In a piece characterising the Basra battles of last week as a “mini-Tet,” Frank Rich avers that
For the majority of Americans who haven’t met any of the brave troops who’ve been cavalierly tossed into the quagmire, the war is out of sight and mind in a way Vietnam never was.
WTF? Is that supposed to be a sizable portion of Americans? Maybe only people who read the NYT can think that that constitutes any significant portion of Americans.
In case the point is too vague, let me put it this way: dude, you don’t matter any more.
Maybe Serr8d can work us up a Tet Happens bumper sticker to send to him.
I literally know Iraq veterans only via the web, and I’ve still managed to meet some in meatspace.
Let’s see, we have been winning this war all along, but when it became painfully obvious to the MSM, they quit covering it. Now this yoyo is harping about it being “out of sight, out of mind”. Buy a clue!
Paging Pauline Kael…
One of those ‘brave troops’ is my brother who has been to both Afghanistan and Iraq.
Oh wait. This is the NYT. In the circle that Frank Rich moves he and that circle probably wouldn’t know of anyone who has a relative in harms way. At least not since 1953. “Making mock of uniforms that guard you in your sleep is cheaper than them uniforms and they’re starvation cheap.” And what’s cheaper is someone like Frank Rich riding on those uniforms and feigning concern for the wearers’ well-being.
For those who didn’t follow the earlier thread deep into the night, you should go and check out Talisman Gate for what looks to me like a fairly detailed, realistic, and nuanced look at the Basra operation. His description of the American reaction is very plausible — Maliki apparently decided he was President of Iraq, dammit, and didn’t need American permission to swat Mookie, and caught everybody from Petraeus and Crocker to the grunts in Humvees with their right hands busy. As I said last night, that’s the Army (and State Department) I know and love :-))
Regards,
Ric
Dinosaurs, they are. He can say that in the same way the one NY Times writer said that she didn’t know anyone that had voted for Nixon.
I stopped my above comment because nearly every other word would have been profane. And if Jeff wants those linkys from someone other than Ace or the Puppy-Blender, I can’t do that.
Hisst! JD! – see #3…
THEOCON!!!!11!!!!!one-thousand-one-hundred-and-eleven!!!
Good to see See-dubya, even if he beat me to the Planet Kael punchline.
Mookie poked his head out of the den, and got his head blown off.
Someone was varmint huntin’
And once again, the total, abysmal, bottomless, boundless ignorance of history is breathtaking.
Tet was an American and South Vitnamese victory.
Frank Rich should move to Berkeley to be closer to his anti-war brethren so caring of the troops
Should CodePink be turning red?
Some in Berkeley think so after the group’s bogus announcement Tuesday anti-war group that the embattled U.S. Marine Corps recruiting center was caving to the pressure of weekly protests and leaving town.
“If you want to be taken seriously as an organization of serious protest, then you don’t play jokes – even on April Fools’ Day,” said Robin Lakoff, a professor of linguistics at the University of California, Berkeley, who has written about the politics of language.
CodePink and other anti-war groups have been protesting the U.S. Marine recruiting center in downtown Berkeley for months, hoping to force the recruiters to leave town.
A CodePink official defended the hoax Tuesday.
“In CodePink we tend to have a sense of humor,” said CodePink co-founder Medea Benjamin. “We tend to joke about a lot of things. It keeps us going where other anti-war groups have gone by the wayside.”…
http://www.mercurynews.com/breakingnews/ci_8775367
COnsidering that US forces were only in a support role and that Mookies bullet stopper asked for a ceasefire, I’m not clear how tis is suppsoed to be a defeat.
For Rich it is only the supreme ignorance of the American people that can explain why we are not storming Washington demanding that our soldiers return immediately.
Also, I thought that, in military parlance, casualties were the sum total of dead, wounded, captured and missing. So while he is lamenting our ignorance he is displaying his own.
Rich’s comment about the majority of Americans is nonsense, but it’s flattering nonsense. Most Americans–probably even most Times readers–do in fact know someone who’s been to Iraq. But when told how informed and cosmopolitan they are, and how most Americans just can’t identify with them, it’s tempting to believe it. It makes whatever other nonsense Rich wants to force down their throat go down smoother.
