April 28, 2012

Irony Alert: Gay activist Dan Savage gives anti-bullying speech – bullies Christians and calls objecting students “pansies” [Darleen Click]

You just can’t make this stuff up

Earlier this month, over 2,000 high school journalism students gathered in a Seattle convention hall for a session they thought was on a popular web-based anti-bullying campaign. Instead, the speaker, founder of the “It Gets Better” project and sex columnist Dan Savage, used the platform on April 13 to slam the Bible and various religious groups, parade his relationship with his gay partner, and name-call over 100 students who got up and walked out in the middle of his speech.

Teachers, parents, and students have since complained about Savage’s crass language and off-topic ranting at the biannual Journalism Education Association’s National High School Journalism Conference.

“As a former journalist, I am generally open to other people’s points of view. But when he started getting vulgar and attacking, it was clearly over the age-group appropriateness,” said Rick Tuttle, a journalism teacher at Sutter High School in Northern California who brought six of his students. “Ironically he was talking about bullying, and he was bashing people.” […]

“People often point out that… they can’t help with the anti-gay bullying because it says right there in Leviticus, it says right there in Timothy, it says right there in Romans, that being gay is wrong,” Savage tells the crowd in a short video posted on Tumblr by a student attendee.

“We can learn to ignore the [expletive] in the Bible about gay people the same way we have learned to ignore the [expletive] in the Bible about shellfish, about slavery, about dinner, about farming, about menstruation, about virginity, about masturbation,” Savage said.

At this point, student Jenny Patterson yelled “That’s bull,” and walked out. As other students followed, Savage called them “pansies,” she said.

Patterson said she had put up with Savage’s cussing and “references to how good his husband looks in a Speedo and how he has to pry him off.” But his attacks on Catholics, Mormons, and Christians for their stance on homosexuality went too far.

“I didn’t come to hear someone preach to me about how wrong my beliefs are,” said Patterson, 17, who came with Sutter High’s Tuttle. “I don’t know what the agenda was behind [Savage’s] session, but it was unnecessary.”

But it was necessary, Jenny. Necessary for him to have you and your fellow students, who object to his practiced obscenities, publicly exposed.

h/t RS McCain

Posted by Darleen @ 9:14am
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Comments (385)

  1. Heh. Good for those kids for walking out. I have hope for the next generation.

  2. The JEA knew exactly what they were getting in this Dan Savage character. From their description of the conference:

    Exciting things happen here on the edge. What exciting idea will you come away with that will revolutionize the journalism industry?

    The convention we’ve organized is a map you can use to navigate to the edge without going off a cliff. With keynotes from Sizemore and Dan Savage, hundreds of instructional breakout sessions and workshops, live contests and awards, you’re sure to find the innovation and inspiration you’re looking for.

    We’ve brought you here, to the edge. Taking the next step is up to you.

    http://jea.org/seattle-spring-2012/

    Yeah, the edge. The god damned edge boys, that’s where it’s at. Tell all the high school freshmen.

    Say, speaking of calculated abuse of language for political power, Dan Savage is the guy who invented a new and filthy definition for the word Santorum, and now he and others cite that definition as if it were a humorous coincidence.

    http://books.google.com/books?id=cLCHP91oR_MC&pg=PT64&dq=Dan+Savage+creates+Santorum+contest&hl=en&sa=X&ei=6U5MT5KnEJLZiAKO4JSCDw&ved=0CEoQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=Dan%20Savage%20creates%20Santorum%20contest&f=false

    http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/SavageLove?oid=14267

  3. Dan Savage is quite obviously an idiot. I thank him for showing all future journalism majors how NOT to report a story.

  4. He’s not a journalist. He’s not even a bad one.

  5. there’s always some amount of obnoxious self-righteous christers wherever you go, but i think what’s obvious is that if in a hall of 2000 you only had 100 people walk out, then you can safely conclude that the vast majority of the christians in attendance were tolerant well-behaved nice people

  6. Count on christophobe HF to defend bullying as long as its against his preferred targets.

    Nothing says “how not to be a bully” like using obscene language and bigotry directed at high schoolers.

  7. Tolerance in the face of hateful intolerance like Savage is no virtue.

  8. oh please you can’t even do a class on evolution without some prissy christer walking out – they’re taught to do this from a young age -most of these people who went to hear the sinful homo talk and walked out? They had already intended to walk out at some point from the second they got there! Duh.

    It’s how they roll.

  9. Complete fucking BS Happyfeet

  10. i watched the video and i didn’t see anyone who was bullied – I saw a bunch of self-righteous losers who very badly wished someone would bully them so they could have more better material for the microphones what they immediately scurried towards

    christians are very quick to adapt the victim stance but somehow it’s always the gay kids what get beaten to bloody little gay pulps somehow or driven to kill themselves to where they’re denied entrance unto heaven

  11. Yes, Savage was the model for decorum.

  12. Savage was Savage he’s a known quantity really Mr. JD.

    very known.

    Infamous in some circles even.

    And I really believe that there were no small number amongst the Jenny Patterson posse who were a lot counting on Savage being Savage when they so innocently went to what they thought would be a nice christian chit-chat about how we should never ever bully the gay kids even though they are of course an abomination in the eyes of God.

  13. Happy, first of all, everyone was aware that Savage was gay, so all the “christians in attendance were tolerant well-behaved nice people”, before he started talking.

    Next, they only walked out when Savage deviated from a talk on bullying into an attack on Christianity. If I go to a talk expecting a certain subject, and it turns into something else, I have every right to walk out.

  14. if a bunch of homo childrens go to a Santorum rally and then walk out cause of he said offensive things, would a tree fall in a forest or would everyone just go get tasty breakfast burritos?

  15. If a bunch of “homo children” went to a speech Santorum was scheduled to give on foreign policy, and instead he started ripping them for being gay, they’d probably be pissed and you’d wear your fingers to a nub posting tasty self-righteous fury.

  16. that’s something of a hypothetical really

  17. It is sad that an anti-bullying speech to a conference of high schoolers became a platform for a hate-filled anti-tolerant rant against those that co not share his beliefs.

  18. that’s something of a hypothetical really

    No, not really.

    Take the name “Santorum” and change it to “Savage”, and change the sexual orientation of the “kids”, you have pretty much what happened.

    All these years you’ve been posting and you still suck at it, hf.

  19. is it true that people in real life point to stuff in the bible to justify hating on gay people or bracketing them from society in some way?

  20. I am seeing an awful lot of pots and kettles in this thread.

  21. Didn’t Savage create the Santorum google problem? Fuck him. He used his platform to hate on high school kids, and then displayed his bigotry, hatred, and bullying when they disapproved.

  22. So this fellow’s standing in the middle of a train track as the speedy-weighty locomotive approaches to mow him down when the thought occurs to him: “. . . dang that hang-nail is buggin’ me, shooting out tiny stabs of grief allatime. This would be a righteous moment to pull out my nail-clipper, sit down and take care of that frickity-frackity nuisance once and for all, since only that can make a start to making the world a better place. Yeah, that’s the ticket. . . . . . or no, actually, I think I need a beer analgesic first. ”

    And off he goes.

  23. Mr. JD I don’t see the “hating on” what I see is that these christian yoot are lying to make it look like they were “bullied” in some way… omg look at the title of this post! It passes along this deception unthinkingly.

    Deceivers!

    .

    At this point, student Jenny Patterson yelled “That’s bull,” and walked out. As other students followed, Savage called them “pansies,” she said.

    Is that what happened? Watch the video. At no point does Dan call them pansies. Later in the speech what he says is this….

    “You can tell the bible guys in the hall that they can come back now cause I’m done beating up the bible…. [clapping clapping cheering cheering] … It’s funny as someone who’s on the receiving end of beatings that are justified by the bible, how pansy-assed some people react when you push back.”

    which, honestly, I have no idea if Mr. Savage has ever been on the receiving end of a proper beating. He’s probably been on the receiving end of a lot of things bless his heart.

    But what I can tell you is that what you see in the video does not support what you are seeing printed in the lying christer press.

    As other students followed, Savage called them “pansies”…

    That is bullshit; it never happened. Watch the video. And it’s what the entire dishonest “gay man bullies christer children” meme is based upon.

  24. Darleen, how dare you defend people for not wanting to be a captive audience-slash-target for Savage’s longer-than-two-minute hate? You should have known how Happyfeet would react, and now you’ve made him feel unwelcome again by forcing him to spout off like a hater that it’s not at all possible for him to be!

    Shame, shame!

  25. thank you Mr. McGehee you get me

  26. Nothing ever changes.

  27. Is pointing out that a groups behavior is pansy- assed a gay slur?

  28. sdferr,

    You’d think that the son of a preacher would recognize a parable
    when he’s presented one.

