Or will John Cole come up with yet another dismissive rationale for the New York Times’ ideological bias in which he once again denigrates those who found the Times‘ “standby rate” argument for a specifically-timed attack ad just a bit too pat…?
– Particularly when what those “nutters” raising such a fuss should have been doing is concentrating on the mess that is Iraq.
(h/t STACLU)
Comment by Semanticleo on 9/23 @ 12:45 pm #
“Particularly when what they should have been doing is concentrating on the mess that is Iraq.”
Imagine if conservatives could arrange for higher CAFE standards seeing as how they can get such efficiency and mileage from this non-story.
Comment by Jeff G. on 9/23 @ 12:51 pm #
Oh, have you concluded it’s a non-story? I hadn’t heard. My mistake. Nothing to see here. Move along.
…but BRING BACK THE FAIRNESS DOCTRINE TO CURTAIL THE PERNICIOUS INFLUENCE ON PUBLIC DISCOURSE BROUGHT ABOUT BY THE ABOMINATION OF RIGHT WING RADIO!
Comment by Doug on 9/23 @ 12:56 pm #
“Imagine if conservatives could arrange for higher CAFE standards seeing as how they can get such efficiency and mileage from this non-story.”
the pliable green slice of rubber speaks a damn fine English, in a pitiable falsetto
Comment by happyfeet on 9/23 @ 12:57 pm #
The STACLU post notes that “Of course we gotta also give props to Confederate Yankee who first explored and investigated on this idea.”
SarahW, from yesterday:
Comment by Pablo on 9/23 @ 1:13 pm #
Right.
The Times was doing us a solid, y’all. Power to the People (who hold the correct POV)!!!
Comment by Drumwaster on 9/23 @ 1:18 pm #
And we’re not even allowed to question the timing. I mean, how lucky was it that there was NO OTHER USE for that particular full page on EXACTLY THE DAY that General Petraeus was scheduled to speak (at the order, and on the timing, of the Democratically-controlled Congress)?
I mean, a day earlier, and people (read: “Democrat Senators on Sunday morning talk shows”) would have had to respond [i]before[/i] the General spoke. A few days later, and it would have been seen as the purely partisan attack that it was.
Can you imagine the synchronicity needed for that lack of hard-money advertisers (even on the regional level) on the very day that the ad was going to be most effective?
I question the ti… oh, wait.
Comment by dicentra on 9/23 @ 1:22 pm #
Imagine if conservatives could arrange for higher CAFE standards
Are these the same CAFE standards that cause auto manufacturers to use lighter-weight and therefore weaker parts, resulting in more highway fatalities?
…the punch line fails me. Someone help me out here.
Comment by gahrie on 9/23 @ 1:28 pm #
Wow Semanticleo, nearly identical posts on two separate blogs trying to change the subject in one day. Slow down, you’ll wear yourself out.
Comment by happyfeet on 9/23 @ 1:32 pm #
Covered in glory, our John Cole:
I don’t know how to help him.
Comment by Carin on 9/23 @ 1:37 pm #
I don’t know how to help him.
I help by not encouraging him. Or, reading his site.
Comment by Merovign on 9/23 @ 1:44 pm #
I think the left may actually have reached the point of being incapable of not lying.
Which is kind of stunning, given the number of people we’re talking about here.
Pablo: Heh.
Comment by Swen Swenson on 9/23 @ 2:11 pm #
It’s not that they’re incapable of telling the truth, it’s that lying, cheating, and stealing in service of the narrative aren’t considered sins. Call it a special dispensation.
A ferret in their pants sure, but not an ant, please. With my karma I’ll probably come back as a cockroach but let’s not hurry things.
Comment by Kirk on 9/23 @ 2:40 pm #
Geez, I still love to see me a good bitch slappin’ every once in a while.
Comment by Aldo on 9/23 @ 2:59 pm #
Cole, 9/13/07:
Then, in this post on September 15, Cole savagely attacked Bob Owens of Confederate Yankee for questioning whether MoveOne got a price break:
Ooops. Looks like old mouth-breathing Bob Owens was right. Again.
Comment by Pablo on 9/23 @ 3:08 pm #
Well, Cole has come to a point of self realization.
I guess I finally have a full-fledged case of BDS.
