As I was reading through the comments to the article at Politico trumpeting socialized medicine, I was almost immediately confronted by what I’m certain will be the “second wave” attack strategy from progressives, the major points for which are distilled into this single, angry comment. In response to a commenter who notes that the Obama “plan” is quite vague on the particulars, our “progressive” useful idiot lets ‘er rip:
What’s your plan, [1] Goober? [2] Keep bending over for the Insurance companies [3] that let Americans die [4] for less than what an exec spends on a pedicure on one of their spa weekends.[5] Good plan, [6] Einstein.[7] What exactly is the stake [8] that a dimwit like yourself has [9] in defending the pathological greed [10] that ends the lives of Americans over “paperwork “,” technicalities’ and “previous conditions” [11]? People of your mentality [12] are absolutely human garbage. [13] Go crawl back under your rock.[14] You lost. [15] Period. [16]
Let’s break this down, shall we?
1) The lack of any other NEW PLAN is an indication that you have no answers to the PROBLEM, which hasn’t been clearly identified. Status quo, or any “plan” that doesn’t involve some sort of massive CHANGE, is by nature of its conservative approach, no plan at all.
2) Those who don’t fall in line with the progressive vision? — must be uneducated hicks.
3) Not wanting to see health care nationalized is akin to allowing yourself to be raped by Big Business. Whereas when the government jams it into your starfish, they are making love to you. And you WILL like it.
4) Big Business wants Americans dead. They don’t care about you. They care about the bottom line. Whereas the government? They’ll always be flush! Hell, they can just print more money as the need arises!
5) Class warfare alert! People who’ve worked their way up to executive positions may have some disposable income. And of that disposable income — which they clearly haven’t earned, the sentiment seems to be — some might be spent on what our progressive friend believes are frivolous personal grooming measures. When people are starving, how dare someone else get their nails professionally trimmed — and from a high end salon, no less?
John Edwards and John Kerry could not be reached for comment.
6) Having created a caricature of the first commentator’s “plan” (which was never laid out) — and equating it with the progressive caricature of how the health care and insurance industries are now run — our progressive warrior slays the straw man with a furious thrust of his progressive broadsword.
7) And those who don’t pretend to swallow all the straw being shoveled? They can’t be too bright.
8) A dual imputation! a) Who are you working for? Really, why do you even care about this stuff? Are you one of those greedy private sector execs? A BIG CORPORATE money man? A Jew? b) Otherwise, you cannot possibly really have concerns about the state of the health care system, because if you did, you’d be squarely on the side of the angels — those who, like the progressives, believe that the government will be far more responsive to the needs of the people and can run a health care system far more judiciously (and, I suppose, more cheaply) than can some private sector business concerned only with the bottom line.
Money shouldn’t be a concern. Morality should. And of course, what can go wrong, morally, by placing unelected government bureaucrats and partisan politics in charge of life and death decisions?
9) Those who don’t fall in line with the progressive plan aren’t bright. This point must be repeatedly hammered home. Are you beginning to get the idea, Goober?
10) Private sector? Greedy. Government? Your protector. Because really, who else will look after you?
11) Private sector? Makes unreasonable demands and is awash in red tape. Whereas the government will run health care as a well-oiled machine. This is a given. And, even better, the government will be quite clear when you are no longer a value to society by declaring that, well, it’s time for you to stop asking for medical treatment and just, like, die already.
Will an insurance company give you that courtesy? Of course not.
12) Stupid, stupid, stupid!
13) And not only are you stupid — or perhaps, because you are so stupid — you are disposable, to boot. Waste. Morally speaking. Which, we assure you, won’t be factored in to our moral decisions on whether or not to treat you. Empathy, you see. We’re all about the empathy. And the pragmatism.
— Which means we’ll likely express genuine regret (or at least, pretend to) when we declare that it’s time for you to die.
14) I know we referred to you as human waste just moments ago, but in actuality, you’re beneath even that. You’re more like an insect or a rodent or a lizard. Subhuman, is what you are. But again, we have no plans at this time to take that into consideration when we do the moral calculus (unlike BIG CORPORATIONS, you see, our health care decisions won’t be based on the bottom line, otherwise, why change?) to determine whether or not to let you live or die.