    Wouldn’t ya?

  29. I think it’s worth noting that those high schoolers are probably a bit less proficient with reading, writing, and arithmetic than previous generations.

    Waste of money and time. They’re hiring a speaker and transporting kids to a central location to hear about a web-based campaign. On a topic that no employer anywhere gives a shit about. While half of them probably can’t handle basic math.

  30. So, some time elapsed before he called them pansy asses, therefore it is good? He admitted to beating up on the bible in an anti-bullying speech.

  31. is it true that people in real life point to stuff in the bible to justify hating on gay people or bracketing them from society in some way?

    Maybe, but it sounds hackneyed and pedestrian. My go-to play is to point to public health statistics. Now, if the psychological profession were ever unshackled from the oppression of the lavender mafia, I’d have way better stuff.

    Prop H8 forevers!!!111!!!1!!!

  32. it doesn’t justify charging him with the offense of “bullying” is all Mr. JD – they can charge him with bad taste – but they’re the ones what went to a Dan Savage speech so that might could backfire – they can also charge him with tendentiousness

    but if they’re going to charge someone with tendentiousness thay should strive a lot harder to accurately portray what Mr. Savage said

  33. Does hf come here for any reason anymore other than to kick over sandcastles?

  34. See,

    bh knows how to apply a parable. Prolly the catholic school upbringing (or the years of intense hall-monitor training;)

  35. i was trying to engage in a spirited discussion of the EPA’s vicious assault on the fair state of Texas but there were no takers Mr. Leamas so I thought I’d poke my head in here

  36. Pingback: Students Walk Out After Anti-Bullying Speaker Dan Savage Calls Bible ‘Bulls–t’ : The Other McCain

  37. it doesn’t justify charging him with the offense of “bullying” is all Mr. JD – they can charge him with bad taste – but they’re the ones what went to a Dan Savage speech so that might could backfire – they can also charge him with tendentiousness

    Bullying is bullshit. It’s just a misdirection so that most people won’t see that what you’re really talking about is reeducation of other people’s captive children in public schools, where the LBTGL activists get to speak and someone else’s kids are made to listen. If they speak to the contrary, it is “bullying.” From the people who brought you the Berkeley Free Speech Movement.

  38. questions for the group

    1. are we really certain that none of the Jenny Patterson posse attended Mr. Savage’s speech with the express intention of walking out en masse at some point? How can we be sure?

    2. did what Dan Savage said really and truly fit the commonly understood definition of bullying? Maybe Mr. Leamas would like to tackle this one.

    3. Do people have a right not to be offended? Should Dan have self-censored his message so as not to cause offense to a minority of his audience?

  39. That they even hired an insane twink like Savage says all you need to know about this conference. He’s a very disturbed little man.

    The mistake the Christians made was being in the audience in the first place. He deserves none of their time or respect.

  40. it doesn’t justify charging him with the offense of “bullying”

    ‘Cuz bullying is like the worst thing imaginable. Calling somebody a bully is even worse than calling somebody a murderer, or even raaaaacist. In fact, calling somebody a bully is bullying!

    Cupcakes!

  41. 2. did what Dan Savage said really and truly fit the commonly understood definition of bullying? Maybe Mr. Leamas would like to tackle this one.

    Disturbed Dan trashing the beliefs of high-school age Christians (and deliberately misinterpreting what the Bible says in the process)?

    Pretty much the definition, yes. But that’s OK, because you think the First Amendment should be limited to freedom of worship–“the Happy Rule,” as you call it.

    Do people have a right to not be offended? No.

    But Dan the Doorknob Licker seems to think so, because he regards any criticism of homosexuality as bullying. So you really need to pose the question to him.

  42. 1. are we really certain that none of the Jenny Patterson posse attended Mr. Savage’s speech with the express intention of walking out en masse at some point? How can we be sure?

    Shall we convict them of doing so unless they can prove their innocence?

    2. did what Dan Savage said really and truly fit the commonly understood definition of bullying? Maybe Mr. Leamas would like to tackle this one.

    He was standing up on a stage with a microphone and the full attention of thousands of people to whom he was expressing a hateful and demeaning opinion. I could be wrong but I seem to recall seeing films of rallies like that in places like Berlin and Nuremberg back in the 1930s, which was over 100 years ago and the guy talking was speaking in a dialect of English so archaic it sounded downright foreign.

  43. Seems Alec has recognzed another lesson related to sdferr’s parable.

  44. ‘Cuz bullying is like the worst thing imaginable. Calling somebody a bully is even worse than calling somebody a murderer, or even raaaaacist. In fact, calling somebody a bully is bullying!

    Cupcakes!

    On a tangential note, the narrative template is that “homophobia” leads to suicide, but “Islamophobia” leads to homicide. Odd, that.

  45. I think Dan Savage’s intent was pretty much obvious.

  46. what did Mr. Savage say that was hateful Mr. McGehee? Would you please offer quotes of what Mr. Dan said to support a characterization of his speech as hateful?

  47. Since we’re convicting the kids of going to his speech with the intent of staging a walkout, despite having no evidence, I think you’re obligated to accept my accusation without evidence as well.

  48. “People often point out that… they can’t help with the anti-gay bullying because it says right there in Leviticus, it says right there in Timothy, it says right there in Romans, that being gay is wrong,” Savage tells the crowd in a short video posted on Tumblr by a student attendee.

    “We can learn to ignore the [expletive] in the Bible about gay people the same way we have learned to ignore the [expletive] in the Bible about shellfish, about slavery, about dinner, about farming, about menstruation, about virginity, about masturbation,” Savage said.

    Mocking the beliefs of others is generally regarded as hateful, unless, of course, you agree with the mocker. And his methods. As does hf.

  49. Unless he was carrying iced tea and Skittles.

  50. “We can learn to ignore the bullshit in the Bible about gay people the same way we have learned to ignore the bullshit in the Bible about shellfish, about slavery, about dinner, about farming, about menstruation, about virginity, about masturbation.”

    seems to me he’s arguing against citing the bible for to justify bullying gay people – now, this might be a red herring, but it’s not hateful per se I don’t think. I think it’s easy to imagine people citing the bible for to justify bullying gay people, but I can’t say I actually know anyone what does this.

  51. I think it’s easy to imagine

    And that’s all the evidence you need.

  52. It’s okay, Mr. Savage, you’re okay without the iced tea and Skittles, Happyfeet has found you a loophole.

  53. Right–because the thugs who murdered Mathew Shepard were recorded 1 Timothy as they did so.

    It’s not just a red herring, it’s fraudulent bullshit. Declaiming to a young audience that their religion’s central text motivates violence against gays is Christian bashing.

    But not bullying, which is bad.

    So it’s all good in the Savage ‘hood. Thumbs up from hf.

  54. Mocking the beliefs of others is generally regarded as hateful, unless, of course, you agree with the mocker. And his methods. As does hf.

    Mr. Price how many people do you know follow old testament laws about tasty shrimps of masturbations or slavery? I don’t know anybody even if I think back to people I knew in rural south texas. We for sure loved our gumbo and our all you can eat fried shrimp fridays. Mr. Dan wasn’t mocking anyone’s beliefs other than the belief that just the odd splatches of Bible what forbade homosexuality should be heeded but not all the other stuff about shrimps and jacking off and enslaving people.

  55. You’re as good an exegete as Mr. Savage. Do you actually understand those prohibitions (apparently not, as the OT says nothing about masturbation–oops).

    OT: Also not bullying in hf’s world.

    http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2012/04/vandals_break_windows_at_south.html

  56. Christians and Old Testament law?

  57. On a recent episode of “The 700 Club,” Pat Robertson told viewers that Christians shouldn’t bully gay students, but reach out to them in love.

    The televangelist stated that such bullying is wrong, regardless of a person’s orientation.

    “You may disagree, you may think these practices are an abomination, you can think all sorts of things, but you need to love and reach out to these kids in love,” he said.*

    preach it brother robertson!

    Question for the group! How does Mr. Pastor Robertson’s message above differ from Mr. Savage’s message?

    Compare and contrast.

  58. I think it might be more useful for you to compare and contrast the messages, ‘feets.

  59. Question for the group! How does Mr. Pastor Robertson’s message above differ from Mr. Savage’s message?

    Compare and contrast.

    You first. I’m beginning to think you suffer from a closed head injury.

  60. When was Savage “beaten” for being a homo? Is there documentation? Photographic evidence? Or is this, as I suspect, embroidery of a taunting incident in middle school?

  61. Mr. Savage is saying if we don’t follow stupid bible stuff in one place why should we floow it just for to justify hating on gay people.

    Mr. Robertson is saying you can belive all that stupid stuff if you want, but don’t for a second think it can justify hating on gay people.