No mention of the NYT revelation over there, though.
Comment by Doug on 9/23 @ 4:02 pm #
“That, my friends, is how the
rightleft-wing blogosphere “investigates.†Create a charge, accuse someone of something, trumpet it wildly, get a bunch of mouthbreathers in a furor, and then, when it is obvious to everyone you have no proof, blame the person you accused.”Can you say Valerie Plame?
Comment by steveaz on 9/23 @ 4:29 pm #
Guys,
Maybe the discount enjoyed by MoveOn was a pro bono payment, as in, payment for services rendered to the NYT. And the latest “admission” from the NYT’s advertising department could be a facile distraction (that appears to be working).
In fact, if you flip the assumed relationship between MO and the NYT on its head, and consider that MoveOn has been evangelizing the NYT’s worldview – not the other way around, then the discount makes perfect sense.
And, once you begin to wonder who’s paying who and for what, then the other collusions come into sharper focus – like the careful coordination of the ad’s publication to coincide with a US Military presentation, or the way MO’s media-message has reflected the NYT’s editorial-direction, in content and passion, since 2003.
It’s too bad, too, that non-transferable pro bono exchanges are still rampant in America’s print and web media-corps. – many experts have attributed the burst of the dotcom bubble to their widespread abuse.
Some just never learn…
Comment by happyfeet on 9/23 @ 4:42 pm #
Clarkie doesn’t have any other sources who might shine a light on who that salesperson might be? Sounds like Pinch yanked the leash. Oww.
Comment by JJ on 9/23 @ 4:44 pm #
Slightly OT, but I was getting all cranked to watch the new Ken Burn’s documentary on WW2 and I notice the first episode is called “The Necessary War”. Great. If that’s right, then it may just be a long drink of more BDS. And if so, it’ll be more evidence of today’s trend that BDS is getting silly and going into a state of advanced logic rot.
But Burn’s documentary on Huey Long was good (not as good as T. Harry Williams on Long).
Comment by Ric Locke on 9/23 @ 4:48 pm #
No, steveaz, it’s facile and superficially explanatory, but it doesn’t work.
Remember two things:
(1) MoveOn.org is funded by George Soros. Never mind the “cognitive dissidence” inherent in having a (putatively) Leftist organization paid for by the fattest capitalist fatcat in the world; just keep it in mind that, for all practical purposes when it comes to business negotiations, MO is worth seven billion dollars.
(2) The current value of the New York Times — stock price times number of shares — is a bit less than the assessed valuation of the building it owns and occupies, let alone other real estate (the printing plant, e.g.). Therefore the value of the newspaper as a newspaper is zero, zilch, nada.
The NYT is not in a position of strength relative to MoveOn. Quite the contrary, in fact — it wouldn’t surprise me if somebody from the Soros organization leaned a bit on the management to get the ad printed.
It was stupid all ’round for MoveOn to get the discount, because that’s what is causing the furore; if all it had been was the ad people would’ve been irritated, but there wouldn’t be a blogswarm. Whoever placed the ad is a dumbshit, and is probably being disciplined even as we speak. It would have been far better if MoveOn had insisted on paying the going rate. They can afford it, and it wouldn’t have drawn the attention.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by happyfeet on 9/23 @ 5:08 pm #
Also, the guy in charge of approving ad copy is named Steph. Most of the discussion of the ad talked about timing, not placement (both of which are not guaranteed by the “standby” arrangement, except for MoveOn ads.)
Steph says this about placement, discussing a hypothetical BP ad:
Has anyone read where the ad was placed in the NYT, and the context? I’m just curious because I suspect that the New York Times sometimes bends the rules for ads from MoveOn.
Comment by Spies, Brigands, and Pirates on 9/23 @ 5:33 pm #
Maybe Soros will return the favor by purchasing some of their crappy stock?
On a side issue, why in the world would a grown man go by the nickname “Pinch”?
Comment by Drumwaster on 9/23 @ 5:36 pm #
Only AFTER it was revealed that the NYT had given MoveOn such a sweetheart deal, and only AFTER they had originally refused to run “political advertisements”. But whatever spin you need to keep the focus on the mess that is Iraq.
(It becomes clear why he has a site glorifying hot air.)
