Josh Marshall’s effort to impose a double-standard on the campaign, under which John McCain must repudiate any person or any comment about Barack Obama deemed to be inappropriately racial or ethnic, while Obama is excused from discussing his less savory associations, has been taken up by a number of left-liberal bloggers during the course of the day.
Leading the charge, unsurprisingly, is Rick Ellensburg, infamous Internet sock-puppeteer. In this instance, Ellensburg’s tack is to deliver a tu cocque-slapping to the media for daring to ask about Louis Farrakhan’s endorsement of Obama’s candidacy, while ignoring that:
Yesterday, though, the equally fringe, radical and hateful (at least) Rev. John Hagee — a white evangelical who is the pastor of a sprawling “mega-church” in Texas — enthusiastically endorsed John McCain. Did McCain have to jump through the same hoops which Russert and others set up for Obama and “denounce” Hagee’s extremism and “reject” his support? No; quite the opposite. McCain said he was “very honored” to receive this endorsement and, when asked about some of Hagee’s more twisted views, responded: “all I can tell you is that I am very proud to have Pastor John Hagee’s support.”
Ellensburg then lists statements by Hagee that: “those who live by the Koran have a scriptural mandate to kill Christians and Jews” and that God caused Hurricane Katrina to wipe out New Orleans because it had a gay pride parade the week before. He also notes — from Christian Palestinian Daoud Kuttab — that Hagee purportedly believes that ”a confrontation with Iran is a necessary precondition for Armageddon (which will mean the death of most Jews, in his eyes) and the Second Coming of Christ.”
Ellensburg does not inform his readers that the New York Times link he provided says only this:
Asked about Mr. Hagee’s extensive writings on Armageddon and about what one questioner said was Mr. Hagee’s belief that the anti-Christ will be the head of the European Union, Mr. McCain responded that “all I can tell you is that I am very proud to have Pastor John Hagee’s support.’’
Mr. Hagee, the pastor of the Cornerstone Church, said that his support for Israel had nothing to do with prophetic scenarios, but rather because he felt the cause was just. “They are a democracy in the Middle East that deserves the support of America and Christian people everywhere,’’ Mr. Hagee said.
Hagee’s opinions on Islam (shared in part by Turkey) and New Orleans (shared in part by Democratic Mayor Ray Nagin) appear nowhere in the story. Nor does his opinion on Harry Potter appear there, though Ellensburg was taken with the reference to it by TNR’s Dayo Olopade. Nor is it particularly clear what the questions actually were, though this did not stop Ellensburg from omitting any reference to Hagee’s denial that his support was based on prophecy. The lack of questions from the media suggests that Hagee’s views are less-known among the establishment media than they are among fringe-left bloggers.
TNR’s Dayo Olopade goes even further than Ellensburg, writing that Hagee’s comments were “no worse than some of the inflammatory comments Farakkhan has dropped over the years.” Apparently, to some people, having a wacky view about Harry Potter is about the same as calling Jews, Arabs and Asians “bloodsuckers,” claiming that “murder and lying comes easy for white people.” and proclaiming that “Hitler was a very great man.”
Hagee’s comment about God hating on gays is a bit closer to the ballpark; McCain would do well to disassociate himself from that view. And perhaps he will, now that the complaint has been brought to the campaign’s attention.
Of course, I would have given the same advice to Obama when he barnstormed through South Carolina with gay-bashing gospel singer Donnie McClurkin:
Obama has hitched his string to McClurkin’s high flying gay bash kite in part out of religious belief (he purports to be somewhat of an evangelical), in bigger part because he’s falling further and further behind Hillary Clinton with the black vote in South Carolina and everywhere else, and in the biggest part of all because he hopes that what worked for Bush’s reelection will work for him.
When Obama was confronted on the association, he issued a three-page memo defending the decision and had McClurkin emcee the event. If Lefty bloggers are craving tu cocque, it is right in their faces.
Ellensburg and his ilk will not care to delve into that, however. Ellensburg is raising Hagee merely to divert attention from others closer to home:
(B)lack Muslim ministers like Farrakhan, or even black Christian ministers like Rev. Jeremiah Wright, are held with deep suspicion, even contempt. McCain is free to hug and praise the Rev. Hagees of the world, but Obama is required to prove over and over and over and over that he does not share the more extreme views of black Ministers.
The glaring difference in the two cases is that Obama has claimed Wright — who inveighs against the “white supremacists†who run the “American empire‖ as his spiritual advisor for 20 years and remains a member of Wright’s “Unashamedly Black” church to this day. There is no such connection between McCain and Hagee. But bloggers like Ellensburg hope that if they sling enough mud, they can impose their double-standard on the electorate.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/28 @ 6:13 pm #
wow…hagee is a leftbehinder.
i bet the leftbehinders were behind (heh) the email i got purporting to come from a christian youth group.
it said Obama was the Anti-christ and quoted a bunch of Nostradamus.
hmmm…i dont think that is gonna be the sweet spot, Karl.
Obama comes from Hawawii..that isnt East.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/28 @ 6:15 pm #
mccain is probably glad to have hagee’s support tho….dobson and robertson hate him.
he called them intolerant didnt he?
Comment by Carin on 2/28 @ 6:24 pm #
I usually can’t stand reading Glenns, but this little nugget made it worthwhile:
Really, it seems that Glenns is OUTRAGED.
Comment by Scott R on 2/28 @ 6:25 pm #
This whole disavowal stupidity brings to mind something that, I think, Reagan said. It was something like ‘He supports me because he agrees with my policies, not the other way around.’
Comment by Karl on 2/28 @ 6:29 pm #
Scott R,
I generally agree with that, except that it’s a harder argument to make when you claim someone as your spiritual advisor.
Comment by Carin on 2/28 @ 6:35 pm #
That is the difference between Hagee’s support for McCain and Obama’s affiliation with Wright. They’ve made this about Farrakhan because they don’t want to focus on the real issue- Obama’s membership in Wright’s church, which has issued support (in kind) of Farrakhan.
I personally don’t care if Wright endorses Obama. I’m more interested in how closely the two men’s views converge. I wouldn’t be a member of a man’s church (for 20 years) if I didn’t agree with him.
My church changes Priests every two-three years. So, if I don’t like him (or can’t understand him) it’s just a waiting game.