I think Frank Rich knew exactly what he was doing when he wrote that.
He says “the result was at best a standoff, with huge casualties” but who were the casualties? Not Americans. Not Iraqi police. Not Iraqi army. They were criminals … the same ones he bemoans what siphon off oil. He’s not very good at this propaganda thing I don’t think.
– I’m going to take a wild guess here, and assume this sort of lame stream Lefty press whining is direct evidence that the ploy of using the words “quagmire, Tet, Iraq, and Viet Nam” in the same article as many times as possible, is not going well, and that try as they might most Americans still don’t know about their “Vietnamization plan” for Iraq.
– Boo-fucking-hoo.
I wrote this elsewhere about Mr. Rich.
“Theater critics given a huge column on the NYTimes OpEd page do not suddenly accrue any credibility on matters of the real world. Especially when they incessantly lie.”
Or maybe they were Iranians. And how can we possibly expect Iran to join the reconciliation process in Iraq if we’re killing their people?
My comment was directed at #18.
I am so damn sick of baby boomers. First we had to listen to their Barbra Streisand about how cool they were inthe 1960s. Now we have to watch their bloody viagra ads, and listen to them shriek out “Vietnam!” every time American engages militarily.
Mini-Tet, my ass. What’s happening is the Iraqi government is trying to establish a monopoly on the use of force. It started this, not al-Sadr, and it’s going to keep it up until it is the monopoly. Of course, when you’re seeing this through your viagra-addled, acid-tripped, “Vietnam!” eyes, well, it’s “Mini-Tet”.
But that doesn’t make it so.
Oh, and BTW, I make a point of saying hello to every soldier I see, shaking hands, and thanking them for their service.
I got 4 cases of Clif bars at Target today for Major John but I ditched em at the checkout line cause the box says they comes from Berkeley. That’s just not right.
Paging Pauline Kael…
he beat me to the Planet Kael punchline.
Damn you both.
I am so damn sick of baby boomers.
Not all of us are such knuckleheads…
…OK, OK, knuckleheaded in a different way.
In fairness to the Boomers, the MSM was lying to them for the entire duration of Vietnam and there was no alternative media to break through the wall. Walter Cronkite should be thrown in Gitmo.
“…..[That] Maliki in unison with the Iraqi government will move to ban all malitias with specific written law. al Sadr does not have enough seats to block the intended vote.”
– Yet more bad news for the Left, whom ardently believe they can’t win the WH if America is still in Iraq at the time of the Presidential election cycle. They have a point. The Amrican electorate has historically never changed horses in the middle of an ongoing war.
– So we see clearly that the Lefts fotrunes run diametrically to the stability and safety of America. Other than the expected mass slaughter of Iraqi citizens, no one really knows what impacts a precipitous withdrawal of American troops and financial support would have on the entire ME as a whole, and the WOT.
– But the rabid Anti-American Left doesn’t give a fuck. Nothing is more important than the survival of the Marxo-Utopian peoples cult that hides behind the non-deplume “Democratic party” these days.
I apologize for venting my spleen and painting with too broad a brush.
But please! “Viva vi-agra”? Please, for the love of God, just age gracefully.
Patrick
Please don’t buy the crap that Boomers were all going to Haight-Ashbury, Woodstock, burning bras and draftcards … there’s the ones that the MSM of the time (Dan Rather, we’re looking at you and Cronkite) who deliberatly ignored those of us that supported the troops, WERE the troops, or were boring and MSM mockworthy for not buying the Drop out, tune in, turn on ethos of the era.
Dear Darleen,
Point taken. BTW, grew up a (USAF) military brat in Europe, and am a vet myself. FWIW.
Patrick
—
And in perfect fairness, characterizing the Boomers — of which I am most definitely one, 58 days older than Al Gore — as self-absorbed to the point of solipsism is fair in enough cases to form a valid first approximation. That’s even true of those of us who did serve; John Kerry is a better representative of service during that time than a lot of us like to admit.
Regards,
Ric
I’m from late enough in the Boom that I’d like to think I set the trend for how the GenXers would view those who did do the Haight-Ashbury, Woodstock thing.
