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"Time for a Divorce"

Just because it’s timely — and because I never tire of happy trotting out his cartoon critique of “Christers” in an effort to point out the perils of stereotyping and discrimination. Harsanyi:

In the 1500s, a pestering theologian instituted something called the Marriage Ordinance in Geneva, which made “state registration and church consecration” a dual requirement of matrimony.

We have yet to get over this mistake. But isn’t it about time we freed marriage from the state?

Imagine if government had no interest in the definition of marriage. Individuals could commit to each other, head to the local priest or rabbi or shaman — or no one at all — and enter into contractual agreements, call their blissful union whatever they felt it should be called and go about the business of their lives.

I certainly don’t believe that gay marriage will trigger societal instability or undermine traditional marriage — we already have that covered — but mostly I believe your private relationships are none of my business. And without any government role in the institution, it wouldn’t be the business of the 9th Circuit Court, either.

As the debate stands now, we have two activist groups trying to force their own ethical construction of marriage on the rest of us. And to enforce it, they have been using the power of the state — one via majority rule and the other using the judiciary (subject to change with the vagaries of public opinion).

[…]

If marriage was a private concern, U.S. District Court Judge Vaughn Walker would not have ruled that California’s Proposition 8 violated the Constitution’s guarantees of equal protection and due process because Proposition 8 would not have existed.

Walker would never have to sit in judgment of Americans and claim that “moral disapproval alone” was behind this plot to define marriage as a union between a one man and one woman.

Moral disapproval alone?

As best as I can tell, support for gay marriage is tepid. A recent CBS poll shows that 42 percent support marriage rights for gays and lesbians, though no state has been able to pass a referendum to legalize same-sex marriage.

Does that mean that approximately half of all voters — and all 7 million Californians who voted for Prop 8 — have no logical or legal reason for believing that marriage should be between a man and women other than bigotry?

Well, yes, if you ask happyfeet. And who are you to question whether happy has the moral authority to pronounce on the craven bigoted immorality of 7 million people from wildly divergent backgrounds and circumstances? After all, Judge Walker did — and we don’t even know him.

Is President Barack Obama, who David Axelrod says opposes same-sex marriage (also subject to change with the vagaries of public opinion, no doubt) a homophobe?

In my world, the answer is: Who cares? Is there any other personal relationship that is defined by government? Other than in legal terms, of course, this one isn’t, either.

Yet, we have decided that either a majority on the Supreme Court or, perhaps, a majority of voters in your state or, even worse, a majority of your legislators in your state have the power to define what is most often the most intimate bond of your life.

Well, there’s that and the thousands of years of precedent about what marriage is and what it isn’t — but to certain libertarians, that’s to be casually tossed aside as “none of their business.”

I disagree. The state has certain reasons to promote certain behaviors — and marriage traditionally understood, though it doesn’t always culminate in new citizens, taxpayers, etc., does at least form the basis for a family structure that historically (and biologically) best serves children.

The point being that the state’s involvement in marriage is only a problem when the courts begin making pronouncements that marriage, as it has long been defined, is itself a kind of arbitrary and illegitimate exercise — that “gender” shouldn’t matter in the makeup of the coupling that comes to count as “marriage”.

And perhaps it shouldn’t matter with respect to couplings. In fact, I’m of the opinion that same sex couples have every right to fall in love and join in unions that provide them with the benefits of other monogamous and legally-recognized couples; what I object to, though — and what many people who aren’t the kinds of cartoon Christers happy and his ilk pretend make up the majority of this country — is courts presuming to announce, by way of fiat, that something that has always been one thing is suddenly something entirely else, simply by virtue of its disdain for the supposed immorality of the rubes who refuse to board the dubious “gender as a social construct” train the court prefers to adopt as the basis for its claim of “rationality.”

There have been instances where definitions both justified and demanded legal change (who, in the US, was legally defined as a person, is one example); but in those instances, there wasn’t the same kind of historical (and cross-cultural) precedent grounding the legal definition in need of change: that is, no one thought blacks (or women) weren’t really humans, so what the legal “re-defining” did was simply correct what had been incorrectly defined in law by the legislature.

Here, the change in marriage corrupts the definition, expanding the scope to essentially deconstruct the meaning of the thing itself.

So is it really any wonder that many Americans are hesitant to allow such an enormous social change without fully considering the potentialities such a change might engender? Labeling that concern “bigotry” or “homophobia” is lazy and cynical — like yelling “racist” at anyone who disagrees with a particular policy position offered by a politician who happens to be black or Hispanic.

Judge Walker’s ruling turns on that very kind of lazy thinking — as well as on advocacy social science that pretends to find that sex is less important than “gender,” and that gender, insofar as it is a social construct, has no basis in anything essential and is instead subjective and self-determined.

Just my bigoted, homophobic, hateful 2 cents.

615 Replies to “"Time for a Divorce"”

  1. T+T says:

    So we seem to have three issues:
    1) The linguistic: The judge says, “Marriage has heretofore (backed by a rich historical, cultural body of thought and usage) meant X, but now I think it should mean X+Y.”
    2) The reasoning for the change: The judge says, “The rich historical, cultural body of thought and usage is irrelevant and bigoted.”
    3) Whether government has a legit interest in stabilizing society by defining, promoting, recording, and licensing marriage in a particular way.

    And I agree with you on all three.

  2. Spiny Norman says:

    Strike the word “marriage” from the law and legal documents. I’ve been in favor of this for years. In California, that would be easy-peasy, since we already Civil Unions which convey every single right and privilege of marriage.

  3. Spiny Norman says:

    already *have*

    damnit

    o__o

  4. cranky-d says:

    I have the feeling (since I cannot back it up with polls) that a majority of people would agree to the idea of civil unions to make the issue moot (or at least wouldn’t be outraged over them), if it were just about getting equal protections under the law. However, this issue is not about that at all, as has been pointed out in this post.

  5. T+T says:

    On a related but different issue, can I (unmarried and no children) legally designate (in Colorado) somebody to be my “Designated Visitor” if I’m hospitalized? My pastor probably has privileges.

  6. cranky-d says:

    I know you can designate people to handle your medical affairs, T+T, but it’s complicated (or at least it requires government forms and the like, notarization, etc.). I don’t know specific Colorado law, though.

  7. cranky-d says:

    Also, one can always lie and claim a blood relation when visiting someone in ICU or wherever. It happens all the time.

  8. george smiley says:

    Remember how the Gore breakup, at first Sally Quinn, said it showed how we can’t measure up, then weeks later, it showed why ’till death do us part’ is just dangerous fluff, that’s Seven Sisters dingbattery, but it’s a sample of this ‘bearded spock’ universe we live in now, Where Kirk murdered Pike to become
    Captain

  9. agile_dog says:

    Very well said, Jeff. And I think Spiny Norman’s suggestion in #2 is just about the only way out of this mess now. You want leagal rights and responsibilites for your relationship? Fill out this Civil Union form and file it with the Town Clerk. You want to be married? Go find a “church” that will acknowledge and bless your union. The two should be unrelated.

  10. Makewi says:

    There is another way out, although I think the odds of it happening are low. A constitutional amendment defining marriage. I’d say the likelihood of that is greater today than it was yesterday, and if the question of forcing churches to perform gay marriages is not settled, I’d say the likelihood will go way, way up.

    Unintended consequences and all that.

  11. happyfeet says:

    I’m hungry, bigots. We will talk about this more laters.

    Judge Walker is a moron idiot by the way I can’t help him.

    But for you guys “fully considering the potentialities such a change might engender” and thinking of ways to mitigate any negative potentialities is a lot a manageable thing but you have to try it won’t just happen for you.

  12. happyfeet says:

    I think Harsanyi has it right by the way but I need to rtwt and I have to go get foozles.

  13. Jeff G. says:

    But for you guys “fully considering the potentialities such a change might engender” and thinking of ways to mitigate any negative potentialities is a lot a manageable thing but you have to try it won’t just happen for you.

    “We need to pass it to see what’s in it” — happyfeet Pelosi

    How progressive, staunchest.

  14. sdferr says:

    So far I haven’t seen any commentary on the testimony of the plaintiffs to the suit as such, which testimony contains some interesting matter in itself, apart from the issues raised in the judgment and subsequently (hell, prior, too) in politics.

    From the court’s summary of that testimony at pp 12 – 13:

    All four plaintiffs testified that they wished to marry their partners, and all four gave similar reasons. Zarrillo wishes to marry Katami because marriage has a “special meaning” that would alter their relationships with family and others. Zarrillo described daily struggles that arise because he is unable to marry Katami or refer to Katami as his husband. Zarrillo described an instance when he and Katami went to a bank to open a joint account, and “it was certainly an awkward situation walking to the bank and saying, ‘My partner and I want to open a joint bank account,’ and hearing, you know, ‘Is it a business account? A partnership?’ It would just be a lot easier to describe the situation —— might not make it less awkward for those individuals, but it would make it —— crystalize it more by being able to say * * * ‘My husband and I are here to open a bank account.’” To Katami, marriage to Zarrillo would solidify their relationship and provide them the foundation they seek to raise a family together, explaining that for them, “the timeline has always been marriage first, before family.” Perry testified that marriage would provide her what she wants most in life: a stable relationship with Stier, the woman she loves and with whom she has built a life and a family. To Perry, marriage would provide access to the language to describe her relationship with Stier: “I’m a 45-year-old woman. I have been in love with a woman for 10 years and I don’t have a word to tell anybody about that.” Stier explained that marrying Perry would make them feel included “in the social fabric.” Marriage would be a way to tell “our friends, our family, our society, our community, our parents * * * and each other that this is a lifetime commitment * * * we are not girlfriends. We are not partners. We are married.”

    Is anyone struck by the juxtaposition of the statements “I’m a 45-year-old woman. I have been in love with a woman for 10 years […]” and “[…] I don’t have a word to tell anybody about that.”?

    That is, she has, so far as I can see, perfectly good words to tell anyone about that, but not the magical word? Similarly with the confusion over “partner”? That these intelligent people cannot describe the thing they are already in without the magic word “marriage”?

    If the word has any magical properties at all, and I only partly jest here, if, I say, then how might these folk think of the magical properties heretofore perceived about that magic in the minds of the heterosexuals to whom the definition formerly applied? Is the magic gone for them now?

  15. BJTexs says:

    …and thinking of ways to mitigate any negative potentialities is a lot a manageable thing but you have to try it won’t just happen for you.

    The best way is to insure Equal Protection for gay couples through Civil Unions and not redefine marriage, which would close the floodgates to other lawsuits about age of consent, polygamy or cousin hitchin’

    See how easy that was?

  16. Joe says:

    I agree. The state really has no business in the institution, other than dealing with issues of children and property when such unions fall apart. And given that a sizable number of children are raised in unions not involving marriage, well so what.

  17. legs says:

    “I disagree. The state has certain reasons to promote certain behaviors — and marriage traditionally understood, though it doesn’t always culminate in new citizens, taxpayers, etc., does at least form the basis for a family structure that historically (and biologically) best serves children.”

    Not to mention that the idea of “no government role in marriage” seems ill thought out. How then, are we to re-work rules about spousal benefits (government and non-government)? Rules about discrimination on the basis of marital status? Rules about inheritance, end of life decisions, etc…. These don’t arise out of just an agreement between two parties (and maybe their religion). These arise out of policy decisions too.

  18. BJTexs says:

    So “awkwardness” is now a legal definition of discrimination?

    I’m assuming that after Zarrillo and his “spouse” clearly defines the whole “partnership” thing that the bank didn’t deny them a joint account … on account of the Civil Union paper that they no doubt presented.

    Seriously? Is this where we are now? Co-opting a word makes all of the relationships better and more secure and friendlier to the family folk?

    Gah!

  19. happyfeet says:

    I didn’t say we need to pass it to see what’s in it but we need to a lot think about the ramifications of passing it before the boomers die and the millenials inherit the earth. What are the expected harms? How could extending marriagings to gay people be done in a way what doesn’t lead to scary litigations and other such anticipated harms?

    You have to work the problem. Just digging your heels in is a loser strategy. And for all the talk of how salutary civil unions are Team R has never been any sort of champion of them whatsoever.

  20. sdferr says:

    ah, the tick back to feed. Gotta have that blood.

  21. happyfeet says:

    *millennials*

  22. BJTexs says:

    And … what stops them from using the words “husband” pr “wife ” or , even for that matter “married” in their private life? Are the marriage [police a gonna come and fine them for using verboten words?

    Please!

  23. Joe says:

    I posted this on the thread below, but it is worth posting again. You know, for an old dead white dude, Holmes made a lot of sense:

    Oliver Wendell Holmes was a steadfast defender of First Amendment rights to free speech, a position which led to many of his most famous dissents; those cases laid the groundwork for First Amendment arguments later in the 20th century. But Holmes also advocated “judicial restraint,” arguing that a judge’s own opinions about good or bad laws should not prevent him from upholding the will of the elected legislative majority.

    Holmes is rolling over in his grave with this crap. But Holmes said some other cool things too:

    “This is a court of law, young man, not a court of justice.”

    “The great act of faith is when a man decides he is not God.”

    “I have no respect for the passion of equality, which seems to me merely idealizing envy.”

    and

    “I should like to see any kind of a man, distinguishable from a gorilla that some good and even pretty woman could not shape a husband out of.”

    (that last one pertains to me, thanks Honey)

  24. sdferr says:

    Yeah, I was struck by this passage hard as I read it BJT. It is the crux though, I think, strange as that may seem.

  25. BJTexs says:

    ‘feets I’ll lock arms with you and bring my bona fide social/religious conservative cudgel and we’ll both fight within the the party and whatever state you choose for Civil Unions.

    Problem solved!!

  26. Makewi says:

    sdferr

    I don’t understand what is preventing those couples from using the words husband or wife in any case. People will smirk or pretend not to understand, but they would likely do that anyway. If the issue is just for clarity or to save time, then just grab that bull by the horns and own that bitch.

    Now if you will excuse me, I have to go xerox a kleenex.

  27. Joe says:

    You know the Communists wanted to destroy concepts like church, marriage and family. Funny how they managed to get their way through the back door (no pun intended) of gay marriage.

  28. Makewi says:

    Too slow.

  29. happyfeet says:

    okeydokey but Mr. BJ but I suspect there’s a barn already what is bereft of a horse

  30. happyfeet says:

    that should just be okeydokey Mr. BJ ok going to eat for reals

  31. Joe says:

    I could care less who couples with who, other than when it impacts me. While gay marriage, per se, does not impact me too much, using some arguable moral stand to justify judicial made law because Democracy is just too damn hard is a big problem.

    That does affect me.

  32. Mikey NTH says:

    “Is there any other personal relationship that is defined by government?” It would be easier to ask what relationships are not defined or regulated by government.

  33. Spiny Norman says:

    Not to mention that the idea of “no government role in marriage” seems ill thought out. How then, are we to re-work rules about spousal benefits (government and non-government)? Rules about discrimination on the basis of marital status? Rules about inheritance, end of life decisions, etc…. These don’t arise out of just an agreement between two parties (and maybe their religion). These arise out of policy decisions too.

    We already took care of all that here in California, with civil unions. But that wasn’t good enough, because of the “awkwardness”.

  34. sdferr says:

    You keep sucking Tick, it’s just what you do.

  35. Joe says:

    Here is the problem when you allow judges to get away with this crap. Where does it stop?

    Many of you (myself included) hate the idea of the Cordoba Islamic Center near ground zero (especially in a building where the landing gear from one of the planes fell into). But I would not violate first amendment protections to stop that project (there are other ways, albeit limited).

    But what if some judge, not liking the result, came up with some decision that allowed that to happen. And the Supreme Court affirmed it. And then years later, some progressive used that decision to justify curtailing speech he or she deemed offensive…

    It can lead to unanticipated results.

    The Constitution and the Bill of Rights were intended as a firewall to protect us from tyrany. Now gay marriage (like abortion) is not addressed in that document. Marriage was always treated as a matter for the individual states to define, not the federal government.

    There is nothing prveenting the states from changing the definition of marriage. Just do it democratically (either through legislatures or by referendum in those states that allow that).

    If that is too hard for them to handle, then stay the fuck out of it completely.

  36. happyfeet says:

    42 percent support marriage rights for gays and lesbian

    that’s really an a lot a huge number

  37. Mikey NTH says:

    #9 agile dog:

    No, I don’t think it will work like that. The first church that refuses to solemnize a homosexual marriage will be sued out of existence, first amendment or no.
    and they deserve it, the bigots.