Pingback by This ain’t Hell, but you can see it from here » Blog Archive » Race baiting from the Dems on 2/28 @ 7:14 pm #
[...] at Protein Wisdom boils Marshall’s rant down to it’s essence; Josh Marshall’s effort to impose a [...]
Comment by Scott R on 2/28 @ 7:32 pm #
You’re probably right Karl. But I suspect that politicians, especially those who aspire for years on end to be president, see people as megaphones or dollar signs. The megaphones don’t contribute much dinero but spread the word and generate votes. The dollar signs are the Soros types. It is ‘what can you do for me right now’, with little care for what has been said or done in the past. Everyone else is just invisible.
Also, the sky is blue and water is wet.
- Captain obvious
Comment by Dan Collins on 2/28 @ 7:54 pm #
Tu cocque is Latin for “your cock,” in case you were wondering.
Comment by Dan Collins on 2/28 @ 7:55 pm #
Et tu, cocque?
Comment by Al Maviva on 2/28 @ 8:23 pm #
I’m sticking with my earlier thought that we’re in the midst of a coordinated slander campaign.
If McCain repudiates anything remotely right-wing-politically-incorrect-sounding, it’s merely a racist/sexist/homophobic Sistah Souljah setup moment and a crass Republican display of race/sex/gay baiting. If McCain fails to repudiate anything of that sort occuring anywhere in the world at any time, including in Antarctica during periods when McCain is in bed asleep, it’s confirmation of Republican racism/sexism/homophobia. The tautology is pretty clear then and today’s instant Tautology Tsunami makes me think that somebody has the ol’ Kool Kids email listserve fired up again.
Meanwhile, I gotta wonder why they’re stoking this line of attack. Nothing is surer to energize conservatives (McCain’s weak point) and drive them into his corner than to have the usual pack of leftist howlers unfairly attacking him with bogus stories that vilify everybody to the right of the last “a” in Obama’s last name.
Comment by McGehee on 2/28 @ 8:51 pm #
Also known as “a presidential election campaign in which a Democrat will be one of the contenders.”
Comment by Ric Locke on 2/28 @ 8:57 pm #
To repeat:
Hagee is a nutcase with some hateful notions. Hagee supports McCain, and McCain didn’t send out hit squads to prevent that; therefore McCain endorses Hagee’s nuttery. Democrats are authorized any methods, up to and including full-bore slander, to offset that.
Wright is a nutcase with some hateful notions. Wright supports Obama, and Obama didn’t send out hit squads to prevent that; therefore Obama supports Wright’s nuttery. Republicans are authorized any methods, up to and including full-bore slander, to offset that.
That’s all there is to it. That’s all there ever was to it. That’s all there’s ever going to be to it. You may shriek ’til you’re hoarse and post ’til your ISP charges you for bandwidth, and that’s still all there’ll be to it.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by happyfeet on 2/28 @ 9:13 pm #
You either fall upon Barack, or Barack will fall upon you. Can I hear an amen?
Comment by Skyler on 2/28 @ 9:49 pm #
The difference between McCain and Obama here is that Obama “denounced and rejected” Farakkhans endorsement. McCain went to a news conference standing side by side with Hagee and said he was “very honored” by Hagee’s endorsement and that Hagee “He has been the staunchest leader of our Christian evangelical movement in many areas.” Reuters
This guy thinks the antichrist is the head of the EU. I can’t believe McCain would show him love.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/28 @ 9:52 pm #
Obama for real hates Israel though. McCain doesn’t.
Comment by Skyler on 2/28 @ 9:58 pm #
Why’s that happyfeet? Because he’s such a good Muslim?
Comment by happyfeet on 2/28 @ 10:01 pm #
I don’t think he’s a good Muslim. He just hates Israel. You can tell by how anti-Israel types flock to him. That doesn’t just happen.
Comment by Skyler on 2/28 @ 10:06 pm #
Yeah, Anti-Israel types like the Anti-Defamation League.
Comment by Karl on 2/28 @ 10:10 pm #
Skyler, how about the Rev. Wright? Or are you just dodging him as badly as the rest?
Pingback by Oh, Dr. T., Get Out, or We Will Send the UO Deprogrammers After You § Unqualified Offerings on 2/28 @ 10:15 pm #
[...] about Louis Farrakhan’s (unsolicited) endorsement of Barack Obama? Well, maybe not, since some think the filth Hagee spews is just, like dude, so nothing. . Added bonus, the first link goes to [...]
Comment by happyfeet on 2/28 @ 10:20 pm #
Oh please, Skyler. The ADL is where anti-Semites who slip go to for forgiveness. Obama hates Israel in that his policies are quite amenable to her destruction. He ain’t interested in playing around in the jew-baiting bush leagues. He’s big-time.
Comment by Skyler on 2/28 @ 10:27 pm #
Well, again Obama said he disagreed with Rev. Wright’s stuff. I think as the campaign goes on we’ll find out more about why they’ve been close. Like honestly, it’s just hard for me to take accusations of anti-semitism seriously when the Jewish community in Chicago, who know Rev. Wright and Obama best, voted for Obama, the anti-defamation league says its nonsense, and columnists for JPost and Haaretz newspapers say he’s not anti-semitic. I’d think the Jewish organizations know best on this subject.
Plus, the fact that people have to show his anti-semitism through what his pastor says, rather than anything he himself has said or done, really proves the case for me. I’m sure that if we started investigating the pastors of our politicians we’d find some whacked out guys.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/28 @ 10:33 pm #
He hates Israel, Skyler. That’s a whole different thing than what you’re talking about. Israel’s jewyness isn’t even the point. They fuck up the kumbaya at the UN is the point. He wants to change that.
Comment by Ric Locke on 2/28 @ 10:35 pm #
Oh, and BTW, Skyler:
Hagee’s church is in San Antonio, TX, a thousand miles from DC and nearly that far from Phoenix. As another poster pointed out, that’s a bit far for a Sunday morning drive.
Wright’s church is the one Obama claims to have attended for twenty years.
Which church is more likely to have influenced the candidate significantly?
Hagee’s church teaches that sometime in the future there will be a war, which will end in a battle in the Valley of the Skulls in which the last Jew who hasn’t found Jesus will be killed. While they’re waiting, they teach that Jews are to be treated like anyone else and their (democratic and reasonably free) country, Israel, should be supported. (And, of course, the invitation to convert, and thereby become immune, is always open but not pushed; they know it’s annoying.)
