May 18, 2012

Election 2012: Romney camp indicates early surrender

We knew it would be this way:  it’s 2008 all over again, with the GOP Establishment having convinced itself that it was the presence of Palin that likely sank the good and mavericky McCain juggernaut.  Which is why we’ll likely get some milquetoast VP candidate like Portman.  To vindicate McCain.

So, to recap. The Romney campaign — along with the GOP intelligentsia (but I repeat myself) — has signaled that, while it’s perfectly fine to trash conservatives and demonize those on the right for their unhelpful bitter-clingery racist and xenophobic homophobia, when it comes to debating Democrats, certain things are off the table. Like, for instance, matters of biography — and as such, matters of character and personal conviction.  Vetting, if you will .

All with the hopes that such a gesture will prevent the Democrats — and their media arm — from launching broadsides against Mormonism or playing the race card against Republicans.  A pre-emptive surrender masquerading as collegiality.  The specialty of the contemporary Republican Party which hopes that, if it just keeps quiet and doesn’t do anything to fuck things up, it’ll get swept into power almost by necessity, Obama’s first term has been such a disaster.

2008, redux, this is. First as tragedy, then as farce.

Good bye, America.

Posted by Jeff G. @ 8:33am
238 comments | Trackback

Comments (238)

  1. It’s kinda funny to me, this story about Wright. I’m pretty sure I speculated here that I had no doubt someone in Obama’s camp was attempting to buy Wright’s silence back at the time Wright hit the lecture circuit to speak before the Detroit audience, and then at the National Press Club. And here, years later comes the story containing the evidence of that bribery straight from Barry’s best butt-buddy and the Romney people want nothing to do with it! They’re a distillate absurdity, this bunch of cowardly republican bozos.

  2. Romney needs to be taken to task over this. And if he won’t do it, others will have to do it for him.

  3. If Romney ran on something, then he’d be expected to try and do something, instead of being something, and then where would the business as usual D.C. Establishment be?

  4. Mr. Governor Romney is going to be very very busy defending the character of our rapist plunderer whore traitor liar president I guess

    I should rather he focus on the economy I thought that was the plan

  5. The FauxNewz panel discussed this last night, and concluded that Romney made the correct decision. They also thought SuperPacs to take up this issue no matter what Romney says, which is possible.

    Then again, they expect Romney to go after Obama directly on the economy. We know that isn’t going to happen.

  6. For me, it comes down to the one question nobody is asking- why?
    For the second time in 4 years, the GOP nominee for POUTS does not want to know about the very legitimate questions concerning the views, associations, and life experiences of his opponent, and doesn’t want anyone else getting too curious about it either.
    The response is “that’s insane; that makes no sense”. And that is all obvious.
    But WHY???

  7. Jeff, I swear, you’re becoming as cynical as I am. Two “Good Men” can certainly debate the issues facing this great nation without dredging up old, divisive history that was thoroughly vetted by the media years ago.
    Quit bitterly clinging to your discredited narrative. And give our regards to Sarah Palin.

  8. Good bye, America.

    Sigh.

    I really liked America.

  9. You know, I can see some wisdom in Romney trying to remain above the fray and focused on the economy. The rest of the world will not be following his lead, and that allows him the ability to bang on the Obama campaign when they’re doing the same thing they’re decrying. You wanna talk about campaigns focused on “stupid distractions?” I give you Axelturd.

    Romney doesn’t need to vet Obama. Breitbart will do it. Hannity will do it. Levin will do it. Beck will do it. The PACs will do it. Even CNN, in trying to cover for Obama, is reporting nonstop that people have been talking about Wright, haters that they are. But they’ve also run the “God damn America” clip eleventy times. The entire left is losing their shit over Wright (again), which means they’re talking an awful lot about Wright. If I’m Romney, I tut-tut in public and giggle like a schoolgirl in private.

    Now, I’m not saying that Romney isn’t a squish, (because he is) but this is tactically wise. Besides, Romney didn’t write The Amateur, nor did he make it #6 at Amazon. The NYT is going to despise publishing the bestseller list this week.

    I fucking love the new media.

  10. All that said this “He’s a nice guy” shit needs to stop. He’s a narcissist who doesn’t care that he’s demolishing America.

  11. I really did think Romney was gonna learn from the McCain campaign.

    Nope.

    Another “Red Shirt” off the USS Enterprise Failure.

    Sdferr, we doing that third party thing yet?

    I can BBQ chicken.

  12. But WHY???

    Take one part political correctness, add two parts superstitious media/political consultant nonsense about moderate and independent voters, combine with a “keep it close, play it safe” mentality and there you go!

    Best served over a steaming pile of bullshit.

  13. Doing not so much yet, Lybd, except to the extent thinking, planning, calculating and so on amounts to doing. For my own part, I think the actual doing is best done post-election, for mere purposes of expedience. But also believe that the thinking part is all to the good now, well in advance.

  14. Romney: The velveeta fist in the velvet glove candidate.

  15. Pablo, the above the fray thing only works if you actually, y’know, stay above the fray.

    If everytime a SuperPac comes along and says they’re thinking about saying something unflattering about Obama, and the Obama camp responds by demanding that Romney hop on one leg and bark like a dog to prove he’s not party to the meanness, and then Romney starts hopping and barking like an obedient bitch, the Pacs are going to conclude they’re wasting their time and money.

  16. That’s all true enough, Ernst. But again, it’s pointing out the obvious, such as “but, that’s insane.”
    Why as in, does Obama have something on you ? Is the fix in? Is there a voodoo spell cast over all Obama opponents that prevents them from doing anything that could damage ‘the One’ ?

  17. As Cherokee Chief Elizabeth Warren would say: “Pablo is wise”.

    But their all narcissists to some extent, and I don’t see Romney having the below the belt fortitude to go a full 12 rounds. Levin, Rush, Beck, Hannity…hell…even Jeff & all us combined can only carry so much water.

  18. the hopes that such a gesture will prevent the Democrats

    I don’t know that they’re hoping for prevention so much as “look at how good we are for not being the bad old meanies the press say we are.”

    Which, that and $1.07 will get you a CroisSONIC breakfast sammich at Sonic these days.

    Including tax!

  19. If everytime a SuperPac comes along and says they’re thinking about saying something unflattering about Obama, and the Obama camp responds by demanding that Romney hop on one leg and bark like a dog to prove he’s not party to the meanness…

    I’m going to have to go with Tuco on this.

  20. But WHY???

    Because as soon as Romney reveals that Obama strapped a baby kitten to the roof of his car, Obama will reveal that Romney drinks kitten smoothies.

  21. Tuco is a truly wise man.

  22. Team Obama is reacting to ads that have never been released. Further, they are ads unreleased by PACS, not Team Romney. They are all over the place being “outraged!!!”

    If I were Mitt, the Presumptive Nominee™, I’d take the high road until the convention. And spend a lot of time chortling to myself in the meantime.

  23. Pablo, I’m not so inclined to go for the ‘stay above the fray’ stuff. I think it’s overrated. And not much use against scumbags.
    Why do you get down in the gutter to fight them?
    Because it beats the hell out of fighting them in your living room.

  24. Romney’s consultant will tell you that if he starts popping away with that nickel plated Desert Eagle, the Obama camp will say that just proves that he’s part of the 1%, and then he’ll have a harder time winning over the moderates. So they’ll stick with the sling shot, just to show that Romney’s a regular guy.

    Meanwhile, Obama’s people will be zeroing in the mini-gun.

  25. “Team Obama is reacting to ads that have never been released.”

    Actually, I think they’re reacting to the disastrous story for them which they know lies behind these relationships, should that story ever become common knowledge. Otherwise, there would be no reaction at all.

  26. I don’t have a problem if Romney chose to stay above the fray, it’s when he joins the fray on the wrong side that bothers me.

  27. When Gingrich or somebody demanded in a debate that Romney say something to stop the 3rd party attack adds, Romney’s response was to point out that it was illegal for the campaign to coordinate with third parties before rhetorically asking if Gingrich (or whomever) wanted him to do something illegal.

    I think it’s telling that he didn’t play this kerfuffle the same way.

    What it tells me is that, much as Romney might want to be president, the people around Romney were more interested in making sure that the wrong sort of Republican didn’t win the nomination. Team Romney is playing not to lose now. Because they’ve already won what they wanted.

  28. Well and pithily said B. Moe.

  29. The Romney who isn’t: I’ll be happy to answer this question as soon as Axelrod is fired and the press corp stops volunteering their work hours to the Obama campaign. Until then, this hand gesture is my way of showing you all the fucks I give. For the blind at home, the answer is no fucks. No fucks is how many fucks I give.

