Writing in the Wall Street Journal, Stephen F. Hayes frets that Republicans, including presumptive nominee John McCain, are making the same mistake with Barack Obama that Democrats made with Ronald Reagan in 1980 — misunderestimating him as an empty suit:
The assumption behind much of this criticism is that because Mr. Obama gives a good speech he cannot do substance. This is wrong. Mr. Obama has done well in most of the Democratic debates because he has consistently shown himself able to think on his feet. Even on health care, a complicated national issue that should be Mrs. Clinton’s strength, Mr. Obama has regularly fought her to a draw by displaying a grasp of the details that rivals hers, and talking about it in ways Americans can understand.
In Iowa, long before the race became the national campaign it is today, Mr. Obama spent much of his time at town halls in which he took questions from the audience. His answers in such settings were often as good or better than the rhetoric in his stump speech, and usually more substantive. He spoke about issues like immigration and national service in a thoughtful manner — not wonky, not pedantic, but in a way that suggested he’d spent some time thinking about them before.
More important for the race ahead, Mr. Obama has the unique ability to offer doctrinaire liberal positions in a way that avoids the stridency of many recent Democratic candidates…
Allahpundit agrees:
The experience contrast will serve McCain better than Her Majesty, but hammering the guy for being a lightweight with a knack for prose won’t work since it makes it that much easier for Obama to prove his heft by showing command of the details. It’s a stupid line of attack anyway: If you want to motivate the base and capitalize on Maverick’s appeal to the middle, you don’t argue that Obama has no ideas, you argue that he has lots of ideas, all of them quite dogmatically liberal. McCain is the real centrist, much to the chagrin of most conservatives.
With all due repect to both men, this sort of anxiety is unwarranted.
It should not be assumed that an attack that does not stick in a primary will not stick in a general election. In 1976, Gerald Ford erased almost all of Jimmy Carter’s 33 point lead by pointing out the illusory nature of his campaign.
McCain can exploit the experience gap in ways that Clinton could not. As has been pointed out previously, Clinton really does not have much more experience than Obama; arguably, she has less. McCain has both elective and military experience Obama cannot come close to matching.
But perhaps more important, a critique of Obama’s lack of experience and a critique of his dogmatic liberalism are not mutually exclusive. McCain can point to a record of working in a bipartisan manner (however annoying to his base), while noting that Obama is the most liberal member of the Senate and the MoveOn-endorsed candidate whose major bipartisan accomplishment involved working with McCain.
McCain can make Obama the anti-Peanut Butter Cup. Unexperienced and dogmatically liberal — two bad tastes that taste worse together, not to mention a combo completely destructive of his claim that he can bring people together.
*****
updated to include Jeff’s thoughts: Obama’s being dogmatically progressive — and having the ability to tick off progressive talking points and the “ideas” for their implementation (all of which involve some sort of wealth redistribution scheme, even when, as with the left’s anti-NAFTA positioning, that redistribution is of the “America first” variety one would expect from, say, Pat Buchanan, the radical left and the paleocon right circling together in an Earl Scruggs/Nitty Gritty Dirt Band, hippy-meets-jugband-redneck kind of unholy jam session of expedience, until the Circle Will Be Unbroken, if you will) — is not the same, I don’t think, as showing oneself to be more than just an empty suit; rather, it shows one to be a doctrinaire partisan who has managed to memorize the party’s leftmost platform and internalize it by rote. None of which speaks so much to Obama’s ideas as it does to his mastery of the progressive agenda, the near perfect adherence to which has driven his candidacy and rallied the hard left base.
Or, to put it another way, even empty suits can look smart if they’re festooned with a nice kerchief and polished brass buttons, especially those provided them by a dream team of experienced progressive tailors working out of George Soros’ various ideological haberdasheries.
Obama’s experience, such as it is, has been in getting elected to ever-higher offices on the strength of a charisma that, to me at least, is as grating and affected as anything even Mike Huckabee might ooze.
In the end, McCain can certainly show that his experience far outweighs Obama’s — and is of far greater heft, if only for its, um, bipartisan nuance. [cough cough hack]
None of which will matter if this turns out to be a Fox Mulder election, wherein enough voters buy into Obama’s platitudes and conclude, ultimately, “I WANT TO BELIEVE”!
