Some folks won’t like this Peggy Noonan piece much. But for me, it struck a nerve.
Of course, had today been a Friday, maybe I’d feel a bit differently. Being naked in a tub of Guinness wouldn’t hurt things, either.
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Me too, JG.
Every time I talk to a committed “progressive” or watch the news, I feel dread. In the existential sense.
Although I will say that I’ve been talking a bit recently with a couple people on the “left” who’ve given me a glimmer of hope.
Hmmm.
Personally I blame the BabyBoomers. Those self-righteous smug bastards.
On the other hand, can we all take a moment out? Can we all sit down together, take a deep breath and think really naughty thoughts?
…
Seriously though I think the main issue is relativism. If everything is relative, and there are no real moral and ethical absolutes, then you’re going to into a situation like this.
Imagine a parking lot with lines drawn. People know where to drive and where to park. People still have a choice on whether or not to obey those rules or to break them, but they’re still there the next day.
Now imagine the same parking lot with the lines removed. No indication of where to park or where to drive. No rules because everything is relative. All things are allowed because everyone defines their individuality by shaping their own particular personal “space”. No rules to break, and yet also no rules to follow. Nothing now, and therefore nothing tomorrow.
And I personally think this rather strident push for moral and ethical relativism has brought us to this situation. Point: The 1918 Spanish Flu was recently resurrected, it’s genome decoded and the resulting data was published openly for any schmoe to use. In an culture with specific moral and ethical guidelines, such as “don’t do stupid shit”, such an act wouldn’t be imaginable. But in a culture of relativism, where anything goes as long as you can muck up a justification, such a thing is commonplace.
Then again I could be full of it so YMMV.
I hated it.
Noonan has a real gift for florid melancholy and I for one don’t need my natural instinct (especially during the fall) for melancholy encouraged.
Besides, every generation, feels like the “wheels are coming off” in some sense. Peggy should take a cue from her old boss, Ronald Reagan, and try a little friggin’ optimism for crying out loud.
I mean, shit wasn’t looking so great back in 1979 when Reagan was declaring that our best days were ahead, now was it?
I flippin’ channels last night and stopped on C-Span for a bit. Some Rep(D) from FL, Debbie Wasserman-Dipshit or something, was outraged, I mean OUTRAGED! that 2 days after Wilma hit FEMA had not brought her sterilized water to wash her two year old in.
Then I wake up this morning and see that people are considering whether Wilson’s civilfuckinrights have been violated, and, well yeah, I guess you could say I agree with Noonan.
Fred – ‘I hated it. ‘
Me too – whining about how bad things are isn’t really the way to fix them.
I don’t think she was whining. She was meditating on the current state of affairs. And while I feel, often, like she does, I do my part every day to try to make a difference. I suspect Ms Noonan does as well.
But it gets difficult at times. Especially when you don’t have a tub of Guinness at your disposal.
YMMV, of course.
I agree, Jeff. This existential fear, that all of America’s innumerable problems will coalesce into one huge, overarching problem was put forth in the 1997 book The Fourth Turning (Strass & Howe). The main thesis was based on cyclical vs linear history, and I thought at the time it was a fairly nutty exposition. The conclusion predicted a crisis catalyst in 2005 (perhaps a few years before or after). Doesn’t seem quite so nutty now.
Well, on the bright side, once we get our anarchic state of nature back, nobody will drive SUVs, the rainforests will rebound, law schools can execute caucacians on sight, and men can go back to flogging women and homosexuals with impunity. All with the blessing of our friendly Islamic warlord.
I’m with Fred. I defy you to find a period in human history where people weren’t saying the same stuff. More or less.
Those damn kids have always been a disaster waiting to happen. Armageddon is always just around the corner. Things are worse then they used to be. Blah blah blah.
The doomsayers are almost always wrong. And even when they’re right, life goes on. And gets better.
IT’S MORNING IN AMERICA YOU FRIGGIN’ INGRATES!
Jay-zus.
I’m gonna pull my copy of PJ O’Rourke off the shelf tonight and re-read his opening chapter of All The Trouble in the World as an antidote to this crap.
Friggin’ Noonan. Get that woman a vibrator or some damn thing. Honestly.
Well, I’ve been watching Peggy circling this drain for a while and I’ve decided she needs some loving and to fall asleep in my big strong arms. She’s a little long in the tooth for me, but I like her and I can see she’s afraid. I hate it when nice-lookinh women are afraid.
Kids have a sense of doom now? How come when I was young -in the late 70’s and early 80’s – I had reoccurring nightmares about the impending nuclear holocaust? Where were MY FRICKEN earrings? Really, that is the saddest explanation for spoiling children I’ve ever heard.
Give me my smelling salts, I’m having the vapors.
If you want and sit and listen to Aunt Pitty-Pat decry the lack of perfection in the most successful, wealthy and free nation in the history of the planet, end it all now. She has a serious Daddy complex that she projects on the Prez and the Feds in general.
I’m not saying that we won’t get our hair mussed, but last time I checked, life is hard, then you die. Get over yourselves.
This hysterical piddle-paddle is typical “woe is me” spoiled rotten myopic hooey one expects from a baby-boomer elite.
I tell ya, if you want to have a really big pitty party over nothing, start listening to Art Bell and his minions blather on and on about how the quickening is about to take us all over…. run, don’t walk to your fall out shelter.
On the otherhand, the Yellowstone Caldera is over-do to blow, which will likely wipe out 90% of humans in North America. Wow, now I’m pissing my pants too.
I don’t think it’s automatic, Byrd, as you seem to be implying. Things have gotten better only when enough people work for them to be so, and only when there aren’t too many people “on their side” trying to bring them down.
