Shelby Steele, “Why the GOP Can’t Win With Minorities.”
Discuss.
And don’t be afraid to point out that you’ve heard it all before — even if you did hear it from one of the worst writers and thinkers EVAH!
Ahem.
(thanks to sdferr)
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Moved from the 500+ comment thread to here with a correction I saw after posting.
Sdferr,
Thank you for the wsj link, even with the mixup. He makes some good points but the advise is just to keep trudging through this hell and eventually there will be an escape.
The Liberal Left can impose the most appalling schemes on minorities. Schemes which destroy those they claim to be helping and spread havoc through all society. And yet, and yet they are absolved of all by their loudly insistent self proclamation of good intentions. Intentions they wrap as a shield around themselves while also proclaiming all of conservatives as covered thick in bad intentions.
This in the field not only of actions, but of speech too. For conservatives even if they do good, even if they never offer an offense, in word or deed, are contemptible because their intentions are always bad.
This partly, is too me, what the furor over Intentionalism is about. They, the Left, assign intentions to groups. Intentionalism assigns it to individuals and investigates and judges it on a case by case basis. If they lose that shield, of preassigned good intent, they will have to answer for their results.
K…also moved from the other thread at Sdferr’s request.
Sorry Sdferr, I did think that was from Michael, but either way I object to America having a legacy of disgrace, for the reasons I stated.
I see America being born in a time when slavery was accepted (much as abortion is now, not universally viewed as morally right, but accepted within our law abiding society, a difference being at the time of slavery in America, it was a universal practice from time immemorial), and being a key player in it’s abolition.
If you want to view yourself as carrying some sort of legacy of disgrace, have at it, but I reject it as a premise, with regards to Americans having some sort of special evilness we must atone for.
As I said two threads ago, it’s because the left (the Democrats in this case) have seductively whispered in the ears of all the identity groups: “You’re special and you’re different. You haven’t had a fair shake because you’re different and we’ll give you what you deserve, because you really are special.” It’s a simple and reassuring message.
When everyone is different and empowered…nay entitled…they are easier to please and easier to control.
The message of the right: that everyone has something in common, and that individuals should be empowered…but result will vary bases mostly on merit. This is a message that is complex, and a little bit scary.
Given a choice between the simple and the complex, people choose the simple. Given a choice between the reassuring and the scary, people chose the reassuring. It’s basic human nature.
That the left pulls this dishonest crap with minorities is only because minorities have more obvious superficial differences from the majority. If the left could figure out how to divide the majority in ever finer groups, they would. Give them time and they surely will.
The left understands power relationships all too well: play your subjects off each other and they will never seriously challenge you. They also understand a basic tenet of information warfare all too well: a simple lie always defeats a complex truth.
Steele:
What will happen to the left though, geoff, should this good thing, human dignity, become an object desired, a positive pursuit of minority populations, stirred up in them by they know not what, some moving urge within, become tired of the emptiness pawned off in the marketed campaigns for lo these many years? What happens when the solid thing takes hold? I wouldn’t want to be selling what the left is selling when that day comes.
at this point don’t you have to go against the Demorat party and everything it has done to America? segregation, palmer raids, bussing, jim crow, prohibition, eugenics, welfare. f$$k these folks and their lackeys.
It isn’t, and won’t be, ever, a matter of how I view myself, lee. It is about my country though. And it is a matter of great disgrace, whether done right along with all the other transgressing nations or no. The reason it is a disgrace is the reason this nation is truly great. Liberty for all. That is it in a nutshell. I can’t see how we can prize that phrase above all others and yet refuse to condemn slavery as an awful evil.
Obama fingers anyone?
No thanks, Joe. If you read the fine print they only used middle fingers.
“I can’t see how we can prize that phrase above all others and yet refuse to condemn slavery as an awful evil.”
Okay, Sdferr. Slavery is evil. As evils go it was pretty bad. Not quite as bad as the Holocaust (while the Middle Passage was a horror, you had a better than 50% chance of surviving it). Nevertheless, a life time of bondage for you and your children is right up there as a pretty horrible evil.
