“Are U.S. taxpayers helping China to modernize its armed forces via interest payments owed on the national debt?”
Or is this just fearmongering bullshit, and besides, Christine O’Donnell wants to be bedded down by the Beast…?
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Recent Comments
- In The Mailbox: 02.28.23 (Afternoon Edition) : The Other McCain on Hey, longtime pw readers…
- In The Mailbox: 12.23.22 : The Other McCain on Patrick J. Carroll truly IS a sad, embittered psychopath
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that’s one way to put it.
“Passing the torch” might be another.
Ah, bad green note money.
But that’s just looney. GOLDBUG!
mr.g gordon liddy uses tweezers now to hold the little dollar bill
They had better beef up their military, because when they send the Repo Man to repossess a whole country, the pillow case full of unopened Mt. Dew cans won’t do the job.
Either by direct technology transfers, or indirectly through treasury bond interest payments, we’ve been doing it for at least 15 years.
Can’t we leave Bill Clinton out of this?
o_O
Wouldn’t there be plenty of good reasons, that is, more fundamental reasons — even more prudential reasons — to keep US debt at far lower levels than stunning heights to which they’ve currently risen? These would seem to be so quite apart from any ancillary help debt payments to China might make.
Moreover, if nations generate wealth through trade, then any trade conducted with China (or any other competitor nations) would tend to generate wealth for China or other competitors, as well as simultaneously generating wealth for the US or whatever trading partner the Chinese or others may have; therefore would contribute both to China’s needs and abilities to grow its military capabilities, as it would for our own.
Can’t. The nature of the beast is that the only way to keep ‘er going is to inflate and race up the debt faster than the underlying cancer. It’s in the basic numbers.
So you’re saying the StimpyStim was necessary JHo? I doubt that’s what you mean, so I’m confused.
We should see so-called Keynesian spending on top of unstable monies in a closed system where one party is rigging the notes to stay employed and hoard while the other is desperately inflating so as to leverage the status quo out over thin air for as long as they can. It’s a last hurrah.
DC is all about taking what you can when you can. There is no tomorrow. The ChiComs suffer no such diversions.
Franklin was prescient. We caved. We didn’t have what it took.
From the sounds of the story you tell it isn’t just a last hurrah but practically a deterministic matter from over a couple centuries ago. Ain’t buying.
Of course it was, sdferr. How many such systems have failed so far?
All of them.
You’re a nutter.
Well of course. Good proof, too. Kudos.
I learned how to make whipped cream so when it all collapses I’m gonna invent cool whip and be fucking rich
the huckabumble bees buzzing:
link
Money is fungible and all but the Chinese like to spend most their money by pumping it into real estate and construction. Exciting!
On the plus side, when it does go pop, we’ll all be glad that they kept the yuan low and discouraged imports.
so Todd Palin is a petty little man what is not particularly concerned with the spendings as opposed to putting his hoochie wife in the white house?
I am disappointed to learn of this.
i thought the huckabumble bee angle was funny
all roads lead back to Fox News anymore how creepy is that
i like to throw my chinky change after a conveniece store visit
on the ground/except for the quarters…on the ground-cuz they give u ur change with ur purchase and reciept and ur all “hand challenged” and u have ur keys of car inna pocket/ so u -{i} throw them change in the wind-cuz ur looking for ur keys and u think..
wouldn’t be a sunny day if u were ten years old and u found a dime in some parking lot-in this depressing world?..
and as an added bonus/when u throw/lose/them change and ur with someone and the hear the echos of the metal to the ground and they stop/ and say- “did u just throw money away?”
i just laugh and laugh
update
link
So Todd Palin zealously defends his wife and HF gets all atwitter over his chivalry. Nice.
Stephanie, happyfeet can be and often is amusing and intelligent, but like Andrew Sullivan the very thought or image of S– P– sends him off the rails. Pity. It spoils many otherwise interesting threads.
