I usually only post when I have something whimsical to contribute, but not today. As an adopted person I am infuriated by this story. Everyone involved in this “experiment” should go directly to Hell.
I found my birth mother a couple years back when I was worried about the breathing problems I was having at the time.
I have a half brother on that side, and 7 (or so, I can’t recall) half brothers and sisters on my birth father’s side. He had passed away, so I never got to meet him.
I haven’t met any of my half siblings, either. But I’m always curious about them.
For one thing, I was the oldest in my adopted family, but I would have been a second child had my birth mother not put me up for adoption. I’m sure that would have changed dynamics a bit — so there’s always the “what if?” part of finding out about your birth parents and biological relatives.
At any rate, I’m sure my being adopted explains why I want to beat trolls with my COCK. Somehow.
happyfeet was adopted. Some lady in Texas got pregnanted by some engineer guy she wasn’t married to and she was already like a single mom or something. The details are vague – it was a closed adoption, which is the proper way to go about these things I think. Open adoptions are kind of trashy I think, though I have seen them work out just fine.
Viola Bernard, a child psychologist and consultant to the agency, had firmly believed that twins should be raised separately to improve their psychological development, and that dressing and treating them the same retarded their minds.
Teh science of psychology at work! Inspiring, ain’t it? Hey, is this teh science that tells us homsexuality is irrevocably, purely genetic. I wonder what psychologists will believe in another thirty years?
Psychology is politicized pseudoscience, for the last 40 years.
This may be more legend than science, but I’ve heard it asserted that twins raised seperately, (unpressured by the need to establish an individuality, that twins raised together migh feel) actually end up being more alike in many respects, than twins raised together.
I wonder if that is really so.
My brother and sister were so different from me, I used to wish so hard for a twin. How horrible to take away that natural ally, a best friend and support, just to see what will happen.
more alike in many respects, than twins raised together.
If so, it could be that when raised together they have more of a need to establish their individual identities.
Many years ago I knew a pair of identical twins who had completely different personalities. Not so much “good twin/evil twin” as “nice twin/wild twin.” Not that the wild twin wasn’t nice, just … in a different way and, at that age, nicer.
While it is indeed criminal that the twins were separated at birth FOR AN EXPERIMENT, with parents like theirs (the natural parents), the decision to send them to adoptive parents may have been the best thing that could have happened. Those of us fortunate enough to have parents whose lifestyles were restricted by stilted, conventional values should be forever thankful.
Not adopted per se, but my parents divorced when I was an infant and my father went back to his country (Kenya). My step-dad never formally adopted me, but he’s the guy I consider to be ‘Dad.’
I’m about to meet the African face-to-face for the first time (I’m 46).
I just read the article and my first thought was that the “experimenters” were almost as cruel as certain other “experimenters”–notorious also for their work on various sets of Jewish twins.
I’ll keep good thoughts about your meeting…that’s gotta be all manner of anxiousness.
When I read about this “experiment” and the good doc’s attitude of entitlement I thought about the hubris of the infamous Dr. John Money of John Hopkins. He really destroyed several lives that we know of.
Jeff, I never took that plunge. My adoptive parents (who got me shortly after birth) made it plain from the beginning that they’d support any effort I wanted to make to learn, meet, etc. Which probably made it less likely that I’d feel driven to do it. Thus far (I’m 32) curiosity hasn’t struck me as a sufficient motive to open that Pandora’s box. I have some info (e.g., Benedick’s natural father + heroin = dead), but my I’m content to count myself lucky for falling in with a wonderful adoptive family and may never explore the almost-was.
Some things simply are imponderable. For example, it’s impossible that I should be as wonderful as I am had some other sperm been a little more rapidly flagellant.
I’ve long been over the “hating him” phase wrt to my bio-dad, but I’m more worried about how the family I *know* will take it. The Dad who nurtured me is a great guy, but he keeps his emotions well hidden, for the most part. He never had to deal with the ex-husband or the bio-dad issue, so he’s my main concern.
