I’m pretty sure that’s what you call a rhetorical question. Thomas Sowell:
[…] [A] democracy needs informed citizens if it is to thrive, or ultimately even survive.
In our times, American democracy is being dismantled, piece by piece, before our very eyes by the current administration in Washington, and few people seem to be concerned about it.
The president’s poll numbers are going down because increasing numbers of people disagree with particular policies of his, but the damage being done to the fundamental structure of this nation goes far beyond particular counterproductive policies.
Just where in the Constitution of the United States does it say that a president has the authority to extract vast sums of money from a private enterprise and distribute it as he sees fit to whomever he deems worthy of compensation? Nowhere.
And yet that is precisely what is happening with a $20 billion fund to be provided by BP to compensate people harmed by their oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico.
Many among the public and in the media may think that the issue is simply whether BP’s oil spill has damaged many people, who ought to be compensated.
But our government is supposed to be “a government of laws and not of men.”
If our laws and our institutions determine that BP ought to pay $20 billion — or $50 billion or $100 billion — then so be it.
But the Constitution says that private property is not to be confiscated by the government without “due process of law.”
Technically, it has not been confiscated by Barack Obama, but that is a distinction without a difference.
With vastly expanded powers of government available at the discretion of politicians and bureaucrats, private individuals and organizations can be forced into accepting the imposition of powers that were never granted to the government by the Constitution.
If you believe that the end justifies the means, then you don’t believe in constitutional government.
Sure. But you may just be a “pragmatic conservative” — so when you finally succeed in getting your guys back into power (which, let’s face it, seems to be your only and ubiquitous concern), you’re hoping your guy will get to play King, too!
— Well, provided he or she does so in a way that can’t be taken out of context by reasonable people.
Because that would be unhelpful.
Sowell again:
If the agreement with BP was an isolated event, perhaps we might hope that it would not be a precedent. But there is nothing isolated about it.
The man appointed by President Obama to dispense BP’s money as the administration sees fit, to whomever it sees fit, is only the latest in a long line of presidentially appointed “czars” controlling different parts of the economy, without even having to be confirmed by the Senate, as Cabinet members are.
Those who cannot see beyond the immediate events to the issues of arbitrary power — vs. the rule of law and the preservation of freedom — are the “useful idiots” of our time. But useful to whom?
Not to BP, that’s for sure.
But then, BP had it coming, anyway, so it’s politically inopportune to cry over them. After all, they can afford it. And scapegoating feels so right — especially to those who rarely get to feel like part of the majority these days.
Sanctimony! Nuance!
(h/t The Virginian)
Team R is complicit in this.
Me. Sowell doesn’t really make that clear I don’t think.
oh. that should be Mr. Sowell.
Why does feets like moral equivalency so much? Didn’t that go out with the Soviet Empire? Moreover, I think Jeff addressed that with his swipe at the “pragmatic” (sic).
You hadn’t noticed John Boehner lately Curmudgeon, or is it that his conduct just fills you with confidence in the Republicans?
Moral equivalency is the new “staunch conservatism”, apparently.
I’ve discussed how some forms of formalist interpretation are a version of “ends justify the means”-type of maneuver at the very structural level of their functioning.
That the end result is that such structural imperatives produce an epistemology that is incompatible with constitutional government should therefore come as no surprise.
It hasn’t to me.
Curmudgeon, it is simply that hf will leap like a tiger at anything vaguely “R” connected. It gets really old, really fast. Sowell was pointing out what is happening UNDER THE CURRENT ASDMINISTRATION and the first comment out of the hf box is “R’s fault too!!!!11!1!”
WTF?
I’m for what Jeff brings up for discussion- not another thread full of “Boehnerfag” and “failcock R’s” or whatever.
Joe will be along to tell us that Sowell is defending BP, and if you are not BP then you should just shut the fuck up.
You hadn’t noticed John Boehner lately Curmudgeon, or is it that his conduct just fills you with confidence in the Republicans?
Like I said, sideswipes at the “pragmatic” (sic) are always appreciated. But you can’t harsh on my main man Tom Sowell without expecting bandwidths of “hate” (sic).