15) The gist: “You lost.” Meaning, you lost a general election, which naturally gives progressives the right — hell, it’s a MANDATE! — to entirely remake society, to run roughshod over the Constitution, to rob you of every last individual liberty that they are unable to take away through the economic burden of taxation, and to ensure that you become dependent on the all-powerful State that progressives have agreed to run on your behalf.
You’ll thank them later, trust them.
Power. It’s all about power.
16) And no, there is no “discussion.” We’ve been “discussing” these things too long. Now is the time for CHANGE. And in order to ensure that, we won’t be holding public debates. Too much could go wrong.
Instead, we will push this through without your explicit consent, and then remind you that it was “you” who voted for us, remember?
You don’t have to fall in love, people. Just fall in line. What you call “fascism,” we call state benevolence. Potato, potahto…
****
Okay, I’m now terribly depressed. I’m going to watch TV.
Asylum. Madmen.
I just hope they have three squares at the re-education camps. And FREE HEALTHCARE!
The inmates running the asylum.
Whoever untied that Politico commenter’s straightjacket needs a “performance review” something awful.
Excellent demolition of that progg’s infantile rant, btw.
Okay, I’m now terribly depressed. I’m going to watch TV.
Perchance a Josh Groban song would perk you up? No one can be unhappy while “You Raise Me Up ” is playing.
But, crap, he isn’t singing about JC is he? Cause, then, nevermind.
*John Edwards and John Kerry could not be reached for comment.*
Edwards spends more on his hair in a month then I make all year.
He feels pretty, oh so pretty…
Honestly, I’ve pretty much lost all desire to debate with liberals since they seem to be completely devoid of a lick of sense. They don’t present argument. They present ad hominem.
Little fucker wants to know what my plan is? Step 1, round up everybody that thinks the problem is that people who own and invest and work and save, aren’t sharing their rewards with the people who waste and ruin and destroy, and give each one a little bit of blunt-force brain surgery. For free.
They want free health care? I’m a giver.
I have found out that you can not “debate” any Obama supporter for more than 10 sentences without hearing one of these two commets: “Well at least he is better than Bush!” or “Well Bush did ______ too!!!! neener neener. (Forgetting for a moment that when Bush did ______ they said hated him for it and trotting him out in an argument is completely hypocritical)”
Ah well the word “debate” has been so debased that people just scream at eachother and call it that anyway.
We occasionally hear some of our senior jurists aver to the wisdom of referring to the laws and judicial practices of other nations as one sort among many reasonable sources of light in just dealing. We hear, too, other senior jurists exclaim with horror at the thought, presuming [gasp!] to hew to a solely Constitutional view of American jurisprudence.
Perhaps it would be interesting to look at a case in which this practice functioned in reverse? Where, in other words, foreign nations took their cues from the practice of the United States? How about the case of Buck v. Bell (1927), for instance? Germany (1934), in particular, thought that this idea, the idea of the state determining to forcibly sterilize “imbeciles” (among other categories) so that those imbeciles might no longer bring yet more imbeciles into the world at the state’s expense. Wanted, efficient eugenic practices. Found and reproduced.
15) The gist: “You lost.†Meaning, you lost a general election, which naturally gives progressives the right — hell, it’s a MANDATE!…
And like everything else in the general election Obama lied about his intentions. That’s my favorite thing about leftards: They call us liars when we’re telling the truth – or simply disagree – and they lie to get their way when the full truth wouldn’t be politically palatable. Real, honest debate with these cretins is impossible.
OT but I feel very secure knowing the Census is in the best of hands.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D981H0JG3&show_article=1
There’s a beautiful quote by Mencken that I wish I could remember (I think it’s in a collection of his political writings edited by Joseph Epstein) about “reformers” and “uplifters.” Mencken says, in effect, that people who want to use the State to improve the world usually resort to the fallacy that if you can’t present an alternative to their plans, that must mean their plans are right. Mencken points out that, no, all that means is that I don’t have the answer, and niether, probably, does the “reformer.”
And of course the “alternative plan” you’re supposed to come up with almost always involves (a) an increase in the State’s power to coerce, and as a corollary, (b) a decrease in the individual’s liberty to run his life and business as he sees fit. To say, “Here’s my alternative: a free society” (or as Leonard Read used to put it, “Anything that’s peaceful,” is never an acceptable answer to State-shtuppers and government-fellators, because the only answer they’ll accept is one that empowers them to push people around.