“I got mine, you get yours,” resonates. And it sucks, because I see it everywhere too. It’s the little things, too—like, just the basic politeness of our culture. We’re not all in this together like we might have been 30, 50 years ago. We’re red staters or blue staters. Black, white. We can’t find common ground because we’re not respecting each other as individuals, but as members of groups, each with a varying degree of credibility and priority.
This nation is too big for Washington to solve all its problems, but as power has consolidated more and more there over the years, that’s the only place anyone spends any effort on, in trying to change things. But it’s like an ever-increasing black hole, getting more and more massive, with more and more inertia, such that to affect any change, it requires the mass, full-time effort and lobbying that saps resources from our productivity that would be better spent improving our world.
It’s a problem. And the whole thing might have to come crashing down before we can fix it.
All that knowing that there are wolves at the door. If a collapse happens, it isn’t just that it won’t be easy to rebuild—it could be really damn hard.
Noonan seems to be verbally standing astride history with a sign saying “The End Is Near”. If so she’s not the first and won’t be the last. But is she right? Certainly. The world is in constant flux and nothing lasts forever.
There’s no need for the pessimism, though, unless you see change as a bad thing. Are we better off than we were 100 years ago? 50 years? 20 years? I think the answer is clearly “yes”. And will things be better than they are now, 20 years hence? I have every reason to think so. Advances in medicine, engineering, computing, manufacturing, entertainment, agriculture, and every other field happen almost weekly now. Children born today have an actuarial life expectancy of over 150 years! [That is: insurance companies have already built in their expectations for improvements in longevity into the new policies they write]
Not to say there aren’t some tough issues facing the world, but most aren’t new issues and we have a whole host of innovative remedies for them, with more every day. We’ll have to deal with the collapse of Social Security at some point. The failure of certain social programs. Future wars and stock market reversals and flu epidemics and the like. But we’re human and we innovate and we bounce back stronger—especially those of us in the West, it seems.
So Peggy can fret about the enormous pressures a US president has to face today, but I’d say FDR had it worse: Hitler on one side and Tojo on the other. By 1946 we’d lost 400,000 men and millions more wounded, yet we were a stronger nation just a couple years later than at any point previous. No, I see no reason to panic now. Things are just getting good.
Here’s what Noonan thought of the big, strong, safe, fatherly Reagan Presidency back then:
Though OTOH, Noonan had an eerily accurate premonition of 9/11, back in the middle of Clinton’s second term. Click and scroll up.
Good piece. She stops short in two places, though:
First, a lot of the problems she bemoans only became problems because we abandoned traditional ethics, standards, and ways of doing things. Those old ways are not irreparably lost; they are waiting in the wings should we choose to re-enlist them, as I suspect we will.
Second, while many venerable institutions have indeed become rotten to their cores, new ones are arising to take their place, such as this blog and its ‘sphere. That brings me to a timely, concrete example: Harriet Miers. Noonan complains that the courts have gone off track— well, this blogger and his commenters have not made a separate peace, and are doing their part to put the courts back on track.
OTOH, I’ll admit that I feel like I’m whistling past the graveyard with the above. There really is an overall Yeatsian feeling about things, and I feel impelled to go dig out my copies of Musil.
I’m glad the comments here have gone the way they have. I get so irritated when people talk in vague terms about “this awful mess we’re in”. Awful mess? Things look pretty damn good to me. Perfect? No, but when has life ever been perfect? For anyone? Ever? In fact, I tend to regard the whole doom-and-gloom thing as a symptom of the fact that things are TOO good.
“There no such thing as homeland security?” Yeah, that would explain all those post-9/11 terrorist attacks. I’m sure a good number of the things she mentions in that column (without any supporting evidence, or even arguments) are easily refutable. (I’m far too much of a slacker to actually refute them myself, but I’m pretty sure.)
“Our media institutions are imploding?” Good. They suck anyway.
“The Presidency is overwhelmed?” Well, gee, you think that might have anything to do with the fact that the government is being expected to deal with stuff that has no basis whatsoever in the constitution?
Kids are being bought stuff because their parents want them to have good memories? What kind of horseshit is that? Kids are being bought stuff because their parents want them to think they’re cool. Because saying “no” is too much like being The Man.
Jesus Christ! Get a fucking grip, suck it up and face the damn future. The world isn’t gonna stop spinning because the President’s in box is full.
TW: Period. Yuh-huh.
While I tend to like Peggy’s articles over there on OpinionJournal, the one thing that struck me about this piece when I read it earlier today was that it seems to think that we, as Americans, need to rely heavily on the elites to guide us out of the muck and mire. I wonder how true that really is. Isn’t the fact that “regular folks” (and not Columbia School of Journalism types) create these blogs to inform, inspire and challenge show that maybe we have moved beyond seeking the elites to do so much for us? That maybe, just maybe, we as citizens are taking a little bit more of the destiny of our country and our individual’s thoughts into our own hands? Admittedly it’s just one example, but I like to think it’s an important one.
Well, I am sorry to hear that PN’s is in such a spiritual funk, because I really like her. And guess what? It IS all going to Hell in a handbasket. But I agree with Fred, et al, that that is no reason to get all bummed out. Because its always been going to Hell in a handbasket. This may be deplorable, but to anyone with even a passing familiarity with world history, Shakespeare, and/or the 3rd chapter of Genesis, it should not be surprising.
We all need to make our separate peace, while it may yet be found, and encourage those around us to do likewise.
I’m sorry but I’m firmly in the “oh jeebus Peggy, would you please relax and have another drink?” camp.
As many have pointed out in this thread, this country and the planet in general are always a step away from complete annihilation from either our own or from natural forces. MAD, Asteroids, Bird-flu, terrorists, economic disintegration, most of these things have been around since the dawn of man. I’m sure the presidency during WWII was a piece of cake.
