August 21, 2014

The end is nigh

Newsmax, after reviewing the performance of their widgets on the site, today informed me it is ending its partnership with me. The last of my site’s revenue stream, save for monthly fundraisers (which I happen to hate, because I don’t like to ask for money), is now gone.

Those who threatened to run me off the internet have gotten their wish. Though the site appears to be doing well for its niche, the lack of links from the network of high-traffic sites that have frozen me out — and yes, it was a coordinated effort — have finally killed off protein wisdom.

For honor.

Which is cool, I guess. After all, what have I ever done for the conservative movement, anyway?

I suppose I’ll do a kind of retrospective of the site starting in September and then see where I go from there.

I appreciate your support over these past nearly 13 years. You stuck with me, and I believe that is a credit to every last one of you, because I understand that it hasn’t always been easy. I write what I believe and I don’t play diplomatic games. I just don’t have the personality for it. And it’s cost me.

I wish all the recently-turned full-throated conservatives — erstwhile pragmatists who poked fun at the “True Believers,” etc., — had joined me earlier rather than working so tirelessly to supplant me.

But it is what it is. And I can hold my head high knowing that I refused to compromise my principles, even if that meant pissing off the go-along, get-along GOP fluffers.

Posted by Jeff G. @ 10:45am
292 comments | Trackback

Comments (292)

  1. It’s a sad day for me. I’m not feeling well to begin with — my family has all been sick, and we’re closing in 5 days on the new house — so I guess I’ll take some time and move more furniture and boxes at my leisure.

    Please know, all, that I tried. I really did.

  2. Please know, all, that I tried. I really did.

    Better than anyone else.

  3. Thanks, SW.

  4. I always say that nothing last forever. It still hurts.

  5. I sincerely hope that something comes along to replace the lost revenue stream. It makes me sick to think that your enemies would succeed in silencing what is, in my opinion, the most thoughtful, original, intelligent, and truly non-partisan, site in cyberspace.

    I wish I could be of help in some way but am financially strapped myself; having to attempt to replace our home, destroyed by Sandy, out of pocket, since the federal flood insurance isn’t paying-at least any time soon. And as a friend who’s a NY judge observed, “it’s the feds Bob, they can simply choose to not follow NY insurance regulations, and do what they want”…

    A situation that doesn’t bode well for those relying on national health insurance. But that’s a different topic for another time.

    God bless, and all the best

  6. Jeff, email me if you would — click my handle and use the contact link — and maybe we could look at what the costs have been and how they might be reduced without quitting altogether.

  7. Blast.

    Valley Forge in August.

  8. Aw, crap.

    What I would really like to say is nil desperandum. I’m sorry.

  9. You’re too good a writer to not have an outlet. There’s no way to keep that bottled up.

    Get moved, get settled, then perhaps you’ll feel differently from a new perspective.

    How is traffic driven in this new open-border era? I’m guessing all the original blogger’s traffics are off. Insty doesn’t have the stature he once strutted. Drudge drives the hits now, Facebook and Twitter claim huge shares. Personally, I never read other blogs anymore, unless linked from here or Twitter. Ace or Hot Air? Dead air AFAIC.

    Wherever you surface, I’ll support. Best to stay here, selfishly speaking… )

  10. I’d love to childishly and thoughtlessly brainstorm desperation ideas like Bob Belvedere, McGehee, Bill Quick, and Chris Muir all collaborating on one site and splitting costs and working out something with instapundit for enhanced exposure and getting an office in a state with Amazon buy-through support, but I don’t really know shit about shit and it’s not my site to re-think.

    Best of fortune t’ye Jeff.

  11. Best to stay here . . .

    I can easily agree with this on a selfish motive, but might alter the expression to say “stay” in motion here. But then I seem to be in the grip of an obsession with variations on a theme today — so both ‘staying’ and ‘moving’ in that way.

  12. Damn.

  13. …the HELL?

    Oh, you can also thank Colorado for nixing the Amazon option.

    Thanks, CO!

  14. That was my selfish reaction, above.

    I understand and know your wife and sons will love having more of you around. Whatever happens this has been a wonderful ride for me reading and commenting here. My thanks for all the fish.

  15. No words, other than I’m sorry.

  16. Wherever shall I go? Whatever shall I do?

    Do NOT respond “Frankly Scarlett…” because I already know that.

  17. Frankly, my dear, I do give a damn.

  18. The relevant lines (in my view) from the Bad News Bears:

    Rudi Stein: We keep playing like this and we’ll be the laughingstock of the league.

    Tanner Boyle: Well whadda ya expect when all we got on this team are a buncha Jews, spics, niggers, pansies . . and a booger-eatin’ moron.

    Ogilvie: Tanner, I think you need to be reminded from time to time that you are one of the few people on this team who is not a Jew, spic, nigger, pansy or booger-eating moron. So you’d better cool it or we may be disposed to beat the crap out of you.

  19. Nooooo! Hate to hear that and hope that something comes up so you can prevail.

  20. - A key moment in time for some serious synchronicity, and it will happen if its meant to be.

    – Thus forsooth, I will not say goodbye.

  21. I’m not dead. Just a bit down. I’m going to do everything I can to try to keep going.

    Maybe my wife will agree to start selling off her eggs.

  22. Di has a point: I’ve had people tell me their sites make so much money off of Amazon partnerships that it’s easy to justify keeping the site running. Not here. The Denver/Boulder donut hole has entrenched liberal Democrats into the state houses, and as a result we drive businesses out of Colorado whenever we can, if there’s a political point to be exploited.

  23. I dunno how much you pay for hosting your stuff, but Yahoo Groups are free.

    And kinda lame, but there’s that.

  24. The Tip [starts at 1:23] (though not as in “just the tip”)

    and Pills

  25. but this is where i make the comments what am i gonna do

    i don’t understand none of it

    i hate change and this is change so i hate it

  26. Not to sound trite, but where there is a will, there is a way. A little brain-storming would seem to be in order. There’s more than one way to skin a cat.
    Ok, that was trite.
    Jeff, I think a bunch of us have your back.

  27. HF, maybe you can start a blog of nothing but comments and we’ll all write blog posts in the comment threads.

  28. what am i gonna do

    take the tip, then the pills (or the pils)

  29. Just spit-ballin’ here: Out-of-state corporation, Sub-S probably, hosts the site. Amazon revenue covers expenses, Jeff (and the usual suspects) post their articles. Income, if any, rolls back into corporation which pays dividends or salary to employee/shareholder.

  30. i can’t start a blog I’m not a go-getter like that

    i just make the comments

    kinda like how ferdinand just liked to smell the flowers

  31. I have a sudden urge for beef ribs.

  32. the cycle of violence: 1)Israel targets and kills a heap of Hamas military commanders, 2) Hamas rounds up Gazan Arabs, interrogates, torturing them, then executes them as “spies”, 3) Gazan Arabs, seeing Hamas’ brutality, seek to provide Israel with information as to location of Hamas military commanders, 4) Irael targets and kills a heap of Hamas military commanders, 5) Hamas rounds up Gazan Arabs, interrogates, torturing them, then executes them as “spies”, and 6) repeat until Hamas is ended

  33. Is there any problem with switching over to a free WordPress.com site?

    All I pay is for the yearly costs of two domains, Whois privacy, and a fee for having no ads.

    I don’t know, but there’s some solution, I am sure, we can brainstorm out of this.

    PS: You’re very kind, Palaeo – thank you.

  34. I hatehatehate WordPress.com-hosted sites that require passwords, which PW would have to. My browser can’t tell which site uses which password for my username and I never can use the same password for all of them.

    Maybe if the rehosted PW used Disqus instead or something…

  35. That’s what they use over at Stacy McCain’s place. Smitty set it up. I don’t use it so I don’t know.

  36. should we have more frequently clicked on newsmax for such gems as >New Fat Burner Takes GNC by Storm < to satisfy the widget?

  37. Of course, if you use the free WP you’re subject to their suspensions. I’m such a small-fry no one has complained about TCOTS yet.

    Dan Collins’s brother used to run a hosting company, I believe. Maybe, I could check that out [I told Dan about Jeff's announcement, by the way].

  38. I tried to, NR, but found it hard for my brain to make it into a habit.

    No…I’m sure, considering all of the intelligence available here, we can come-up with a solution.

  39. i love fat burner storms, especially at night

    for all their fury and vehemence, they lull you to restful sleep

    i love fat burner storms

  40. >Oh, you can also thank Colorado for nixing the Amazon option. <

    so register pw in another state. say a po box in wyoming? is the pw server in co? also any local guns store you use. because i keep buying guns and ammo and the water somehow takes it. i'll buy from them if helps you.

