Me, I see the benefit of telling them to get bent. Or get rid of the gasoline taxes that are already supposed to be paying for highway maintenance and the like.
Our freedoms are being taken away one new “mandate” at a time. From CNS:
A new Congressional Budget Office study says taxing motorists based on the number of miles they drive would be a fair and “efficient” way to charge motorists for the real cost of using the nation’s highways. “Vehicle-miles traveled” taxes (or VMT taxes) also would provide a strong incentive for people to drive less.
Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood floated the idea of a VMT tax one month after President Obama took office, but Obama’s spokesman immediately shot it down. “It is not and will not be the policy of the Obama administration,” White House press secretary Robert Gibbs told reporters in February 2009.
But that was then.
The CBO study, released this week, says the federal government pays in part for about 25 percent of the nation’s highways, which carry about 85 percent of all road traffic. Right now, federal spending on those highways is funded mainly by taxes on gasoline and diesel fuel, but those taxes do not raise enough money to support either the current federal spending on highways — or the higher spending levels that some transportation planners advocate.
The CBO said most of the costs of using a highway, including pavement damage, congestion, accidents, and noise, are tied more closely to the number of miles traveled than to the amount of fuel consumed.
While raising fuel taxes would bring in more money, the CBO notes that a “fundamental” problem would remain: “By themselves, fuel taxes cannot provide a strong incentive for people to avoid overusing highways,” the report said.
On the other hand, VMT taxes would have most motorists paying “substantially more than they do now — perhaps several times more,” the report said. “Such a system would maximize the efficiency of highway use by discouraging trips for which costs exceed benefits.”
Is that really the role of the federal government? Firstly, to define what “overuse” of the highways is, and second to declare that they have a right to collect money based on said “overuse”?
An “incentive” not to move about affordably is an incentive toward imprisonment over freedom. That is, unless some savior comes along and brings us, say, high speed rail. If only we could find that man. He’d be the one we’ve been waiting for…
Oh goody, the federal government gets to gather data on where I go and when … I mean, is it REALLY necessary for me to watch my grandsons 2-3 times a week at my home? Look at all those “overused highway” miles that could be saved if my daughter was smart and just made sure to enroll them into a government-run afterhours childcare center.
When did the fed government get to dictate to me what is or is not “necessary” travel? And since when is traveling for pleasure something EEEEVVVVIIIILLLLLLEEEE!??
Good luck getting any kind of monitoring device installed on my ’79 Bronco. My attorneys (Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson) will be having an in-depth discussion with you…
Perhaps if that doesn’t get it through the taxpayers’ thick heads that the government doesn’t want citizens using the highways they paid for, then perhaps they’ll give out little mileage debit cards – a ration card – once the limit is reached, your shit outta luck, chump. Driving with an exceeded card limit? Your vehicle gets impounded, just as if you were driving on a suspended license…
If that fails to achieve the desired effect, some kind of “internal passport” will keep the damned peasants in their place…
Time to call your elected representatives and tell them in no uncertain terms that this kind of horseshit will not be tolerated.
More fuel for the TEA Party…
Strabo! You didn’t turn that into the government through the Cash for Clunkers
fiascoAwesomely Successful Program??Why do you hate the environment?
You know, I think user fees are the most fair method of taxation, and would gladly pay a tax on miles travelled (provided there is no creepy tracking method used to calculate where I go) among other user fees, but only if the Federal Income Tax was abolished.
Indeed, Alex. I think I argued something similar when we were having debates about CAFE standards years back.
But this is just extra taxation, and it comes with another government mandate. So no. Thanks.
Implementation options-
-Tamper-resistant mileage counters in vehicles, to be left alone under penalty of law.
-GPS trackers to count miles moved, plus provide “other useful information,” with assurances that although other data is collected, it will never be used for anything. Device also to be left alone under penalty of law.
-Tollbooths on every highway.
-The honor system.
-‘Gut feeling’ of a government worker assessing the tax.
————————————————————
So the local water district told us to conserve water, and we reduced our consumption by about 20%. Then after a year or so the water authority complained about their recent 20% drop in revenues and petitioned to raise their rates — successfully. So now they buy less water and sell it for the about the same revenue as before.
I think this transportation proposal is blowback from our efforts to decrease the use of gasoline. If only we’d known.
It’s frightening that our country is in a place where they’d be brazen enough to even contemplate something like this out loud. The old saying about communists being liberals in a hurry rings truer every day. The inevitable public reaction seems not to have even entered their minds.
Totally fool-proof! Everybody knows JUST how hard it is to jam a GPS receiver. Must take all of 1/4 of a watt…
How about having killing the Dep’t. of Transportation and selling off the Interstate system to a private operator? Mitch Daniels did it with the Indiana Toll Road in 2005.