BTW, Dad didn’t want to adopt me because of my African surname (aka “middle name”) and the patronymic. Knowledge of one’s African culture is very prized among black Americans, since 99% of us have no knowledge of the cultures from which we are descended and that was Dad’s concern.
It would be interesting to know who else who posts here is adopted.
My wife ran across a story a few years back on a Chinese adoption board where a couple had just adopted their second child from China. Coincidentally (or not, I have no idea) the second child came from the same orphanage. People would ask them the nearly inevitable “are they sisters?”, to which the answer is always “yes, but”. But then they KEPT hearing it, and noticed that these girls strongly resembled each other. Suspecting that they’d adopted cousins, they had a DNA test done, and it came back that they were, in fact, sisters. Later they contacted the orphanage through an interpreter to ask why they weren’t told that their first child had a sister waiting to be adopted, and the reply was that it just hadn’t seemed all that important.
Not much surprises me, after that.
It’s possible that that story is really this one, but it’s also possible that similar screwups have occurred.
“What’s the old line?
If you have one child, you believe in nuture.
Have more than one, you HAVE to believe in nature.”
This is why I prefer to get my child rearing advice from people who have more than two children of their own. (Which lets out the *entire* staff of Parenting Magazine.)
I’m not adopted but my brother-in-law was and in this generation I’ve got three cousins who have adopted children, one adopted a girl from Georgia (I believe), one adopted two boys from Korea, and one was asked by one of her students who was pregnant if she would adopt the baby – she said yes.
So each of them is the evil twin?
I usually only post when I have something whimsical to contribute, but not today. As an adopted person I am infuriated by this story. Everyone involved in this “experiment” should go directly to Hell.
(Except the victims, of course.)
Jeff’s adopted. My wife’s adopted. It would be interesting to know who else who posts here is adopted.
I found my birth mother a couple years back when I was worried about the breathing problems I was having at the time.
I have a half brother on that side, and 7 (or so, I can’t recall) half brothers and sisters on my birth father’s side. He had passed away, so I never got to meet him.
I haven’t met any of my half siblings, either. But I’m always curious about them.
For one thing, I was the oldest in my adopted family, but I would have been a second child had my birth mother not put me up for adoption. I’m sure that would have changed dynamics a bit — so there’s always the “what if?” part of finding out about your birth parents and biological relatives.
At any rate, I’m sure my being adopted explains why I want to beat trolls with my COCK. Somehow.
Somebody should put together a study.
happyfeet was adopted. Some lady in Texas got pregnanted by some engineer guy she wasn’t married to and she was already like a single mom or something. The details are vague – it was a closed adoption, which is the proper way to go about these things I think. Open adoptions are kind of trashy I think, though I have seen them work out just fine.
Teh science of psychology at work! Inspiring, ain’t it? Hey, is this teh science that tells us homsexuality is irrevocably, purely genetic. I wonder what psychologists will believe in another thirty years?
Psychology is politicized pseudoscience, for the last 40 years.
This may be more legend than science, but I’ve heard it asserted that twins raised seperately, (unpressured by the need to establish an individuality, that twins raised together migh feel) actually end up being more alike in many respects, than twins raised together.
I wonder if that is really so.
My brother and sister were so different from me, I used to wish so hard for a twin. How horrible to take away that natural ally, a best friend and support, just to see what will happen.
Oh. I heard this story on the NPR but I wasn’t really paying attention and I thought they were talking about lesbians.
Sarah
You might actually be on to something. My grandsons (5 y/o) are idential twins. They are very close but also very different in personalities.
That aside, I’m just agog at the cavalier attitude that infants are just fine subjects, thank you so much, for experimentation.
Do advanced degrees require the abandonment of morality??
If so, it could be that when raised together they have more of a need to establish their individual identities.
Many years ago I knew a pair of identical twins who had completely different personalities. Not so much “good twin/evil twin” as “nice twin/wild twin.” Not that the wild twin wasn’t nice, just … in a different way and, at that age, nicer.
I wouldn’t throw away the guy’s data, so I think that makes me kind of a bad person too. I’d rather not think about that too much.
I think me and the girls need to get together for research and such…if you know whut I mean.