And where are we now? We are at a point in time where the US is the sole super power remaining, life expectancy is higher than ever before, median income higher than ever, disease less capable of becoming a full fledged pandemic thanks to huge steps forward in healthcare, etc.etc.
I’m sick of everyone telling me what a disaster things are going to be for me once they retire.
Offer me a suggestion as to what one single thing needs to be done to reverse this course, and I’ll listen.
As a matter of PRINCIPLE I ignore any future speculation uttered from the mouth of Saint Chappaquidick.
I’ve been saying for years that America’s elites are failing the people. That’s a subtext of Noonan’s piece, I think.
Every society has a leadership class – the elites. Elites justify their elitehood by leading the society to the betterment of all. When they don’t, they are replaced or they run the place into the ground. Remember the Bourbons?
The genius of American and Anglospherian democracy is that we have bloodless ways of replacing our elites. In government, we vote’m out. In the media (a relatively new thing), we stop buying what they have to offer and spend our info dollars somewhere else (bandwidth?) For the plutocracy, inheritence taxes used to work fine – that’s why I support them.
Now we need a way to purge academia since they seem to be the last bastion of unproductive elitism.
It’s always darkest before the dawn.
I heard some apocalyptic jazz on the radio last night (no, not Sun Ra) from <a href=”http://www.ancientmanuscripts.com/frameset.htm” target=”_blank”>this cat</a> who was selling the idea that some sundry ancient texts portend the return of a large planet with an extremely eccentric orbit. The effect upon the earth of its return would be, y’know, apocalyptic. This huckster’s seductively sober exposition lacked only the poetry of Ms. Noonan’s meditations.
Jeff, I figure you’ve probably read RAW’s Prometheus Rising. He presages Kurzweil’s (and others’) singularity with the “Jumping Jesus Phenomenon†therein. Basically the idea is that the growth of aggregate human knowledge is logarithmic. I submit that more people know more now than ever before. I further submit that in spite of manifold ‘bad knowledge’, overall, knowledge is civilizing.
As aggregate human knowledge grows, it seems to me not at all surprising that our exposure to the unknown and therefore conflict actually increases. I believe it was Wilson (RA, not Joe) what made mention somewhere of Aleister Crowley’s â€ÂThe Soldier and the Hunchback†which seems apropos.
TW: lost
Agree, Jeff. That existential dread has been in place for me for a while.
And while I agree with Whitehall on the subtext of her speech, I think she hinted at why there is that dread. While many means are opening up for replacing things we don’t like, politics and court decisions have been closing ranks and not allowing political institutions to change. At least for the better (in my skewed view of the world, I’m sure)–Court decisions like Kelo, Bolinger, and Raich (for starters), the rigged system for incumbants, etc.
Another subtext might be the lack of meaning in many of the lives she talks to. Politics has replaced religion for many, but what meaning does it give? Eh, my 2 cents, and you get change.
Some of you are missing Noonan’s point. Certainly, there’s nothing novel about the notion that “everything’s going to a hell”—that’s perennial. What matters is people’s response to that perennial feeling. Is it: “We’ll just fight the good fight as best we can as long as we can”? Or is it simply: “screw it”?
‘Screw your courage to the sticking post.’
Although I’ll gladly join you for a beer, I’m definitely with the suck it up crowd. A little perspective is in order.
At my age–54–I’m old enough to realize that the quality of life fluctuates wildly: like a fireman’s job, it’s composed of periods of relative quiet punctuated by sudden moments of absolute insanity and, sometimes, terror.
For example, it was very nippy back there in the 60s and 70s. I was there when life went from Leslie Gore to Frank Zappa almost overnight. I went to university in the early 70s and could barely attend a class without it being shut down by some kooks bursting in yelling, “On strike! Shut it down!”
During the Viet Nam war and for years afterward, you couldn’t discuss politics with anyone without risking a fight. Sometime in the 80s, ABC started showing the American flag in its ads, and I knew the tide had turned. Life finally calmed down. There are fashions in thought.
We should declare ourselves fortunate to have had a couple of decades of relative quiet with no more the think about than our own silly little concerns and fads (disco, jogging, grunge clothing, the market boom, big hair, chai, SUVs, flip-flops, etc.)
Life is a large, dramatic canvas on which–in addition to sublime scenes of ecstasy and repose–are painted major cataclysms and recurring matters of life and death. There is an ebb and a flow to it.
Right now, we’re having to deal with many things: the lingering myths of failed and bitter Marxism, the rise of the Information Age and its attendant issues such as loss of privacy and increasing dehumanization, genetics and its effects on bioethics, the cumulative influence of 50 years of television brainwashing, the deadly spiritual weakness of postmodern relativism, the serious financial corruption and decadence of our government, the effects of a negative media on peoples’ desire to enter public service and armed forces, the growing menace of Islamic terror, and the fact that the larger part of the US population is now composed of aging, self-indulgent, baby boomers who’ve benefited from the sacrifices of the Greatest Generation without having had to make sacrifices of their own… I could go on.
What’s happening to us now is no more than what’s happened to millions of people before us. These are the kind of roiling, fascinating times we always read about in history books. Only, it’s happening to us. And we can’t turn our backs. These are the times that show humanity at its worst–and at its best.
I thought it was interesting, but I’d have to agree with Fred et al: don’t see where things are any worse now than in the past. It’s natural to worry about the state of the world – and we should. But her attitude is too defeatist for me. I’d rather confront the problems we know are coming up (again, having qualified people on Supreme Court is a significant part of that) as opposed giving up and let things play out.