Whether you view the Civil War (or as some call it the War of Northern Aggression) as some geo political struggle, fact is it was about slavery. 600,000+ died fighting it. Twice that number were injured. If there was a collective sin for slavery, that war did a lot to pay some of the blood debt.
I do not want to gloss over history, the good or the bad. Slavery has obviously had a profound affect on the country and especially the black community. But to say folks 150 years later, none of which were slaves or slave holders, have to live in shame because of slavery? I do not think so.
We can’t, yet the complex truth is this nation would have died aborning if that question/fight hadn’t been put off for another day. That it was put off is a shame. That it was put off in a manner that guaranteed it would be dealt with in time is to the good side of the ledger.
Who here has claimed anyone must live in shame, Joe? No one that I can see.
Michael Steele is shallow precisely where Shelby Steele is deep. I think Shelby Steele is one of those rare truth tellers, someone for whom the truth is near to a religious devotion, someone who would rather suffer pain incurred by facing a hard truth than enjoy some empty pleasure by facilely turning away.
There is going to be pain, lots of it, dealing with the problems of race Steele has laid out before us. The key, I think, is to focus on the truths we have to tell, learn to be a little proud of them, learn to insist our truths are heard in the square. Be honest about them though. If they are of necessity boring, say so. If they take slow steady gains to make themselves felt, say so. If a free market results in change that displaces as it creates, make it clear. But go further, explain why they are so almighty important, demonstrate the myriad of connections they lead to, show why they make human life better and not worse.
By todays standards, slavery is an awful evil, 300 years ago, not so much. It was just a fact of life.
Never mind that Obama’s father is Kenyan, thus no “slave blood”, and it’s as likely Obamas family was on the selling side rather than the sold side.
Anyway, I’m not playing the redemption game. I don’t think I owe anything extra to the lucky minorities who find themselves living in America these days, rather than a hut in Kenya like Obamas brother.
Mr. Steele writes as if there’s a force in modern politics called “conservatism.” Might wanna run that past Orrin Hatch.
No one is suggesting you play the redemption game, lee. Quite the contrary. Steele flat out says you can’t, you’ve no tools to do it with. You’ld lose if you tried.
I’m suggesting with Steele that we, we conservatives offer everyone this: “human rather than racial dignity”. Maundering on about Obama’s Kenyan descent won’t cut it, lee.
The morality of the left is highly situational. It is a house of cards built on a foundation of jello.
Minorities are too easily swayed by dirty socialists. They should grow up.
The right has ever been about the business of advancing human dignity for indivduals (at least since the founding of the Republican party anyway). Let me short ciruit the criticiam immediately: it has been a process and not an event. The right has been an imperfect champion.
Yet the right is well grounded in advancing, and perserving, basic idividual human rights.
A force hf? I don’t see a force.
I do see a principled idea. One that happens to comport with the improvement of human life and self respect.
Not sure I’d frame it quite so bluntly, happy. Just saying that it’s human nature to want to be affirmed. The left has been very good at singling out groups and increasing their sense of apartness, then affirming them within the leftist context.
It’s dishonest, and manipulative. It’s also very effective if you can take a long view (which the leftists have,traditionally).
If we want to play wale on the left, one particular thing we know is that their schemes just don’t work. Not now, not ever. They are written in fail. And knowing that, I’d say get ready, because the time will be soon coming to fix the mess they’re going to leave.
Maybe I’m just a bad person but I thought that was blah blah blah, Sdferr. America doesn’t have shames except for it’s empowered a bunch of dirty socialist whores. The Conservative Ones are navel-gazing while the new and promisingly robust party of Not Dirty Socialists is chewing its way through America’s stomach lining like one of them Alien critters I think. George Soros and his little pezzydential duppy pog are too ridiculous to need dogmatic opposition. What a farce.
oh. I think we basically said the same thing.
Yes sdferr, but I fear that while the ants have been industrious, the grasshoppers have been playing. The winter of our discontent is a comin’.
I wish we didn’t have to see how bad things can get before they must be fixed, I fear that the progressives don’t mind flirting with bad results.
