Karl Rove, speaking to the RNC on Friday:
“Republicans have a post-9/11 view of the world. And Democrats have a pre-9/11 view of the world,” Rove told Republican activists. “That doesn’t make them unpatriotic, not at all. But it does make them wrong  deeply and profoundly and consistently wrong.”
Democratic Party chairman Howard Dean denounced Rove’s remarks and renewed his call for the deputy White House chief of staff to be fired for his role in leaking a CIA official’s name. “That is both unpatriotic and wrong,” Dean said.
So, for those of you playing at home on your portable Fascist Meters, a useful protein wisdom translation of the exchange follows:
Rove: “The GOP thinks the current DNC foreign policy strategy, especially insofar as it seems to proceed from a pr-911 paradigm that calls for “realism,” “containment,” international consensus, and paper pressures, is—while not unpatriot—profoundly wrong.”
Dean: “How dare you question our patriotism! And Jesus, haven’t we put this evil motherfucker in jail yet? For that leak thing—the one where no intent to do damage coming from the White House was ever proven? Christ, correct me if I’m wrong here, but if we can’t simply insist upon the firing of our political rivals by accusing them of crimes that even a special prosecutor with a couple year’s worth of access is unable to prove, then the terrorists have already won.”
Adjust your scorecards accordingly.
Your Fascist Meter is a PORTABLE? The Chimperor is forcing me to use this clunky old desktop.
Fucking Fascists…
UP
Dean: YEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAARRRRRGH!
Rove, pitchin’ a shut out. These people (Dean, Kennedy, Reid, Pelosi, et al) have no clue.
“That is both unpatriotic and wrong,†Dean said.
So its the Democrats that are questioning people’s patriotism? Oh, my word, God exists and he is Montey Python
You can’t question my patriotrism – because you’re unpatriotic!
The Democratic Party has become a parody of itself.
Question: When did the Democratic Party ‘jump the shark’?
So someone who—at least based on the current indictments and statements of the prosecutor involved—played no role at all should be fired?
Can I call for Dean to be executed for his role in the Lindbergh baby kidnapping? And his role in the Starkweather murders?
Then, of course, there’s the matter of his role in the Hindenberg disaster…
BECAUSE OF “THE HUMANITY”!
Question: When did the Democratic Party ‘jump the shark’?
Posted by Larry | permalink
It has been going on for awhile. Time to rename the Democratic Party “Cypress Gardens”
I thought republicans were the ones that supported originalists. Talk about pre-9/11!
I thought republicans were the ones that supported originalists. Talk about pre-9/11!
You know, actus, the world is round. If you just stop, it will appear as if you are not that far behind when the conservative, originalist Rethuglicans lap you.
The parodies come a dime a dozen these days.
That wasn’t Dean, it was Kennedy.
How else to explain all the hot—nay, flammable—air?
I see acthole flew over and farted. He tried to drop a load but nothing of substance came out.
Tired and trite. Typical acthole.
The trouble with Dean’s “critique” of Rove is that t relies heavily on the Kerry/Clinton myth of nuance and “gray areas”.
There is no gray in the real world.
You are evil or you are good.
You are for the president or you are for the terrorists.
You are honest or you are a liar.
You are right or you are wrong.
Period.
There’s no gray about Rove being wrong and unpatriotic.
No shit, actus; those damn progressive Republicans. If this shit keeps up, there’ll be no constitutional right to gay sex in Texas by 1875.
This is getting serious. Somebody do something.
tw: Taking the Constitution seriously, dammit.
Really? Because he thinks the Democrats are not serious about security, he’s “unpatriotic”?
Bullshit, actus. Try to act like an adult.
That’s not what Dean was talking about. Maybe the problem isn’t so much Dean’s nuance as other people’s comprehension.