Doctrinaire liberal and a complete lack of practical executive experience in any environment is a pretty lousy combination.
allahpundit’s argument is futile..the instant O and Mccain appear on the same stage for a debate Mccain is doomed.
he will appear very white (even albinoish), very old, and very, very short.
polls are spoofed because ppl will never admit they vote on appearance…..but they do.
Mccains best strategy wud be to neverever appear next to O.
if he can manage it.
dittoes to u JeffieG.
How can Mccain counteract the appearance factor?
Perception IS reality.
Double shitburger.
Perception IS reality.
IS it?
Well, Obama looks very Urkelish, if you ask me. He doesn’t look commanding; he looks bookish and sleight.
Like Jesus, only without all the hair and robes and glow that comes from being the son of God. Though I expect he’ll at one point don a crown of thorns — or at the very least, a mod suit and a Beatles cut.
Jesus was a carpenter. Before they had power tools.
Prolly he was pretty buff.
glad that nishi went right for the race thing, right after excusing Obama’s association with murderers and terrorists on the ground that the crimes were so old.
You’re really racking up a record for beclowning yourself.
How can Mccain counteract the appearance factor?
Perception IS reality.
There are many perceptions shit for brains, not just yours
It’s as least as likely that we’ll overestimate as underestimate Obama. What’s he shown so far? That he’s a damn fine retail politician. He’s smart, cagey, and charismatic. He’s also classic lib, minted in the 1980s. He’ll need to tack right to win the general. Few in the middle buy that tired lefty crap he trots out.
McCain should play hard ball but not gutter ball. Put simpy, Obama has no record, and his ideas stink, however, glibly he can dress them up. Do we really want Obama in a show down with Putin? Please.
It will be a tight race. Obama is too good on the stump not to get somewhere in the high 40s, but sanity and experience will ultimately trump Obamamania.
Sure Billy Jeff beat two war heroes. But that was then–before the smoking craters in NYC. It may seem like we’ve forgotten–but we haven’t.
Obama looks very Urkelish….
to u. john and cindy are nice looking for old ppl….but the obamas look like movie stars.
why do we even have movie stars? because of the way they look.
right after excusing Obama’s association with murderers and terrorists
im sry Karl, but i dont get it…its like Che!…to me Che! is a cool t-shirt.
and probably that is true for most people in my demographic.
im not excusing it….im saying it is meaningless to me. it wont sway my judgement.
praps that is wrong.
and wat race thing? i dont unnerstand that either.
Allahpundit said a brilliant thing in the link….its NEVER the right time to club Bambi.
how is mccain gonna pull that off?
[…] 2008: Obama and the anti-Peanut Butter Cup February 26th, 2008 unknown wrote an interesting post today onHere’s a quick excerptHayes frets that Republicans, […]
Perception IS reality.
Given most peoples perception of you on this board, nishi, you might want to give that one some thought.
oh..i didnt mean white race, like cauc…..i meant white in color….like, albinoish, untanned.
sry.
its fine B Moes, that IS ur reality of me.
i accept it.
i dont care, or i wud modulate my behavior.
I’d be harsher, too, guys, but Jeff likes it.
its fine B Moes, that IS ur reality of me.
No, that is my perception of you. It has nothing to do with reality.
There may never be a good time to club Bambi, but Bambi eventually has to face the real world.
nishi,
oddly enough, when you effing wrote:
I took it as a reference to his being white. Because apparently I’m the crazy one.
Thanks for adding Che to your list of things in your moral vacuum, though we all would have guessed it.
There may never be a good time to club Bambi, but Bambi eventually has to face the real world.
Accidents happen in the real world, don’t they? What if Bambi were to wander in front of a speeding lorry? Be a shame.
Oh, I see now that when you wrote white, you didn’t really mean, y’know… white.
Keep digging!
I agree with Karl, and I would add this: Obama has been an empty suit in the primaries because it was a good strategy to be an empty suit. When you have lots of charm, and your opponent has none (or negative), you don’t do issues unless you’re forced to. Not only does getting into the nitty-gritty engage Hillary on her strongest terrain, but it increases the possibility he’ll be mired on the far left when it comes time to tack to the middle for the general election.