Seth – that makes sense to an extent but people are responsible for the dirty socialist dipshits what they put in our little White House I think. And there’s just no excuse for this nonsense ideological or otherwise. National Service I piss on you head.
Missed it by…
…all but that much.
Steele’s a decent guy whose life’s work is politics, so he sees aspiration in it. BZZZT.
Politics is low shit. In it, identification precedes thought — what passes there for thought — and determines it. So any pitch aimed at anyone already other-identified is a personal affront that’s likely only reinforce his other-identification. (See: the other Steele.)
The windows for pre-emptive alter- or dis-identification are closed to Republicans, well closed, smartly closed, and can’t now be un-closed.
Marginal cases are marginal.
When everyone now living is dead, some things will be different. Until then, this.
Shrug at it.
“Fuck ’em all” optional. It doesn’t matter.
An openly genocidally racist party would get as many of its hate-objects’ votes as the GOP does from its non-hate-objects. More, historically.
Don’t care. It’s mean.
The Left at times, these times especially, appears as this colossus striding across the earth. Unstoppable in it’s maelstrom of destruction. In my darker moments that is what I see.
But the Left, they too have their nightmares. By they, I mean those in the power elite, their nomenklatura. They know of all the horrible, ghastly things they have done. By force of words alone they keep that day of reckoning at bay. Theirs is a brittle power. When the words finally lose their power to protect them, they will fall fast. Like their love of younger days the USSR.
I’m sorry but I have to go and do about a two hour job at my work. I will return to this thread around 2 am eastern.
Absolutely happy. The great mass of the wise majority got exactly what they voted for…whether they had the intelectual curiosity to find out what that really was or not. And those that thought they did understand what they were voting for don’t seem to have thought things through to actual consequences.
They never do. Progressives…thinking things through, that is.
Time for bed, my sentence structure is going to pot moreso than normal.
I’ll leave you with a thought: until such time as the right can take the shine off of the distortions and outright lies of the left, we’ll be stuck sucking thin gruel.You can take that to the bank…so long as there are any left, that is.
You have to learn to think the way leftists think. Jeff gives us much insight into this, as does Evan Sayet
Slavery was bad. We recognize that the Anglosphere led the fight to end slavery, but according to leftist thinking, because it didn’t end sooner, that makes us just as bad as the countries that had it longer (or even still have it today). No, not just as bad… it makes us worse than those countries. Because leftist thinking cannot find Western Civilization to possess any values superior to those of The Other cultures, instead it must tear down the former and elevate the latter. It is forced to magnify our evils to serve as the Root Causes that more than justify every atrocity committed against us.
We can see the same reasoning in the manufactured failures in Katrina response (and Sebelius’ transparently pathetic attempt to do the same with Greensburg) and up-armoring of Humvees. No matter how quickly FEMA/NG aid got to victims, or vehicles were modified to new specifications, it wasn’t quick enough. It is trivial to point to that window of time between the catastrophe and the response, or the establishment of new standards and their implementation, and say “See how George Bush hates black people in NOLA” or “Chimpy McHitlerburton cares more about his corporate cronies than the service men (disproportionately of color!) left at risk with inadequate protection”.
Conveniently, when libs are in power, the same (or even greater) failures are excused because they care more than we do, and their good intentions trump the manifest failures of their policies. Steele gives us this mentality as the explanation for why minority voters keep voting for the party of Robert Byrd.
Neither will going along with the premise America has a legacy of disgrace. Fuck that noise. Appealing to human rather than racial dignity sounds nice and all, but what is the incentive for minorities to give up their lucrative race grievances?
“Yeah, you’ll have to take responsibility for your high drop out, incarceration, and out of wedlock birth rates, but at least no one will be politically pandering to you”
I guess I’m missing the practical strategy for conservatives convincing minorities to give up racial identity for human dignity. Can anyone tell me how we do that while maintaining our conservative principals? I can’t see where Steele did.
Also, what Monster said.
Steele didn’t. And wouldn’t.