They can charge tolls via iZoom, ePass and the like. The private operator is responsible for maintenance, roadkill and snow removal, etc.
If I could kill the ‘having’ in the ‘having killing’, I’d kill.
Metaphorically. Not INTERNET DEATH THREATally.
I cannot wait to ask a leftist/progressive why installing a GPS that tracks every car is okay, but warrantless wiretapping is verboten.
How about having killing the Dep’t. of Transportation and selling off the Interstate system to a private operator?
Only if they can the gas tax.
I’m not sold on private roads… I avoid the Skyway into IN like the plague, and will curse to high heaven if I accidently take the wrong exist and wind up paying the ridiculous $9 toll or whatever twice, just to turn around.
It’s highway robbery.
My position is, if you aren’t going to give me well maintained public highways, fuck your income taxes too. What the hell am I paying you for? I’d rather pay a mob accountant to launder it honestly.
It’s a cop out to let them off the hook for the roads so they can focus like a laser on buying votes, laundering our GDP through corporate welfare and bombing Africa.
0 Base line budgeting. If they’re putting cowboy poetry subsidies ahead of road maintenance so be it, make them do it in the open. Privatizing it would likely just give them the means to spend the difference on even more cowboy poetry subsidies, or special tax breaks for multi-billion dollar corporations.
Darleen, I’m sure you trust the government to keep all that GPS data safe and secure, right? I mean, after all, it isn’t like the data will wind up leaving on CD and get lost.
It’s no so different from the original model for highwaymen and toll roads honestly.
If they’re going to charge me $9 to go foward, they ought be required to allow me a place to turn the hell around and go back.
Else they’re basically just mugging me for accidentally wandering onto their feudal turf.
That’s basically the Somali pirate business model, less the genuine accident part.
-Tollbooths on every highway.
Untenable.
-Tamper-resistant mileage counters in vehicles, to be left alone under penalty of law.
-GPS trackers to count miles moved, plus provide “other useful information,” with assurances that although other data is collected, it will never be used for anything. Device also to be left alone under penalty of law.
I’ll put them on the garage shelf right next to the catalytic converter.
Molon labe.
Entropy,
How long before someone figures out how to spoof the GPS using a cell phone?
The gas tax is a mileage tax — and a progressive one at that. Because I only get 12-14 mpg in my truck, I pay more per mile than some green geek in a Prius.
The only possible reason why a new pay-per-mile mileage tax is being proposed is to justify these draconian enforcement strategies.
The gas tax is a mileage tax
Yeah, that’s my point… but I change my mind anyway.
Alec is right. Only if they can the income tax.
I said the same basic idea, as Alex, to Iowahawk in a response on Twitter. I’d support the idea if they would remove other taxes and covert to consumption and use revenues.
They could get around the access control through an Ipass (Illinois) type device for the Interstate; without having the “gps tracking”. Each on/off ramp would have to be electronically gated though. You register the vehicle, it gets a device. Which, it looks like Darth just covered all this as well. So, echo!
RELENTLESS!!! Next is carbon tax on our breathing.
We are well and truly fucked….
I know this statement will be redundant, but this is social engineering pure and simple. People will be forced to use public transportation over driving to save money where public transportation is available. People in the rural areas will be forced to pay the majority of the taxes. Business will once again be stifled by more govt regulation with more jobs lost to make up for the extra gas charges or raising prices to make up for rising gas prices and on and on and on and on. Just stop spending our fucking money on bullshit already!!
Of course the CBO thinks it’s a great idea, he’s totally out of money. ANY idea that brings more $$ in is a great idea. He needs to balance the books somehow, but can’t seem to keep all the money from flowing OUT.
Garym:
People in the rural areas will be forced to move to the city… and those greenspaces around the cities will be no more than wide open federal lands requiring permits to access. Seems Asimov had some comments on cities of the future wrt city living…
It’s all right there.
No use trying to figure how they could do things better, our goals are wildly divergent.
If you have GPS data like this, you don’t even need to enforce speed laws any more, because everyone will be driving around with a device that can monitor their speed and location at any time. Think of the revenue you could get in speeding tickets that don’t even require a witness except your GPS device.
They could make a fortune.
I can tell you one thing, the Teamsters will LOVE a VMT – because it will put the independent truckers right out of business.
I’m not giving them money for something they’ll just leave out in the rain. All that money for a beautiful new highway, big enough for everyone and in just a few years, it shrinks to almost nothing. Last time I drove to the airport you could barely move the road was so clogged up.