While it is indeed criminal that the twins were separated at birth FOR AN EXPERIMENT, with parents like theirs (the natural parents), the decision to send them to adoptive parents may have been the best thing that could have happened. Those of us fortunate enough to have parents whose lifestyles were restricted by stilted, conventional values should be forever thankful.
What’s the old line?
If you have one child, you believe in nuture.
Have more than one, you HAVE to believe in nature.
If there’s one set of twins in this ‘experiment’ then there’s another. Or more. Neubauer strikes me as the type to work in 3’s.
For the data…
Not adopted per se, but my parents divorced when I was an infant and my father went back to his country (Kenya). My step-dad never formally adopted me, but he’s the guy I consider to be ‘Dad.’
I’m about to meet the African face-to-face for the first time (I’m 46).
That’s got to be scary.
I’m not sure what to feel yet.
I just read the article and my first thought was that the “experimenters” were almost as cruel as certain other “experimenters”–notorious also for their work on various sets of Jewish twins.
Wow. Can you keep us posted about that? You might want to correspond with my wife about that sort of thing.
Baldilocks
I’ll keep good thoughts about your meeting…that’s gotta be all manner of anxiousness.
When I read about this “experiment” and the good doc’s attitude of entitlement I thought about the hubris of the infamous Dr. John Money of John Hopkins. He really destroyed several lives that we know of.
“Do advanced degrees require the abandonment of morality??”
Reference Eugenics and see who the proponents were and what they thought needed to be done.
The short answer is “yes”.
Jeff, I never took that plunge. My adoptive parents (who got me shortly after birth) made it plain from the beginning that they’d support any effort I wanted to make to learn, meet, etc. Which probably made it less likely that I’d feel driven to do it. Thus far (I’m 32) curiosity hasn’t struck me as a sufficient motive to open that Pandora’s box. I have some info (e.g., Benedick’s natural father + heroin = dead), but my I’m content to count myself lucky for falling in with a wonderful adoptive family and may never explore the almost-was.
Some things simply are imponderable. For example, it’s impossible that I should be as wonderful as I am had some other sperm been a little more rapidly flagellant.
I found my birthmother almost by accident. Turned out it was the lady who lived with us that we called ‘Mom’. Talk about uncomfortable!
If you are talking to me, will do.
Darleen,
I’ve long been over the “hating him” phase wrt to my bio-dad, but I’m more worried about how the family I *know* will take it. The Dad who nurtured me is a great guy, but he keeps his emotions well hidden, for the most part. He never had to deal with the ex-husband or the bio-dad issue, so he’s my main concern.
BTW, Dad didn’t want to adopt me because of my African surname (aka “middle name”) and the patronymic. Knowledge of one’s African culture is very prized among black Americans, since 99% of us have no knowledge of the cultures from which we are descended and that was Dad’s concern.
My wife ran across a story a few years back on a Chinese adoption board where a couple had just adopted their second child from China. Coincidentally (or not, I have no idea) the second child came from the same orphanage. People would ask them the nearly inevitable “are they sisters?”, to which the answer is always “yes, but”. But then they KEPT hearing it, and noticed that these girls strongly resembled each other. Suspecting that they’d adopted cousins, they had a DNA test done, and it came back that they were, in fact, sisters. Later they contacted the orphanage through an interpreter to ask why they weren’t told that their first child had a sister waiting to be adopted, and the reply was that it just hadn’t seemed all that important.
Not much surprises me, after that.
It’s possible that that story is really this one, but it’s also possible that similar screwups have occurred.
Oh. Yeah. Different stories.
I hate it when stuff like this makes me cry at work.
Many different stories, apparently.
“What’s the old line?
If you have one child, you believe in nuture.
Have more than one, you HAVE to believe in nature.”
This is why I prefer to get my child rearing advice from people who have more than two children of their own. (Which lets out the *entire* staff of Parenting Magazine.)
I’m not adopted but my brother-in-law was and in this generation I’ve got three cousins who have adopted children, one adopted a girl from Georgia (I believe), one adopted two boys from Korea, and one was asked by one of her students who was pregnant if she would adopt the baby – she said yes.