recognition would be strictly “verboten”!
The Watts .30-06 apocrypha needs to be placed next to the Atlanta Convention Center “rape and murder” which was reported to have taken place after Nagin refused to provide buses for people wishing to leave New Orleans. Kinda funny how those lies get spread among the deeply ignorant…
– Rick. Come on. How do you think it would go over if the “victims” ever discovered that the only thing victimizing them is their own party. You know the drill. Low hanging fruit, mentally-ill fruit, dead fruit, anything that ever had a name attached to it is a potential voter. ITS TEH BIG TENT! Do it for the <Chilll-drinnn!!!!
Ron Burgundy is a fucking tool, lacking class, grace, and even the most basic of social skills.
String [of] written profanit[ies]?
Maybe next month his counselor will help him string together sentences to express a coherent thought
Nope, they’ll be way too busy with you and your #10.
Jd’s just mad that I called him out yesterday.
Nope, I am mad at you because you unjustly, and rudely directed snark, and not even good snark, at my Better Half, and her native country. So, you did not call me out, you were a fucking jackass towards my Better Half. If you are cool with being “that guy” and by “that guy”, I mean a disingenuous lying race-bating class-warfare promoting asshat, then so be it.
The over the top actions and speechifying are cartoon-like. It is a person who really does not know how to do something aping what he thinks is the correct thing and instead creating a parody. It kind of tells me that the Democrats really do not believe; rather they want you to believe that they believe.
well, duh! but really not worth your anger JD. ;D
OTOH, I love how he’s all “we don’t care what you believe” but “we” the DNCC are going to pander away!
I expect many of the religious leaders there to be part of this group which has been organizing under many names in the Upper Midwest for years. It’s big thing is rights for illegals and “social justice”.
JD,
You have to acknowledge the intensely racist and inflammatory nature of your remarks concerning the remarkable success that Vietnamese refugees have achieved through hard work, diligence and perserverance. That type of talk is an incitement to every cup rattling sexual and racial identity monger in the Democratic party. People just need to learn that subsistence through equitable redistribution of wealth from the productive to the nonproductive is the only way to true harmony – just ask O!.
And don’t forget to turn on your Lightweight O! Vibrator – it’ll give you that tingle to start your day right.
Maggie – I know. Had he said that about me, that would be one thing. I tend to be pretty protective of my girls, and fucking mendoucheous taint stains like Ron Burgundy do not have the intestinal fortitude or the marble sacks to do anything else, should not be tossing snark at them, especially in the manner in which that lying cum-guzzling gutterslut did.
Rick – How could I forget? I denounce myself.
Heh, BBH re #25, I used a similar joke in another thread. The classics never get old.
JD – he has to toss that kind of snark here – where he is anonymous and no one can see him. If he did that in a bar he’d be still be searching for his nose.
As for “JDâ€Â, if your wife misses Vietnam so much, why is she is here? One would think she’d be grateful for the impetus to come here. Now, she can do the INVADING! Isn’t that what numerous PW commenters say about blacks coming over as slaves? They should be glad?
FWIW, this is the little pile of steaming cowdung from Ron Burgundy that pissed me off. Apparently, he is proud of that. Should I let it bother me? Of course not. But I am not a big enough man to let it go, I guess. I fully agree with Mikey, small pathetic little cowards like Ron Burgundy, he of multiple aliases on here, according to Karl, can only do this behind the protection of their keyboard. In meatspace, he would never say such things.
JD,
At least you’ve had the basic decency not to mention the Hmong farmers who arrived here thirty years ago, possessing not so much as an alphabet. That’s a story better left undiscussed. Sharecropping to entrepreurship in a generation – what are those people thinking?
Those fucking Hmong’s. If they miss VietNam so much, why don’t they just go back. They could then be triumphant invaders.
– The bitter ankle-biting haters JD. Most are nothing like they present themselves to be. Society dead-enders that get a tingle up their leg, doing whatever they can to diss anything of value to others.
– I always take hope in the notion they die just like they lived. Alone, and drowning in their own hateful puke. Makes me smile, it does.