The guys has written a couple books. He was a college professor. As soon as the empty suit thing stops working he’ll go with another play. Or, to extend the analogy, there’s no reason to go to the air if the other team can’t stop your ground game.
Of course, there’s the possibility McCain can’t stop the ground game either. Carter couldn’t.
If I thought having Bambi eating away at my garden would open up a clear path for more dangerous predators to make their way to my patio door, I’d shoot that doe-eyed fucker in a heartbeat.
My inner Jacksonian trumps my gentle Dr Phil exterior.
jeff…he looks graceful to me. and gracious, also, in his manner….like when he bends slightly towards someone he is talking to.
that is best word set i can come up with.
look at this SNL skit where he makes an appearance.
i think that is sort of unquantifiable.
we are a visual culture….even ur Urkel refernce..that is visual modelling.
Incidentally, my perception of nishi is that she is getting dumber by the day.
I don’t know if that is the reality, but nishi is right about perception in politics.
And dammit, we missed our chance to nominate Brangelina!
OBAMA FEELS MY PAIN!!!
HE LEANS INWARD, AND ANNOINTS ME WITH FINE OILS!!!
nishi, what’s the fundamental difference between Obamania and religion? Because I’m missing it.
Bambi can be killed with kindness–while my esteemed colleague was in grade school, I was in the Hanoi Hilton–etc.
I also think that McCain will get more than his fair share of women–ahem. When there’s a burglar downstairs, who would you send–Obama or McCain?
Hey, you gonna eat that?
Karl, im sorry i meant white IN-COLOR, WHITE_COLORED not white RACE, not cauc.
jeez…jeff ur right, i cant separate that effectively….that word is corrupted.
didnt we just have that whole race-as-fuzzy-concept thing here?
im a jeffersonian, not a jacksonian. ;)
Jeff said perception is reality.
i just boosted it.
oops….watch here
No. I just don’t think so. The experience thing is paramount, and Obama is um, ahead of his time you could say. Why? I will tell you why. The media is why. They are hell-bent on the peoples knowing they live in like the most reviled country like ever, with an economy collapsing faster than those two tower thingers did. These are peoples that they are making not be the stalwart desperate times call for desperate measures little changebunnies that will turn their hopeful eyes upward towards Baracky’s promises of salvation. No, not even. They are creating a very risk-averse environment I think, and McCain will be the safe, experienced choice.
I’m not watching the debate tonight. I’m just going to hang out in my room and stare at the Obama poster that came in this month’s Tiger Beat.
It’s like it was too too risky to create personal Social Security accounts – they had a lot of success with that little concept – but yeah now let’s turn the wheel over to the hopeychangey man and like hope really hard. It’s not gonna happen. People aren’t stupid. They say they wanna revolution yeah you know but they thought it was just gonna be on tv.
see, it’s thinking like that that’s going to get us in trouble. You’re ignoring Obama’s accomplishments and experience. Like that time he spent as govern… um, wait… um, he’s on some committees. and he’s dreamy.
Did’ya ever get up in the middle of the night having to pee, only to crush your little toe on the beg of the bureau that somehow moved itself into your path in the dark?
THAT’S reality.
maggie,
To be fair, Obama is the chair of a Senate sub-committee on Europe… which never had a policy meeting.
And he thinks that Michael Jordan’s basketball shoes used to cost too much money. And ESPN likes him too …
The Dems don’t even think he is qualified enough to be a fucking Committee Chairman in the Senate, and we are supposed to think that he is qualified to be POTUS ?
feets, u can argue substance with ppl here, higher IQ gradient.
but most ppl are primarily visual.
seeing interacts with the primitive part of the brain, the part that often saved the species during the EEA.
i am just asking, how does Mccain counter O’s advantages in the visual dimension?
sure, he can club Bambi with policy and xp (experience).
but will anyone hear it if they are totally invested in the visuals?
…i am just asking, how does Mccain counter O’s advantages in the visual dimension?
By looking more Presidential.
ah, well, that’s what I get for only skimming his Senate site.
By smelling better. Duh.
but he wont look more presidential.
perhaps he shud stand on a box and get a spray tan….but if that gets out it will be bad.
Awesome.
i am just asking, how does Mccain counter O’s advantages in the visual dimension?
Plato was right. This is why I’m against all the “get out the vote” movements.