Regards,
Ric
Seeing as she brought Miller to the national attention, and Huck just glommed along like lazy Razorback
It’s sorta funny because Huckabee almost does this to me and he’s implied to be the dark matter of the story. It’s like perfect bait. I assume Allah is all over this.
Not only is it the interest payments onthe debt China holds, but the trade defecit with them as well. You see, China get’s the lion’s share of the monies coming into thier economy. And although, as JHo noted correctly, a lot of Chinese effort is going into “churning” construction and manufacturing markets, in order to keep people employed and all the plates spinning-so to speak, they are spending a dramatic amount of that money developing and purchasing a blue-water Navy; at the same time we are making conscious decisions to dramatically pull back from our one-time intended 600 ship blue-water force.
And perhaps more disturbing is the Chinese foray into missile technology and space travel/exploration. I don’t think I need to remind anyone of the quantum technological levels increase the US military, and indeed consumer, realized from just the spin-offs of these types of national efforts. Chances are you’re using some of it right now to visit this forum…
And I will take a decidedly non-partisan approach to assigning blame here. Thanks Billy Jeff, for OKaying the transfer of missile control and guidance technology to the Chi-coms in the 90’s; effin’ loser…
Oh, and thanks Mr. Bush, for allowing IBM to sell thier personal computer division to the Chi-coms in the mid-2000’s; nice call, podnuh…
I remain convinced that if we had to build factories overseas to escape union extortion and excessive taxation, we should have been doing so in South America; a move that may also have positively impacted the illegal immigration problem we face today.
How did Palin and Huck-a-fool come into a foreign policy and economics discussion!?!?!
Newrouter’s link at #16, Bob.
And happy,
Are you winding up for a “FUX NEWZ” bender too? First Palin, then Christie (on another thread), and now FOX.
http://powip.com/2010/10/todays-helping-of-chris-christie-awesomeness/
Please provide us all with a map, because this minefield is getting difficult to negotiate, bro…
Ric, I know but it is funny-strange that HF defends the staunchiness and then when Todd gets all staunchy in defending his wife, HF prefers a wimp.
Which does HF prefer – staunchy in your face politics or the usual wimp out? Seems he’s angling for the wimpiness in this case…
Todd was saying – she’s worked her ass off for Miller and Miller’s best response wasn’t “Sarah Palin is not the narrative invented by the MSM” but acquiescenced to the “ohh she’s not fit” narrative… he blinked plain and simple.
Chris Christie was helping campaign for a hardcore fiscal conservative for governor today in Wisconsin. He’s popular enough here that they promoted a picture with him as the prize for making the most phone calls from the local offices.
Also did some great radio interviews in the right markets and pitched our guy as on the same page with it came to cutting spending. Very useful trip. We’re indebted.
I see, said the blind man.
Seems like baiting a bit to me.
throwing bottles in the ice
like a blizzard
the same page when it came
Some folks find Christie too combative; I’m not one of them. I like him a lot. I think he’s a good, unapologetic, spokeman for fiscal austerity and limited government.
Even if he did endorse Castle.
“throwing bottles in the ice
like a blizzard”
Is that a line from a rap tune?
Here you go, Bob.
yes except for I think it’s posed to be popping bottles in the ice
lisa thecowski is russia or putin
here’s where they pulled the sample from she has
conviction
lisa has a house too!
lisa murkowski is NOT a big fat slurpy treat
I tire of her
things also of which I tire are include living in a society where the discourse is driven by cable news personalities
also that stupid Chuck show why the fuck is that not canceled
Nonsense. It’s the other way around.
They’ve been propping up our well-intentioned foolishness in Iraq, or the very necessary but so far not-really-working-out-fight in Afghanistan, or the mistake-in-altogether-poor-taste that is our budget.
So thank a Bank of China official next time you see one. They help us forstall the difficult, grown up decisions that the GOP is supposed to make and the Dems view as evil incarnate.
Oh, and if anyone cares, at least $100-billion of that figure is held in CDOs and various second-lien and other land-of-dreams mortgage type bonds.