Will we see Rev. Wright and Fr. Pflegler? Will the DNC sponsor a “Dancing with the Faith” contest in which these two will team up for the tango? And will Barack and Michelle trip the light fantastic with a “Socialist Samba”? Stay tuned … ther’ll be a whole lotta shakin goin’ on.
Ron, sadly, is the sort who thinks the buffoonish handle is ironic. Note that his concern for “denizens of superstition” does not extend to the sort of denizens who fly airliners into buildings over the issue. Ron is focused on the “real” enemy, and baselessly flinging the “anyone who dares criticize Obama = racist” charge around.
(not coweringly religious, mind you, but deeply spiritual)
Actually the Hmong and the Meo, were from Laos, and they were ‘chucked under the bus”
by Senator Symington, when facts became
inconvenient; The former were relocated to Montana and parts of Minnesota as I understand it. It’s the Rhade and the Montagnards who were the beneficiaries of Sen. Cooper, Church, Hughes, ‘redeployment
legislation’ those who survived made it to
Orange County and the shores of Galveston
Karl – I have been told it is best to ignore the slimy bastage. It does not seem to work.
God damned Christianists.
Faith to Play Big Role at Democratic Convention
Shhhhh! Don’t tell Nishi.
THEO-LIBS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
/spit
JD,
Ron is not (afaik yet) part of the multiple-personality troll here. And given what he wrote, I thought your response was an expression of justified anger. Although it’s generally best to ignore, a low-level troll like this does occasionally need to be flagged, if for no other reason than to alert new visitors as to what Ron is about.
Karl – Thanks. It has that same unjustifiably self-importantm, popmpous, arrogant, holier-than-thou, you are a racist tone as the others.
Mandelay, Mike, JD
The basic point you raise here is why I ave been on the topic of Black Liberation Theology as long as I have. BLT is a racialized twist on the hardcore Religious Left movement. Trolls like Ron will throw arond charges of racism — better directed at the church Obama attended for 20 years — to avoid having to address their cognitive dissonance over who and what they are backing in this election.
I’d like to give Ron Burgundy the Transcendent Irony Award for being so hatefully anti-religious that he felt the need to snark at the commentators here on a post about Democrats holding an interfaith conference.
Irony, thy color is burgundy. Bravo!
What he wrote about JD’s better half was mindless, hateful and quite fascistic.
As P. J. O’Rourke points out in ‘Mr. Sununu Goes to Washington’ today (Wkly Std) “The problem on the left is, now that Karl Marx has forsaken them, they have no [political] philosophy.” To the extent that this is so, it is not at all surprising Democrats would turn to ‘Faith’, is it? And particularly in this regard, Christian faith, since that faith comports so well with their gut moral intuitions. Makes perfect sense to me.
So, Ron Burgundy was in favor of tolerance, before he was against intolerance, before he was in favor of tolerance.
I AM INTOLERANT OF INTOLERANCE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!eleventy
“since that faith comports so well with their gut moral intuitions”
Dammit, Sdferr, do you have any idea how much a Krupp Ironiedetektor costs? Maybe this thing can be fixed but the way the needle pierced the case when it popped makes be think its shot.
Heh
Though not usually given to denouncing, I will, just for now (and for the next 30 secs.), denounce myself.
Almighty One –
Please don’t notice that we are in favor of abortion on demand.
Yes, we have faith in you or whatever… but when it comes to engineering the face of mankind, really we the sincerest pumpkins in the entire pumpkin patch, know better…
Yours, The DNC
ps. O!
Ok, I take it back. Denouncing over.
How’s about we try this, instead?
Freedom vs Equality.
Which side of the scale gets the weight of your mental finger?
Following up on Ron’s f irst comment, my suggestion for the democratic party is try not to refer to religion as “your superstitition”, at least during an election cycle. Any true “person of faith” is unlikely to feel comfortable in the democratic party, given its hostility to pretty much any faith based position. As an example, look at Obama’s church – I did not get the impression, listening to wright’s sermons, that those people are there to glorify God but are instead there to glorify themselves and feel better about their lot in life. And everytime I see the Clinton’s in church, I always wonder if Bill is like me as a boy of 10, when Mom forces him to get up every Sunday and go to church.