Perhaps if McCain wore a Che shirt he could garner the young-hip vote?
Find a history book, nishi, Presidents don’t look like movie stars. They mostly “appear very white (even albinoish), very old…” The best policy might be for McCain to not smite Bambi, but just be very Grandfatherly and wizzened and gentle with the wunderkind.
Perhaps if McCain wore a Che shirt he could garner the young-hip vote?
dubious
it isnt like we are pro-Che!…its just like hes kinda meaningless for us.
wat Mccain really needs is a head transplant (a younger head) and tibia/fibula bone replacement to make him taller.
ill agree with that B Moes, but we need to append…..before television to ur statement.
I’m pretty sure those “perception is reality” visual types who refuse or perhaps can’t reason things out, won’t even be watching the debates.
They’ll be hanging out at some bar/coffee shop with their Che t-shirts affecting blase attitudes. Debates are (like) too real.
You also seem to be ignoring the fact that there was an actual movie star in this race at one point.
Ya know, Obama’s the kind of guy who could turn the old ‘Liberal is a bad word’ idea on its head. At least in a debate format. Remember that prior to 1980 there was such a thing as a socially liberal Republican.
it isnt like we are pro-Che!…its just like hes kinda meaningless for us.
I’d prefer that those “Che-is-meaningless” types stay home that first Tuesday in November.
Not that it would occur to nishi that there are any number of people — including Democrats — who will see McCain and say, “Oh, there’s the pasty white dude! And a war hero? Where’s my ballot?”
Pasty white guy
“t…its like Che!…to me Che! is a cool t-shirt.
and probably that is true for most people in my demographic.”
Then you’re an ahistorical ignoramus, and a fool.
“Reality? That’s where the pizza delivery guy comes from!”
Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn’t go away.
-Philip K. Dick
And for nishinozzle:
“Reality is for those without the strength of character to handle drugs.”
Jeff said:
…the radical left and the paleocon right circling together in an Earl Scruggs/Nitty Gritty Dirt Band, hippy-meets-jugband-redneck kind of unholy jam session of expedience…
That’s brilliant. And f*cking hilarious.
Oh. The visual thing. That’s easy really, and they’re already on the case. You’ve seen all the ads of McCain in military uniform. That trumps height and good looks. You can see this a lot in who they cast as the military people in the movies. Usually they don’t put a high premium on pretty. Anyway, I don’t really see how you can say Obama looks presidential when he doesn’t look like any president we ever had except for the 24 one and Obama’s like a lot more waifish. Maybe you mean like for some other country? I could see that. Yemen, maybe.
Jeff only thought of jugband because of . . . you know . . . the ears.
EARIST!!!
before television to ur statement
Have you ever seen Nixon, Carter, and Reagan?
There are also pictures like this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:McCainWithSquadron.jpg
I am not gay or anything, but that is a damn good looking man.
BMoe is getting all gleenwaldian on us.
McCain is going to end up with those that vote for manly men. Too much hopeumungous changerooni makes one shoe squishy, I think.
Worse comes to worse, he’ll challenge Barry to an arm wrestling match. “STEP ON UP, STICK BOY!”
B Moe is a distinguished poster whose writings have been read on the walls of PortaJohns all over the southeast, he isn’t even sure what language they speak in Brazil, and has never been there. Except if you mean the movie, he has been to see that.
He also loves kittens and makes frequent charitable donations to various bartenders around Athens.
BMoe is simply fabulous. Fierce even. A strapping and virile man if there ever was one. His wisdom has been spewed at honkeytonks and roadhouses throughout this great land. And he is not scared of teh ghey.
Normally I skip over nishi’s teenage girl comments but this one came too soon on the thread. But anyway, Barry looks pretty white to me. BTW, why does he get to dub himself black when his mother was white? Is this a sperm/egg thing? Are some halves more halves than others? Is there some genetic 50% that is actually more than 50%?
screwed the tags again!
And, his musings would have been read into the Senate record but Feingold is a fucking moonbat who thought the words of a Cream of Wheat blogger that looks like Beaker from the Muppet Show was more appropriate.
Hmm.
The appearance of these Moes makes me wonder what might have ever happened to A Moe?
I’m thinking that if freaking Nixon can get elected twice, McCain’s appearance is not an issue and nishi is once again proving how batshit crazy she is.