Hi Rick,
My Dad joined the USN in 1945, and left the USAF in 1968. Oh, and he married late in life. He was having too much fun as an NCO. Loads of stories there. In any event, after he left the USAF I listened to regular tirades about easy acceptance of 35-10 violations, easy acceptance of drug abuse, etc. Mind you, this from a guy who’d stack cases of Carling Black Label in the house at weekends, high enough to be used as remporary furniture.
But I digress, sorta.
He might have been a bit of a lunatic at home, but he was totally committed to the job, and massively unhappy with how standards slipped in the 1960s. He was old enough not to have been a baby-boomer. I am young enough to have missed the baby boom. I’m kind of hoping the USA can simply ride out the baby-boomer self-involvement and become a little more sane when the extreme examples finally die off.
I apologize if this reads a little confused. I’m watching LOTR while typing.
Patrick
—
Patrick,
Well, as I said, I was born in 1948; that puts me just after the peak (1946-47) of the boom. My high school class was the second-largest ever before integration; the one just before mine was the largest.
One of the reasons Boomers are so acquisitive is that we never had enough — enough classroom space, enough teachers, all that — because the boom overwhelmed the facilities built for the much-smaller previous cohorts. Note that I distinguish very strongly between “reason” and “excuse” — the latter are much rarer than people think.
******
On a completely different subject — folks, go have a look at this guy and his Web site. His focus is the use of language in (especially racial) politics, with current emphasis on Barack Obama, whom he despises, perhaps hates. It would be kewl, I think, to ask him if he’d like to contribute something along that line of thinking as a guest post.
Regards,
Ric
Tits Happen, Man!
Dear datadave,
My exercise program out the window, my consumption of Sweetwarer 420 holding constant, your words strike deep.
Stil, another yummy 420 will ease the pain.
Patrick
—
Frank rich is impressive, after a fashion. A once truly incisive theater critic, although one whose politics were more transparent than most, he somehow talked Sulzberger’s mildly retarded son into letting him write about the “theater of politics.” Except that “theater” consists entirely of liberals being victimized by Republicans.
he is also impressive in that when I frequently ponder what an utter disaster Iraq is, He will say or write something like this, and reminds me that no matter how bad things are, every day that a POTUS is in power that he hates, is a decent enough day all around.
Dear Ric,
Given the choice among Obama, Clinton, and McCain, the proper response is suicide. Preferably self-immolation as a saffron-clad monk in front of the Capitol (So *they* get it, dontchaknow). (“Vietnam”)!
The improper response is to tell jokes, as in: “Clinton, Obama, and McCain are in a plane crash. Question: Who is saved? Answer: The American people.”
McCain could choose a good VP though. Every day a new hope.
And who, tolling, tolling, tolling,
In that muffled monotone,
Feel a glory in so rolling
On the human heart a stone
ack. Wrong thread. Can’t hurt nothing though I guess.
I thought the answer to that riddle was going to be “Mitt Romney”.
Isn’t that poe-ing the snake?
//failpun
Oh. He was always just “not-McCain” to me.
FAIL
That was funny, the poe-ing. Mostly cause of how it took me so long.
Actually, ‘feets, it fits here as well as there, maybe better. Expand the quote by a couple of lines:
And the people – ah, the people
They that dwell up in the steeple,
All Alone
And who, tolling, tolling, tolling,
In that muffled monotone,
Feel a glory in so rolling
On the human heart a stone
They are neither man nor woman
They are neither brute nor human
They are Ghouls:
If I owned a newspaper I’d be tempted to rename it The Iron Bell.
Regards,
Ric
nice. Good catch.
Heh. And…
How they clang, and clash, and roar!
What a horror they outpour
On the bosom of the palpitating air!
Yet the ear it fully knows,
By the twanging,
And the clanging,
How the danger ebbs and flows:
Yet the ear distinctly tells,
In the jangling,
And the wrangling,
How the danger sinks and swells,
By the sinking or the swelling in the anger of the bells-
Blogosphere, anyone? That’d be a good heading for a blog — of course the electric bell hadn’t been invented in Poe’s time, but they did have hand-cranked versions of the sort of thing you see in old cartoons and/or Modern Times.