  41. Because the post title, and because I’m still traumatized over Robin William’s suicide, this hijack sort of fits.

    Oh, and Discus threads truly suck the life out of comment threads. Hate ‘em like ‘feets hates the wimmens.

    “How in the hell could you possibly do that to your children? I don’t care how well adjusted your kid might be — choosing to kill yourself, rather than to be there for that child, is every shade of awful, traumatic and confusing. I think as soon as you have children, you waive your right to take your own life. No matter what mistakes you make in life, it should be your utmost goal not to traumatize your kids. So, you don’t kill yourself.”

    That’s truth and should be banked.

  42. *Robin Williams’* suicide

  43. Bob, I just tried to post a comment over at TCOTS. My password — for whatever was the last WordPress.com site I commented on — was rejected.

    Ya might as well be using Zuckerbook comments for all the good it does me.

  44. some people just don’t handle rejection very well

  45. I refuse to accept this news. I am quiet, but I am here, darn it. And I like it here. {sniff}

  46. Oh, and Discus threads truly suck the life out of comment threads. Hate ‘em like ‘feets hates the wimmens.

    Compared to not being able to log in to post a comment, I’d put up with a life-sucked comment thread. When I’m jonesing, I’m jonesing.

  47. some people just don’t handle rejection very well

    It happens to me so seldom, I just can’t ever get used to it.

  48. wordpress is very chicago(except in pwland). when i login it ask “who sent you”?

  49. Ya might as well be using Zuckerbook comments for all the good it does me.

    I don’t use Zuckerbook.

    So I veto that paradigm, for what it’s worth.

  50. Damn. I’ll have to look into that.

  51. McGehee: You can comment without a WordPress identity and are then just required to provide a name and e-mail address.

    I just recalled that I have several WordPress user accounts. In fact, I use a special one to comment here. Both my browsers remember the accounts, so re-signing-in is easy.

  52. Jeff, IMO you need to write a book (or ten) and self-publish it. If PW is already a registered business, you can use it as your publishing house. It costs nothing to write a book and list it on Amazon; they will supply you with one of their ISBNs and list your book in exchange for a chunk of your profits…and if you want more control, you can do part of that yourself. It’s screamingly easy and, since you already have a built-in fan base, a portion of your advertising is already taken care of. I’ve gone self-pub myself just to see what it’s like and, although there are definite drawbacks, I know a few people who make a living from their books and they are not the writer you are. Food for thought.

  53. If I give my email address, WordPress.com wants me to login. It recognizes the address and won’t let me comment without logging in.

    Yes, I could use some other email address, but why the @#$!! should I have to?

  54. Always hold your head high Jeff Goldstein!

  55. Also, shit.

  56. Okay, I just reset my WordPress.com password and now TCOTS recognizes me. But if history is any guide after a while the cookie with the new password will expire and I’ll be back in the same boat. Pisses me off every time it happens.

  57. For what it’s worth, I do remember how a power mad assistant DA destroyed another man’s livelihood and is still linked in polite society.

    When that person has most recently started speaking about how (TX) DAs shouldn’t be all drunk and power-mad then I sorta stopped giving a shit.

    Fuck the blogosphere. They’re full of shit. Full stop.

  58. I remember back when this all started and how Pablo became the mensch of the century by refusing to be silenced by a power mad ADA outta Cali.

    Remember that?

    I remember all the emails I saved from that time period so that same power mad ADA wouldn’t bury us all with lawfare.

    Because people do forward those emails. It happens.

  59. oh you better believe history is a guide

    a trusty guide, stalwart and true

    a little sumpin bumpin thump thumpin on the wheel ride

  60. That it is, hf.

  61. i got it political bumperstickers: (w/armadillo image) redskins! sortof link

  62. I just changed the setting so that name and e-mail address are not required.

  63. Remember that?

    I do. And here’s a link to a piece of it. And another to the time of the original incident itself, upon which that earlier link just now reflected.

  64. For what it’s worth the second, I’m Jer Olson and I can afford legal fees. Lots and lots of them.

  65. I sometimes forget that nobody cares what I have to say. Or that this isn’t a site where I need be tolerated.

    I’m kind of an asshole that way.

  66. If I might “squirtlesquirtlesquirtle” I’m going to take my exhaustive experience in this “interweb” realm and declare you full of shit.

    If that bothers you and your block paragraphs of personal failure, you should maybe send me a email at fuck@off.com

  67. it’s nice to be important but it’s more important to be nice

    that’s what Alyssa says

    and she’s famous

  68. FAMOUS

  69. > I have a WordPress blog myself mostly dedicated to film/music reviews. <

    you review proggtardia? what fun!

  70. > I have a WordPress blog myself mostly dedicated to film/music reviews. <

    have you look at the "gentle giant" mike brown's raps?

  71. >I’ve never understood why Protein Wisdom can’t be something that Goldstein does in his spare time. <

    ditto for academia w/o the tenure

  72. Well, we were serious for a moment there at least.

    Now it’s dummy time.

  73. To state an obvious truth, when too many clowns chime in then serious people start wondering whether or not this is a serious thing.

    Is this a serious thing?

  74. No, seriously.

    Does it matter to you guys that Jeff is going off-line?

    I think it’s a bit tragic.

    You’re really just gonna pivot to some other horseshit you wanted to talk about anyways?

    Fuck all y’all indulging in that.

  75. I lurked for many years on this site before I ever commented. Jeff I like your take on matters and wish for you to continue. I contribute money when I can and will continue to do so if you keep the site running. Squirrel shit you know absolutely nothing about Jeff if you think this is his full time job. as bh so eloquently stated fuck off.

  76. I’m sad to hear the news, Jeff.

    I always thought you’d make a head-run around the bastards…that you’d hook up with the international thinkers, like David Thompson, Caroline Glick, Kate Werks, Kathy Shaidle et a, and bypass our cloistered, American conservative ‘blockers.’

    Daniel Greenfield, and some of the up-and-com’ers at National Review (like Kevin Williams), and the pungent, daring crowd at Takimag, they’re all natural bedfellows with you, Jeff, so most of all I’m disappointed that you weren’t able to cop some dap from them. Or with them. Or whatever. Sigh…

    You know, like neurons in a petri dish reach out to eachother…like amoeba looking for food.

    This interrupted potential is what saddens me most. I think I need a Xanax…

  77. Squirtle. Please don’t even imagine yourself in the same league as Jeff Goldstein.

    You haven’t the talent to take his trash out to the curb, much less consider yourself inhabiting the same blogosphere.

    Spheres. Imagine a couple spheres moving through time and space; one blazing bright and about the size of Alpha Orionis. And yourself, a dirty snowball, one of millions, packed together on the backside of Pluto.

    You’re not even on a real planet.

  78. Hmm.

    DenBeste of USS Clueless fame has a blog over in mee.nu space. http://chizumatic.mee.nu/ (He’s pretty much given up on serious stuff and writes about anime now.)

    So do I, where I have written precisely one thing. I don’t know if proteinwisdom.mee.nu is taken or not, but perhaps that’s an option.

  79. mr. g go out with an “outlaw”

    A Hawkish Rick Perry addresses the Heritage Foundation

    perry 2016!!11!!

  80. >(He’s pretty much given up on serious stuff and writes about anime now.) <

    critiquing propaganda

  81. Not quite.

  82. Jeff, IMO you need to write a book (or ten) and self-publish it. If PW is already a registered business, you can use it as your publishing house. It costs nothing to write a book and list it on Amazon; they will supply you with one of their ISBNs and list your book in exchange for a chunk of your profits…and if you want more control, you can do part of that yourself. It’s screamingly easy and, since you already have a built-in fan base, a portion of your advertising is already taken care of. I’ve gone self-pub myself just to see what it’s like and, although there are definite drawbacks, I know a few people who make a living from their books and they are not the writer you are. Food for thought.

    Good advice. Hell, there’s probably ten books worth of material in your files.

    To say nothing of that idiot’s guide to cultural marxism for dummies that I think you’re uniquely equipped to write.

  83. >Not quite.<

    -the spreading of ideas, information, or rumor for the purpose of helping or injuring an institution, a cause, or a person-

    whatever

  84. You are a voice shouting in the wilderness.

  85. One of the things PW has always had going for it is its commentariat, which engaged in wide-ranging and often off-topic discussions.