Many hosannas for the “Leichter Arbeiter”, healer of the earth, enricher of the poor, caregiver of the sick…uh…I can’t remember the entire list! Damn! I’ll have to tivo Matthews and Olbermann on MSNBC!
Also, I have to say, I have not encountered any democrats in the last 2-3 years who expressed any faith in God- in fact, I find the democrats I do run into are generally folks whose parents were religious and their parent’s religious natures turned them off to God and the Church.
Minor correction.
– Kgt Hunter, always laboring tirelessly for the cause, checks Sdferr’s party card for the proper denouncing credentials…
– Ah. I see you have th order of the Flying Eaqle of the damned…Ok Comrad, you pass muster….. job well done…
Seig O!
Matt, Esq
Have you not encountered Lisa on PW? Do you not believe there are actually millions of your fellow citizens very much like her in regard to her profession of faith and membership in the Democratic party? Can you safely ignore them and still claim to understand the world you live?
The Dems are absolutely schizophrenic on religion. They vary from deriding them, calling them names, theocon /spit, and at the same time they have an overtly “religious” candidate that they have a messianic complex for.
BJ – Spot on.
…live in?
Sorry.
And Ron Burgundy is the bastad love child of a Ron Jeremy / Jef Gannon spunk-fest, an oozing rectal fisutal on the GAY COCK PORN OF LIES !!!!!!!
Okay, troll-scat aside,
1) When party-level Democrats “do religion,” it always looks to me like a parody. It’s like their imitating what their internally-filtered preconceptions tell them “religionists” must be like.
2) Maybe the Republicans described in the post don’t have to talk constantly about religion because they’re actually doing it, you know, “walking the walk,” and therefore don’t need to pose so much.
I denounce, and condemn myself, in the harshest terms possible.
Roughly 30% of self-identified evangelicals are registered Democrats. The percentage is somewhat higher for Catholics but I am unable to find the cite at the moment.
The Lightweight Vibrator is making as big an attempt to hold as he is to increase. Between Rev. Wright and Fr Pfleger I don’t rate his chances as very high for either.
Hmmmmm
Soooooooo.
I guess liberal Democrats will stop calling Christians “Christers”??
– Easy there Jd. You just got your condemnation rating on your party card. Best to break that puppy in gradually.
Pew data late 2003. They have evangelicals at 22% and Catholics at 28%. Interesting to note the shift in observant Catholics from 42% in the ’80’s to 30% in 2003. I wonder what in the world might have been the cause?
“Take a Progressive friend to church this Sunday. You’ll both be bitter for it.”
Rick
I entirely agree with you and Karl that BHO is particularly in a very tricky squeeze betwixt and between his moral philosophical antecedents, but to which should he turn for salvation, Marx (ultimately, if only indirectly) or Jesus? I offer him no, zero, slack on his political choice of a church, an entirely cynical move on his part in my estimation, but I can’t make from that a case that he doesn’t believe. He won’t convince me (and in the event, I don’t think he will convince the majority of voters) that he didn’t know exactly what Rev. Wright was up to and that Wright wasn’t up to unmitigated good. But my post on O’Rourke was meant to be a broader generalization, well beyond Obama, beyond even the Dem Party as currently constituted, to the question, where do they turn for foundational underpinning in the future? I think religious faith is a better bet for them than W.V.O. Quine, for instance, to pull an eliminative materialist out of the hat. More people (voters) go for Jesus than go for airy fairy Nishian futurist schemes. So, color me unsurprised and shoot me.
Just for good measure, since it appears that the troll has shat and vanished:
First, I am glad that Ron knows the difference between religion and superstition. It makes him stand out as thoughtful and knowledgeable.