    They’re both arguing against citing the bible to hate on gay people. This idea offended the little christian bitch for some reason.

  62. Likewise, I’d like to hear any sort of evidence that Christians think gay kids should be picked on. Christians have a rather consistent stance on the whole “don’t be a dick” issue. They even think you shouldn’t be a dick to the fat kids and the paste eaters.

  63. When was Savage “beaten” for being a homo?

    I couldn’t find any evidence of this

  64. *follow it*

  65. *believe*

  66. Fun fact for Dan (and those who find the shellfish argument compelling): that same section of Leviticus also says to show hospitality to strangers and not screw your sister.

    Follow-up question: why do you feel the need to mock observant Jews?

  67. Dont bully Jane Austen; Jane Austen is your friend. But then, so is Lucretius.

    “. . . OT says nothing about masturbation. . . ”

    Wait, what was that business in Jonah 4 about the people who couldn’t tell their right hand from their left then?

  68. Dale mentioned it above but are you unaware of the nature of the relationship that Christians have with the Old Testament? It seems like Savage is.

    Christians haven’t decided to ignore the Bible about shellfish. It simply doesn’t apply to them.

  69. apparently there was some mix-up about Mr. Onan

  70. Likewise, I’d like to hear any sort of evidence that Christians think gay kids should be picked on. Christians have a rather consistent stance on the whole “don’t be a dick” issue. They even think you shouldn’t be a dick to the fat kids and the paste eaters.

    Bingo, to use the Catholic term.

    But Dan’s vigilant well-past the point of contempt, and gutlessly so, because he knows the “little Christian bitch” (per hf) isn’t going to beat the shit out of him.

    Unlike, say, recent immigrants to Amsterdam.

    At least hf is honest enough to drop the mask, which is welcome clarification.

  71. Christians haven’t decided to ignore the Bible about shellfish. It simply doesn’t apply to them.

    Mr. Savage is saying yeah but then why do some christians choose take the bible to heart about homosexuality being all abominationy and whatnot?

    He’s suggesting they should please stop doing that.

  72. oh please Mr. Price that nasty little christian bitch scooted her sick little christian ass right out of that hall to a microphone where she immediately bore false witness against Mr. Dan

    As other students followed, Savage called them “pansies,” she said.

    That is a lie and you are damned liar Jenny Patterson.

  73. Mr. Price how many people do you know follow old testament laws about tasty shrimps of masturbations or slavery?

    good lord, again HF’s anti-semitic/christophobia blinds him to what those passages are about

    THEY ARE NOT FOR GENTILES. It was rules for the JOOOOOS (and, again, Jesus was a Jew and Christians were an offshoot of Judaism)

    You’re not Jewish? Well chow down on all the crab and lobster you like. You’re just not a member of the club.

    But see, haters like HF and Savage do not like there are other clubs with their own beliefs and traditions.

    Thus the Taliban smashed the Buddha sculptures, just like Savage and HF want to smash the faces of the Jenny Pattersons.

  74. that nasty little christian bitch scooted her sick little christian ass

    #waronwomen indeed.

  75. so it’s just the mentions in leviticus about gay people specifically what are intended for gentile ears darleen?

    that seems like a difficult-to-defend proposition on the face of it

  76. homosexuality being all abominationy

    homosexual ACTs, hf.

    Behavior, not “orientation”

    and I don’t think any speaker telling kids about his own sex life is appropriate either straight or gay

    Mr. Savage trying to groom some twinks for a little afternoon assignation after the conference?

  77. mentions in leviticus about gay people

    It’s about male sexual behavior, hf. Not about gay people.

  78. Darleen is this statement in fact true?

    As other students followed, Savage called them “pansies,” she said.

    Would you please show me the timestamp in the video of where this can be said to occur, because I think it’s a dishonest statement, and I think it forms the whole basis of the charge that Mr. Dan is a “bully,” which I don’t think is a charge what has evidence to support it.

  79. It’s about male sexual behavior, hf. Not about gay people.

    Darleen the Bible says you should kill homos. To death. Not to kill homosexual acts. The Bible says you need to pro-actively kill people when you find out they’ve had the gay sex.

  80. If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

  81. It is her fault Savage attacked them. He admitted to attacking their beliefs, and absolutely did call them pansy asses, but that elapsed time seems to be at issue. Robertson said love the sinner, hate the sin. Savage said disregard your religion’s teachings because it is dumb.

  82. that was New International here is King James:

    If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

    and here is the Hatioan Creole version:

    Depi yon nonm kouche yon nonm tankou li ta fè l’ ak yon fanm, sa yo fè la a se bagay Bondye pi pa vle we. Se pou yo touye tou de. Lè konsa, se yo menm sèl k’ap reskonsab lanmò yo.

  83. If one has a captive audience that is there because you have come to say “X” but you go off on an obviously staged, obscene-filled rant about your sex life and hating on people you know are going to be in the audience, ramping it up until some finally leave then call them “pansy-assed” (which a gentler person will translate into “pansy”)

    then yes, you may be a bully (and a bigot and a generally NotGoodPerson)

  84. *Haitian Creole* I mean

  85. It’s not a topic that I ever cared enough about to research and I just don’t remember much — if any — discussion about gay people when I was in parochial school so I went and googled “New Testament homosexuality”.

    Here’s a wiki page devoted to the topic. I won’t pretend to be well enough versed in the matter to tell if the page is useful or full of nonsense. But, it does seem like the gay sex prohibition carried over.

  86. Teachings of the Old Testament are not applicable to Christians. In Catholic liturgy, there are two lessons read each week. The first is from the Old Testament and the second from the New Testament. Both are then followed by the reading of the Gospel and the Homily both of which are delivered by the priest.

    The Old Testament fortells the coming of the Christ. It is used in that manner to inform the New Testament and to fulfill the prophcy of the coming of the Son of God.

    Stuff about shellfish and pork are for Orthodox Jews and people who are allergic to iodine.

    Onanism is a misreading of Onan “spilled his seed” which was a biblical way of saying, he pulled out so as not to impregnate his brother’s wife whom he had been forced to marry when the brother died. It was a line of succession thing with Onan, who didn’t want to have kids with his brother’s wife who would according to law at that time, would be considered to be his brother’s children. God smote him for being selfish.

    There is nothing in Christian teaching about hatin’ on any group of people. We’re all about salvation.

  87. he didn’t call them anything until after they’d already left Mr. JD, so what he said about some people’s ractions being pansy-assed was not a factor in why they walked out, nor was it “bullying,” in that they had already left by the time he got to that part – so how were they bullied?

    What harm did they suffer? How were they made to feel threatened in any way?

  88. You know the best thing is that I’ll bet out-raged fueled contributions to everyone involved are way up because of this.

    They should take this show on the road.

  89. I’m not saying Mr. Dan is a good person I’m saying if you’re a prissy christer going to a Dan Savage speech and you get your ass offended, well there you go

    but you weren’t bullied were you? No you weren’t.

  90. *reactions* I mean

  91. 2. did what Dan Savage said really and truly fit the commonly understood definition of bullying? Maybe Mr. Leamas would like to tackle this one.

    It sure as hell fits the new, trendy definition of “bullying.” See also, Darleen’s original post.

    The asymmetry here though is that we don’t get to sit Savage down on his capacious ass and reeducate him until his will and spirit are broken and he has to say the “correct” things, as defined by the people who disagree with him.

  92. I would certainly hope you aren’t trying to defend Dan Savage’s actions, all evidence to the contrary in this thread.

    It’s cocksuckers like him who give fags a bad name.

  93. 1. are we really certain that none of the Jenny Patterson posse attended Mr. Savage’s speech with the express intention of walking out en masse at some point? How can we be sure?

    We can be sure because his talk was scheduled to be about bullying, not religion or sexual preference.

    Unless you are suggesting these kids knew a typical gay man would, as a typical gay man, go off-topic to bash Christianity and do all that nasty sex talk, like they always do.

    ….are you?

  94. those kids looked deiant and smirky as they walked out Mr. Leamas, not bullied

    did you watch the video?

  95. If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable.

    Describing an act, not an orientation.

    You might look at history, REAL history not that Leftist revisionist social studies that are rooting around for all those forgotten cross-dressers of the Revolutionary War and realize that Jews were a struggling people, being monotheistic in a polytheistic world, and their traditions were to keep them separate and to promote one of the best things to happen to women and children up til then

    Monogamy

    So men had to be forbidden to engage in other relationships besides committed monogamy with women

    In Greek and Roman culture, homosexual ACTS were considered part of a male citizen’s prerogative … even expected of upper class men in proof of their dominance (though “marriage” to same sex was unheard of and forbidden because it did not produce progeny). In such a society, women had a status just above slaves (and slaves could actually earn their freedom and become respected citizens, women’s status never improved)

    The idea of a “gay sexual orientation” in ancient history is unknown. Period.