If they ever mark that to market–and they dont (at all)–the Chinese are FUBAR.
jesus and huckabumblebee luvs lisa thecowski. say it ain’t so joey m.
Far east movement looks pretty cool; and easy on the eyes too! I’ll have to listen later as my wife and MIL may not be down wif it.
Actually, thank me. Assholes. I don’t even eat meat everyday.
Everyone who buys our treasuries is enabling those things mcgruder, not just the Chinese.
And you’re right about the CDO funny-money losses waiting to happen. FWIW, they’ve lost about 100 billion over the last few months just because of the losses in dollar value:
http://tiny.cc/chicomz
I don’t buy anything third hand from “Mudflats”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2q_v7XW0uZc&,feature=player_embedded
with barneys fwank, chris dodd, andrew the cuomo, cra, fannie, freddie and housing in general
Winston.. Miller’s Huckabee camp confirmed the email exchange. And in the process outed themselves as the leakers. Aimed at Sarah and probably took down the candidate they were supposed to assist. Sounds so McCainish, don’t it?
my prob with karl the rover on hannity tonight: he ain’t no patton in this war.
i like to take my prize pig on a glop
but she insists on wearing her ring..
dang me/dang me-they’re gonna put a rope up and hang me
the man was just being honest – how can he honestly tell Alaskan peoples that their quitty governor what bailed on them is qualified to be president?
He can’t honestly say that cause it would be a lie before God and country.
Not necessarily a lie, just his opinion. Perspective bro…
’tis not ur tiny feet–or ur charm
or ur large head-oink-oink-
let’s meet at the halfway cafe?.
i’d wear a blanket for pig justicer
But Todd is asking him to say something that isn’t his opinion so Todd is asking him to lie. To just look out at those innocent wide-eyed Alaskan peoples and lie simple as that.
Todd Palin is a very manipulative person.
yes don’t bail on noes illinois senate job. the baracky he be quittin’ any blowjob anytime. ax acorn.
hug a ned beatty.com
mrs. chitown thug has nice arms
frank luttz suxs hannity’s big toe. dick morris like that too
funky squerrill.net
Actually he’s quite direct, and if he knew where you lived, he’d punch your lights out for the lies you’ve spread about his wife, you passive aggressive jackass
I’m not going to get into a Palin discussion with you tonight happyfeet. We have different opinions, that’s all.
And whether she’s running or not hasn’t definitively been established. It’s easy to see why even if she weren’t that Todd would take exception to Miller’s reluctance to commit to a position on her fitness to be President. There’s nothing unusual on him playing a central role, behind the scenes, in his wife’s political apparatus.
And there’s nothing wrong with good ol’ political hardball, IMHO.
But, YMMV.
my zippers are all metally .chetoos.come on..
come o/ let me show u where its at/ the name of the place is “i like it like that”
I’m just very concerned cause if Sarah Palin is the nominee then the very disheartened groundhog comes out of his hole and says goddamn four more years of socialism I didn’t sign up for this shit.
Interesting that happyfeet can call an election two years out, but not the candidates one year out. hummm…
Jeff’s said he’s not happy about about all these threads turning towards Palin. Seems like we ought to respect that. I’d add a YMMV but there’s only one host here. So let’s be cool like the Fonz.
it’s not ur cheeks/ or your squeeks
or ur dieing/ and i do mean dieing on the trough…
as you and i wave a bye/ it’s your tasty bacon that i’m thinking of
Well, it sounds like you need to tell Mitch Daniels to get on the stick then! See if JD has any entrees to the governor.
“So let’s be cool like the Fonz.”
Word
Well getting back on topic, the PLA clique that runs China, is wonderfully opaque, it makes AIG and Enron seem like a model of transparency, when the party stops, it’s going to be a hard crash, all around the world
Fox News says Daniels needn’t bother.
I worry every time a Chinese container ship docks in LA.