I think the point I made above to geoff was that one day they may choose, not that one day we might convince them to choose. Why will they choose to change? It’s in their interest and that will suddenly be apparent? Who knows? Maybe boredom with the same old same old and happening to notice something better somewhere else. Makes no difference why though. If done, it’s done. Barking on and on about legacies seems pointless to me. The past is past and fixed (more or less, so long as we’re not dealing with a Stalin or an Orwellian nightmare.) If you don’t want to look at it, that’s your choice. But I’m not going to be holding out for a day when the opinions of many millions who believe the grief of slavery weighs heavier (not my opinion, by the way) than the greatness of the Declaration will suddenly flip on its head and they will see the light.
I do too. My own history is what encourages me. I spent my late teens and well into my twenties enmeshed in leftism. A foot soldier like, I suppose, the many who worked for Obama. I became disillusioned during Carter and then a few books opened my eyes to just what I was supporting, it’s legacy. The flip happened almost over night. I’ve opposed them ever since.
I hope that by keeping the information about what the Left is and does available Always taking them on to show what’s behind that pretty mask, that others will come to see them as they are, and disown them.
The Liberal Left can impose the most appalling schemes on minorities. Schemes which destroy those they claim to be helping and spread havoc through all society.
Hey. The only reason their programs haven’t worked is because the racism of the GOP keeps everyone down. Otherwise, everything would be just ducky.
If you haven’t seen Breitbart on Maher’s program, go watch, but only on an empty stomach. Dude what was with Breitbart kept using the phrase “code words,” and Andrew gamely tried to swat down the notion but the dude was in leftist filibuster mode.
You know how they do: run down a laundry list of talking points so fast and so furious that you can’t get a word in edgewise. Me, I’d have smacked him upside the head. I got nothing to lose that way.
Those shows make me yearn for the days of dueling.
did Breitbart play with his nipples any? not sure I could bring myself to watch otherwise.
ah, RS McCain has the clip here third one down.
Caution, analogy alert.
The Left is a flim-flam man. An artist pretending to be an architect. They draw these beautiful, wonderful, amazing structures. Ones never conceived before. Building that can do, well, buildings like this one. Perpetual motion machines, everything free to all forever. Drawings of that which they promise build once given the money and power to do so.
People flock to them. Everyone wants to have one of those built just for them. Why once you have that, all things will be yours with a wave of your hand. Perfect, perfection, but.
Along comes a real architect and artist. He looks at the drawings, laughs, and points. See, see, right here is where you are being tricked. This can never be built. It is a trick, an illusion. He expects to be praised for showing them how they were about to throw their money, their lives away on this trick, this scheme.
Instead most of them turn on him, reviling him for squashing, or trying as they see it, to take away their dreams, those wonderful airy dreams of that forever perfect life. They storm away, saying vile things about the architect as they are leaving.
A few stay and they ask,
“Show us again where it is that we have been fooled”.
“Show us how to see as you see.” Thus does the process of learning to see the real begin.
Protein Wisdom. Jeff G.’s School of Architecture and Art.
As long as the violations of some citizens’ rights is seen as the solution to the problems of racism, those problems will never be resolved. The very process of pretended redemption Steele references perpetuate the conflict.
It brings to mind an old aphorism: if you want something done right, do it yourself. I haven’t heard that one in years. The point is that Conservatives/Classic Liberals offer the chance to improve your own lot; progressive offer to fix it for you. One requires effort on your part, the other offers an easy way out, one that fails time after time.
Think of the government as an auto mechanic. They can fix what’s broke, but they seem to keep finding other things wrong that keep you coming back. You keep ponying up cash for repairs in an addictive relationship, even though you are never fully satisfied with the car you brought in. You may be even more dissatisfied with the car than you were at the beginning. And in the end, you may spend more repairing the car you don’t like than if you bought a replacement that you would like. But fixing it was easier. You paid to fix it bit-by-bit. You have a sunk cost that you would have to consider lost when you replace the car.
Minorities have a comparable relationship with the Democratic party. If you spend more money and give up more freedom, will fix it for you. They never consider replacement as an option, because they are so invested in repair.