    I’m not sure a version of PW that discourages that would have lasted this long; one of its strengths has been the way people engage trolls — with a wit flinty enough to set fire to an aquarium.

  86. The Phoenician guy didn’t seem to like the responses he got from various parodies of his handle, IIRC.

  87. I’m not sure a version of PW that discourages that would have lasted this long; one of its strengths has been the way people engage trolls — with a wit flinty enough to set fire to an aquarium.

    It’s a thing I should remember better. At the moment I just see carrion and circling birds and I feel angry about it.

    Ehhh, that’s all I got, really. I’m a bit pissed off how this whole blogosphere thing turned out, I guess.

  88. I just remember how I followed a link from Jeff back to his site and said, “Holy shit, this guy can write.” And, wow, he has actual readers. Lots and lots of them.

    It was a better time that way. It made sense. Good writers got the juice. That is how it should work. How could it not work that way?

    A couple years after that I remember asking Jeff what a “trackback” was. And, there it went. Poof.

  89. And sadly, things are going to get a whole lot worse.

  90. The Phoenician guy didn’t seem to like the responses he got from various parodies of his handle, IIRC.

    That was one of the funniest threads!

  91. -the spreading of ideas, information, or rumor for the purpose of helping or injuring an institution, a cause, or a person-

    How the hell his blog is “critiquing propaganda” when the subject is anime is beyond me.

    Given most of your comments, I think your avatar is a actual image of yourself and you are really from Tau Ceti V.

  92. Belvedere: Hey! What’s all this laying around stuff? Why are you all still laying around here for?

    Unnamed PW Commentator #1: What the hell are we supposed to do, ya moron? …There’s nothing to fight for anymore.

    Unnamed PW Commentator #2: [to Belvedere] Let it go. War’s over, man. Pragmatists dropped the big one.

    Belvedere: What? Over? Did you say “over”? Nothing is over until we decide it is! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!

    Jeff: [to Boon] Germans?

    McGehee: Forget it, he’s rolling.

    Belvedere: And it ain’t over now. ‘Cause when the goin’ gets tough…

    [thinks hard of something to say]

    Belvedere: The tough get goin’! Who’s with me? Let’s go!

    [Belvedere runs out, alone; then returns]

    Belvedere: What the fuck happened to the PW I used to know? Where’s the spirit? Where’s the guts, huh? This could be the greatest night of our lives, but you’re gonna let it be the worst. “Ooh, we’re afraid to go with you Belvedere, we might get in trouble.” Well just kiss my ass from now on! Not me! I’m not gonna take this. Dana, he’s a dead man! Malkin, dead! Frey…

    Jeff: Dead! Belvedere’s right. Psychotic… but absolutely right. We gotta take these bastards. Now we could do it with conventional weapons, but that could take years and cost millions of lives. No, I think we have to go all out. I think that this situation absolutely requires a really futile and stupid gesture be done on somebody’s part!

    Belvedere: We’re just the guys to do it.

  93. Jeff,

    The site is and always has been yours. Your playground; your soapbox; your lectern; your canvas. We’ve hashed out the reasons why you were frozen out by the “cool kids,” and what a travesty it’s been. Like the others, I would be terribly sad to see this place go dark; I’ve been around since the early days, and PW still enjoys its perch at the top of my bookmarks list. Its absence would be sorely felt.

    I certainly don’t blame or begrudge your feeling unappreciated or burned out. It’s been a tough decade for the classical liberals, and the war for liberty still has countless battles yet to be fought. Still, though you and I both know that you’ll never be credited for it, the fact is people are finally starting to see the light. Nobody’s running around calling Teh Penphone a Good Man any more. People are finally seeing the naked emperor for what he has always been. They’ll never thank you or acknowledge you for getting there first, because that means admitting that they were snookered for six whole years, and the egos of our “leading lights” are never going to allow such an admission.

    I’m pretty sure we all understand that you have a family to look after, and a new house to put in order. We all have lives outside of PW, too, and this is a very good thing, because if I had to spend 24/7 with the nutcases in this crowd, I’m pretty sure I’d miraculously discover the weapons cache at the bottom of the lake.

    Do what you gotta do, Jeff. Without regret. Even if you walked away tomorrow, you have a hell of a body of work here. You were undeniably ahead of the curve when it came to identifying the Marxists and Chicago mobsters who took over the White House. You were also screamingly funny about it. I hope you’ll consider sticking with PW, perhaps reinventing it as something more suited to your circumstance. I hope you’ll pop up to post whatever grabs you — literary, absurd, political, or sublime — at whatever frequency works. You don’t have to prove yourself to anyone at this point, so write from passion rather than some sense of obligation to those of us in the peanut gallery.

    On a personal note: I’m first and foremost a physics geek. I’m well-read, and I can write, but I never spent a lot of time studying language in any formal setting. Reading your pieces back in the day on the role of language and the means and methods of abusing it for political ends was a real eye-opener for me, and worth at least a dozen credits that I never took in college. Any contributions I’ve made to the bandwidth fund since then are just a partial repayment for my education here. So — thanks.

    And whatever else may happen, we’ll always have Martha.

  94. Oh, hell. You can’t just abandon me out here to hang out as Ace’s blog hoping one of his less pragmatic commenters guts him like a fish on his own blog. The pickings get slimmer every day.

  95. I can’t add to anything that has already been said.
    I will miss your comentary, your humor, and the comradeship I have found here.
    Thank you for letting play me here.
    And thank you for introducing me to what have to be the most brilliant commenters on the web.
    I have learned so much here.
    God bless you and your family.
    I have an impression we haven’t heard the last of you.

  96. Jeff, what irks me is the way you were treated by the person who used to link you all the time, before she started creating new websites and selling them. She was snowed by the doofus ADA and eschewed a friend who she had often thanked for opening her mind to the blogosphere.
    You are one of the originals that I still click to several times a day and I will miss your conceptual series and citizen journalist humor should you decide to end the blog.
    Good luck to you.

  97. Jeff, you can’t go – Squirtle just cain’t quit you!

  98. I should have added, upthread, that no other blogger has what it takes to draw together a commentariat like that.

  99. I sometimes eat my own snot. But first, I like to roll it up into a ball and season it with Louisiana hot sauce.

  100. I still have a pulse.

    Like I noted, I was feeling about down yesterday, losing the last of my advertisers. I’m human. I see other sites bringing in a good deal of revenue through advertising and partnerships and I realize how much easier it is for them to keep going, and to brush off the constant attacks on their person (though in fairness, I tend to really attract the crazies, we’d all probably agree).

    We close on our new home on Tuesday. Then we start ripping out the carpet and the hardwood floors and replacing it with the good stuff. After which it’s paint, lighting fixtures (we pre-wired all the rooms for fans so we can put in our own fixtures), replacing any laminate counter tops with quartz, changing out the stock sinks for undermounts, installing and paralleling the second hot water heater, installing our garage door openers, installing a laundry sink, installing the heated towel rack, fans, and having a new GFI outlet put in, then replacing the existing registers, disposers, and toilet seats with the aftermarket ones.

    Because we were forced to close early, we simply won’t have the funds saved up to furnish the place — and are relying on the help of friends to do some custom woodwork and a french door install at cost just to get those things done, hoping they’ll let me pay them in a few installments. Losing the last of the site’s non-bleg income stream was a poorly-timed blow.

    On the bright side, we got the house rented out BEFORE having to put in the new carpet here, and we rented it for $200 more per month than we hoped. Hoping to have the lease signed today. We used a company called Housing Helpers who gets 75% of the first month’s rent.

    It’s been a grueling process; I’ve been moving furniture, inspecting the new house daily, packing, taking care of the kids, dealing with low volt / security people, scheduling satellite and — finally! — broadband install, and trying to run the site as well as my side business.

    Once things settle down and I get a new desk, and start writing from a new personal office, I have a feeling I may be reinvigorated. Especially because the desk I picked out is SO FREAKING AWESOME!

    I’m feeling a bit better today. I want to make clear, by the way, that I don’t fault Newsmax. They’ve been a great partner, but as nr suggested above, people here aren’t likely to click over to stories about celebrity fat burning secrets.

    I gave it a go, but it is what it is. I’m picking myself up by the bootstraps. And I do very much appreciate all the kind words. They’ve buoyed my spirits and have left me plucky and ready to fight another day. So thanks.

  101. Mark Levin bumper music full version time it is, then.

  102. Blast.

  103. Spleef.

  104. squirtlesquirtlesquirtle says August 22, 2014 at 10:53 am

    You couldn’t handle being disagreed with by actual people instead of the caricatures you and TwerkBoy thought you were arguing with.

