October 16, 2013

“Obamacare shock: $12,600 deductible, 40 percent co-pay, zero competition”

Wheeeee! Paul Bedard, Washington Examiner:

Many Americans shopping for better health insurance deals promised by the two-week-old Obamacare system are instead being slapped with rate shock, including savings-sapping deductibles and co-pays, according to multiple reports from around the country.

For some able to get the problem-plagued Obamacare website to work, the so-called “deals” the system is coughing up around the country include $12,600 deductibles, co-pays of up to 40 percent, zero competition, and rate hikes of 260 percent.

The huge cost increases that some Obamacare applicants are seeing are feeding the effort in Congress to change the system and delay implementation until January 2014.

The top Republican on the Senate health committee has collected several official and media reports of the Obamacare horror stories Americans have encountered so far. They include:

— A $12,600 deductible. CNNMoney reported that one family “found a bronze-level plan for roughly $357 a month, after their subsidy, which they could swing. But it comes with a $12,600 family deductible.”

— Enormous rate increases. A research group found that a 30-year-old male nonsmoker “will see his lowest cost insurance option increase 260 percent.”

— Some who already buy their own insurance are receiving cancellation notices — and offers for expensive new policies. The Christian Science Monitor reported on a North Carolina family who had been buying Blue Cross and Blue Shield insurance for $380-a-month. “BCBS is offering them a new plan for three times the cost, $1,124.50 a month, still with an $11,000 deductible,” reports the paper.

— A California couple said that the Obamacare policy suggested to them included a 40 percent increase in their doctor’s office co-pay. “Our co-pay skyrocketed from 0 percent to 40 percent and the maximum out-of-pocket increased an additional $2,300,” according to a letter in the Fresno Bee.

Kaiser Health News found a lack of competition in some pockets of the country. “Eighteen percent of counties have only one insurer offering plans and 33 percent of counties have only two insurers competing.”

— There is little uniformity to premiums charged around the nation. “For instance,” Kaiser also reported, “Cigna is offering 50-year-olds one of its midlevel plans for $614 if they live in Flagstaff, Ariz. That same plan, contracting with different hospitals and doctors, will cost $428 in Phoenix and just $395 in Nashville.”

But remember: the terroristic extremist wacko birds thought it best to stop this, while the “smart” Republicans thought it best not to put their own asses on the line, fighting a fight they determined they couldn’t win, but instead electing to wait until the people are so hurt by this abomination — and there will be deaths, suffering, delayed treatment, etc., as a result of this enormous bureaucratic clusterfuck, though hey, you need to sacrifice a few chickens if you’re going to make a GOP political omelet, Hobbits — that they either all die off or else vote in a full Republican ticket, giving the GOP the House, the Senate, and the Presidency.

— Which we will be told can only be won by a moderate.  Like Chris Christie.  Who didn’t sign on to the lawsuit to prevent it in the first place.

At which point we’ll find out that “the good parts” of ObamaCare will be retained, while the rest will be “fixed.”

For the bipartisan comity.  That being “the best we could hope for.”

That is, unless the follow-on to this is to push amnesty, with the help of the GOP.  At which point the influx of new welfare state voters will make a GOP victory all but impossible, and the “rebranding” of the Party complete:  they will have turned from the party of “angry old white people”  to “really really angry old white people who won’t vote for them, even if to do so would mean stopping the next leftist from taking office.  Because it no longer matters anyway.”

Admit it: you know I’m right, don’t you?

Posted by Jeff G. @ 1:31pm
214 comments | Trackback

Comments (214)

  1. - The tipping point, the event that broke the elephants back, so to speak, and sent the faux-Republican party scrambling to make sure nothing changes must have been that rather casual article this past week that showed that 50 of the states were starting to show definate signs of leaning Conservative which, you know, the ruling class just cannot allow. Next thing you know the rube electorate rabble will be making demands and voting on key issues, like a Republic is supposed to do.

    – They had to do something before a financial limit forced the Democratic wing of the National Fascist party to make dangerous concessions on their beloved Socialist agenda.

  2. BBH, I saw a map of the USA that showed all of the counties by voter pattern and it was bright red in the center and bleeding out to blue, where I’m afraid you folks are coding, on the edges. Alaska, mostly red except parts of Anchorage and Hawaii solid blue.

    Look for the return of “The Electoral College is stamping out the individual and must be overturned!” when Shrillary makes a move toward the throne. The EC is a favorite whipping boy of cheaters.

  3. I think it was in The Right Scoop, but I’m not certain.

  4. - There is yet one small light burning in the gloomy darkness, namely the Hastert rule, which if unfimiliar to you states that for any cloistered vote up bill a majority of the majority is required to pass. That means that at least 117 RINO’s, (I refuse to call them Republicans any longer), will have to vote yea for passage. Of course Bonehead can waive the House rules, and very likely will, but that at least is one small hope.

  5. Oh, but this can’t be right. Stevo is saving all kinds of money. He said so, and he wouldn’t lie, would he?

  6. The only problem with the Hastert Rule is that Hastert himself said an article a while back that there was no Hastert Rule. Of course, that was probably leftist bullshit in a leftist paper. So, take it with a peck of salt.

  7. “What’s this ‘$400/month with a $4000 deductible and 40% copay’ shit? I thought it was going to be free!” — random tattooed and pierced barista

  8. The Hastert rule is of the unwritten sort and Boner ignores it all the time.

  9. I was going ask him about his deductible yesterday, but decided to pass since his entire post was a lie.

  10. Kind of like Reagan’s eleventh commandment, Pablo?

    Speaking of the Gipper, if I hear Jugears invoke the name of RWR one more time, you’ll be able to hear me screaming all the way to RI.

  11. - SBP, its a game. They’ll cherry pick the few cases among millions that will be punished by this bullshit socialism in order to paint a happy face on Fascism. Basically there are two facts the Lefturds refuse to even discuss.

    * Approximately 15% of the population, those that for any reason have little or no source of viable income, other than possible governmental provided assistance in one form or another, are being paid for by the 51% of the population that work for a living and therefore pay taxes. (BTW, many of the 15% are the same people that voted for Bumblefuck. His base is made up of the hard assed Lefties + every sociatal misfit, deadbeat, slacker, free loader, and ner’do well in ‘Merica, particularly heavy in melleniums hiding in Daddys basement.)

    * If ObamaCrap were voted on in a national vote, state by state, it would never pass in the history of the world. It took the combined perfidity of both wings of the National Fascist Party to ram it down our throats.

  12. Admit it: you know I’m right, don’t you?

    In my heart even.

    So. Lemme see if I have this right: The GOP is looking at yet another forty years in the wilderness, but at least they’ll have dished the Tea Party and shown those tea baggers their place. Does that about cover it?