  30. Jonah encourages Romney to take off the gloves, observing:

    the mainstream media are so deep in the bunker for Obama, they could ride out a nuclear war without having their Jenga tower fall over.

    Also: John Kerry is a “pompous human toothache.”

    Quoting Tim Stanley, “The president could go ‘seal-clubbing and much of the media would see it as a new epoch for winter sports. “Barack Obama Becomes the First President to Kill Six Seals in Under One Minute,” the New York Times would proudly report.’”

  31. You know it’s gonna be a weird election when both candidates have preemptively surrendered.

    When you’re the incumbent, the state of the union is your campaign.

  32. Pablo, I’m not so inclined to go for the ‘stay above the fray’ stuff. I think it’s overrated. And not much use against scumbags.
    Why do you get down in the gutter to fight them?

    But why sink your teeth into a mangy wolf when you’ve got a pack of Rottweilers to do it for you?

  33. Leigh, this isn’t even about ‘the high road’. They are legitimate questions. You win by putting your opponent on the defensive, and making him react to you.
    Who gives a damn what Obama and others will think about it? You know how they’ll counter; counter it by boring in relentlessly on the subject.
    “Hey, I’m not the guy who consorted with terrorists like Ayers, or spent 20 years of Sunday’s listening to anti American racist propaganda from a pastor who I claimed as a big influence in my life! That’s him. I just want answers to these very troubling questions. And while we’re on the subject, I’d like to know why his pals in the media refuse to ask-again.”
    Rush and co.? A limited audience that speaks mostly to the choir; you already have their votes. And they can be ignored and nuetralized to a degree. But as the nominee, Romney has 100% of the audience, coast to coast.
    Because they have to follow him around and cover everything he says and does. Use that.
    When asked what is his philosophy of warfare, the brilliant field marshall Heinz Guderian, father of panzer warfare, replied;
    “Attack, attack, attack. Then attack.”
    Try it conservatives. You might like the results.

  34. Actually, I think they’re reacting to the disastrous story for them which they know lies behind these relationships, should that story ever become common knowledge.

    Yes, but the thing is that the story isn’t some ad campaign proposal that a rich guy and a SuperPAC might have been thinking about. The story is in The Amateur and there ain’t a damned thing they can do about it. Better yet, the story has been coming out of Jeremiah Wright’s mouth and landing on tape.

    Thank you, Ed Klein.

  35. I thought this through, Pablo, and I just don’t think it’s tactically smart. Americans are looking for a leader who isn’t going to play politics with their lives, and the very fact we’re discussing the tactical benefits of choosing what to engage and what no to engage as a matter of political expediency means we aren’t giving Americans what they’re looking for — and they’ll know it.

    If this becomes a campaign built around replacing one political manipulator with another, we’re going to lose.

    The very people who are now telling us how smart this tack is told us the same thing back in 2008 when McCain was surrendering.

    How about we just try honesty? Instead of letting the Democrats dictate which facts and truths are off the table? Because honestly, if right wing radio does the work the Romney campaign should be doing, do you think that’s going to insulate Romney? Or that the American people will vote for him because they see him as a victim of aggressive campaign attack ads?

    No. They’ll see him as a squish afraid to to take on race and class-based attacks — the very things people too afraid to do themselves are yearning for some leader to come along and do.

    Instead, they surrender. Yet again. Like NRO and all the rest.

    INDEFENSIBLE!

  36. I wonder if anyone has ever run a “just imagine how bad it would be if I weren’t the President” campaign like this before. It would be funny if it didn’t have such a chance of working.

  37. If the mangy wolf demands you swat the Rottweilers on their noses, and you do so, the Rottweilers are going to get confused.

  38. wait a minute. Yesterday the NYT was shitting it’s pants..

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/17/us/politics/gop-super-pac-weighs-hard-line-attack-on-obama.html?_r=1

    …because Ricketts was ready to unload on Obama. I posted on it. Is that already disavowed?

  39. I’ma go buy the Amateur and post some of it here. Also, that book “No matter … racist” is very worth your time, as well.

  40. “Our plan is to do exactly what John McCain would not let us do: Show the world how Barack Obama’s opinions of America and the world were formed,” the proposal says. “And why the influence of that misguided mentor and our president’s formative years among left-wing intellectuals has brought our country to its knees.”

  41. You know why people get pissed when the other side runs negative campaign ads against them?

    Because they work.

    You can’t hurt a politicians feelings. They don’t have any.

  42. Yes. Disavowed.

    Candidate McCain won’t have any of it!

  43. Romney isn’t a coward like McCain I don’t think … it’s more he’s a control freak

  44. It’s hard to defeat an enemy that you don’t acknowledge exists.

    “Everyone in Washington wants to do the right thing.” — Tom Coburn

    Talk about a howler. If Coburn actually believes this he’s not sane.

  45. “Everyone in Washington wants to do the right thing.” — Tom Coburn

    So much of what I hate in one short sentence. For a blind fool, Coburn certainly has a way with words.

  46. But why sink your teeth into a mangy wolf when you’ve got a pack of Rottweilers to do it for you?

    I thought this through, Pablo, and I just don’t think it’s tactically smart.

    Moving an order up, who then is Mitt Romney? Or more importantly, what will he do as President? He can stay above the fray…while holding what operating principles, exactly?

    We’re saying beat Obama by not running against him but instead by running against the inevitable result of who he is, in other words, what he’s done.

    But what will Mitt Romney do as the result of who he is, which not one of us knows. What we think is that he’s not Obama but he is the second coming of John McCain, who he lost to four years ago.

  47. If I may expand on Jeff’s points. This is not running negative attack adds, such as using opponent’s sealed divorce records.
    This is not inane drivel designed to distract from Obama’s record and performance as POTUS, such as Romney’s involvement in a school hazing some 50 years ago.
    This is taking Obama to task on his own words and actions.
    You don’t win a fight strictly by demonstrating how well you can take a punch.

  48. Americans are looking for a leader who isn’t going to play politics with their lives

    Sure about that? Seems to me like Americans (or least a significantly-large enough number of them) are looking for a leader who’s going to give them More Free Stuff.

  49. Glenn Beck made an excellent point today. Beck pointed out that MBM is reporting that Jeremiah Wright is back in the news. MBM is not reporting why Wright is back in the news.

    And we have team Romney running scared from the Wright story, because it’s being portrayed as an attack on religion.

    However, that is not the story, the story is about bribery.

    And team Mitt bought into the deflection.

  50. If this becomes a campaign built around replacing one political manipulator with another, we’re going to lose.

    So in other words, if people understand what this election is about you’re going to lose.

  51. Hey! All you teabaggers need to know is, the country CAN’T SURVIVE four more years of Obama! That’s why we must elect moderate severe conservative Mitt Romney! So DOOMSDAY is postponed until some date in 2017 or thereafter!

    NOW SHUT UP AND SIT DOWN IN THE BACK OF THE BUS!

  52. Sure about that? Seems to me like Americans (or least a significantly-large enough number of them) are looking for a leader who’s going to give them More Free Stuff.

    I’m not talking about Obama voters. Progressives don’t really like the whole notion of nation states anyhow. So if I forget to count them among Americans, they’ll take that as a quiet compliment — though publicly they’d likely squawk.

    But honestly, I don’t much give a fuck what they think.

  53. For a blind fool, Coburn certainly has a way with words.

    Coburn sees evil, but no evildoers.

  54. Seems to me like Americans (or least a significantly-large enough number of them) are looking for a leader who’s going to give them More Free Stuff.

    And if those people become a majority of the electorate, the country is gone, and none of this matters anyway.

  55. I’m not sure that’s true currently, Ernst. It probably was before they ran out of other people’s money but that was then and this is now. Now we see cities in Cali going bankrupt (no More Free Stuff for them) and Dem politicians in blue states going after public unions.

    It’s a bit like the UAW. When Detroit was making money hand over fist management could always roll over and still survive. Now? You just shut down the factory.

  56. We’re at the point where we test, “Trends that can’t continue, won’t.” I’m betting on the truism being true.

  57. “Everyone in Washington wants to do the right thing.”

    Correct, but what “the right thing” is is a variable with infinity as its range.

  58. Two names for you bh, my friend,

    Greece

    France

  59. However, that is not the story, the story is about bribery.

    And team Mitt bought into the deflection.

    Which shows us that Team Mitt aren’t as think as they smart they are.

    But we here knew that, already.