Comment by ThomasD on 9/23 @ 5:41 pm #
SB&P,
Such monikers are what passes for class distinction in our ‘classless’ society. Having one lets you avoid having to buy any polo ponies.
Comment by Drumwaster on 9/23 @ 5:44 pm #
Says the man identified as “Spies, Brigands, and Pirates”.
{Got no beef, ’cause look at my ‘nym…)
Comment by Drumwaster on 9/23 @ 5:48 pm #
Since when are payments for services rendered to the New York Times considered “for the {public} good” (which is what pro bono {publico} means)
Comment by Blitz on 9/23 @ 6:12 pm #
way off topic…I’m trying to give either Jeff or Ric a heads up. I’ve an idea on a great post,but I’m not the person to write it(obviously)…It’s regarding Mussolini=Dinnerjacket and Hitler=Putin-the whole jew thing….Can someone please point me to Email?
Comment by happyfeet on 9/23 @ 6:23 pm #
The little “Contact” link up at the top right. Well, here, really.
Comment by JD on 9/23 @ 6:23 pm #
2 simple questions for John Cole.
1) Why are you still part of Pajamas Media?
2) When are you going to type your unconditional apology to everyone for being so painfully and publically wrong, wrong, wrong?
I expect nothing but gobsmackingly vile BS to continue to spew from his pie-hole, and act as though this issue never existed.
Comment by happyfeet on 9/23 @ 6:23 pm #
It worked better for me after I took the spaces out.
Comment by Jeffersonian on 9/23 @ 6:26 pm #
How about, “BLOOD FOR OIL!!!” (when the proper egos are being soothed that the exchange is being made for ‘progressive’ reasons)
Comment by happyfeet on 9/23 @ 6:26 pm #
JD – he answered the Pajamas question here. It’s cause of his integrity, dontcha know.
Comment by JD on 9/23 @ 6:34 pm #
The lure of a check keeps him anchored to the evil captalist side, huh happyfeet? Fucking hypocrite, he is.
Are these the same CAFE standards that cause auto manufacturers to use lighter-weight and therefore weaker parts, resulting in more highway fatalities?
Nope, this is just cyclical. The trial lawyers will then start going after the automaker for not going with the safer design, and some braindead Judge and jury will allow a verdict of tens of millions for some drunk driver at three times the legal limit and no seat belt who crashed their car into a bridge abuttment, and sues the automaker for making a smaller lighter car rather than the option that was heavier, but did not meet the CAFE standards.
Comment by steveaz on 9/23 @ 6:52 pm #
Hi Drumwater,
In the accounting biz, an invoice with “pro bono” on it represents a non monetary “bill” for services rendered. In addition, this “soft” cost is rationalized in-house by defining it as an exchange of goods or services of “like” value.
I define it more harshly, though. In the case of MoveOn’s “discount,” a pro bono transfer from the NYT could be used to launder an illicit, or politically unattractive, trade of goods or services.
Which, in this case, would be proxy, 501 (c) advocacy against America’s efforts to modernize and liberalize the Middle East.
Comment by Ric Locke on 9/23 @ 6:52 pm #
If I were running a car company, I would have my engineers working hard on setting up a system for making engine changes trivial — “power pack exchange”.
I would then ship every vehicle I made, including one-ton dually pickups, with a one-liter, normally aspirated four-banger, and simultaneously offer “power packs” for remote-energy use (pumps, generators, that sort of thing.) Presto: CAFE of 40 MPG including light trucks, and the customers can have what they want with a little trouble.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by Mikey NTH on 9/23 @ 7:00 pm #
Of course, MoveOn placing the ad in the NYT was just a preaching to the choir. And NYT giving a discount to MoveOn was wrong…they should have charged full rate to have the cash infusion be made without criticism.
Comment by Drumwaster on 9/23 @ 7:07 pm #
It still stands for “for the public good”. It means you are doing a service for someone because you think it is a good idea, not necessarily “for profit”.
You seem to have your positions mixed up, too, in that it would be the NYT doing the “pro bono” ad for MoveOn, and that would be a clear exposure of bias for the NYT, utterly devastating any claims of neutrality. It wasn’t MoveOn doing the NYT a favor by running the ad.