  13. - Also note that with all the “workers that have stopped looking and essentially left the work force” during Bumble shitheads rein I’m not at all confident that the 51% employed number any longer reflects reality.

  14. - It will be most interesting to find out who “Bennett” really is, assuming the drive-by press even covers this story. Since the early evidence is “pissed off union worker and loyal Lefturd commie” that may not happen.

  15. “I’m not at all confident that the 51% employed number any longer reflects reality.”

    I was going to mention that — I’ve heard that the productive are already below 50%, but don’t remember where I saw it.

  16. Barack Obama was right the first time: only a single-payer program can provide universal coverage, and only a single-payer program can control costs. – See more at: http://proteinwisdom.com/?p=51502#comments

    this country won’t last another 40 years

  17. So. Lemme see if I have this right: The GOP is looking at yet another forty years in the wilderness, but at least they’ll have dished the Tea Party and shown those tea baggers their place. Does that about cover it?

    And McCain says, “Nyah! Where’s your Constitution now, Cruzes? Nyah!”

  18. this country won’t last another 40 years

    The trigger has already been pulled, and it’s just a matter of time before it falls. What do you think will happen the first time that the EBT cards won’t work “for real”?

    It won’t just be looting of Wal-Marts and grocery stores by those “Youths of Undetermined Ethnic Origins” (because it would be RAAAACIST to note the most obvious facts about the crowds). But they will run into the uncomfortable fact that there are LOTS of people in the suburbs who also have weapons, and most of them are former military and police.

    There will be blood

  19. I’m no longer in the ‘productive’ category, but on purpose. Grey market is the way things will be from here on, just want a jump start on it. Hell, I’ll even barter

  20. Ammo and alcohol, alcohol and ammo…

    Those will be the two steady trade goods. Any man who can make both will be wealthy. (I do NOT use the word “rich” for a very specific reason.)

  21. “I’m no longer in the ‘productive’ category, but on purpose.”

    Yep. I hear you.

  22. Well, I’m a disabled vet who has (finally) retired after five careers and God only knows how many other jobs, but I can still man a post or post a man.

    And I’m a good shot, too.

  23. So, shall continue the fiction of calling Obama “President” or should we just go straight to petty tyrant of a dictator?

  24. I don’t think so. He’s just seized the power of the purse.

    Dictator works.

  25. Um, I’m paying $1400 / month for a family of four on Kaiser today. I’m looking at this plan, which is better coverage for less:

    $894 per month

    Health Net Health Plan of Oregon, Inc.
    CC10-100-1-1000DX
    POS
    10940OR0370001-01
    DEDUCTIBLE (I): $100c
    DEDUCTIBLE (F): $200c
    OOP MAX (I): $1,000c
    OOP MAX (F): $2,000c
    PRIMARY CARE VISIT: $10
    PLAN LEVEL:

    PLATINUM
    PRINT
    Compare
    In network
    m Indicates a Combined EHB Medical & Drug Deductible
    c – Indicates a Combined In Network and Out of Network Deductible
    * Indicates deductible required to receive benefit
    Plan costs

    Deductible
    Per Individual $100c
    Per Family $200c
    Out-of-pocket max
    Per Individual $1000c
    Per Family $2000c
    Primary care visit $10
    Prescription drug deductible
    Per Individual
    Per Family
    $0c
    $0c
    Prescription benefit
    Generic
    Preferred brand
    Non-preferred
    $10
    $20
    $40
    Plan benefit highlights
    Other office visits and hospitalization
    Preventive care No Charge
    Specialty office visit $50
    Urgent care $50
    Outpatient lab 10%
    X-ray 10%
    Imaging 10%*
    Hospitalization 10%*
    Emergency room $250/10%
    Ambulance 10%*
    Outpatient surgery 10%*
    Back to top
    Maternity
    Prenatal care 10%*
    Maternity and delivery 10%*
    Back to top
    Assistive care and durable medical equipment
    Rehabilitation 10%*
    Durable medical equipment 10%*
    Home health 10%*
    Hospice 10%*
    Back to top
    Other benefits
    Pediatric dental Not Covered
    Pediatric vision exam No Charge
    Pediatric eye glasses No Charge
    Vision Not Covered
    Acupuncture Not Covered
    Chiropractic Not Covered
    Naturopath Not Covered

  26. So, shall continue the fiction of calling Obama “President” or should we just go straight to petty tyrant of a dictator?

    Imperator Dei.

  27. I’d say “L’etat, c’est moi”, but it’s been done.

  28. “I’m looking at this plan, which is better coverage for less”

    Translation: you’re dumping your kids on the public dole, and chortling about it.

  29. Even assuming Stevo is telling the truth (a very generous assumption, to put it mildly), his experience is not the norm. No, not even in Haight Ashbury North.

    http://www.valuepenguin.com/oregon-health-care-cost-increases-under-obamacare

  30. You’re about a broke fuck, aren’t you, steve? That gubmint titty sure tastes sweet, eh?

  31. Even assuming Stevo is telling the truth (a very generous assumption, to put it mildly), his experience is not the norm.

    Given the size of the subsidy that would be required for those numbers to be true, there is no fucking way he’s currently, actually paying $16.8K/year on health insurance.

  32. Notice that there isn’t one single demographic group in that report that will see their premiums go down. Not one.

    So, I’d say that Stevo’s lie is thoroughly busted — unless he’s counting in a healthy “subsidy” (i.e., getting the rest of us to pay for his spawn).

  33. 29 House republicans have voted yea on the bullshit budget deal now.

    I think that’s it.

  34. Yeah, my calculations indicate that it’s a done deal. One Dem has defected, but I don’t expect many more.

  35. Nope, mistake. Idiot pressed the wrong button, apparently.

  36. Steve is a “Tommy Christopher” type who asks at a press conference if the Republicans will agree to delay heart attacks for a year if Obama delays ACA for a year and expects people to clap and whistle at the awesome sick burn he just spat. Instead people roll their eyes and pretend not to be sitting with him.

  37. @SBP he must have voted against it before he voted for it…

  38. 25 year ago I paid $150 a month/$500 deductible for a family plan. Blue Cross with eye care and dental.

    Those were the days.

  39. 57 Republican yeas now to 98 nays

    They probably think that counts as ass covering.

  40. Annnnd…. we’re done.

  41. Pablo, try it yourself:

    http://www.coveroregon.com/individual/browse

    Zipcode: 97232
    County: Multnomah
    Tribal Member: No
    4 people, ages 43, 42, 13, and 10. No one smokes
    Annual income: 250k

    Throw out everything but Gold and Platinum plans in the results that show up. Look at the HealthNet plans.

    Also, on the report showing everyone’s health costs going up – here’s two things about these kinds of analysis that might play in here.