Wright’s church teaches that Jews are part of the Vast Conspiracy to Suppress Brown and (especially) Black People, and must be guarded against and suppressed when possible.
Which of the two is for practical purposes anti-Semitic?
These little riddles can occupy quite a bit of time, can’t they?
Regards,
Ric
Comment by Education Guy on 2/28 @ 10:55 pm #
I’m glad to hear Obama denounced and rejected Farakkhan. That was a good move because Farakkhan is a major league bigot. Everybody should denounce that creep, then maybe he’d just go away.
Comment by McGehee on 2/28 @ 11:07 pm #
I denounce anyone who would denounce the denunciation of Louis Farrakhan.
Comment by Education Guy on 2/28 @ 11:14 pm #
Not good enough McGehee. You failed to reject him as well, thus proving you secretly love him and want to raise little racist babies together.
MIXED RACE POWER!
Comment by Skyler on 2/28 @ 11:24 pm #
Well Ric, I guess if Hagee was just calmly waiting for the Jews to be butchered, rather than pushing for a war with Iran he believes will hasten the process, I would agree with you that he is less anti-semitic than Wright.
However, even if that was the case, it doesn’t matter. I don’t care who wins the anti-semite contest. I think its better for one candidate to publicly repudiate a “bigger” anti-semite than another to embrace a “littler” anti-semite.
Here McCain embraced this nutcase who pushes for apocalypse in the Mideast, believes that the people of New Orleans deserved Katrina, and that Catholic Church conspired with Hitler to commit the Holocaust. Bill Donahue is already after him
Obama by contrast stated that his pastor’s statements about Jews in the past were wrong and said he did not believe them.
Again, the largest Jewish organizations in our country by all appearances have accepted this. They have not denounced Obama and some have instead denounced the anti-semite rumors. Mainstream Israeli media as well has mainly defended him. Chicago Jews — who would know these anti-semitic church teachings best — went for Obama. I go with the Jews when it comes to anti-Semitism.
Comment by James on 2/28 @ 11:27 pm #
Don’t forget that the mother of Senator John McCain’s black child (born out of wedlock) is a Muslim!
Comment by Skyler on 2/28 @ 11:33 pm #
“He hates Israel, Skyler. That’s a whole different thing than what you’re talking about. Israel’s jewyness isn’t even the point. They fuck up the kumbaya at the UN is the point. He wants to change that.”
Yeah, since you can’t prove that he’s anti-semitic, you’ll move on to him being anti-kumbaya or something. Ignoring the mildly racist tone of throwing in the kumbaya there, that just doesn’t make sense.
Comment by psycho... on 2/28 @ 11:36 pm #
Equally seriously, I think –
I doubt he even has any opinions of his own re: Israel/Jews, etc. — few politicians do — but what he does seem to have is a there-there-boy comfort with the likes of Farrakhan that comes from not taking black antisemitism (or religion) seriously, regarding it as a kind of ghetto-dada exotica (or a stupid outfit he can get photographed in to bring in some rube votes).
It’s a quite common bigotry among upper-class whites.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/28 @ 11:37 pm #
Ok. Nevermind. OBAMA HEARTS THE JEWS!!! Say it loud and proud, Skyler. Spread the word.
Comment by Skyler on 2/28 @ 11:46 pm #
well psycho, I never realized that Obama doesn’t take black religion seriously. Does that mean he’s not a Muslim?
Comment by Skyler on 2/28 @ 11:48 pm #
Mazel Tov Happyfeet :)
Comment by happyfeet on 2/28 @ 11:49 pm #
My sigh just then was for real.
Comment by Ric Locke on 2/28 @ 11:54 pm #
Which is to say, your understanding of the situation comes from the Press, who know less than nothing — that is, what they think they know is wrong — so they just make shit up that matches Teh Narrative, keying off the sound bites.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by happyfeet on 2/28 @ 11:57 pm #
I mean I really for real sighed out loud.
Comment by maggie katzen on 2/29 @ 12:00 am #
too much Peggy Noonan?
Comment by Skyler on 2/29 @ 12:03 am #
Ric, really, my information comes from the press? And yours comes from where, God?
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 12:05 am #
Ohnoes. I am bepeggified.
Comment by maggie katzen on 2/29 @ 12:11 am #
acknowledging you have a problem is the first step, happyfeet.
Comment by OldSpook on 2/29 @ 12:22 am #
Hagee is a despicable bigoted little man. McCain should have repudiated him.
He is, to us Catholics, what Farrakhan and his ilk are to Jews: a bigoted ill-informed ignorant enemy.
Comment by Karl on 2/29 @ 1:10 am #
Skyler,
Apart from whether Wright is anti-Semitic, his church is built on the idea that whitey is out to either slaughter the “talented tenth” of blacks or enslave them into “middleclassness.” But I guess if you tell the media that you disagree with some of the things he says — as opposed to the repudiation he gives Farrakhan — it’s still okay to go to a discriminatory church every week to hear sermons on the “white supremacists†who run the “American empire.†It’s a very Unifying message.
OldSpook,
Agreed, as noted in the original post. And McCain may well do it, now that the Catholic League has complained. I tend to doubt that McCain knows much about Hagee, having been on the outs with evangelicals in the past. If not, it’s a mark against him (and not the only one in my book).
Comment by Gene Callahan on 2/29 @ 1:39 am #
“Obama just hates Israel.” == “Obama has at some point failed to give the Israeli lobby every single thing they have asked for.”
Comment by Rusty on 2/29 @ 6:23 am #
Gosh Gene. That’s just…………………………stupid. Obama isn’t even president yet. Can he count on your vote.
Comment by jdm on 2/29 @ 6:37 am #
To Skyler, IJS (or whatever that acronym was in this topic’s last go-round) and all the other Obama syncophants, this is not a McCain hot spot.
… geez, eight more months with claims of hair-splitting but yet oh-so significant differences between the two primary candidates *and* faux discussions about how many Obamas can dance on the head of a pin.
Not to mention middle names! We haven’t gotten to (reached) the bottom of that yet, have we?
Comment by N. O'Brain on 2/29 @ 7:57 am #
“…how many Obamas can dance on the head of a pin.”
Lots and lots.
They only have left wings.
Comment by JD on 2/29 @ 8:24 am #
Skyler – Barry O doesn’t hate the Jews, he just plays really nice with those that wish for the destruction of Israel. Nuance, and all.
Make the world a better place,
Shove a pie in gleenwald’s face(s).