Thomas Sowell is a national treasure. I’m sure all the media will want to have him on to interview him for his newest observations about Barry and his gang of thugs.
I didn’t harsh on Mr. Sowell. Team R didn’t not stand up for the rule of law. They are complicit. They’re definitely showing some signs of being willing to stand up for the rule of law for so they can beat down the uppity homos, but on this one they’ve left the field.
*didn’t* I mean jeez I’m late and I got up early too
If the problem raised is a question of interpretation, what its aim is, how it’s done, and so on, and we see Republicans behaving in their interpretive acts just as Democrats do, we’re somehow supposed to overlook that as a minor quirk, or are we to expect that the Republicans will act just as Democrats do on the same theory of power that the Democrats hold? Seems to me that happyfeet isn’t wrong about the need to hold Republicans to the same standard of judgment. Or if he is wrong, why?
Sowell is rightly concerned. Why wouldn’t he point out that Boehner and McConnell only aid the progress toward tyranny Sowell rues when they slap down truthful speech? (I think he would, by the way, if asked.)
#14 – it is more of a piece that we have Sowell pointing out what the current Administration is doing – and immediately the entire thread is ‘jacked into a discussion of how bad “R” is… it gets repetitive and boring as hell. Yes, we know, we have heard it endlessly.
How about we advance a discussion past, solely, hf denouncing “R” and everyone discussing that?
JD, go fuck yourself.
“How about we advance a discussion past, solely, hf denouncing “R” and everyone discussing that?”
I’m with you LTC, wherever you’d choose to go with that. Advance away. No problem there so far as I’m concerned. But neither do I have a problem with hf pointing out the similarities. Nor Jeff, for that matter.
sdferr, Sowell probably doesn’t mention it *now* because it’s a short article and his main point is what the Democrats are doing.
I’m actually with hf on Team R, though. I’m not going to roust myself off of my new couch to GOTV for a bunch of people just itching to take over the slush funds and extra-legal power that the Democrats have scraped up. La-di-freakin’-da on that one.
Did you ever think the tyrany might be Obama offering a carrot to BP as opposed to the stick? And it is strange BP was going to do this deal before Obama and his hentchbitches grilled them in a private meeting for 45 minutes. And that paragon of virtue, Rahm Emanuel, says they got BP to cave. Right.
JD, go fuck yourself.
And the universe is back in balance.
“sdferr, Sowell probably doesn’t mention it *now* because it’s a short article and his main point is what the Democrats are doing.”
Which is why I pointed out that I believe the would agree with the proposition that Boehner and McConnell aren’t helping, but hurting.
Go fuck myself? For accurately describing your position on this matter? No thanks.
Oh, I get your point, LTC. I can hate on the Dems for a while. :)
Actually, I thought about it, and the whole Obama administration just gave me a headache, so I’m going to get a cup of tea. I’ll hate on the Dems when I am strengthened by tea.
sdferr – Sowell has identified the problem. The solutions are partly self-evident; cast those that believe this is the way to run things out into the electoral wilderness. However, Jeff is fightinng the longer term battle – how do you inculcate the value of seperation of powers, respect for law and the intent of those that write it into the people as a whole. Much of that comes back to his seemingly endless struggle to poinnt out that it involves taking back language from those that subvert it. Those are the ideas, the discussion, the solutions I want to see and hear about.
* believe the would agree * should read: believe he would agree.
As Abe stated, how many times does Joe plan on making the same argument, like rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic?
sdferr, yep, you did say that. I was really just babbling.
Did I mention that I need tea?
Also, why does my “n” key repeat? Another answer I seek…
JD, at lest Joe was shorter and to the point this time. That’s something!
Look! Joe linked again to the irrelevant bit about BP entering voluntarily into an agreement that makes a mockery out of Congressional oversight, the Constitution, et al.!
What BP got out of the deal.
“… how do you inculcate the value of separation of powers, respect for law and the intent of those that write it into the people as a whole.”
I tend to argue, more or less obsessively I guess, that classical liberal arts education is the way to go. People think that’s boring. But you know, whatever, fuck ’em if they can’t take a solution.
Apparently someone does not understand what a shakedown is. Typically, they get something. It is almost definitional.