  60. Without Germany, they’re out of free stuff. We have no Germany.

  61. Greece is out of free stuff now because Germany said so, and Greece voted for more free stuff, and now they have to vote again.

    France voted for the guy who said he’d find a way to get more free stuff out of Germany and millionaires.

  62. I gotta get on the road but my main thrust is simply that Margaret Thatcher’s aphorism places a natural time limit on Tocqueville’s observation.

    Can’t win by bribing everyone if you go broke first.

  63. I’m not disagreeing with you as far as “that which can’t continue, won’t” goes. I’m just cautioning that we can choose to do even worse as easily as we can choose to do better.

    And probably it’s easier to choose to do worse.

  64. However, that is not the story, the story is about bribery.

    And how does one go about proving that the allegations are true?

    Is it important that they are?

    Or is it more important just to have it out there?

    And should Mitt be the one leading the whisper campaign?

  65. The point where Thatcher’s aphorism limit’s Tocqueville’s observation is the point where Hayek’s title takes over.

    Hayek read Tocqueville too.

  66. Mitt doesn’t have to say anything, BT. Yet he did. What, if anything, should we infer from that?

  67. Ricketts says it was never a plan, only a proposal. I don’t see any evidence to the contrary.

    I’ma go buy the Amateur and post some of it here. Also, that book “No matter … racist” is very worth your time, as well.

    I’m ordering it too. In the meantime, I’d go to the audio tape. Here and here for starters.

  68. I’m still waiting for Ernst to tell somebody to “pith off”.

    Everyone in Washington wants to do the right thing..

    Two words. Spike & Lee.

  69. the Ricketts Plan

    You can’t make that bow-legged shit up.

    Ricketts?

    Joe Ricketts?

    I get that it’s s’posed to be spelled with one “t”, but come on man.

  70. Moving an order up, who then is Mitt Romney? Or more importantly, what will he do as President? He can stay above the fray…while holding what operating principles, exactly?

    He will proudly help Congress dismantle Obamacare, and resurrect about 90% of it in separate bills, giving us RomneycarePlus. NRO, and other such Republican cheerleaders, will tell us that this is a sterling example of “market-based reform.” Romney will keep forcing insurers to accept policies with pre-existing conditions, will force insurers to keep offspring on parents’ policies to a reasonable age like 24, will create subsidies for low income earners to buy policies from managed “exchanges,” will perhaps offer a “tax incentive” for people to buy coverage. Not a mandate, mind you. Just a bribe from Uncle Sam if you buy the right kind of medical insurance. A carrot not a stick, paid for with public money. See? Like, all free-markety, and stuff.

    I listened recently to a staunch opponent of Obamacare (I think he was someone from AEI or Heritage) praise to the skies the smashing success that is Medicare Part D. It’s all free-markety too, what with government subsidy and the sheer size of the program.

    In other words Mitt will be like Bush 43, except less mean and conservative. He might even let John Sununu pick his SCOTUS nominees. Like David Souter.

  71. Mitt doesn’t have to say anything, BT. Yet he did. What, if anything, should we infer from that?

    That he decides who is authorized to speak on his behalf.

  72. Does Romney get to pick the topics his authorized speakers speak on, or does he plan to continue deferring to Axelrod?

  73. It is entirely too telling that Team Romney, willing to unleash any manner of oppo research dirt upon rivals for the Republican nomination, now blanch at the prospect of going negative against their main opponent. It is almost as if they hold left leaning and swing voters in higher regard than conservatives or even registered Republicans.

    Wait, that’s not true. It is EXACTLY as if they hold left leaning and swing voters in higher regard than conservatives or even registered Republicans.

    IOW, while they are not your friends, they certainly would appreciate it if you do the heavy lifting and dirty work for them.

  74. That he decides who is authorized to speak on his behalf.

    Guess you missed the part where he said during the primaries that he can’t do that.

    But I’m tired of saying I told you so, so I’ll just stop and watch the train wreck play out. Again.

    And that’s the case even if Romney wins. The thing is, they are betting that he wins — and are trying to make sure that if he does, he isn’t beholden to conservatives.

    That’s the bet they’re making. It’s a bet for the ruling class and against us.

    Bank it.

  75. Does Romney get to pick the topics his authorized speakers speak on, or does he plan to continue deferring to Axelrod?

    I would certainly hope he is involved in the narrative decion-making. Don’t see what Axelrod has to do with Romney running his own campaign, i believe Axelrod has his hands full enough already.

  76. “Guess you missed the part where he said during the primaries that he can’t do that.”

    Translated. He can’t get caught telling Super Pacs what to do on his behalf, directly.

  77. To expand on both Thomas and Jeff, the Romney campaign/D.C. Establican strategy here, at least with regards to the party’s conservative base is a heads I win—tails you lose one.

    Sorta like how the Democrats play the game with Republicans.

  78. “Don’t see what Axelrod has to do with Romney running his own campaign, i believe Axelrod has his hands full enough already.”

    Yeah, that’s no doubt what Eisenhower had in mind setting up a fake invasion force under Patton’s command too. What on earth could Eisenhower have to do with determining what Hitler would decide?

  79. Axelrod demanded that Romney repudiate the SuperPacs reported (reported, not actual) plan to run adds about Obama’s ties to Jeremiah Wright. Romney complied and proposed adds were repudiated before they ever ran. So I guess that means not only is Romney the one who gets to decide who’s authorized to speak on his behalf, but that any speech by any party not so authorized is verboten.

    That’s not staying above the fray, that’s getting down into the fray in order to make sure that it’s one sided. Because it seems Romney’s side is too proud to fight, lest they be accused of fighting dirty.

  80. Or to try (for once) to put it more succinctly:

    He can’t get caught telling Super Pacs what to do on his behalf, directly.

    In the primaries, sure. Now that we’re in the general, he doesn’t seem to have a problem telling the Super Pacs what not to do.

  81. Whether he expects or even wants them listen, I’ll grant you, is another thing.

  82. Axelrod demanded that Romney repudiate the SuperPacs reported (reported, not actual) plan to run adds about Obama’s ties to Jeremiah Wright. Romney complied and proposed adds were repudiated before they ever ran. So I guess that means not only is Romney the one who gets to decide who’s authorized to speak on his behalf, but that any speech by any party not so authorized is verboten.

    That’s not staying above the fray, that’s getting down into the fray in order to make sure that it’s one sided. Because it seems Romney’s side is too proud to fight, lest they be accused of fighting dirty.

    Anyone who lives in an early primary state is well aware of how hard Romney’s PACs can hit.So it isn’t like he can’t or won’t fight.

    But in the end, it is his choice as to when and how the gloves come off. And in my opinion, it is too early to go nuke.

  83. “In the primaries, sure. Now that we’re in the general, he doesn’t seem to have a problem telling the Super Pacs what not to do.”

    Are the laws different for primaries and the general? Does Romney now have the authority to tell the SuperPacs what to do? Could the Super Pac run the Wright Ads without Romney’s approval?

    Seems to me the law says yes. So what effect does Romney’s statement really have? As much as, more than, less than Obama’s statement of his current stage of evolvement re: same sex marriage?

  84. I don’t see Romney as being or acting like McCain. McCain was always a dilettante, riding along on Admiral Dad’s coattails to nearly flunk out of the Naval Academy. Spending most of his youth as a drunk and a disgrace as an officer and shitty pilot (lighting up the flight deck on the Forrestal. Crashing in the jungle.) He’s spent the remainder of his days trading on his captivity in Hanoi, marrying a trophy wife after his trusty first wife stuck by him while he was a POW, banking scandals (Keating Five, anyone?), lack-luster and unconstitutional legislation (McCain-Feingold). Romney? He supposedly gave a guy a haircut! In prep school! The horror!

    We really haven’t seen what Romney will do. He is running a series of “Morning in America” type ads that paint the future of America as a rebirth of our national greatness. He’s not RR, but he’s not Obama in whiteface.

    Six months is an eternity in politics. Quit being so impatient or run for office yourself and give us the skinny on how it should be done™.

  85. I believe the point of this post was that Romney is signalling that he intends to fight the general election battle in more genteel fashion.

    Now that the real enemy has been defeated.

  86. That remains to be seen. Tearing one’s hair and screeching “It’s McCain all over again!!!!!” is projection at best.

    Of course, standing with one’s arms crossed and spitting “I done tol’ ya!” is satisfying for some.

  87. McCain is a lot of things. But one of the things is not “electrical short circuit in a rocket pod” (“lighting up the flight deck of the Forrestal”)

    That was a damnably stupid thing to say.