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 8:37 am #
historically jews are democrats and have far better empathy with blacks than they do with evangelical christians (of which the leftbehinders are a subset). This seems strange since xians cite their judeo-xian heritage ad nauseum and are forever emphasizing the similiarities between judaism and xianity.
i think it is that whole apocalypse in MENA after the jews have returned to the Temple, kind of off-putting.
it makes jews feel expendable.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 2/29 @ 8:43 am #
“xian” is a very offensive term.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 8:45 am #
eight more months with claims of hair-splitting but yet oh-so significant differences between the two primary candidates *and* faux discussions about how many Obamas can dance on the head of a pin.
zactly.
Karl, Farrakhan is just another shoddy weapon that turns in your hand.
I think possibly Hagee is even more offensive to Jews than Farrakhan….both entities desire the destruction of the Jews, but Farrakhan is at least open about it and doesn’t dress it up as prophecy and biblical exegesis.
u need something much better Karl, something subtle and subversive…a viral meme.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 8:46 am #
#
“xian†is a very offensive term.
#
why?
X is greek for the christos.
it is just shorthand for me.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 2/29 @ 8:46 am #
Anyway, the reason I stopped back:
James Taranto’s headline about Baracky in todays’ WSJ is just perfect:
“Cut and Run and Then Run Back”
http://tinyurl.com/32dzle
Comment by N. O'Brain on 2/29 @ 8:48 am #
“# Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 8:46 am #
#
“xian†is a very offensive term.
#
why?
X is greek for the christos.
it is just shorthand for me.”
It’s a deliberate insult created by reactionary leftists.
But then, you don’t even know how to use a cap key, so you have a built in excuse.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 8:57 am #
but i didnt take it from leftist texts.
i just use it for shorthand.
if judaism or islam was many letters i wud shorten those.
i dont see why anyone should be offended.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 2/29 @ 9:01 am #
The correct term is “Christian”.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 2/29 @ 9:04 am #
Ok, I just figured it out.
The reactionary left originated the offensive term “xian” so they wouldn’t have to use, or even type, the name “Christ”.
Just one more example of the childishness of the left.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 9:14 am #
but im not a leftist
im a registered repub.
however….i am a mathematician.
X=christos is perfectly valid for me.
its not malicious.
Comment by Pablo on 2/29 @ 9:21 am #
So, nishi=0 is a proper formulation, then? Math ≠English.
Comment by daleyrocks on 2/29 @ 9:31 am #
but im not a leftist
im a registered repub.
hahahahaha
registration means nothing
its the thought and vote that counts
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 9:36 am #
hrm im just trying to unnerstand.
Brain said the term was offensive cuz it was coined as an insult by leftists.
but im not using it that way.
it is just a substitution, shorthand, to me.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 9:37 am #
and why is it an insult?
X is greek for the christos.
why is that a slight?
Comment by Rob Crawford on 2/29 @ 9:39 am #
So? Your statements in the past make it clear you’re an anti-Christian bigot.
Comment by daleyrocks on 2/29 @ 9:41 am #
Every site needs an idiot mascot. Right now it’s nishi’s time in the spotlight.
Congratulations!
Comment by Rob Crawford on 2/29 @ 9:42 am #
No, it’s not.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 9:43 am #
xian denotes a subculture, that’s all.
Comment by daleyrocks on 2/29 @ 9:44 am #
Your statements in the past make it clear you’re an anti-Christian bigot.
Isn’t that a fundamental tenet of Islam? Imadamnutjob keeps talking about one world religion when he visits the U.N. and no one calls him on it.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 2/29 @ 9:47 am #
So Christina Aguilera is also know as Xina Aguilera?
Comment by BJTexs on 2/29 @ 9:54 am #
Rob is correct. The X in xtians is meant to convey the cross and is offensive to Christians because it was created as a sarcastic way refer to the “Cross Lovers.”
For a mathematician your critical thinking is alarmingly shallow on many topics.
Comment by daleyrocks on 2/29 @ 9:59 am #
But she knows this stuff because she studied religions! Ejumication, catch the fever!
Comment by Karl on 2/29 @ 10:03 am #
nishi,
If you review what I have written, you will see that I think Wright is Obama’s problem, not Farrakhan.
I would use “nitwit” to refer to you as shorthand, if it was shorter.
Comment by BJTexs on 2/29 @ 10:06 am #
Daley:
Have you noticed the blinding irony of nishi’s blanket and absolutist condemnation of Evangelicals as “anti-science” coming as it does from the recently converted Muslim???
Feel free to try and sell ESCR and reproductive choice in any of the various Islamic Theocracies. Be sure to bring a toothbrush and/or a hard hat.
Just remember: Baracky is dreamy and that’s all you need to be elected.
Deep Thoughts!
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 10:07 am #
Of course, one wouldn’t dream of using “Cian” as literary shortening for Christians, because using the filthy anglo-saxony letters is kind of gauche.
Exception: use of French words in place of English words that mean exactly the same thing.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 10:09 am #
“Christ”, in Greek, does begin with “X”, so: plausible, but not really explicable.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:15 am #
why are u fixating on my use of xian?
what do you think of my hypothesis that Hagee is just as offensive to Jews as Farrackhan?
Comment by Carin on 2/29 @ 10:16 am #
If you review what I have written, you will see that I think Wright is Obama’s problem, not Farrakhan.
Exactly Karl. The whole Farrakhan dealo is just a distraction from the real issue. Smoke and mirrors.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 10:22 am #
I wouldn’t fixate on nishi’s xian construct, because she rarely spells anything correctly to begin with. It’s like picking out a needle in a haystack made out of needles. No, I prefer to just pretty much ignore, now, because commenting on it has no effect at all.
Comment by Carin on 2/29 @ 10:23 am #
what do you think of my hypothesis that Hagee is just as offensive to Jews as Farrackhan?
Not much.
Quick review:
It’s not Farrakhan’s endorsement of Obama that concerns us. At all.
McCain – endorsed (not guided) by Hagee.