  105. people here aren’t likely to click over to stories about celebrity fat burning secrets.

    Except squirtle, apparently. Who before being re-edited (for once, it wasn’t me) claimed to have been a customer rather than a troll.

  106. Come to think of it, there were a couple of PW commenters whose behavior may have contributed to a coarsening of how we treat trolls here: thor, and the Oregon nutjobette who shall not be named.

    One might also note that TwerkBoy was endured here for months, under multiple aliases (because he couldn’t take “go away” for an answer from the guy who pays for the bandwidth), before squirtle ever showed up.

  107. Wow… that is an awesome desk!! [envy envy envy]

    I’m squeezed onto a small student desk next to my hubby’s little portable desk … our small 3 bedroom home having 5 people in it (the twins who turn 12 in a few weeks, now over 5′ tall and who eat like 3 adults qualify as full people now)

    I’m going to save a pic of that desk for the day I get my own office space again …

  108. There, now. I knew you’d rise like a phoenix. You’re just fabulous that way. If you feel a bit heavier in liftoff it’s not because you’re a fatter phoenix. It’s because we’ve bound ourselves to your legs like Sinbad.

  109. It even has soft close drawers, Darleen. And that bookshelf in the back? I was sold the minute I saw it.

  110. CRATE AND FRICKING BARREL!?!?!?

    you sold out dude

  111. No, Ernst. They have finally come to me.

  112. Ah, I misunderstood the actual problem. Going to mee.nu won’t solve it.

    Sorry about that.

  113. bookmarking the desk

  114. that’s weird though how it has that cool little shelf thing and then in the picture they shove the desk against the wall

    i guess you use it to hide contraband items and toblerone bars that way

  115. Got to keep the tequila away from the armadillo.

  116. Jeff, some people see desk, I see reloading bench, rifle cleaning workstation, pistol cleaning surface, etc.

    Something about the wood surface pleads “please caress me with a fine walnut Monte Carlo style stock.”

  117. It even has soft close drawers, Darleen. And that bookshelf in the back? I was sold the minute I saw it.

    You are an evil man, Jeff.

    [doing the math on how long I have to wait until #2 & twins move out]

  118. Earlier today I heard Rush talking about this Walter Isaacson op-ed about the relationship between cyber anonymity and declining standards of decorum that I though we might want to toss around here in light of some of the earlier comments.

    But, since it’s a Friday night, and the end is nigh anyways….

  119. everyone should be good for the decorum even if they’re anonymous i think cause that’s just the best way to make the comity

  120. >cyber anonymity and declining standards of decorum<

    these folks are out in the open


    Folsom Street Fair
    The world’s Biggest Leather Event

  121. >cyber anonymity and declining standards of decorum<

    or this

    Sex education book featuring bondage shelved after outcry from US parents

  122. Am I the only one who can hear bh’s insane giggle?

    Must be.

  123. >On the bright side, we got the house rented out BEFORE having to put in the new carpet here<

    good for you

  124. >Am I the only one who can hear bh’s insane giggle?<

    never got the bh problem. just noticed that limbaugh's "declining standards of decorum" is bigger than anonymity on the internet.

  125. just noticed that limbaugh’s “declining standards of decorum” is bigger than anonymity on the internet.

    The relevance of the piece to the future of Protein Wisdom isn’t.

    Bigger than the internet, that is.

  126. >This has not elevated the civic discourse. If I could conjure up a magic Plato ring, it would allow me to know and publicly reveal the names and addresses of all people who anonymously post vulgar rants and racist tweets. I would use it only sparingly, but I suspect that just a few such revelations would make the Twittersphere and Blogosphere suddenly a bit more civil, or at least subdued.

    sounds alinsky as he decides what is ” vulgar rants and racist tweets”

  127. “Twittersphere and Blogosphere suddenly a bit more civil, or at least subdued.”

    Why in fact did our greengrocer have to put his loyalty on display in the shop window? Had he not already displayed it sufficiently in various internal or semipublic ways? At trade union meetings, after all, he had always voted as he should. He had always taken part in various competitions. He voted in elections like a good citizen. He had even signed the “antiCharter.” Why, on top of all that, should he have to declare his loyalty publicly? After all, the people who walk past his window will certainly not stop to read that, in the greengrocer’s opinion, the workers of the world ought to unite. The fact of the matter is, they don’t read the slogan at all, and it can be fairly assumed they don’t even see it. If you were to ask a woman who had stopped in front of his shop what she saw in the window, she could certainly tell whether or not they had tomatoes today, but it is highly unlikely that she noticed the slogan at all, let alone what it said.

    link

  128. So was Jeff then.

    Or whoever it was that exposed a certain space-elf titty scribbling fetishist.

    That assumes I remember that incident from the middle neolithic rightly.

  129. I think it more likely that one would get Eiched than slapped with the party slogan myself.

    Seems to me I remember a smart guy talking about making trade-offs in an imperfect world.

  130. isaacson

    >One of the many cool things about Uber is that it allows passengers to rate the driver. <

    tough to do it if your dead

    SEATTLE: Muslim convert uses Gay app to hook up with and murder homosexuals with Islamic names

  131. Nope, don’t hear bh giggling: sounds more like a low growl to me. He doesn’t like booger eating morons fucking with his favorite blog site.

  132. > He doesn’t like booger eating morons fucking with his favorite blog site.<

    a paul ryan fascist then.

  133. Ah, there’s one now.

  134. >Ah, there’s one now.<

    sorry paul ryan is a fraud waiting for his turn at appropriations with orangeman as his guide. too many losers in dc to care much anymore.

  135. Listen moron: Paul Ryan is a non sequitur, another piece of the endless trash you haul into conversations making the act of conversing practically impossible. How ’bout it’ you that’s the fraud? Ever think of that?

  136. Last night I mentioned by email to sdferr how certain places become imbued with honor in our minds because of what men have done there. The Forum is such a place. Lambeau Field is such a place. Gettysburg is such a place. (Yes, they’re all different but the common element remains.)

    I’ve seen men offer fantastic rhetoric here. I’ve seen men do hard things against their own interest here.

    I hold it in a certain regard.

    So, yeah, I do offer a hearty fuck you to retards who want to turn it into something low and common.

  137. Of course I know that nr and a billion texting imbeciles are the future.

    I hate that damn future though. We’ve lost something worth saving and we’re not getting it back for a good long time.

  138. >another piece of the endless trash you haul into conversations making the act of conversing practically impossible. <

    paul ryan said alot stuff, including:

    GLENN: Nice to meet you, sir. Tell me, tell me your thoughts on progressivism.

    PAUL RYAN: Right. What I have been trying to do, and if you read the entire Oklahoma speech or read my speech to Hillsdale College that they put in there on Primus Magazine, you can get them on my Facebook page, what I’ve been trying to do is indict the entire vision of progressivism because I see progressivism as the source, the intellectual source for the big government problems that are plaguing us today and so to me it’s really important to flush progressives out into the field of open debate.

    GLENN: I love you.

    PAUL RYAN: So people can actually see what this ideology means and where it’s going to lead us and how it attacks the American idea.

    link

    paul ryan: pos ruining class rino

  139. All of which is another demonstration of your contempt for your interlocutors, you fraud. You don’t give a good goddamn about this place and the people in it, and show it every fucking day of the week.

  140. > You don’t give a good goddamn about this place and the people in it, and show it every fucking day of the week.<

    oh showing how the "gop ruining class" mouths shit but does the opposite? egads man go back to complaining about the o's

  141. oh showing how the “gop ruining class” mouths shit

    This is a defense for what you do here? You clearly don’t have any idea what you do here — and what’s more, as already stated, you clearly don’t give a shit what you do here. Everyone else be damned as far as you’re concerned. But because you think yourself virtuous for attacking other political monsters, it’s enough. Well no, it’s not enough. It’s unattached. It’s absurdly deranged. It’s insulting and never-ending in it’s low estimation of others, where not utter disregard.

  142. I’ve seen men offer fantastic rhetoric here. I’ve seen men do hard things against their own interest here.
    I hold it in a certain regard.
    So, yeah, I do offer a hearty fuck you to retards who want to turn it into something low and common.

    That’s kind of what I had in mind when I linked Isaacson. Does anonymity elevate and ennoble the level of discourse, or does it lower and vulgarize? Does it not have any effect at all? Would requiring something like real id (is that even a thing?) improve things, or just open up new wormy cans?