    1. The cheapest plans are not an apples to apples comparison, as ACA plans likely cover more than the cheapest plans otherwise available.
    2. As to other prices, they are going off eHealthinsurance.com “first quotes”. These aren’t the prices you’ll actually end up being quoted after you answer the questionnaires and they find out that you’ve had a headache in the last 20 years. In other words, they didn’t actually *get* insurance at the eHealthinsurance rates.

    Final question – aren’t these super cheap plans still available? Can you still buy individual plans outside of the exchanges?

  42. “25 year ago I paid $150 a month/$500 deductible for a family plan. Blue Cross with eye care and dental.
    Those were the days.”

    Teddy Kennedy’s brilliant HMO reforms fixed that problem for you.

  43. Palaeo, even Bob Beckell said Christopher looked like he just got out of Bellvue.

  44. “Pablo, try it yourself”

    Link to your current coverage, liebot.

  45. This is the part where the cowards vote.

  46. “Final question – aren’t these super cheap plans still available?”

    No.

    Next!

  47. Oh, I don’t know that they’re actually illegal. However, buying one won’t excuse you from buying Obamacare. Not even if you’re a 60 year old woman (or single man) who feels that paying for maternity coverage isn’t strictly necessary.

    But hey, you and and your sperm donees get to freeload. How awesome that is for you.

  48. Vote ‘rat.

  49. SBP, fill out the form here with the same info and you’ll see the first Kaiser plan is $1410:

    https://kaiser.healthinsurance-asp.com/expressweb/plan/QuotingInformation.action?noScript=false&WT.mc_id=92131&WT.z_Site=BuyKP&WT.site=BuyKP#4

  50. “In other words, they didn’t actually *get* insurance at the eHealthinsurance rates.”

    It doesn’t sound like you’ve actually “got” insurance at your claimed rate either. So why haven’t you signed up?

  51. Do any of your current doctors take Obamacare?

  52. Why are all our trolls 1%ers? He needs Ocare like a hole in the head.

  53. Uh, yeah. Like, all of them. Kaiser has plans under the ACA. I could just move to a Kaiser ACA plan, but I’m strongly leaning towards getting out of Kaiser now that I can. And you can look at the networks for HealthNet, Providence, etc. and see who’s in-network for them too.

  54. “Uh, yeah. Like, all of them.”

    Uh, yeah. You’re lying. Again. Trick question, son. The fact is neither you nor anyone else has any friggin’ idea whether your doctor is going to take Obamacare.

    Hint: “takes your current Kaiser plan” doesn’t equate to “will take Kaiser’s Obamacare plan”.

  55. And I notice you didn’t answer the question about why you haven’t signed up.

  56. “Why are all our trolls 1%ers?”

    I doubt Stevo has ever made more than minimum wage in his life.

    His 250K job sure seems to give him a lot of free time to troll in the middle of the night.

    My guess: unemployed and unemployable.

  57. Fuck, SBP, ’cause I’m thinking about it and talk’n it over with the little woman. Don’t worry man, I’ll make sure the coverage don’t lapse boss.

  58. I’m guessing he lives with an older more responsible brother who had to turn his house into a wayward family member refuge after too many fuck ups in too short a time.

  59. And you can look at the networks for HealthNet, Providence, etc. and see who’s in-network for them too.

    the baracky controls you fool. have a “little debbie” on moi!!11!!

  60. I’ll make sure the coverage don’t lapse boss.

    the baracky sezs no fool

  61. Spies, he reminds me of Balloon Fence guy. What did he call himself?

  62. monkyboy.

  63. anyone else notice that ole stevie has no problem extolling the benefits of slavery?

    Yep, nothing says freedom of choice quite like a gun held to the head.

  64. “These bracelets are so darling, and the chains set off the brand on the back of my neck!”

  65. Was that timb? No, Stevo seems more literate.

    Note that Stevo’s “awesome” insurance company doesn’t yet list this plan in their provider search. It has about a dozen current plans, all of which have different provider networks.

    His blithe assumption that his existing doctors will take this new plan is idiotic on its face.

  66. “Uh, yeah. You’re lying. Again. Trick question, son. The fact is neither you nor anyone else has any friggin’ idea whether your doctor is going to take Obamacare. “takes your current Kaiser plan” doesn’t equate to “will take Kaiser’s Obamacare plan”.

    Kaiser is different. They have their own Drs. so there will be no difference there. With other plans, it will depend on the insurer. Some will have different networks for ACA vs non-ACA plans, some will have the same exact network.

  67. Wait, McGehee, that’s a brand? And all this time I thought it was the imprint of a boot heel.

  68. So, you’re currently paying $1400/month for an HMO? And you’d like us to be impressed by your intelligence and fiscal acumen? Heh?

  69. They have their own Drs.

    nice plantation nigga faggot

    5:15 Live

  70. All hospitals have their own doctors who are contracted. Kaiser was going broke last year.

    I think you’re getting bad advice.

  71. Was it alphie/alfie?

    It isn’t timb.

  72. _it will depend on the insurer._

    which 4 dickhead under O!care?

  73. Nothing says “Paid OFA shill” quite like the following: “Kaiser is different. They have their own Drs. so there will be no difference there. With other plans, it will depend on the insurer. Some will have different networks for ACA vs non-ACA plans, some will have the same exact network.”

  74. “Some will have different networks for ACA vs non-ACA plans, some will have the same exact network.”

    So you’re admitting that you were lying, then?

    Heathnet has CoverOregon grayed out. No doctors listed.

  75. stevie the “useful idiot of the proggtardia”™

  76. My Amish beard is growing very nicely, but I’m having trouble milking the bull

  77. SBP – my existing DR *won’t* take my plan if I leave Kaiser. Kaiser drs. are available through the kaiser plan and only the kaiser plan. Kaiser is different from other kinds of insurance.

    This is fine with me. Kaiser’s pretty good for GP, but when you need a specialist, they suck. When I signed up with them 20 years ago, that wasn’t a big deal, but as I get older, there are going to be more specialists in my future.

    So when I switch to a different plan (which might be HealthNet, or Providence, or something else), I’ll do my homework and see which Drs are in-network *for that plan*. As you pointed out different plans (under the same insurer) have different networks *already*.

    Now truly, I do appreciate your willingness to do my homework for me, so be a dear and cross reference this list of top docs with all the low deductible gold and platinum plans and let me know what the alignment looks like.

    http://www.portlandmonthlymag.com/lists/top-doctors-2013?page=1

  78. Princess Lindsey has got to go. I’m so mad I could spit. (so mad I’m talking in cliches)

  79. So yes, I’d recommend “talking it over with the little woman” before jumping on this “awesome” deal or dropping your current Kaiser plan.

    Oh, wait: you don’t have a choice, do you? The Kaiser plan you linked to ceases to exist come January 1.