Fanny/Freddie in the financial realm, Medicare/Medicaid in the medical realm. Government breaks it. Blames someone else, a convenient previously setup scapegoat. Then proposes taking over the entire mess “for the public good”. Again and again.
The avalanche of tyranny is picking up real speed now.
geoffb,
An excellent point, and one I’ve heard more than once in recent weeks.
That’s right, Geoffb, and then they just take more of our money to fix “our” new crisis. If we don’t want to play along we are divisive haters…
Jeff, I would suggest cartoons. That’s about all that’s keeping my head from exploding, at this point.
Hey, you know how carbon is evil? Guess what you’re made of.
My old man used to like to point out that “when you don’t know what the fuck you’re doing, the best thing to do is usually nothing.”
Progressive mantra. Don’t just stand there, fix something!
I take no comfort in the fact that we are about to learn a Very Hard Lesson, even though it’s a lesson I personally didn’t need to learn. I am merely resigned to it. Until I am tossed out on the street, that is.
[…] smelly mess actually splashing about in said jerk’s innards would create — Jeff pretty much nails our current sorry impasse: The gist: “You lost.†Meaning, you lost a general election, which […]
Okay, I’m now terribly depressed. I’m going to watch TV.
I’d recommend drinking, too.
or as reagan said, ‘don’t just do something, stand there.’
i’m depressed too. and so damn angry. it’s only lunchtime but tv won’t cheer me up. so i’m cracking open a bottle of gavi already. and if i should happen to make any comments later which are even less coherent than usual you outlaws will know why, and hopefully forgive me. >_>
Simply, they are obvious character disorders. Witnessed by the lies, leftism is a mental illness. The left is where they go to congregate.
This has never been about something as lofty as equal political ideologies or competing high-minded theories, not in a philosophical setting or sense. This isn’t that symmetrical and honored; it’s clearly principally asymmetrical. It’s about holding off the hordes for as long as possible.
“11) Private sector? Makes unreasonable demands and is awash in red tape. Whereas the government will run health care as a well-oiled machine. This is a given.”
Indeed. See Cook County Hospital for example!
http://www.co.cook.il.us/portal/server.pt?open=514&objID=449&parentname=CommunityPage&parentid=2&mode=2&in_hi_userid=2&cached=true
I don’t know why they just don’t treat healthcare like food. We don’t let poor people starve so we give them food stamps and then send them on their merry way; there is no bureaucracy in place telling grocers what to charge for hamburger. Give those who can’t afford insurance vouchers and be done with it.
And for those that have some pre-condition who can’t get insurance even if they can afford it?
Here in California car insurance is required. All of the bad drivers who normally wouldn’t be able to find insurance are put in a pool and then are meted to the various insurance companies doing business in the state -even Asians. Just do the same for medical insurance.
Re#25 – I think they hid their budget numbers… the County of Cook cannot pay for that many red ink cartridges.
““11) Private sector? Makes unreasonable demands and is awash in red tape. Whereas the government will run health care as a well-oiled machine. This is a given.â€
Indeed. See Cook County Hospital for example!”
Or the Veteran’s Administration.
So… this is the right wing? Are you guys so far out in the wilderness that you feel the need to mock a badly composed flame line by line? Clearly, this is not the place where the rebirth of Conservatism will happen.
Will it be a Virgin ReBirth, I wonder?
Uh-oh, now I’ve gone and mocked a dearly held religious belief… Clearly, I will not be joining the Apostles of the reborn Conservatism…
So… this is the right wing? Are you guys so far out in the wilderness that you feel the need to mock a badly composed flame line by line? Clearly, this is not the place where the rebirth of Conservatism will happen.
Oh look. It’s the other kind of leftard. The independent observer concern troll.
“So… this is the right wing?”
No. You’ve come to the wrong place. Check your dictionary for “libertarian”. Maybe Google the term “classical liberal”.
One thing you can always be sure of about births (and rebirths, I suppose) – at some point in the process, somebody got fucked.
Though as Sphereical just proved, afterbirth shows up here frequently, drops one comment and runs for the hills.
Also, I denounce you mojo. Please appear at your nearest Christian Right Wing God bothering Nascar watching tobacco chewing facism camp for beheading and re-education.