[…] at the front pages, Jeff links to Shelby Steele, who makes many of the same arguments that Jeff’s been making for he past . . . well, […]
“conservatism is simply racism by another name”
QED.
Maybe the Republicans should focus on majorities instead of minorities. Just a thought.
“You have a sunk cost that you would have to consider lost when you replace the car.”
In reality, sunk costs are lost regardless, because you can’t unsink them. But people are irrational, and don’t want to admit that those sunk costs never should have been sunk in the first place. At some point, one decides not to spend “bad money after good” (or is it the other way round?).
That’s just crazy talk.
Maybe the Republicans should focus on majorities instead of minorities. Just a thought.
Exactly. Yet the WSJ continues to advocate immigration policies that make matters worse. As long as the victimization multicommunist template infects academia, the government and the media, immigration (at least as it stands) will only make things worse. Will the WSJ ever learn?
It seems to me that the only, teeny-tiny chink into which a wedge might be inserted begins:
What’s it got you?
That is, if your support, your living, comes from people who resent “giving” it to you, are you getting respect? If you want to be recognized for your uniqueness and contributions to society, is compelling people at gunpoint to acknowledge that actually accomplishing anything?
Regards,
Ric
For a small number of people, mostly on the Left because they receive huge rewards, having the power to force others to do their will is the essence of life. They have woven an intricate web of lies and deceit. Beautiful, gorgeous and false.
This web of words and promises is what binds the vast majority to them, in service, in servitude. What you propose is a good knife to cut through it.
Okay, I’ll admit it. I was a little surprised when Mr. Steele ended the essay with OUTLAW!
The article brings up some interesting points, but I’m a LOT more interested in reaching out to our new, hard-working, self-reliant, (actual) black African immigrants than I’ll ever be to the “black/African-American” community of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton.
As for Hispanics/Latinos- if we just stop saying things like:
“We’d take the War on Terror more seriously if the government would control the (Mexican) border!!”
or otherwise pretending that Mexico is as dangerous as Pakistan,
or thinking that Latin American immigrants are pressing for same-sex marriage, abortion on demand and a war on Christmas,
…that would go a long way towards reaching out social and political goals.
John Gibson’s radio show the other day came to pretty much the same conclusion that Psycho did above; Gibson’s suggestion, to me though, made a lot of sense: forget the black vote (as per Shelby Steele), the GOP will never win it over. Concentrate instead on the Hispanic vote.
Feh. It’s not really a racial thing, although the poor education afforded many of our minorities exacerbates the situation. Consider:
By definition 50% of the population are below average. And who populates the left side of the bell curve? Well, Churchill was right: “If you’re not a liberal at 20, you have no heart, whereas if you’re not a conservative at 40, you have no brain”. Consider how many of the leftards who appear in these fora have limited spelling and writing skilz, further evidence of either lack of education, lack of brain, or both.
So.. The natural constituency of the left are the youth, who lack experience, and those of any age who have no brain. To them “From each according to his ability, to each according to his need” sounds good. In their heart of hearts they know they lack ability and/or experience and would get the short end if forced to compete on a level field, but they have great needs. The left promises to fulfill their needs, the right promises a level playing field.
In their position which would you choose?
Okay, enough flattery. Off to drink green beer.. Or drink beer until I turn green.
Jeff is too self-effacing to mail this thing all over the right leaning blogosphere saying I told you so. That doesn’t mean the rest of us should be. :)
As for Hispanics/Latinos- if we just stop saying things like:
“We’d take the War on Terror more seriously if the government would control the (Mexican) border!!â€
or otherwise pretending that Mexico is as dangerous as Pakistan,
The narco-terrorism in the border towns is getting dangerous. Perhaps up in Minnesocold that hasn’t hit yet, but in San Diego (and in a host of other Cali cities) it has. To say nothing of cross border crime.
or thinking that Latin American immigrants are pressing for same-sex marriage, abortion on demand and a war on Christmas,
Problem is, the Commiecrats who do press for cultural destruction promise the immigrants a bunch of welfare and Affirmative Racism, and get their votes anyway!