    “Please note that all 2013 Kaiser Permanente plans will be discontinued on December 31, 2013, so that we can renew coverage on January 1, 2014, onto a new plan that includes all the benefits of the Affordable Care Act.”

  80. “I’ll do my homework and see which Drs are in-network *for that plan*.”

    Kinda hard to do your homework when the menu option is grayed out, innit?

  81. this list of top docs with all the low deductible gold and platinum plans and let me know what the alignment looks like.

    nice big fed gov’t telling you what to do. O!fool™

  82. Hey Pablo, you know what’s great about paying $1400 a month for Kaiser? When you’re in your 40s and have a family and buy insurance in the individual market, you can’t actually get insurance. The odds of someone having a preexisting condition is about 100%. So you just re-up with the insurance you have ’cause it’s that or nothing. Now Kaiser does have cheaper plans, but I like the peace of mind of no lifetime limits and little things like that. So there’s my financial acumen. Let’s hear yours. SBP, you too. Let’s see those coverages boys.

    So again, my premiums will go down, for better insurance, and I’ll have multiple insurers to choose from, and I can move freely between them. So yeah, it freak’n rocks.

  83. My Amish beard is growing very nicely

    Article [I]13

    Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof;

  84. “So again, my premiums will go down, for better insurance, and I’ll have multiple insurers to choose from”

    Still ignoring the doctor issue, I see. Providence doesn’t list any doctors that take it, either.

    Don’t you think that’s a little….curious… with only two months to go?

  85. _Let’s see those coverages boys._

    i’ll leave it to aholes like you to want stupid stuff. myself i head to the hills. good luck with the black liv crowd loser.

  86. Do tell us how you’re going to “do your homework” on doctors, when none of the plans actually list any doctors.

    We’re all on the edge of our seats here.

    If you think the cheapjack option is going to get you access to more doctors, you’re pretty freakin’ stupid.

    They have to pay out 80% of the premiums to the doc, and keep 20%. That’s statutory.

    If the plan is cheaper, then they’re going to pay the doc less. That’s arithmetic.

    Docs don’t like to work cheap (and largely, don’t have to). That’s human nature.

  87. Yeah, SBP, they’re totally going to have $900 / month plans an no doctors. Oh, and you guys can totally win the next budget / borrowing hostage crisis. Stay strong brother.

  88. What’s your current coverage SBP? And who pays for it?

  89. SBP, what’s the over/under of most doctors saying “fuck it” and going to a fee for services arrangement and not accepting any form of health insurance? After that, what’s the over/under on government mandating that all doctors accept insurance or, the doctors that do accept insurance are also the ones of marginal ability?

  90. + Oh, and you guys can totally win the next budget / borrowing hostage crisis. Stay strong brother.+

    so your health insur. sucks because of O!care and we are the “hostage et al” takers stevie? go O! go fuck yourself with an axelrod toute suite!!11!!

  91. - And who pays for it?-

    who pays for you stevie? you effin’ leach?

  92. And who pays for it?

    Idiots abound.

  93. “Yeah, SBP, they’re totally going to have $900 / month plans an no doctors.”

    Straw man. I’m sure they’ll find a few hungry docs to take it, same as there are a few who take Medicated.

    Let’s do this in nice round numbers, since you seem to be somewhat math-challenged.

    Plan A costs $1000 month.
    Plan B costs $500 month.

    Obamacare requires that 80% be paid out to doctors, 20% kept by insurance companies. That’s the law.

    Plan A pays $800/month to doctors (on average, of course).
    Plan B pays $400/month to doctors.

    Everything else about the coverage is equal (or even “better”, under your claim).

    Which one do you suppose doctors will take, genius? Which insurance company is going to be able to give you better service, genius?

  94. Pretty good, Blake, going by experience with Medicaid. Doctors largely don’t want to take it, and many don’t.

    Good docs don’t have to accept low pay/slow pay providers.

  95. >they’re totally going to have $900 / month plans an no doctors<

    hey stevie it is called the " affordable health act" loser

  96. SBP – you’re not on Medicaid are you?

  97. >SBP – you’re not on Medicaid are you?<

    yo stevie have answer to the O!care clusterfuck dude

  98. You know what’s funny, SBP? The ACA may have the unintended consequence of creating the conditions for the return of fee for service doctor visits, which would absolutely crush hangnail to hair follicle style health insurance.

  99. “SBP – you’re not on Medicaid are you?”

    Never in my life. I worked in a medically-related field when I was an undergraduate, though.

    We hated, hated, hated to take Medicaid. Things haven’t gotten any better since then.

    Now, perhaps you’ll explain how a statutory 80-20 split doesn’t mean that the doctor gets less with a cheaper plan, and why you think doctors will be lining up to take it.

  100. After that, maybe you’ll explain why none of these plans apparently have any doctors signed up, with only two months to go.

  101. >The ACA may have the unintended consequence of creating the conditions for the return of fee for service doctor visits, post const. fed gov’t<

  102. “The ACA may have the unintended consequence of creating the conditions for the return of fee for service doctor visits, which would absolutely crush hangnail to hair follicle style health insurance.”

    That could well happen. There are a lot of docs going to cash only already. Not so many percentagewise, I don’t think, but quite a few in absolute numbers. Yep, I expect a lot more of them.

  103. @9:51 baracky will do whatever see harry reid

  104. The stupid is strong with this one.

  105. Well lets just wait and see then. The Kaiser plan under the ACA is also cheaper, and it has all the same doctors, because it’s Kaiser.

    You keep not listing the specifics of your shity-ass coverage, btw, or who pays for it.

  106. “The Kaiser plan under the ACA is also cheaper, and it has all the same doctors, because it’s Kaiser.”

    Nonsense. Now you’re living in a fantasy world.

    By the way, my “shitty-ass coverage” is called “pay the IRS 1% of my income at tax time next year because I’m not buying into your system”.

  107. >You keep not listing the specifics of your shity-ass coverage, btw, or who pays for it.<

    have you stevie done a baracky "health care" site today? tell cnn you got through!!11!!

  108. >Well lets just wait and see then.<

    how the proggtarded eff things up.

  109. SBP – seriously? I’ve been listening to an uninsured guy all this time?

  110. Add “reading” to “math” on the list of skills in which you’re grossly deficient.

    I’m not going to be paying for your spawn’s insurance, Steve.

    Sorry. Hope you find enough suckers.

  111. hah Mr. Steve when I think of your name you use I think of one of those stickers people put on their shirt at sad social occasions where it says “hello my name is” and you have to write your name in either magic marker or sharpie

    you should go for the magic marker cause they smell more better just don’t let anyone see you sniffing cause people

    people are goddamn mean

  112. new – so the insanity of the Tea Party is contagious? Well ain’t that a howdy-fuck-a-do.

    grape magic marker. grape’s the best

  113. You’ve got more things to worry about than the Tea Party, Stevo.

    Such as where you’re going to find a doctor, and what’s going to happen when all the young, healthy people decide to pay the fine rather than pay hundreds of dollars a month to support your kids.