I think I read somewhere that in Portland OR. they are no longer building out, but building up to keep the sheep from moving further away from the city.
People in the rural areas will be forced to move to the city… and those greenspaces around the cities will be no more than wide open federal lands requiring permits to access. Seems Asimov had some comments on cities of the future wrt city living…
Or Yevgeny Zamyatin.
Ya think that might be what the Proggs’ have in mind, Entropy?
Next we’ll be under domes with glowing crystals in our palms…..
We’re past the looking glass here, people. Now they’re doing Monty Python!
“Poo-poos?!“
I have averaged 42,000 miles a year for the last 3 years, so I offer a hearty FUCK YOU to Sec LaHood and his band of fellow travelers in the Obumblefuck administration.
And I would offer the same hearty FUCK YOU. were I to average 5000 miles a year.
75000+ road miles in just my job alone. So, I’m with JD … FUCK YOU.
Any government with unchecked power has the ability and resources to steal everything you ever had or will have, and furthermore, to cloak their actions in terms of nobility, i.e., “we’re only doing it for the chirren”, “we must stop global warmening”, etc.
Yep.
Yevgeny Zamyatin.
i stole that book from villanova library. i’ll send it back for a fund raiser.
Give us a song, nr. It’s Friday.
Here you go, bh.
There we go, Pablo.
i also “stole” proust’s “À la recherche du temps perdu” from a book club
those were the days my friend et al
Yeah, I’ve got a whole stack’s worth of books that bare fallacious stamps falsely claiming they are the property of public or elementary school libraries.
All lies. They are mine.
Not my copy of ‘We’, however. I bought that off amazon.
These might be clever comments but they are not songs.
Pay the piper. It’s Friday.
Neil Young – Heart Of Gold
oh there’s an armadillo here:
link
Ahhh, that’s the good stuff.
Not like this. (Yes, people actually email me these things.)
Thelonious Monk – Epistrophy
Better Idea: We turn bike paths and walking trails into toll ways. That way the fucking highway monies can be spent on the highways.
Or we cut out the gov’t middleman. Instead of kicking back a piece of the road repair/maintainance contract monies to the politicians via campaign contributions, we just sell sections of the highways to the repair companies and they can collect tolls for maintaining them. (I’m sure tolls have already been discussed)
I also think we could assess fees on electrics and hybrids based on average annual gas consumption by class comparable traditional combustion engine vehicles.
Leave it to Ernst to harsh everyone’s mellow with brain thoughts.
oh heck: Glenn Miller & His Orchestra – Tuxedo Junction
link
Anyone who lived in my building in the mid 90’s will “fondly” remember this as the song we blasted at “10” on the stereo every time we’d stagger in drunk at 4 am.
Vass ist diss “mellow” you speak ov? How does vun arsch it?
watch out for the right wingers
that right hand is a problem could be arnold
link
I guess we can rule newrouter out as a Catholic.
Darleen –
You are white and alive, therefore you are EEEEVIIIILLLLLL! Bunny Ears says so…
“The gas tax is a mileage tax — and a progressive one at that. Because I only get 12-14 mpg in my truck, I pay more per mile than some green geek in a Prius.”
Well, M-hehee, I think that 12 miles per gallon is WAY better than driving a Prius, and worth every penny it costs. And even a Prius is better than a Volt.
They sold, what? – 238 Volts in February? Go, baby, go! That’s what happens when a guy with really stupid looking ears takes over your car company.
Organize that, fuckin’ Bozo.
JD, and my husband, would pay an extra $8000 just for the privledge of driving to work (based on a modest .20 per mile – suggestions from the CBO report varied between .10 to .50 depending on time and location.) I gave it a modest .20 for all miles. $800. A trip to visit grandma? Add in another $20 (each way).
We just bought a hybrid – Honda insight. It was priced under $19,000, and gets up to 59 miles per gallon. I thought we were being responsible? Ha. Naw, we’re just cheap and trying to save money on gas.
Obama and his fucktards can kiss my ass. Him and his commie group of nudgers need to be sent packing.
And my (foreign – made in Japan) car is loads better than that Volt, with it’s 25 miles before it needs to be recharged, and under 30 MPG afterwards. Not to mention that Motortrend’s Car of the Year costs twice as much.
insull
That is, unless some savior comes along and brings us, say, high speed rail.
Well, that was my plan until Ickes ran me right off the continent.
Grab a third rail, Harold.
Carin – those clowns deserve a swordfish.
Suddenly my odometer doesn’t work.
Mueller, your odometer won’t be the issue; it will be the GPS beacon in your engine electronics which will disable your engine without a signal from the Borg collective.
“Drivers seat” Sniff an the Tears