Jeff, and it took seconds after your comment for Joe to do it again… maybe I will just come back tomorrow when the threads are not being derailed by Joe and hf.
BP and Obama, the cozy relationship of conveinance.
Joe: Of course BP got something out of the deal. They sat down with the King and bargained.
You seem unconcerned that the problem is the method, not the deal — the means, not the ends.
Which brings us full circle…
Joe, wasn’t the whole issue that BP doesn’t, or shouldn’t get to make any deal outside the law, i.e., via a deal with the executive branch?
Jeff, then we have to take control of Congress and the Presidency so you can prevent this sort of abuse in the future. I am not defending the process either, it sucks. But BP hired its democratic insiders and cut a deal. We should be driving home the rather cordial relationship between BP and Obama rather than trying to separate them.
“I am not defending the process either…”
Something about that proposition just doesn’t sit right, since on the face of things it has seemed like you’ve done nothing else for the last few days.
It sucked when Bush and Paulson did it with the banks and TARP. But it is interesting how civil Obama and BP are to each other, it is almost like they are allies…
Same argument, 40th time. Still non-responsive. You are defending the process, absolutely. You can try to walk back your 83029638174r929387465982764982736498726359872635 comments that you made on this, but it won’t change the fact that you are fine with them operating outside of the law, the legal system, for political expediency, and because you want to scapegoat a bad actor.
The whole point is that it shouldn’t matter who is in power. An abuse is an abuse.
“Jeff, and it took seconds after your comment for Joe to do it again… maybe I will just come back tomorrow when the threads are not being derailed by Joe and hf.”
And cynn/meya/nishi/whoever hasn’t even shown up yet. She must be riding her Sybian this morning.
Correction, Team DC is complicit in this, for crying out loud in the blog. Regardless, this question isn’t being asked of hapless Team R, ‘feets.
sdferr, no.
I just did not see the wisdom of apologizing for BP for cutting some deal voluntarily on its own with Obama (who it was rather cozy with long before the spill). As for challenging the constitutionality of Obama and BP’s actions–did this deal violate due process? Unfortunately not in a way you can challenge legally now.
We need to win Congress and the Presidency and perhaps we can prevent these sort of things in the future.
Joe has exceeded the densest natural element, Seaborgium. I give the science community its replacement, Joeminium!
The whole point is that it shouldn’t matter who is in power. An abuse is an abuse.
Of course. If the process is wrong it is wrong. And I do recall you criticizing Paulson and Bush when they did it. But until you get politicans in office who will make these administration deals illegal, or a President who will nominate Supreme Court justices who recognize the issue and will oppose it, I do not see how you challenge these arrangements.
You spin me right ’round, baby
Right ’round
Like a record, baby
Right ’round, ’round, ’round
.
.
.
Take it back to RSM already.
Not a snowball’s chance when a proper republican philosophy isn’t found among but a fraction of the classical right, Joe.
If the process is wrong it is wrong.
Unless a bad actor is involved. Or unless the bad actor agrees to be fucked, voluntarily. Or the bad actor can afford it.
“…the wisdom of apologizing for BP…”
This is mincing cuntery, Joe. Still. Was at the start. Is now. So you know, you aren’t criticizing the process, where you claim you aren’t defending it.
The Heritage Foundation states your position well.
I am still not sure Obama really threatended BP, I think the two are very much together on this.
sdferr – Normally I would note that there is a difference between not criticizing a policy and defending a policy, but he has actively defended this by throwing every conceivable strawidiot at the wall trying to make something stick, to no avail.
What we should do with the rule of law is roll it up and smoke it, yeah ‘feets and Joe?
Either you’re for it or you ain’t. And if you’re for it only some of the time, then you ain’t.
Rather, until we stamp out corporatism, progressivism, and fascism, meaning ending the lobby and literally stripping ninety nine out of every hundred laws from the books, Joe. Where on the right do you see that advocated when the ostensible right advocates cooperation of a nice flavor of principate of mango?
JD, agreeing to be fucked voluntarily matters.
Sdferr, I’m suddenly tempted to give you a cool fighting nickname.
The Mangler sort of rhymes, doesn’t it?