  114. howdy-fuck-a do…very good..that’s what I greet customers with in my new part time job. I’m the head fry cook..drive thru guy..have a nice enema

  115. the lying troll steve thinks stealing from his neighbors entitles him to any doctor anytime he wants.

    So when ObamaCare acts like BritCare, where death panels are a way of life, he won’t admit his error. He’ll blame racism and demand that doctors and nurses be made civil servants and forced to give him care.

  116. why would I blame racism? i don’t even know racism. Is it one of the Bushes? ’cause then it makes sense.

  117. Also, nationalizing medicine because of the very small percentage of people with pre-existing conditions is a scam. They all could have been covered in an assigned risk pool.

    But ObamaCare was never about actual healthcare. It is a naked, raw power grab.

    And this is just the first step.

    Stevie is happy to shine his jackboots and starch his brownshirt.

  118. Stevie.. every dissent from King Barry the First’s pronouncements is racism. Every failure of his policies is due to racism. Even when the oceans are uncooperative is due to racism.

  119. It remains to be seen whether the “little woman” is happy with Steve’s awesome plan.

    Maybe he can move in with this guy:

    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/hobbit-hole-dweller-lives-simple-life-5-000-year-article-1.1487291

    Child support orders generally include adequate insurance, and I’m doubting that a judge would find a plan that has a severe shortage of available doctors “adequate”.

  120. “demand that doctors and nurses be made civil servants and forced to give him care.”

    Of course, enslaving someone who’s got a (literal) knife at your vital organs might not prove to be a wise strategy, either.

  121. Of course, enslaving someone who’s got a (literal) knife at your vital organs might not prove to be a wise strategy, either.

    I should tell you sometime about a rather abusive a**hole and how my daughter & her partner dealt with him during her paramedic days…

  122. “so the insanity of the Tea Party is contagious?”

    The inanity of the steve is contemptible.

  123. Professional dignity? That’s for Senators, not doctors.

  124. You can’t shoot owls in Texas can you? We’ve got a largish (football sized I’d guess?) horned owl on a dead tree hooting away tonight. I hope he doesn’t get my cats. I try to bring them in at night but they often don’t cooperate with me (neutered semi-ferals). I doubt anybody will come remove it either. Shit.

  125. thank you for the tip about the grape markers, especially with the weekend coming up

  126. I’ve been taking care of those cats for at least eight years now. It might be closer to ten.

  127. you’re welcome. all day i’ve been laughing at inappropriate times because the term codgerwhores pops into my head.

    but this makes me sad:

    http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/10/how-the-gop-slowly-went-insane/280614/

    you cannot serve two masters

  128. Much better to serve one, the Unicorn Prince himself.

  129. cats and owls and owls and cats
    constant are their cruel combats
    but once a year they reconcile
    tis halloween! and for a while
    the owls and cats they dance and sing!
    have tickle fights and fun teasing
    each other bout their ceaseless strife
    they frolic unafraid for life
    but when the sun arises new
    the owls and cats bid peace adieu

  130. “but this makes me sad:”

    No steve, that’s NOT what makes you sad. It’s something else.

  131. but this makes me sad:

    *snipped after the first lie*

  132. - You are free of course to wander the net and spew your carefully prepared lies Stevo, but eventually if you can’t cash in you’ll have sold out for nothing of value and lost that which is irreplacable.

    – Not something to chortle about it would seem.

  133. - An old Hindu parable for Stevo’s consideration:

    – When you meet Mr. Cobra on the road you can smile and call him sir and he will smill back and still bite you.

  134. - The 60’s redux:

    “Freedom is just another word for nothing left to do. Particularly for people that have no intention of ever doing anything.”

  135. All those ants are Steves. And that palace ain’t gonna get any bigger anyhow.

  136. i think it’s safe to assume failmerica’s pork-loving kentuckysluts will be big chris christie fans come 2016

  137. I have pre-existing conditions and am in an assigned risk pool now. It costs me $345 a month with a $2500 deductible.

    I consider that to be quite reasonable.

    I lose the coverage at the end of next year. I have no idea how much insurance will cost me now, but I imagine it will be a lot more.

  138. “but this makes me sad:”

    You know what makes me happy? The thought of you and the little woman desperately trying to find a doctor who takes your “awesome” coverage, and, if you find do find one, having to spend 4-5 hours in a waiting room with a bunch of bitter clingers before seeing a “doctor” who doesn’t speak English and is practically guaranteed to pass his board exams any year now.

    You asked for it, son.

  139. you cannot serve two masters

    One other crazy has uttered this same line in the last 24 hours.

    Their argument was also found to be uncompelling.

  140. Maybe “other” is presumptive. Let us know when you make bail.

  141. Obamacare’s ROCking navigators.

    The organizations tapped by the Obama administration and its state allies to educate consumers about their health care options include left-wing radicals, labor union front groups, and partisan activists.
    […]
    Obamacare isn’t ROC’s only source of public funds. In recent years, ROC and its regional affiliates have received nearly $1 million from the Department of Labor, along with $500,000 in federal stimulus funding in New York City and $200,000 from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

    One aspect of Obamacare is that it is the continuation of progressive-left funding by other means. Apologies to von Clausewitz.

    Related:

    But of course they have you register to vote.

    Another part of the whole sign-up application thing is to collect the information needed by “The Narwhal 2.0.” If you aren’t registered to vote that info is not so useful.

  142. So when does he start ranting about all those “Freemasons” who wrote [or didn’t in the rant] the Constitution?

  143. What’s wrong with fee for service, steve? I’ve been doing this for years and doctors love me for it. Cash in their pockets and no forms to fill out. I’ve also been hospitalized twice in the last ten years and if you pay cash, they charge you half price. It’s win-win for everyone. Of course, it require that one have savings or an excellent line of credit.

    I notice there are no chiropractors in network on your awesome plan. Too bad. After all the real doctors quit or start practicing from home, that’s all that’s going to be left.

    You and the Amish: Goin’ to the chiropractor.

  144. Here’s what makes me sad:

    When the media complains about Republicans not allowing a vote while studiously avoiding Harry Reid’s refusal to even discuss a budget.

    It’s not as if the Senate can’t amend the budget bill, vote on it, and return it to the House. It’s that they can’t be bothered to.

  145. leigh, also, if you pay cash for prescription meds, many times you can negotiate a lower price.

  146. slart, it’s not like the Senate and the House really matter, any way.

    Obama and his henchmen run the country. Harry Reid is perfectly okay with doing the bidding of the White House and the Republicans in the House of Representatives are too gutless and compromised to do their job.