Obama – guided by Wright who, by the way, praises Farrakhan.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 10:23 am #
Except sometimes, when I feel like saying something. Consistency is for hobgoblins.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:23 am #
daley, i am not a sunni or a shi’ia
i am a muslim, and a mu’tazilah and a sufi.
i assume that u are an xian, but neither a leftbehinder or a snakehandler.
to become a muslim, all u have to do is say the shahada.
there is no god but allah and muhammed is his prophet.
thats it.
i dont have to believe anything about death to apostates, islamic caliphates, virgins or jihaad.
as a mu’tizilah, i must obey the First Obligation of the Mu’tizhili: to approach allah thru reason and science.
i have other, sufi-specific instructions.
but the sufi are secretive.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 10:25 am #
You can’t ignore it. Your head translates it when you see it. That would be a neural pathway what you didn’t have before, and your firewall can’t stop it.
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 10:26 am #
a mu’tazilah
That can’t be easy to type out.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:26 am #
carin why do u say guided?
does wright inform O’s policies?
i dont think u can say that.
Comment by Pablo on 2/29 @ 10:27 am #
Consistency is only a virtue if you’re not a screwup.
Comment by BJTexs on 2/29 @ 10:27 am #
I think you don’t talk to many Jews or Evangelicals. I happen to be the latter and my niece converted and marraied an Iranian Jew.
Some Jews would have a problem with Hagee but that tension is mitigated by his unrestrained support for Israel.Keep ion mind that Jews traditionally vote in the mid to upper 70%’s for the Democratic Presidential Candidate. Farrakhan is a pariah to the vast majority of Jews for his long and despicable record of harch, anti Semitic remarks. Try to remember that more than 50% of Jews in this country are either secular or relatively indifferent to practicing their religion.
Agian your conclusion is based upon you shallow perception of Jewish attitudes.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 2/29 @ 10:28 am #
“i assume that u are an xian, but neither a leftbehinder or a snakehandler.”
I was right.
Hater.
Comment by Education Guy on 2/29 @ 10:28 am #
but the sufi are secretive.
Please explain this.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:28 am #
what feets?
which neural pathway?
the sufi are all about neural pathways, but totally disinterested in politics.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:29 am #
we are not allowed to talk sufi-stuff to the un-initiate.
thats all.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 10:30 am #
Just that xian transmutes culture into subculture. You said you believed in alchemy.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 10:30 am #
And here I thought Sufis were all about Islam. You learn something new every day, on the Internets, even if most of it is wrong.
Comment by Pablo on 2/29 @ 10:31 am #
Do you know where the term “Audacity of Hope” came from? Given that his policy is Hope! (with a double side of Change!) I think u can say that.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:34 am #
well..i can say this.
sufi believe some are born open-channel to allah, like prophets, like adam and moses and issa and muhammed.
the rest of us can overcome our genes and our environment to become openchannel.
but i cant talk about the details.
we learned a long time that leads to real serious persecution.
kinda like the jews.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:36 am #
Just that xian transmutes culture into subculture.
ah
for u.
why shud i have to adopt ur transmutation?
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 10:36 am #
So, actual, aspiring godbotherers, I see.
Comment by Ric Locke on 2/29 @ 10:37 am #
Bullshit. No, God doesn’t speak to me, but proselytizers do.
I’m not directly familiar with Hagee in his present incarnation; I last lived in San Antonio when he was just cranking up. But all the megachurches are syncretic rather than synthetic, picking and choosing among existing bits and pieces of doctrine to find the ones most universally appealing, and therefore attractive to enough people to populate a congregation of thousands. Comparing them is like comparing KMart and Target, which are both more like one another, and like Wal*Mart, than they are different.
Fundamental [!] to all of them is the shivery-scary notion of the Apocalypse or “End Times”. In basic Christian theology this is the End of Everything — Earth, people, and all disappear in a conflagration, with the few survivors taken to the City of God. In recent years we have seen the “Left Behind” fiction series, which postulates that there will be something after the Apocalypse other than the inhabitants of the City of God. It isn’t canon yet, but it informs a lot of thinking, especially among those who note that an hundred forty and four thousand ain’t a lot of people compared to the total population.
–All of which is a longwinded way of working up to the absolute fact that **ALL** of the “Jews will die” etc. business happens after the Apocalypse and is the work of God and/or Satan, not a human agency. Megachurches do not preach that Christians should kill or even be unkind to Jews; quite the contrary, in fact. Jews are honored as progenitors, with sadness because they obstinately refuse to get with the program. Their fate after the Apocalypse is strictly due to that obstinacy in the face of the Word of God, not something that people do (or are even authorized to help with).
And the notion that any but a tiny minority of Christians, not enough in the whole country (and probably the World) to form a megachurch, believe that action by Christians can either advance or delay the Apocalypse is laughable. It derives strictly from the Leftist “logic” that self-defense is an attack and therefore unconscionable, which leads to the corollary that if you think war is coming and prepare to defend yourself in it, you clearly and obviously want the war. This notion, originally stuck onto Gandhian pacifism by Stalinist propagandists attempting to weaken the West against the attack of the USSR to make the world safe for Socialism, has become inextricably mixed with the US Left’s attempts to splinter the Reagan Coalition by characterizing Christianity as evil and any support from Christians to be shunned, and taken a life of its own. I, for one, long for the dear dead days when the talented folks along Nevskiiy Prospekt would have suppressed that one for the idiocy it is.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 10:37 am #
I would never hurt you.
Comment by Carin on 2/29 @ 10:37 am #
carin why do u say guided?
does wright inform O’s policies?
i dont think u can say that.
What is the point of being religious if it doesn’t guide you? And, Wright’s teachings go beyond the religious into politics. “Black Values”, you know.
If Obama is true to his church, how can he represent “all” the people when the values he has embraced appear to be focused solely on the condition of blacks? Not Christians. Not the underserved of society. Blacks.
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 10:37 am #
we are not allowed to talk sufi-stuff to the un-initiate.
What will happen if you do?
muhammed
Another long word you type out.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 10:38 am #
Oh. Not you Ric. I mean you neither but nishi for sure.
Comment by daleyrocks on 2/29 @ 10:39 am #
nishi – Assume wat u want …. I am secretive too
Great pumpkin may you breed many little pumpkins this year
oops….did I say that out loud?
Comment by Pablo on 2/29 @ 10:40 am #
Issa? Don’t you mean X?
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:44 am #
b moes, theres this.
my jewish friends especially dislike mormons.
because of the death baptisms i guess.
Comment by daleyrocks on 2/29 @ 10:47 am #
kewl….sufi are like cafeteria muslims
take some of Islam and leave the rest
just like cafeteria catholics
ignore wat u dont like
Comment by Education Guy on 2/29 @ 10:48 am #
we are not allowed to talk sufi-stuff to the un-initiate.