  88. “I believe the point of this post was that Romney is signalling that he intends to fight the general election battle in more genteel fashion.”

    That may be true today. His track record says tomorrow will be another day.

  89. We really haven’t seen what Romney will do. He is running a series of “Morning in America” type ads that paint the future of America as a rebirth of our national greatness. He’s not RR, but he’s not Obama in whiteface.

    Really? He’s not? Then why are they both running the same campaign theme (i.e. morning in America is just around the corner if you vote for me)?

  90. lighting up the flight deck on the Forrestal.

    I am second to no one in my lack of regard for McCain the Politician, but I simply cannot countenance the repetition of blatant falsehood.

    The rocket that started the fire that became the Forrestal disaster was accidentally launched from an F4. McCain was not even in that F4, he was in another plane, barely escaped it alive, and was a short time later almost killed by an exploding bomb while assisting in the rescue.

    On that day he was no screw up.

  91. Re: the Forrestal. Sorry Charlie. That’s the cover story. He also ratted his fellow POWs out. I know a source.

  92. Both of these guys are playing not to lose. Which means nobody is going to win, (in the sense of having an affirmitive mandate to enact a legislative program) and then we all lose, quickly if Obama is relected (because we know he’ll govern as if he won) , more slowly if it’s Romney because he will be constrained in what he can do by the lack of an affirmative mandate).

  93. Was it McCain’s F-4 with the malfunctioning rocket pod, or was it his that was hit by the errant rocket?

  94. McCain didn’t fly F-4s. His was an A-4 Skyhawk.

  95. McCain never flew F4s (fighter), he was an A5 (attack) pilot.

  96. correct, Sdferr, A4.

  97. So what’s your solution, Ernst? Why don’t you forward some of your ideas to Team Romney?

  98. Sorry Charlie. That’s the cover story.

    You are alleging a cover up by the entire US Navy. Got anything to back that up?

  99. Not for attribution, ThomasD.

  100. I thought the incident was captured on camera, showing the flash from the aircraft on the opposite side of the deck?

  101. Apparently that film footage was made in the same studio as the ‘Moon landings.’

  102. I thought this was just crazy enough to work leigh:

    How about we just try honesty? Instead of letting the Democrats dictate which facts and truths are off the table?

  103. You’d think, if the Navy really did engage in a massive cover up they might want to avoid scrutiny of the event. Yet to this day they persist in making it a BFD for everyone who serves shipboard.

  104. I thought this was just crazy enough to work …

    I would agree 100%, Ernst. My point that is getting obscured is that we haven’t seen the campaign proper, yet.

    As to Obama and Romney basically running the same campaign, maybe it looks that way at a glance, but does anyone believe that Obama is going to make it all better? Or that Romney is Reagan? I submit they do not. I have said it until I am blue in the face that Romney was my guy last election cycle. Sadly, we got stuck with Gramps McCoot. We’re going to have to make the best of a bad situation or end up with four more years of Obama.

    Either way, the cities are going to burn. I have extra room so any Outlaws needing shelter can bug out to my place until the carnage is over.

  105. My guy is Army, Thomas. He was stationed in Vietnam at the same time both the Foresstal and McCain’s capture took place. He’s friends with Colin Powell. I’m just saying there is probably enough truth stirred in to the story to make it plausible. Either way, it was a million years ago, I was a little kid and it’s hearsay to me and I really don’t care one way or the other.

    It’s like a lot of stories about wartime; equal parts truth and ass-covering.

  106. If it’s all going to burn, what’s the difference whether it burns now or burns later?

    On the other hand, if we can keep it from burning by, say, stop adding fuel to the pyre or stop spilling (borrowed) kerosene all over the place, wouldn’t it be important to, y’know, actually sayingthose things instead of pretending to argue about kinds of fuel were adding, or the quality of the accelerant?

    Oh. And since one of the candidates is a fucking arsonist, it would help if you could call the fucking arsonist a fucking arsonist, without gettting accused of being unhelpful, or of expecting candidates to light their own hair on fire for your ostensible amusement.

  107. He might as well be your second cousin who heard it from some girl in band camp.

    Never mind what you are saying about John McCain, by alleging such a cover up you are smearing all those present who gave testimony as to the facts of the event, and all those in the chain of command who participated in the investigation and prepared the final report.

    They may be faceless, but that’s alot of people to impugn.

  108. Christ, Ernst. Who pissed in your cornflakes? Stay away from sharp objects, okay?

  109. My apologies to any who may have been harmed in my making a blog comment on a largely forgotten matter. Even if I was the one to bring it up. I never will again.

  110. Get of your high horse leigh. On the one had you say ‘you don’t care’ yet on the other hand you are damn quick to make the assertion that John McCain was directly responsible for blowing up the front of an aircraft carrier, causing the deaths of ONE HUNDRED AND THIRTY FOUR MEN. Or, what you call ‘lighting up the Forrestal.’

    And, in case you missed my earlier attempt to amend your ignorance, this event is not ‘largely forgotten’ in the Navy, it is something that has been incorporated into the training of every person who serves on a ship aka ‘every sailor a fireman.’

  111. What does Wright have to do with the economy?

  112. Oh, I’m not on a high horse, Thomas. I didn’t mean to be flippant. I was repeating scuttlebutt, even though I should know better. I’m sorry.

    BT: Wright doesn’t have anything to do with the economy. He’s a shiny thing that is being dangled in front of us to take our eyes off the prize.

  113. What does Wright have to do with the economy?

    About as much Cloward and Piven. Which is to say that this is what Hope and Change looks like. Obama promised fundamental transformation, and now we’re getting it, good and hard as they say.

    Look, if Romney doesn’t want to talk about Wright’s influence on Obama and why that explains in part why we are where we are, that’s fine. But he also doesn’t have to go out and say that he doesn’t want anyone else to talk about it either, does he? Because if he’s telling the truth, he’s a fool. And if he’s lying he’s a fool and an idiot.

    I happen to think that how we got here matters, if only because we don’t really know where we’re going if we don’t know where we’ve been. If you don’t care where you’re going, so long as it’s elsewhere, because all you care about is not liking where you are right now, it’s as likely as not that you’ll wind up someplace worse rather than someplace better.

    Or as Obama calls it,

    Forward!

  114. What does Romney have to do with the economy?

    Positing any president as an economic savior is part of the problem we face.

    Wright is as valid an issue as an over weaning government destroys the free market is an issue.

  115. We’re over a thousand days without a budget. Who’s in charge here?

  116. The last two posts (Ernst and ThomasD); Amen.
    This is why this is so frustrating to me. One side plays by no rules, and takes no tactics off the table. The other, with plenty of legitimate questions to ask and points to make, refuses to do so.
    That they then try to excuse this by cloaking it in some kind of half assed gentlemanly morality makes it worse.

  117. The Democrats are in charge leigh. And that’s the wrong question anyways. The question is why have we gone a thousand-plus days without a budget?

    But that’s not a question for the Romney campaign. No sir,

    seeing as how it might compel them to rethink some of their premises about Obama.

  118. Well Ernst if you want to make Wright the issue, have at it. I don’t think that Romney should make Wright the issue today.

    And Thomas, Romney will have plenty to do with the economy once he takes the reins of the regulatory bureaucracy. Hopefully with a compliant house and senate.

  119. Here’s what Wright has to do with the economy:

    “The painting depicts a harpist,” Reverend Wright explained, “a woman who, at first glance, appears to be sitting atop a great mountain. Until you take a closer look and see that the woman is bruised and bloodied, dressed in tattered rags, the harp reduced to a single frayed string. Your eye is then drawn down to the scene below, down to the valley below, where everywhere are the ravages of famine, the drumbeat of war, a world groaning under strife and deprivation.  It is this world, a world where cruise ships throw away more food in a day than most residents of Port-au-Prince see in a year, where white folks’ greed runs a world in need, apartheid in one hemisphere, apathy in another hemisphere … That’s the world on which hope sits.” [my emph.] And so it went, a meditation on a fallen world.

    That’s from Obama’s Audacity of Hope, as quoted here.

    For Obama, like Wright, the economy isn’t about the efficient allocation of scarce resources anymore than the capital gains tax is about raising revenue to fund the government. It’s about social justice

    Obama may or may not be a “good man.” I guess that depends on what your take on “social justice” is. But if you think Obama is “in over his head,” it’s beause you either don’t know or refuse to recognize what it is that Obama is doing. I think he knows exactly what he’s doing, and why he’s doing it.

    Like the man said, you can’t make an omelette without fundamentally transforming a few eggs.