  38. Makewi says:

    Not as big as 58 though.

  39. happyfeet says:

    what say we have gay marriage and then reintroduce marriage classic would that work?

  40. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – The whole state involvement in “marriage”, was and is, simply another way to tax.

  41. legs says:

    “No, I don’t think it will work like that. The first church that refuses to solemnize a homosexual marriage will be sued out of existence, first amendment or no.
    and they deserve it, the bigots.”

    Do religious institutions face lawsuits for discriminating on the traditional civil rights bases, like gender, race, religion or national origin?

  42. Mikey NTH says:

    #34 legs:

    Go through the probate code and look over who gets when a decedant dies intestate. It is mind-boggling, and yes the definitions are there. And the probate code rose out of the old ecclesiastical courts before the English crown took them over. None of this stuff occurs in a vaccum, even if the state is using a drafted from whole cloth model probate code. There is a long history here and untieing these definitions are going to have ramifications that I cannot even begin to fathom and Judge Walker can’t either.

  43. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – As a private operation you can be as inhospitable, cantankerous, bigoted, and discriminatory as you wish, but you have to do it on your own dime.

    – As soon as you accept public/Fed/State/City funding or tax benefits, you open yourself up to all sorts of finagling and political manipulation by other special interest groups.

  44. happyfeet says:

    As the debate stands now, we have two activist groups trying to force their own ethical construction of marriage on the rest of us. And to enforce it, they have been using the power of the state — one via majority rule and the other using the judiciary (subject to change with the vagaries of public opinion).

    that’s very apt

    stupid activist christers and matrimonious bridezilla homos both need to tell the government to go fuck itself

    ok on the count of three

  45. Alec Leamas says:

    – As a private operation you can be as inhospitable, cantankerous, bigoted, and discriminatory as you wish, but you have to do it on your own dime.

    – As soon as you accept public/Fed/State/City funding or tax benefits, you open yourself up to all sorts of finagling and political manipulation by other special interest groups.

    Actually, my understanding is that you have to toe the line as soon as you offer commercial services – i.e., renting out the Church hall for weddings to cover the costs of maintenence etc. That’s the angle they’re taking to try to force Catholic Hospitals to perform abortions, and it’s what they did to the Catholic adoption network in Massachusetts.

    They know that Churches are dependent upon Federal Tax Exempt status (State Tax Exempt status – think property tax – often piggybacks on the IRS determination) because they don’t make and sell a lot of stuff. They’re allready planning to move to revoke this status from any Church or organization that doesn’t comply on account that their “bigotry” should not be “subsidized.”

  46. happyfeet says:

    nobody outside of Kentucky uses a church hall for a reception anymore… might as well just go to the jp and get tacos after if you’re gonna be a cheap-ass

  47. Alec Leamas says:

    stupid activist christers and matrimonious bridezilla homos both need to tell the government to go fuck itself

    Circa 60% of the U.S.A. can’t all be composed of activist christers. Lots of regular, normal people. Lots and lots.

  48. BJTexs says:

    matrimonious bridezilla homos

    Crap! Do you have any idea what a horrific mess it makes when you snort Red Gatorade onto a desk?

  49. Alec Leamas says:

    nobody outside of Kentucky uses a church hall for a reception anymore… might as well just go to the jp and get tacos after if you’re gonna be a cheap-ass

    Why do you dissemble when the real totalitarian aspects of this decision and the plans of the activists behind it are shown to you?

  50. happyfeet says:

    Alec I think the vast majority of people would be a lot unruffled by gay marriagings and we know this casue of the places where it’s been legalized… cause it just doesn’t change the price of anyone’s peabnut bubber

  51. happyfeet says:

    that’s not dissembling Alec that’s true I know this cause of … I just know it… Wedding Inc has pretty much obliterated the church hall wedding reception competition

  52. Ella says:

    #42, oh, yeah. That’s why Catholic Charities doesn’t handle adoptions in Massachusetts. They got sued and penalized into oblivion for not adopting children to gay couples.

  53. Alec Leamas says:

    Alec I think the vast majority of people would be a lot unruffled by gay marriagings and we know this casue of the places where it’s been legalized… cause it just doesn’t change the price of anyone’s peabnut bubber

    I suppose the rest of us should just accept that we’ve been tyrannized and get used to it?

    Fags ate reasonably priced peanut butter before Faaabulous Vaughn Walker’s decision too, no?

  54. happyfeet says:

    plus most churches can’t really serve alcohol cause of their insurance

  55. T+T says:

    hf,
    It isn’t just the gay marriages that are the problem here: in addition to that it’s the issue of faddist courts using bad reasoning to overturn law,

  56. Alec Leamas says:

    that’s not dissembling Alec that’s true I know this cause of … I just know it… Wedding Inc has pretty much obliterated the church hall wedding reception competition

    You’ve sort of just revealed the class in which you circulate, I think.

  57. Obstreperous Infidel says:

    puts the government in the role of creating two separate institutions: marriage and civil unions.

    I don’t understand this. The government wouldn’t have anything to do with marriages is my understanding of it. Civil Unions would be under the purview of government, not marriage.

  58. Carin says:

    matrimonious bridezilla homos

    They have a show on A&E or something that proves homos are better at being brides than women.

    The bride wants some tacky horrible wedding, and the gay guy puts her right.

    I don’t think it’s a HUGE leap to say the guy is gay. Honestly, would a straight guy become a wedding planner? amiright?

  59. happyfeet says:

    oh. *cause* of the places where it’s been legalized I mean

  60. Big Bang Hunter says:

    “i.e., renting out the Church hall for weddings to cover the costs of maintenence etc.”

    – Unless you have a legal set aside, any sort of money raising beyond simple voluntary contributions can be immediately seized upon as a public/business function, and again opens you up to the same attacks. Private means private. Privately funded, privately owned, privately operated.

  61. happyfeet says:

    he’s like that little fish what attaches to a shark underneath kinda

  62. T+T says:

    hf,
    Who is it that’s like the remora?

  63. happyfeet says:

    faddist courts using bad reasoning to overturn law are bad and this ruling should be overturned

  64. happyfeet says:

    remora! the little gay wedding planner guy

  65. happyfeet says:

    faddist courts using bad reasoning to overturn law are bad and this ruling should be overturned

    I thought we established that yesterday already

  66. J."Trashman" Peden says:

    Judge Walker’s ruling turns on that very kind of lazy thinking…

    Pitiful, isn’t it that, as we see over and over amongst Progressives, Judge Walker relies upon the very same bigoted thinking he attributes to/projects upon others? It is/reminds me of Communist “thinking” all over again, where the Communists end up producing in the real world the very epitome of the classist Master-Slave State they allege to criticize within their fantasyworld.

    And, hey, if “history is class warfare”, how are the Communists themselves going to escape their own alleged mechanistic principle in the first place?

    Likewise with their attack on Marriage, why would we not expect the Proggs to end up producing the very same Authoritarian, “might makes right”, destructive and regressive “marriage” between people that they claim to oppose? After all, for Communists, “History is class warfare.”

  67. Makewi says:

    I’m not really sure that 42% constitutes the “vast majority”. Let me get a calculator.

  68. happyfeet says:

    I’m just saying most people just shrug and get on with their day cause there are many adventures to have

  69. Alec Leamas says:

    remora! the little gay wedding planner guy

    When you boat a marlin, a whole bunch fall off all over the deck. They’d actually be kind of scary looking if they were bigger.

  70. Makewi says:

    Yes, hf, I would agree that the majority of Americans have a very libertarian spirit. They just want to be left alone to drink their beers and watch their 2 1/2 Mens and contemplate the start of preseason footballs that is almost here.

  71. ThomasD says:

    Cupcakes no doubt counts on having many more adventures as they will most certainly come for him last.

  72. bour3 says:

    In my view, legal marriage is a contract. The State’s interest in marriage is singularly as arbiter of contracts. Property, that is all. Boink. Done. Here I see the State saying, Welcome, Gays, to the wonderful world of divorce court where your property is arbitrated based on the contract you’ve made through us.” You’re thinking Luuuuuuuurve, while you should be thinking, lawyerrrrrr$$$ZZSSSS$$$.

    Other than that marriage is a state of mind, and being of human origin states of mind change over time, the silly things. Oh! Speaking of silly things, would you care to have a look at the pop-up card I just now mailed off to my brother whom I love enduringly? <http://bour3.com/animations/uploads22/crocodilePopUpCard.html>It’s silly as hell.

  73. happyfeet says:

    I’ve never boated a marlin! My whole life. that would be way more funner than agitating about whether gay people can get married to each other or not but the next person what reminds us that gay people are perfectly free to marry straight people has to buy the cupcakes

  74. sdferr says:

    Who’s going to refill the hampster’s water bottle?

  75. happyfeet says:

    bour3 speaks wisdom

    is there supposed to be a link?

  76. happyfeet says:

    it haunts me too Mr. sdferr

  77. bour3 says:

    Apologies. I parsed incorrectly the link to the pop-up card.

  78. happyfeet says:

    here is the link for the new card fittingly it has an adventure theme

  79. happyfeet says:

    an epic adventure theme

  80. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Speak of the> devil…

    – Apparently he has a history of picking and choosing the “discrimination’s” he likes.

  81. Squid says:

    What gets me about the whole thing (and gets me in a lot of hot water with my gay friends) is that they can advocate all they want to about acceptance and equality, and as we’re seeing, they can even enjoy a lot of success at forcing such acceptance on the culture through force of law. But it doesn’t matter whether a judge or a legislature sets up a structure for gay marriage — the truth is that the same people who look crosseyed at Peter and his husband Paul today will do the same after legalization.

    Gay couples may feel more confidence after they have a little piece of paper that says they’re for-reals married now, but it isn’t going to change the looks they get when they talk about it at Happy Hour. In the meantime, they’re pissing off a lot of their friends who’d rather not talk about it, and who kinda resent being forced to talk about by virtue of having Change shoved down their throats.

    And yes — Happy Hour with my gay friends is often an interesting event.

  82. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Actually I agree with the lawyers on the side of majority rule and the state Constitution, and I could care less if the judge is a transvestite from Transylvania with a really bad haircut and raging herpes.

    – They plan on appeal to the wrongness of the decision, and not for recluse reasons.

  83. Joe says:

    I have boated several marlin. It is a lot of fun.

  84. Jeff G. says:

    Other than that marriage is a state of mind, and being of human origin states of mind change over time, the silly things.

    And if they don’t, we’ll just rule their legislated non-change into forced changed.

    Because they are silly things. With the exception of those doing the ruling, and people who think like them. Those ones get it.

  85. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – I have never boated a transvestite, but I imagine that would be a lot of fun also.

  86. dicentra says:

    Individuals could commit to each other, head to the local priest or rabbi or shaman — or no one at all — and enter into contractual agreements, call their blissful union whatever they felt it should be called and go about the business of their lives.

    What legs said in #17. The state is involved for the purpose of settling disputes that arise from marriage and the breakup thereof, and settling disputes is a necessary and legitimate reason for even having governments (redress of grievances).

    When y’all talk about “civil unions,” do you mean that every type of couple can have a civil union under the law but if they want actual marriage they have to repeat the ceremony in their church?

    That’s not a solution; that’s just legalizing same-sex marriage and giving it a different label even though functionally it would be exactly the same as marriage.

    Right now, the state sanctions “civil unions” between one man and one woman, and if you want something else, you go elsewhere.

    If you include same-sex couples in “civil unions,” then that IS same-sex marriage; you’ve just changed the name to pretend that it isn’t really marriage.

    Besides, it’s ludicrous to assert that marriage is a purely religious construct simply because it’s mostly religious people who defend it right now. Marriage chronologically precedes the state and precedes any organized religion.

    If it’s just religious people defending marriage (Our Host’s current post notwithstanding), that’s a pretty sad statement on the secular world, who doesn’t have a compelling reason for abandoning the concept of marriage outside of distaste for god-botherers. What, marriage doesn’t benefit atheists and agnostics the same as it benefits believers?

    Please.

    it’s a sample of this ‘bearded spock’ universe we live in now, Where Kirk murdered Pike to become Captain

    And Greedo shot first.

    And Dewey defeated Truman.

  87. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – The message that the American people are sending legislators and courts is “leave marriage the fuck alone”. They are the ones not getting it.

    – They tend to get it when they fail at the voting place.

  88. Joe says:

    I boated a 300 lbs. bronze whaler shark once. We started butchering it on deck and about a dozen live pups popped out of her. A ceasarian. We threw them back and they swam away (although the captain recommended they would be tasty grilled). The tates of the shark was okay, kinda like mako/swordfish.

  89. Joe says:

    I do not care for judge made law.

  90. Joe says:

    I never liked bearded Spock or Bizzaro Superman.

  91. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – This whole approach of “voters as morons” is going to cost some people their cushy gov jobs before its over.

  92. Joe says:

    I boiled the fins on that shark and made some kick ass shark fin soup.

  93. happyfeet says:

    well the important thing I think is that gay people have a relationship they can enter what is a legal equivalent to what married people have and then whatever you want to call it everyone can just call it “marriage” cause it would be really silly to have two words for the same thing

  94. Big Bang Hunter says:

    “cause it would be really silly to have two words for the same thing”

    – And even sillier to call a Giraffe an airplane.

    – Marriage has been defined since ancient times. If you want to so something else, then give it a different name. Anything else would be silly.

  95. dicentra says:

    As for whether churches will get sued good and hard…

    Every single time my church wants to build one of these, we have to wade through a gauntlet of lawsuits, protests, town hall meetings, and other nasty stuff as the locals freak completely out about the eeeevil Mormons doing horrible things to their neighborhoods.

    Construction can be delayed for YEARS as they complain that the steeple will shade the freeway (Boston) or that traffic patterns will be unbearable or whatever. Then after we finally get out of court and finish the thing, the property values in the adjascent neighborhoods go up because of the pretty temple in their midst, and the locals start boasting about it to outsiders.

    Every. Damn. Time.

    Also, you might want to ask BYU about the Title 9 problems they’ve had because they insist on sex-segregated living quarters (off-campus and on).

    Or the time the LDS church wanted to close off a one-block section of street in downtown SLC and turn it into a pedestrian mall to join the two adjacent blocks that the church owned. The city counsel had proposed closing that street for traffic-flow purposes since the 1970s but had never gotten around it. The church paid the city cold hard cash for the street, and all propriety was excruciatingly observed.

    Naturally, the ACLU decided that the church was violating first-amendment rights by controlling activity in the private property it had just acquired, because that property wasn’t really private, it was PUBLIC, because you could walk on it from one public sidewalk to another. EASEMENT!

    Years and years we endure the screeching and the hysterics and the protests about the EEEEVIL church not permitting people to smoke or swear or make out on their own property.

    Of course, now that the thing is built (and gated, so that the doors can close once a year so it won’t be called an easment), nobody is complaining about it at all.

    But I promise you, every time the church moves a finger, somebody files a legal challenge, regardless of merit, because we obviously deserve it.

  96. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Hey, there’s a lot of gold to be mined in activism, and looking at the sort of freaks that do it for a living I can easily surmise it’s about the only way they could make a buck.

  97. happyfeet says:

    this is the church this is the steeple open the doors and see all the people!

    except not that one over there he’s a poofter we don’t talk to him

  98. Alec Leamas says:

    I’ve never boated a marlin! My whole life. that would be way more funner than agitating about whether gay people can get married to each other or not but the next person what reminds us that gay people are perfectly free to marry straight people has to buy the cupcakes

    Well, you got to have something to talk about while the spread is out between marlin. FYI, Ol’ Gunny Mac is not a fan of teh Ghey marriage, though he does have a funny story about his “friend” who had a confusing experience with a prostitute in TJ whose gender may or may not have matched his/her sex.

  99. Big Bang Hunter says:

    “…But I promise you, every time the church moves a finger, somebody files a legal challenge, regardless of merit…”

    – I take it Mosques get a pass from the Left.

  100. happyfeet says:

    I’ve never lain with a prostitute!

  101. dicentra says:

    How about I remind people that straight people are not free to marry the same sex, either?

  102. cranky-d says:

    Well, dicentra, according to South Park, you guys are the only ones who’ll get into heaven, so I guess we have to make it hell on earth for you while we can.

  103. happyfeet says:

    pretty sure you still have to buy the cupcakes

  104. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – They couldn’t reasonably consider themselves as “straight” di, if they “married” a same sex partner.

  105. Alec Leamas says:

    I’ve never lain with a prostitute!