Second, Leftism has always been “faith-based,” it’s just that their faith is not in the Judeo-Christian God or any other traditional god. It is in the God of the State, which springs forth, fully grown, from the forehead of the God of Their Own Intellect.
Inviting Christians and Jews and Muslims and Hindus and Sikhs and whatnot is just window-dressing.
It strikes me that after reading this thread, and the attendant attack on JD’s better half by this example of bipedal feces that the anonimity of the internet is the greatest known testicular enhancer yet devised.
It’s not a stretch, Sdferr. One viewpoint on Marxism has always been that it’s a somewhat extreme Christian heresy, and this just brings that into focus.
One repeated feature of Christ’s ministry was addressing the question of rich people. He spent much time emphasizing that Christians should not be envious or grasping — should, rather, ignore the matter and even feel sorry for wealthy people. After all, the rich are so busy minding the store (so to speak) that they don’t have time to get right with God.
The medieval Church, in my opinion, distorted that almost beyond recognition, especially when it got coupled with Divine Right, and continued well into the modern period. Marxism does very little beyond affirming that, albeit while rejecting the notion of Godhead — the meek shall inherit the Earth, and are thereby empowered to <ahem> assist the Current Management to make their wills early.
Protestant Christianity, especially here in the US, and modern Catholic doctrine tend at least somewhat to swing back toward the original teachings. Leftists have no acquaintance with belief outside their own ideology — pallid kumbayah-singing Unitarians don’t count — so whenever they try to opine on the subject they end up like somebody who’s tone deaf trying to comment on Bach. As here.
Regards,
Ric
“…just window dressing.”? ‘Just’ meaning, only, solely, singularly, ultimately, with no other component what-so-ever?
Ric: Leftists, ok. Unitarians, ok. Are we confidant that we should define Dems so narrowly? How about Lisa? Ultimately how will they define themselves? I’m only guessing here, not offering the well considered result of years of sociological research.
By ‘as here’ you are perhaps referring to ‘Ron Burgundy [now two fictional stooges]’?
Yep, great point, Ric. My father, the good blue blooded liberal Catholic that he is, often brings up the “it’s easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to get into heaven” verse, when ruminating about the evils of Capitalism. My dad is a thrice time loser in small business startups, but is a very accomplished politican and program administrator at the local level. Anyhow, I always answer him with the remainder of that verse, where Jesus’ disciples ask Him, well then WHO can be saved. Jesus’ response? That what is impossible for man is not impossible for God. Jesus had no concern for the flesh or the affairs of the state. He was worried, though, that our desires for man made things would be greater than our desires for everlasting life. But again, and this is anathema to modern day liberals’ sensibilities, it’s about free will.
“Faith” is one thing. Christianity, Judaism, Islam, etc. is another.
The ongoing failure of the Democrats- and of the secular media- to understand the difference is the issue. And I’m sure that the difference will be all too apparent at Denver.
Prayer to “To Whom it May Concern,” by any rational reading, is a violation of the Eighth Commandment. Of course, given abortion, the Democrats already have the Fifth to answer for.
Ric: Spot on.
OI: look at the way modern secularism misquotes Paul’s statement that “The love of money is the root of all evil.” There is no reasonable, rational way to read the New Testament and come away with the clear understanding that Jesus hated wealthy people. Heck it was a wealthy person who paid for his tomb and he was often in the homes of well to do indivuduals (tax collectors, Roman Elites and such.) As long as money wasn’t the central focus of a person’s life, they could find good favor with Jewish carpenter (and God.)
Jesus has been hijacked by poverty activists, environmentalists (“what would Jesus Drive?” Answer: Um .. Jesus drove? I’ll say … sailboat!) and race baiters of all types. Some are more shameless than others. When the past president of Planned Parenthood said that Jesus would have been pro-choice because “he honored women in the Bible,” one had to sign a contract with a Circe du Soliel contorsionist to bend the result into the narrative. These are the sorts of things that have the vast majority of evangelicals and a significant percentage of Catholics wary of the Democratic party and their stated “values.”