  120. I happen to think that how we got here matters

    Naw. Only how Romney performs with lesbian evangelicals in swing states matters. It’s all a numbers game. Ideology has nothing to do with it. Securing power does.

  121. So Ernst, I take it that you won’t be voting for Obama? For the record neither will I.

  122. I can’t make Wright the issue BT. Because Romney’s already agreed with Obama that Wright is off limits. Since it’s already been predetermined to be unhelpful, if I ignore Romney and make an issue of Obama’s association with Wright, I’m hurting Romney.

    How am I hurting Romney? Obama points to me and cries foul, demanding the Romney denounce me to prove he’s playing fair. Romney does so and deflects my attack on Obama. Romney doesn’t do so, and he proves he’s cheating. I continue to ignore Romney and it proves he can’t control his “surrogates” and thus can’t lead effectively.

    Like I said, Romney is either a fool, or a fool AND and idiot. And he’s done this to himself by playing Axelrod’s game.

  123. I won’t be voting for Romney either. For the record.

  124. once he takes the reins of the regulatory bureaucracy.

    He’ll be about as effective as Slim Pickens after the nuke had broken free.

  125. Romney’s already agreed with Obama that Wright is off limits.

    For now. They’re already starting up the Mormon smear machine at the alphabet networks and cable news. Martin Beshear in particular has been really odious, even waving a copy of the Book of Morman — like it was a koran for pete’s sake!

    Many people who are in the Secret Service are Mormons. Harry Reid is a Mormon. Is Romney going to sit back and let Team Obama kick sand on his crew? Hardly. The Reverand Wright will get his due all in good time.

  126. Shorter leigh: Romney, Romney, he’s our man, if he can’t do it, why don’t you, you whining purists?

  127. Bullshit, Jeff. I don’t care for Romney either.

    Unfortunately, my preferred candidate turned out to have foot-in-mouth disease.

  128. So what effect does Romney’s statement really have? As much as, more than, less than Obama’s statement of his current stage of evolvement re: same sex marriage?

    To do it now gets you labeled racist and looked into — as one of them fringe types. Unhelpful, you see. And really not one of us.

    So why bother, if the candidate doesn’t have your back — and in fact will denounce you?

  129. So it isn’t like he can’t or won’t fight.

    Yes, against filthy subhuman conservatives who want him to set his hair on fire.

    But that’s different. Like squishing cockroaches.

  130. How’s the baby?

    I have to take my son somewhere. I’ll bbl.

  131. Bullshit, Jeff. I don’t care for Romney either.

    Not yet. But so long as he’s not distracted by the shiny baubles and keeps his eye on the issues — JOBS! — he’ll have your admiration and support! No crazed fringer is he!

    Unfortunately, my preferred candidate turned out to have foot-in-mouth disease.

    If you’re talking about Perry, he’s another one who when push came to shove backed the establishment.

  132. Or what Ernst already said.

  133. Baby has discovered he has vocal cords.

  134. Ernst I am thoroughly perplexed. If you will not vote for Romney, of what concern is it of yours how he runs his campaign? I wouldn’t dream of advocating that Obama run his campaign a certain way.

  135. Ernst I am thoroughly perplexed. If you will not vote for Romney, of what concern is it of yours how he runs his campaign?

    Because he’s going to be the new “right winger” we’re all tacked to. The new far right that pushes all of us even further right. So we have a stake in his acting like a craven simp.

  136. I’m going to Costco now to stock up on chocolate covered raisins. Before the dark days hit.

  137. Baby has discovered he has vocal cords.

    he’ll find them useful at 3:00 am

  138. I’m going to Costco now to stock up on chocolate covered raisins. Before the dark days hit.

    Be worth more than gold in the post-apocalypse.

    Those and black pepper.

  139. here Mr. Jeff this is an affordable alternative to the costco I think

  140. Okay, I’m back. I think you make a very nice point here, Ernst:

    The point where Thatcher’s aphorism limit’s Tocqueville’s observation is the point where Hayek’s title takes over.

    Hayek read Tocqueville too.

    Yes, this is a different animal than the one Tocqueville foresaw. Different mechanism at work. Doesn’t need to be an outside threat, internal turmoil itself might work. (Hence, Cloward-Piven.)

    The practical application of Hayek would be vigilance on the liberty front. And that’s where we’re seeing Obama at his most dangerous. Bribery was yesterday, the strong man promising security is today.

  141. For the record, if Romney is elected in ’12 and governs as necessary for the country then I’ll be perfectly willing to vote for his re-election.

    I might even promote him to others. I’m a team player.

  142. For you Peach tree state outlaws:

    I’ll be in Atlanta this weekend. If conditions permit, break cover and send an echo message to dangerdaveoc@the gmail network

  143. Ernst I am thoroughly perplexed. If you will not vote for Romney, of what concern is it of yours how he runs his campaign? I wouldn’t dream of advocating that Obama run his campaign a certain way.

    Maybe I’m under the impression that the point of a comments section was to comment on the topic(s) of interest. Maybe I’m too cheap to buy a cell phone and spend three hours a day, five days a week hitting the redial button when spouting off here is easier. Maybe I’m under the mistaken impression that there might be a pragmatist or two lurking about actually interested in trying to understand how an unhelpful purist like me thinks so that we can all find some common ground. Maybe I’m laying out the expectations I have that the Romney campaign is going to have to meet if they want to earn my vote, instead of taking it for granted that I’m going to vote for them because I have nowhere else to go.

    Or maybe I’m just being fundamentally unserious in an unsmiling somebody’s been pissing in my cornflakes sort of way.

    And I’ll second what bh said.

  144. Maybe I’m under the mistaken impression that there might be a pragmatist or two lurking about actually interested in trying to understand how an unhelpful purist like me thinks so that we can all find some common ground. Maybe I’m laying out the expectations I have that the Romney campaign is going to have to meet if they want to earn my vote, instead of taking it for granted that I’m going to vote for them because I have nowhere else to go.

    That’s much better. We are on the same page there.

  145. Ernst, I understand your concerns. In 08 i voted for neither McCain nor Obama. I voted all the down ticket races though.

    This time around I will vote for Romney
    1. Because in Florida my vote might actually make a difference
    and
    2. Because i trust Romney to do his best to right the ship vs leaving it to Obama to continue steering towards the rocks.

  146. From my P.O.V., Romney’s best, insofar as what on offer is concerned, isn’t worth the bother. It’s why I keep harping on about mandates and not Obama and playing not to lose instead of playing to win.

    The GOP just squandered a once in a generation opportunity.

    Much to the relief of the party elders and their parasitic hangers-on, no doubt.

  147. In all honesty, if calling him the Mandingo Kenyan Usurper from now through November would get it done I’d support it with every fiber of my being.

    But I agree with Pablo. Let the questions linger. Let people wonder why we can’t discuss “God Damn America” when the MSM is so interested in haircuts in Michigan Prep Schools in 1965. Every minute Romney’s not blaming that cocksucker for the fact that Joe Swingvoter’s daughter’s Christmas is really, really going to suck, we’re losing an edge.

    In 2008, the electorate hired him to fix the economy, with prodding from the MSM. He pursued other priorities. He failed miserably. When we’re not saying this, pointing it out, emphasizing it – when we’re talking about other issues that are split 50-50 or even 60-40 in our favor, we’re losing.

    Eventually, if Romney stays on message, the perception that Barry is deflecting will set in.

  148. baracky 100% enemy
    mittens 50-60% enemy

  149. Ernst – Nail. Head. On.
    Once in a frickin’ lifetime opportunity.
    Worst leftist since wayback. And we go with Mr. Milquetoast.

  150. […]It’s why I keep harping on about mandates and not Obama and playing not to lose instead of playing to win.

    The GOP just squandered a once in a generation opportunity.

    People say this all the time and I want to. This.

    Electoral winning isn’t objective winning if it isn’t followed by policy winning. The reason why the ratchet moves in one direction is because they do 10 things and the best we insist on is negating 7 of them. It’s been a jump ball since the early 90’s and we’re still offering tacit approval to the most corrosive aspects of progressivism. Reagan did better before we even broke their hold on the legislature.

    How? It’s that mandate thing. When a man uses his national campaign to run amok on these fools and frauds he earns actual power. Not useless “I control the bureaucracy” power, no, it becomes “I’m gonna blow up your bureaucracy” power.

    Where do we find ourselves now? With that very chance once more. With high gas prices, with high unemployment, with the new depression. Any one of our candidates could have defeated Obama.