Kuz wrote:
Good point. Anyone else read the fantastically snobby piece in Esquire (recent issue, it had Jessica Biel on the cover as the world’s sexiest woman….yeah.) from Charles Pierce about how the U.S. no longer values elitism? Well, he said that we no longer valued intelligence but the gist of the article is that people no longer just accepted what their betters told them to think, do, say, etc. His examples for this? ID, the war in Iraq, the fact that we elected Bush, etc. It was predictable nonsense, but reading Peggy’s piece I couldn’t help remembering it and wondering the same thing: is part of that attitude just a backlash from those elites who are accustomed to being in charge and don’t like the idea of the rabble thinking for themselves?
quiggs,
Is it: “We’ll just fight the good fight as best we can as long as we can� Or is it simply: “screw it�
The answer is of course both. That’s exactly the point. Some will say the hell with it, others will fight the good fight. And in the end nothing will be any different than it has been before.
This reminds me of a wedding I went to in the mid 90’s where I had a conversation with a WWII vet who served in D-Day. I went on and on about how lucky we were to have guys like him around at the time to strap it on and fight the good fight when it needed to be fought. He looked at me very solemnly and stated -“trust me son, were the stakes the same for your generation, you guys would have done exactly what we did.”
I talk to friends of mine who are re-enlisting to go back to Iraq and I see what he means.
But by all means, go ahead and invest in that bomb shelter…
BLT, I think your throughts are well considered about Roosevelt having it harder than Bush in terms of the external enemies he faced, but I think that the internal threat that Bush has faced pushes the weight of difficulty towards him.
Here is just a little personal narrative—I live in San Francisco, and after September 11th, other than a smattering of Leftist moonbats, people generally stood by their countrymen during that time. I falsely concluded during that time that when the rubber met the road, Leftist arguments would be marginalized under raw scrutiny.
The honeymoon was short, and it started with Afghanistan. Once military action was taken, the Left began their resurgence by sniping at each and every action the United States took to combat terrorism. They did so quietly at first, but waxed lyrical as time progressed. They were stoking the fires, and then we confronted Iraq and all hell broke loose. In a few short years, the Left has managed to convince almost 50% of the people in this country, through a constant and relentless barrage of negativism, that the United States is really blowing it.
Each time period in history brings its challenges, however, I don’t think America has been this publically divided since the Civil War. NO ONE from the Left is going to lift a finger in this fight, and many have resorted to outright opposition. If and when we get attacked again, you know where the finger pointing is going to be aimed.
I considered myself a fairly liberal guy until I watched the Left and the moderate liberals turn against what I so dearly value. The Right hasn’t been perfect (no one ever is, but this is the obligatory qualifier), but I sure as hell agree with Jeff in that I feel like the cooks on the Right are far easier to managed than the completely insane fanatics on the Left.
I just hope we can get a few people to jump ship and get 60 – 65% into the anti-anti-American range sooner rather than later…
Couldn’t track back for some reason, but Noonan’s column sounded awfully familiar.
Tman —
Agreed—each person chooses one or the other; and what matters in the long run is the choice made by the majority (or perhaps the consequential minority) of our fellow countrymen. What disturbed me about the article was that it forced me to look honestly into myself and then to discover signs of creeping screw-it-ism.
I felt more worried in the 90’s, when things were too good. A kid could graduate from college, get hired to a well-paying job, take two years to travel Europe and come back with the job waiting. You could quit your job every 6 months and still find another.
That’s when I felt the wheels coming off the trolley. Remember Woodstock 2 when the kids rioted because the bottled water was too expensive? Or how cars were burned by mobs whenever a pro or NCAA team made it anywhere near the finals? You could just feel it in the air- we can’t handle life without conflict. We’ll create it if we have to.
The only thing I really fear is the helplessness I feel the 90’s brought on us- the feeling in our society that we should be able to control everything (we can’t). The feeling that someone is at fault if we are inconvenienced or unhappy. And the validation of those feelings by media and politicians too afraid to tell people the hard truth.
Waiting in line 12 hours after a hurricane hits because you didn’t bother to get yourself water, and complaining that the government isn’t helping you. Blaming the Port Authority 68% for the 93 World Trade Center Bombings (the terrorists got 32% of the blame) because they didnt’- I don’t know- barricade the parking lot. Being in Mexico and complaining that the US government isn’t coming to your rescue (hello? you left the US government in the US). There isn’t anyone that can guarantee you won’t have any problems.
I don’t think the wheels we’ll come off if we just engage in another cliche’– tough love. We aren’t built for everything to always be ok, we are built to find solutions when there are problems. We are built for challenges, but we have to take them on and not let them overwhelm us.
I’m sure life was much harder during the Industrial Revolution or the Dust Bowl or even long winters on the prarie, yet we perservered.
BLT in CO;
Conspicuously absent from your list of things that are getting better are law and government, possibly the two most important. And I’ll agree with your implied conclusion: they’re getting worse, quickly.
TW: stop, as in Buckley’s phrase.
A Separate Peace blows.
Your judgment is suspect.
Now that I have had a chance to really read it, I do find fault with this:
Because she is still assuming that it was government made us great and only government can save. I think it was the magnificent lack of government we had for so many years that lead to our unparalled success. And the elites I worry about are the entrepenours and achievers that the rabble has set their sites on. I just don’t see how this country can survive if we keep shifting our goals to rewarding dependancy and punishing success.
I would say we are transitioning from apathy to depency now. I hope we can prove him wrong, but whistling Don’t Worry, Be Happy probably won’t be enough.