So the secretiveness is something that comes from the sect itself and is not a tenant of Islam?
I understand why others are bothered by xian used in place of Christian, but I try not to let stuff like that bother me because God is not mocked. It’s impossible, at least according to the OT.
Comment by Ric Locke on 2/29 @ 10:48 am #
Happyfeet, the parallel isn’t quite exact, but as a first approximation think of sufism as the Islamic version of Christian Science.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:49 am #
maybee it just isn’t done.
we learned a long time ago that it leads to persecution.
a basic sufi teaching premise is that man cannot acquire what he cannot use.
ric locke it is not such a small minority as u say.
65 million served.
and a series for 10-14 year olds.
Comment by Education Guy on 2/29 @ 10:50 am #
adam and moses
Do you mean Abraham and Moses? I don’t think Adam is considered a prophet.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 10:51 am #
Gotcha. Maybe if we persecuted some Christian Scientists though they’d synch up better?
Comment by Carin on 2/29 @ 10:51 am #
y jewish friends especially dislike mormons.
because of the death baptisms i guess.
How very progressive of them.
If one believed that the Mormon death baptisms were gonna do anything … perhaps they should join the LDS? Otherwise, it concerns me about as much as the thought of the Hidden Imam turning up in Iran. For reals.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:52 am #
no ric locke that is wrong….
sufism is the mysiticism of islam.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:53 am #
mysticism, hehe
i have a friend that writes for a prestigious islamic journal, and he says the holy trinity is mysticism for xianity like sufism is mysticism for islam.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:54 am #
adam is a prophet in islm.
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 10:55 am #
we learned a long time ago that it leads to persecution.
persecution like people trying to kill you, or persecution like people calling you snake handlers?
Comment by Education Guy on 2/29 @ 10:55 am #
Ah, OK. I didn’t know that.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:56 am #
carin, that is anectdotal data, like B Moes was offering.
my jewish friends find the mormon baptisms of dead jews repugnant.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 10:57 am #
#115
both
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 10:57 am #
Guess which book?
Comment by Carin on 2/29 @ 10:57 am #
So, is Nish’s version of Islam kinda like Madonna’s version of Judaism?
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 10:58 am #
Same book. Curious.
Comment by Carin on 2/29 @ 11:01 am #
jewish friends find the mormon baptisms of dead jews repugnant
Again. That’s silly. If you don’t believe in specific religion, what does it matter what they do unless the “harm” actually -you know- HARMS someone? Comparatively speaking, of course.
For example, do they find it more, or less, repugnant than the beheading of gays?
Comment by BJTexs on 2/29 @ 11:05 am #
Yet again and example of your shallow thinking. There are several books in the series so 65 million sold doesn’t mean 65 million people are drinking the Left Behind highball. Also, many Christians read it for what amounts to entertainment value. It simply presents one view of the Final Judgement at a personal level. To use this Series as an expression of Christian/Jewish conflict is foolish. Ric laid it out in it’s most practical form: If one believes in a Final Judgment then it’s an inevitable conclusion that there will be “winners” and “losers.” The details of said are mostly unknown so any description is informed fantasy at best. The huge majority of Christians do (and should) honor Jews for our historical connections. That tiny percentage that don’t are bigots, unchristian and a relic from the middle ages.
BTW: Would it be OK for me to use FI as a shorthand for sufi?
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 11:07 am #
#115
both
Then what do you think of yourself calling people snake handlers? You are persecuting people, no?
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:08 am #
this is one of my favorite books.
Fusus al-Hikam
Ibn Arabi is one of my shayyks, my teachers.
in sufism ur shayyk doesnt have to be still alive. ;)
also, carin do u know of Ibn Hallaj?
he was crucified for sufism.
so u see we dont exaggerate about the persecution stuff.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 11:10 am #
Well, I think I actually bought one or two volumes of the series. That must mean that I completely buy into the authors’ vision of the Rapture and so on. Or, possibly, it was fiction that I bought as possible entertainment, and that it took me two entire volumes to become sufficiently disgusted with the bad writing to continue.
It being fiction and all, I didn’t find it necessary to agree with the theology, just as I don’t find it necessary to agree that Quicksilver is historically authentic.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:10 am #
That’s silly
not to my jewish friends.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 11:12 am #
OTOH Mein Kampf and The Protocols of the Elders of Zion are extremely popular in the Middle East. One of which is an autobiography, and the other of which is taken as historical fact by readers already eager to do so.
Nothing to see here; move along.
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 11:15 am #
he was crucified for sufism.
so u see we dont exaggerate about the persecution stuff.
In 922, by muslims.
Although I don’t want to diminish any sense of persecution you may feel.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:15 am #
guys
i am just sayin 65millionsold is why jews might see the leftbehind series as sort of….icky i guess, and the drudge article is pretty accurate i think.
it is like….evangeicals and fundamentalist really like jews…..to eat?
in that they are fungeable in the grand scheme of things.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:16 am #
maybee……errm
wasnt jesus crucified by jews?
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:16 am #
not to eat….but to perish i guess.
Comment by BJTexs on 2/29 @ 11:17 am #
Fer cryin’ out loud, nishi, Ibn Hallaj was persecuted in the ninth century! Are we going to start a new victimization process that links current persecution to executions that happened over a thousand years ago?
And what a surprise that he was martyred by … wait for it … the Abbasid Muslim Ruler!
Maybe Jews should keep their rituals secret beacuse of the church forced conversions in the 14th and 15th centuries. The idea that Christians in, say, China, actually worship in secret today has less significance than hundreds year old oppression.
I’m going to take a wild guess that the reson you are circumspect with your rituals has nothing to do with snake handlers, faith healers, or xtians of any kind.
You are becoming more shallow and, as a result, more obtuse.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:18 am #
#128
sure slart, and those books have an effect on some, just like the leftbehind books have an effect on some.
they do it too isnt really a good defense.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:19 am #
BJtex….ermm when was jesus crucified again?
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 11:19 am #
Wow. A guy was crucified over a thousand years ago for his religious beliefs.
That sort of thing probably only happened to sufis.
I think that perhaps you weren’t expecting the various Inquisitions as a counter-point to your fear of persecution.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:21 am #
the main reason sufis dont talk detail is that man cannot acquire what he cannot use.
and also we wud get madonna wanting to be a practicing sufi.