    And we’re going with the I’m-a-progressive-Republican technocrat. And we’ll hopefully negate 7 out of 10 things he did.

    (A wise penguin once said, “This town needs an enema.”)

  151. Maybe that was the Joker.

  152. Mr. Milquetoast really equals Dad. Obama is more like your embarassing brother-in-law who drinks too much at family get togethers, slaps your pre-teen daughter on the ass and laughs at his own jokes. I’m ready to have an adult in the White House.

    We’ll see what happens in June when the Supremes hand down their decision on the AHA. If it’s deemed unconstitutional, Obama will go berzerker on the “unelected officials” for the remainder of the term and forget all about the economy.

    Whatever happens, the turn of the year is going to usher in a whole new mess with expiring legislation, et al. It will be a trying term for whoever wins.

  153. Mr. Milquetoast really equals Dad.

    Not true. Dad says the family can’t spend more than it takes in. Dad says if you don’t pay the rent you should shut up.

    Dad > Mr. Milquetoast.

  154. You know my dad? You sound just like him.

  155. The problem with letting people wonder is that they won’t wonder for long.

  156. I am going with the candidate that won the primaries.

    And i don’t see why Mitt needs to apologize for winning against such a weak field. He didn’t pick his opposition. Neither did we. But the ones who should have run didn’t. And the ones who shouldn’t have run did. And that is why everyone seems to be looking at their dinner plate wondering why they are getting leftover hash instead of prime rib.

    But that is the way it goes.

  157. So we’ll eat it and we’ll like it.

  158. For myself, I’m looking at what’s on offer and thinking it’s really a better use of my resources to focus locally, BT.

    We’re not at a place where a lesser of two evils is an argument. We’re at the place where we either fix it immediately or we find the life boats.

  159. YOu need to bite the bullet and get in a race, bh.

  160. bh,

    I agree with you completely that concentrating on the farm system is the best approach. There is good talent at the AA -AAA level.

  161. Every election cycle it’s the same thing, the same tired old scripts dusted off and played again. So whats’ to do ?
    Well, make some noise but in the end, settle in and get behind the nominee, whoever that cycle’s ‘Mr. Inevitable”.
    Vote for anybody but? Well, I guess there’s some satisfaction to be had there, but it’s paper thin and is soon gone.
    To hell with it and don’t vote at all? That one just doesn’t work for me at all.
    So what’s to do?
    I’m tired of leftover hash.

  162. To hell with it and don’t vote at all?

    I’ma write in Sarah Palin, I think. And I’m gonna take the Democrat out of the Kennedy seat. Patrick, that is.

  163. I might could write Allen West in so I can say I voted for the black guy.

  164. But I will rebut the bullshit slung at Romney, of which there will be plenty. Because if we get Obama again, America is over in short order. Which is weird, because I’ve long said I wish we’d just hit the wall and get to rebuilding. There must be some ember of optimism within me that has yet to be extinguished.

  165. Your a patriot, Pablo.

  166. I’ve gone the 3rd choice or write in route myself a few times, Paco. I just don’t think it’s effective on the national vote. Not enough of us. Way too many locked into taking what they’re given- bad or worse- and thinking it a ‘choice’.

  167. Pablo, my aspirational vote will be a write-in. I’ma thinkin Ms. Palin. Just for shits and grins.
    Down-ticket will be against Sheldon and Cicilline.
    Of course, if my frickin’ house (9 months on the market) would sell, I’d be voting in NH, where my vote might have an impact.
    I just might run for local office in NH. Gotta run against the Massholes.

  168. Pingback: <b>Election 2012</b>: Romney camp indicates early surrender | protein <b>…</b> « Feeds « Palin Republicans

  169. Leigh, I probably over share already so let’s just say I’m not really someone who runs for office. I’ve been effective on others’ behalf though so I don’t see any pressing need there.

    BT, when I say focus locally I thinking of maintaining active yeast strains. If I had to break it down, that’s only half joking.

  170. bh, I think that what you do- and people like you- are the answer. By far, turning things around on the local level is the best, and most prefferable way to do it. I just don’t know that we have the time.

  171. Run for mayor and clean up Dodge. I want to see you on teevee and say “I know that dude!”

    That or open a microbrewery.

  172. Why choose between mayor or microbrewery; do both. Win the election, and beer for everyone.

  173. Because if we get Obama again, America is over in short order.

    This is true.

    It might also be true that if we get Romney, America is over in short order.

    It might simply be true that if we don’t completely change direction, America is over is short order. It’s not illogical to worry about both candidates leading to the same conclusion.

    Maybe the smart course is to start telling Washington to go fuck itself regardless.

  174. “Maybe the smart course is to start telling Washington to go fuck itself regardless”.

    ‘all politics is local’

  175. Here’s the synthesis between a position Romney can take and my own view of present conditions.

    Romney can start telling Washington to go to hell his-own-damn-self. I know this puts him on the spot because Obama is the face of Washington at the moment and he’s such a sweet fellow.

    This proposal seems fair to me. I’m not asking for much. He can take me up on this offer at any time.

  176. Completely OT: why do none of the Great Lake states have the death penalty? There is an entire swath of states where one could go (and have) on a major league crime spree and just end up locked up.

    I need to quite reading criminal background checks while also reading PW.

  177. You could offer to be his pointman, bh.

  178. Michigan has never, as a State, had the death penalty. We do however have life without parole which gets them off the streets and if later it is determined there was an error it can be corrected. I think we do just fine with this.

    As for other States I have no idea what they do or why.

  179. According to demcrats history is a diode. It’s moving to the left. And if the electrons don’t like it then fuck ‘em. Every once in a while a Carter/Reagan pairing comes along and catalyzes the electrode allowing flow in both directions. In 2008 Obama triggered one all by himself and the flow went in the other direction for 2010. Now Romney and the GOP establishment want to dix the history diode push the current leftward only again. Why? I dunno. But fuck those electrons who don’t like it.

  180. Nearly every time someone on Facebook (who is not from Texas or in Texas) mentions Texas having a death penalty they talk about electric chairs and frying. This is even those people who seem to approve of it. But we are just lethal injection. Where do people get these ideas? We don’t burn our capital criminals in a wicker man at the end of the year or anything. We don’t lower them down to the giant ants or toss them into a crime-chipper or brick them up alive in catacombs.

    The execution method in Texas is sedation and euthanasia. There are no rockets or catapults or clowns with machetes or anything.

  181. Yes, I knew that about Michgan’s state constitution. It just seems odd that all the neighboring states are the same way. Of course, we are rather hasty with the needle down here. I’m not a fan.

  182. I know what you mean pala. Try talking to Aussies or New Zealanders about gun laws if you want to get a splitting headache.

  183. Lotta good fine races down ticket, no matter what state you live in.

    The Presidential race will take care of itself, I figure.

  184. I hope Romney wins

  185. This is true.

    It might also be true that if we get Romney, America is over in short order.

    No, America under President Romney has a far better chance of surviving that under lame duck Obama. Romney won’t intentionally kill it with impunity. He’ll just be a crappy technocrat POTUS.

  186. A far better chance?

  187. We have problems when we talk about reforming entitlements here at pw.

    A far better chance?

    My portfolio includes rental properties in South America.*

    *Sounds like a joke, doesn’t it.

  188. It’s a half joke.

  189. I would say a marginally better chance of surviving, myself. The odds improve if we win back the Senate, expand our majority in the House and put the fear of the Tea Party menace into the porkers in the leadership (including the committee & subcommittee chairs). A far better chance would include all of that, and a President Romney who ran on cleaning up the tax code, streamlining regulation, fixing entitlements, and bringing some of that Bain Capital creative destruction to the federal bureaucracy.

  190. Our friend Tony Downs thought about this a bit and he had this inkling that all voting is aspirational and makes no difference for any one voter. It’s one of those fundamentals of public choice theory.

    He’d still be all, “Political actors are rational actors in their own right and also respond to the relevant signals.”

    What Tony and those guys are telling us is that we should stop pretending that our individual votes matter and start realizing that politicians respond to carrots and sticks.

  191. Uncle Milty read that and he was all, “Stop trying to elect the right guy, start trying to correct the incentive structure.”

  192. My point?

    GMU is probably more relevant than the U of C now. It’s like the Tocqueville to Hayek transition from the other thread.

  193. More sticks. Rreferably 1/2″ x 3′ hickory dowels, with which to virtuously beat the politicians to bruising, no bone breaking allowed.