That BMoe is a fine chap, Kelly. You would want him. You can prolly feel it in your loins. A Greek Adonis in Athens. A visionary in his thinking. A man’s man.
“Barry looks pretty white to me. BTW, why does he get to dub himself black when his mother was white?”
The Democrats One-Drop Rule”.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-drop_rule
Arrrrgh! Runaway quotation mark!
When you get to “FlamingMoe”, I’m outta here.
Now, daleyrocks, Nixon got elected before the advent of TV politics and … uh … er … um …
MCCAIN IS TEH ASHY!!!!!! LIKE AN BLEACHED ALBINO!!!!!!
BTW: I happen to like all of the Moes and it could be in a gleenwaldian way. ROWRRRR!! Guitar Playa!
But WHAT HAPPENED TO A MOE?1!!!!
…why does he get to dub himself black when his mother was white? Is this a sperm/egg thing? Are some halves more halves than others? Is there some genetic 50% that is actually more than 50%?
His Father was Black.
Barack is black enough I guess for Michelle. That’s good enough for me. Her I can’t picture ever getting with a for real white guy. I don’t think she much cares for them. Or maybe she just thinks they’re too controversial.
But WHAT HAPPENED TO A MOE?1!!!!
I would rather not talk about it.
I’m just going to hang out in my room and stare at the Obama poster that came in this month’s Tiger Beat.
Turn-ons:
Stubble
Camel no-filters and Coke
Berets and dark shades
Turn-offs:
Thick ankles
Mean people
Terrorism (of ALL kinds)
Keep it down in here! Don’t make me say it again.
Get outta here!
Wait, you mean father or Father?
Nishi’s cool t-shirt.
Barack is black enough I guess for Michelle.
Feets – I don’t think Malkin disputes he’s black. Oh, that’s prolly not the Michelle you meant.
I’ll bet nishi thinks she’s winning the argument here. Legend in her own mind that little chickie. Attention span of a hummingbird’s wing beat.
Intellectual depth of a bed pan and as useful too.
What? What?! Y’all are a buch of gleenaphobes.
nishi’s demonstrating Rush’s old arousal gap theory. The Tiger Beat poster is apt.
Shemp. Shemp.
Whatever happened to Shemp?
Not to mention the Cheese.
Anybody seen five guys named Moe around here?
CNN is reputable, because they told me once that W lied our way into the debacle in the Middle East, that Americans are Imperialst agressors, capitalist running dogs, and likes to oppress them some brown people. That is why I like BMoe. He is the king of the oppressors. And Pablo. And that BJ guy. Karl and Jeff G – they are thinkers, sneaky oppressors, in fact worse than the others because their thoughts give intellectual cover to white supremacists like the rest of you yokels. And, Kyoto.
C’mon, bark eep. Jus’ one mo’. Won for the road, for the Gipper, hiccup. Heh. I am cute, and funny, and bulletproof. Jus’ one mo’ little shotta tokillya an I’ll be on my way.
Ted Kennedy overheard at local tavern, right before bursting onstage and trotting out his new Spanish while campaigning for Osama Obama.
If you see Moe, tell him Manny & Jack are looking for him.
If you see moe., beware the drum circle.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moe_(slang)
Google is fun. There is also a http://www.moe.org, and http://www.moes.com
How tough can it be to regurgitate the liberal line these days?
It doesn’t take a huge brain to repeat the emotional narrative to all the unfairness on Earth. That Obama has mastered the same talking points that most oppressed college Frosh have mastered shouldn’t be a huge shock.
And nishi…Che might mean nothing to you. Seriously though, slathering yourself in that ignorance isn’t attractive. Is your Mengele t-shirt in the wash?
Kirk – Barry O is the personification of everything I dislike about the loonwaffly moonbats. He is the ultimate elevation of form over substance.
i am just asking, how does Mccain counter O’s advantages in the visual dimension?
Vast experience.
It’s the little lies that trip you up.
Spread out!
[…] other bloggers have responded to Hayes. His column generated a fair amount of thoughtful comment. ProteinWisdom focuses more on Obama’s content than the Hayes noted process. The DailyKos detects signs of […]
John McCain got cornholed at the Hanoi Hilton?