- “The word ‘dyke’ appeals to the Dutch, and winning the War on Terror is all about building international alliances.”
- “The Cheneys opened the door to Senator Kerry’s factual remark by engaging in the kind of lurid monkey sex that produced Mary Cheney in the first place.”
- “The American people have the right to know that, should George Bush die and Dick Cheney assume the presidency, the White House would be overrun with biker chicks and short-haired women in flannel shirts.”
- “Rosie O’Donnell wouldn’t have minded one bit.”
- “What the Senator said was perfectly tasteful. After all, he could have taken Terry Mcauliffe’s advice and reminded America that at some point, Mary Cheney has almost certainly had some leatherclad butch’s pierced tongue up her ass.”
- “Homosexuals have been persecuted unfairly by a blinkered, fundamentalist Christian society for hundreds of years. What’s a coupla more weeks gonna hurt…?”
- “(Kinda off topic…but whatever happened to that smoldering Jimmy Smits…?)”
- “How dare you question the Indigo Girls’ patriotism!”
- “When it comes to oppressed, identity-politics voting blocs, sometimes Senator Kerry cares just too damn much!”
****
Andy’s rhetorical contortions here. More here; and here; and here; and here; and here; and here; and here; and finally here.
****
update: for a different take, go here and here.
I find it strangely ironic that Andrew rationalizes fanning the flames of homophobia as a way to further the interests of homosexuals.
Mr. Sullivan is ready to assume the position for John Kerry despite Kerry’s statement that, “The president and I have the same position, fundamentally, on gay marriage. We do. Same position.” This is nothing but more evidence that Kerry’s words cannot be believed except with a subtle nod and a wink.
Haven’t we all…haven’t we all…
It’s simply not about her orientation, or her status of “in” or “out” of the closet, or whose pierced tongue has been up whose ass and why I don’t have pictures of it.
It’s about that unwritten rule of: You do not make political hay out of your opponents family.
I don’t care that Sullivan’s become a Democrat. I care that he’s become a dick. – Priceless.
Sullivan is to HOMOPHOBIA! is what Oliver Willis is to RACIST! ?
Color me shocked.
Ever since Bush jilted Sullivan over the FMA he has taken on the personna of Glenn Glose in Fatal Attraction. I guess that makes Dubya Michael Douglas. Maybe Mrs. Bush should be concerned.
Bunnies, dude. Don’t forget the bunnies.
i had to give up reading sullivan two weeks ago…
it’s one thing to be biased, and i think he has a right to be. but what i can’t stand is how he pretends as if he’s not biased and as if he’s still trying work all of this stuff out in his mind.
also, his (understandable, in my view) anger about bush and the FMA, had led him to become totally ignorant and unreasonable on other issues – LIKE THE WAR – and to overlook how much anti-gay sentiment exists among DEMOCRATS as well.
and he refuses to admit that ANY of the swiftvets might actually have legitimate complaints – even if some people disagree with them. he writes off the entire group as a stunt by karl rove, even though one of them (day) was a cell-mate of john mccain.
Sully’s been in the Kerry Camp since Silky Pony Boy Johnny Edwards was selected. Sully now goes to bed each night dreaming of sperm enemas from his Johnny! The way that’s clouded his judgement, particularly on the whole SwiftVet issue, is disgusting!
And Andrew makes another slow, lazy turn in his intellectual-death spiral…
Yeah, Andy’s been twisting so hard on this gay marriage / Bush-Kerry thing, he’s just about permanently bent.
Oh, relax. Andy says things like that aren’t gay baiting. So get off my back.
At issue is whether or not the private lives (and one’s sex life whether acknowledged or not constitutes private life) of candidates CHILDREN are fair game in an election. It’s not about what Sullivan’s exasperating about. And I’m confused as to why he doesn’t get this. LEAVE THE KIDS OUT OF IT! Nuff said.
Seriously – it’s not like Bush/Cheney have been weaving in Kerry’s slutty boob-showing, celebrity-making-out-with daughters into his discussion of family values..this would be below the belt right?
Matt
Don’t make wild claims if you’re not going to provide detailed photographic evidence for…review
Look, even though I agree with Kerry that Cheney’s position on homosexuality is wrong, I was angry that Kerry:
Took a non-sequiter cheap shot that dragged a private person’s life into the Presidential debate. He showed he has no class at all.
BUT at that moment all over the country, gays and lesbians like jumped out of their chairs and screamed “You tell him sister!”
Kerry probably insured Andrew Sullivan’s quavering vote in that one instant of bad taste.
It was ugly but it was competant politics.
BTW: Earl T, creeps like you make me want to vote democrat. I’ll have to go read a few of Teresa’s speeches or
Kos to regain my balance.
There is an interesting analysis of Andrew Sullivan “quoting” Bush here
stagolee, here you go!