    We live under a tyrannical government, run by a smarmy limp-wristed weasel of an executive. Since Obama is a weak petty little man, for the most part, the country doesn’t have much to fear from Obama. However, the next person in the office of the president should be feared.

  147. Annual income: 250k

    Please explain to me why steve’s getting mandated coverage through the government, when according to the guy he voted for, he’s rich.

    What pond scum.

  148. True, Blake. I believe I have mentioned before that my youngest son has juvenile glaucoma. His medication was extremely expensive ($75 for 125 mg) until a generic became available last year. Due to my cash-friendly relationship with his ophthalmologist, I was given many bottles of eye drops when one of his other glaucoma patients went to his reward. A savings of nearly$500.

  149. leigh, my son has had to pay cash for his anti-seizure medication. The difference in price between paying cash and buying through insurance was rather eye-opening.

  150. One of my prescriptions has tripled in price in the past six months as we are being prepped for Affordable Care. We have a large population of elderly in my little town and many of them have groused that their meds are being dropped from coverage as their various insurances scramble to make ends meet.

    Benevolent government at work.

    (Ostupid is lecturing on the teevee. Fuck him.)

  151. It amazes me that modern science has been able to fireproof pants to such degree that Washington, D.C. isn’t littered with charred-from-the-waist-down corpses.

  152. leigh, just wait until employees start getting laid off due to drug stores going to a “cash as much as possible” system. If it isn’t necessary to process insurance paperwork, then it isn’t necessary to retain the employee that took care of insurance paperwork.

  153. Hillary mastered the flaming pantsuit ages ago.

    Jughead is campaigning again in his speech. He’s going full speed ahead on the illegal immigration thing now. Now he wants a budget? By the end of the year?

    What a dreamer.

  154. Blake, when I was an undergrad I worked at a board and care home for the poor souls who were born mentally and physically challenged. I worked in the office as part of my duties and filed lots of paperwork for Medicaid. It would take all day long to process perhaps ten to twenty patients (this was back when we used typewriters and the post office) and months to receive payment. In the meantime, the patients still needed to bathed, fed, clothed, exercised and examined by the doctors who adjusted their medications as needed.

    It was my first peek at what a clusterfuck socialized medicine would be.

  155. “What pond scum.”

    Assuming he’s telling the truth, which I doubt. My money is on him never having been a net taxpayer in his entire life.

    Even if he is telling the truth, not to worry. He’s going to get his. Good and hard.

    Notice that he’s just blithely assuming that there are plenty of doctors eager to treat him and his sperm donees for whatever pittance is left after no young, healthy people sign up.

    I look at the sites and see no doctors listed that take any of these “plans”, just two months from the day the “coverage” goes into effect. Shouldn’t they already have some doctors signed up?

    The CEO of Aetna is estimating that it will take at least three years to fix this pile of feces:

    http://www.cnbc.com/id/101110161

    Note that this is just to fix the technical shortcomings. The financial shortcomings aren’t include in that.

    Hope Stevo, the “little woman”, and the kids aren’t planning on getting sick for the next three years, minimum. Maybe they’ll be able to find a doctor before then, too.

  156. If you want drug price sticker shock try drugs for MS.

    Around 2002 or so the drugs available ran $1000 to $1500 per month and the companies had programs for those without drug coverage where you bought the first month at full price and the next 11 months were free and all were sent FedEx to your door.

    Those went away when Medicare part D was passed as now everyone disabled by MS had “drug coverage” though the cost now ran about $5000 to $6000 per year then, now coming up close to $10,000 under Part D coverage. Because lately, even though new drugs have come available, the prices of all have increased hugely, likely in the run up to Obamacare coming on. $3000 to $6000 per month, $36,000 to $72,000 per year is now the range.

  157. He told Judge Kenneth Karas, “I’m truly sorry for the content of these statements and the violence they imply.”

    The judge said, “Sometimes those statements lead to bad things being done to the public officials. … It was public. It’s a Facebook page.”

    ***

    jesus.

    name me one fucking time, judge cocksucker.

    judge boy has a highly inflated opinion of the puissance of facebook postings i think

    but by all means let’s deprive this poor guy of his freedom and his livelihood

    it’s the goddamn american way

  158. LoftiestMagistrate MrGreenJustifiesTheEndsJeansClownDisaster pontificates — beyond the Pontiffs, naturally — over a claim to possess American, the adjective. Its HisMajesty’sProperty and HisHolyHighness ain’t givin’ it up to low-lifes the like of us.

    Get with the program, peons: He Won. Shut up and take what HisMagificentMunificence deigns give you.

  159. Yikes, geoff! My stepmother broke her back in several places a decade ago and is on chronic pain meds and physical therapy both of which cost a fortune. Your experience with the MS drugs sounds similar to what my father was telling me about stepmom’s.

    She’s a candidate for an experimental procedure at Stanford later next year, but we’ll have to wait to see if that comes to fruition.

  160. Notice that he’s just blithely assuming that there are plenty of doctors eager to treat him and his sperm donees for whatever pittance is left after no young, healthy people sign up.

    I am someone who’s been in the healthcare finance field for many years. You hit this on the head.

    Doctors will contract SEPARATELY (and get paid different fees) for their Obamacare exchange plans than with the healthplans they’re already contracted with. Because a physician is contracted through Kaiser, it doesn’t mean they’ll contract withe Kaiser’s Obamacare exchange product, which is an entirely separate health plan.

    Like you said – steve is either lying or blindingly stupid. I’m not sure which one is worse.

  161. Ever since the federal government encouraged the establishment of, and later got into being itself a, “third party payer” system in medical insurance the whole market for medical insurance and treatment has had a complete disconnect between what is paid for some service, what the service costs the provider to deliver, and what the service is worth the the recipient.

    It is not the place in our system of governance for government to be a marketplace player which they are in Medicare and Medicaid.

    Obamacare simply takes this disconnect to a whole new level and cements it in place. Iit uses the force of government’s iron fist to tell an industry that they may only sell exactly the product that a Sec. of HHS will allow them to sell, what price they can sell it at, and demands that all humans living here buy one of the mandated products or pay a fine which will increase steeply in coming years.

    The Sec. of HHS [pdf] and through her the President become the de facto czar of all the healthcare system of the US. Not ending well for us all.

  162. I Callahan, I tried to explain the doctors as contractors thing to him last night and he blew it off because “Kaiser is different”. Well, not really. They are all healthcare exchanges and the doctors are contracted through a healthcare concierge (ours is Quest Diagnostics) or they are independent contractors. The last are rare birds since the malpractice premiums are so onerous that most docs are part of a practice that allows them to spread and level the costs across their practice. All of us here understand this. Many of us work and live with the burdens of bureaucratic interference, especially if we are in healthcare.