Plus, that wasn’t what they said – they specifically said it was the “stand-by” rate (which apparently means “65% off if you don’t mind having your one-day ad run on the EXACT SAME DAY it would do the most damage, and give the ideological opposition the least amount of time to respond”).
It just seems too coincidental.
Maybe they’re just too used to leaking things to realize how it would look bad for them, too.
Comment by Drumwaster on 9/23 @ 7:08 pm #
Oh, not to sound snitty or anything, but you misspelled my name.
Just call me “Drum”, alright? Easier to remember.
Comment by Uncle Pinky on 9/23 @ 7:10 pm #
I’m just waiting for Pinch to break out the ol’ stuffed moose again.
Comment by happyfeet on 9/23 @ 7:48 pm #
“comped x%” is what they would say I think
Comment by Drumwaster on 9/23 @ 7:53 pm #
Like an AC casino does for a high roller? I’m not sure they would agree with the analogy, feets…
Comment by happyfeet on 9/23 @ 7:57 pm #
is just a guess. I’ve heard talk about tv make-goods that uses language like that is all.
Comment by Drumwaster on 9/23 @ 8:25 pm #
I’m not saying it isn’t accurate, mind, just that they probably wouldn’t agree.
Or like it very much. ;-)
Comment by Scrapiron on 9/23 @ 8:40 pm #
Since the anti-american NYSlimes made an illegal contibution of $60,000+ to the democrats Moron.org says they will pay the rest of the ad price. Is this to avoid a prison sentence for the NYSlimes and Moron.org?
Comment by Scrapiron on 9/23 @ 8:42 pm #
If the FEC had a high school graduate on staff the charges would have already been filed. The educated elite FEC weenies are slow on the uptake.
Comment by RiverC on 9/23 @ 9:00 pm #
You know, I think there are some times that Semant is just waiting for a post, to jump on it. Like those old slashdotters that would continually refresh just to get ‘FIRST POST!!!!111!!’.
Either way, the exchange strikes me as less sinster than it is kind of just plain dumb. Like going into a church service and declaring God doesn’t exist. You’re not going to get killed, but you’re definitely going to look like a total ass and get escorted out.
Tact is a very, very small thing against the Tremendousnessness(tm) of the Narrative(tm) I suppose. The whole ostensible discount thing is just rubbing our face in it. ‘Yes! We’re working together! We really suck (like everyone) at hiding it!’ (hint to ‘troofers’)
Comment by Karl on 9/23 @ 9:04 pm #
Scrapiron,
With all due respect, your comment demonstrates a lack of insight as to how the FEC works… or doesn’t.
The FEC is charged with policing federal elections. Their budget comes… or doesn’t… from Congress.
Imagine how effective and timely the IRS would be if it had to beg taxpayers for their annual budget. Or the EPA had to get their money from energy companies.
Put another way, when I worked there (briefly), you could not run the shredder and the microwave oven at the same time without blowing the power for the entire building (which, ironically, used to house DC’s power company). Now they share space with the Hard Rock Cafe.
Also, the Commission itself always has an equal number of Rs and Ds — a sure recipe for inaction. Not that more of the gov’t couldn’t stand to be underfunded and engineered for inaction. But that’s how it is with the FEC, which rarely initiates action on its own and is generally way behind in any sort of investigation it undertakes on a complaint.
Comment by Sav on 9/23 @ 9:54 pm #
Cole has a post up detailing how a Canadian rag has Bush on its cover dressed in Saddam gear with expected comparisons inside. And his point of the post is to mock those who might find this comparison a bit, shall we say, vile. He’s all excited that Malkin responded as he believed she would. I really can’t distinguish him from the nutroots anymore.
Comment by Pablo on 9/23 @ 10:18 pm #
That effort is an exercise in futility, Sav.
Comment by Merovign on 9/23 @ 10:20 pm #
Karl – like Congress is going to make sure its watchdog is well-fed… heh…
Comment by Robin Roberts on 9/23 @ 10:27 pm #
The NYT finally admitted that they did break the rules and illegally give MoveOn.org a discount? Wow, I’m almost as shocked to learn that they admitted their bias as I am to learn that anyone still reads John Cole.
Comment by thor on 9/23 @ 11:42 pm #
Why is there a orange and black strip on the top of my screen?