Joe, agreeing to something corrupt is still corrupt.
then we have to take control of Congress and the Presidency so you can prevent this sort of abuse in the future.
Who’s we, white boy? Team R?
Dream on.
flavor of = flavor with
No, Joe, it has no bearing whatsoever on whether or not Barcky was acting under the color of the law. If so, you should be able to show us what law he was acting under, and when the Constitution was changed to allow him legislative and judicial powers, without you know, actually letting the legislature and judiciary do their jobs. BP got an agreement to only pay $100,000,000 towards 2 things that they owed exactly $0 for, and you think this was not a shakedown? Good Allah.
Fuck off, meya. At least you have company with Joe on your side on this issue.
JD, Barack was not acting under any law. Hell, even Bush and Paulson made sure they had some Congrssional backing before they did what they did. Barack did not even bother to do an executive order. Barack just did it. And BP went along with it.
dicentra. You are right. Team R is not probably going to do it (at least with its current make up). You are going to need a lot more conservative candidate to change that.
That your head doesn’t assplode is simply amazing.
Sort of rhymes with ….. boring?
There is a pony in that pile of shit…honest to gawd!
So, noble Proggs, I guess “shredding the Constitution” – including your own “my rights! my rights!” civilian court due process even for freaking Terrorists, and the unconditional obligation of the Federal Gov’t to enforce existing Federal Law, provide for National Security, etc. – is suddenly ok when it’s in service of dem good ol’ “positive liberties” = “might makes right”?
Nuts, meet
epistemic closureNutshell.Either you’re for it or you ain’t. And if you’re for it only some of the time, then you ain’t.
Ok. The speed limit in my neighborhood is 25 mph. Some people choose to drive a fair bit faster. I don’t like it, but I do tolerate it most of the time.
That doesn’t mean I can rightly flip a biscuit when some jackass tears through at 75 mph.
There are those that will point fingers and say I’m to blame for not decrying everyone who exceeds the posted limit. Screw them. Out in reality land it is always a matter of degrees.
Well Obama is tearing down Constitution Avenue at Mach 2 taking out everything in sight and anyone who wants to quibble about who started it needs to buy a fucking clue.
can’t rightly flip a biscuit
Just a minor rhetorical quibble, but who flips biscuits in the first place?
Pancakes, sure. Waffles (nature’s pixelated pancake), unnecessary. But every biscuit I’ve ever seen or made has involved a lump of dough placed on a metal sheet and baked until Golden Brown and Delicious. No flipping.
And, in the spirit of pragamatism: “ANSWER THE QUESTION!!!”
I’m disappointed.
No Donald Rumsfeld angle.
Dig down deeper, Joe
Heh.
This is your argument in its defense?
Are you fucking nuts?
Blast.
Drill blah-blah-blah period
Maybe Obama should do a GW Bush … violate habeas corpus due process, suspend the Constitution, and torture the BP CEOs in order to ‘defend America’??? BTW… Thomas Sowell was a big defender of Bush torture practices. So when a Republican is president, he can lock people up for as long as he wants and torture them, but when a Democratic president asks a multi-national company to establish an independently managed escrow for damages stemming from their negligent destruction of the Gulf of Mexico and several states’ economies, not to mention the deaths of 11 workers, and they agree to do so — the Constitution is being trampled and the very nature of American democracy is threatened?
OK uncle Tom
Jeff’s comment above:
Compare to a post at firedoglake:
Does it embarrass you, William Yelverton, midget cat serenader, that I can identify you just on your repetitive plagiarism?
It should. It’s the sort of thing you can lose tenure over.
anything Obama did what approached presidential would be welcome at this point
bh – That was a thing of beauty. Willie the Plagiarist Yelverton, the bigoted hillack.
WTF is William Yelverson and what does that have to do with me quoting FDL?
Conservatives for BP. That’s what you need to know.
Barcky for BP. Chu for BP to save the world. That is who you are.
You did not quote FDL, you lifted their work wholesale. Drivel no matter how it is presented, but in your case, you did not quote nor attribute.
That’s hilarious… Because you said that here under a different name… and then back at your blog. Would you like the links?