Actus, the trouble with nuance and its rhetorical cousin “irony” is that both fail to take into accont the ruthless, and ultimately evil, nature of the enemy we are no facing. As Bill Bennett said, irony died on 9/11. Nuance may not have died but it was ceratinly wounded. Yours is a classic example of pre-911 thinking, rife with uncertainty and relativism masquerading as tolerance.
Rove: Muhahahahahahaha
Dean: Yearghhhhhh!
Got it. It’s like Close Encounters of the Third Kind
Actus,
Dean’s problem is that people comprehend him just fine.
See. You’ve got a problem when you think Dean, of all people, is nuanced.
See, but him saying that, post-9/11? that just proves him wrong. And didn’t he get busted with his gambling problem post-9/11?
See, for bennet, there never was irony. All that crap he’s been saying all this time? That was serious. Its always been serious for him. He can’t tell when irony is dead, because for him it never was.
– The real irony is that actus thinks shes making sense.
…
…
What point are you trying to make? This looks sorta like the old Lefty retort “OMG LOOK AT THAT ‘MORAL LEADER’ WITH A PERSONAL PROBLEM LOLZ HYPOCRITE! HYPOCRISY IS WORSE THAN EVIL!”
But I’m not really sure…
Yay Rove!
Where can I go to enroll in the Grand Rovian conspiracy? I wanna join in on the spoils. And canny awareness of, like, reality!
– Its in the same industrial park complex as the Dean Aluminium foil corp.
… Conspiracies….. conspiracies everywhere I tell yah….
That wasn’t the point. The point was that for Bennet there never was irony, so he can’t tell us on what day it died. As for the retort in your head? on Bennet, it happens to be true. Too bad.
– actus, you’re something like 0 and 15 against Bush/Rove, and apparently incapable of comphrehending that GW won’t be seeking a third term.
– You’ve been fucked worse than a 50 year old whore in a HongKong opium den. What will it take for you guys to wake up? Are you just planning to keeping on trucking through 2008 on this crap, ‘cause if so you’re going to make a whole lot of Reps very happy.
… if you say so.
The only irony I see in this situation is that liberals are attacking the patriotism of the Republican politicians and the overwhelmingly Republican military that are fighting to keep Islamists from taking over cities like San Francisco and killing all the liberals. If liberals think there’s something unpatriotic about that, maybe they’d all be happier living somewhere else.
I agree with O’Reilly when it comes to Baghdad by the Bay—if they don’t support our armed forces, then they don’t deserve the protection of our armed forces. There’s nothing ironic about that, is there?
So Dean was talking about material leaks of classified information that could have affected national security and gotten people killed?
Did the article refer to the NSA leakers as both unpatriotic and wrong?
Because that would have been ironic.
And the other irony is red staters saying ‘we have to fight them there so we don’t fight them here’ while new yorkers, DCites and the like have a clear idea of how to fight this war, but get flustered by those who fear that Laramie Wyoming is part of the latest orange alert.
Probably not. What was affected? Terrorists now tremble that they are bein illegally surveyed? Or according to some, that no laws are being broken?
That’s been an interesting oddity: the people who say that this is all perfectly legal will also tell you that it should be surprising that the president is doing this. Is it a surprise? Could we (and the terrorists) have guessed that terrorists are possibly monitored?
– As in “cut and run”, advancing to the rear, aggressive surrender, and lets get back to give-away programs, this war is screwing up our welfare agenda…..
No, the irony is that New Yorkers continue to vote Democrat even though it was a Democratic President who was too busy philandering to catch the terrorists who attacked New York on 9/11. Somebody explain that one to me, please.
Jeff, has Actus been rifling your sofa cushions? ‘Cause I think she’s finding all the good pills.
You mean that presidents can’t get poontang and fight terror at the same time? That must explain why george is so testy. Dude needs to ask his brother about getting a Thai vacation.
The last paragraph on illegal immigration got me. “Rove scolded them, took away their allowance, and accepted their apologies. They then tucked their tails between their legs and minced home.”