Damn, Jeff, I normally find Peggy a bit gushy and sentimental (and kinda hot–I can’t help it), but this article gave me that sinking feeling one gets when one realizes he might be onto something in his own darkest thoughts. My wife and I have been talking a lot about the moral decline of our world, and whether it’s even right to bring children into it. And I don’t mean a decline in traditional morality, but really a decline in depth, an embrace of the mediocre and the frivolous, and a resignation that little if any good ought to be expected from the human endeavor.
Honestly, I don’t know if the world is falling apart, and I frankly get the sense that good people throughout time have felt this same anxiety . In thinking about this, I’ve also wondered why I’m libertarian, giving that I generally don’t think most people are worthy of the rights and freedoms they now ignore. What I figure, though, is that it doesn’t matter that people are good, but merely that they’re good enough. That is to say, I think people are generally good enough to take care of themselves, and in so doing contribute meaningfully to the overall good and progress of humanity. Our greatest failures come from trusting one another to govern one another.
Either that, or I’m moving to a militia commune in Montana. Do you think there’s a market for contermporary architecture in one?
The wheels are coming off?
Hurray, I was wondering when those flying cars would show up.
To quote Grandma Simpson: “I hate John Knowles.”
I hate to disagree but I think the Vietnam era created a more divided America. It was divided by the Pro War – Anti War crowd, by youth against maturity, by poverty against affluence and by Conservatives against Liberals. There were so many divisions then that one was afraid to even be anything.
Noonan is wrong. She is encapsulated in that “bubble” that surrounds the elites, of which she is one. The only thing she knows about what this country thinks is what she can get from polls. The only people that are really concerned about the politics are the political junkies like us. The rest of the country goes to work, watches TV (not the news) and goes to bed and gets up and goes to work again. That malaise she is sensing is coming from those that have an investment in perpetrating it.
Everybody is working for their own self interest, whether they want to admit it or not; whether they are liberal or conservative. They will continue to do so with the energy and will that they have always had. It’s that simple – no one is going down with the ship.
BECAUSE OF THE ROSE-COLORED GLASSES!!
eDog-
You have the kids, and you raise them to be exceptional people. That’s what I’m doing.
And we will save the world one spawn at a time.
rls:
Vietnam didn’t threaten our very existence, but just as with the Civil War, the stakes now are a whole lot higher. The divisions are very clear, and mostly entrenched, now.
It IS all going to Hell in a handbasket. But I agree with Fred, et al, that that is no reason to get all bummed out. Because its always been going to Hell in a handbasket.
So, basically, the human dialect is little more than an asymptote with regard to Hell: always approaching it, but never arriving. Damn, that’s even more depressing–we can’t even reach that goal!
But it gets difficult at times. Especially when you don’t have a tub of Guinness at your disposal.
Jeff, have you ever thought of homebrewing? I’ve got 5 gallons of 30 proof honey mead waiting for me at home.
You have the kids, and you raise them to be exceptional people. That’s what I’m doing.
And we will save the world one spawn at a time.
And besides, someone will need to make good kids who can pay the taxes to support all the bad kids. My family does have a grand tradition of tax evasion, one we pass down like the secrets to an ancient craft. In fact, for tax purposes, I already have several children. Sure they’re all undocumented day-laborers, but they’re loveable scamps nonetheless.
I liked this song better when Billy Joel sang it.
Peggy needs a vacation, and if you agree with her, then you do, too.
I used to feel this way, back in ‘04 when I was reading blogs for hours each day. The ‘sphere is, in many ways, a wonderful thing, but it also gets to sounding like a million fingernails on a million chalkboards after a while. It’s Allah’s “I’m outraged!” thing: every day, everybody’s screaming back and forth at each other about [WHATEVER IT IS WE’RE SCREAMING ABOUT TODAY]. It was funny reading that Weekly Standard article on the Plamegate background, remembering how FURIOUS I was about the whole “16 words,” thing. In two years, who’s gonna remember Cindy Sheehan? Terry Schiavo?
Of course, I’m not a blogger. If you are, I guess you gotta keep doing it, but keep in mind that it’s making you crazy—that the longer you do it, the further away from reality your perception of the state of things drifts.
The danger is that the blogger-effect is presumably even worse for the people who are actually running the country. That’s why I like Bush. He takes long vacations.
Having said all that, I still think some asshole’s going to wipe my hometown off the face of the earth one of these days, and every time the train rolls out of Penn, I wonder if it’s my last ride. Whaddya gonna do?
This is crap. There was no “Alexander Tyler” and Alexander Tytler, the 18-19th century professor and jurist, never wrote such a book or made such a statement. This quote is an internet-urban legend.
Besides, the sentiment behind it is your typical Left-liberal clatrap. It’s selfishness that will undo us all!!!!
Which means, of course, that we absolutely must elect a fucking Democrat to the presidency, so the government can increase taxes on the eeeeevil rich, because, after all, a high-tax, socialist nannystate is the Left’s idea of being generous.
Nothing spells “generous” to a Leftist like taxing other people and spending their money.
Look, what brought down ancient Greece, and Rome, and half a dozen other ancient civilizations was socialism—a command economy designed to favor the ruling class’s political supporters at the expense of everyone else. Government-sponsored monopolies, special privileges, and (the real biggie) debasement and devaluation of the currency.
These things cause economic stagnation decline. They weaken the economic foundation of civilization itself. Then, when some “crisis” comes along (which they inevitably do, like Gothic invasions, or whatever), the economy is in no position to respond. It’s atrophied. It’s lost all flexibility. That’s what a government that “manages” its economy will do for you.
If the “wheels are coming off,” it’s because the people in charge still haven’t accepted these basic economic truths (or they just don’t care, take your pick).
Hey, maybe the president shouldn’t be expected to solve every trifling problem someone in Big Media finds the self-righteousness to scream about on any given day. Maybe that would help keep the inbox down a bit.