However secular progressives are more than willing to expose themselves to some of that there “superstition” about “sky beings” beacuse the ends justifies the means. Many of them would prefer that people of faith come to the idea of breaking capialism and making government care for all honestly, through personal caring, higher education and advanced activism. The fact that some Christians have elected to partake of a communion of Liberation Theology wafers and full employment/income redistribution kool aide is quite all right amongst the itelligencia. “Welcome my brother! Um, we won’t be opening with prayer tonight, you understand, right?” Many of those secularists will pat the the liberal Christian (or Jew or Unitarian or Wiccan or whatever) on the head, shake their hand and then roll their eyes to their friends after the poor, demented, but very useful godbotherers have turned away.
I know that this is overly cynical and somewhat unfair to both Liberal “people of faith” anf seculat progressives but the tone and construct is real and observable. For the many liberal Christians whose writings I have read and those I have talked with, the significant unifying factor is an almost complete rejection of God as central and active. They have matured and grown past the the historical figures of faith and must now face a new reality of ascendent “human beings” of reason who, by the way, happen to believe in God (or sophia or goddess or whatever other name assuages a purely human injustice.)
Most of it on the Dem side is “fixing” ego and self driven, where Christ (or God) is no longer central but relegated to a doddering but amusing icon to be referenced like a beloved, elderly uncle who doesn’t get out much anymore. the individual that was supposed to be transformed by faith, confession and atonement is instead “rebirthed” as activist with their salvation accounted for by good deeds to the lost and least.
Heavan can wait, after all. The poor and unemployed need us now!
Brian: “There’s just no pleasing some people…”
Ex-Leper: “That’s just what Jesus said, sir!”
— Life of Brian
All the displays of “deeply held religious feeling” by Democrats is suspect. True people of faith don’t generally wave it like a flag. Dems tend to do this when they think they need the votes of the “god botherers”.
All?
mote eye log
Beam, not log.
In my case, maybe toothpick.
Mental note of correction made, mojo, though I liked log because it’s inherently goofier.
The faithless try to con the faithful.
If a Christian looks under the tent to see what the platform is, they’ll find all sorts of rotten things attached to it that a Christian simlpy will not embrace and remain a Christian. If one can compartmentalize morality to permit it, one ends up like Jesse Jackson, an empty soul in search of a mistress who won’t tell.
Sdferr, I do generalize — otherwise my posts would be even longer than they are — but I also try to be fairly nice (in the “precise” sense) in my terminology. Not all Democrats are Leftists, but that’s the way to bet. If I had to put in all the disclaimers and exceptions every time it would turn into ladder-instructions boilerplate.
There are a lot of people around who take “It is easier for a rich man…” as being somehow permission to act badly toward the rich. IMO this is a distortion of Christ’s teaching, based on an older perception of what is right. It is bad to rob people. It is, however, virtuous to be unkind to bad people, no? So if rich people are bad, it’s virtuous to rob them… Christ was trying to oppose the second part of that syllogism. It is never Christian to be unkind to anyone. God reserves the right to be unkind to people, and He doesn’t need assistants.
You have only to read the posts by “Ron Burgundy” and “datadave” to see the distortion in action. The executives of Exxon are rich, therefore they are vile, and it is virtuous to call them nasty names and take their money away.
Regards,
Ric
Ric, my post 87 was poorly executed I think. All my fault. And it is easy for me to see that you are in fact, nice, in just about every post you’ve put up that I can recall. (That other, modern, usage of ‘nice’ as in ‘milquetoasty’ in lieu of having to come down forcefully in favor of ‘good old fashioned’ virtue is a symptom of something I disfavor.)
Back to the failure of my post. I should have hit return/enter after ‘…unitarians, ok…’ and then addressed myself to the rest of the board, some of whom tend to make precisely the over-generalizations you are not guilty of.