John Gibson’s radio show the other day came to pretty much the same conclusion that Psycho did above; Gibson’s suggestion, to me though, made a lot of sense: forget the black vote (as per Shelby Steele), the GOP will never win it over. Concentrate instead on the Hispanic vote.
That won’t work either. Does the term Aztlan ring any bells?
The narco-terrorism in the border towns is getting dangerous.
…then we should focus (like a laser beam) on the drug gangs and cease trying to stop nearly ALL immigration (legal or “illegal”) from Mexico- in other words, use our resources more efficiently or just better prioritize them.
Perhaps up in Minnesocold that hasn’t hit yet, but in San Diego (and in a host of other Cali cities) it has.
Oh, we’ve got plenty of Latin American immigrants up here in frickin’ “Minne-so-cold” (sweet Jesus…), Curmudgeon. And they’re rather well-behaved, too.
To say nothing of cross border crime.
Well, we’d probably get a lot more cooperation from Mexican immigrants on either side of the border if we weren’t wasting our resources trying to track down every last immigrant for simply crossing the frickin’ border.
Problem is, the Commiecrats who do press for cultural destruction promise the immigrants a bunch of welfare and Affirmative Racism, and get their votes anyway!
…they also don’t conflate Mexican immigration issues with our continuing struggle against the radical variant of Islamism in general (or against groups like Abu Sayyaf, Lashkar-e-Taiba, or Al Qaeda in particular).
The Democrats are simply taking advantage of the opportunity we’ve freely handed to them to capture the Hispanic vote that the Republican base mostly doesn’t want. It’s just really hard to persuade a Mexican-American to vote for you if you keep comparing Mexico to Somalia/the Middle East, or Mariachi music to some Muslim Adhan.
I agree, Chris, I think we should do two things:
create a secure border, and–under REPUBLICAN leadership–vastly increase the numbers of legally immigrating Mexicans we let in.
…secure border…
Uh huh. Replace all the coal-fired power plants with perpetual motion machines of the third kind, then start on the “secure border”. It’ll be good practice.
Regards,
Ric
Well, we’d probably get a lot more cooperation from Mexican immigrants on either side of the border if we weren’t wasting our resources trying to track down every last immigrant for simply crossing the frickin’ border.
What part of “illegal” don’t you understand, Chris?
Sorry, Chris. You just don’t get it. Hispandering will epic fail, just as blackpandering has. You can’t out-pander the Demunist masters of pandering.
In fact, importing an ever larger underclass simply busts out public schools and hospitals, and lowers wages for working class blacks, and Mexican Americans, and whites for that matter. All of which has already happened here.
When 1/3 of the jails here are filled with illegal aliens, and the rest of the prison population people who find legal work less and less rewarding, what do you expect.
When 1/3 of the jails here are filled with illegal aliens, and the rest of the prison population people who find legal work less and less rewarding, what do you expect.
It’s nice to know I don’t have to waste any more time arguing with Mr. Savage Nation, here (U.S. jails 1/3 full of illegal aliens, I tell ya!! Michael Savage and World Net Daily told me so!!!)
What part of “illegal†don’t you understand, Chris?
I don’t favor sanctuary cities- I want to change the law. It’s just time to end our long, stupid struggle against cigarettes, booze, handguns, marijuana, and mariachi music. I’m not a Libertarian- I just fear socialism, Stalinism and/or fascism more than I’ll ever fear “Yo Quiero Taco Bell”.
Sorry, Chris. You just don’t get it. Hispandering will epic fail
Oh shit- the State of California and your own personal life are more in danger of “epic failure” than the results of any political campaigning in the Hispanic community are (but don’t worry- you’ll always have Pat Buchanan :)
Chris, you are a dupe. 1/3 of CA prisons are that way. And I have no like for Pat Buchanan, a man who makes moral equivalence between Israel and the bloodthirsty islamunist savages who try to kill them. or Michael Savage. But he’s right about that.
But dupes like you know that you can’t answer issues substantively, so you just throw out smears and insults. You can’t answer about what has happened to the schools and hospitals and the wages for a lot of jobs out here, can you? No, of course not.
You are full of this romantic “open borders” nonsense, and you can’t face the fact that it has never worked that way for long.