    Jews needed to keep their culture alive, separate from the hostile societies in which they found themselves and to reproduce

    so channeling a man’s sexuality exclusively towards his wife – “make one flesh” rather than the bifurcating of family and pleasure – was necessary.

    Certainly the “sex liberation” ala the 60s and the consequential sheering of cultural mores in regards from our honor to our commitments to “whatever FEELS good” has had devastating consequences. Especially for the young.

  96. *defiant* I mean

  97. Describing an act, not an orientation.

    yes Darleen but God wants us to murder the actual people with the orientation what commit the acts, not to simply eschew the acts

  98. How does one look when one is bullied? Is there a template? A continuum?

    Is it like a Jedi mind trick where you can tell who is a bully and who was bullied just by looking at a photo or a snip of video?

    If I say I was bullied, must you believe me until I’m proved a liar? Aren’t those who shreik “LIAR!” bullies?

    And so on…

  99. I’m not saying Mr. Dan is a good person I’m saying if you’re a prissy christer going to a Dan Savage speech and you get your ass offended, well there you go

    but you weren’t bullied were you? No you weren’t.

    I see. The mistake was in expecting that a homosexual could engage civilly in the arena of ideas with people who may not agree with him rather than taking the opportunity of an assembly hall full of minors to camp it up like the Queen bitch that we would all be bigots for thinking he was in the first place.

    hf is evidence that Rube Goldberg dabbled in neuroscience at some point.

  100. God wants us to murder the actual people with the orientation what commit the acts…

    That is a lie. God wants us to do no such thing.

  101. Mr. Tom I’m suggesting that Mr. Savage has a reputation of being abrasive and crude and not at all accommodating of your more refined religious sensibilities, and that I think the Jenny Patterson posse was fully aware that they might would hear Offensive Sentiments in the course of his speech, and I think that they in fact anticipated hearing such

  102. How does one look when one is bullied? Is there a template? A continuum?

    watch the video, leigh… the smirky self-righteousness emblazoned on these brats’ faces is for sure NOT how one looks when one is bullied

  103. Mr. Tom I’m suggesting that Mr. Savage has a reputation of being abrasive and crude and not at all accommodating of your more refined religious sensibilities, and that I think the Jenny Patterson posse was fully aware that they might would hear Offensive Sentiments in the course of his speech, and I think that they in fact anticipated hearing such

    Well, christers have a “reputation of being abrasive and crude and not at all accommodating” to homosex, so the homofags should best just steer clear of them.

    Bullying epidemic be solved!

  104. God wants us to do no such thing.

    that’s what Mr. Dan was trying to say too

  105. I think the Jenny Patterson posse was fully aware that they might would hear Offensive Sentiments in the course of his speech,

    What orifice are you pulling that out of? That wasn’t how he was billed. This wasn’t MTV, this was for journalism high school students about bullying in high school.

    It wasn’t billed as a Pink Nazi rally.

  106. This was supposed to be an anti-bullying speech at a high school journalism conference. That is list on Happyfeet for some reason. They didn’t just wake up and say “I want to go see Dan savage mock Christianity”.

  107. If that is what he was trying to say, why does it take so much interpretation?

    Perhaps he should take some public speaking courses so as to make himself more clear in delivering his message.

  108. leigh

    Notice how bigotfeet completely ignores Jewish history? It’s SO more than 100 years ago. Can’t be of any use in such a swell modern world.

  109. that’s what Mr. Dan was trying to say too

    That is not at all what Mr Dan was saying.

  110. that’s what Mr. Dan was trying to say too

    No. The human bicycle seat wants everyone else to say that God don’t abhor it even though that is not true.

    Just because he won’t kill you for eating shrimp doesn’t mean that Uncle Sugar needs to recognize, solemnize and celebrate Crustacean Marriages.

  111. This was supposed to be an anti-bullying speech at a high school journalism conference.

    how was this not an anti-bullying speech Mr. JD? – the video is clear – he’s saying that you’re not opposed to cite the bible for to justify bullying

    now.. was this gratuitous or wholly unneccessary? Maybe. We’ve already noted that he failed to adduce any examples where people have cited the bible for to justify their bullying ways, and so far nobody has found one to adduce here.

    But his speech was hardly a bullying act itself, and it was obnoxious for the dippy children to behave as if they had been victimized. They heard something they didn’t like; they walked out. End of story.

    But no.

    Then they launched a dishonest media campaign whereby they tried to tar Mr. Dan with the appellation of “bully.”

    Nasty piece of work, this Jenny Patterson.

  112. watch the video, leigh… the smirky self-righteousness emblazoned on these brats’ faces is for sure NOT how one looks when one is bullied

    What you’re saying is that they look like gay anti-bullying complainers/campaigners, if I understand your meaning.

  113. how was this not an anti-bullying speech Mr. JD? – the video is clear – he’s saying that you’re not [s]opposed to cite the bible for to justify bullying

    He’s saying that citing the Bible is bullying, dipshit.

  114. HF, maybe the kids were just “speaking up against hate and intolerance whenever I see it”?
    _____________________________
    JOIN OUR MOVEMENT – TAKE THE PLEDGE: Everyone deserves to be respected for who they are. I pledge to spread this message to my friends, family and neighbors. I’ll speak up against hate and intolerance whenever I see it, at school and at work. I’ll provide hope for lesbian, gay, bi, trans and other bullied teens by letting them know that “It Gets Better.”
    _____________________________

    Or doesn’t that work for God-botherers?

  115. Then they launched a dishonest media campaign whereby they tried to tar Mr. Dan with the appellation of “bully.”

    ” . . . for all that take the dishonest media campaign shall perish with the dishonest media campaign.”

    Matthew 26:52

  116. Darleen, it’s certainly trying, this trying to be patient with him. Especially when he thinks he’s outsmarting all of us. There is no need to take a contrary position on everything just to be contrary.

  117. Mr. Tom the kids have every right to speak up and explain how it’s offensive to them when someone says it’s “bullshit” how the bible says we should kill gay people.

    They don’t have a right to lie about what happened in that hall. They were not bullied.

  118. Mr. Tom I’m suggesting that Mr. Savage has a reputation of being abrasive and crude and not at all accommodating of your more refined religious sensibilities, and that I think the Jenny Patterson posse was fully aware that they might would hear Offensive Sentiments in the course of his speech, and I think that they in fact anticipated hearing such

    Go ahead to Savage’s ‘IT GETS BETTER’ website and find that abrasiveness and crudeness. Otherwise, you’re just making stuff up.

    But I am heartwarmed at the sight of you beating up a teenage girl’s reputation in order to save your boy’s ass. (as it were)

  119. Mr. Tom I still think those kids were fully aware of who Mr. Savage was and that they planned to walk out before they even sat down.

  120. My high school friend, now facebook friend, is all about the gay marriage. I have tried to have a reasonable discussion with her about why this idea, while trendy in some circles, isn’t going to fly outside of that circle. It’s like chasing a rainbow, pun intended.

    She cannot/will not, I am not sure which, understand that tolerating an alternative lifestyle is not the same as embracing and celebrating it, and the majority is going to draw a line in the sand about their level of tolerance. She, like Dan Savage, resorts to trashing people of faith, rathering than making a rational case for her POV. She is not arguing in good faith and neither is Dan Savage.

    Screaming “Bigot!” is a sign that you have lost the argument. Bigot is the new Hitler.

  121. They don’t have a right to lie about what happened in that hall.

    And what was the lie?

    Mr. Tom I still think those kids were fully aware of who Mr. Savage was and that they planned to walk out before they even sat down.

    And I think you are talking out of your ass because the person who is primarily quoted in the article is a public school teacher, not a kid.

    ..ooooops.

  122. GOProud wants Dan to say he’s very sorry.

    Jimmy LaSalvia, executive director of GOProud, called those statements “outrageous” and demanded an apology.

    “Dan Savage should apologize for his comments and should apologize to the high school students in attendance whom he called ‘pansy-asses,’” continued LaSalvia. “It is ironic that someone whose claim to fame is fighting bullying would resort to bullying tactics in attacking high school students who were offended by his outrageous remarks.”

    LaSalvia said people of faith should be treated with respect.

    “Dan Savage’s outrageous anti-Christian tirade hurts – not helps – the fight for gay rights in this country,” LaSalvia said in a statement. “There is nothing incompatible between being a Christian and believing that all people should be treated equally, and Dan Savage’s attacks on Christianity only fuel those on the extremist fringe who oppose gay rights.”

  123. Mr. Tom I still think those kids were fully aware of who Mr. Savage was and that they planned to walk out before they even sat down.