Regards,
Ric
–“…..he is also impressive in that when I frequently ponder what an utter disaster Iraq is…”
– I’d suggest you ponder the state of the Colonies, during the pre-Contenetal Congress and all that followed, frequently or otherwise, and then get back to us.
– And keep in mind Iraq has a big advantage, having a able benefactor, which all the trade in the world from France couldn’t match.
– Judge yee yes, But judge yee fairly, and judgments rushed are judgments without merit, regardless of outcome.
I think Iraq got very lucky to catch our eye like they did. They were not on a good path.
Do you mean the NYSlimes still has an employee that can type? If so they had better type themselves a good recomendation along with their pink slip. The recommendation will look better if they say they worked in the raw sewage department.
[…] was suggested by, and created for, Dan Collins–in response to NYT Columnist Frank Rich’s weekend op-ed “Tet Happened, And No One Cared“, […]
I must be hanging with the wrong crowd. I know some of those troops. One of them is my brother. In fact, I’d bet Mr Rich I know more of them than he does, despite his prestigious (sorry, stifling laughter) New York Times credentials.
[…] Karl at Protein Wisdom caught New York Times theater critic turned editorial writer Frank Rich in a humdinger, apparently confusing “the majority of Americans” with “the majority of New York Times readers”. In a column portraying the recent fight in Basra between Iraqi forces and the Mahdi army a new “Tet offensive” (oooh–Iraq-Vietnam analogy? How edgy.), Rich reveals himself as pretty out of touch with America: For the majority of Americans who haven’t met any of the brave troops who’ve been cavalierly tossed into the quagmire, the war is out of sight and mind in a way Vietnam never was. Only 28 percent of Americans knew American casualties in Iraq were nearing 4,000 last month, according to the Pew Research Center. The Project for Excellence in Journalism found that by March 2008 the percentage of prominent news stories that were about Iraq had fallen to about one-fifth of what it was in January 2007. […]
I learn so much about history here…I was taught those helicopters over the Saigon embassy were taking Americans away. I had no idea they were taking the NVA away from those veteran, well-motivated, well-trained ARVN forces.
By the way, N, you might want to go to the local library and pick up a book by Clausewitz. It might help explain how one can win a battle and still lose a war. You know, unlike Maliki did here, where he lost the battle and will probably lose the war when his ass is kicked in provincial elections in the fall. At that point, it will be the height of wonder to watch the right wing blogsphere start talking about al-Sadr like he is George Washington.
Kinda like, most of y’all decided you could vote for McCain after all?
IJS – Why don’t you go ask some of those horrible brown people that were being airlifted from the roof of the embasssy their impressions?
You know, unlike Maliki did here, where he lost the battle
Not content to redefine history, the Leftists are now just rewriting it as they go along.
But you hope things go well in Iraq, for the sake of the Iraqi’s, right IJS? The rest of your comment is pure self serving drivel, designed likely to assure yourself of your own correctness and superiority to teh stupid warmongers, but you are at least still human enough to wish the Iraqi’s well, right?
Tet: 1968.
Helicopters over the embassy evacuating Americans: 1975.
Wow. Long weekend.
IJS: How’s the weather in Indianapolis?
See-dubya throws a MM link — anyone know how to tell him Dan wrote this one, not me? I think I confused him by saying nice stuff about him up-thread.
That’s okay, Karl. I think it’s funny.
Also, Clarice still thinks I voted for Obama.
Wait … Wait a minute!!
KARL AND DAN ARE TWO DIFFERENT PEOPLE!!??11??!!
FABULIST FAKERS!!
BJ – IJS is an asshat from Texas.
Opinions of Frank Rich aside, it’s clear he’s wrong on the facts. This is from a UPI report on a Zogby poll last September:
“Indeed, 71.2 percent of the 7,081 U.S. residents asked in a Zogby interactive poll said they knew someone who served in Iraq.â€Â
http://www.upi.com/Zogby/UPI_Polls/2007/09/14/upi_poll_onequarter_know_iraq_casualties/2597/
#64
Get out of town! Really?
[…] in time for Petraeus’s testimony, the mini-Tet that failed. A GAMBLE that proved too […]