As to the question I began with, ‘Democrats: where do they turn for undergirding?’ I believe I ask it only because I’ve seen the practical failure of their (formerly?) favorite theorists, over and over again these last, what shall I say, forty years? Was your “It is not a stretch…etc” meant to imply that their semblant ‘heresy’ and the laughable contradictions they now face (as noted by many here) must augur their return to, if not Karl M. himself, then some other secular advocate in the lineup, especially in light of ‘…that’s the way to bet’? I do not make a habit of keeping up with the latest leading lights in the liberal pantheon, so I may be out of touch in that regard, but the last bigwig splash I can think of is Rawls. Is he the one to lead them onto the barricades? Oh, then there’s that pesky electorate to think of. They won’t want to go through that.
As I said before, I do not know, but I do think they’ld eventually get tired of banging their heads ‘gainst that wall.
Jeebus, I hope this one makes sense.
[…] Protein Wisdom – Faith to Play Big Role at Democratic Convention [Karl] […]
Ron Burgandy –
You have got to be among the top ten absolute stupidest assholes on the web.
Your stereotypes are un-fucking-believeable! What are you? – About twelve years old?
A better caption for that picture would read:
Obama 2008 – Resistance Is Futile
Resisting laughing, you mean?
#88 – O.I.
That plays well into the rich man giving a large temple donation and the poor woman giving a lesser. It is about who you are, not what you do or your resources. How do you live your life?
It would be unreasonable otherwise, and God is reasonable – so said Pope Benedict at the Regensburg address. Here is a scenario: A baby girl is born to a rich man. Alas, she sickens and dies before her first birthday. A baby girl is born to a poor man. Alas, she sickens and dies before her first birthday.
So, which baby should get into heaven? Um, why would that be a question? The answer is both – if God is reasonable. And entrance to heaven based on bank balance is utterly unreasonable. And God is not unreasonable, cannot be unreasonable if He is worthy of reverence.
If he is unreasonable, then we would be as well off throwing virgins into volcanos as trying to worship him.
Any resistance, Sferr. Embrace your enlightened overlords.
N.B. – the rich man did the donation with ostentation and display, the poor woman gave her donation quietly.
There is the difference – vanity and pride as opposed to humility.
Ah! The widows mite!
‘
Much to my bank accounts misfortune, that was my father’s favorite story.
Not complaining mind you, but with out my father’s attachment to that story, I could have easily been dead years ago…
This isn’t sounding the way I imagined it would, but what I am trying to say is that you get what you need.
Unless you are a secular humanist, who actually gets what he/she needs, but is too self absorbed to realize it.
Mikey, et al
Do you, does anybody know any intentional jokes told in the Bible? I think I can put my finger on one, though it may just be a function of translation and the stoopidity lodged in my wetware.
â€ÂWhat would Jesus Drive?â€Â
A somewhat beat-up, 10 year old Ford F150, just like every other carpenter.
– The word “camel” (gemeal in the Hebrew for “thread”) is a gross mistranslation. The word from the aramaic is also “thread”. Thread, not the animal.
– Run that through your mental babnlefish and see what that suggests to you. With that in mind, and as Ric went over, neither Jesus nor God had any particular problem with honestly acquired wealth. This “get the evil rich guy” is the class baiter’s holy grail, and its wrong. But a lot of churches, and their elders/clergy, preach it as gospel.
– King James did the best he could with what he had to work with.
– Theres lots more of those ro be found, but they that have other motives are not inclined to look.
#90 BJTex, that condescending attitude toward Christians is strong in the Republican Party, too. The elites love the evangelicals’ votes but find evangelicals’ policy preferences distasteful. Huckabee’s showing in the early part of the campaign was a reflection of restlessness in that part of the GOP coalition.
Nazdar: I would agree and don’t think that those of us who consider ourselves evangelicals haven’t noticed.
Unlike some of my brethern I haven’t made the social issues the be-all end-all of my political preferences. I like to look at the whole picture and make a reasoned decision based upon personal preferences and critical thinking. Of course, we get tarred and feathered with every snake handling ultra fundamentalist sound bite that is gleefully dredged up and presented as representing the 30% – 40% that has “hijacked” the Republican Party.