    A word of wisdom – do your due diligence before you pay.

  106. george smiley says:

    Didn’t Howard ‘Yeargh’ Dean, change churches over a bike path, which proves what a twink he is

  107. happyfeet says:

    I imagine just picking one out is half the fun it’s like cupcakes

  108. happyfeet says:

    except you never have to ask a cupcake to be gentle

  109. cranky-d says:

    BBH, let’s say they wanted all the legal benefits that such a contractual decision affords? I could see it happening often. If one doesn’t have a family, one could “marry” a friend to be sure that one has someone to look after them and their property, without all the hassles required if they aren’t married. A father or mother could “marry” a daughter (or son) to avoid inheritance issues, or to make sure that only one child gets all the money.

    The possibilities are endless in this scenario, and are not out of line with what could happen.

  110. Alec Leamas says:

    I imagine just picking one out is half the fun it’s like cupcakes

    A cupcakes is generally only digested once during its useful life. Prostitutes and cupcakes are very often frosted, though, so the analogy stands.

  111. happyfeet says:

    that’s kinda hot

  112. Alec Leamas says:

    that’s kinda hot

    Think Katy Perry in that California cupcake video. She’d be a ‘spaaansive one, though.

  113. JD says:

    this is the church this is the steeple open the doors and see all the people!

    except not that one over there he’s a poofter we don’t talk to him

    That does not strike me at all as a very fair observation.

  114. pdbuttons says:

    bjork marries eggs and flour
    and makes cakes out of them…

  115. cranky-d says:

    OT: Obama talked about “Freedom of Worship” recently, not freedom of religion. I doubt he chose his words incorrectly. I wonder what he meant.

  116. bh says:

    Was just reading some letter Burke sent some fancy pants and he says something like, paraphrasing obviously, “The social contract is also between the dead, the living and the not yet born.”

    Which, that’s Burke for ya. Feels relevant to this issue. The dead offer tradition and the trial and error lessons learned over time. Not necessarily the best possible tradition but the assuredly functional. And the not yet born might see something that at least looks a bit different under the sun and want to tinker around here and there.

    Federalism seems to offer a pretty good resolution to this inescapable tension. As long as the spirit of the not-yet-born is acted on through the legislature.

    My dumb ass 2 cents anyways.

  117. dicentra says:

    Well, dicentra, according to South Park, you guys are the only ones who’ll get into heaven, so I guess we have to make it hell on earth for you while we can.

    Fair enough. Everybody back on your heads.

    In other news, conservative gays boast that “our gays are more macho than their straights”.

  118. crankyfeet says:

    The Mormons built a temple along a highway in San Diego (La Jolla, actually). I’m not sure if people fought against it or not, but it’s pretty, and it’s a landmark now. I know no one in my family cared, but we’re conservatives.

  119. happyfeet says:

    it’s time to win!

  120. dicentra says:

    Obama talked about “Freedom of Worship” recently, not freedom of religion. I doubt he chose his words incorrectly. I wonder what he meant.

    It didn’t go unnoticed:

    Freedom of worship. Do not confuse the freedom of religion with the freedom of worship. Barack Obama has said in his Cairo speech “freedom of worship,” and he has been taking to the use of that phrase over freedom of religion. There is a huge difference.

    Freedom of religion is what we have here, but let me show you Article 124 from the USSR Constitution: In order to ensure citizens freedom of conscience, the church in the USSR is separated from the state. Separation of church and state. And the school from the church. So the church and the state are separate and the school from the church.

    Now, we don’t have that in any of our documents, but it’s weird how the progressives insist that there is a separation of church and state, exactly the way there was in the Soviet Union, and a separation of God in all of our schools, just like there was in the Soviet Union. Freedom of religious worship and freedom of antireligious propaganda is recognized for all citizens.

    So in other words, freedom of worship, you can worship any way you want. You want to worship? Go worship. Now, wait, wait, wait, wait. You are going to talk to other people about that? No, that’s religious propaganda. You can worship anything you want. Wait, wait, wait, wait. What does your Bible say? Wait a minute, wait a minute, your preacher says what? You can worship any way you want, but that doesn’t give you a right to talk about it. That doesn’t give you a right to preach about it. That doesn’t give you a right to propaganda. And that’s what it is. The preacher is just up doing propaganda.

    So you can worship all you want, but I’m sorry, you can’t print that and hand that out. But if you are anti-religious, you’ll notice that it’s freedom of worship and freedom of anti-religious propaganda. Ah. That means you can speak out against it, but you really don’t have a right to speak out for it. (Emphasis mine).

    All you wingers calling Obama a commie? Stop it right now!

  121. crankyfeet says:

    Thank you, dicentra. The fact is, I turned on Glen Beck’s teevee show a little while ago and he mentioned it, which reminded me I had heard it earlier this week.

  122. Big Bang Hunter says:

    “The possibilities are endless…”

    – Which is exactly why you don’t start legislating social constructs against all sanity and the will of the people to support the desires and aims of a minority. There is no benefit to a society to do such a thing.

    – If a special interest group wants to engage in some offbeat activities, then it should do so in its own way and with its own words and idea’s, and stop trying to hijack religion.

    – As others have pointed out, including you and I, marriage is an ancient social contract/construct that was not religious based originally.

  123. bh says:

    Messed that up. The notion above was in

    Reflections on Those Crazy Frogs

    .

    In the letter I was just reading he was talking about how innovators aren’t reformers and innovators are probably French anyways and so could use a good killing.

  124. bh says:

    That’s exactly how I wanted it to look. I won’t conform to your precious formatting tradition. Innovation!

  125. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Wonder if most of the threads on this site are getting sidetracked in Digg. ::schnort::

  126. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – The Saudi’s have outlawed Blackberries. They say they are afraid they’re being used by subversive groups in a way they can’t monitor. The UAE is doing the same.

    – Wonder if that will work? /sarc

  127. Chuck Norris says:

    I’ve never boated a marlin either.

    Banged one once though. Used a great white shark as a condom. Just because I could.

  128. newrouter says:

    jeez i watched delta force last night and look who shows up

  129. happyfeet says:

    this is kinda nifty

  130. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Attack of the little limey men?

  131. Chuck Norris says:

    Ran out of marlins that day. They either died of exhaustion or were split in half, whichever came first. Sure wasn’t me.

  132. pdbuttons says:

    if ur all drowning

    and shit and panicky and
    bjork throws u a life preserever
    she’s just fucking with you…

    who put that icebjorg in the titantics way?
    who’s from iceland?
    vanilla ice?..ice ice baby?
    ask yourself..why do ice cream trucks circle ur neighborhood?
    are they lost?
    hail is just the lords reminder/hoping to plunk u on the head
    that bjorks coming and we’re all gonna die..

    hail bjork
    full of grace…

  133. Hadlowe says:

    Kinda the purpose of having different words for different things is highlighting distinctions between them. Calling gay unioning “marriage” makes the language dumber by saying it’s impolite to highlight the difference between procreational vag sex and recreational butt sex.

    Butchering a Ric Locke nugget here, but why not also change the name of salad to “hamburger” so that vegetarians can finally eat hamburgers?

  134. bh says:

    Btw, if I was to say that modern academics are moral cretins, would that be using a broader brush than someone who explicitly narrows their slurs?

  135. pdbuttons says:

    when i was little snot nosed kid
    my dad had a boat and he’d take me and my
    brother out fishing in boston harbor
    and after like twenty minutes
    and not catching anything i’d whine
    and say/ can we go in now?
    but my brother and dad were all like/fuck no..
    so i’d sit in the back of the boat with a puss on
    and listen to casey kasems top forty..
    i used to hate fishing..
    but now that i’m of legal drinking age..
    fishing is awesome!

  136. Alec Leamas says:

    Btw, if I was to say that modern academics are moral cretins, would that be using a broader brush than someone who explicitly narrows their slurs?

    You would run afoul of the Leftist injunction against “generalization.” “Generalization,” it would seem, is appropriate only when those being generalized are ignorant christers.

  137. bh says:

    I’m of the mind that the statement would be what was recently recognized here as a “bad generalization”.

  138. serr8d says:

    – If a special interest group wants to engage in some offbeat activities, then it should do so in its own way and with its own words and idea’s, and stop trying to hijack religion.

    If we give them everything they want, do you think they’ll do it with their own monies or will they still want to raise our taxes ?

    (Offbeat?)

  139. Joe says:

    I have not yet adequately expressed the more than anxiety that I feel at the ever increasing scope given to the Fourteenth Amendment in cutting down what I believe to be the constitutional rights of the States. As the decisions now stand, I see hardly any limit but the sky to the invalidating of those rights if they happen to strike a majority of this Court as for any reason undesirable. I cannot believe that the Amendment was intended to give us carte blanche to embody our economic or moral beliefs in its prohibitions.

    Oliver Wendell Holmes, Baldwin v Missouri (dissenting).

    Pretty smart Yankee that Holmes was.

  140. serr8d says:

    Peggy Noonan starts to get it (but she says she ‘got it’ first in 1994)…

    When the adults of a great nation feel long-term pessimism, it only makes matters worse when those in authority take actions that reveal their detachment from the concerns—even from the essential nature—of their fellow citizens. And it makes those citizens feel powerless.

    Inner pessimism and powerlessness: That is a dangerous combination.

    You’re damned straight it is.

  141. SDN says:

    BBH 101: Sooner or later, us hatey Christian types are going to start realizing that the way to get churches treated the same as mosques is to take the same loving approach mosque attenders are famous for……

    which should improve the market for Ryder trucks and ammonium nitrate, if nothing else.

  142. Big Bang Hunter says:

    “Inner pessimism and powerlessness: That is a dangerous combination.”

    – Yes. I seem to remember that Britain found that out the hard way.

  143. newrouter says:

    “The Power of the Powerless”

    Obviously the greengrocer . . . does not put the slogan in his window from any personal desire to acquaint the public with the ideal it expresses. This, of course, does not mean that his action has no motive or significance at all, or that the slogan communicates nothing to anyone. The slogan is really a sign, and as such it contains a subliminal but very definite message. Verbally, it might be expressed this way: “I, the greengrocer XY, live here and I know what I must do. I behave in the manner expected of me. I can be depended upon and am beyond reproach. I am obedient and therefore I have the right to be left in peace.” This message, of course, has an addressee: it is directed above, to the greengrocer’s superior, and at the same time it is a shield that protects the greengrocer from potential informers. The slogan’s real meaning, therefore, is rooted firmly in the greengrocer’s existence. It reflects his vital interests. But what are those vital interests?

    {7}Let us take note: if the greengrocer had been instructed to display the slogan “I am afraid and therefore unquestioningly obedient;’ he would not be nearly as indifferent to its semantics, even though the statement would reflect the truth. The greengrocer would be embarrassed and ashamed to put such an unequivocal statement of his own degradation in the shop window, and quite naturally so, for he is a human being and thus has a sense of his own dignity. To overcome this complication, his expression of loyalty must take the form of a sign which, at least on its textual surface, indicates a level of disinterested conviction. It must allow the greengrocer to say, “What’s wrong with the workers of the world uniting?” Thus the sign helps the greengrocer to conceal from himself the low foundations of his obedience, at the same time concealing the low foundations of power. It hides them behind the facade of something high. And that something is ideology.

    {8}Ideology is a specious way of relating to the world. It offers human beings the illusion of an identity, of dignity, and of morality while making it easier for them to part with them. As the repository of something suprapersonal and objective, it enables people to deceive their conscience and conceal their true position and their inglorious modus vivendi, both from the world and from themselves. It is a very pragmatic but, at the same time, an apparently dignified way of legitimizing what is above, below, and on either side. It is directed toward people and toward God. It is a veil behind which human beings can hide their own fallen existence, their trivialization, and their adaptation to the status quo. It is an excuse that everyone can use, from the greengrocer, who conceals his fear of losing his job behind an alleged interest in the unification of the workers of the world, to the highest functionary, whose interest in staying in power can be cloaked in phrases about service to the working class. The primary excusatory function of ideology, therefore, is to provide people, both as victims and pillars of the post-totalitarian system, with the illusion that the system is in harmony with the human order and the order of the universe. . . .

    link

  144. newrouter says:

    and more havel

    The post-totalitarian system touches people at every step, but it does so with its ideological gloves on. This is why life in the system is so thoroughly permeated with hypocrisy and lies: government by bureaucracy is called popular government; the working class is enslaved in the name of the working class; the complete degradation of the individual is presented as his ultimate liberation; depriving people of information is called making it available; the use of power to manipulate is called the public control of power, and the arbitrary abuse of power is called observing the legal code; the repression of culture is called its development; the expansion of imperial influence is presented as support for the oppressed; the lack of free expression becomes the highest form of freedom; farcical elections become the highest form of democracy; banning independent thought becomes the most scientific of world views; military occupation becomes fraternal assistance. Because the regime is captive to its own lies, it must falsify everything. It falsifies the past. It falsifies the present, and it falsifies the future. It falsifies statistics. It pretends not to possess an omnipotent and unprincipled police apparatus. It pretends to respect human rights. It pretends to persecute no one. It pretends to fear nothing. It pretends to pretend nothing.

    {10}Individuals need not believe all these mystifications, but they must behave as though they did, or they must at least tolerate them in silence, or get along well with those who work with them. For this reason, however, they must live within a lie. They need not accept the lie. It is enough for them to have accepted their life with it and in it. For by this very fact, individuals confirm the system, fulfill the system, make the system, are the system.

  145. Abe Froman says:

    I read this book like a year ago and it really is eery how similar Havel’s struggles to pierce the fog of leftist bullshit are to what we’re confronting.

  146. bh says:

    Ummm, guys? Vaclav Havel is a modern academic.

    Moral cretin.

  147. newrouter says:

    Ummm, guys? Vaclav Havel is a modern academic.

    no he’s not

    . For political reasons, he was not accepted into any post-secondary school with a humanities program; therefore, he opted to study at the Faculty of Economics of Czech Technical University in Prague but dropped out after two years.[3]

  148. bh says:

    Since 1997, Havel has hosted a conference entitled Forum 2000.[20] In 2005, the former President occupied the Kluge Chair for Modern Culture at the John W. Kluge Center, Library of Congress, where he continued his research in human rights.[21] In November and December 2006, Havel spent eight weeks as a visiting artist in residence at Columbia University.

    It’s okay, newrouter, being a modern academic doesn’t actually make you a moral cretin.

  149. bh says:

    That was also from his wiki.

  150. Big Bang Hunter says:

    “…to what we’re confronting.”

    – Confronting? I wonder.

    – So far I see no signs to believe we are confronting this obvious attempt to Change the Republic to some sort of pseudo Eurotrash Socialism.

    – I’m given to believe, if an almost unlimited set of historical examples can be trusted, that it will collapse under its own built in flaws, just as it always does.

    – The really bad part is that as it runs its course it almost always costs a lot of social harm and chaos, and human life. That is really the worst aspect of Totalitarianism, soft or otherwise.

    – The founders gave us the necessary tools to quench this sort of attack. It’s just a question as to whether we choose to use them.

  151. Abe Froman says:

    Good point BBH, confronted with would have been more apropos.

  152. newrouter says:

    Let us now imagine that one day something in our greengrocer snaps and he stops putting up the slogans merely to ingratiate himself. He stops voting in elections he knows are a farce. He begins to say what he really thinks at political meetings. And he even finds the strength in himself to express solidarity with those whom his conscience commands him to support. In this revolt the greengrocer steps out of living within the lie. He rejects the ritual and breaks the rules of the game. He discovers once more his suppressed identity and dignity. He gives his freedom a concrete significance. His revolt is an attempt to live within the truth. . . .

    {15}The bill is not long in coming. He will be relieved of his post as manager of the shop and transferred to the warehouse. His pay will be reduced. His hopes for a holiday in Bulgaria will evaporate. His children’s access to higher education will be threatened. His superiors will harass him and his fellow workers will wonder about him. Most of those who apply these sanctions, however, will not do so from any authentic inner conviction but simply under pressure from conditions, the same conditions that once pressured the greengrocer to display the official slogans. They will persecute the greengrocer either because it is expected of them, or to demonstrate their loyalty, or simply as part of the general panorama, to which belongs an awareness that this is how situations of this sort are dealt with, that this, in fact, is how things are always done, particularly if one is not to become suspect oneself. The executors, therefore, behave essentially like everyone else, to a greater or lesser degree: as components of the post-totalitarian system, as agents of its automatism, as petty instruments of the social auto-totality.