Unlike Bill Clinton, who grabbed his poontang when and where he could. Maybe Dean just needs a visit from Monica.
TW: yes. Who’s talking, Monica or actus?
new yorkers, DCites and the like have a clear idea of how to fight this war
You mean that we need an immediate redeployment, like Murthafocker said?
How ironic, the best way to fight is not to fight at all.
TW: actus is actually Alanis Morisette
He’s from West-central PA no? That’s not NY or DC.
Tsk, tsk, actus. You avoided the question posted by Vercingetorix. You must really like the “cut and run” philosophy if you apply it to debate.
Actus, Jean Schmidt said it best: “Cowards cut and run. Marines never do.” I don’t care where Murtha is from, how many medals he managed to procure, or how great a “friend” of the military he claims to be. If wants us to cut and run, then he is a coward. He may come from western PA, but he’s a DC insider these days, just another liberal operative in the Pelosi/Dean mold.
I always knew you were an elitist prick. Here’s a hint: we’re concerned for all of America, not just where we live or the places that vote the same way we do. Moron.
Or I prefer to fight terrorists on my terms, rather than theirs. Metaphors are made to be stretched.
<blockquote>
Here’s a hint: we’re concerned for all of America, not just where we live or the places that vote the same way we do. Moron.
<blockquote>
But not so concerned that you’ll give deference to the places that are actually in danger. You’ll just go on with the I LOVE NY attitude.
Mock Bush all you want, the results of Clinton’s philandering spoke for themselves on 9/11. Unless you want to say that he was neglecting his duties for some other reason, like a lack of concern for America’s future. I wouldn’t go so far as to call Clinton a traitor, but I definitely think he was selfish and let the wrong part of his anatomy do the thinking for him. And nothing you say about Bush will ever undo the damage this caused to America. But laugh it up, liberal, and make sure to run Kerry for office again next time around. America’s safer with you people in the minority anyway.
Hmmmmm!
actus, you are not only stretching metaphors, you are mixing them. Unless you think that Vercingetorix, among others, is a terrorist. And you still haven’t answered the question:
Not that you will answer it, of course.
Ah? And here I thought that we live in a democracy, where at least opinions expressed on a blog have equal weight, and are validated by their logic, not wishful thinking.
Further “deference” does not mean “valid”. Nor does it mean “priority”. It means “Submission or courteous yielding to the opinion, wishes, or judgment of another”, or “Courteous respect”.
This is what we have a government for. To make decisions that are (hopefully) made on a non-deferential basis. Not that this always happens, but I see no need to emulate someone else’s stupidity. Write your congresscritter about this.
Also, we haven’t heard from NY or DC on this thread. We’ve heard from you. Are you claiming to speak for potential terrorist targets?
And, no, this is not a stretched metaphor on my part.
People love their children and feel concern about them, too, but that doesn’t mean they let them make decisions about keeping the home secure from burglars. If Democrats want the American people to trust them with power again, they have to stop acting like children.
Would you like me to explain? I mean they have to stop worrying so much about their big spooky parents and wiser siblings, the government and the Republican party. They need to stop worrying about the “monster under the bed,” the bogeyman who’s coming to take away their precious privacy. They should worry a lot more about the very real burglars and serial killers who are right outside the window and trying to get in the house. Hell, if we let Democrats run the house we won’t even have a gun in the closet.
How do you bring yourself to vote for these idiots, anyway?
Who do you think NYC or DC wanted to defend them from terrorists? Dubya, the savior of laramie Wyoming? or someone else?
Yes, it’s too bad that 2 cities don’t get to run the rest of the country, isn’t it? I’m sorry that you don’t like democracy.
Of course not! Laramie Wyoming has to have it say in how NYC gets defended! We have to fight them over there so we don’t fight them over there in NY.