I worry about apocolyptic events that I fear are probable in my life time due to terrorism. On the other hand, this isn’t exactly Rome circa 1 AD either. I have to laugh when folks imagine that the world is going to Hell in a handbasket. Oh, we may get there, but it will be a short, sharp shock that puts us there, not a day-by-day, or year-by-year decline.
Meanwhile, each generation continues to live longer than the last with greater prosperity and ever expanding avenues of discovery in front of us. I’ll be 46 next week. My children would not recognize the world I was born into. Vietnam was just getting started. Not to mention Detroit, Watts, Watergate, AIDS, Ebola, the oil crisis, the Munich Olympics, the Iran hostage crisis, Chernobyl, Three Mile Island, the Sandinistas, Violetta Chamorro, Ferdinand Marcos, Benigno Aquino, the Red Brigades, the Weathermen, the Baader-Meinhof Gang, the Symbionese Liberation Army, the stock market crash in 1987, the dot com bubble in the ‘90s, the collapse of the Soviet Union (if you told anyone that would happen in 1960, how do you think they might have guessed it would ultimately happen—anyone want to say with a whimper?), Aum Shinrikyo, the Oklahoma City bombing, Charles Manson, John Wayne Gacy, Jeffrey Dahmer, the loss of two Space Shuttles, Mount St. Helens, Pinatubo, countless earthquakes, hurricanes, tornados, and tsunamis—oh my! And, finally, um, well, 9/11.
As Tom Robbins had the Chink say in Even Cowgirls Get the Blues, “The world situation remains desperate, as usual.” Is your glass half full, half empty, or is it impossible to discern because of a hormonal imblance?
Turing word: training, as in wheels.
Well, there aren’t enough good people, so get busy and bring ‘em on!
Turing = head, as in Boy–I say, boy, you’re doing it all wrong!
Dang, DTLV beat me to the Billy Joel thing. Shows what I get for being late to the party. I will go a bit further back, though. In West Side Story, Doc yells to the Jets: “You make this world lousy”, to which Action replies: “Hey, it was that way when we found it, Doc”.
I suppose we need a good cathartic gloom fest every now and then, but after that, you gotta decide: Are you in or out? Noonan thinks some elites are out. Out for themselves, out of line, but not out of character. I say f’ em. I’ll be at work tomorrow morning, cutting the guys their pay checks for the week. They earned it, and I have it to give them. Oh, and there will be Christmas bonusses this year, as always.
(I know, in the dang movie he says it different, so shoot me)
Damn, it came from a usually reliable source, my apologies if it is bogus.
Depends on your definition of selfishness, I guess. I consider it extremely selfish, and greedy for that matter, to think you have a right to goods and services you havn’t earned. So the selfish and greedy I reference are the eeeeevil left.
Appropriately, I’m finally getting around to reading Tuesday’s New York Post. And on the opinion page we have George Will eulogizing Alan Greenspan by noting that things are so good now most people can’t even recall that 30 years ago most elites thought democracies were ungovernable.
I haven’t had the time to totally think this through, you know work and kids and shit, but sometimes I worry that 50 years from now my children and grandchildren will live in a country that is filled with lazy, amoral, godforsaken wretches who are only able to hold off the rest of the world by threatening them with their superior set of nukes. Kinda like some of the ancients used to hide behind their city walls while a more ambitious, energetic and ruthless tribe besieged them.
But I’m relatively optomistic about where we’re heading in my lifetime.
I was taught in school that nations are founded, grow, and then recede and that this was the way of history. But I am not ready to jump ship. I think what we have here is a lack of leadership. We have been straddled with a nit wit surrounded by persons who are obsessed with greed and avarice and only think in terms of indulgence. It happens.
I personally believe that the United States was founded on priciples that transcendent. Never before in our history has any nation been founded with these ideals. That we may have lost them, or misplaced them, is something that can be corrected.
Don’t worry, Peggy, we’ll be ok in spite of your doom and gloom.
(sheesh, and I thought they were supposed to be the one’s with the “morning in America routine” phony SOB”s)
I’m too young to really put together an opinion on the state of the world as I’m still pulling it together, but I’d put money on “we’ll stick it out.”
In the off chance that we don’t, well… I’ll buy a shotgun, head to Texas, and throw my lot in with the Imperials at the Rottweiler if they’d take a pudgy nerd in their inevitable militia of those who still care should the government fall through.
Helps to plan for either way.
CHICKENPESSIMISTIC!
There have been some profound and elegantly expressed sentiments in this thread, and I’m glad to see it (of course there were a few snarky ones, as well, but that’s pretty normal).
The thing that I kept pondering over while reading the Noonan piece, and the subsequent comments here is that whereas in the past, most conflict was met with the brand of resolve and determination that led to the establishment of this Republic, the circumstance now is such that far too many people have found ways to glean short-term personal benefit from the conflict itself. Examples would include the millions that have been made by the race-baiters or the time Cindy Sheehan has spent basking in the MSM’s spotlight.
The “I’ve got mine” syndrome, far from just hindering the correction of the problem, has become integrally a part of the problem, as “getting mine” now includes making sure the problem endures.
Furthermore, the sentiment echoed by Noonan emerges in one of two ways. The first is fairly benign: the feeling that nothing can be done, and that the forcast is hopelessly bleak. The second is dangerous: since nobody else seems to care that everything is falling apart, I’ll do what needs to be done myself. That sentiment fosters drastic and often violent action (or, more accurately, reaction).