  143. wisconsin rethuglicans can stay there next to ann althouse. pansies the lot of them starting with Reince: perry 2016.

  144. >This is a defense for what you do here? You clearly don’t have any idea what you do here —<

    you bore me alot of times with your o's play by play comments. me i see them and roll on. you too could do that. think : diversity and tolerance.

  145. In fairness, I think newrouter tries to contribute, as best he’s able.

    Speaking personally, I think

    You don’t give a good goddamn about this place and the people in it, and show it every fucking day of the week.

    And

    You clearly don’t have any idea what you do here — and what’s more, as already stated, you clearly don’t give a shit what you do here. Everyone else be damned as far as you’re concerned. But because you think yourself virtuous for attacking other political monsters, it’s enough.

    Is more apropos of some one else.

    But then, we all have our bete noirs,

    and anyways, it’s not for me to decide.

    Or at any rate, that’s what I keep telling myself.

  146. > Does anonymity elevate and ennoble the level of discourse, or does it lower and vulgarize? <

    ask the federalists

  147. I will not make any defense of my idiosyncratic errors committed here, since they’re errors and wrong to do. I’d be more than happy to defend the things I write here which don’t happen to bore you or anyone else on grounds of their intimate idiosyncratic meaning for myself. Care to take up any of that? Care to delve into substance, you pusillanimous weasel?

  148. wisconsin rethuglicans can stay there next to ann althouse. pansies the lot of them starting with Reince: perry 2016.

    You only think he’s not a rethuglican because the demonrats are out for his flesh.

  149. > you pusillanimous weasel?<

    were the federalist wrong to be anonymous?

  150. >You only think he’s not a rethuglican because the demonrats are out for his flesh.<

    he may be a somewhat "team r player", but he won't be played on the southern border like walker, ryan, reeces pieces wisconsin clowns would.

  151. So no then. Which is no more than what one would expect.

  152. You mean John Jay, Alexander Hamilton and James Madison newrouter?

    Gee, how’d people ever figure out who Publius was?

    And I did give that some thought, by the way. The lack offreedom of the press in the Colonies, not to mention the fact that criticizing the government was seditious libel, might have had something to do with the tradition of pseudonymous polemic in the eighteenth century.

    So, who’s our Cato?

  153. In fairness, I think newrouter tries to contribute, as best he’s able.

    Your phrasing is noted but, nah. That description, even stated like that, doesn’t fit what’s on display.

  154. >So no then.<

    why not and why is my stupid comments not tolerated by ruining class losers like "time to close it down" writer?

  155. >doesn’t fit what’s on display.<

    so you be part of the wisconsin gop clowns: walker, ryan and reeces pieces? ain't buying your stuff.

  156. How do people “tolerate” the unintelligible? What does anyone do with the unintelligible, the baldfaced indeterminate? I mean what the fuck? Put a bit of effort into things, make Ernst look like a prophet.

  157. Idiotic twitteresque grunting.

  158. >Idiotic twitteresque grunting.<

    very true. you argue like a proggtard

  159. >How do people “tolerate” the unintelligible? <

    well i've read some of your convoluted posts so there's that.

  160. So, Ernst: what do you see again? See the trials to contribute? See the considered effort at self-editing? See the constructive criticisms designed to help his interlocutor companions to see the error of their ways, to guide them into the light?

    It’s to laugh. Or abandon to oblivion. One or the other.

  161. Wait, wait a second…

    I’ve been convinced. Yes, yes, you’ve been right all along. I once thought that pw was a place where intelligent people discussed things.

    I was wrong. So very wrong. It’s actually a playground for nr and hf.

    Yep. Sure, maybe this was once a thought that would make me recoil from the utter insult it would give to Jeff and all the brilliant people he’s drawn here but I was mistaken.

    Nope, me proggtarded. Me sorry.

  162. >See the constructive criticisms designed to help his interlocutor companions to see the error of their ways, to guide them into the light? <

    yes see the "green grocer" by havel

  163. Vaclav Havel is a Czech socialist. Who for fuck’s sake gives a shit about him?

  164. > It’s actually a playground for nr and hf.<

    i say hail to the pikachu moment. more yellow please

  165. In all honesty, sdferr, and no disrespect meant, I admit to laughing at newrouter’s 9:42, so he’s at least got that going for him.

    And we really haven’t addressed Isaacson, or how his op-ed may (or may not) be relevant to the PW community.

    Have we?

    Finally, bh pretty much summed it up. It’s hard to talk about adult topics* in front of the children**.

    *as seen on Instapundit.

    **demonstrating absurdity by being absurd. n.b. not actually recommending we talk about reality TV’s venture into softcore porn.

  166. Vaclav Havel is a Czech socialist. Who for fuck’s sake gives a shit about him?

    Gertrude Himmelfarb, for one, sdferr. Somewhere in On Looking into the Abyss, I think.

  167. >Vaclav Havel is a Czech socialist<

    he was for the individual over group think. maybe his time cast into the "proletariat" in the socialist republic had sumthing to do with it. the wall fell and he became president of a free nation.

  168. Have we?

    No, we haven’t. I think I’d be glad to talk about Issacson and his views and how those relate to pw, but would prefer to do that without incessant interruptions interposing stupidities while we engage in a search for the truth, wouldn’t you?

    First, however, I’m going to have to come up to speed on Issacson’s views, and I suppose, Limbaugh’s alongside them, since I’ve heard nothing of the Limbaugh show on that subject. I’ll be off to do that now.

  169. Okay then

    I was wrong and bh was right after all.

  170. Mr. newrouter links stuff and it’s helpful I think

    i don’t know why the herd has turned on him so viciously he needs to pick up a branch and hold his arms over his head in an effort to appear bigger

  171. Gertrude Himmelfarb, for one, sdferr. Somewhere in On Looking into the Abyss, I think.

    The question was posed in order to give newrouter an opportunity to explain in his own words and thoughts why this should matter to us. See, secretly, I already own a personal respect for the Czech socialist Havel, if only on account of his fights with the Czech conservative Klaus.

  172. And maybe sing some opera?

  173. y’all ever think about what google’s driverless car would do to traffic ticket revenue?

    i’m starting to think that this might could end up being a serious inflection point, foreshadowed in some ways by the uber thing

    but on a way bigger scale

  174. yes yes opera lulls the savage p wizzle

    or maybe I’m thinking of vicodin

  175. I found it self-evidently true, to be honest, so I wasn’t driven to say anything, Ernst. This has to be partially because we’re always forced to watch it play out here. Over and over and over again.

    (For myself, btw, I’ve heard any number of professorial types speak exactly as sdferr does. Some people start by identifying an area for discussion because it helps refine that same thing rather than just jump in with standard declarative statements. If I’d be tempted to titter about it that’d probably be a sophomoric impulse nearly by definition, wouldn’t it?)

  176. Me living up to the christian portion of my nom de cyber then.

    boy am i silly

  177. I found it self-evidently true, to be honest, so I wasn’t driven to say anything,

    So, it’s not necessary for me to tell you that you’re right. Ever. From now on, we’ll both assume it?

    (For myself, btw, I’ve heard any number of professorial types speak exactly as sdferr does.)

    As have I.

    But I still thought it was funny. We all had professors whom we could imitate because of specific verbal tics. Funny like that is what I meant.

  178. anonymous

    That’s like Odysseus in Polyphemus’ cave, ain’t it?

    And going named, naming himself got Odysseus into the trouble of his life with Poseidon, right? Hubris comes to get him. Better to keep his mouth shut and not give Polyphemus the opportunity to go crying to daddy. But no, Odysseus had to shoot off his mouth in pride. Bad move.

  179. Just read the Isaacson piece…

    He remarks, at one point:

    …The idea that we should be able to interact with other people anonymously is rather new in human history. It arose when people started moving from tight-knit communities to urban areas where they were generally unknown….

    Actually, no. It began when people decided to speak out against Tyranny and feared being arrested and imprisoned – possibly killed – by their government.

    I maintain my anonymity in order not to be fired from the state government job I work at. However, to be fair to my direct employers, I do not criticize the branch of government I work for, nor pass along insider information on it, because, to do so from anonymity, would be immoral, as the accused would be unable to confront their accuser. This leads into my next point.

    Anonymity is not the problem. The use of it by people who are not Virtuous is.

    I hope the tradition is preserved because it is a valid tool to fight Despotism.