My problem is I don’t really know what the blue blood elitist Republicans stand for! Right now they are as amorphous a group as any I’ve known. Smaller government? Lower taxed? Strong defense? Individual liberty? What views and/or accomplishments in the last 7+ years would lead me to believe that that particular group believes in the core principles of Conservatism/Classical Liberalism that I embrace as my own?
The answer is far to depressing to contemplate.
Well, BJ. If you weren’t an oppressor of women and brown people, maybe it would make more sense to you.
What, JD? Have you joined the Blue Bloods? Do you have an exclusive membership in that toney country club and hang out with Muffy and Bartran as they sip appletinis and Harvey’s Bristol Cream (“Any friends of ours who can ski the deep powder at the top deserve the very best!”)? Are all of your ascots dry cleaned and neatly folded next to your copy of the Financial Times?
I denounce you as an elitist snob albiet with certain probations for your Way Better Half.
Besides, as a certified oppressor of teh browns, I should have a legacy memebership into the blue bloods. Shouldn’t I? :-)
BJTexs
“My problem is I don’t really know what the blue blood elitist Republicans stand for! Right now they are as amorphous a group as any I’ve known. Smaller government? Lower taxed? Strong defense? Individual liberty? What views and/or accomplishments in the last 7+ years would lead me to believe that that particular group believes in the core principles of Conservatism/Classical Liberalism that I embrace as my own?”
So it turns out the republicans were educated by the same system as the democrats, neither side ends up knowing where they came from, what their own valuable politico-philosophical antecedents are, nevermind the valuable antecedents of their ostensible opposition. I wonder, am amazed that this could come to pass, but not that it has in fact.
The idea of me becoming a blue blood is laughable.
It would be interesting to trace back to the point where the Republicans quit acting like Republicans. Off the top of my head, when the House blinked in the staring contest with President Clinton, that has always seemed like a turning point for me.
Well maybe so, sdferr, but I do know what the modern Liberal/Progressive believes and will work very, very hard to achieve.
What of Republicans? What do the blue bloods want? What world view has their elitist education fostered? What is their vision for America? It doesn’t matter who’s paying lip service to who’s faith at this point. While hard core fundamentalists will “cling” to their social con agenda most of the rest of us are seeking a comprehensive vision. Do you see that with McCain or, for that matter, the Republican party in general?
I don’t and it frustrates the crap out of me.
JD: I do know that. The thought of you sipping a Perrier with lime with Muffy and Bartran makes me giggle. Besides in that “enlightened”, exclusive company your Better Half may be, how we say, less than warmly received, as would my family, I suspect.
I’ve felt for quite awhile now that the Reps overeavched with Clinton’s impeachment. For whatever its legality the public simply never supported it. There’s a good reason why Kucinich can bring up impeachment until passes out from exhaustion and it will never see the light of day. Pelosi is smart enough to know that there is precious little public support for the spectacle.
Republicans are free form drifting ina sea of dissatisfaction and blindness and I just don’t see McCain as the answer to that malaise.
Not yet, anyway.
BJTexs
Back in my college days I learned that James Madison took notes during the constitutional convention and wanting to have for myself what he wrote, I started looking for his notes in bookform. No bookstore I went into, and this includes, by the way, most shocking to me, the bookstore at Independence Hall in Philadelphia, had them. As far as I could tell at the time, they were not in publication (this was mid-70s). This was remedied by the onset of the bicentennial anniversary of the publication of the Constitution itself, which occasioned the re-issue of Madison’s Notes. But I mean to say, how on earth could they have ever gone out of print?
It is funny you mention that, BJ. The only people, in my experience, that have ever mocked Better Half’s ethnicity were enlightened liberals. Then you have asshats like Ron Burgundy.
I am so upset, I would like to see the play this weekend and I can not find any information on when the play is showing. I have the flyer and there is no information on the time “My Sisters Keeper” is playing. I also looked on the web sites and I was not able to find out what time the play is showing. I called the number listed on the flyer twice and I left my phone number and no one has returned my phone call. I would really like to see the play this weekend. unhappy Myila