Joshua,
If you believe that Kerry’s remarks about Mary Cheney’s being a lesbian was made to nail down the homosexual vote you are off your nut. Kerry had the gay vote locked up the second he was nominated. Kerry doesn’t need to appeal to gays he can take them for granted like he does other minorities. Except for Cuban-Americans
Forgive me for being a touch, um, old fashioned. Discussing the sex life of someone’s daughter in public simply is not done. It’s just not the action of a gentleman. What more do you need to know about JFK?
Mr. Schieffer: Mr. President I want to go back to something Senator Kerry said earlier tonight and ask a follow-up of my own. He said, and this will be a new question to you, he said that you had never said whether you would like to overturn Roe v. Wade. So I’d ask you directly would you like to?
Mr. Bush: We’re all God’s children, Bob, and I think if you were to talk to John Kerry’s daughter, who had an abortion, she would tell you that she’s being who she was. She’s being who she was raised as. I think if you talk to anybody, it’s not a choice. I’ve met people who struggled with this for years, people who were pregnant, because they were living a sort of convention, and they struggled with it. And I’ve met wives who are supportive of their husbands or vice versa when they finally sort of broke out and allowed themselves to look at other options to abortion and be who they felt God had made them. I think we have to respect that.
Harry, yes I agree it was unnecessary, but it energized Kerry’s base.
My main point was that Andrew and friends were too busy enjoying the dig to care (or notice) that it showed a lack of class.
Come to think of it, it was Bush that showed a complete lack of class on this issue before Kerry did, and in a more substantive way. Wouldn’t it have been better if Bush had had the class to stay away from grandstanding against gays? Yeah we know that a constitutional amendment will never pass – but, therefore, there is no politically valid reason to propose one. He just wanted to play one group off of another, and that’s damn ugly.
People are REALLY angry with Bush and Cheney over this for good reason, and Kerry played to the anger – isn’t that always good (if ugly) politics?
Joshua: Shouldn’t the Massachusetts couple had the good taste to try an appeal to the voters instead of venue-shopping a court case with a corrupt judge, and shouldn’t gay couples in other states have better taste than to use that tainted Massachusetts verdict to sue for the same court-appointed “right”?
Nah, of course not. How homophobic of me even to suggest that in a democracy, plebiscites and ballott initiaves might be a better way to determine the will of the populace than rigged court cases are.
“People are really angry at Bush over this…”–that explains the runaway sucess of state anti-gay-marriage initiaves, doesn’t it? All those voters just RAN out and SHOWED mean ol’ Mr. Bush how much they disagreed with him, didn’t they? Oh, wait…
What proof is there in this world that either Andrew Sullivan or Josh Marshall has EVER had a thought of any kind?
A Brain is needed, so where is their PROOF ?
I too have stopped reading Sully. I liked his unique point of view – gay, tory Catholic. But his desertion of Bush to pseudo JFK over the FMA is dumbfounding. No doubt Bush doesn’t want to see gays marry, a position I couldn’t care less about one way or another. But what does Kerry offer and how can you be sure of it? Andrew if you ever read this – come back to your senses. It little matters if you and your boyfriend can marry if Islamic extremist behead you both on your honeymoon.
Dave, don’t be an idiot. I didn’t say that EVERYONE in the country is really angry at Bush and Cheney over this, I said that many people in Kerry’s base are really angry at Bush and Cheney over this. I did not say, and did not imply that there aren’t lots of people who agree with Bush and Cheney…
Sorry it offends you whenever someone points out that legislating _against_ rights for any specific group is ugly. You can wish that it was holy and beatiful all you want, but it’s still ugly and it still makes the intended victims and their simpathizers angry, no matter what (in your opinion) God thinks.
Lots of people are angry, and illogical nonsequiter arguments like can’t possibly change that reality.
And you never addressed my point, that proposing an amendment that has no chance of passing is just an ugly way of playing one group against another in an election.
Of course I meant to type:
Lots of people are angry, and illogical nonsequiter arguments like yours can’t possibly change that reality
Joshua, don’t be a corprophiliac masturbator… at least, any more than your mother taught you to be.
Your exact quote:
“People are REALLY angry with Bush and Cheney over this”
Did I see, “KERRY’S people” in there? NO. (and your rebuttal makes no sense: why in hell should Bush care if Kerry’s base are angry at him over gay marraige or any damn thing else? They’re KERRY’s base, they’re not voting for him anyway… talk about nonsequiter arguements)
Did I mention God at all? NO. (sounds like you have something that you feel guilty about…or do you just automatically try to apply a religous smear against anyone who has the opposite side of an arguement?)
You got busted, and now you’re trying to spin it. Gay marraige is NOT popular or approved of by the majority of AMERICANS, not just the majority of REPUBLICANS, and having it forced upon them by judicial fiat sits even less well and turns people who would have supported the measure in an honest vote into outright enemies. As I said, the landslide victories of initiatives barring gay marraige in almost all of the states they’ve been put up to a vote confirms this. You might want to do some thinking about why those initiatves sprung up in the first place, and so quickly.
>Sorry it offends you whenever someone points out that legislating _against_ rights for any specific group is ugly.
What rights?