  194. I don’t have any metric for this but, yes, half inch sticks seem appropriate, sdferr.

  195. [I] don’t see why Mitt needs to apologize for winning against such a weak field. He didn’t pick his opposition. Neither did we. But the ones who should have run didn’t. And the ones who shouldn’t have run did. And that is why everyone seems to be looking at their dinner plate wondering why they are getting leftover hash instead of prime rib.

    All reasonable points BT, a few to which I would like to respond.

    I don’t think Mitt should apologize either. I just wish he (and his SuperPac supporters) would direct some of that same ruthless tenacity into attacking Obama instead of just responding to Obama’s attacks (e.g. Romney stuck the dog on the roof of the stationwagon —oh yeah? Barak Obama ate the dog!; Romney bullied an long-haired effeminate wannabe hippy —oh yeah? Barak Obama bullied a little girl!) Anything less makes it seem as if team Romney was more interested in making sure that the wrong type of Republican didn’t advance to the general and screw up the gentleman’s agreement the two sides of the ruling class have when it comes to sharing power —as well as sharing out the spoils of power.

    I think the field was stronger than it’s given credit for. But six month and 30(?) debates with crazy uncle Ron being treated seriously made it easier for the opiners to opine about what a weak field it was. That said, I agree that there was no obvious Reaganesque conservative to rally around. I still insist, however, that the fact that there is no obvious heir to the Reagan mantle hasn’t come to be entirely by chance.

    As for the high name recognition Republicans who declined to run, I think it says something about their judgement (to say nothing about the judgement of their so called political guru advisors —I’m looking at you and your stupid whiteboard, Karl) that they all decided to take a pass at challenging the weakest incumbent in thirty-two years.

  196. If they get too much bigger in dia. they won’t tend to break under the lower forces desired. Welting is good, permanent injuries not so much. We want them to feel remediable pain, and under the stings, come to understand our righteous anger. But hickory is a stiff and stern fiber, tending not to be brash to fracture.

  197. Our friend Tony Downs thought about this a bit and….

    Here’s the problem with that bh:

    Democrat politicians are as irrationally aspirational as their voters.

    That, and the incentive structure is so fucked up that continuing to do the things that you know don’t work, in the expectation that this time, there’s a rabbit in the hat, seems sane to magicians —err, politicians.

  198. Anybody remember that line from National Lampoon’s Chrismas Vacation?

    Something like, “Mister, I ought to beat you with a rubber hose[,]” wasn’t it?

  199. this was fairly brilliant what Mr. Governor Romney done today

    The former Massachusetts governor warned that the U.S. economy faced a huge fiscal hole and high taxes like California’s if he is not elected this autumn.

    “There are only two ways to go: Like America in the past,” Romney said. “Or like California, where they raise taxes higher and higher and higher. They scare away employers … and they have huge deficits,” he said in a telephone town-hall meeting with voters from four swing states.

    The comments were a departure for Romney, who usually holds up Europe’s economic troubles, not California’s $15.7 billion budget gap, as an example of a doom-laden scenario for the American economy.

    The exodus is real – and this message can resonate with anyone what’s noticed or heard tell of an influx of Californians in his community. It’s a self-validating message in that respect. I would like to hear more about how California sucks balls, especially as its fiscal chickens are glancing at their iphones saying omg look at the time gotta get home I’ll text you

  200. Nah, they really aren’t, Ernst. If you want to find a true believer you look in an Occupy Something camp.

    If you find a Dem politician you think fits that profile check back a year later and they’re making 10 times more at a NGO or trust.

    It’s an incredibly predictive way of looking at the world. Find a true exception and you’ll be comfortable the rest of your life as the resident contrarian in Chicago or Washington.

  201. I’ll give you a reference.

  202. Here are things that Dem politicians are good at: investing in the stock market, investing in companies that somehow get paid cash money even though their only asset is a blind monkey, retiring to greener pastures in academia and the NGO world.

    Dennis Kucinich will join three or four boards the minute he leaves Congress and he might actually be clinically insane.

  203. Oh, and lobbying.

    Remember when David Obey’s retirement foretold the great conservative landslide of 2010? Lost his job because of a dumb vote for Obamacare, right? Was that irrational?

    He works for Gephardt Government Affairs now. Wonder what his base pay is. Wait. Gephardt. That rings a bell.

  204. Maybe it’s all perverse incentives then, bh. But to my way of thinking, if the Democrats were rationally responding to relevant signals, Heath Schuler would be minority leader, and Nancy Pelosi retired to a Marin County funny farm; Obama would have announced he wasn’t running for reelection, and Hillary Clinton would be fighting it out with Joe Biden and crazy uncle Denny for the Democrat nomination.

    I guess the signals they find relevant are mere static to me.

  205. The incentives, they are perverse.

    I understand what you’re saying though. Why wasn’t Obama a bit more intelligent and put the benefits before the costs with Obamacare? (Repaying favors.) Why didn’t they bribe citizens on a retail basis rather than give big payoffs to specific entities with the stimulus? (Repaying favors.)

    They’re not geniuses. They’re grubby little fools following those carrots in a world absent of sticks.

  206. Grubby little fools that justify their grasping with a terrible ideology, bh.

    Have a good weekend big guy.

  207. Glenn Reynolds proposed a tax rule that public choice theorists could get behind.

    Romney could pitch that, I suppose. See, I’m willing to let him win me over. Lots and lots and lots of things he could do.

  208. Have a good one, Ernst.

  209. a world absent of sticks.

    Democrats practice their own form of “creative destruction”. We have seen it creatively destroying anyone of conservative stripe that dares to attempt a run against their cherished leaders. They have plenty of sticks, they just use them to drive away challengers that they think they can’t win against. They also have carrots and since the stimulus they are now grown huge.

    The stickless ones waggling carrots at every threat are our establishment Republicans and their carrot-juice-mafia pals.

  210. The stickless ones waggling carrots at every threat are our establishment Republicans and their carrot-juice-mafia pals.

    Yes.

  211. carrot juice is tasty but an 8 ounce serving has about 13 carbs

  212. We are not North Korea, (though you never know about Arkansas) but if the Democrats can pull something similar in the general we will then be.

  213. I’d like to take that farther though.

    What I’d like “our” people to realize is that Washington creates sticks and carrots in Washington because using sticks and carrots in Washington increases Washington’s ability to create sticks and carrots in Washington and repeat step one.

    The noble and true sticks and carrots in Washington decrease the sticks and carrots in Washington and this is an entirely different thing than just coming up with a new tax plan or entitlement reform scheme.

  214. has about 13 carbs

    Must be Webber downdrafts.

  215. you know you made me google don’t you

  216. Yep. My parting gift before going to bed. G’nite guys.

  217. nite Mr. geoff

  218. they found gamara omg

    Excavating in a coal mine in Colombia, paleontologists have discovered the fossil of the world’s largest turtle, a 60-million-year-old specimen nearly 8 feet long — the size of a Smart car. Thriving in a lake about 5 million years after the demise of the dinosaurs, the turtle was undoubtedly the largest predator in its environment, researchers say. The creature had powerful jaws that would enable it to eat nearly anything else it encountered, including mollusks, smaller turtles and even crocodiles.

    The turtle belongs to the order Pleurodira, an unusual type of turtle family whose members **pull their heads sideways into their shells.**

    I’m having trouble getting my head around the sideways thing, so to speak

  219. “And i don’t see why Mitt needs to apologize for winning against such a weak field. He didn’t pick his opposition. Neither did we. But the ones who should have run didn’t. And the ones who shouldn’t have run did. And that is why everyone seems to be looking at their dinner plate wondering why they are getting leftover hash instead of prime rib.”

    Distilled: Damned if my guy didn’t run because he was attacked before he even actually determined he wanted to run but he shoulda run anyway what with all those folks who shouldn’t have run because I didn’t care what their platform was because damn it my guy should have run and he didn’t. Who your candidate or choice of candidate was/is doesn’t matter, since Mr. inevitable the “severely conservative™ ” candidate who has been running since 2008 and now is the presumptive nominee we should all get behind cause damn it my guy didnt run though he should have given all those other folks who ran but shouldn’t have. After all we didn’t get to pick who was gonna be a cadidate.

    Shorter: Just shut up and eat your Pragmatic Hash and be happy you got anything at all.

    And wanting Romney to actaully act like a presumptive presidential nominee is asking him to apologize?

  220. “geoffb says May 19, 2012 at 12:12 am
    We are not North Korea, (though you never know about Arkansas) but if the Democrats can pull something similar in the general we will then be.”

    We used to be mean about Arkansas in central Texas too. I’m not sure why. It may have been the Longhorn Razorback rivalry of yore back when the Southwest conference was a thing.