Similarly, there are two directions things may progress. Either there will be some major event that will truly expose the fallacies of the recent trends in political and social philosophy (what’s scary is that 9/11 wasn’t sufficient), or the current trend will continue until the people finally have had enough and decide to take back by whatever means necessary those freedoms they were swindled into surrendering to the once-benevolent state.
Either way, my American Optimism demands that I believe that things will eventually be better, whilst Realism insists that we’re in for a hard road to that end.
Ms. Noonan’s only problem is that she expects the government to ‘solve’ all these ‘problems’. 99% of what she is talking about is none of the government’s g-damn business.
You know–I think Peggy is right on the mark. For the last 6 months I have been saying we are screwed–no matter how you cut it, we are screwed. Muslims want to bring down Piglet because he’s made of pork, a city outlaws piggy banks for the same reason, the Christmas tree is now a giving tree or a friendship tree–people used to come to this country and strive to be American. They learned English, they participated, even in lil’ Saigon and Chinatown. We are so diversified–judeochristian principles used to bind us. Now English doesn’t even bind us. If Al Qaeda were to attack us on America’s shores, do you think you could count on your neighbor to pitch in and lend a hand? Where I live, my next door neighbor would probably be too concerned about breaking a nail but she would sure want to come over and be in my stuff–and now people are trying to make laws that don’t allow me to have a gun to protect myself and my family. All I know is that as long as I sit behind this keyboard and don’t run out in the middle of the street asking “what the #%$^**+@” is going on here–as long as we haven’t started a revolution–God forgive me but we haven’t a chance in hell. How interesting. The coded work I had to type match in order to send this post was the word, “end.” There are no coincidences.
Sorry Jeff, I have disagree with you on this one. This is the same woman who was whining about being “tired” and needing “a break from history” while I was climbing up a frickin’ landmined cliff along the Panjshir River. (I would be embarrassed to complain – too damn many WWII vets in my family) I piss on her woe-is-us-all, the-end-is-near gloom. From where I sit, things are hard in some respects, but a whole lot better in more. The two History degrees I earned make me cringe every time I find someone trying to imbue their own times with extra importance. Cowgirl up, dammit.
I wouldthink that Peggy is old enough to remember the 70’s. It’s been mentioned before how bad it was then, but if you didn’t live it you never could have imagined it. Complaining about high gas prices? Back then the gas situation got so bad you couldn’t even buy gas when you wanted to. Alternate days, stations out of fuel, long lines. The economy? Imagine every company around you going out of buisness. Inflation was out of control, and everyone with a PHD would tell you that capitalisim just doesn’t work. Ignore those crazy supply-siders. God forbid if they ever got in power. Good thing it won’t happen.
Back then our Military was left rusting. Morale was down, troops not in fighting condition, and every country with a gun seemed stronger than we were. Think the left is bad now? Back then they were spitting on troops and the nobody said anything.
Read any sci-fi book about the year 2000 writen in the seventies. Either the Soviets were winning, or we were living on a radioactive rock. Ask any kid if he was going to grow up someday and they’ll tell you that the odds are greater that they’ll be wiped out in WW3. Fear of bio-weapons is nothing compared to the absolute conviction that the bombs could be flying any minute to destroy the world.
Imagine if you were to take someone your age out of the year 1976 into our world. Show him a world where the Soviets have been defeated, where America is the only Hyper-power. Show him a world where even the poor have cellular phones, DVD players, computers and can buy gourmet foods for cheap prices (kids, visit Lileks for a view of what passed for food back then!). Take them to Times Square and Central Park at night without fear of getting mugged and killed. Show him or her an America where half the country is ready to fight and isn’t afraid to salute the flag. Show them a world of multi-media where every person in the country has access to a printing press. Show her that our only enemy at the time is a bunch of desert dwelling savages and then ask them if they agree with Peggy that it’s gone to hell.
I feel like an old man, but if you’re not feeling good about the future you haven’t been following the past hundred years.
All Peggy bashing aside, this has been one enlightening thread……..boy do some folks need to lighten up or what?
Cowgirl up indeed….
(on a side note, after posting my thoughts earlier today, I ran in to another friend of mine tonight who just returned last week from Iraq. The end of the world will have to go through the baddest assed motherfuckers this world has ever seen. On a bad day these men chew up armageddon like beef jerky. Which means, in the big picture, not likely anytime soon….so relax Peggy…….)
Lump me in with Major John on this one. Except replace “climbing up a frickin’ landmined cliff along the Panjshir River” with “sitting on my ass in an office in Nebraska”. Also, remove both history degrees. Thank you, Major.
I have to agree with Major John, for similar reasons, but with a slightly different focus…
Empasis is mine.
She’s taking Ted Kennedy seriously? As one of the “elite”? I recall a story of the car that wouldn’t float….does anyone else?
Folks, this one line alone told me Peggy needs to increase the anti-depressants.
I agree that there is an “existential dread” in the nation. Is this surprising? We are fighting a war, and watching our national leadership behave like spoiled children. The future is not bright and rosy, not at all. Any who thinks that is highly focused. As many of us were, pre-9/11. Reality sucks, but it’s what we have.
ahem earlier noted that he’s seen this before. So have I, being 48. I recall my father (a WWII veteran, BTW) stockpiling supplies in our basement turned into fall out shelter. I’ve watched river sicken from pollution.
In fact, I served in Germany at a time when the Soviet Army was poised to flood through the Fulda Gap….and my unit’s battle positions were just south of that, near Bayreuth. We figured we had less than a 50% chance of getting to our area of operations, let alone being able to accomplish our mission, between nuclear/chemical attacks from the Soviets, Spetnatz and partisan activity, refugees, and friendly fire.
Thank God the Soviet empire collapsed. That was one obstacle out of the way!