“Cuz of there might be Chinese soldiers inside.
dig my pig/ he’s big- no prig..
gives to certain charities/ample..
forgets ur digs about his character/ is nice/..if u cut my friendly pet u could prob eat for weeks/ but u don’t hate round pink people/do u?/ pigist!
Now happyfeet,
That’s one guy’s opinion, and not “the official FUX NEWZ narrative”. And even if it were, I reject the notion that an appreciable percentage of right leaning voters merely memorize and repeat the positions of Fox news personalities…
They aren’t kingmakers, and Murdoch and Ailes aren’t “Citizen Kane”…
C’mon man, climb back in off that ledge. I thought I was the only person among the PW commentariat that was a part-time tinfoil hatter…
I’m now not a fan of this Shane Vander Hart person. Hmmm, it even sorta sounds like a fake name. I bet it’s Huckabee.
Don’t mind his advocacy of social conservatism. I do mind his implication that it’s a zero sum game within the coalition.
miss piggy was a puppet..
things up an ass make certain jury’s flakeand- to make a stand/ the holy ghost never had an enema..
yup/ i said it!
I concur bh.
I’m depressed it’s very depressing and it looks for all the world like there’s a trainwreck a coming and I’m like hey everybody look at that train gosh it sure is going sorta fast maybe it should slow down and everyone’s all like shut you face you stupid happyfeet you’re a silly monkey
I liked that Shane fellows article. The John Adams quote was neato.
Shut your face, you stupid happyfeet, you’re a silly monkey.
It’s more like this: if there was a mysterious guy who randomly jumped up out of nowhere and stabbed me in the face every single day? I probably still wouldn’t talk about him this much.
Dick Morris has climbed on Mr W’s 100 seat change in congress prediction. Looks like a socialist train wreck to me…
heres my joke/ jesus mary/ ever get laid?
2/ jeepers creeper jesus dude/ stop staring at me in the mens room- cuzz i will beat u- with extreme pudjuice..
what does one holey ghost say to another?…
relax
Heh, I’ve noticed that, Lee.
Here’s hoping. [lifts glass vaguely to the west]
C’mon happyfeet, snap out of it mange!
I’m not tellin’ you to shut up, just get a grip on yourself. The election of 2012 is, well, two years away. Let’s concentrate on getting there first.
Remember, Ronnie Reagan was able to merge the compatible elements of social conservatism, fiscal conservatism, smaller government, and strong national defense; without succumbing to any one group’s demands.
As bh noted, it’s not a zero-sum game as that Shane fellow alludes to. Just as you don’t like DeMint, there are some that don’t like Daniels.
We don’t even know who’s runnin’ bro. Don’t get depressed, keep an open mind, judge people on their actions, ideas, and words.
And chase that AllahPundit, Eeyore feelin’ away. Get back your swagger!
oh great now I’m a silly monkey wif mange
better. and. better.
you know what the cheeringest thing is?
I will tell you.
No man, mange is supposed to phonetocally invoke a cool blues singer sayin’, “man”. It’s supposed to emulate the nasal sound.
Haven’t you ever heard Muddy Waters?
Summer lemonade cupcakes?
Red velvet cupcakes, with whipped cream icing?
The cheeringest thing is that we know that bumblefuck is going to pivot right after the election to talking about the deficit.
With a Team R majority in the house even if it’s led by a contingent of Boehnerpussies we will very quickly know some things we simply don’t know right now.
For example, we will be able to gauge Team R’s level of concern with respect to the spendings.
A “hard” pivot, to be sure. Right after his defecit commission tells him he has! to raise taxes; and ask M’chelle of he can cut some of the spending…
sure/call them pigs/
i prefer to call them “mobile tasty units”
don’t even gets me dander up abouts them chickens..
call me coklenenel all u want..
just don’t call me late for dinner
The new class, including Col. West is just going to have the kick the old Guard into shape, kind of like fiscal bootcamp
Just tonight I’ve sent in a post about this. My eyes are on the ball… with a laser like focus.