    What I see happening in the not too distant future is that hospitals will once again become a place where one goes to die. Something we spent a hundred years getting away from. Private hospitals for those who can afford the best care will flourish, but they will most likely be offshore.

    Obama and his merry band of imbeciles has managed to gut the best healthcare system on the planet. And he’s proud of it.

  163. Seems to me hellomynameissteve is enormously effective. He seeks to divert, to misdirect from the necessary question to a question decidedly subordinate, of tremendously lower order, and succeeds like a champion here. Then the question can become, “why would such as these participate in their own diversion?” And that’s a winner, no?

  164. http://www.coveroregon.com/individual/browse

    Does not accept IE9, which is mandated by my place of employment.

    Change!

  165. sdferr, steve is incapable of or prefers not to admit that slavery has been re-introduced to America.

    However, slavery will not be determined by skin color, rather, the new slavery comes under the guise of “income equality” because the cost of health care will fall on those most able to pay.

  166. Like you said – steve is either lying or blindingly stupid.

    I vote “Both”.

    OUTLAW!

  167. Remember our friend slipperyslope? He made $250k a year, too. It’s kind of a standard for left-wing trolls, I think.

  168. Curiously, slippy had two kids 13 and 9 last December.

    http://proteinwisdom.com/?p=45685#comment-936864

    It’s an average left-wing troll kind of thing, perhaps.

  169. I think so , too Slarti. I don’t know about anyone else, but I’ve never earned a perfectly round sum in all the years I’ve been working.

    For these guys $100K doesn’t sound like that much (mainly because they don’t have a clue about earnings and taxes) and $250K sounds like quite a lot, but not too “rich”. Nevermind that O! thinks (what was the last?) $57K is “rich”.

    Math-a-magic!

  170. How has the cost of health-care come to be the predominant question?

    Wouldn’t the question of the justness of the means and forms of government (taken or judged on their own merits or demerits) be prior to any question of a potential justification of unjust means as happy (or unhappy) ends arise, therefore predominating any questions of governance far before any outcome is decided to be efficacious or not?

    After all, the means and forms of governance are going to apply to everything, not merely health-care or health-care outcomes.

    Will the United States be governed justly or unjustly? And is this question to be decided by the ends attained? I mean, wow, talk about losing the thread, that looks like it would take the cake-prize.

  171. Maybe we can dig out all of the stupid things slippy said in comments and regale steve with them. We could all have a chuckle.

  172. If the goal is social justice (always a mask for nefarious purposes), then to level the playing field, TPTB should have just cut a check to those in need and left the rest of us alone. The problem is always disingenuously phrased as “healthcare” when it’s insurance the Oministration is talking about.

    I had this argument four years ago with a professor who was whinging about the 15% who were uninsured. I told him they should suck it up since the other 85% were insured.

  173. “TPTB should have just cut a check to those in need and left the rest of us alone.”

    That would have been the least harmful strategy, certainly, but that wouldn’t have provided an iron rice bowl and petty power for nearly as many bureaucrats.

  174. Remember when slippy said that Hostess went under because no one wanted Twinkies anymore? And that it was all our fault?

    Good times.

  175. “Remember our friend slipperyslope? He made $250k a year, too.”

    Good catch, and Leigh is right about $250K sounding like a “rich person” to a no-doubt unemployed and unemployable loser like slaphead/steveo. $250K is still in “works for a living” territory, upper middle class at best.

    To find the real rich you have to look at hip young people of color like Soros, Heinz-Kerry, Buffett, Feinstein, Boxer, various Kennedy offspring, et al. The faces of the Democratic Party.

  176. TPTB, which I take as “the powers that be” ( — which have come to be the-powers-that-be “How, exactly? On what grounds? With what justification? By what authority? With what legitimacy?” — ) should just cut a check ( — from what source? Which accumulates in what fund? With what justification? On what grounds? By what authority? With what legitimacy? — ) to those in need ( — who are determined by whom, exactly? On what grounds? With what justification? By what authority? With what legitimacy? — ).

    But who are “the rest of us”? What, we’re mere bystanders? Onlookers who aren’t affected at all by the foregoing determinations and actions, with no part in the funding of the whole shining enterprise?

  177. Hostess products are back on the market now under a new company (which bought the Hostess name and other assets). Non-union.

    So, nice going union guys. Now not only did you not get your extortionate raises, you don’t even have jobs.

    I’m still not sure why the baker’s union pushed it that far — when the Teamsters (who did accept the company’s offer) have audited the books and agree that there’s no more blood in that stone, they’re very likely right.

  178. Yes, slippysloppy and hellomynameisstupid seem to be cut from the same cloth. I wouldn’t be surprised if they are the same cloth.
    Just think, somewhere in this great country, there is a virtual boiler room with an army of paid trolls just looking for right/conservative sites to befoul. I wonder if they have a journolist or just a trollolist?
    And neither of them ever responded to my queries re bona fides.

  179. sdferr, I didn’t mean to imply that I was onboard with the philosophy of check writing to the “needy”. My point to my professor friend was that if he was so keen on giving away “free” shit: my suggestion was less costly in the long run. Why many have this compulsion to give goods and services away to some faceless other is beyond my ken.

    Of course, I’m just a selfish woman who pays her own way. What do I know?

  180. I have no doubt that the socialjusticiocrats would paint you a vivid picture of The Powers That Be in which they somehow resemble the Koch Brothers, Scrooge McDuck and Leona Helmsley all at once, and yet somehow bear no resemblance at all to George Soros, Jon Corzine, Nanny Mike, Harry “Don’t Ask Me How I Got Filthy Rich Since I Became a U.S. Senator” Reid, or Warren “Raise the Taxes I Don’t Pay!” Buffett.

  181. “there is a virtual boiler room with an army of paid trolls”

    If it’s like most ACORN-style “social justice” operations, they’re getting minimum wage, if they’re lucky (the unlucky get roped into “unpaid internships”). No “health care” either.

  182. . . . my suggestion was less costly in the long run.

    Well sure, but honest? Who gives a damn about that? (Answer: A progressive!)

    Is that outcome somehow going to be useful to justify the means of getting there? Which is the point I’m trying to get over here.

    It doesn’t matter what the outcome is — good, bad, indifferent — so far as the central question before a nation in a crisis of legitimacy of authority goes.

    Besides having an actual Constitution to which to refer (the position in which we stand), the framers of that Constitution had to begin somewhere when they had no such instrument, and began with the question of the justice of the means and forms, as opposed to the “fundamental transformers”, who explicitly reject any question of the justice of means and forms of governance, preferring to seek to justify whatever injustices, frauds or evils they may commit in the process of governance by means of sole reference to the asserted “goodness” of the outcomes they hope to achieve.

    Where, I think, our conversations work against us, when we descend into relative trivialities of that sort.