;)
Comment by Jeff G. on 2/29 @ 11:21 am #
You attacked Greenwald(s) for his homophobe-baiting two-faced half-truths, and you got a pingback from Henley’s site.
I haven’t popped over there, but I suspect it’s coming from Mona. Which, if that’s true, must mean either she has like a very specific and very powerful Gaydar, or else she monitors sites looking for any mentions of her nasally, prolix master so that she may spring to his defense.
Like Billie Whitelock in the original Omen, this gal is.
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 11:23 am #
maybee……errm
wasnt jesus crucified by jews?
Yes. But isn’t one of your complaints about Christians that we don’t keep secretive enough? Anyway, I can easily say that Christians and Jews aren’t the same religion. You’ve tried to say various sects of Islam aren’t real muslims, which is a tough argument to make.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:24 am #
well…no one expects the spanish inquisition.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 11:26 am #
they do it too isnt really a good defense
They do it too?
Let’s examine the differences, shall we?
One set of books paints a picture of what the authors expect the end of the world to look like. Possibly, what they hope it will look like, but when you’re speaking of religious beliefs, “hope” isn’t exactly the right word.
The other books lionize Adolf Hitler and demonize Jews. Protocols attempts to, among other things, deny the Holocaust as a sort of Jewish PR pity-party, and lays out a supposed plan for Jews to, en masse, I suppose, achieve world domination by distracting the rest of the world with pornography and staged financial disasters.
I say there’s maybe a great deal of open space between these works of bad fiction and these other things. Maybe not for you, though.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:28 am #
i told u wat a real muslim is!
just the shahada
ʾaÅ¡hadu ʾan lÄ ilÄÂha illÄÂ-llÄÂh, wa ʾaÅ¡hadu ʾanna muḥammadan rasÅ«lu-llÄÂh
there is no god but allah and muhammed is his prophet.
not, his ONLY prophet, not, his PREFFERED prophet, just his prophet.
all the rest is sectarian.
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 11:33 am #
to become a muslim, all u have to do is say the shahada.
there is no god but allah and muhammed is his prophet.
I assume you have to believe it.
Anyway, you are welcome to your religion. I just think you are not doing unto others, etc.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:34 am #
i didnt call anyone a snakehandler.
i said, leftbehinders and snakehandlers are sects of xianity.
like catholics and lutherans and methodists.
just like sunni, shi’ia, mu’tazhili, sufi, faylasef, etc are sects of islam.
Comment by Major John on 2/29 @ 11:35 am #
“to become a muslim, all u have to do is say the shahada.
there is no god but allah and muhammed is his prophet.”
That is just the first step. And when you say the shahada, you better have A Muslim witness and you had best mean it. There are 4 more Pillars of Islam. [ie. Will you make the Hajj? Do you pay zakat? Do you fast during Ramadan? Etc.]
BTW – Sufis are considered “non-muslim” by a fair number of the more orthodox believers.
Comment by Carin on 2/29 @ 11:36 am #
That’s silly
not to my jewish friends.
Let me contrast this with the high regard you hold for those who wish to protect life in the womb…
To recap:
– Disdain for pro-life Christians,
– Concern for Jews offput by Mormon after-death baptism.
Got it.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:37 am #
and wahhabists and salafists.
just as u are not endorsing snakehandling and leftbehinding, i am not endorsing wahhabism or salafism.
that is my point.
and also, that some sects of xianity alienate jews.
like some sects of islam alienate xians.
whew.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 11:39 am #
Yeah, thats what I thought too. Mostly though what I was thinking before is that in the sufi lands it’s easier to talk about just thems that aren’t persecuted. It’s different is all. A lot at least in the West I know when people talk about how hey maybe we should persecute Jews, it’s a lot their secretiveness they invoke.
Comment by Andrew on 2/29 @ 11:40 am #
“we are not allowed to talk sufi-stuff to the un-initiate.”
Sufis…the Mormons of Islam?
I Keed, I Keed!
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:40 am #
major john, i have disdain for anti-science theocons. not the same thing at all.
and frankly, i think i will let my shayyks judge if i am a “good” muslim.
it is not ur job.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 11:43 am #
I think she means more the Freemasons of Islam. But Sufism is really disproportionately cool from what I’ve read and that part is getting left out. The best parts of culture over there was mostly from them. I can see how they’d get them some persecuting.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:44 am #
xians are perfectly welcome to their wombpersonhood beliefs.
i just want those beliefs kept out of government.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 11:46 am #
The circle is complete.
Comment by Carin on 2/29 @ 11:49 am #
Well. you weren’t very respectful with Michelle Malkin suggestion that a woman may have taken her own life after aborting her twins.
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 11:49 am #
but again:
as a mu’tizilah, i must obey the First Obligation of the Mu’tizhili: to approach allah thru reason and science
If approaching allah through science is part of your religion, how is keeping science in government not putting your religious beliefs in government?
Comment by Rob Crawford on 2/29 @ 11:52 am #
BECAUSE OF THE BEST SELLER LIST!!!
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 11:52 am #
I mean, just as your jewish friends don’t want Mormons baptizing their dead bodies, maybe I don’t want my tax dollars to pay for your approach to Allah.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 11:54 am #
science is not religion.
religion is faith, science is empirical data.
the First Obligation says approach allah thru science, not thru religion.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 11:54 am #
As deep as any ocean…
Good heavens, Miss Nishizonoshinji
You’re beautiful
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 11:54 am #
It’s part of your religion, right?
Comment by Major John on 2/29 @ 11:59 am #
nishi, I coulnd’t possible care less whether you are a good Sufi/Muslim or not. But putting out that there is only one thing you need to do to become a Muslim ain’t the same as also mentioning the obligations that come with the deal. Or do the Sufi hide the 5 Pillars of Islam from the uninitiate as well?
Odd how you act defensively about what you perceive as my judging of your purity of Islamic faith while you deliberately (or sloppily and ignorantly) go out of your way to try and offend “xtians”…
I hope, for the sake of your co-religionists if no one else, that your grasp of Sufism is better than your understanding of Christianity or Judiasm.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 12:00 pm #
MayBee is being awfully incisive I think. Nice work.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 12:04 pm #
major, that IS the only u thing u need to do to BECOME a muslim.
to be a practicing muslim there are sectarian things u may do.
u know little of my faith.
OTOH, i was raised in yours.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 12:05 pm #
so is reason a part of my religion maybee.
shall we we eschew that as well?