I credit my staunch inattention to the daily Palin news.
I am glad to have been of service.
i mean/ kernel cuntuky fried..i just wanna save medium sized babies..
is that a crime?
Amen winston.
Colonel West is the man!
somebot put a greassy bucket on my head;;
danger will robinson
Mcgruder: you can be assured they will sooner than later have to come clean because their fraudulent loans and foreclosures will emerge. What a bloodbath. And no thanks to Obama and his uberadministration for any push on this.
He’s great and there will be a very large group of new congressmen next year.
I’d really like for us to exert as much effort pressuring them to commit to our agenda as the progressives will waste pushing the Conyer’s type bullshit that Jeff mentioned earlier today. If that results in Col. West beating up a few people in the cloakroom, I’m fine with that.
What exactly is your agenda? I assume you have the Queen’s voice.
Not just her voice. Many matching dresses and hats.
‘lil’ bo peep/ said to certain sheep
runaway- ur free! run!..
and shirley/sureley ‘dem sheepies said
i like the protien wisdom grass/ goo goo ga joo
Can’t really do the Queen wave though. It’s surprisingly subtle.
I’m on board with that bh.
I mean, holding thier feet to the fire; not the Queen’s voice, dresses, and hats…
It’s something I’ve done for many years anyway. I complain whether they’re R’s or not…
I wrote many a letter to Boooooooooooosh! about not following through on social security reform and pushing amnesty. And Billy Jeff before him; as well as different Congressmen and Senators.
I just had to be careful with my tone when I was still active duty; especially when criticizing the C-in-C.
… So do you care that we are subsidizing China’s ascendance. Apparently not. We are fucked.
Now just goes to show you how the fix is in, the VFW endorsed Klein over West
That is not Obamas fault, btw.
the C in C is a jackass can I get an amen
ok I mostly stole that from Mr. drudge
“So do you care that we are subsidizing China’s ascendance. Apparently not”
Yeah, ‘cuz we hardly ever mention the deficit and how politicians are spending our grandkids money.
You may partially wrong about the Chuck thing, btw;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yvonne_Strahovski
Doesn’t matter what I think on that because we’re not. No, they invested in our profligacy and are rather predictably misallocating the returns.
On the often conflated separate issue, their “ascendancy” through “unfair” trade is only based on the fact that their citizens pay for more expensive imports so that we can pay less. If that’s a problem, I wish we had many, many more of them.
LBascomb: So what the hell are you doing about it? Besides voting Repug.
Are you addressing me cynn? I think I made my feelings clear in my comment at #27.
happyfeet,
I’m surprised at you; calling the C-in-C a jackass…
That’s an insult to jackasses everywhere! :)
“So what the hell are you doing about it? ”
Eating Thia, I refuse to patronize them commie Chinese restaurants.
You?
The VFW backs Klein over West-the Veteran?!?
Another letter to write…
chuck berry diddled a song…
BH: They may be required to pay more, so they pay collectively less, because they don’t buy as much; makes no sense. Do you have even a remote source for that bullshit?
Can you internalize the Walmart business model? Oh, my Jah.
stop! in the name of love
1
Hell, cynn voted in the Commie what sold China even more interest bearing notes. She called it something like “riding the juggernaut,” snif now turned all Fudgesicle.
Yes, cynn, I have a cite. It was called International Trade, Currency and Current Accounts: All about Butter. Or something like that.
The simplest way I can think to explain it is to think of currency manipulation as a mirror. What they do, the opposite happens back at them. If they make their exports cheaper for others, they make imports more expensive internally. This isn’t something they can cheat. No one gets to cheat.’
China isn’t cheating. There is no free Kung Pao chicken for them either.
But they’re not importing.
False.
Go to a coastal city in China and you’ll find how wrong that is. But, imagine if what you just said was true. Do you think that would be the best deal for the Chinese consumer? Of course not.
People don’t trade because they lose. They trade because they win. It is the sole motivation for trade.