    “Think” DNE “imagine based upon my latent hatred of people who disagree with me on this issue based upon no evidence other than my mind-reading abilities”

    happyfeet – unless Amynda Marcotte loaned you her mind reading machine? Do tell.

  124. They were not bullied.

    Savage’s obvious bigotry is bullying … by his own standards.

  125. Jimmy is outraged.

  126. He ought to be.

  127. I think this might be one of those agree to disagree issues

  128. Savage’s obvious bigotry is bullying … by his own standards.

    And you agree with him.

  129. Jimmy is outraged.

    He is almost there. Once he is offended the circle will be complete.

  130. No, happy, I am not going to agree to disagree. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. Savage can’t have it both ways.

    He is intolerant and by his own argument, that makes him a bully.

  131. Well I think the wee christer childrens are being a bit hyper-sensitive at best, and downright dishonest at worst.

  132. Do you blame them for being sensitive? They’re kids and he’s saying things about “their fucking bible”? Dishonest? Not anymore than Savage with his “beating” story.

  133. Yawn. Savage bashes the Bible, which is nothing new for the “bold and creative” left.

    Get back to me when Savage takes on the Koran.

    For all the talk about the intolerance of Christians, it certainly seems that a lot of people get away with bashing Christians.

    Happy, I generally leave you alone. However, you’re way out of line on this one. You’d be doing yourself a favor if you ignored any threads that talk about Christians and Christianity.

  134. B Moe

    I can point out Savages hypocrisy without completely accepting his standards.

    I believe those students who walked out were justified … it was bait-n-switch time by Savage.

    I was in a position once in high school where, during what was billed as a So. California history lecture, listened to a Mexican-American teacher rant and scream at the white kids in class about our “guilt” in stealing California from its rightful owners and that nothing we could do with the rest of our lives could ever fully make up for our genocidal ancestors. I couldn’t walk out and when I actually challenged (I raised my hand first during the Q&A afterwards, so there was no interrupting) him I was mocked and told to shut up.

  135. Blake, the homos will never take on the Muzzies. The muzzies don’t play that game and will chop off their heads and their nethers.

    It’s like expecting the radical feminists to make a stink about how the women of Islam are treated. *crickets*

  136. I believe those students who walked out were justified

    the kids don’t need a justification to walk out – though they were the ones who most needed to hear the speech I think.

    But lying about it after by claiming they were bullied out of the hall is not at all commendable.

  137. Mr. Blake I think it’s creepy how christianity, led by saucy tarts like our new friend Jenny Patterson, is increasingly defining itself as an anti-gay institution. I don’t think we should accept this definition of christianity at all.

  138. Lying about getting your ass beaten like Matthew Shephard without the dying tied to a fence part, is pretty bad, too.

    The kids can hear that speech or a variant everytimne they watch MTV or hear a public service announcment.

    The kids were holding up a mirror to Savage and he didn’t like what he saw. Since when is calling anyone a “pansy ass” in a public forum okay?

    Maybe Savage is just asking for that ass-whoopin’ so he can quit lying about it.

  139. I just see both sides playing the same game.

    You can’t criticize someone, or something, without hating and bashing and being intolerant and offensive.

    Which means you can’t have discussions you just shit fling shit and one another and bitch about who started it or who does it more.

  140. Matthew Shephard was that little gay kid in Montana what got murdered right?

  141. Damn. I need more coffee.

  142. Well, I’ve been away, for various reasons, and I guess I missed a lot in the meantime.

    Sadly, the reason I haven’t had much interest in returning is still here, spouting his usual mindless bigoted gobbledegook.

  143. google says it’s *Shepard*

  144. I don’t think we should accept this definition of christianity at all.

    No one is. I work with a lot of children and they are a lot more tolerant than you’re giving them credit for.

    I’ll submit that working around a demonstrably larger than normal percentage of homos than do most of us, is warping your thinking on this topic.

    When was the last time a fag got a beat-down just for being a fag and not for being an asshole? Asshole get beat up pretty regularly in real life.

  145. Shepard/Shephard. Anyway, that story is a distortion of the facts, as well. A drug deal gone bad and a dead kid becomes a cause celebre for the gay activists. He didn’t get killed for being gay. He got killed for trying to cheat two guys who’d been snorting crank for three days and decided to take it out on his hide.

  146. I think happyfeet’s brain is warped by the fact that living in Texas and then LA is like never being in America at all.

  147. After reading all of this, it’s difficult to wrap my own mind around the fact that happyfeet is, like me, a native of South Texas.

  148. I am going to violate my own strict non-engagement policy to point out that hf is talking out his ass. Savage is a bully and a hater.

  149. When was the last time a fag got a beat-down just for being a fag and not for being an asshole?

    here is a little gay kid what killed himself recently cause of the bullies but I don’t think he got a beatdown per se, just harassment and death threats.

    Mr. Savage says bullying is wrong and me I believe him.

  150. Mr. Savage says bullying is wrong and me I believe him.

    Bullying is wrong. Savage should take his own advice.

  151. Was he bullied because he fancied cock? Or was he bullied because he was an effeminate pussy? Because I’m all for tormenting pussies. It’s organic, locally-sourced and Darwinian n’ shit. Besides, where would the arts be without sensitive pussies being tormented as children?

  152. that brusque demeanor hides a sensitive soul Mr. Froman you’d no sooner torment a little gay kid than you’d not tip your bartender it’s just not how you roll

  153. He’ll probably be immortalized in film. Lionized that pervert Harvey Milk who was friends with Jim Jones of Jonestown fame.

  154. but yeah I think this one was more in the effeminate pussy camp

  155. If he’d just manned up, he’d still be with us. Being an effeminate pussy is no way to get through high school.

  156. here is a song about Jim Jones leigh I don’t know if you were here when I linked it the other day it’s an oddly cheering ditty

  157. I’m not taking about tormenting gays. I’m talking about the standard childhood behavior of thinning the herd. Nobody wants the booger eating moron or the twerp who plays with dolls on their wiffle ball team.

  158. I was going to say you are wasting your time, ‘feets. But you have exposed some ugliness here I wasn’t aware of.

    It seems Rev. Phelps would have some allies here if he would just tone it down a bit.

  159. Fred Phelps is an idiot. I certainly doubt that he would find any allies here.

  160. I guess the question Mr. Moe is if Mr. Savage’s message is the wrong one ok fine… what’s the message Miss “I put up with his references to how good his husband looks in a speedo” Patterson thinks people should hear?

  161. It was apropriate for the audience.

  162. Really, leigh? Because I think this is right up ole’ Fred’s alley.

    If he’d just manned up, he’d still be with us. Being an effeminate pussy is no way to get through high school.

  163. Everything I read about Savage or Patterson is they were two idiots made for each other. In fact, they depend on each other for existence.

    What I don’t get is this whole fucking thread on what is normally one of the more intelligent blogs on the nets.

  164. Why are you presuming that effeminate pussy equals gay, B Moe? I certainly wasn’t suggesting anything of the sort.

  165. personally I think Darleen starts looking for these sorts of posts when i’m around cause she knows I’ll say hey there one second I have an alternative viewpoint and hilarity will ensue

  166. I went to school with a kid that had Tourettes. Nobody knew what the hell it was back then, we just knew Ronnie was kind of weird. Most of the time he was okay though, so people just dealt with it. This included him yelling “fuck” occasionally during class.

    A few decades earlier, it would have been acceptable, and likely encouraged, to beat the shit out of him because he was possessed by demons.

    Being possessed by demons is no way to go through life, you know.

  167. what’s the message Miss “I put up with his references to how good his husband looks in a speedo” Patterson thinks people should hear?

    How about “truth in advertising”?

    I come to hear a lecture billed “Risk Management for Supervisors in Law Enforcement” I don’t want nor expect to hear the lecturer go off on how “hot” his wife is in a bikini and what a sex maniac she is that he has to pry her off him.

  168. I don’t really care, Abe. I am disgusted that you think it is okay to beat someone up for either reason.

    I wasn’t raised that way.

  169. personally I think Darleen starts looking for these sorts of posts when i’m around

    Yes, hf, my life revolves around you. I wake up each morning thinking “what can I post that will get on hf’s last nerve?”

    Cuz in all the glorious calm of your absence I never once posted on stuff like this. EVAH.

  170. Jim Jones was bullied for a weirdo as a child in elementary school. I had a friend who went to school with him and sat on the curb one afternoon attempting to comfort him while he cried about the bullies. She told me the story the day the Jonestown story broke.

  171. I’m being flippant, B Moe. The point, really, is that I find the whole notion that human nature – as revealed by children – has much of anything to do with Christians and an anti-gay agenda.