Peggy strikes me as being on the edge of despair. I can understand that. But there is hope. We have our soldiers, fighting on, in Iraq and Afghanistan. The rivers are coming back to life.
And the children—always the children.
Duty is man’s.
Consequences are God’s.
Pessimism is French.
The sky is falling! The sky is falling!
Aaaawwww, the liberals are finding out that the government and the wealthy aren’t there to run the ship – but that we all have to take care of ourselves. They’re either going to grow up, or whine themselves out of existence. Hopefully.
It’s real simple… instead of developing policies, Democrats are busy manufacturing FUD as fast as possible, and the MSM is their free distribution channel for this product. Nothing is more important to them than making sure that Bush’s Presidency fails – nothing, and yes that includes the safety and well-being of Americans too. That is why the Dems and the MSM are such despicable and dangerouse institutions.
Of course we Conservatives don’t help much by being so willing to compromise with them – liars don’t respect compromise, they just leverage it to tell better lies next time.
what? is she off her meds?
who fucking cares? this is worse than the aristocrats is funny.
guess what, we’re all doomed. we’re all going to die someday. society will crumble. oh no, whats next? giant ants from mars?
the people that “know better?” what?
statistics show that peggy noonan is completely off her rocker.
Many good points here.
I think what we’re also seeing here is information fatigue. In the past, we had three channels, each with a nightly half hour national news program, and one or two local newspapers. Now, we have the CNNs and MSNBCs (and yes, Fox too), plus two hours each of additional network morning national news (e.g. “Today”), plus “Nightline,” plus that douchebag Jon Stewart on Comedy freakin’ Central (what, you can’t show funny programs on a comedy channel?)… all bathing us in that peculiar all-knowing, too-wise-for-words, East Coast media elite malaise. I stopped watching these nabobs years ago, and it has helped both my mental health and blood pressure immensely.
I think the Internet and the democratizing effects of blogs come in for some blame, too. Yes, it’s great that people like Jeff have a broadcasting format and provide a forum for like-minded people, but now we also have people like Koz and Atrios – nutjobs who in the past would be limited to handing out poorly mimeographed tracts in coffeehouses in marginal parts of town. Now, their nonsense is broadcasted widely, so yes, it does seem like there’s more madness, because now we can hear the nuts.
So we’re all just damn tired of the constant assault. I recommend re-reading some Julian Simon, a good night’s sleep, and a close rationing of your media intake.
A lil’ nude Guiness bathing couldn’t hurt either, Ms. Noonan. May I suggest my help in that endeavor?
I agree with this. For some odd reason, some people love to preach doom just when things are actually starting to get good.
James Madison or Uncle Jimbo or somebody said that. I think. Even it it’s fake, I think it’s true – when things get too good, people who just enjoy complaining have to remind us how bad things are, even when they aren’t. Or something.
TW: anyone Can anyone tell me what I just said?
And another thing, Peggy, you are alarmed because a cocktail swilling Teddy Kennedy says “apres moi, les deluge”?!
When PN first came to public attention, way back when, I was enthralled. Now when I see her, she makes my skin crawl.
Of course I have thoughts like hers, and would probably have to be considered to be mentally ill if I didn’t. The difference between what drives her feelings of doom and my own though, are that I am always suspect of mine because they seem to become more dominant when I see a good possibility of the Left grabbing the reins.
This is NOT the country I grew up in, but only a farcical parody of America. We have become rude, self centered, and I suspect that most of the people where I live can only see the Earth they plant their feet on if it is shown on TV or
pictured in People Magazine or Vogue. It would never occur to them to look under their shoes.
For myself, I could care less, but I really worry that my son will become an adult without ever understanding the feeling of accomplishment or the righteousness of responsibility for his own actions. I try, Lord knows, but I feel insignificant when I see the power his school and the TV hold over him. Unfortunately, I don’t believe in beating others into submission, so I must be content with (hopefully) planting a seed. That’s how it worked for me, but I feel awfully lucky to have lived long enough for that seed to blossom.
Noonan is right up to a point, but our “world” only makes it more important that we try ever harder to pass on the essence of being a human being to our children. God help us that we have to contend with the likes of Schumer and Kennedy (and the MSM) telling our kids that government and socialism are the answer, and that by handing over their freedoms to the government, they will find Nirvana.
A pox on all their houses, and a heartfelt prayer for my son…
You’ll notice one predominant theme here: most of us feel powerful enough to have an effect on events. That’s one trait that separates us from the left: we’re not resigned.
tw: believe. Ya gotta.
Well said, Percy.
But I have to say that one of the few things that bothers me about the Internet, though, is the extent to which it takes its cues from TV. That’s one medium that has done far more harm than most people even imagine (and as Han Solo said, they can imagine quite a lot!).
The Teddy Kennedy bit does raise some questions. Does Teddy think the Great Collapse will come in spite of his efforts or because he’s actively working to bring it about?
I’ve had thoughts like PN on many occasions in my 41 years but then I’m also subject to crippling bouts of depression. In the early-mid 90s it seemed like every day a big company was laying off enough personnel to populate a small city. How long could that continue before it became apparent to those in power that a major chunk of humanity no longer served any useful purpose? How would the ‘problem’ be addressed?
Then the second half of the decade saw a boom period where it was difficult far any mildly intelligent person to lack a decent wage. (You had to really work at it like me.) But that boom was built on illusions and the ‘New Economy’ was just snake oil. The old rules still applied.
It doesn’t help that I live in a region where the cost of a roof over your head is going insane but people still want to move here. Meanwhile, my professional skill now barely qualify to stay above the poverty line and more advanced skill are being devalued faster than I can acquire them.
So yeah, it’s easy to get into a negative mood about the state of the world but hasn’t it always?