Your’re full of bull. It’s incredible; you guys are desperate. China owns us.
…And I meant America isn’t exporting. What a joke.
Like many things in this life cynn, every sword cuts both ways. The Chinese need us as well, to help maintain the tenuous increase on the standard of living their people are just beginning to enjoy.
Why do you think they had to inject a stimulus equivalent to 25% of their GDP ito their economy last year?
There’s a lot of hinky economic stuff going on in China that many folks don’t realize.
we used to export lightbulbs then president bumblefuck and his socialists sent those jobs to… china
Baseball cards. Nothing has value until it does. Then everybody trades from there. Simple really.
Even in terms of that very simple paradigm in your head, cynn… still not true.
cynn,
Last year GM sold more cars overseas than they did in the US…
http://www.omaha.com/article/20100703/MONEY/707039902/1009
No BS
Yeah, it’s a big topic of conservation in some circles. I still remember reading an E&Y white paper back in the ’90s talking about energy consumption versus their official figures. I’ve remained jaded.
Are you guys saying there is no problem with China holding so much of our debt?
I mean, we aren’t talking pocket change owed to a Canadian here.
All I know is I see a lot of bitching and moaning from our free traitors. Eat the losses. Suffer bringing jobs and the accompaning benefits like customer service home.
Lee, the problem with China holding so much of our debt is only that we have so much debt. Anyone who gives you money wants it back with interest.
Every now and again, we have to invent an Asian bogey who’s going to eat our lunch money or something. When I was a yute it was the Dai Nipponese, now its the Middle Kingdom. I suppose in 20 years it will be those fearsome Indians.
The wide Pacific keeps us from seeing the problems these places have until its obvious. Japan, Inc. was unstoppable until it suddenly stopped. China may be recovering a good deal of political/military status, even Great Power Status. It’s also in Late Stage Growth Obesity. It’s Starbucks in 2005, when even unfunny bastards like Lewis Black had a Starbucks-across-the-street-from-a-Starbucks bit to stay topical.
If we weren’t all convinced that Asians had magic, inscrutable powers, we’d see our rivals’ weaknesses. If some of us weren’t enamoured of the notion that economics was the playground of the crusading state, we’d let things take their course. They will anyway.
Well, it’s just I don’t trust the Chinese. Because of the communism…
Listen to Andrew. He’s as wise as he is inscrutable.
The nice thing about being lent money is that you don’t have to trust them, Lee. They fulfilled their end of the contract right off the bat.
Now, I can imagine why they wouldn’t trust us with our rather shocking new approach to budgeting…
Watching Frank Luntz’s focus group of California voters on Hannity. What the hell is in the water out there?
By the way, over at Stacy McCain’s blog, commenter Thomas D left this bit of advice for Dave Weigel that certain Pain-hating beta males would do well to take note of:
Indeed.
*Palin*-hating beta males, that is.
Speaking of bats, I wouldn’t borrow money from swarthy guys wearing pinky rings. It’s different than borrowing from the parents…
Boudreaux cribbing Caplan on comparative advantage. Get some.
Yes, sdferr. Exactly.
bh, Bob, and Andrew are right, cynn. It’s a complex dance. At it’s center are the artificial relationships between monies and markets, between powers and peoples, and between importer and exporter nations. The whole damn thing is a construct — being built on currency manipulation and funny money.
Our problem is the end game. This thing, being so artificial, is socializing us faster and harder than our politics. Power funnels to the top and money follows it.
The ostensible conservative’s greatest failing is his lack of a grasp on or a concern for this phenomenon. We’ve been warned time and again and yep we insist on thinking this system of ours is simply unfettered wholesome capitalism in action. It is not. It is a pending failure and right now every bit of the circumstantial evidence related to money and markets points to that failure.
China Has Lost Over $100 Billion In Dollar-Adjusted Terms On Its UST Holdings In A Few Short Months
No, they don’t. China has invested in our treasury bonds the same as Social Security has. Would you say that “Social Security owns us”?