  172. B Moe

    How is Patterson the equivalent of Savage? Does she have a TV show? She is 17 years old. She felt betrayed by the organizers who sucked her into having to sit there and be hectored and mocked when she thought she was coming to a lecture on an anti-bullying campaign.

    I disagree with Abe … no one ever deserves to be “beat up” just because they are different.

    But that includes kids that are Mormon or Jews who don’t belong to the cool Pink Nazi club that mocks their yarmulkes or “magic underwear”.

    I was 5’7″ by the time I was 12 y/o and … funny thing, as I went through the hell of jr high, my height actually allowed me to stick up for the littler kids.

    Why I shouldn’t I point out the irony of Savage’s hypocrisy .. especially since he’s going after high school kids.

  173. Does it ever occur to anyone that, by allowing/encouraging/accepting arrogant anti-social behavior by the public faces of all the left’s favored identity groups, the very stereotypes of these groups, which the left is supposed to be fighting to eliminate, are verified and reinforced?

    Isn’t it possible that this is a feature not a bug because it keeps the groups from ever being really assimilated into the general society, which if it ever happened would result in the loss of power by those very self same public faces and the left’s non-identity group overall leadership.

  174. Really, leigh? Because I think this is right up ole’ Fred’s alley.

    Really BMoe? Kids have been picked on since there have been kids. Most boys don’t like boys who act like girls. When I said “man up”, I meant quit whining about it and making it his cross to bear. I knew several gay kids in high school and they were popular kids or at least had a load of friends. If kids could deal back in the day (70s), what has happened that the little darlings can’t cut it today? It’s not like high school kids were more tolerant then, than now. We didn’t have grief counselors when one of our classmates got killed in a car accident, either. There were a few kids who committed suicide, as well. It was terrible for their families, but we went to the funerals and soldiered on.

    As to your classmate with Tourette’s, kids who had ADD were undiagnosed, as well. A lot of things were. Dyslexia, for one. Wallowing in teenage angst is a new one, though.

  175. Apropos of nothing but a few mentions of his name, there’s a good documentary on Jones on youtube. It relates more craziness than I was expecting and I was expecting quite a bit of craziness.

  176. I guess I just don’t see Savage’s hypocrisy on this one. I see a lack of tact, which is his whole schtick, but other than rude rhetoric he is simply making a criticism of the way some people interpret the Bible.

    There are folks out their who use the Bible to justify violence and oppression of gays.

    Does this mean all Chritians? No. Does this mean gays should get special priviledges? No. Does this mean if we ignore it and “attack” the messenger it will all go away? No.

    Your other criticisms, of the way Savage behaved with his lover and how it was marketed I agree with. But I also don’t see anything in Savage’s basic point that is that out of line. At least not in the statements that are actually quoted.

  177. we don’t have the actual quote anywhere fo what Mr. Savage said about his husband just Jenny Patterson’s characterization of it, and she’s a known liar

  178. There are folks out their who use the Bible to justify violence and oppression of gays.

    No, there really aren’t.

    There are folks who use the Bible to justify not pretending that two men can be and are married, but that hardly falls within a reasonable definition of “oppression.”

  179. Jones really was an operator, wasn’t he? Fleecing and philandering with the faithful across a couple of states and another country. I learned a lot of stuff about him that I hadn’t known previously when I read some documents that had been unsealed a few years ago. That was mostly financials, though and not about teh krazy which is well documented.

  180. we don’t have the actual quote anywhere fo what Mr. Savage said about his husband just Jenny Patterson’s characterization of it, and she’s a known liar

    Please share the particulars of your prior interaction with this 17 year old child from which you assess her credibility. Did she write you a bad check or something?

  181. Really BMoe? Kids have been picked on since there have been kids. Most boys don’t like boys who act like girls.

    Kids do a lot of things because they are kids. That is why they have parents who teach them which of those things are acceptable and which aren’t.

    What did you teach your kids? Did you teach them that it was okay to pick on fags?

    Most little boys don’t like girls who act like girls, did you teach them it was okay to pick on girls? That they could pick on anybody just because they didn’t like them?

  182. she’s a known liar

    You’re so cool, trying to fuck over little girls and all. Your momma would be so proud.

  183. No, there really aren’t.

    And the sky isn’t blue, dicentra hates bunnies, and all Muslems are just misunderstood.

  184. What did you teach your kids? Did you teach them that it was okay to pick on fags?

    Considering it was my own daughter that helped start the GSA club at her high school, I know I my lessons on how all kids should be treated made an impression.

    They don’t pick on Christians or Jews either. Something Savage overlooks.

  185. They were taught not to pick fights, but they were told they could fight back if someone started with them. Now, the only one I still have at home, can’t do that either because he’ll lose his college scholarship if he gets in any trouble at school or away from school.

    He channels his murderous rage into wrestling like a beast. /sarcasm

  186. *of* what Mr. Savage said I mean

  187. and the sky isn’t blue, dicentra hates bunnies, and all Muslems are just misunderstood.

    Outside of the insane Phelps clan (and really, their whole “church” is nothing but family members) can you link to some “hate crime” against a gay where the perps were screaming “In the name of JAYSUS!” while they beat him up?

  188. this chick talked to like 500 convicted gaybasher people and she got the impression that religion was a lot involved

  189. She’s working backwards from her conclusion and showing confirmation bias, as well.

  190. can you link to some “hate crime” against a gay where the perps were screaming “In the name of JAYSUS!” while they beat him up?

    Not right off hand. I can point to a sentence where you are starting to go Marcotte on me.

  191. and all Muslems are just misunderstood.

    I think they have another book, and they do it in countries where anti-bullying programmes would have marginal effect.

  192. The most bestest social science is leftists studying gay shit. I’m convinced of it.

  193. can you link to some “hate crime” against a gay where the perps were screaming “In the name of JAYSUS!” while they beat him up?

    here this is pretty close

    A gay Gibson County couple said they were assaulted when they tried to attend church services at the Grace Fellowship Church in Fruitland last Wednesday.

    “I went over to take the keys out of the ignition and all the sudden I hear someone say ‘sick’em,'” said Gibson County resident, Jerry Pittman Jr.

    Pittman said the attacked was prompted by the pastor of the church, Jerry Pittman, his father.

    “My uncle and two other deacons came over to the car per my dad’s request. My uncle smash me in the door as the other deacon knocked my boyfriend back so he couldn’t help me, punching him in his face and his chest. The other deacon came and hit me through my car window in my back,” said Pittman. He said bystanders did not offer assistance. He said the deacon yelled derogatory homosexual slurs, even after officers arrived. He said the officers never intervened to stop the deacons from yelling the slurs.

    sounds like it was a bad scene

  194. It’s weird how happyfeet picks and chooses when he’s naive and stupid, and when he actually understands the world.

  195. The most bestest social science is leftists studying gay shit.

    yeah I’d take her with a grain of salt too

  196. sounds like it was a bad scene

    Hey – let’s go camp up dad’s Church where we know we’re not wanted and make a big ghey scene. Hope we don’t get “bullied,” wink, wink.

  197. yeah I’d take her with a grain of salt too

    Definately. She’s using a convenience sample, too. Convicts. Who, as has been demonstrated over time, are reknowned for their truthiness.

    Also, that study is nearly 20 years old and refers to events that took place 20 years prior to that.

    I’d have handed her back her proposal and told her to try again.

  198. here is a link for that story Mr. Leamas

  199. happyfeet says April 28, 2012 at 12:47 pm

    Bored now.

    happyfeet says April 28, 2012 at 4:30 pm

    Yup, still bored.

  200. you should go out and play

  201. So do they still teach the story of Soddom and Gommora in Church these days? Even though it is from that old Jew part of the Bible?

    Do they still leave out the ending, like they did when they taught it to me?

  202. It’s weird how happyfeet picks and chooses when he’s naive and stupid, and when he actually understands the world.

    It’s like when sometimes people want to argue like good faith intentionalists, and other times not so much.

  203. So I see 200 comments on this thread and I wonder how such a thing happens on a Saturday afternoon. Then it occurs to me that if the topic is the degenerate Dan Savage, happyfeet is in here carrying his water.

    No, I’m not psychic.

  204. Bullying is when you’re not nice to people. Savage is a douchebag to everyone who doesn’t have a dick and suck them. I’m feeling bullied all the way over here.

  205. Bullying is not the same as rudeness.

  206. From the Prager speech thread:

    Darleen says April 28, 2012 at 3:51 pm
    @7:46 in the tape … a quote that ought to be billboards across the country

    We measure morality by what happens, not what is intended

    This is exactly what I am getting at. What you teach in Sunday School has consequences you need to be aware of. What happens isn’t always what you intend.

    As leigh points out, many children are naturally little Inquisitors, making them understand what sin is and how we deal with it is more important than just teaching them what sin is.