1/3 of CA prisons are that way.
I keep hearing this on The Savage Nation but I never hear or read a source for this claim.
You can’t answer about what has happened to the schools and hospitals and the wages for a lot of jobs out here, can you?
Well, Texas seems to have gotten along just fine with its Mexican immigrant population without turning into a pathetic, whiny, insolvent failed-state like California.
You are full of this romantic “open borders†nonsense,
Not so much “romantic” as lacking a fear of anything Mexican.
and you can’t face the fact that it has never worked that way for long.
While I don’t remember reading any 19th or early-mid 20th century accounts of border fences, you’re right that America has never lacked for “know-nothings” and Charles Lindbergh isolationists- today it’s the Mexicans, yesterday it was the frickin’ Pollacks and Irish. Kinda makes it difficult to complain about Muslim Saudi “students” overstaying their visas if you’re throwing a shit-fit every time you encounter a pro-life, pro-traditional marriage Mexican Christian, don’tcha think?
I keep hearing this on The Savage Nation but I never hear or read a source for this claim.
Look it up for yourself. Rates are lower in other states obviously. The point stands; it’s too high.
Well, Texas seems to have gotten along just fine with its Mexican immigrant population without turning into a pathetic, whiny, insolvent failed-state like California.
Proportionally, Texas does not have as high a percentage. Proportionally, Texas is more white. Moreover, the citizens of Texas, white and brown alike, tend to have stronger extended family structures than rootless Californians and are thus more conservative to begin with.
But the voting disparity remains. Because an underclass of people, no matter how good many of them may be, will be more likely to be seduced by the welfare state Left. It’s as simple as that. And smearing me won’t change that.
Should Republicans recruit hard from the Talented One-Third of Mexican Americans who are regulars? Obviously, yes, just as they should from the Talented One-Tenth of African Americans. But racial and ethnic pandering is a fools errand, and it only alienates the “Reagan Democrats” / those seduced by the cult of Ross Perot in 1992 / working class independent voters / call them what you will, who are indispensable to Republican victory. Newt Gingrich won them back in 1994, only to have cheap labor greedheads and romantic saps like you alienate them with your “comprehensive immigration reform” frauds. And make no mistake about it, Bush’s approval ratings went into the toilet largely because of that issue. You are still full of this romantic “open borders†nonsense, statements from you like (legal or “illegalâ€) are proof.
Not so much “romantic†as lacking a fear of anything Mexican.
Once again, the smears and baiting because you have no substance. Facts are facts: an underclass of people, whatever their race, ethnicity or background, are more likely than not going to be seduced by the Demunist siren song of welfare goodies. If you want to reduce the poverty class of Left voters, stop importing them.
While I don’t remember reading any 19th or early-mid 20th century accounts of border fences,
Then you really are a dupe. Why do you think the Texas Rangers were in large part formed? To say nothing of Operation Wetback.
you’re right that America has never lacked for “know-nothings†and Charles Lindbergh isolationists- today it’s the Mexicans, yesterday it was the frickin’ Pollacks and Irish.
We didn’t have a “multicultural” cottage industry hampering assimilation back then like we do now.
But hey, since you are a fool who thinks he has a sense of history when he really doesn’t, fine. Let’s look at past immigrant waves (1840-1860 and 1880-1920). We had subversive Anarchists and Reds, Mafia goons, and rough street gangs (try looking up the orgin of the term “paddy wagons”), all of which were the products of too open a floodtide of immigration. Moves to restrain immigration, first during the Civil War upheaval, then in the 1920’s, were necessary correctives to give the nation pause to digest those who had been ingested. After a forty odd year floodtide since 1965, it’s time for another pause. You are a dupe with no sense of history if you can’t understand that. I bet you still believe that Sacco and Vanzetti were innocent, don’t you? Never mind the 1961 ballistics tests. And Emma Goldman was just a cute bomb-thrower, right?
Kinda makes it difficult to complain about Muslim Saudi “students†overstaying their visas
For the record, I married a Korean immigrant. So shut up with your miserable baiting.
if you’re throwing a shit-fit every time you encounter a pro-life, pro-traditional marriage Mexican Christian, don’tcha think?