Dude, you’re really not intelligent enough to play here.
Jeff shits on the Constitution, and pisses on the Bill of Rights.
He is not intelligent enough to play in a sandox, without a helmet and adult supervision.
Willie the racist skinjack hillflute player is a retard. As are you, being that you and he are one and the same. That is all YOU need to know, troll.
http://hotair.com/archives/2010/06/22/obamas-energy-secretary-in-2007-bp-is-going-to-help-save-the-world-or-something/
This is Barcky’s BP, Chu’s BP, Jeff/willie the racist hilljack plagiarist Yelverton’s BP.
Goodnight, all. Early round of golf tomorrow, hopefully done in time to watch the US soccer game.
Here:
At his blog(cached link):
Earlier he thought this was clever off something you said, JD. Under some name or another.
Willie, you do understand that there are many people in the world more observant than you, right?
This plagiarism though, Willie. That’s considered a “serious offense” in your little world. You should realize this.
Do Willie, SFAG, et al actually believe that their constant name changes fool anybody? I can’t decide whether that’s funny or sad.
#87: That’s right, bh. He should talk to Ward Churchill about that. It’s the academic equivalent of getting Al Capone for tax evasion.
If he wasn’t such a committed fascist, I’d actually feel sorry for him, SBP.
Thanks for the tip JD. Now that I’ve kicked your asses so many times, you think I’m everywhere. Priceless.
Go Jeff #74
A slighty smarter midget would have at least feigned innocence again.
This is too easy.
This is awesome.
Willie, (let’s all pretend) did you know someone here was ripping off your blog?
Willie, do you realize that you’ve forgotten to use a period under two different names now in this thread?
It’s another of your tics.
Yelverton is so stupid that he lowers his cat’s IQ just by sharing a house with it.
And Willie just happens to show up in the thread where he’s under discussion. In the middle of the night.
Racist hilljack skinflute plagiarist.
Wait, were did Jeff go?
Yelverton is here but Jeff isn’t proclaiming his innocence anymore.
This shit is hard, isn’t it, Willie?
I am everywhere. Come to me, get your ass kicked. Glenn loves to see you at TN Free. Abe Froman, old buddy, how goes it? How are things in wingnut land?
Hey, Willie, someone keeps coming here and ripping off your blog. Like three or four times now. Would you like to know their IP address so that you can get to the bottom of this?
Jeff?
Jeff?
Where did you go?
Good times.
Speaking of plagerism and sock puppets, what is it with you closeted homos always lusting after my ‘skin flute’? Don’t go through life like Larry Craig, SBP. Playing pirate is ok, but picking up guys in restrooms is a bit lame. What a coincidence, several commenters all calling me a very specific name… hmmm
You can’t make this stuff up.
Yelverton forgot another period. Unbelievable.
Ever watch a cat try to bury a turd on a hardwood floor?
I guess we can add “homophobic” to Willie’s skill set.
Better watch that, too, Willie.
I love the way he misspells “plagiarism”. Higher education is doomed, I tell you. Doomed.
No Abe, SBP, you can’t touch my dick. Try JD, he’ll meet you at the golf club restroom.
I will tell my grandchildren about the legend of Yelverton. I shit you not.
Jeff?
I don’t know about you guys, but I’m sensing hostility toward gays here. I wonder if Willie’s institution has a “speech code”.
And bh, thanks for the spellcheck. You’re a good little teabagger
Keep distracting the loser so he doesn’t serenade me.
Yelverton [missed] another period
King warned us about that mountaintop.
But did we listen?
No, again.
Abe Froman, old buddy, how goes it? How are things in wingnut land?
Silly me, I forgot to say “hello” back. Hi Willie the racist hilljack skinflute player! I wouldn’t know how things in wingnut land are, actually. You’re the one who lives in a holler, so why don’t you tell me?
Goodnight everyone, my much younger and extremely hot girlfriend will be coming in the morning and I need to rest up. It’s going to get pretty hot here tomorrow. Thanks JD for letting me know about this thread.
my much younger and extremely hot girlfriend
Sexist, too! Hope it isn’t one of your students — that’ll get you canned as well.
She ain’t hot, Willie. Sorry.