  207. as the story’s developed nobody’s claiming 100 kids walked out – looks like it was more like a dozen or so – and there’s some suggestion that they were all from the same christian school – except for one vaguely swarthy dude they’re all very very white, so it seems likely they’re not public school kids I think

  208. *just teaching them what is a sin* was supposed to be the last part there.

  209. We’re Roman Catholics, BMoe. Trust me, we know from sin.

    I’m unaware of any other religion that sends its congregants to confession.

  210. I’m unaware of any other religion that sends its congregants to confession

    Orthodox Christians do to.

  211. Yeah, I wasn’t including you guys out. We’re kissing cousins, after all. Schism or no, we have each other’s backs.

  212. Bullying is not the same as rudeness.

    Is too. Didn’t used to be, but it is now. Depending on who you’re being rude to. If it’s a twink, ferinstance. Totally bullying. But it gets better.

  213. Some links about this story at Insty.

  214. you should go out and play

    I did. You should have.

  215. no… it looks like what happened is someone at DU found this page and erroneously concluded that Sutter was a private school … but as far as i can tell it’s public … they do have a special club just for christians though…

    but Sutter only accounts for 6 kids cause that’s how many Tuttle says he brought from there…

    here is the umbrella group for Youth Alive (they’re big on something called the ONE MONTH CHALLENGE: The One Month Challenge is straightforward and simple: students visibly carry their Bibles with them to school, shopping, on a date, studying, to movie theaters, to friends’ houses – EVERYWHERE for One Month.)

    so maybe this was all some kinds of Youth Alive scheme – it looks very coordinated plus nobody’s figured out who took the video yet and if the were part of the protest action

  216. if *they* were part of the protest action

  217. I scroll through any comment posted with that asinine yellow avatar, but I can see from the responses by Darleen, McGehee, et al, that this post elicited the predictable, tired and dishonest crap I would have expected from that source.

    Not going to read any response, if made, from the little twerp.

  218. the good news is that Mr. Dan still has time to avoid being burned to a crisp like when you forget you left a brat on the grill

    Very dark days are ahead, and it may seem like the Dan Savages of the world are victorious in their wickedness, but one terrible, awesome Day, all the lies of Hell and the enemies of God will be burned to a crisp at the coming of the Lord by the Word of His mouth.

    Dan Savage, you have time — while you’re still alive — to avoid the fire, if you so choose. Turn and accept forgiveness, freedom and salvation from God the Father through Jesus, Who loves you so much that he paid for your sins long before you were ever born.

  219. It’s good to have options.

  220. Heh, you all ain’t tuckered out yet?
    This had started before the NFL draft’s final day today. That ended over an hour ago, and as I check back in at PW, it’s still going strong.
    Anyone know what the record for posts on a PW thread is?

  221. Anyone know what the record for posts on a PW thread is?

    1,792 on Darleen’s “The Rape of Liberty” thread from March 2010.

  222. Over 1000, I think.

  223. And here, another Darleen thread. Good work, ma’m.

  224. My youngest child is making his Confirmation tomorrow, one of the Sacraments of the Church. He’ll wear his new suit, get annointed by the Bishop at the Cathedral.

    We’ll have cake and punch after and sit around chatting about driving gay teens to suicide by believing in Jesus.

    With our minds.

  225. Heh, sounds like fun, Leigh.
    Seriously, congrats to the youngest. I hope it’s a happy day for you and your family.

  226. Leigh, don’t forget to stock up on Jesus cooties to throw at all the innocent passersby as you and the newly minted godbotherer go about your day.

  227. I’m plannning on taking a hip flask with me to fill with Holy Water. When I see someone who even looks like Teh Gay, they’re getting a splash right in the kisser.

    If you hear anybody screaming “It buuuuuuuuuuuurns!!, well, you’ll know I’m on the job.

  228. Out of 227 posts, 67 belong to Happyfeet; pushing 30%. Twice, Mr. Happyfeet has made 3 consecutive posts. Dangerously close to having a moderator throw a penalty flag at him.
    In threads such as these- those with over 200 posts- any one poster who has 25% or more of the total posts will be found to be the instigator over 95% of the time.
    That’s a scientific fact.
    Which I just came up with.
    Scientifically.

  229. i had many respondings to make it can be challenging Mr. 4ever when you’re in the minority what doesn’t fall into lockstep with the majoritah, but I manage

    but yes I instigated much of this discussion I think but then that was Darleen’s Cunning Plan all along

  230. Womyns are very cunning creatures, Hap.
    You all just keep throwing those haymakers.
    Honestly, this site, this group are to me the best on the interwebs.
    Most thought provoking and intelligent, too. Which is refreshing. I enjoy it all.

  231. meanwhile I went looking for tasty confirmation cakse – this one’s my favorite by far… there were lots of them in the shape of crucifixes and they look like creepy frosted tombstones I think

  232. Mr. 4ever they really are a good bunch sometimes we just disagree is all

  233. *cakes* I mean

  234. I’m pretty sure the cake will be a sheet cake, happy. This is Oklahoma, after all.

  235. there’s really no such thing as bad cake

    except for when they sneak that stupid layer of icky pineapple under the icing and ruin it

  236. Leviticus, Deuteronomy (later, Judges) were about the aftermath of Hebrews crossing a parted sea (if you go for that kinda thing) after generations of Egyptian enslavement, and upon reaching the other side of said sea (being suddenly completely free), they acted like Caligula up for a straight week tweaking on meth at the Rehab pool, Hard Rock-LasVegas.

    They made a big golden calf and everything.

    Moses came down from the Mount with more than 9 & less than 11 Commandments (unless Mel Brooks was right), and hollered, “You will knock this shit off right now!!”

    Then the elders wrote laws to govern The Tribes (eye for an eye, you can’t beat your slaves like that, you owe that guy two oxen), and so it went.

    As a “Christer”, I don’t give a rats ass if you or anybody else is gay, Happyfeet. Personally, I think it’s genetic (and I ain’t on of them Episcopalians or Unitarians). If the Bible is right, and it is a sin? It ain’t one of mine (and I’ve got many). Don’t judge, don’t care. If it is a sin, it’s t’ween gay folk and God.

    But shove the agenda up your ass. If I feel all “eww” or put off my lunch if I happen to see two dudes kissing on some park bench, or some asshole talking to an auditorium full of high school kids about how good his gay lover’s junk looks in a banana hammock? Just natural reaction. Just like gays’ attraction to the same sex.

    Now who’s intolerant?

    By your logic, as a “Christer” (of course), I’m the definition of “tolerant” by not running over to the park bench and beating the shit out of the “queers”.

  237. Jaysus Keerist. Over nine hours of yammer about a dickhead insulting HS kids. Ably assisted by Happy denigrating a certain religious group as “Christers”. Happy, do you call Muslims, “Mohs”?
    If I recall, homosexuals are about 2% of the population. I tolerate them just like I tolerate truthers – not my style, but I don’t give a flying fuck unless you demand that I celebrate something I don’t care to.
    If someone is being a dick, by all means, walk out. But being a dick covers a lot of sins, not just bullying.
    Again, Jaysus Keerist. Now we are elevating bullying to hate crime status. The dismembering of the American Republic might be a little more immediate. I completely understand people standing up for their particular flavor of religion, but there won’t be a 1st Amendment to protect religious liberty if we don’t stay focused, comrades.

  238. I’ve caught up on the thread…and you’re right Happy. We all disagree sometimes.

    The “Christer” thing was what chapped my ass on even got me to pipe up in this crazy thread. I may rarely be the Christian my Pastor wants, but I believe. Hate is for fools. And to lump “all” Christians in like that?

    Come on, dude.

  239. Welcome to PW RI Red. This happens sometimes. You lock the kids in a room and they beat the shit out of each other until they realize, “This is stupid, we’re missing Dad cooking steaks.”

  240. LYBD; sounds like you abide by ‘live and let live’. I have strong opinions about things; about right and wrong, among other things. But I don’t feel a need to push or force my beliefs on others, and appreciate if they show me the same respect and courtesy. Do what you will, as long as you are not hurting others or declining them the right to live as they see fit.
    To me, God was about love , and for us to love one another. Always the first casualties when the screaming starts.
    The part about if Mel Brooks was right?
    That one worries me.

  241. i lost my comment – I am very… um how to say? Strident sometimes Mr. lamont but I am very annoyed at this Jenny person who I find to be dishonest and stupid. So stupid in fact that I’m not sure I can discern whether she’s tolerant or not. She’s obviously very much in the eww camp, which is stupid I think if you want to get into a good college cause the better schools google your ass. But more she’s stupid cause of what she says…

    I didn’t come to hear someone preach to me about how wrong my beliefs are

    the belief that Mr. Savage was preaching was wrong was the belief that the bible can be used to justify bullying gay people. That’s just what he said. Unless she thought he was criticizing her shellfish thinkings. So if she’s offended that one of her beliefs were criticized as being wrong, which belief was that?