Christians do not tolerate intolerance. Off with their heads !
I dunno. I kinda felt the need.
This was Spherical’s first trip outside of its collectivist Leftist bubble. Be kind.
what a great post. Is there any way to conflate it with the Luntz post? I are so busy today I will read more better later to where I can say more than hey what a great post.
Clearly, I just don’t fit in with the symmetric-shape mafia…
beheading and re-education
In that order.
Whatever the government projects national health care to cost over the next ten years, multiply that by twelve. Because that’s how much Medicare growth actually outstripped the government’s initial projections. The laws of supply and demand are wondrous things; they enable us to predict what will happen to both the supply and demand for health care once the official point of purchase price becomes zero.
“Oh look. It’s the other kind of leftard. The independent observer concern troll.”
Perfect.
What is interesting is that no one actually bothers to examine the basis of government subsidized or run health care. That is due to not wanting to find the limitations in the axes of approach nor deal with the various European models which have all run into problems. Even Germany is looking to off-load its government part of healthcare… which is not something that those touting it wish to examine. Which includes the Germans, themselves, who don’t fill out EU reports on it so that it can be cross-analyzed.
Looking at the setup of subsidies giving you the problems of subsidies, which is uneconomic use of that which is subsidized, we see one factor playing into the cost of healthcare. Another is that as it is made public, it then moves to the ‘tragedy of the commons’ and a Nation like the UK being unable to get enough natives interested in becoming doctors so they have to import them. Mostly from Pakistan. Going along those lines, you come up to the other model of government programs and it is one that is horrifying.
It is the NASA model of the 1980’s.
It has direct equivalents in healthcare run by governments. They want these things from healthcare:
1) Easy to get and readily available.
2) High quality.
3) Low cost.
Choose two out of three.
And often it is only one out of three with government intervention.
All I can say is outstanding work, wisdom. Congratulations.
Hrm. So it looks like the American happy post-modern form of the Killing Fields are going to look like a sea of letters denying medical services.
Not only that, but dual too.
Hope=visualize power
Change=apply the power
Result: Free Lunchâ„¢
Leftism in a nutshell.
dicentra nails it with this:
I take no comfort in the fact that we are about to learn a Very Hard Lesson, even though it’s a lesson I personally didn’t need to learn. I am merely resigned to it.
I’m almost in full agreement. I’m not sure we’re going to learn the lesson, frankly.
Oh, shorter version of the Proggs’ argument:
Shut up!
What’s sought isn’t power, but the feeling that it’s increasing. There’s no end.
A maybe not obvious consequence of that:
Dead President X would not be an OUTLAW! now. Olden Tymes Feminist Y doesn’t roll over in her grave. Apotheosized Spiritual Leader Z wouldn’t frown on the perversion of his legacy. They’d be this.
Because of the progress.
I think Spherical was one of those potential “moderate” voters, and I’ve done pushed him away.
Will Allah or Hugh Hewitt ever forgive me?
This is a fantastic deconstruction, Jeff, I like the cross-reference number thingie you did there.
I’m going to use this take-down technique sometime and mark point for point the logical fallacies of a post then list them numerically providing their names in Latin. That will make me appear really uber smart and have the side benefit of proving I’ve paid attention.
That’s why I love this place — it helps me be more fierce.
To really get it right, make sure you’re wearing your pimp outfit when you break it down. I was dressed like Huggy Bear, for instance. Got me in the mood.
jeff dressed as huggy bear? i totally want pics. please? >_>
if the proggs get this every national election will be on their terms:
paraphrasing m steyn on hewitt
So… this is the right wing? Are you guys so far out in the wilderness that you feel the need to mock a badly composed flame line by line?
Snif, we’re just trying to “understand” you, snif, snif, so that we can empathize and all, snif, snif, snif.
So you misunderstand our intent, dear Spherical, this is the new conservatism, snif, snif…whaaaaaa…
See?
#54, those pics I’d pay almost as much money for as dillo dancing…..
Oh, and Jeff, I prefer a trip to the range, myself.
[…] by Lissa on May 8, 2009 Because I’m not smart enough to deconstruct a comment like Jeff is. What’s your plan, [1] Goober? [2] Keep bending over for the Insurance companies [3] that let […]