Why are you so certain another terrorist attack would be aimed at NYC or DC again, actus? You are again betraying the left’s typical lack of imagination. Is it beyond your grasp that they might hit somewhere else next time? I have read, and agree with, plenty of conjecture that a strike at a middle-American suburban mall would have a devastating effect on our psyche and economy. Of course, a bunch of red-state fundie pricks getting gassed in Laramie would probably secretly amuse you and your friends, huh?
That last orange alert was just for DC and NY. But you’re right. We should worry about flyover country too. Like the Midland texas walmart cell-phone buyers.
actus, soulsista, you’ve had 5 years to come up with a plan to fight terrorism. If you are going to criticize the way we fight now, you should be able to piece together your own plan so let;s have it already.
My plan, our plan in Iraq, Afghanistan, the Horn of Africa and the world at large, is the classic: Separate the fighters from the population, and then destroy them with overwhelming force. It dates back to when Caesar crushed Vercingetorix [me!!!] and rolled up the Gallic tribes, or Alexandros Megas conquered Bactria, Napolean fought the Peninsular war, and all of the little wars in the 20th century.
Your ball and you had better impress the hell out of me.
Good point. Why is it that the MSM is so happy to criticize the White House plan to protect us from terrorists, but the loony left, such as actus, is not held to a similar standard. Bush has a plan to keep us safe. You may not like it, actus, but you don’t have a plan. Once you come up with one, then we can talk. Until then, zip it.
Oh how effin simple.
My plan is to bring liberalism and feminism to the muslim world. Till then, everytime you give them democracy they’ll just elect another theocrat.
Yep, another elitist pompous prick. And an armchair general to boot.
You done jumped the shark, actus. And probably not for the first time.
My plan is to bring liberalism and feminism to the muslim world. Till then, everytime you give them democracy they’ll just elect another theocrat.
How delicious. Imposing liberalism and feminism by extortion, perhaps?
I’m about to enter the rapture, I positively am, as my opponents are so delightfully inept only G-d himself could have planned this.
TW: That’s it, btw. Theocrats oppose liberalism and its orthodoxy (abortion, destruction of the nuclear family [and extended family] by contempt for its institutions and the welfare state, among many others). Democracy empowers theocrats. It will in Iraq (so they tell us) as it may do all over the Middle East, as its done in America. That’s all you need to know to get the Republican = theocrat meme: both are against liberalism, both succeed against it in democracy.
How utterly pathetic.
actus you refuse to acknowledge B Moe’s Two Fundamental Truth’s of Interpersonal Relations:
1) You can’t have a unilateral negotiation.
2) You can have a unilateral ass-whipping.
In other words your plan sucks.
Where is this “presto-chango” magic wand of liberalism and feminism, actus? Most of us here have never heard of it before.
Why not use the Bush plan?
The rapture would be the best thing: all the ‘saved’ people would leave. And those who didn’t, we can tell them to stop trying to be so saved.
Oh you want an easy answer? Sorry.
Most of us would be happy with any kind of answer from you actus, but I am not holding my breath. Precocious sophmoric snark seems to be the best you can muster.
In general there are mays ways to promote enlightenment values such as liberalism and feminism. PR, education, outreach, funding of groups, philanthropy, exchange programs, educational curricula, etc… Almost too many to list. We set a quota for female representatives in iraq, for example. That’s a movement in this direction.
So we should… what? Buy some ads in the Iranian media? Women get lynched for resisting rape over there, you think the answer to this is community fucking outreach clinics? I have an idea, how about you volunteer to be a visiting scholar, let me know how the mullahs version of orientation works.
Women’s clinics are were raped women turn to in this country.
But I do agree that some force will be necessary. We civilized the south and stopped their lynchings. We can do it elsewhere.
Like I said, there’s lots of ways to do it. Asylum laws work too. Not every wrong is going to be corrected by a comment on a blog.
I am starting a campaign to bombard Tehran with bumperstickers:
You Can’t Hug a Mullah With Nuclear Arms
Meanwhile actus reminds us why the left will stick to bashing Bush rather than promoting their own agenda.