    {16}Thus the power structure, through the agency of those who carry out the sanctions, those anonymous components of the system, will spew the greengrocer from its mouth. The system, through its alienating presence in people, will punish him for his rebellion. It must do so because the logic of its automatism and self-defense dictate it. The greengrocer has not committed a simple, individual offense, isolated in its own uniqueness, but something incomparably more serious. By breaking the rules of the game, he has disrupted the game as such. He has exposed it as a mere game. He has shattered the world of appearances, the fundamental pillar of the system. He has upset the power structure by tearing apart what holds it together. He has demonstrated that living a lie is living a lie. He has broken through the exalted facade of the system and exposed the real, base foundations of power. He has said that the emperor is naked. And because the emperor is in fact naked, something extremely dangerous has happened: by his action, the greengrocer has addressed the world. He has enabled everyone to peer behind the curtain. He has shown everyone that it is possible to live within the truth. Living within the lie can constitute the system only if it is universal. The principle must embrace and permeate everything. There are no terms whatsoever on which it can co-exist with living within the truth, and therefore everyone who steps out of line denies it in principle and threatens it in its entirety. . . .

    {17}The original and most important sphere of activity, one that predetermines all the others, is simply an attempt to create and support the independent life of society as an articulated expression of living within the truth. In other words, serving truth consistently, purposefully, and articulately, and organizing this service. This is only natural, after all: if living within the truth is an elementary starting point for every attempt made by people to oppose the alienating pressure of the system, if it is the only meaningful basis of any independent act of political import, and if, ultimately, it is also the most intrinsic existential source of the “dissident” attitude, then it is difficult to imagine that even manifest “dissent” could have any other basis than the service of truth, the truthful life, and the attempt to make room for the genuine aims of life.

  153. bh says:

    If it helps, newrouter, I’m not disagreeing with Havel or calling him a hypocrite. Nor was I giving you or Abe a hard time.

    Havel, generally considered a moral man, having lately indulging in some academics, just fell into my lap when I was thinking about generalizations and which ones might be bad.

  154. happyfeet says:

    this could be more fucked up

    maybe

  155. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – I’m no longer even accepting the Leftist gambit of word warping, so I don’t accept that the unraveling of our social fabric all around us is any sort of generalization. It’s all to real for anyone who cares to look.

    – The only choices left at this point is whether we will stand up to it now while it can be done with the Constitution and voting, the less aggressive tools of Democracy. or we wait until it requires the use of a gun.

  156. […] “Time for a Divorce” […]

  157. newrouter says:

    If it helps, newrouter, I’m not disagreeing with Havel or calling him a hypocrite. Nor was I giving you or Abe a hard time.

    havel is a true academic with real life and history changing experiences.
    ward churchil, howard zinn et al not so much

  158. sdferr says:

    Sometimes I wonder how it is that human beings, who invented politics after all, could manage to lose their grasp of it so easily? It’s an odd thing.

  159. Big Bang Hunter says:

    #157 – Yes. Fucked up indeed. Unless the perp was actually putting himself and others at risk, ala fire in the crowded theater.

    – The article doesn’t touch on what actually caused his arrest, and you know the MFM. You’d have no idea she was lying down in Duke until 12 months later when they fired the Prosecutor.

  160. bh says:

    I see your distinction, nr. Myself, I normally think of them simply as proggs though. The academic aspect is neutral. Similarly, sometimes you hear people talk like the Baby Boomers wanted to destroy the country’s institutions. No, the proggs did. The generational aspect is neutral. Same with novelists, musicians, historians, and all the other secondary classifications used as occasional proxies for the political.

  161. sdferr says:

    Maybe this belongs here too.

  162. Abe Froman says:

    I agree, bh. It’s part of why I cringe when a sort of reflexive, categorical anti-elitism leads us on a path which ends with a white trash moron like Sarah Palin being taken seriously.

  163. happyfeet says:

    I feel you

  164. sdferr says:

    Somehow or other I’ve got Vaclav Havel and Vaclav Klaus always tied together in an inseparable pairing, like a salt and pepper set. They go together like Hamilton and Madison go together, or Jefferson and Adams. So if one doesn’t wish to think Havel an academic, think Klaus instead.

  165. bh says:

    The odds of this thread hitting 1000 just spiked dramatically, Abe. Heh.

    I’m probably a 6 where you’re an 8 or a 9 on the Palin rejection scale but, yes, exactly, that impulse needs to be recognized and strongly rejected.

  166. newrouter says:

    havel was what all the dopers like billy ayers aspire to be. toppling a system.

  167. happyfeet says:

    hey Sarah Palin and her super best friend Michael Steele are gonna go see Scott Pilgrim tonight they said to ask if you wanna come? haha you can’t come you’re not invited loser

    ha you shoulda seen your face

  168. sdferr says:

    I’d like to see Mitt say one day that there are many good things he can do for the republic, and that first among them is not running for the presidency in 2012. That would show me he’s on the ball. Until then, I’m going to take him for a deluded ass.

  169. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Think the commentator at Hot Air was being a little evasive. She made it very clear she was “joining” the RNC as an outside agent, and latter referring to turning the GOP more toward the Tea Party goals snf conservative values.

  170. newrouter says:

    I’m going to take him for a deluded ass.

    Heh: Romney driving pick-up truck to fundraisers now

  171. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Annnnnddddd cupcakefeets is off to the races…..

  172. happyfeet says:

    grizzly womens can do a lot of things like scribble on facebook and catch salmon and have babies and bibble babble on cable but they’re for shit at straddling fences

    center of gravity is all wrong I think I read

  173. george smiley says:

    Hey they have a seven million dollar shortfall, feets, someone has to help make up the difference, back in the Pliestoscene era, early 2009, when vizier Murphy was saying opposing Obama was going to ut the GOP in the Ice Age, she along with Jindal, Perry, and yes, even Sanford, held the line against the stimulus,
    The legislators in the Big Easy, accidentally voted for the funds, Perry held fast, the Hogs in Alaska swallowed it whole, on a day she was at a prolife speech speaking of resources and missile defense

  174. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – She could straddle my fence anytime she liked cupcake.

    – Don’t know about PONTUS, but with her hunting skills I imagine she’d make a good secretary of state.

  175. happyfeet says:

    sexist

  176. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – mea very coppa

  177. happyfeet says:

    helping the RNC with their 7 million dollar fiasco is no different than redistributing monies to “the states” for so they don’t have to layoff any of their loser union employees

  178. george smiley says:

    The Russians dubbed her the Okhanitsa, the Huntress, (I got that from Roger Kimball) she’s much tougher
    than she lets on, now the Stache, John Bolton, who was one of those who scouted her out, back in 2007, would make a great Secretary of State

  179. JD says:

    I really enjoy Top Chef. If you watch it with the sound off, you don’t have to listen to any of their incessant whining and bitching, but you can learn a lot from them.

  180. george smiley says:

    “You go to war, with the army you got’ and Steele and the other clowns are the one we ended up with, with three months to go we can’t really be choosy

  181. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – She’s just being practical feets. We have a two party system, like it or lump it, but its somewhat encouraging that Steele, or someone in the RNC, must have convinced her they were open to getting back to what they said they stood for since the days of Lincoln.

  182. bh says:

    No spoilers, JD. Haven’t seen it yet.

  183. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Yeh, I love the Stache, but he’s way too candid. Wouldn’t last two months with the way the MFM would go after him, and he’d call them on it every time.

  184. JD says:

    Oh, I am watching it On Demand, bh.

  185. bh says:

    Boehner was just saying that about Ryan, BBH.

    Ryan is still kicking though.

  186. Joe says:

    Comment by Abe Froman on 8/6 @ 6:20 pm #

    I agree, bh. It’s part of why I cringe when a sort of reflexive, categorical anti-elitism leads us on a path which ends with a white trash moron like Sarah Palin being taken seriously.

    Abe, I do not want Sarah Palin to run for President in 2012. I do not think she is ready. But she is not a white trash moron. And I would take Sarah over Obama or Biden.

  187. george smiley says:

    You know if he had a Lousiana drawl, I would suspect our little pickachu was Dan Fagan, her mortal enemy
    up there in what she calls ‘God’s Country’, he’s a real reactionary. who just happens to cut off any promising conservative off at the knees, and then wonders why there are none, ‘things that make you say hmm” , You know it didn’t matter that she had actually done something for gays with the veto of the anti
    domestic partnership bill, that she didn’t pushed prolife issues in the legislature, that she had kept
    the bars open in her town up into the early hours, or that she’s a Van Halen and ACDC fan, she’s just
    a christer in your book

  188. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Yes well, you have to tread a careful path. People are pissed about what they see as way too much Leftist crap, potential taxation, along with the economic meltdown and conflagrate spending, but they also don’t want to go back to the stuffy staid form of Governance either. So its not an easy row for any candidate.

  189. bh says:

    I’ve never seen ‘feets and Bjork in the same room either, George.

    Hmmm.

  190. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Well maybe you have bh. You just didn’t recognize him/her in the bunnie costume.

  191. george smiley says:

    Look the choices were abysmal last time, I was for Guiliani, but they tore him down, before he reached the starting gate, Romney, as Iowahawk would say in a different context ‘Roman please’ Huckabee, moving on, so we ended up with McCain, who had been a bur under. . .for the better part of a decade.

  192. JD says:

    Padma Lakshmi and Reshma Shetty rock rock rock.

  193. JD says:

    Nobody has ever seen me and Tiger Woods in the same room.

  194. bh says:

    Nobody has ever seen me and Tiger Woods in the same room.

    Not clothed.

  195. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – We would know anyway JD. You always shank your 7 iron.

  196. happyfeet says:

    Family Research Council Action President Tony Perkins praised Palin for her defense of traditional marriage.

    “Governor Palin also believes that marriage is between one man and one woman,” said Perkins. “In a speech in 2006, she expressed her disappointment in an Alaskan Supreme Court ruling ordering that the state provide benefits to same-sex partners. ‘I disagree with the recent court decision because I feel as though Alaskans spoke on this issue with its overwhelming support for a Constitutional Amendment in 1998 which defined marriage as between a man and woman.'”*

  197. Abe Froman says:

    Abe, I do not want Sarah Palin to run for President in 2012. I do not think she is ready. But she is not a white trash moron. And I would take Sarah over Obama or Biden.

    The white trash part is debatable. She does jog.

  198. sdferr says:

    The second thing Mitt says he can do for the republic is take Lindsey Graham along on a business trip to Morocco, where as it happens Lindsey gets lost in the suk in Tangier while shopping for carpets, never to be seen again. Turns out later it’s rumored that Lindsey has been kidnapped to become the butt-boy of a notoriously lascivious Tuareg camel merchant and smuggled out of Morocco to Mali, or was it Algeria? Wherever it is, it’s hot. And sandy, but not sandy like those christmas cookies.

  199. B Moe says:

    helping the RNC with their 7 million dollar fiasco is no different than redistributing monies to “the states” for so they don’t have to layoff any of their loser union employees

    You guys don’t understand, you don’t need money, or an organization, or leaders that can actually, like, lead.

    You just need to click your heels together three times and staunchly say “there’s no place like a balanced budget” three times and everything will magically go back to normal.

  200. B Moe says:

    And there is no way the Republican candidate can win without the LA and NY hipster vote, so obviously Palin is right out.

  201. sdferr says:

    Can Palin win the 2012 campaign without having to talk? That would be magic.

  202. happyfeet says:

    did you write a check Mr. Moe for reals?

  203. JD says:

    I only shank my driver, BBH. I am money with the irons and short game and flat stick.

  204. bh says:

    I find this point a bit frustrating, ‘feets, because I’m one of the bigger gay normalization advocates here and I totally agree with her statement.

    It’s entirely possible to intellectually support all the goofy shows on Bravo and still think some aspects of societal change should come through the expressed will of the people.

    I’m doing it right now. Really. Honestly and truly. Not even breaking a sweat.

  205. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Anyone who thinks her a moron is a bit stultified on that. She’s a bit country-ish/rural in her speech and idea’s, which is only natural, but she’s shown herself to be naturally intelligent, adaptive, and very tough.

    – I agree with Joe. Short on the hard nose Washington type of experience she’d need to survive and govern well.

  206. B Moe says:

    did you write a check Mr. Moe for reals?

    To the RNC? Hell no. But more because of Steele than Palin. T

  207. happyfeet says:

    I’m just answering Mr. smiley’s contention that she should get some kind of credit for supporting domestic partnership benefits.

  208. happyfeet says:

    Mr. smiley at #191

  209. bh says:

    Oh. Carry on.

  210. happyfeet says:

    I’m not giving any monies to politics this year

  211. george smiley says:

    And yet she vetoed the bill because it ran up against the state constitution, she put a PP member on the state supreme court, because she kind of had to, the other guy was a lefty who ended up mishandling the
    Johnson case

  212. happyfeet says:

    she’s a keeper I don’t know why Alaska let her slip away oh well their loss

  213. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – I doubt Steele will still be in that seat by 2012. Just don’t think so. If ever the party needed some real campaigning/fund raising abilities in the chair it will be then.

    – Here’s a shocker. Maybe Palin is being courted, even as we text.

    – That should serve to lower cupcakes blood pressure about 50 ticks, since historically Party chairs are seldom if ever even considered for a run at the big job.

  214. bh says:

    Everyone says they won’t donate but then I buy them two martinis at lunch and sing the Pledge of Allegiance like it’s a Three Dog Night remix.

    Works every time.

  215. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – I’d do that differently bh.

    – I’d announce that I didn’t expect anyone else to buy my rounds what with the upcoming tax increases.

  216. bh says:

    No way she becomes the RNC chair. I’ll gladly put money on that.

  217. newrouter says:

    sister sarah’s a hell raiser; a president not so much.

  218. sdferr says:

    with the RNC
    a habit is reaching for
    the
    carriage return

    when there
    isn’t even a

    carriage

  219. george smiley says:

    I vote for Kodos, Blackwell in that job. There is a touch of irony in that she had in the early going, burned bridges with the party establishment, and then poured napalm on the path. As a result she ended
    up working with Democrats for many of her initiatives. Hence when she turned on Obama, the floor gave
    out under her. and then they ‘jujitsued her own ethics reform against her, they repeated every charge
    no matter how ludicrous, which the McClatchy chain carried down to the lower 48. That’s whar forced
    her out to the tune of half a million dollars in legal fees

  220. bh says:

    coughEdGillespiecough

  221. newrouter says:

    No way she becomes the RNC chair. I’ll gladly put money on that.

    sarah can’t raise money? egads only an academic or anorexic could think that

  222. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Maybe. Politics is a real crap shoot and surprise on the beach.

    – If anyone would have told me 10 years ago what the country would be like right now, and who/what would be Pres, I would have thought they’d lost their mind.

  223. Abe Froman says:

    She could raise money for both parties.

  224. newrouter says:

    sister sarah can say big gov’t sucks much quicker than steele

  225. JD says:

    RNC would be a much better place for her.

  226. newrouter says:

    She could raise money for both parties.

    well yes of course if you think the communist party has a future

  227. Joe says:

    bh and abe are cracking me up now. Very funny.

  228. sdferr says:

    Andy Card.

  229. george smiley says:

    Now Lindsey is like Mt. Burns ‘even when he tries to be goof, he’s still evil”:http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/242693/birth-strategy-talking-immigration-lindsey-graham-daniel-foster Now. she did support him last year, but has come to regret it, just as with Lisa Murkowksi
    who stabbed her on the back on ‘death panels’ so she did field a challenger against her, this time around

  230. Joe says:

    I agree Sarah Palin as RNC chair could play the role Howard Dean did with the DNC. Polarizing sure, but you want that for your party chair. She is a great fund raiser. Steele lacks the mojo for the job.

  231. Willie the racist hilljack skin-flute player has more cojones than Ms. Lindsey.

  232. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – I think Palin would be great as the RNC chair. As long as she made it clear she wasn’t angling for a run all the divisiveness would go out of the MFM balloon, and I think people would embrace her then.

    – Under those circumstances she’d be a super fund raiser, and the flyovers who do love her would come back to the fold. Plus the tea partiers are in her camp. So win-win.

  233. Joe says:

    I have to agree with sdferr (imagine that). Andy Card would be a hell of a RNC chair too.

  234. Too bad Lee Atwater ain’t around anymore. That guy knew how to kick some donkey.

  235. bh says:

    Ed Gillespie has done it successfully before. And recently. His Rolodex has the recent numbers and he knows the names of these people’s wives and kids.