On the other hand, serenading me is the closest Willie has ever gotten to real pussy.
Plagiarism a serious offense? Shit. It’s the only offense. Rewriting the same piece over and over again? That’s just CV padding. Gotta keep your production up, you know. Next time cite yourself buddy.
I’m thinking of an old, old joke with the punchline “Bring out the cat and grease its butt”.
Did this actually just happen?
It’s like a Monty Python sketch, bh.
Okay, later, guys. No way we’re topping Willie’s little performance tonight.
Time to close my eyes and think of Donald Pleasence.
That was parody…..please?
Wow. William does a cheap remake of the Gleens Greenwald sockpuppetry saga, using only a third of the requisite IQ.
And a cat plays the Brazilian cabana boy!
Hell, reading this was funnier than willie the racist homophobic hiiljack trying to talk about Barcky is better at creating jobs than Bush.
Not to mention the Dow.
Hush, SFAG. There’s no way you’re going to be able to top Willie’s self-humiliation tour de force.
What a coincidence, several commenters all calling me a very specific name… hmmm
It’s more than you do for yourself, and that isn’t your chest you’re beating.
Meya – are you going to contend that Barcky has done a better job at job creation than Bush? Yes or no. Then jam that vuvuzela where the sun don’t shine.
I don’t think SFAG understands the meaning of the word “job”, actually.
SBP – willie’s performance is going to be tough to beat, but meya is nothing, if not persistent in its mendoucheity.
JD, what are you talking about? Obama has SLOWED the rate of job loss, hasn’t he?
We were bleeding jobs under Bush. We’re all bled-out now. See how much better off we are?
Well William,
Amazing to see you have aquired enough scrotal content to post under your own name, instead of the countless socks that you generally use. But, you know, we still see through them all to your own presence, your style is at once unmistakable and unremarkable; might have something to do with the shameless plagiarism…
Oh, and don’t flatter yourself; none of us want any of your underdeveloped genetalia. It’s just an amusing sobriquet, invented by our own JD, that is so apropo that we’ve all adopted it; willie the racist hilljack skinflute player is who you are.
Although, considering you hail from New York, I suppose we should add “carpetbagger” into that list somewhere.
When the little weaselly mob guy leans on your store counter and offers his fire insurance with his 6’5″ 260# partner lounging by the door, it does not matter that you were considering fire insurance earlier or even if you were considering his product to buy, it’s still extortion, illegal, wrong, and evil. Done by a US President makes it worse not better.
Why are you a BP defender, geoffb? How is SC? Get any low country cooking yet?
BbbbbbbuuuuuuSssshhhh!!!! Yes or no, meya?
“When the little weaselly mob guy leans on your store counter and offers his fire insurance with his 6?5? 260# partner lounging by the door, it does not matter that you were considering fire insurance earlier or even if you were considering his product to buy, it’s still extortion, illegal, wrong, and evil.”
The problem that this misses out is that in BP’s case, you’re offering fire insurance to someone who’s reckless incompetence set their own store on fire. So where your partner is standing is rather immaterial. We’re getting a valdez’s worth every how many days? That cost 5 billion and 20 years of litigation. Even if all that this fund accomplishes is that 20 billion gets disbursed with minimum litigation costs, BP and the compensated people come out ahead.
#138: Your “hopes” would have far more credibility if we had any evidence that you had any intent of ever getting a productive job, SFAG.
Just sayin’.
C’mon meya,
You know it was more than 3 million over 8 years; that’s just the net figure including the effects of the financial crisis at the end of his term. Boooooooooooooooosh! was cursed in that respect, inheriting the effects of the dot-com bubble bursting, 9/11, and then the real estate bubble bursting and the concomitant financial crunch.
And, by the way, for all of the p[alaver about “jobs saved or created” bu your boy Obama and the idiot Biden, how many jobs have been lost since the spendulus-that-will-save-our-economy was passed last year? IIRC, it’s aroung 3.5 million or so…
But, you know, that’s all on Boooooooooooooooooosh! anyway, right?
You’re tiresome meya, do us all a favor and find another niche to haunt…
I wonder how many names meya will go through before finally arriving at DissemblingCuntbag?