    Anyway, I remember an uncle of mine getting in minor trouble at a barbecue for getting kind of sauced and saying that the Arkansas state motto was “Hey! We’re not ALL assholes!”. I don’t remember why everyone else was upset about it but I was eleven and kind of sleepy from the june heat.

  221. thank you

    so it’s more like a duck n cover sorta thing

  222. A followup to the NYT’s Ricketts plan pants-shitting articleCharles M. Blow weighs in today, ‘dissecting’ one sentence of that proposal, this…

    “The metrosexual black Abe Lincoln has emerged as a hyper-partisan, hyper-liberal, elitist politician with more than a bit of the trimmer in him.”

    Blow’s blowback…

    Now to the “hyper-partisan, hyper-liberal” accusation: false. Obama is a pragmatic, left-leaning centrist, much to the consternation of many devout liberals. Americans in the middle also see this, so efforts to paint him as an extremist will always fail.

    Romney used to be a pragmatic, right-leaning centrist. That was until he checked his principles and previous positions at the door so that he could cavort with the Tea Party.

    …seems to me, on it’s very face, absurdity times two.

    But is Blow correct in his assertion that the so-called ‘independent’ voters, the fat, dumb and happy ‘middle’, can’t possibly see Obama as we see him, lacking an interest in matters deeply p0litical; and that any effort we expend to expose Obama as the Cloward-Piven ‘Manchurian’ is doomed to sail right over their little carefree ‘Lost, with cupcakes’ heads? If TEA Party efforts (not the GOP’s halfhearted McCain-approved measures, those served with tea and petit fours) are bound to fail, then why does Blow and his ilk rush to Obama’s defense?

    I believe these so-called ‘Ricketts’ sorts of proposals need airing, if for nothing else than to expose the lightweights in ‘middle America’ what exactly is causing the ruination of this Republic.

    As for Romney being TEA Party ready, surely he can’t be in any way construed as that! If that’s truth, and the middletons fall for Obama’s minion’s paintings of Romney as another evil TEA Partier, then we once again will have lost the battle.

    That’d be two losses in one Blow back.

  223. Heh. Related

    Americans have started to connect a swarm of dots, revealing politics as the pattern. Even when this president crosses oceans, Americans see him putting politics first.

    Recently, in perhaps the most damning YouTube moment yet in a presidential race, Barack Obama was captured putting domestic politics ahead of foreign policy. He was caught on an open microphone, telling outgoing Russian Prime Minister Dmitry Medvedev that he would be more amenable to Russian interests on the issue of missile defense if he survived the November elections. “This is my last election,” Obama said. “After my election, I have more flexibility.”

    The president’s mask slipped. The politician beneath was revealed. Voters, including the president’s core female supporters, got to see what they had only suspected: Obama’s priorities aren’t necessarily theirs.

  224. A far better chance?

    Yes. A lame duck Obama will end America as we know it. He’ll put the pedal to the metal and take us over the cliff at top speed. Romney will putter along in that direction. He may even swerve this was and that. There is a possibility that America will survive President Romney. It will not survive President Obama’s second term.

    Any chance at all is far better than no chance whatsoever.

  225. The only reason I’d pull for Romney would be the fear I have of Supreme Court Justice Eric Holder (or his equivalent). Since there’s no reason for BHO to hold back next term, his appointment(s) wouldn’t need to be such ‘nice gals’ as he’s already installed.

    That very real factoid should make everyone’s sphincters tighten enough to rush to various polling places come November 6th.

    I’ll be happy to ship-to appropriate nose clips if necessary!

  226. From a Twitter linky

    The political gurus who advised Mitt Romney to condemn a plan by a “super PAC” to use Barack Obama’s influential relationship with the Rev. Jeremiah Wright against him in the 2012 campaign will lead the presumed Republican nominee to the same fate as John McCain four years ago, said talk-radio host Michael Savage.

    “Romney’s finished,” Savage told his “Savage Nation” audience yesterday. “He’s a fall guy. I’m the only one in the media who told you.”

    Savage said Romney was “being misdirected by the very same people who misdirected McCain – who should have won the last election.”

    “McCain said, ‘No, I won’t go there, I won’t do that,’ and lost the election.”

    Republicans in 2008 naturally voted for McCain, Savage explained, but the independents who decided the election “did not come out for him, because he was nothing but a two-faced RINO,” a Republican In Name Only.

    “I can only conclude Romney doesn’t even understand what he’s doing, or Romney is a straight-out fall guy for the Republican establishment, offered a huge payout at the end of the term in the form of contracts, books, lecture tours or whatever,” Savage said.

  227. Sometimes you’re left with only bad choices.

    a) your candidate is an imbecile
    b) the fix is in !

  228. I’m actually more at peace this year than I’ve been in any presidential election year. There not being any candidates still running that I really, really want to win, I can just sit back and eat popcorn.

    I am rooting for Obama to lose — it’s just that it doesn’t necessarily mean I have to root for somebody else to win.

  229. The GOP just squandered a once in a generation opportunity.

    Much to the relief of the party elders and their parasitic hangers-on, no doubt.

    I was unfortunate enough to be working during the Carter administration and remember that his amazing stewardship helped ushed in Reagan. Now Barry and Co. might help usher in Mitt Romney. And that’s supposed to help us how?

    To be fair, the GOP learned its lesson well from being forced to endure 2 Reagan terms: fuck the conservatives and libertarians. After all, who else are they gonna vote for?

  230. 2nd big goofy pussy in a row loses race the right way and kicks own party in the balls so people will think he’s classy. Gets called racist, cult freak, corrupt corporate scammer, rich boy, loser, and thus practically a nazi by the press, political hacks, and some leftist bloggers. Then he wonders why so many republicans (who he called idiots wackos and losers and blamed for his loss) don’t have his back as the media rides him out of town for good. Rinse. Repeat.

  231. “I can only conclude Romney doesn’t even understand what he’s doing, or Romney is a straight-out fall guy for the Republican establishment, offered a huge payout at the end of the term in the form of contracts, books, lecture tours or whatever,” Savage said.

    That’s just stupid. Romney’s worth approximately a quarter billion and he’s pulling $21 million a year on his investments. WTF are you going to pay him off with? Speaking tours? How much is John McCain making on speeches? Books? “He doesn’t know what he’s doing.” is plausible. “He’s bought.” is not.

  232. […]if later it is determined there was an error it can be corrected.

    Michigan has an operational time machine? Who knew?

    After all, how else are you going to be able to relive the years that you spent in jail?

  233. Something’s got under the skin of that little lady from Colorado…

    2. The Breitbart group AND the HotAir fools (Ed Morrisey and Allahpundit), ONCE AGAIN are pissing all over people who dare point out that Obama’s eligibility to hold the office of the Presidency is seriously, seriously in question. They are doing this in the same breath WHILE REPORTING THIS VERY STORY, which proves beyond any doubt whatsoever that Obama is a liar and con-artist.

    WHY? Why do these “conservatives” refuse to engage reality on this point?

    I know the answer, and I warn you, it is very depressing.

    These folks have made a BOATLOAD of money off of the Obama usurpation. Bottom line: Obama is good for business if you are a “conservative” blogger looking to advance your career and either move into a high-paying gig in the “mainstream media” OR attempting to establish a new-model business like Glenn Beck. It was reported (I think in Forbes) that Beck made a cool $80 million last year. Don’t think for a second that Morrisey, Allahpundit and the Breitbart Team aren’t salivating at the thought of seven-to-eight figure annual hauls.

    I actually believe that most of these folks are rooting for Obama to “win”, for whatever that means in a lawless electoral environment, in November because Obama is very, very good for their businesses. Think about yourself. Do you read more or less news now than you did four years ago? Oh, I’d be willing to bet that you read MULTIPLES of what you read four years ago. I do. No doubt.

    In order to get those page views, and thus that ad revenue, these folks want as much upheaval and fear among their readers as possible. Obama provides upheaval, fear and outrage in massive quantities. Thus more page views. Thus more income. If Romney is “elected”, many folks would stand down and traffic to sites like HotAir, Breitbart and Beck would curtail precipitously.

    But, BIRTHER~!

  234. Even if it were true that he was born in Kenya, as long as Dunham is his actual mother I think he would still be considered natural born.

  235. I’ve argued against the ‘birtherism’ clauses since that day in January 2009 that BHO (clumsily) took the oath, B Moe. Any attempt to invoke that was by then too late.

    Move along, little dogies!

  236. Pingback: Catholic Vote Beclowns Itself for Romney | The American Catholic

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