    Also, if he’s successful at the state level this cycle, during the wave midterm election, he’ll be the most important behind the scenes guy since…?

    I’m blanking here.

  236. bh says:

    cough

  237. newrouter says:

    andy has been so effective lately who?

  238. sdferr says:

    Scooter Libby? (heh, just kidding)

  239. bh says:

    Who redraws the district maps? The R people who will soon think Ed Gillespie is super cool.

  240. newrouter says:

    Ed Gillespie has done it successfully before

    more inside the beltway types now!

  241. bh says:

    Those local R people are also the people who like calling people and asking them to vote and contribute towards candidate X for 2012.

    Cough.

  242. newrouter says:

    lindsey graham rnc dude.

  243. newrouter says:

    Those local R people are also the people who like calling people and asking them to vote and contribute towards candidate X for 2012.

    like bob bennett

  244. sdferr says:

    Father Coughlin?

  245. Joe says:

    Ann Althouse said…
    “Althouse: I don’t think you’ll ever give this topic a fair shake because you’re too biased about the subject matter for personal reasons. If you could just put that aside for a moment–can you not see any disadvantages of overriding public will and ruling by judicial fiat?”

    You’re wrong. I would be happy to let this matter ferment in the culture and be dealt with over time, state by state. But I know the case law, and I don’t see how this equal protection right doesn’t follow. You have to stretch to keep this step from coming. Also, as a matter of prediction, I know enough about Anthony Kennedy to be willing to bet a lot of money on the outcome.

    8/6/10 8:06 PM

    Althouse thinks Kennedy is going to go for it, I hope she is wrong.

  246. bh says:

    Cough.

  247. sdferr says:

    Rarl Cove!

  248. bh says:

    Would you be interested in knowing who wrote much of the Contract With America?

    I’m running out of coughs here.

    Gillespie. Seriously.

  249. newrouter says:

    Father Coughlin?

    leftist loser seig heil

  250. sdferr says:

    She’s a hottie JD. Ed Gillespie? Seriously? Did not know that about him.

  251. bh says:

    Then you are a dangerous maniac, JD. And you must be stopped.

  252. newrouter says:

    Would you be interested in knowing who wrote much of the Contract With America?

    no because you had a nice idea 16 years ago doesn’t make you prescient now.

  253. Pablo says:

    Hey, JD? You see how that has my name on it?

    I’ll be in my bunk.

  254. JD says:

    I figured Pablo would appreciate the symmetry with that one. And I did not know that about edgillespie. Still don’t like him, but think more highly of him now.

  255. happyfeet says:

    I like Marco Rubio at the RNC if he fails

  256. george smiley says:

    Ditto,

  257. george smiley says:

    About Ziva not Gillespie, ‘let me be perfectly clear’

  258. sdferr says:

    I like Ed Gillespie, he’s good people. I used to like Vin Weber but he’s been disappeared a long time now. If Marco fails there won’t be any point to having an RNC.

  259. JD says:

    I want someone with theoretical ‘nads, someone that can sit across the table from hodean or MadCow or crissy or any of their ilk and calmly state “that is a lie, and you are a liar, you fucking cocksucking cumguzzling mendoucheous twatwaffle leftist”

  260. bh says:

    Ed Gillespie has many, many daughters even hotter than, uhhh, female Pablo.

    And he had the Constitution tattooed on his johnson. The word bromance was coined because he and Reagan so enjoyed one another’s company.

    He is Trig’s actual father and has cleverly led Andrew Sullivan astray with false conjecture.

    He shot Hamilton and framed Burr.

    Cough.

  261. happyfeet says:

    maybe should just get Mr. Krauthammer and call it a day

  262. JD says:

    Step away from the Graphix bong, bh.

  263. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – you left out poopyhead.

  264. sdferr says:

    You’re thinking we all have sports hernias bh?

  265. B Moe says:

    Dick Cheney. Just to fuck with the moonbats.

  266. pdbuttons says:

    if ur in a room with bjork
    try not to cough..
    that’s one of the ways she steals ur soul…
    she collects coughs/ and puts them in a jar with ur name on it…

  267. B Moe says:

    I want someone with theoretical ‘nads, someone that can sit across the table from hodean or MadCow or crissy or any of their ilk and calmly state “that is a lie, and you are a liar, you fucking cocksucking cumguzzling mendoucheous twatwaffle leftist”

    Dick. Cheney.

  268. sdferr says:

    That’s a good reason to turn to Scooter B Moe. And fewer heart problems I think.

  269. bh says:

    This is why I can’t do sales.

  270. JD says:

    Better Half just told me she would leave me for Shemar Moore. Bitch.

  271. B Moe says:

    Herman Cain might be a good choice. Dude has some serious business chops, and can whup up a crowd with the best of them.

  272. Pablo says:

    Transhuman Dick Cheney. You know he could pull it off.

  273. newrouter says:

    maybe should just get Mr. Krauthammer and call it a day

    sauerkraut sux big time peggy noonan

  274. newrouter says:

    we need more team r elitists now

  275. JD says:

    Maybe Pee Wee Herman

  276. happyfeet says:

    Shemar’s people probably work really hard to keep his name out of these kinds of threads.

  277. Look everyone, it’s very simple. In our new post-traditionalist world the definition of marriage is this: Marriage is any random pair of people–though “pair” and “people” are increasingly optional–who share a fridge for some extended length of time. Now go privilege your narratives, hatuhz!

  278. pdbuttons says:

    coughfing fits are fine.. only if u have a cup of coffee in ur hand
    hissy fits…
    not so much

  279. sdferr says:

    By the way, the bright white jogbra last night was very disappointing. Boo, boo heavyassedmaterialjogbras, boo.

  280. JD says:

    If you run into his people, please ask them to lose Better Half’s cell number …

  281. JD says:

    Bright white jogbra?

  282. sdferr says:

    On the Peregrym torso JD. It’s bad enough having to put up with the armored vest all night.

  283. bh says:

    I’m taking this as a no on Gillespie.

    That’s fine. I’m changing my vote to Missy Peregrym anyways. She’ll be all, “It’s really hot in here. My clothes are scratchy.”

  284. bh says:

    And, just for kicks, NO, YOU’RE THE ELITIST, NEWROUTER!

  285. sdferr says:

    oh, I’m a yes on Gillespie, with the proviso that I think there are lots of capable qualified people out there who have what it takes. I’m a no though on Norm Coleman, for instance, or anyone who intends to run for national office in 2012 (not that N.C. does, just I’ve seen his name bandied about elsewhere).

  286. bh says:

    (Not a joke, I like the Rubio idea.)

  287. Joe says:

    Fuck, I find myself agreeing with sdferr and JD. But JD is right, we need a RNC chair who can fight.

  288. bh says:

    When I spoke with Mal the Tert on the phone he quietly mentioned how he thought JD might have put something into his drink.

    Fact!

  289. sdferr says:

    That would be one way to find out if Marco has managerial/organizational skills. I’d still rather see him in DC giving Bill Nelson fits though.

  290. bh says:

    When I spoke with JD on the phone he mentioned how heavy an unconscious man can be. Just mentioned it casually.

    Fact!

  291. Ric Locke says:

    Wrenching it back to something allied with the original topic —

    What this judge has to say is irrelevant. There is no “gay marriage” and never will be. “Marriage” was defined long ago, back in the day when “wyf” just meant “woman”. We’ve added complexity and codicils, but the underlying concept is still the same one Og the cave man used when polishing up his club.

    What there will be is people compelled at gunpoint to pronounce the Official TRVTH (the Havel quote is horrifying apropos), and what you have there is a simple calculation: “My goons are bigger and badder than your goons.”

    And when you reduce it to that, it is wise and prudent to make a complete and careful physical inventory, complete with freshness dating and careful note of any manufacturers’ recalls. It’s so embarrassing to send an urgent requisition up, and get the response, “Sorry, that’s on back order.”

    Regards,
    Ric

  292. JD says:

    Okay, if Joe agrees with me, I was clearly wrong. edgillespie rocks.

    Mal the Ter is a very cool, uber scary smart fellow.

  293. bh says:

    Fact!

  294. bh says:

    Pretty sure Ed Gillespie was the original topic, Ric. Not going to bust your balls this time but let’s stay away from these tangents, okay?

  295. JD says:

    bh follows Shemar Moore and Michael Moore on twitter. FACT !

  296. newrouter says:

    NO, YOU’RE THE ELITIST, NEWROUTER!

    The original and most important sphere of activity, one that predetermines all the others, is simply an attempt to create and support the independent life of society as an articulated expression of living within the truth. In other words, serving truth consistently, purposefully, and articulately, and organizing this service. This is only natural, after all: if living within the truth is an elementary starting point for every attempt made by people to oppose the alienating pressure of the system, if it is the only meaningful basis of any independent act of political import, and if, ultimately, it is also the most intrinsic existential source of the “dissident” attitude, then it is difficult to imagine that even manifest “dissent” could have any other basis than the service of truth, the truthful life, and the attempt to make room for the genuine aims of life.

  297. Big Bang Hunter says:

    “…the same one Og the cave man used when polishing up his club.”

    – Yeh, I can believe that’s what they called it in those days.

  298. JD says:

    bh founded this twitter group … http://twitter.com/mlpcollecting

  299. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – What the duck?

  300. bh says:

    You counter the charge of elitism with words from a continental intellectual, newrouter.

    NO, YOU’RE THE ELITIST!

  301. bh says:

    That just doesn’t feel like an insult, JD.

    You can give them many different hairstyles. Many. And not just human hairstyles. Pony hairstyles.

    Yeah, don’t get what you’re hinting towards.

  302. JD says:

    I forgot how much I enjoy Rescue Me. Great show.

  303. Big Bang Hunter says:

    #304 – The curly hair falls really sets off the eye shadow.

  304. JD says:

    Here is the most recent link bh emailed me …

    http://www.alaska.net/~kathryn/clothes.htm

  305. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – So that would be: “Shut up and show us your falsies”?

  306. JD says:

    bh is internationally known as the Grand Master of these …

    http://blogs.citypages.com/dressingroom/2010/05/puppetry_perfor.php

  307. bh says:

    What’s with the insults, JD? We did these things together. You said they’d help us become even closer.

    I just don’t get you sometimes.

  308. bh says:

    Anyways, like Jeff was saying with this post, Ed Gillespie probably is our only hope. And he has machine guns for arms.

  309. newrouter says:

    You counter the charge of elitism with words from a continental intellectual, newrouter.

    so you decide elitism? an intellectual like ward churchill?

  310. newrouter says:

    Ed Gillespie probably is our only hope.

    poofter alert

  311. newrouter says:

    or faggot it works too

  312. My kids are jumping out of their skins, waiting for their parrot and kittykat webkinz to arrive from Amazon.

  313. newrouter says:

    bh ghey cream

  314. Abe Froman says:

    One has to wonder why JD has these things bookmarked.

  315. bh says:

    NO, YOU’RE THE GAY INTELLECTUAL, NEWROUTER!

    (Sorry, I find it sorta funny.)

  316. JD says:

    Abe – google is fun. If someone pulled my search terms they would paint a picture of a very disturbed mind, though not as disturbed as bh.

  317. Abe Froman says:

    I have no idea what you’re talking about, JD.

  318. bh says:

    “Goats are like that. Never can tell what they’re thinking.”

  319. JD says:

    I am trying to figure out if Board Heads or Bikini Island is the worst movie I have watched in ages …

  320. bh says:

    Oh yeah. Inception is pretty good. It’s far less confusing than people are hinting. The nested dreams are not just obvious they’re constantly explained visually.

    I’ll go farther than that. If you find it confusing, please don’t vote.

  321. When it comes to starring in bad movies, nobody…and I mean NOBODY…beats Joe Don Baker.

  322. JD says:

    Bikini Island is bad, but there are a crap load of bikinis and shower scenes. Board Heads might be worse, but there is a young Gabrielle Anwar to make up for it.

  323. geoffb says:

    I want someone with theoretical ‘nads, someone that can sit across the table from hodean or MadCow or crissy or any of their ilk and calmly state “that is a lie, and you are a liar, you fucking cocksucking cumguzzling mendoucheous twatwaffle leftist”

    Hmmmmmmmmmmmm… Only one name comes to mind, someone who has a proven record on this precise thing. Ready to try a new field, JD?

  324. “Think you can take me? Go ahead on. It’s your move.” – Joe Don Baker as Thomas Jefferson Geronimo III, Final Justice (1985)

  325. JD says:

    geoffb – I would do it in a heartbeat, but they would have to show the Sunday morning shows on cable.

  326. bh says:

    Mike isn’t making that movie up. I just checked.

  327. JD says:

    Actually, if I did it, it would have to be on HBO, Showtime, or Skinemax.

  328. pdbuttons says:

    bjorks farts aren’t “silent but deadly”
    they’re loud and cripple you

  329. george smiley says:

    What does the folding streets mean

  330. JD says:

    Goodnight, you cousinfucking racists.

  331. pdbuttons says:

    they don’t so much linger
    they more or less permeate the air
    attach themselves to ur nostril hairs…
    breathe deeply!

  332. Jeff G. says:

    J D Baker was Buford Pusser.

    For that he gets a lifetime exemption from criticism.

  333. Ric Locke says:

    http://xkcd.com/775/

    The mouseover is rather Jeffish, I thought.

    Regards,
    Ric

  334. newrouter says:

    n the second place, if a feature of classical dictatorships is their lack of historical roots (frequently they appear to be no more than historical freaks, the fortuitous consequence of fortuitous social processes or of human and mob tendencies), the same cannot be said so facilely about our system. For even though our dictatorship has long since alienated itself completely from the social movements that give birth to it, the authenticity of these movements (and I am thinking of the proletarian and socialist movements of the nineteenth century) gives it undeniable historicity. These origins provided a solid foundation of sorts on which it could build until it became the utterly new social and political reality it is today, which has become so inextricably a part of the structure of the modern world. A feature of those historical origins was the “correct” understanding of social conflicts in the period from which those original movements emerged. The fact that at the very core of this “correct” understanding there was a genetic disposition toward the monstrous alienation characteristic of its subsequence development is not essential here. And in any case, this element also grew organically from the climate of that time and therefore can be said to have its origin there as well.

    One legacy of that original “correct” understanding is a third peculiarity that makes our systems different from other modern dictatorships: it commands an incomparably more precise, logically structured, generally comprehensible and, in essence, extremely flexible ideology that, in its elaborateness and completeness, is almost a secularized religion. It of fears a ready answer to any question whatsoever; it can scarcely be accepted only in part, and accepting it has profound implications for human life. In an era when metaphysical and existential certainties are in a state of crisis, when people are being uprooted and alienated and are losing their sense of what this world means, this ideology inevitably has a certain hypnotic charm. To wandering humankind it offers an immediately available home: all one has to do is accept it, and suddenly everything becomes clear once more, life takes on new meaning, and all mysteries, unanswered questions, anxiety, and loneliness vanish. Of course, one pays dearly for this low-rent home: the price is abdication of one’ s own reason, conscience, and responsibility, for an essential aspect of this ideology is the consignment of reason and conscience to a higher authority. The principle involved here is that the center of power is identical with the center of truth. (In our case, the connection with Byzantine theocracy is direct: the highest secular authority is identical with the highest spiritual authority.) It is true of course that, all this aside, ideology no longer has any great influence on people, at least within our bloc (with the possible exception of Russia, where the serf mentality, with its blind, fatalistic respect for rulers and its automatic acceptance of all their claims, is still dominant and combined with a superpower patriotism which traditionally places the interests of empire higher than the interests of humanity). But this is not important, because ideology plays its role in our system very well (an issue to which I will return) precisely because it is what it is.

    http://panokroko.wordpress.com/2009/10/29/power-of-the-powerless-vaclav-havel/

  335. J D Baker was Buford Pusser.

    For that he gets a lifetime exemption from criticism.

    Walking Tall is a classic, it’s true. I still can’t believe that lame remake with Dwayne “The Rock” Johnson was ever made.

  336. newrouter says:

    ed gilloser is what we need no bh. him and karlrove and $4.00 will buy you ward churchill

  337. bh says:

    Good times.

    I mean it. Good times.