“One day, I’ll grow up and become a tea party leader on disability or something.”
So for now momma’s basement is good enough though, eh?
“Net is kind of what matters, don’t you think? Why don’t want to count jobs lost? That’s odd. The financial crisis was a disaster — I think counting through that makes something of a net of 0 jobs for the 2000’s.”
I didn’t say not to count the jobs lost, I was only enplainng why the net figure seemed so low. First you said only 3 million jobs were created during the Boooooooooooooosh! term, now you’re saying it’s zero. Which one is it meya? And are you trying to lay the jobs lost under Obama’s failed economic policies off on his predecessor somehow?
I thought we’d finally stop hearing the plaintive cry; “I BLAME BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOSH!“
Nah. I like to spend all day on da blogs.
There’s no other explanation for a weirdo who has so little self-respect that it subjects itself to endless mockery in order to lie, dissemble and peddle hack politico spin designed to sway or in the very least confuse low information voters. Every minute you’ve spent here has been a wasted one. Every single one of them.
One day, I’ll grow up
Not bloody likely.
designed to sway or in the very least confuse low information voters.
Of which there are very few here, needless to say. SFAG fail. Big time.
What is Barcky’s net, lying twat?
And the government needs to be involved in that why? How is that an improvement over BP paying claims on its own?
“And the government needs to be involved in that why?”
It doesn’t need to be. That’s why its nice that Obama did it.
“How is that an improvement over BP paying claims on its own?”
They were going around offering money in exchange for liability waivers. The state AG’s put a stop to that, but nobody cried.
Barcky’s net, you lying douchenozzle?
Why is that nice? When did liability determination become a function of the Executive branch?
It is nice for the govt to get involved in something it shouldn’t be involved in?
“And the government needs to be involved in that why?”
It doesn’t need to be. That’s why its nice that Obama did it.
It’s “nice” I suppose if you’re not a big supporter of the Constitution.
Just like it’s “nice” that the government is getting concerned with
ouryour overweight children, and smoking, andwhat we do in the bedroom, and how much we earn, and how much we should be able to keep, and our healthcare, and …“Why is that nice? When did liability determination become a function of the Executive branch?”
They haven’t made a liability determination. That’s up to the process that the Ashcroft appointee to the 9/11 victims fund will design. To right thinking people like Thomas Sowell, this is like Hitler.
“It’s “nice” I suppose if you’re not a big supporter of the Constitution.”
I’m not seeing what the constitutional problem is here. Like what do you think has been violated? You think the president can’t talk to people and ask them to do things? You’re imagining this is some presidential order that can’t be violated or something?
OK, that hits my idiocy max for the day.
I’m not seeing what the constitutional problem is here.
Hint: that would be because you are stupid. And a fascist.
It should be easy for you to quote the legislation/law/authority they were acting under. What is Barcky’s net job number? He has lost more jobs than you have personalities.
Guys and gals: I had a long talk with someone close to me who works for a liability law firm in NYC (I’ve talked to JD about this.) He and his firm have no part (yet) in the potential BP liability cases but he has his own (and his industries’) take on this whole 20 billion dollar escrow. I offer it out as he told me and I see his points.
The whole point of the escrow is to provide BP with what he called “liability cost certainty” for the foreseeable future. Our government is involved because they can, in some manner, limit BP’s punitive damages exposure by providing a “for the good of the country” managed fund to pay people their directed costs. They can then show up at cases filed as “friend of the court” to seek dismissal of liability claims. All of us, whether or not we hate BP with a white hot passion, benefit in the long run from a continuing financial presence that can pay 20 billion or more, as needed. There is a certain pragmatism here.
Now as to the politics: Far from this being an example of what a big bunch of “pussies” BP is … this is actually a rather shrewd quid pro quo for the boys. We may feel that the government has no business managing this ala Iranian compensations or 9/11 funds (and I certainly agree that I have no confidence that this bumbling crater crew has any shot of doing it honestly or efficiently) BP gets, in effect, a payback for all of the political favors done for Democrats in general and Obama in particular. BP is going to take a horrendous and ongoing PR hit no matter what they do. Is it so hard to visualize a scenario in which, during the meeting between Obama and the Corp. execs, rather than table pounding, there was quiet head nodding and hand shaking? Obama gets to control the fund and look as though he’s whipped the “pussies” into shape. BP gets a measure of cost certainty which will have a short and long term positive effect upon their stock price.