  183. Don’t forget Heinz-Kerry, McGehee. Ketchup is the quintessential white trash, Walmart-shopper condiment. That shit isn’t even organic. If a Republican made it, there would be any number of smug cracks about it.

    John and Terreeezzzzzzzza get a pass on getting rich off such a declasse operation, though, because they spout the right rhetoric about “taxing the rich”

    They don’t actually pay their taxes, mind you, but they do talk about it. That’s what counts.

  184. I’ll be in my bunk(er).

  185. It doesn’t matter what the outcome is — good, bad, indifferent — so far as the central question before a nation in a crisis of legitimacy of authority goes.

    That is the crux. Well said.

  186. If a Republican made it, there would be any number of smug cracks about it.

    A Republican did make it! It’s his no-account classless hoochie widow what decided to let Lurch get all up in that.

  187. Not so well said though, that the point takes on a life of its own in others. I mean, sometimes it seems to me I drone on and on about hardly anything else, and yet, if I look in on the random front page of most any periodical or news source (not all, obviously to those here at pw), it’s nowhere to be found in the hands of the content creators.

    I don’t hear the likes of Brit Hume, just for one instance, talking about sovereignty in the United States in the explicit terms that conversation would require. I don’t know whether he’s never heard of the concept, doesn’t consider it at all; has heard of it but thinks it’s moronic, completely rejects any suggestion that the sole legitimacy in the US government flows from the consent of the governed; or would agree with the proposition, but has merely forgotten the fundamental meaning of it? — I mean, the question seems to be so obscure that people don’t recognize it when it’s pressed into their faces by men like Sens. Lee and Cruz, who repeat a constant refrain, yet are constantly lied about by the Washington set, intentionally or otherwise mistaken there.

    But is the question going to jump out from obscurity all on its lonesome impetus, if no one speaks of it? How would that work?

  188. palaeomerus, “….often don’t cooperate with me (neutered semi-ferals)”
    If it is any consolation and helps you with the owl issue, based on your comments alone, Ive never really thought of you as neutered semi-feral singular or plural.

  189. I try to take heart that there are like-minded folks scattered across our fair land, sdferr. The cowardly pundits and newsreaders aren’t going to help us.

    Your erstwhile neighbor, Brother Juan, has been on FNS exclaiming that the “TEA Party faction of the GOP” needs to learn to act for the “greater good” (shades of Chamberline) instead (instead!) of bowing to the wishes of their tiny groups of constituents.”

    Now, we have many times discussed how while Juan is a decent guy, he is not the sharpest tool in the shed. I have to tell you though, I had never heard something so outrageous go unchallenged in a panel discussion. And, I heard him say it at least three times last week alone in prime time while the rest of the panel and the host nodded along as if this were sage wisdom. Not one objection. Not one. Meanwhile, I am waving my arm at the television and saying “Are you fucking nuts?!”

    It makes me admire all the more the courageous stand of Ted Cruz and Mike Lee during the past two weeks. It has to have been exhausting, as well as frightening at times. (I saw pictures of protestors crowding around Cruz’s home last week.) For my part, in my small way, I do my best to educate people. A people who are mainly an unwilling audience who plug their ears and run their mouths.

  190. Paleo….22, flashlight taped above the scope. Fire at will. ( Or the Owl, Will? that poor sob)

  191. I was thinking he should saw down the dead tree. The owl will have to find some new digs.

  192. “Curiously, slippy had two kids 13 and 9 last December. http://proteinwisdom.com/?p=45685#comment-936864 It’s an average left-wing troll kind of thing, perhaps.”

    Working from the same script.

  193. No sense in wasting a good target tree Leigh. I do it with raccoons in the apple trees all the time. Raccoon is good eating!

  194. The tree is on park land behind my fence and just outside of my property line. I live in Austin which makes firing a .22 a bad idea, especially at night. I think Shooting horned owls in Texas is a felony and the fine alone could cost me my house. I am calling the city today to get the tree taken down since it might, in a wind or ice storm, come down and clip the power-lines and maybe even damage my fence my fence. I suspect that they might take it down a couple of years from now. If they feel like it. It’s not like the mow the grass back there or control the damned bamboo. And it’s a throw point for the frisbee golf course since it’s up on a 15-20 foot ridge above the start of the park’s creek bank.

    I doubt using a ball bearing and sling shot makes killing the owl any more legal. I might ask to have the Owl removed but if a neighbor with similar concerns nuts up (or goes the Dutch courage route) and shoots it that just makes me the preferred suspect assuming he does not dispose of the carcass carefully.

    I don’t think the law lets you do much to defend your cats.

    Maybe I can get a huge fake raptor statue (are they called statues?) of like a fishing eagle or something and put it on my roof.

  195. Nope I looked it up. CLass B midemeeanor w/ $10,000 fine and exceptions can only be made for preservation of livestock.

  196. You need one of those circular nets with the weights sewn in it, like Batman has. Shoot it up there with a paintball gun and it can parachute around Mr. Owl and tumble his noisy ass to the ground. You then “rescue” him and return him to the wild.

    In Round Rock.

  197. No, release the owl on the grounds of the State Capitol building and watch the proles freak out over the battle between protecting the wildlife and not getting owl shit all over their cars.

  198. Try a really strong water-filled supersoaker.

  199. “exceptions can only be made for preservation of livestock”

    Step 1: file business license (or whatever in your locality) as a “cat ranch”
    Step 2: goodbye, Hooty.

  200. The Great Horned Owl is the only animal that regularly eats skunks.

    huh, hadn’t ever heard that until just now.

  201. Exclusive rescue animal petting zoo. Snake Farm 2.0 : Hipster Edition LLC

  202. Oh shit Paleo. My bad. Where I do it is so far away from authorities or even people that I can get away with it. NOT that I would ever shoot a Great Horned, I’d just chicken wire the tree. Now a barred? Yeah, no prob.

    Porcupines, raccoons, even deer? .22 LR Nightime, aim between the eyes. works.

  203. Sdferr, Bears eat them also, as do wolves, wolverines,ferrets and any carnivore in Africa, so no

  204. May be so Blitz, but maybe too that “regularly” isn’t just there for decoration, but refers to some measured characteristic? I dunno, but can conceive the possibility.

  205. Maybe so!! I have seen ravens feasting on a carcass, same with Bald Eagles. I do know that bears do regularly eat them in Maine.

    Other than that? clueless.

  206. Oh,and Badgers in Britian

  207. owls! fuck yeah

  208. owlses!

    “W-O-L that spells owl,” said Mr. Eeyore, knowingly.

    “Bless my soul, so it does,” said Mr. Owl.

  209. Maybe we can dig out all of the stupid things slippy said in comments – See more at: http://proteinwisdom.com/?p=51565#comments

    Dig in.

Leave a Reply