  338. newrouter says:

    hey bill ayers suck dick

    Finally, if an atmosphere of revolutionary excitement, heroism, dedication, and boisterous violence on all sides characterizes classical dictatorships, then the last traces of such an atmosphere have vanished from the Soviet bloc. For, some time now this bloc has ceased to be a kind of enclave, isolated from the rest of the developed world and immune to processes occurring in it. To the contrary, the Soviet bloc is an integral part of that larger world, and it shares and shapes the world’s destiny. This means in concrete terms that the hierarchy of values existing in the developed countries of the West has, in essence, appeared in our society (the long period of co-existence with the West has only hastened this process)In other words, what we have here is simply another form of the consumer and industrial society, with all its concomitant social, intellectual, and psychological consequences. It is impossible to understand the nature of power in our system properly without taking this into account.

  339. bh says:

    Jeff, did you know the main guy from Zabriskie Point was in a crazy ass cult? Not a smart and sensible cult. A crazy ass one.

    Just read that in an old Rolling Stone article.

  340. pdbuttons says:

    it’s not the scythe bjorks carry-ing in her little tiny frosty hands that
    bothers me/or her impish grin…
    it’s the stareing into the void part i can’t get my arms around…
    why does bjork carry a scythe..
    to scare the fluck outta u..

    sure/ she could cut fields and shit/ be all harvesty
    but wheats fight over the privilege
    and it is a privilege
    to get into a cereal box that might be shipped to
    bjorks playboy mansion ..
    know why?..
    cuz bjork takes tiny bites and lil wheats like that..
    will the circle be unbroken?

    she likes to read the back of cereal boxes/ especially those
    two words
    battlecreek michigan…

  341. geoffb says:

    Want some vintage video bh? I’d completely forgotten about that group. Love the quote.

    “The Manson Family preached
    peace and love and went around killing people.
    We don’t preach peace and love…”
    -Jim Kweskin

  342. pdbuttons says:

    ever see bjork type in
    a straightjacket with one of them
    bands on her head that pointy thing and
    she bends over and her head is all typy
    like/fast/ and first ur thinking..
    that must give her an enormous headache
    and ur second thought is/why didn’t i pleasure myself why i was
    watching that?
    and ur third/most important thought was after she got done
    bobbing and a weaving and she handed u the manuscript and
    u read it.. u were all.. shakespeare aint got nuttin on this imp..
    to summarize or do a bjook review / here is the basic plot
    why?…/ because!

  343. geoffb says:

    “battlecreek michigan…”

    Good evening PD.

  344. bh says:

    Holy shit.

    Is it wrong that seeing such a young Dick Cavett freaked me out far more, Geoff?

  345. pdbuttons says:

    bjork put holes in dolphins heads
    so crippled children could swim with them..
    bjork put a hole in ur ass
    so shit wouldn’t come out of your mouth..

    say what?

  346. pdbuttons says:

    we fired our guns
    but the cripples kept a comin
    wasn’t as many as

    there were an hour ago..
    and then ol’ jethro said/ dad/stop shooting cripples
    we gotta move/fast outta here.. so we loaded up the truck and we moved to..
    we’re having an argument right now..
    i prefer gillagans island but granny insists
    on battlecreek michigan..

  347. geoffb says:

    No, I thought when I linked it there would be more about the cult but there is only that part at the end I believe. What flipped me is how much Rex Reed looks like an Elvis impersonator.

  348. geoffb says:

    If we are going to use the wayback machine, I just came across this piece. In North Vietnam, August 13, 1970, by Noam Chomsky

  349. Joe says:

    It is both beautiful and frightening when pdbuttons is on a roll.

  350. pdbuttons says:

    i did a book report for boy scouts
    or some orgy a nation
    titled/ why i like to shoot at cripples

    ahem..
    ok/ number one’u can learn cuz cripples aren’t fast so u can take lot’s of shots
    at them and u eventually get better
    ahem
    number two
    cripples suck and are a drain on our economy
    ahem
    number three
    my dad said the reason for my tiny/tiny dick was my gramps was acripple
    number four
    ahem
    bobby orr wasn’t a cripple and could skate wicked fast
    ahem
    number six/cripples carry diseases/ slowly i know/ but they still carry ’em
    ahem
    number seven.. power!/ cuz it’s fun to watch cripples struggle and know
    u could maybe make a difference in their life but u don’t really give a shake
    number nine/yoko ono
    and finally/ the one u’ve all been a waiting for u freaks
    ahem
    number ten…u can point cripples in certain directions with the knowledge that they will
    eventually get hurt/ run over/ fall down stairs/ wipe ur hands of em!
    send them out into the big bold world..
    it’s cuz ya luv em..
    don’t u?

  351. bh says:

    “If there were no bad people there would be no good lawyers.”(1)

    (1) Big Brother UK, “Friday Eviction”, bittorrent .avi, just now, possibly referring to some old written nonsense.

    Footnotes are getting harder.

  352. pdbuttons says:

    ever give one of ur chillens a cripple christmas pesent
    all broken a nd fucked up cuz u’ve
    been drinking and u polly found it in the gutter or a dumpster..?
    but ur thinking of the child!
    who may or may not be urs..
    waiting for the dna tests..
    and u wrap it up in a kentucky fried chicken bucket and u think ur
    being all special and showing how much u love him/her
    that this will finallly show him/her/it how much i love
    him/her.. one question/ and one question only…
    when the kid grows up and buys a gun is he/her/ gonna shoot u in the face?
    or the back?
    maybe cap u in the knees and watch u suffer a bit..
    that’s what my kid would do!
    i’m so proud of that “lil shooter”
    if i could get up off my knees i’d hug ’em!
    whatever

  353. David R. Block says:

    There was a time when I wasn’t too opposed to civil unions. But if I have to live up to the “Christer” tag, that kind of knocks civil unions right out.

    What a shame.

  354. Big Bang Hunter says:

    * plastic surgeons call this remedial face saving

    * 4 when your face needs saving

    * you did the best you could

    * its all good so fuck off nicely

  355. pdbuttons says:

    gave my kids a broken xmas present
    told them santa fell on it coming down the chimney!
    it was okay til one of the parts poked his eye out
    with a wire or something..it was sticking out!/ i didn’t see it!

    we call the kid “wink” now..
    he’s plucky but cries alot for his missing eyeball..

  356. happyfeet says:

    I thought christer just referred to the hatey white trash pseudo-christians

  357. Big Bang Hunter says:

    i won’t cry for him
    only kid in school
    with a wire for an eyeball
    he’s special
    make a fortune
    watch with his good eye
    while he counts his money
    guud daddy

  358. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Only people who believe in Christ and hate homo’s get to be called Christers. Discriminatory, I know, but an inside thing.

    – You have to believe in choice. It’s only fair.

  359. happyfeet says:

    I guess. It gets confusing if you think about it too much really.

  360. happyfeet says:

    Are you talking about abortion? The Super Bowl isn’t for freaking forever.

  361. pdbuttons says:

    give my children a shiny new penny
    every xmas..
    i used to spit on it but his bitch mother uses the dna in court..
    i told the lil tugger
    save up ur pennies/maybe after 5/6 years
    we can go shoppping at the penny candy store….

    u know what his rejoinder was….
    i’m getting all emotional here..
    the lil bugger said
    ok/ pop! but do u need these 4 pennies more?

    i took ’em!
    spent on a crack whore…

  362. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Not all that confusing really. Majority rule. Only system that lasts and works in the long run.

    – If the dumb ass majority makes a really fucked up mistake, like Bumbblefuck for instance, the good news is, even the dumb fucks finally get it when they realize how badly they’re being screwed over, and then they get a pair and fix it. No other system is self adjusting in quite that way.

    – The Constitution is a living document alright, but not in the way the Lefturds wants to think. It’s living because it can survive the most rotten awful mistakes, and go on.

  363. pdbuttons says:

    bjork has a special place in her heart
    for kids with wires in their eyeballs..

    ain’t gonna save ur monkey ass tho/ no matter how many pricks u
    got coming in or out of ur eye…ear,,,orifices…

  364. happyfeet says:

    live and let live is a more better system than majority rule I think

  365. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – That’s a nice thought feets. Except the two idea’s are not mutually exclusive until you start to allow the gov to wipe your ass for you, and because of that dependence you get the gov meddling in things it has no business in.

  366. pdbuttons says:

    ever ask.. or see.. a crippled kid bow down and face that like mecca direction?
    neither have i..
    u cruel bastard christian walnuts!

  367. happyfeet says:

    yes I really wish Team R would get on board with Mr. Harsanyi for the most part but Team R isn’t solutions-oriented like that

  368. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Wasn’t feets, wasn’t.

    – One thing you can always count on with politicians.

    – They always keep their options open. But that also means they will go whichever way the wind is blowing.

    – The coming wind will be a hurricane. Fire and brimstone. Raining cats and dogs. Men dancing with their wives. A political Armageddon of Biblical proportions.

  369. pdbuttons says:

    do u oil ur crippled kid as often
    as often as the tin man got oiled /lubed up in the wiz?
    why not? are u a heartless creep?

    one other question/ do u let ur crippled kid pee
    and then follow the pee stream and sing/ follow the yellow brick road?
    do u do drugs?
    do u have any extra laying abouts?..

  370. happyfeet says:

    Mr. buttons the christers really come into it cause of it’s I think … how to say… illuminating to imagine the government telling the christers no marriages for you. My feeling is they wouldn’t respond to this idea very well at all.

    These ones think it quite the natural order of things for them to have a passel of kids to the glory of the Lord… and then they marry the one off and then marry the other off and then marry off the other one and then marry off the twins and then we get to young Vincent and no marriage for Vincent and it all ends in tears.

    That’s just fucking retarded.

  371. happyfeet says:

    The coming wind will be a hurricane. Fire and brimstone. Raining cats and dogs. Men dancing with their wives. A political Armageddon of Biblical proportions.

    I very much hope so. And maybe getting the christers all riled up about the fag marriage will help. Hey give me a hand here I think the horsie has something in its mouf.

  372. happyfeet says:

    this is sharni talking in her for reals voice

  373. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Society moors change over time feets, generally based on idea’s of practical need for group survival. If it’s too slow for you, that’s the price you pay for living in a stable society.

    – There’s a lot of things we’d all personally like to see different. 8 million stories in the naked city. Those of us that have seen the alternative have no wish to destroy the only working system to get our wish. That’s even worse than retarded, that’s the ultimate in narcissistic selfishness.

    – The worst thing I see about the whole Progressive movement is they don’t give a shit what kind of world they leave their kids. Why. Because they don’t think anything matters or comes after. That’s what you get with Theism. Total emptiness and dispare for the future. Go for everything now, because tomorrow you die and that’s the end of it.

    – Believing in something, anything, can be really scary for people. Not believing in anything is 1 million times worse.

  374. pdbuttons says:

    crippled kids are great when u get
    all drunk drivy and shit
    cuz they’re already cripplled before u’ve hit the pole
    and maybe/ just maybe..
    they will walk again?

    or tap dance on your face!

  375. happyfeet says:

    42% already Mr. Hunter… that’s pretty amazing… gay marriagings are very close to being more popular than bumblefuck

  376. happyfeet says:

    entropy is my co-pilot

  377. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Well see. There yah go, and it doesn’t take destroying our way of life to get there.

  378. happyfeet says:

    no and let me reiterate again for the nth number of times that I don’t think anyone needs to interrupt our supreme court people at brunch or anything just for this

  379. happyfeet says:

    it’s TIME to WIN!

  380. pdbuttons says:

    crippled kids are good at parties
    cuz they’re usually low and in a wheelchair..
    or have crutchy crutch cructhes.. which makes them tired..
    for all the arm strength they have exert..

    ever try to give a cripple kid a hi five?
    they usually respond with a high three/ except the strong struggling ones who believe
    that one day they’re gonna walk…ha ha!..
    they usually try to give u a high four… it’s so so cute!
    keep plugging..lil buddy!
    give ’em that kid book about the train..
    i think i can! i think i can!/ i think i can!..
    try not to spit/erupt in their faces with laughter cuz
    numero uno.. u might have to wipe it off
    number two.. u don’t hate crippled kids…./ do u?

  381. pdbuttons says:

    cripple kids are priceless!
    ever try to sell one on the internet?

    the going rate for crippled kids would not
    even pay for the paper towel u spit in to shine their spokes,,

    save ur bodily fluids..
    for a crippled russian mail order bride…

  382. Big Bang Hunter says:

    russian brides can be beautiful and fickle
    they have an agenda
    you don’t want to know
    doesn’t include you in the long term anyway
    save your ego
    save your money
    select a comely russian girl
    not to meet on sunday
    you’ll both be better for it

  383. happyfeet says:

    omfg :54 seconds in Jake Shannon appears and it’s glorious

  384. pdbuttons says:

    mail order russian brides can fix tanks..
    that’s good enough for me!

  385. pdbuttons says:

    everyday these two russin mail order brides would exit the factory
    with wheelbarrows with a blanket over them….
    and every day the security guard would pick up the
    blankets and peek underneath and say to his groggy self..
    and see nuttin….
    i know they are stealing from the company and i vill catch them..

    and this happened day in/day out and the security guard couldn’t
    figure it out

    then one day the factory ran out of wheelbarrows

  386. happyfeet says:

    you are the giftedest one don;t ever change

  387. happyfeet says:

    this is tragic about the dead kid even if they are democrats I think and from many googlings all I can find is here for to send monies to help…

    Christopher Bryski Fund, c/o Diane Bryski, 164 Country Farms Rd., Marlton, N.J. 08053

    it’s the right address, but I can’t find anywhere what says that yes that is the fund for helping but I imagine it sure won’t hurt nothing

  388. […] Jeff Goldstein demurs: Well, there’s that and the thousands of years of precedent about what marriage is and what it isn’t — but to certain libertarians, that’s to be casually tossed aside as “none of their business.” […]

  389. serr8d says:

    this is tragic about the dead kid

    ‘feets, a tragic death for the 21-y/o ‘kid’ who was climbing a tree, for whatever reason, sure, but there was a student loan that was co-signed by his parents, that needs repaying. He, and they, opted for private financing; with a federal student loan WE would all pay the balance due.

    Sure, help his family out if you like. But don’t bemoan the fact that the money should be repaid, because he did borrow it with those conditions included, and his parents did cosign the note.

    A take away Learning Moment: don’t climb trees whilst in debt unless your name is Keith Richards.

  390. Joe says:

    Homophobes, facists and racists!

    There can be no other explanation.

  391. Jeff G. says:

    Are you speaking of Mark Freschette from Zabriskie Point?

    He died not long after. Weightlifting accident.

  392. Big Bang Hunter says:

    you can always spot
    women from Odessa
    they have flat feet
    from standing close
    to the tractors
    dosvidonia droog

  393. bh says:

    Yeah, Freschette.

    A weightlifting accident in prison. Maybe murdered? And he was in prison because he robbed a bank with some other cult members.

    Why in the world hasn’t there been a movie about him?

  394. bh says:

    Question: Would the guys here marry a fairy?

  395. sdferr says:

    By the “guys here” you intend who?

    If us, I look to her hands and think, would she be comfortable carrying water buckets? Uh-unh.

  396. Silver Whistle says:

    I don’t know, bh. Has she got any money?

  397. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Be careful.

    – Faeries have a very strong union.

  398. Jeff G. says:

    If you read the Wiki article on Lyman and the family, you can sense the editorial tension between the warring “sides” in recalling it’s history. The Lyman adepts seem to be winning, but not by much.

    For the record, I once considered becoming a cult leader. But I decided to get an iPod instead.

  399. Jeff G. says:

    I think the chick in ZP, Daria Halprin, was a member of the “community,” as well. She did another film no one’s ever heard of, married Dennis Hopper for a bit, and now has her own “temple” with her mother — a kind of new agey retreat for “expressive arts therapy” called the Tamalpa Institute.

  400. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – At least she’s one Lefty that’s honest about projecting.

    – Do these people ever really make any money with these rackets?

  401. Silver Whistle says:

    Nothing wrong with a bit of Cult, Jeff.

  402. sdferr says:

    Madison Cult. Start one.

  403. bh says:

    I didn’t know any of that about Daria Halprin.

    Man, someone has to make a movie about these people.

  404. Big Bang Hunter says:

    “There are again two methods of removing the causes of faction: the one, by destroying the liberty which is essential to its existence; the other, by giving to every citizen the same opinions, the same passions, and the same interests.”

    – There’s a third option involving Smith and Wesson.

  405. crankyfeet says:

    How about a cult centering on the armadillo? For our celebrations, we could drink tequila.

    I admit it needs some fleshing out.

  406. cranky-d says:

    Out, damn sockpuppet!

  407. Joe says:

    @bh. All I know is RSM has been trying to get a tweet out of her for evah.