After all, no other politician in the US took more money from BP than Obama in the last 4+ years and BP was an early supporter of Cap and Trade and alternative energies. Engage the narrative and reap the benefits during crisis. Also, under the above scenario it sure makes Obama’s statement of “whose ass to kick”seem even more disingenuous and hypocritical.
Yes it’s kind of slimy and sleazy but I find myself having a tough time feeling sorry for all of the tort lawyers who will lose out on the asbestos largess.
As per my above: How about circumventing the entire civil suit process? You know, by an administration that has already determined, in the GM case, that unions are way more important that “secured” creditors.
I measure your deep thinking as about 1/16th of an inch.
BJT – Unless there is specific legislation to prevent it, the tort bar will still launch itself into the fray, escrow or not, looking for big $. In my civilian work they are all I deal with – never underestimate the sheer lust for money those folks have driving them. Peter Angelos got mansions, yachts and a baseball team – and the US has no real non-defense shipbuilding industry in the East Coast anymore, for example. Ask anyone who has watched available, effective pain medications vanish from sight how they feel about Mark Lanier?
They care not what they do to the United States, as long as the contingency fee rolls in.
they are pussies I think cause of they are throwing up a fog of blame instead of owning up to the causes of the disaster what they caused… this fog gives president bumblefuck cover to destroy the industry with his open-ended moratorium (and rape many of BP’s competitors in the gulf)
the pussies killed Americans with their shoddy inept well design and now they are complicit in throwing tens of thousands more Americans out of work
full disclosure I bought British Pussy stock last week cause they are very very talented little pussies it seems to me
When the “Godfather” asks for his favor it isn’t an order barked but there are consequences, known, foreseeable consequences for failing to quietly comply, and good things for doing so quickly.
“When the “Godfather” asks for his favor it isn’t an order barked but there are consequences, known, foreseeable consequences for failing to quietly comply, and good things for doing so quickly.”
The president does have powers that the godfather doesn’t have, constitutionally, but I think you’re missing out something here. Something that I pointed out earlier:
“The problem that this misses out is that in BP’s case, you’re offering fire insurance to someone who’s reckless incompetence set their own store on fire. So where your partner is standing is rather immaterial. We’re getting a valdez’s worth every how many days? That cost 5 billion and 20 years of litigation. Even if all that this fund accomplishes is that 20 billion gets disbursed with minimum litigation costs, BP and the compensated people come out ahead.”
The problem with the ‘godfather’ analogies is that the US legitimately has BP over a barrel, not because we’re lawless, but because of our laws.
Carin, you can remove the strikethrough from “what we do in the bedroom.” If you have a computer or a radio in the bedroom, they care what you’re doing.
They also care if meya’s dildo isn’t biodegradable, Ernst.
No doubt Abe. Surely there’s some TARP II tax credit money to help her out with her stimulus!
LTC John: I’m not a lawyer so I’m still hazy as to my source’s confidence that the escrow fund will put a dent into punitive damages. He seems to feel that because the fund exists and is managed by the government that that, in and of itself, will create a dampening effect upon the usual tort lawyers and their desire to get involved. Let’s not forget that the TLA and other tort funded political hacks are securely in the grasp pf Obama and the Dems (especially after that gift of a health care reform package.) The administration can bring political as well as PR pressure on those suing guys.
‘feets – I don’t disagree with your assessment of BP in any way. I only point out that collecting on years of political and financial pandering to the Dems makes them more sleazy and opportunistic than pussies. The “pussification” is all part of the game IMHO.
I see what you mean… and it’s impossible to tell who bought who and what with the 20 billion.
“…the government that that, in and of itself, will create a dampening effect upon the usual tort lawyers and their desire to get involved.”
Of course, even that may be dependent on the signals, not to say winks and nods, coming from Obama & Co. toward their friends in the trial bar. Wait, did I say ‘not to say’? Ha!