  180. So, it’s not necessary for me to tell you that you’re right. Ever. From now on, we’ll both assume it?

    I meant that by way of explanation, Ernst. I didn’t mean anything negative by it. I stopped and read both links and my failure to comment upon it was, I think, as simple as “Yes, that’s right, we’re seeing it right now.”

    My apologies for being brusque there. To be honest, it’s entirely possible that an irritating horsefly might cause this thoughtlessness on my part because, well, I hate irritating horseflies buzzing around my head.

  181. Actually, no. It began when people decided to speak out against Tyranny and feared being arrested and imprisoned – possibly killed – by their government.

    This is where I mention this book again. There are many ways to skin tyrannical cats.

  182. the chilling effect fascist whore harry reid is inculcating very successfully with his koch brothers thing

    that’s where this whole anonymity discussion starts and ends for me

    done and done

  183. At the same time, it’s also a tool for the vicious to indulge their taste for petty tyranny, isn’t it?

    Maybe (maybe) the loss of anonymity would incent bad people to do the right thing.

    (Or whatever Freidman said about politicians).

  184. I should state that far more simply.

    Sorry about that, Ernst.

  185. >I hope the tradition is preserved because it is a valid tool to fight Despotism.<

    the pikachu revolution begins. all hail yellow!

  186. I was joking around bh. That’s a paraphrase of Lt. Col. Tall to Capt. Staros from The Thin Red Line.

    I should have taken the minute or two to find a link to the quote.

    We’re getting into that hazards of the format area again.

    (As if we ever get out of it!)

  187. Okay, cool.

  188. The pikachu revolution ends like all revolutions do.

    The American revolution being the revolution that proves the rule. (Which is why the Europeans don’t consider it a true revolution).

  189. At the same time, it’s also a tool for the vicious to indulge their taste for petty tyranny, isn’t it?

    Exactly, and the whole point of the Ring of Gyges business, which reappears in Machiavelli Prince 15, and in Mansfield’s comment on Machiavelli’s behalf about it: “and you would too”.

    The self-restrained philosopher challenged in the Republic and prosecuted in the Athenian court is precisely what Machiavelli claims is necessary to escape. Of course, he’s wrong, but only because he isn’t concerned with justice.

  190. You know, for quite a while there back when I first started hanging around this dive bar of Jeff’s, I thought nr and hf were the same guy.

  191. we made billy

  192. Ernst wrote:

    At the same time, it’s also a tool for the vicious to indulge their taste for petty tyranny, isn’t it?

    Maybe (maybe) the loss of anonymity would incent bad people to do the right thing.

    (Or whatever Freidman said about politicians).

    It might, but it would also silence people such as myself. And it might have silenced Samuel Adams and others of his time.

    Anonymity, I think, is like a prejudice: something that is neither Bad nor Good on it’s own, but depends on how it is applied.

  193. Since Bob brought up his reason for posting (and blogging) pseudonymously, I think it’s worth mentioning something I meant to mention earlier, but never got around to, since this particular train was blown off it’s tracks like that train in Lawrence of Arabia*. And that is, I don’t think a pseudonym like Bob Belvedere, or Ernst Schreiber, or even sdferr or bh, for that matter, is the same thing as being anonymous like one of our two (or is it three?) intermittent trolls. And that’s because I don’t get the sense that the real Bob, or sdferr or bh, are in any meaningful way different in the real world, from their online personas. I hope I present myself similarly, since I think of my handle as more of a pen name than an alias to hide behind.

    nr and hf strike me as somewhere between Bob, sdferr and bh and mileysquirtleiamacallmyselfsomethingelsetoday.

    So I guess it goes back to that Virtue thing Plato rambled on about.

  194. heh, I like to think where it comes to virtue that Plato scrambled on what Aristotle rambled on. But that’s only a jest. Or is it?

  195. Well Bob, God knows liberals don’t respect privacy (to bring up the other half of Isaacson’s equation). I mean, just look at the way they’ve gone after donor records and petition lists in California and Wisconsin.

  196. Every dive bar has its Cliff Klavan, or its Marv.

  197. liberals don’t respect privacy

    This is of course because they are not liberals. A liberal society necessitates a private sphere, and these will have none of it. They’ll tell us what we must believe, what we must think, what we must own, what we must surrender. There’s nothing liberal about them.

  198. I see the distinction…and agree with you about NR’s and HF’s placement.

    Where did you get your pen name from?

    Mine was my stage name, which was derived from my first car [a 1964 Plymouth Belvedere] and my insane drummer [aren't they all to some extent] who, for no reason anyone can explain, just started calling me ‘Uncle Bob’.

  199. *Find your own damn youtube of the train blowing up!

    (Another hazard of the format –you’re typing so fast trying to maintain the flow of conversation that you forget to finish your thought).

  200. A liberal society necessitates a private sphere, and these will have none of it.

    The intended consequence of politicizing the personal?

    Probably not for the hippies though. They just wanted to do drugs and fornicate without The Man gettin’ all preachy-judgey an’ shit. Don’t you think?

  201. As we know, in, perhaps, it’s most slick move, the Left took the term ‘Liberal’ when the label ‘Progressive’ started to become toxic. ‘Twas the finest example of The Big Lie they ever concocted.

  202. The most dedicated hedonists turned away from the city, wanting more or less nothing to do with it on principled grounds — they became apolitical, deadly seriously so.

    Our modern day sorts probably didn’t give any of it much thought, really. Too stoned? Or too coddled? Can’t say to distinguish, but can say they weren’t terribly serious in their greater numbers. A few, maybe, found their way back to the ideas Epicurus had so long ago, but in the main, that’s too much trouble for most.

  203. Bob, a little bit here, a little bit there, equal parts aspirational and hortatory.

    A few, maybe, found their way back to the ideas Epicurus had so long ago, but in the main, that’s too much trouble for most.

    sdferr, Benjamin Wiker argued we’re all Epicureans now.

  204. Thanks for the tip about the Wiker book. Added it to my ‘To Read’ list.

  205. Strauss has some funny thoughts about Hobbes as an epicurean-materialist-physicist in NRaH. Which, I guess, implicates ol’ Locke as well.

    Who knows? Could be.

  206. But no one today is going to be an actual Epicurean, I think. Unless we warrant making Epicurus’s thought meaningless, in the same sense that we make the Redskins’ name offensive.

  207. I wish Jonah Goldberg would have read it. Maybe then he wouldn’t have aquitted Darwin along with Herbert Spencer of the “crime” of being a Social Darwinist in Tyranny of Cliches.

  208. There was a thread here years ago about internet anonymity but I will not myself comment on this topic since I am “Just Another Random Anonymous Internet Person” and so am not qualified to comment on this.

  209. I think it’s a kind of reductivist Epicureanism. avoid pain; pursue pleasure –just like all the other dumb animals on this planet. Wiker agrees with Strauss about Hobbes in Ten Books that Screwed Up the World.

    That one I’ve actually read. It’s why I’m aware of Wiker’s earlier Moral Darwinism.

    Being aware of a book, of course, isn’t the same thing as being familiar with that book by way of reviews, summaries, excerpts and such.

    To say nothing of, you know, having read the actual book.

  210. Probably not for the hippies though

    The counter-culture had the Heads and the Reds. Hippie was a media invention, Newsweek I think, from the “Summer of Love, which stuck like a hated glue.

  211. About Moral Darwinism the book I know nothing. About the idea that if we are critters evolved in a long long chain of relative generational successes, then our moral proclivities will have necessarily evolved along with the rest of our parts, I’ve heard a bit, and been fascinated thereby. Especially fascinated when I first heard of this evolutionary psychology business presented in utter terror by NPR hosts. Hmmm, I thought to meself, what’s scaring them so?

  212. Wow! A comment by you know who taking up for Jeff like Rush took up for that white drag queen of an A.G.!

    Thanks GeoffB for that excursion into prelapsarian Protein Wisdom.

    I’m bagging it myself now.

  213. This one is better yet.

  214. Check this one from that same thread: our electric-yellow friend actually writing a real-live comment, with adult words, capitalization, punctuation, the whole nine yards…

    And no reference to hoochie cum-slut failshit whores, either.

    ‘feets: What happened, man? You used to be one of my favorite commentors. Did the Palin thing completely break you?

  215. As we know, in, perhaps, it’s most slick move, the Left took the term ‘Liberal’ when the label ‘Progressive’ started to become toxic.

    And of course, having shat all over ‘liberal’ for the past 60 years, they’re back to calling themselves ‘progressives’, because who doesn’t like PROGRESS!!!1!!!

    It’s like they can’t have nice things.