  408. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – The last I heard the armadillo had managed to park Jeff’s Jeep on top of a water tower in Golden…

    – Not sure how that all worked out.

  409. happyfeet says:

    oh. Mr. serr8d I’m not bemoaning the necessity of repaying I just think the poor kid is probably not a lot at peace with his retirement-age mom and dad doing an updated remake of The Necklace

    Mark Frechette that is very sad I’m watching an interview he did with Dick Cavett

  410. happyfeet says:

    oh. climbing trees is probably a lot more better bet than robbing banks.

  411. JD says:

    In the world long drive championship, these guys are carrying the ball more than 350 yards. Carrying it 350+.

  412. B Moe says:

    Registered Expressive Arts Therapist

    A fundamental sense of honesty and awareness of the world outside your own navel can be a real fucking career killer these days.

  413. Big Bang Hunter says:

    “Carrying it 350+”

    – Unfortunately they putt the same way they drive. 350+.

  414. JD says:

    The guy that won the 2009 event hit was 5 foot 9 and 165 pounds. Clubhead speed 210+ mph

  415. Big Bang Hunter says:

    #324 “I am committed to helping you meet your goals and experience significant and positive life change.”– Catherin E. Lewis – PHD, psychology

    – Who would have thought naval lint removal could be so intense.

  416. sdferr says:

    OT: Jeff, since we’re fast closing in on pro-football season, I wonder if you’d comment on what you Denv-airians are hearing and seeing of Tebow’s progress as a quarterback adjusting to the professional game?

  417. happyfeet says:

    Mr. Cap’n Ed wise and all-seeing also endorses Mr. H’s approach so it’s time for Team R to lead follow or get outta the way

  418. sdferr says:

    We will still have the current problem as a polity that the endstate Harsanyi and others might like to attain is precluded by the interventions of the court, which isn’t a political branch. In fine, the court says: you can’t determine the law politically because the law you determine isn’t “rational”. We, the courts, will say what is rational for you instead, and thus, what the law will be.

    That’s — how to say? — fucked up beyond repair.

  419. Big Bang Hunter says:

    – Once the will of the people no longer matters, what ever the devices, the Kingdom is lost.

  420. Makewi says:

    Tebow and Palin in the same thread, someone may be hoping for some overtime on this one.

  421. Makewi says:

    It’s been covered happyfeet. The state is involved in marriage because marriages end and there has to be someone who says no, just because you did get a truck faster than he did doesn’t mean you get to take all the shit.

  422. happyfeet says:

    there can be private arbitrations established in the original contract if need be but a good pre-nup saves a whole heck of a lot of yimmer yammer

  423. Makewi says:

    True, I was just thinking the other day that society would be better served if we had a bunch of lawyers who weren’t answerable to anyone helping us in ways like writing marriage contracts and arbitrating shit.

  424. happyfeet says:

    it’s no different than letting a judge decide except for your business is a whole lot less a part of a public record

  425. serr8d says:

    Nike’s limited edition of 500 Tim Tebow cross-training special editions shoes sold out in five minutes.

    Buyers were giddy enough that one could say they were walking on water. One could say.

  426. serr8d says:

    Looking at my handful of Titans tickets, I see Oct. 3 we’re hosting Denver. Good times.

  427. happyfeet says:

    well yeah those shoes are skanky christer ho magnets

  428. serr8d says:

    Let’s see your shoes, ‘feets.

  429. happyfeet says:

    I’m wearing my Clark’s! I can’t believe I never knew about these I’m going back for more.

  430. happyfeet says:

    I’ll show you my favorite

  431. happyfeet says:

    crap I can’t find them I got them at a real good price so maybe they were closeouts but these ones I want

  432. sdferr says:

    Totten posted this vid at Contentions today. America seems to have slipped in under the door when the powers that be weren’t looking. And it won’t leave.

  433. serr8d says:

    Finally changed up shoe brands. I’m trying these now. Rockport served me well for years, but…CHANGE!

  434. happyfeet says:

    clark’s I like cause they have their own store and a lot of the other shoe places like macy’s and bloomingdales make it a really gruesome painful need drugs experience to get in and get out wif your new shoes so I go there and to a shoe warehouse in the hood and that’s it but when I go back to the warehouse I’ll see if the have streetcars I’m supposed to go this weekend wif my friend P

  435. happyfeet says:

    if *they* have streetcars I mean

  436. happyfeet says:

    that wasn’t too bad at all Mr. sdferr

  437. serr8d says:

    I posted that vid at home on Wednesday, sdferr. Pink Floyd is one of my long-term favorites; I have to give Blurred Vision credit for performing the best cover of that song I’ve ever heard. And phlegmatic Roger Waters gave BV permissions (and all rights!) to perform that song. Still doesn’t get him off my shit list, though…

  438. sdferr says:

    I never did like the song much myself, back in the day. I see now it has its uses though.

  439. serr8d says:

    Heh. I somehow secured tickets to the pre-release screening of The Wall, the movie, back in the day. In 1982, that is. For the visual effects alone it was well worth it.

  440. bh says:

    Shoes? These are comfy. Yes, the Air stands for Nike Air. For when you need to jump over a conference table or sprint down the hallway.

  441. happyfeet says:

    jeez do you know how many cupcakes those shoes are? Like five dozen if you don’t count the tax cause that should be about the same

  442. sdferr says:

    I have a shoe. Now if I could only find the other one.

  443. bh says:

    Man, all kinds of dress shoes can cost 120 cupcakes pretty easily. And these ones don’t kill your feet.

  444. happyfeet says:

    bh will ask you to sacrifice

  445. sdferr says:

    don’t have to run through the jungle and scuff-up your feet

  446. happyfeet says:

    that goes in the plus column

  447. bh says:

    What’s sort of funny is that when you priced them in cupcakes I thought the shoes were still reasonable but the cupcakes were wildly overpriced. $4 for a cupcake? Outrageous.

  448. happyfeet says:

    chocolate coconut creamcheese

  449. happyfeet says:

    hey the other day it was a cupcake nightmare feel my pain brother you know I went over there all the way to Burbank for the creamsicle and the strawberry shortcake and so I get there and this other guy gets there at the same time and I hold open the door because I’m just like that well what does the motherfucker do? He orders 72 goddamn cupcakes – including all the creamsicles and including all the strawberry shortcakes and I could only choose from the picked over cupcake dregs cause he was throwing himself a birthday today

    Happy goddamn birthday motherfucker.

  450. newrouter says:

    is it phila cream cheese?

  451. happyfeet says:

    birthday *party* I mean I guess

  452. B Moe says:

    I like the ones that look like leather Chuck Taylors. Will I have to think if I like them a hundred dollars worth.

  453. happyfeet says:

    it’s philly creamcheese but they work it

  454. newrouter says:

    same could be said of baracky

  455. happyfeet says:

    that’s right isn’t it

  456. JD says:

    Bh – my new favorites are a company called Adler of New England.

  457. bh says:

    Kinda like those myself, B Moe.

  458. JD says:

    Alden of New England. Eating 28 oz of dead cow has me working at less than optimal performance.

  459. bh says:

    Maybe you meant to type Alden, JD?

  460. happyfeet says:

    I like these aldens a lot a lot and I like this “dark brown chukka boot” but I would need a good reason

    I can’t find adler shoes

  461. happyfeet says:

    oh there you go

  462. newrouter says:

    imelda marcos thread

  463. JD says:

    Mercanti Fiorentini’s are generally very nice as well.

  464. sdferr says:

    Imelda? oh look out, next thing you know we’ll be talking about Paul Wolfowitz the devil.

  465. bh says:

    Guy I know bought a pair of these and made the mistake of letting me see them. Now I tease him constantly.

  466. happyfeet says:

    those are really snazzy

  467. B Moe says:

    Eating 28 oz of dead cow has me working at less than optimal performance.

    I have heard Obama makes that same excuse some mornings.

  468. bh says:

    He’s a gay Columbian who loves only two things: contract killing and salsa dancing. His name is… Snake Eyes.

    (I pretend I’m rolling dice when I say Snake Eyes.)

  469. Pablo says:

    Bh – my new favorites are a company called Adler of New England.

    I know the Adlers of New England. Good, solid folk. If you need a road built, or a development excavated, or a few cord of firewood, I recommend them. But I would not be buying pricey mail order beef from them.

    I do not know these Aldens.

  470. JD says:

    Bh – I can hear you saying that. Quite humourous.

  471. Jeff G. says:

    Well. If Hot Air and Cap’n say so, you best agree. Problem solved.

  472. geoffb says:

    Day late, must type sloooooooooooooooooowwwwww.

  473. geoffb says:

    Cap’n not you. If that was unclear.

  474. pdbuttons says:

    the only thing wrapped around
    bjorks feet/hoofs/claws
    or whatever she got down there
    is kisses from ur pathetic lips
    as you beg for forgiveness

  475. happyfeet says:

    it’s the gravitas you know

  476. pdbuttons says:

    bjork invented clown shoes for
    two reasons..
    to stamp out hunger
    and they look funny/prportionally wise

  477. LBascom says:

    I’ve decided there’s no use worrying about gay marriage. The people will keep saying no, our betters will keep trying to override the people with their superior morality, and the fight will continue until America becomes a Muslim country instead of the evil Christer one we have now.

    Then there won’t be any more homosexuals, just like Iran! Problem solved.

  478. pdbuttons says:

    u can tap dance around this subject
    all that you want..

    but how do u solve a problem like maria?

    i emailed bjork and she emailed me back
    cuz bjork doesn’t like to hear earth peoples voice
    so we don’t call

    her reply was
    kill the puerto rican bitch…
    hey.. problem solved!..
    thank u bjork!
    please kill me last!

  479. pdbuttons says:

    no shirt/no shoes/no service?
    bjork flaunts them rules..
    if ur the owner of
    said establishment and she comes in buck naked..
    u better bring like/ water..asap..and warm rolls
    don’t look her in the eyes! do not!
    if u refuse her/it service…?
    than may God have mercy on your soul…

    can u hum a few bars of that old chestnut
    amazing grace?…
    start a humming….

  480. Ed Gillespie says:

    Only I can defeat the dreaded Bjork.

  481. JD says:

    I am going to be adding bjork to my list of things that should be killed on sight. So far, that list includes midgets, clowns, and Bin Laden.

  482. serr8d says:

    Don’t forget zombies, JD. I know, they’re already dead, but they are needing to be on a list somewheres.

  483. serr8d says:

    Well. If Hot Air and Cap’n say so, you best agree. Problem solved.

    I’m thinking this whole gay marriage debate thinger might be opening up a whole new can of people who are halfway there already and just need a tacit OK from society worms.

  484. Makewi says:

    I see the title of a new book. A million little star chambers. Private ones of course.

  485. pdbuttons says:

    the spider asked the fly..
    my,my,my..
    what’s the most comical thang u’ve ever seen?
    and the fly replied..
    ed gillespie trying to give bjork a blowjob…
    the spider laughed/paused/ and then proceeded to torture the fly..

  486. JB says:

    Wait, doesn’t marriage (or non-marriage) affect interstate commerce? There is no escape from meddling authoritarians; we will always be fighting them – and since they refuse to acknowledge individual rights, labeling something private (to wit, private property) is no magic, let alone silver bullet!

  487. serr8d says:

    Speaking of Tim Tebow, seems his teammates (including ex-Titan Terrible Towel Stomper Lenwhale White) have a wicked sense of humor.

  488. Rusty says:

    #441
    Oh. Those are nice. I have a pair of sketchers that are kind of dressy, but are very comfortable which is why I bought them. All my other ones usually wind up as work shoes and get ruined pretty quick. I found out that a $200 pair of work boots last just as long as a pair of leather loafers at work so I dress comfortably.
    Hint; Always wear natural products around welding and forging etc. They don’t melt onto your body parts.

  489. sdferr says:

    Humor maybe, serr8d, but no sense of congruency in image making, unless they’re purposely attemting to bend Tim’s to a better angle. Friars, at least in the contemporary view, were often enough ribaldrous characters and as such, antipodean to Tebow’s ’til now preferred manner.

  490. sdferr says:

    Though the occasion may call for my favorite Palin-drome: Stop! Murder us not, tonsured rumpots!

  491. Danger says:

    “Guy I know bought a pair of these and made the mistake of letting me see them. Now I tease him constantly.”

    bh,

    I saw several guys wearing those shoes here in N.Y. I’m thinking they needed some teasing but I that I should save that for you;).

  492. bh says:

    Hey Danger, how’s the trip treating you so far?

    On Monday or Tuesday, I’m going to find out if I can swing a trip over there. Have to arrange a face to face meeting with a couple folks to justify it.

  493. Silver Whistle says:

    I have a pair of these chaps’ deck shoes, and jolly nice they are too. I wish I could afford a pair of these, though. Just the thing for a country gent.

  494. serr8d says:

    An follow-up on the Tebow haircut. He “took it well”, even suggesting it might help “build [team] chemistry”. They didn’t hold him down, so it’s not all assaulty. Just standard-fare rookie hazing, with more irony than you’d expect to see in a (Broncos) locker room.

  495. serr8d says:

    Shoes are, to me, more important than watches. They must perform flawlessly or the will get Good Will tossed.

    I’ve been buying New Balance vibram-soled cross-trainers since they first arrived. I’ve watched ’em grow up (and my feet appreciate every step!). But these, Vibram FiveFingers, are now the ‘shoes’ to own for the outdoorsy sorts.

  496. Silver Whistle says:

    I’ve got a friend who does his fell-running in those, serr8d. Just looking at them cracks me up.

  497. happyfeet says:

    thank you for the followup about the haircut

  498. Jeff G. says:

    Last year’s third string Broncos rookie QB (since released) Tom Brandstater got the same cut.

    And as far as I know, his mother wasn’t a cumslutty Christer vag hag what wants to impregnate you all with Jesus, then force you to birth the little bastard.

  499. happyfeet says:

    preach it brother

  500. Jeff G. says:

    I sprayed Deet all over the manger. Let’s see the little deity get all uppity with a snoutful of enviro poison.

  501. happyfeet says:

    little ones to Him belong they are weak but He is strong

  502. bh says:

    It’s just that kind of sacrilege that forced God to punish Denver with all those injuries.

  503. Jeff G. says:

    At least the injuries are early in camp when nothing much matters.

    Least, I hope. The Dumervil injury is tough, but we have two past number 1s to try to pick up the pass rush slack.

  504. bh says:

    I can’t believe that Moss guy broke his hand then.

    Just shitty luck.

  505. bh says:

    Just came across this report though looking through Ayers’ ESPN page.

  506. serr8d says:

    Ayers is retiring. No champagne allowed.

  507. sdferr says:

    Not before training his replacement.

  508. geoffb says:

    imelda marcos thread

    That crossed my mind too but then I thought, nobody here gets their shoes paid for by robbing the country blind. They all work for every penny paid for those shoes. Me I’m a cheapskate presently wearing a pair of $10 canvas slipons from Walmart, because they for some odd reason fit my broken-arches-spread-out old feet. Fit is the hardest thing for me nowadays.

  509. newrouter says:

    oh i didn’t mean to do that just joking about foot wear talk

  510. geoffb says:

    Understood.

  511. bh says:

    You overpaid, Geoff, I have a $7 pair of blue canvas shoes.

  512. bh says:

    Here, the ultimate performance shoes for lawn mowing.

  513. JD says:

    Or, you can buy a 20 year old paid of Chuck Taylor’s at Goodwill.

  514. JD says:

    paid / pair. I suck.

  515. newrouter says:

    i keep trollhammer running for those times when paid/pair occurs

  516. bh says:

    Towards the pricier dress shoes though, you buy them because you have to. Same with the suits. The ties. The overcoat. Same with the dry cleaning bills and having to stash fresh shirts in different places just in case. All so that you can be 40% less comfortable than most everyone else.

    It’s the uniform. If you don’t wear the uniform, people don’t trust you.

  517. Jeff G. says:

    Moss has a fracture. Dawkins had the same injury last year in training camp. In a couple of weeks they’ll cast him up and get him back out there. Again, at least it happened now and not during the 4th preseason game.

    I’m more worried about Decker’s ankle, frankly.

  518. geoffb says:

    That’s the lace up version. All I know is the the slip-ons fit me and cost $10 at the local store. My feet don’t really match up anymore to most all of the sizes they use except for a few. Everybody seems to use different lasts so I have to look to find ones that match me.