I guess that explains the even higher rate of out of wedlock births among Mexican Americans than among white Americans, doesn’t it? Yes, dupey dupe, go look that up too.
And since when was deep spirituality a guarantee of conservativsm? After all, African Americans are deeply spiritual too.
Bottom line: Importing an impoverished underclass en masse is a bad idea. Given the millions, nay billions, who want in, it makes sense to pick the most skilled, most culturally compatible, “the best and brightest”.
And given the academic, government and media charlatans that our blogger Jeff Goldstein here rails against, who exploit any and all real or imagined racial and ethnci slights, it makes sense to curtail immigration until these radical academia, goverment and media parasites are hounded out of their posts.
Nothing will change until republicans and conservatives are as bold in telling the truth as leftists are in telling lies.
Take for instance, “Black Leaders”. Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are not one damn bit different than David Duke except for the color they claim to represent. While David Duke is a pariah and rightly and universally considered a filthy fucking bigot; Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson are called the voice of a negro nation. Meanwhile, these two fucks are indistinguishable from Klansmen in their views, attitudes and goals. The only difference is color.
Shame is the only thing that will bring so called minorities to vote for conservatives. When they are as ashamed of fuckwad bigots like Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton and the rest of the hate filled scum who make up the list of “Black Leaders” in and out of government, they might at least consider it. Until then, no way.
And the onus is exclusively on Republicans and conservatives to make this happen. The left won’t do it, and so far the right isn’t even engaging them on it. Shit, can you imagine how delicious it would be to see these fucks have to defend their bigotry?
Its that or nothing. Nothing is whats being done now.
Shame is the only thing that will bring so called minorities to vote for conservatives. When they are as ashamed of fuckwad bigots like Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton and the rest of the hate filled scum who make up the list of “Black Leaders†in and out of government, they might at least consider it. Until then, no way.
The only problem here is that these people like Jackson, Sharpton, etc. have no sense of shame; in fact, they have a sense of entitlement. I think a better approach is to point out how treasonous and un-American they are. I am reminded of elections in 1988, 1992 and 1996 where Dukakis and Clinton said something to the effect of “Waah! You’re questioning my patriotism!” To which I kept hoping the Republican reply would be something to the effect of “Damn right, you commie leftovers, given what and who you support, why the hell shouldn’t we?”
Look it up for yourself. Rates are lower in other states obviously. The point stands; it’s too high.
. . . .
I guess that explains the even higher rate of out of wedlock births among Mexican Americans than among white Americans, doesn’t it? Yes, dupey dupe, go look that up too.
Mr. Curmudgeon, you yourself can’t provide us with any source for your claims. Just how are we supposed to “look up” information that doesn’t exist?
You want ’em, dupe? You got em: Real quick off the cuff Google search!
Out of wedlock births: here , and here and hare . Shall I go on?
For the record, I married a Korean immigrant. So shut up with your miserable baiting.
Sure, and Lou Dobbs is apparently married to a Mexican- but he’s still a disgrace.
Real quick off the cuff Google search!
Well, it’s a start. I’ll go through the City Journal article and the rest of your “Google search” later.
So where are you getting the “1/3 of the California prison population is made up of illegal aliens”?
Moreover, the citizens of Texas, white and brown alike, tend to have stronger extended family structures than rootless Californians and are thus more conservative to begin with.
I still don’t see why you’re blaming the Mexicans for the sorry, pathetic state of California. What will you blame them next for, the 1967 “Summer of Love”? The Berkley City Council?
(try looking up the orgin of the term “paddy wagonsâ€),
OK, so are you Jamestown, or Mayflower? I feel like I’m debating Daniel Day Lewis in “Gangs of New York” . . .
Bottom line: Importing
I didn’t know immigration was covered by the WTO . . .
an impoverished underclass en masse is a bad idea.
Oh, I dunno- you Californians could use the elbow grease.
Given the millions, nay billions, who want in
channeling Cosmos . . .can you hear us, Carl Sagan . . .
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