  216. Late night brain fade must have kept me from remembering that the internet anonymity question was a central part of this early cyberpunk classic novel, “True Names” by Vernor Vinge.

  217. The thread being referenced was from 2007, likely before the fiction named “Barack Obama” was even on anyone’s radar. And it all went to shit soon after that.

    Coincidence?

  218. Pingback: From Around the Blogroll | The First Street Journal.

  219. Clearly not a coincidence, since it was the election of the Good Man, whom it was every pragmatist’s duty to offer well wishes of token support, lest the left accuse the right of being bitter-clinging extremist crypto-fascist racist sexist bigoted homophobic gaia-polluting hate-mongers,* that led to the fall.

    *and we sure didn’t want to give the left any reason to think or say anything like that now, did we?

  220. I heart duckyfoot!

    he makes blog time lots of fun plus hes cute and yellow and chubby

    a-rub-a-dub-dubby

  221. I think mostly though it’s the hazards of the format. Blogging, messaging, etc. is textual converstion, and conversation isn’t the optimal format for the written word.

    It’s hard to put together a thought-out, well-reasoned comment on any subject at hand, and have that comment posted in a timely matter. You spend twenty to thirty minutes composing an argument about some point of interest in either the original post or the follow-on discussion, and likely as not there’s at least six degrees of seperation between your comment and what you’re originally reacting to.

    That problem is compounded on places like a formerly smart, now dumbed down, military blog where comment threads go and on and on. It’s simply too easy to fall into the habit of snarking and sniping.

    Which of course, we all do. Because it does have it’s place. But when it gets out of its place, it crowds out thought.

  222. Well put, Ernst.

    I’m quite slow at composing responses and often find that, by the time I’ve finished, someone has made the same point. The same goes for blog posts, as I often find Jeff has published something I was planning to write about. Usually, then, I end-up quoting from him and throwing in a few complimentary remarks [for sorrow!...all the great prose I could have written (open hand, palm outward on forehead, head tilted back, dejected sigh)].

  223. It may be odd, and I’m sure I’m often counted among the sloppy, crass, and disruptive commoner posters who drag the place down, but I’m most bothered by the spam ping-backs comments on this blog.

    Oh look “Antibiotic lizard spray for exotic pet owners” is posting on an old 2008 thread about legalized gambling or something. “Arizona Owl Watcher’s Phone Guide.com” is reacting to the thread about Akin two years too late.

    I have no idea what if any solution could be implemented but I find those maddening. The idea of Langolier-like spam bots pouncing on blogs that wander off the path creeps me out.

  224. you know who’s cool is Ernie

  225. I cull those pings whenever I think of it, palaeo. I spent weeks clearing out several years’ worth of them a few years back so I take every new one a little personally.

  226. [...]I’m sure I’m often counted among the sloppy, crass, and disruptive commoner posters who drag the place down[...]

    I’m fairly certain you’ve never heard anything like this from me.

    But, fine. Whatever.

  227. winner winner chicken dinner

  228. what kind of chicken dinner?

  229. today i had a simple one at my filipino place

    just chunks of bbq chicken on skewers with this white rice what had chipper choppered green onions in it and a dab of a spicy papaya salad

    then i hiked up to mulholland and gazed down upon this arid valley i have made my home lo these many years

  230. mama c’s got all the moves

  231. My experience of you is that you are a complete asshole.

    So, good luck.

    But, you know, with no more of my money.

  232. >My experience of you is that you are a complete asshole.<

    i feel the same way about the google

  233. >But, you know, with no more of my money.<

    says former pw TOP contributor. you go transex loser

  234. what’s with google moving into former nabisco buildings?

    it’s like some weirdo freemason shit

  235. When did Henry Waxman ever donate to PW?

  236. you don’t like digital cookies?

  237. Everything’s better when it snitches on a Ritz.

  238. are there unionized masons? a baracky needs to know?

  239. >we be fracking so: <

    those dots are too big. but the npr needs sumthing to hide the truth

  240. My experience of you is that you are a complete asshole.
    So, good luck.
    But, you know, with no more of my money.

    Was this directed toward me? Because I don’t recall meeting a batboy or being an asshole toward one.

    But I do drink so it is possible I guess.

  241. i hate it when the end is nigh but i hate it even more when i drink

  242. Tennessee Ernie Ford’s shotgun.

    Tennessee Ernie Ford’s Shotgun Boogie.

  243. I’m sitting here having just watched a Fox news panel segment on Fergusen. Who’s their guest? Jesse Fucking Jackson.
    So people can spend time and effort trying to shut out voices such as Jeff, but hand prime forums to the likes of Jackson.
    That pisses me off. Jeff, I hope this is able to be worked out, as voices such as yours are needed, and will be needed more than ever in the days ahead.
    Hang tough, brother.

  244. OK, that being the lightening agent, I’d like to drop a couple cent’s worth on the commentariat purge…for fear that if I don’t speak up, I too will join those forced outside looking in.

    I’m not naming anyone , just generally speaking. To protect the innocent, and all of that.

    PW (as I see it) is unique, a gem in the gravelly Thunderdome that is the blogosphere, ‘competing’ (yes, it’s a freewheeling competition for viewer’s eyeballs and reads) and therefore needing all-important site viewers. The comments section here is like no other I’ve seen (granted, I’m not as blog-well-travelled as many who comment here); a wonderful mix of great intelligentsia (you know who you are) and others, like me, who lurve sampling the flow.

    Liken it, if you will indulge me long enough, to running the Ocoee River; where we find experienced kayakers easily dominating the slothful, slower-moving rafts carrying their inexperienced, uneducated cargo.

    But those river-runners all share one commonality: love of the river.

    What if those experienced, high-level kayakers decided to rid the river of the slower, nearly uncontrollable rafters? Obviously they don’t belong here. They clog the flow, and more often than not they will barge in the ‘holes’ the more serious ‘yakers covet for play, and run right over the serious sorts without even a by-your-leave, and be gone to disrupt the next hole.

    Run them out, those ponderously slow raft-requiring morons!

    Oh. They’re gone, then.

    Also gone is the infrastructure created to support the diverse ecosystem that is recreational river-running. All of a sudden the serious high-level ‘yakers are sleeping on weed-infested grounds because the campsites are closed and not maintained. They are eating from cans of spam because the nice restaurants had to close. They also lament that they have only their own high-level selves to talk to, because the pretty girls and beer-guzzling “lives of the party” were sent away. It’s now almost..stifling.

    As analogies go, that’s as full of holes as the rafts the kayakers regularly punch through. But I never claimed to be a serious high-level writer or thinker, now did I?

  245. Run them out, those ponderously slow raft-requiring morons!

    Please. This is bullshit. No one is suggesting any purge that I’m aware of. At most, I’m asking newrouter to raise his game; to have a care or two about the rest of us. To engage his mind with ours, and not treat us like we don’t exist. Remember, Lupus is still a Bear, if a dribbly-nosed a sweet kid, albeit freakishly withdrawing, lacking in self-confidence, who yet uncharacteristically catches a ball at the wall to rob a homerun.

  246. Here’s another analogy. There’s a pool that everyone shares. One or two people make a habit of constantly taking a shit in it.

    People say, “Hey, dickhead, stop shitting in the pool.”

    That’s not the same thing as a purge. It’s not the same thing as calling all the other people who don’t shit in the pool dickheads.

  247. Where the analogy breaks down of course is that you really only enjoy a pool by swimming in it whereas you can get a great deal from pw by reading the posts without going into the comments. That fairly obvious solution is available to me so I’ll stop complaining.

  248. That would be like watching Jeff taking his hacks in a batting cage, as opposed to the lot of us wandering onto a field where we’re utterly outclassed.

  249. “Purge” a bit strong, is it? Why did that word jump into my head, I wonder ?

    Heh. One thing for certain: Jeff G does not run a “pool” .

  250. serr8d, I’d merely urge that you take a close look at the sequence above:

    Ernst modestly proposes a serious subject for examination at 7:41pm mountain time, 9:41 eastern. He heard something on Limbaugh’s show (sometime between 12-3 eastern), he’s been thinking about it, he finds it might have some relevance to pw in particular (we probably would too), and he suggests we discuss it.

    newrouter responds twice, prior to anyone else, the first occasion being a link to the pornographic Folsom St. Fair, and the second to some nonsense about sex-ed. Really?

    This is how newrouter thinks of Ernst’ suggestion? What about Ernst? Is this how he thinks of his suggestion?