  519. sdferr says:

    Mowing in barefeet covered with fireants helps to dull the sandspurs

  520. geoffb says:

    My job has a “uniform” I have to buy also, and keep a spare set in the car in case I destroy one in a machine. It’s just not pricey or good looking. The shoes/boots though have to fit well and hold up to a lot of rough use. The slip-ons are for home not work.

  521. bh says:

    The internet just informed me that he had a pre-existing high ankle sprain to go along with the foot sprain. Bad news.

    You’re right though, the earlier the better for all this bad luck.

  522. bh says:

    My job has a “uniform” I have to buy also, and keep a spare set in the car in case I destroy one in a machine.

    Yikes. I’m far too much of a klutz to type that sentence… with all ten original fingers.

  523. bh says:

    Though I did tear up my favorite Georgia Bulldogs baseball cap on one of those big ass industrial grinders (took the burs off the edges of steel plates) when I was 17. Thing shot back out at me going about 100 mph.

  524. geoffb says:

    No body parts missing but plenty of scars. You get yours extracurricularly I expect.

  525. sdferr says:

    I found the trick to keeping all the fingers (and all complete) is to live every day in mortal fear of machines. They’re out to get you. It’s a sucky way to go through the day but it seems to work.

  526. geoffb says:

    Would that simply fearing the political class worked to keep them from being “out to get you”. For them you have to make ’em fear you.

  527. newrouter says:

    don’t fear machines fear your inattention to details

  528. newrouter says:

    same with the political class

  529. newrouter says:

    also most machines have an “off” switch the political class doesn’t(not yet).

  530. bh says:

    […]live every day in mortal fear of machines.

    Done. It probably helped that Maximum Overdrive came out when I was an impressionable youth.

  531. bh says:

    I also have a healthy fear of cute pets sold by old men in Chinatown.

  532. happyfeet says:

    hey that’s where gapagus and darwins came from

  533. bh says:

    Uh-oh. I’m sure you already get them wet. DO NOT feed them after midnight.

  534. sdferr says:

    It’s easier said than done, since the 1,000th time you pick up that 7.25″ 1725rpm circular saw it feels like a part of your hand. Same with the 10,000th and the 20,000th. It isn’t, and it’s still out to get you.

  535. Jeff G. says:

    Decker was probably the most NFL-ready of all rookie wideouts — the only reason he fell to the 3rd round was that foot injury, and I loved the pick (a steal if he can get healthy) — so I’m okay with him missing a few weeks, honestly. So long as he didn’t re-aggravate the Lisfranc fracture, the sprained foot is a blessing insofar as it led to the team catching the pre-existing high ankle sprain before it got severe.

    At least, that’s what I’m telling myself. 5 weeks until the games start counting. The Broncos are pretty deep at receiver — though none of the names are really marquee names.

  536. newrouter says:

    from shoes to what sissies

  537. geoffb says:

    A little music for the machine.

  538. sdferr says:

    Better to be bad to the bone than opened to it I guess.

  539. bh says:

    Well, from my hopeful perspective, this is all leading up to McDaniels going wildcat with Tebow in the season opener.

    I can dream anyways.

  540. geoffb says:

    I’m from Michigan. We haven’t had a professional football team since the 50s. No, really.

  541. bh says:

    I’m fucking tired of the Chargers being on top in the AFC West, btw.

  542. sdferr says:

    Leastwise you guys got to have Barry pass through and give y’alls a taste of high art.

  543. bh says:

    All we need to Lions to do is beat the Bears and the Vikings once or twice each, Geoff. The rest of the games don’t matter.

  544. Jeff G. says:

    This is very catchy.

  545. geoffb says:

    Tru dat. I may have to live to be 120 though.

  546. geoffb says:

    Now for Tru Blood. bye.

  547. bh says:

    Another catchy one.

  548. bh says:

    This one isn’t so catchy but it’s what you listen to when you are smoking your first pack of Marlboros and lying to your buddies about getting to second base.

  549. newrouter says:

    good allen music suxs these days

  550. JD says:

    I was listening to David Allen Coe today, while installing ceiling fans. It is hard to route the lights on a ceiling fan thru a dimmer.

    The Colts are going to be good good good again. Shocka.

  551. bh says:

    You know what’s good about the Colts and the Broncos? AFC. I can root for any of them without guilt.

  552. bh says:

    I’m even starting to forget about Elway ruining a perfectly good Super Bowl for me.

  553. JD says:

    I learned today that it is hard to install a large ceiling fan by yourself, while balancing on the very top of a folding ladder.

  554. B Moe says:

    I’m from Michigan. We haven’t had a professional football team since the 50s. No, really.

    The Schembechler era Wolverines had their moments.

  555. Ric Locke says:

    JD, are you just not paying attention? The blue wire goes to the dimmer. The black wire goes to the continuous (if you use the pull chain) or switched (if you turn it on and off from the wall) wire. Easy peasy.

    Regards,
    Ric

  556. Danger says:

    “Hey Danger, how’s the trip treating you so far?”

    bh,

    The trip has been good I’ve heard from Abe and BJT who both were flexible about meeting. I’d like to get together Tuesday or Wednesday. I might be able to stretch it til Thursday though.

  557. geoffb says:

    The Schembechler era Wolverines had their moments.

    My one year at MSU they weren’t too bad either. But the Lions, arrgghh.

  558. Danger says:

    bh,

    I sent you an e-mail w/ my cell # included.

  559. JD says:

    That is what the booklet said too, Ric. But there is a white wire and a black wire just floating around there and I gave up for the night. I took it all apart, and will try again tomorrow. Electricity and I do not get along, ever since I took 220v and went all epileptic on the kitchen floor.

  560. newrouter says:

    robots all

  561. bh says:

    Shit. Sorry, Danger. Missed that but see it now.

    Tomorrow morning I’ll see if I can lock in a meeting with our clients and then I’ll email and/or give you call.

  562. serr8d says:

    Electricity and I do not get along, ever since I took 220v and went all epileptic on the kitchen floor.

    First rulez of wirez: with a wire in one hand, kip other hand in pocketses. Because if you have 2 wireses, or a hand on a ground (stovetop, chassis) you’ll create a nice path for zee moving electrons. Right across your heart. Never a dull moment when that happens.

  563. JD says:

    this.

    Okay, she is way way way sexy …

  564. JD says:

    serr8d – I was trying to install a new 220v outlet. Grabbed the wrong wire when pulling the wires through the wall.

  565. bh says:

    You seem to be partial to brunettes, JD.

  566. serr8d says:

    There’s this thinger in the garage or basement called the ‘breaker box’. When in doubt, hit ’em all, and use a flashlight. You can always reset the alarm clocks.

  567. bh says:

    Silly, everyone knows you’re supposed to lick wires to make sure they’re not hot.

  568. JD says:

    I just use a lightbulb and hit the wires against the bottom of the bulb. If it lights up, or blows up, I have live wires. It works.

    bh – It does seem to be a trend.

  569. bh says:

    By the way, this wiring nonsense is all pretty much off topic.

    This thread is about how great Ed Gillespie looked in stylish Oxfords before he sprained his ankle and went onto the Broncos IR.

    And Bjork.

  570. JD says:

    I would stick a live 220v line right in bjork’s eyeball if she ever got anywhere near me.

  571. serr8d says:

    Two live wires in 220, JD, and a neutral. Which isn’t really a ground until it gets to your breaker box.

  572. JD says:

    See, this is exactly why I get shocked every time I mess with that invisible shit.

  573. serr8d says:

    bjork sounds like a real live wire. Call it ‘nishi’ and ‘feets would hit it?

  574. JD says:

    That Kia commercial with the lifesized sock monkeys is way freaky.

  575. serr8d says:

    There’s this cool device that ‘squeaks’ if it’s near a live wire; no batteries needed, powers itself through induction. Bonus! it’s also a wire stripper; leave the steak knives in the kitchen drawer!

  576. bh says:

    For the record, I’d probably nail Bjork and nishi. It’s one of those stories you could tell people. Mescaline and gin. Get the proportion right and it’d be like one of those Beatles cartoons.

    And, dude, you strip wires with your teeth. Steak knives? What are you, some sort of fancy intellectual?

  577. bh says:

    coughjeff’sanintellectualandsoiseveryoneelsewelike:miltonfriedman
    thosepeoplewhotalkaboutsignifiersthatjeffreferencesthatguywhoinventedFAKE
    sowedidn’tneedtokillanymoreelephantstoplaypoolandthestuffyouputintoyourpool
    soitdoesntturngreenandtheguywhofiguredoutyoushouldn’tlookintoaguntoseeifits
    loadedandthatgayguywhohelpedbeatthenaziswithannoyingtechnomusicandclevercodebreakingcough

  578. Amy says:

    There seems to something particularly pernicious about going to the polls in order to remove a civil right from a group of Americans.

  579. pdbuttons says:

    do not make fun of bjork please…
    just a warning…
    like going over the security fence in the zoo cuz u wanna touch the
    polar bear /bond with it
    putting ur hands thru the bars cuz u want to
    pet it?.. cuz it’s cute?..
    then it rips ur arms off …?
    don’t fjuck with bjork!
    don’t even bjoke about her…

  580. serr8d says:

    hmmmph. ya broke it.

    This here forum need some strippings.

    There seems to something particularly pernicious about going to the polls in order to remove a civil right from a group of Americans.

    Whaaat?
    Speaking of Prop 8’s 7M plus voters, who legally voted “Nay, scoundrels!
    You’ll not ruin the institution of Marriage, when you have already your
    stinking Civil Unions!” as was their right?

    How was a civil right removed that wasn’t there in the first place? And
    has never been there since this country was founded? The 14th Amendment
    wasn’t installed until 1868; that’s what the Funny Judge Walker used to
    strike Prop 8.

    History, my child; it’ll do a mind good.

    And stay out of the damned refrigerator.

  581. pdbuttons says:

    how were the pjyramids bjuilt..?
    bjork i tells ya..

    what came fjirst..?
    the cjhicken or the ejgg?..

  582. bh says:

    Thanks, Jeff.

    I couldn’t figure out where to put the commas.

  583. pdbuttons says:

    it’s not bjorks impish grin that bothers me..
    or her sprightly ways..
    or her sing-songy…
    it’s that fact that she can hover…
    above me/u/ us..
    and bring death from above!..
    but/ hey.. water is wet.

    get used to it

  584. Jeff G. says:

    Jeff is Gulliver after his travels. Barns, horses — they rawk. The smell is bad, sure, but if you go all metaphorical, it’s like sleeping in roses and cinnamon compared to the stench most humans give off.

  585. Jeff G. says:

    Incidentally, my wife just got an iPhone for work, so we switched plans and I got one too — thanks to some old Apple gift cards we’d had lying around.

    Which means I’m now part of the 21st century. I might even Tweet, if some hot chick promises to blow me if I do.

    If not? Doodle Jump.

  586. pdbuttons says:

    tis kinda hard to get a fitful nights sleep
    with coconut halves tied to ur elbows…
    believe me. i know..
    but just remember to close the closet door..
    cuz u may just wake up in the morn

    and i love u!
    kinda/ i tjhink..
    let me pjee first…

    yup/ ur awesome!
    give urself a pjat on ur bjack..
    trooper!

  587. pdbuttons says:

    bjork laughs at human concepts like centuries..
    while she cleans her fingers/hoof/claw nails..
    she say she say/ who shall i pjick off fjirst?
    that ajsshole?.. mmm/ no..
    that ajsshole?..mmm..mjaybe
    u?
    why did elvis die with his face around a porcelian toilet bowl?
    why is bjork the shade off a toilet bowl?
    sure/ take a shit in said bowl..
    puke in it…
    take a shit in the nearest field but…

    ain’t gonna save ya…

    knock knock knocking on heavens door…

  588. bh says:

    Just so we’re clear, there isn’t actually an app with hot chicks promising to blow you per tweet, right?

    Sounds like a cult. It’s always awesome at first.

  589. pdbuttons says:

    mosquito bites are bjorks way of
    collecting ur blood for some mad dr mengele experiment..
    that frankly/ i don’t want to know about..
    bee stings/hornets/papercuts..
    are her way of reminding u ur an asshole…

  590. bh says:

    I also hope Bjork kills you last, buttons.

    But, maybe, I really hope I’m second last and then, maybe, I’m not so much dead as pretending.

    And then Blue comes and pees in her mouth.

    Amen.

  591. pdbuttons says:

    if u ever get arrested and have one phone call…to make..
    call bjork!/ cuz she’ll come down to the police staion and
    be all terminator like..
    laying waste. pumping..
    and pull u out of county..
    u’ll be all like.. i didn’t want 50 cops shot..
    i just wanted bail money..?

    and as she’s sucking/licking the smoke off the gun..
    and winks
    that’s when u know ur fucked

  592. pdbuttons says:

    bjorks gonna kill bobby orr last/ then me
    then…u?

  593. pdbuttons says:

    why djid bjork cross the road?
    to get to the other side/ u silly gooseeeee!

    why/ oh why/ did she return to the first side?

    to watch u writhe in pain
    and piss on your on your corpse
    cuz she’s a freakazoid!

  594. happyfeet says:

    please report

  595. happyfeet says:

    err paging Mr. orr I mean

  596. pdbuttons says:

    it ain’t the truck drivers who
    are up my ass as i drive
    respectfully i might add/ on American roads/ all leagle
    it’s when i look in the rear viw mirror and i got a 18 wheeler up my ass..
    and i notice the driver looks like bjork!

    thats when it’s
    game over!/ done/set/match…

  597. pdbuttons says:

    bjork thinks human earthling hands are
    the freakiest..
    thumbs up!

    she/ it also loves dolphins
    long walks on the beach..
    retarded cripple children with one or more wires in their eyes

    her hates are..
    you
    two legged things
    mercy
    crippled farm babies who can’t plow or pull their crippled weight… eaters!
    russian space{ha ha!) stations

    and general fuckery..

  598. pdbuttons says:

    bjork can skip rope
    and be all “doublely doubele dutchly”
    to prove she’s all street and that..
    but she’d rather take them jumpy ropes and tie u up
    she’d rather hang u with piano wire/ but double dutch ropes be good..
    as long as they have the dna of fatherless inner city young pussy on
    their ropes
    cuz their ain’t no sweeter taste/ than doubley dutchy ropes
    that have young fatherless thang hand sweat on them…? cuz u can lick ropes in private
    is there?//
    rascist bastards!

  599. pdbuttons says:

    two crippled farm babies square off
    against a watermelon.. which/ may or may not be moving../ or rolling..
    i call it/ mmm/ battle of the network stars?
    heres the concept..
    two young crippled farm babies crawl out into a field..
    cuz theirs mommas drunk and passed out so they “get away”

    and they meet a tiny watermelon who teaches them about racial justice

  600. pdbuttons says:

    season two
    young watermelon gets bigger !
    but unfortunateley one crippled farm baby gets licked in the eye
    or crawls in farm animal doo doo
    and gets all sluggish..
    but the other crippled farm baby tu/ tu/ tu/ tucks his
    pa/ pa/ pa/pa/ pants in!
    and comes to the rescue!..
    maybe..
    tune in for channel th
    thr’ three

  601. pdbuttons says:

    season four..
    radical terrorist / they parachute?
    land?/
    dunno/ but they show up on the farm..
    and the little cripple farm babies ..
    get all patriotic and crawl like all get out..
    they’re crawling here/ crawling there..
    stealth cripple crawling..
    and they kill the bad guys!
    and i think one of the crippled farm babies fall in love..
    or falls/

    tune in 4 eppysoda fiver u punks!

  602. sdferr says:

    I suspect that one model of the horse-lover Swift looked to is Antiphon, Plato’s half-brother (mother shared), who, though he turned away from pursuit of philosophy to focus on horses, yet was capable years later to recall from memory the encounter of youthful Socrates, Parmenides, and Zeno, having learned that conversation by heart from Pythodorus, who was present for the event and had often recited it to Antiphon.

    Some people, hearing the discussion of the three, assume it was the complexity of the subject which put Antiphon off. I don’t. I think it was the degeneracy of Athenian politics in general, and the execution of Socrates in particular: disgust with people, in other words, and not with the subject.

    It’s an interesting name, Antiphon. A near literal translation might be Counter-call. It’s odd in English, but better than “sound-from-opposite” or the like.

    So much for this conjecture.

  603. […] Jeff Goldstein demurs: Well, there’s that and the thousands of years of precedent about what marriage is and what it isn’t — but to certain libertarians, that’s to be casually tossed aside as “none of their business.” […]

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