Comment by Karl on 2/29 @ 12:06 pm #
Jeff G,
I checked Mona’s post, in which she links to claim that I wrote Hagee’s views are so nothing.
Which is why I wrote that McCain should disassociate himself from Hagee’s views, mostly because of the gay-bashing.
Yep, Mona is still a liar. In other news, the Sun will be setting in the West today, just around sundown.
Comment by Major John on 2/29 @ 12:13 pm #
The 5 pillars are in the Koran, nishi – that ain’t “sectarian”. Unless you don’t believe the Koran is the Word of God transcribed. That would make you “not a Muslim”. It would be like an “xtian” saying that Christ was not the Son of God, or a Jew saying that YWH is just one of several gods who are all the same.
I have managed to pick up a little knowledge of Islam by reading the Koran, studying History (I have a BA and MA in the field) and happening to be deployed now three times to a Muslim land.
Also, you know nothing of my faith, so you are guessing.
Well, back to that lovely third deployment then…
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 12:14 pm #
sry Karl i jacked ur thread again.
:(
im going off to sulk.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 12:19 pm #
but major, i dont have to execute on the five pillars or do everything the Qur’an says to be a muslim.
i wud just be a bad muslim.
i wud still be a muslim.
:)
rawr….im assuming ur xian.
but i cud be wrong lulz.
i have studied evolutionary theory of culture and religion in grad school.
i had a bibliography on another thread if ud like to see it.
Comment by MayBee on 2/29 @ 12:23 pm #
so is reason a part of my religion maybee.
shall we we eschew that as well?
Some would say we have indeed taken reason out of government.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 12:33 pm #
The 5 pillars are in the Koran, nishi – that ain’t “sectarianâ€Â.
but that is wat sectarianism in al-Islam is all about.
varying interpretations of the Qur’an.
that is the sunnah and the hadith….to tell ppl how to interpret the Qur’an.
to paraphrase, the Qur’an aint easy.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 12:34 pm #
im really just waiting for Jeff’s Mona post.
Comment by Victor. on 2/29 @ 12:38 pm #
I think it’s worth mentioning that when the entire civilized world was cowed by the insinuations and accusations of bigotry, xenophobia, and war mongering, Hagee stood alone in correctly identifying the Global Threats facing America and Israel. At a time when the establishment types in America were too afraid to even name and identify the enemy, Hagee was lecturing on Islamofascism and it’s origins.
Comment by happyfeet on 2/29 @ 12:39 pm #
Who?
Comment by Belvedere jones on 2/29 @ 1:03 pm #
“So Christina Aguilera is also know as Xina Aguilera?”
Yup.
You guys get bent out of shape about Xmas too, which “has been used for hundreds of years in religious writing, where the X represents a Greek chi, the first letter of ΧÃÂιÃĀoÂ, ‘Christ’?
Comment by alppuccino on 2/29 @ 1:11 pm #
As a Lutheran, I would appreciate it if you would refer to me in the shorter vernacular: $n
Thanks
Comment by Belvedere jones on 2/29 @ 1:17 pm #
“As a Lutheran, I would appreciate it if you would refer to me in the shorter vernacular: $n”
lol glass cleaner by the monitor, good idea. can’t read through d coke.
Pingback by The Excitable, Gullible Choice for Blog Readers: Sullivan [Karl] on 2/29 @ 1:42 pm #
[...] dismisses as a “flap” Obama’s prior association and defense of gay-bashing gospel singer Donnie McClurkin – the poster boy for African-American [...]
Comment by daleyrocks on 2/29 @ 2:07 pm #
I love nishi’s description of becoming a muslim. It’s sort of like the Eagle’s song Hotel California, though.
You can check in any time you want
But you can never leave
fatwa, fatwa, fatwa
no one ever leaves Islam
off with their heads
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 2:12 pm #
actually….sufis are more like jews.
we dont proselytize, and we dont take everyone who wants in.
if u want to get in, u have to work pretty hard.
this philosophy has historically caused a lot of problems for both our tribes.
Comment by Billy Bob Thornton on 2/29 @ 2:17 pm #
we dont proselytize, and we dont take everyone who wants in.
It’s like the team that the Bad News Bears had to play in the Championship game. They didn’t let just anyone on that team.
Were they the dicks in the movie too? cause I don’t remember. I think they were, maybe.
Comment by nishizonoshinji on 2/29 @ 2:32 pm #
zactly
:)
Comment by Slartibartfast on 2/29 @ 3:43 pm #
As a Luthoran, I would appreciate it if you would refer to me in the shorter vernacular: Lexian.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 2/29 @ 4:12 pm #
I think nishi’s real faith is best described as “faddism”.
Comment by Obstreperous Infidel on 2/29 @ 6:00 pm #
Shock! Dismay! nishi is a reactionary disgruntled ex-Catholic! Who could have seen that coming? (please note sarcasm) My sister made the same journey. Catholic to sufi. She’s just as closed minded and reactionary as nishi. Funny thing is I sympathize with a great deal of what nishi says in regards to separation of church and state. As a Christian it is, for me at least, mandatory. She is right in one sense in regards to “once a Muslim, always a muslim”. She’s just a miserably bad muslim. Which for us is a good thing. Just put up with the arrogance, but at least she doesn’t want to blow us the fuck up. Again, that’s a good thing.
Comment by daleyrocks on 3/1 @ 12:07 am #
but at least she doesn’t want to blow us the fuck up.
How do you know?
Comment by Rusty on 3/1 @ 12:16 pm #
i value intelligence and problem solving ability over all
Because the pontiff just isn’t PATRIARCHAL ENOUGH! Just can’t wait for the new spring line of colorful black bhurkas.
Pingback by Hot Air » Blog Archive » Audio: A very special message from Obama’s pastor on 3/1 @ 1:06 pm #
[...] of last year — but thanks to McCain’s Hagee-related jerkiness and the left’s highly nuanced dudgeon about it, everything old is new again. “Say, big A, doesn’t that make this a tu quoque?” [...]
Comment by Barbara Diamond on 3/4 @ 1:43 pm #
Pleas,
Screw the left
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Waters clear liquid form and general abundance/availability has made it easy for us to take it for granted. If it turned black when not alive we wouldn’t touch it. It doesn’t, so we continue to drink it without question. It is encouraging to see this attitude changing when it comes to the benefits of drinking water. Lets hope that over time this will foster greater action on a global water to honor water and therefore ourselves.
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