    Not if we look to see Ernst more than two hours later suggesting we haven’t really addressed his original question — which was true.

    Instead, newrouter’s non-sequiturs and my anger at them (after a long train of a thousand-fold examples of abuses) had completely diverted us from looking carefully at what Ernst had been thinking.

    What the fuck is fair about that to Ernst, to say nothing of the just treatment of the ideas he raised?

    Not much, I think. And what’s worse, we’re still far from fully exploring what had given Ernst pause.

    Clearly, I took a role in this diversion. I could have, for yet the ten-thousandth time, and as suggested by newrouter himself, simply ignored the inserted stupidities.

    But why? Why would silence be the better course in all cases? At some point, it seems to me, we’re better off addressing what’s right before our eyes.

  251. Yes, that immediate example is an example of ill-thought inanity. Discus would fix that: nesting comments in groups, in which case nr’s additions would clearly be out if line, and not receive any responses whatsoever. But Discus does that to detriment of sites using it: stranding comments deemed ‘unworthy’, and showcasing only the ‘approved’ discourses. Would that model serve PW? I don’t think it would. Freewheeling style is a positive.

    Ernst might’ve taken into consideration his post timing: everyone knows nr sometimes gets into the sauce after sundown, and is more apt to respond inappropriately shortly thereafter. As ‘feets is known to enjoy “first comment” positions, purposely despoiling posts he personally disapproves of (see: many of Darleen’s “God-bothering” offerings).

    I suggest Ernst re-post his comment later on, perhaps in daylight hours, where it’ll get the sober responses it deserves.

  252. I’ve no thought of any sort of system fix. Such a thing doesn’t seem to me as either necessary, nor particularly useful. Freewheeling is fine, and that means that malcontents and blitherers are going to malcontent and blither — this is what they do. Still, they do this by choice, willing themselves. And sometimes others will to point this out, and reasonably ask, by my lights, that better choices be made. None of that, I think, necessitates Ernst making accommodation to these poor choices. Rather, it seems to me that simple respect for Ernst’s view can enter the choices in response. It isn’t hard to do. It only requires a minimum of care.

  253. I could be wrong because I’ve never applied Disqus on my site, but it seems to me it ought to have a setting to not do side-threads as it normally does.

    In any case, no one suggested using Disqus on PW as it stands. I mentioned it in complaining about being unable to log on to sites hosted on WordPress.com — which I was subsequently able to remedy.

    Someone had suggested Jeff move PW to being hosted on WordPress.com. My issues with that host’s login system would almost certainly make me a less frequent commenter, for whatever anyone might think of that — and it would also prevent me from carrying out the spam-trashing duties I perform here.

  254. Heh. A minimum of care largely disappears after a bellyful of beer. Or so I’m told! )

  255. McGhee, you do a fine job. I’d like to see more of your posts appearing topside. Perhaps even aiding serious commentary, Ernst’s as example, get better traction.

  256. Erm, that’s Mr. McGehee of course. Damned iPad.

  257. Yet antoher reason to switch to Adenoid.

  258. Who is this batboy? And what harm did I do to it?

    And also, nr — though at times abrasive — isn’t the enemy.

  259. Granted that newrouter isn’t the enemy, which only makes one wonder how it is bh gets to be proggtarded.

  260. bh isn’t proggtarded.

    How “that”
    happens…

  261. Even in face-to-face space I’m what is politely called “reserved,” so protecting my privacy online has never needed to include use of an alternative name or persona. Anyone sufficiently motivated could learn how to find out all they need to know to harass me, but so far no such campaign has resulted in a missing-persons report materialized.

    As a result — and also because discussions on the subject of online privacy/anonymity/pseudonymity have occurred here and elsewhere and I’ve commented in those — I fear that more recent such discussions no longer hold my interest.

    For what it’s worth.

  262. -After having thought about it, McGehee, over a few bourbons last night, I agree with you about the WordPress commenting. I didn’t think it through.

    -And Disqus applied here would change the atmosphere.

    -PW is a bar – and my favorite one these days.

    -Newrouter isn’t the enemy. He’s the guy at the end of the bar who can get quite annoying as the evening goes on, even though he still will say something amidst the slurring that makes sense. You just ignore and move on [and order another drink].

    -As my hero, Baretta, liked to say: You gotta keep on strokin’.

  263. Whether newrouter becomes nowruder or not, termologizing Nancy Pelosi with bh is right out.

  264. I still think there are options to reduce Jeff’s costs, if he’s no longer trying to support a revenue stream — but who’s to say another revenue opportunity won’t come along, say, right after he’s moved to a host that can’t support it?

    I’ve seen it happen.

  265. And batboy.

    The name rings a bell, but wasn’t it an alias/related to an “elf something or other?”

  266. just a small taste of the wreckage we’ll find in the wake of the tenure of fascist cocksucker eric holder

    ***

    It cannot be ruled out that huge regulatory civil penalties on banks at this stage, whatever the grounds, could help to trigger a new financial crisis. What they have almost certainly done, through the cases of JPMorgan Chase, Citibank and Bank of America, is to make it impossible for distressed medium sized banks to be rescued in future by larger ones. For all these banks have now incurred big penalties for malpractices in institutions which they later rescued.

    The former Bank of America chief executive Kenneth Lewis was pressured by the then US Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson not to pull out of its rescue by Merrill Lynch. Now the bank has been heavily penalised by the subsequent US administration largely because it did not pull out. It does not look like justice and could have very unfortunate consequences.

  267. bankstas?

    lol

    banks are pussies

  268. >banks are pussies<

    nah tools of failshitamerican gov't

  269. banks should be more like china to where they just tell fascist little shits like obama and holder to go fuck themselves I think

  270. The name rings a bell, but wasn’t it an alias/related to an “elf something or other?”

    That was Ryan Bacon as his alias here.

  271. I get back from a vacation where I completely unplugged, crank up the PC and then see this post. Ugh. Also the Seven Words You Can’t Say On TV, although I probably could here; apologies to George Carlin.

    I have to admit that I don’t have suggestions for revenue streams, especially since the Socialists The Be in CO have made Amazon affiliation a non-starter. My hope after the great purge was that one of the bigger folk who didn’t ostracize you, such as Glenn Reynolds, would want to partner up with you. Personally, I think you’d and Bill Whittle would perfectly complement each other, but then I’m just an Internet nobody who knows nothing.

    Others have made some decent suggestions in the event that this site needs to move. I’d follow wherever you go because PW is the place where I’ve headed when I want some intelligent and insightful discussions. Oh, and the occasional philosophizing by the ghost of Corey Haim; that’s just a bonus.

    In any event, if you have to pull up stakes and move, let me know where the new blogstead will be. And if you decide to pull the hole in after you, I will understand that as well. Fighting the good fight gets hard when most of your erstwhile allies abandon you.

  272. i emailed batboy but didn’t hear back. he commented here quite a bit and didn’t seem to be a troll so I have no clue, really, how he had said experience with me. Curious, I asked. Politely.

    No response.

    So I guess now he’s the asshole.

  273. Maybe he meant it in the nicest possible way.

  274. I thought he was a guy who emigrated to the States from Ireland? And was headed back in retirement or some such?

  275. Maybe he was having a bad, bad day. People who have bad, bad days tend to lash out without involving logical processes.

    Or, there’s the whole bat thing.

    Rabid, perhaps ?

  276. That would account for the personality change…

  277. Thanks for the tip about the Wiker book. Added it to my ‘To Read’ list. – See more at: http://proteinwisdom.com/?p=54911#sthash.SmIB6Aye.dpuf

    Couple links to Wiker’s online writings..
    Benjamin Wiker “Darwin and the Descent of Morality” 11/01
    and the back-and-forth letters resulting from that post 2/02.

  278. No, no, no, no. You can’t go. I don’t comment a lot but there are so few people out there who hold to their principles, where I be assured that I’m not crazy and I count you among them. The others are…Mark Levin and Professor Jacobsen (most of the time). I’m trying to think of anyone else and although I scour the web daily (I’ve been laid off for years & working only part time), it’s amazing that I’m having a hard time coming up with any others. Oh, McCain also. There are a few individual writers at some sites like Victor Davis Hanson but that’s not really the same thing.

    So, you cannot go, that’s it, it’s decided. We’ll figure something out when you get back. God speed to you with setting up your new home!

  279. Seconded. AnyopposedBAMmotioncarries.

  280. Now this has been a good thread, distractions and all. I like seeing the big brains at work.

  281. Thanks, Serr8d, for the links.

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