Something or another tilted the axis. I see the same names but there’s a different pattern on the table cloth.
Comment by blarkin on 9/24 @ 5:47 am #
In addition to what Karl says, the FEC does not have criminal sanctions at its disposal, only civil fines.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 9/24 @ 6:16 am #
Heh….
Hot Air calls the NYT ad cost a “family discount”.
Comment by eLarson on 9/24 @ 7:02 am #
John Cole’s inner 14-year-old is worried about what all the ‘cool kids’ are doing at Yearly Kos. Angling for an invite, I suspect.
Comment by alppuccino on 9/24 @ 7:36 am #
Aren’t you guys being a little hard on this John Cole guy? Don’t you think a hug would do him more good than all this gloating? And what about Pinch? How do you think he feels right now? When do you think the last time was that someone held George Soros in their arms and said, “There, there…..it’s all gonna be alright.”? THESE ARE PEOPLE, PEOPLE!!!
Why doesn’t that mean general understand how he’s hurting John Cole? It makes no sense.
Comment by clarice on 9/24 @ 8:34 am #
What are the odds that the ANSWER crew and a number of pre-election ads by this and similar groups didn’t get favorable rates? What are the odds that the NYT does not want the FEC to proceed on the instant complaint or a thorough investigation of the rates they’ve been charging their leftist allies?
Just saying….
Comment by happyfeet on 9/24 @ 8:46 am #
I would not be comfortable hugging George Soros. Maybe tequila would help. John Cole I thing has an auto-hug feature.
Comment by happyfeet on 9/24 @ 8:46 am #
*think*
Comment by Slartibartfast on 9/24 @ 8:57 am #
Jeff, when you get up: comments spammers have infested your archives. You might want to have one of your minions clean it up.
Comment by Great Banana on 9/24 @ 1:51 pm #
Semanticleo says:
“Imagine if conservatives could arrange for higher CAFE standards seeing as how they can get such efficiency and mileage from this non-story.”
Of course, the NYT (a News publication) giving special deals (i.e., losing money by charging less for the ad) to ideological compatriats to run full page ads is not a story.
But when radio stations run conservative OPINION talk-shows as a business decision based on the fact that such shows get great ratings and make lots of money, the leftists (such as our always reasonable and honest friend semanticleo) call for the “fairness doctrine” whereby such shows can be shut down and/or replaced with zero rating left-wing shows.
What Semanticleo does not understand, and probably does not have the brain power to understand, is that we on the right don’t care so much whether the NYT gives cut-rates to ideological fellow-travellers. It’s their business if they want to lose money. However, it is a story b/c it proves that the NYT is not an objective non-biased institution as it and the left claims. Instead, it is a biased advocate for a leftist political viewpoint and must be read with that in mind.
the left hates this story b/c it is opens the curtain a little further for us all to see the wizard, and the left’s years of lying about the “objectivity” and “honesty” of the main stream press is slowly coming to an end.
Without total control of information getting to the electorate, what are the left’s long term chances in a democracy? Not very good, or else stories such as this would not cause such fear in the left.
Comment by JD on 9/24 @ 2:34 pm #
Maybe Tila Tequila, the bi-sexual Vietnamese girl with the new show on MTV? She could certainly life Soros’ spirits.
Comment by Merovign on 9/24 @ 2:48 pm #
Shit. Am I going to have to get cable now?
Comment by JD on 9/24 @ 3:06 pm #
Mreovign – Short answer … YES
Comment by narciso on 9/24 @ 4:26 pm #
The author of that MacLeans piece, Patrick Graham, who made a fool of himself, three years ago (not for
the first time in Harper’s Magazine.
“Among the Insurgents” was as turgid
a puff piece of the fighters of Fallujah,”The City of Four Hundred
Mosques” who he had characterized as
staunch Salafists and opponents of Saddam; until the Americans came. For
a quick rebuttal; Bill Roggio’s interview of the “Lion of Jabbour” former Saddam army captain, who happens to be a part of the three major Sunni tribes (Dulaimi and Ubeidi
are the other two) that composed Saddam’ army.
Trackback by Moose Sofa Table on 10/7 @ 8:59 am #
Moose Sofa Table…
0…