    I’m not sure she could say because she’s stupid and hasn’t thought this all through – she just wanted to make a scene I think.

    Also I do not lump all christians together except sometimes maybe out of carelessness – christers, I will have you know, are a subset of for reals real-world christians like we all went to church with. It’s not a super-precise term, but Christers are the ones what give Christianity public relations challenges. I think it’s a goodly appelation for them. Bigot is another.

  242. I blame Obama.

  243. Happy, do you call Muslims, “Mohs”?

    no but I reserve the right to be annoyed with them at a later date

    If someone is being a dick, by all means, walk out.

    I agree but Jenny was not bullied, and she intimated that she had been hounded out of the room by a torrent of hate. That is not what happened.

    Jenny and her Youth Alive pals just couldn’t hang is what happened… the normal kids – by far the vast majority in attendance – were clapping and basically in agreement with the proposition that what we do not do is use the bible to justify bullying gay people.

  244. Now, HF, I could swear you just went from civilized arguing to out and out personal attack mode. Especially the last 3 sentences.
    Would Lamont be wrong if he responded angrily to such an off hand slap?

  245. no Mr. 4ever I did not personally attack Mr. Lamont you are mistaken and which comment are you talking about anyway?

  246. Happy, Savage’s choice of venue in which he launched his tirade, as well as his choice to refer to a holy book as “bullshit” is what started this whole conversation. He is preaching to the wrong crowd about Christianity being intolerant. Sure, some of our history is a little checkered, but we are not on about raining death down on the heads of unbelievers. That is a certain other religion, heavily represented in the Middle East and parts of Asia.

    And if he wants to talk about his “husband’s” junk in its marble bag bathing suit, he needs to save that for a different crowd.

  247. Dearest Mr. Lamont, it has come to my attention that one of my commentings, towards the end, may have been phrased in such a way as to convey something less than my most sincere respect for you what has accrued over the years and I want you to know that this was not my intention.

  248. HF; “bigot is another”.
    Lamont refers to himself as a Christian. Not all Christians are bigots, any more than anyone else. At least not in my experience.

  249. Was typing while you posted , HF. That’s the thing about ‘good intentions'; I hear the road to hell is paved with them.

  250. but Christers are the ones what give Christianity public relations challenges.

    It ain’t a subset what preludes you from taking the name of your most favoritest West Hollywood jean shorts wearing poodle walker. Nor are the most yucky of Jesus peoples among the more likely to open a can of whoop ass on a gay people for being gay. If anything, they’re likely to be all earnest and creepy about telling them “Jesus loves you, and my friend Cletus performs gay exorcisms if you fancy having the Lord as your personal savior.” Or some such shit.

    The mean bully person is more likely to smack the shit out of his own wife and be a Christian in the same way that Thor is a ladies man.

    Spare us the bullshit.

  251. I go along with Leigh’s last post. The guy was being very belligerent, and I believe intentionally. I believe to draw a reaction, which you feel was the young girl’s intent.
    The intent was his; her’s was a reaction .

  252. leigh he didn’t refer to the whole bible as bullshit just teensy parts of it – but yes that was naughty of him to put it that way. Naughty but not scandalously so.

    I agree that he didn’t make a very good case – at least not in the portion we are able to see – for the proposition that contemproary christianity is in some way a catalyst for bullyings, but I don’t doubt that he’s sincere in his concern that there are people who may believe all that silly abomination stuff.

    And as far as what he said about his husband we really just have Jenny and that Tuttle dude’s word for that. So far I think we have only have three people on the record… Rick Tuttle – who went on the trip – Jennifer’s dad – who I think is Gregg Patterson – and Jennifer. The fourth character we have is the cameraman, who was in just the right place to capture the whole dealio.

  253. Jenny and her Youth Alive pals just couldn’t hang is what happened… the normal kids – by far the vast majority in attendance – were clapping and basically in agreement with the proposition that what we do not do is use the bible to justify bullying gay people.

    I’m bolding your characterization. Here’s what appears to be the relevant passage:

    “We can learn to ignore the [expletive] in the Bible about gay people the same way we have learned to ignore the [expletive] in the Bible about shellfish, about slavery, about dinner, about farming, about menstruation, about virginity, about masturbation,” Savage said.

    Your characterization and what was said do not match up.

  254. Someone has a problem with the wimmens, especially the cumslut Christer ones.

  255. “Also I do not lump all christians together except sometimes maybe out of carelessness – christers” Liar. Hence the term “christers”. Was it you that blamed Christians, (all Christians, if I remember correctly), for the two black men that stole your Blackberry. The tolerance you demand, (but do not reciprocate), is a gift of the religion you spurn and denigrate.

  256. *contemporary*

  257. Happy, “tiny parts”? Let’s split those hairs a little finer, eh?

    I watched the video and your assesment of the teens as “smug” is wrong, I believe. They look embarassed and are smiling in an embarassed teen way because they are walking out on a speaker in front of their peers.

    And the “normal ones” stayed and cheered and clapped. You lost me there, my friend.

  258. Which, personally, I don’t really give two shits about because if you’re gonna waste time and money ignoring the subjects that kids should be getting an education in, it almost always turns out to be something like talking about bullshit in the Bible at a high school students journalism conference.

    On a different day it could be about endangered snails or global warming.

    It wasn’t trigonometry. It wasn’t explaining whatever the hell a gerund is.

  259. the proposition that what we do not do is use the bible to justify bullying gay people…. Your characterization and what was said do not match up.

    Mr. bh I think you need a more bigger excerpt… the whole passage is prefaced on an assertion that people use the Bible as a justification for being mean to gay people….

    ***

    The Bible. We’ll just talk about the Bible for a second. People often point out that they can’t help it — they can’t help with the anti-gay bullying, because it says right there in Leviticus, it says right there in Timothy, it says right there in Romans, that being gay is wrong.

    We can learn to ignore the bulls**t in the Bible about gay people. The same way, the same way we have learned to ignore the bulls**t in the Bible about shellfish, about slavery, about dinner, about farming, about menstruation, about virginity, about masturbation. We ignore bulls**t in the Bible about all sorts of things. The Bible is a radically pro-slavery document. Slave owners waved Bibles over their heads during the Civil War and justified it. The shortest book in the New Testament is a letter from Paul to a Christian slave owner about owning his Christian slave. And Paul doesn’t say “Christians don’t own people.” Paul talks about how Christians own people.

  260. so when the gay mafia attack kevin dujan that’s just good clean fun?

  261. I still think they looked smug and righteous leigh – why would they be embarassed anyway? Nobody knew that they were the losers Mr. Dan was talking about until they stood up and confirmed it.

  262. I still don’t think that matches up.

    In fact, he seems to be saying that the Bible isn’t just good source material for beating up gays, it’s also great justification for owning slaves.

    The guy fucking hates the Bible, I think.

  263. And Paul doesn’t say “Christians don’t own people.” Paul talks about how Christians own people

    the faggot doesn’t take on islam i see. slave owning was “repealed” in saudi land in the 1960’s. hell they toss the gay guys off of roofs in teheran today. no the faggot takes on peeps who merely disagree with him and his perversion. real tough guy that fouled mouth savage loser.

  264. The only time “bullying” and “gays” go together today with any regularity are when it’s Christians being bullied.

    Other than that — when it’s the other way around — it’s one off incidents in rural high schools, or faux-earnest Lifetime propaganda pictures about the hellish anti-gay bigotry in rural high schools. But the truth is, you’re probably just as likely to get bullied for being a nerd or a sub-continental Indian.

    Start laughing at being called a homophobe the way you should be laughing at being called a racist. And for Chrissakes, stop trying to justify yourself to good works Christians who don’t believe in the scriptures. I’m not even Christian, but when people like Sullivan or hf start pronouncing on how a faith should be practiced — because it would make it less distasteful to them personally — I just kinda roll my eyes.

    Now, back to my cloister.

    Thanks to all who sent me well-wishes and diaper money. When I have some free time — if, that is — I’ll try to throw up a quick post or two this week. But no promises.

    Thanks, too, to all the guest posters and commenters keeping this place going.

  265. I don’t think he’s particularly fond of the bible, no

    but what I’m saying is that he “went there” to make the point that we have to deligitimize this rampant practice (what we have no actual examples of yet) where people use the bible to justify bullying gay people, and most people in the audience thought that was a reasonable thing for him to stipulate

    the reactionaries were just pissed – even though Mr. Dan’s criticisms – sans the inflammatory word bullshit – are reasonable enough… I thought Mr. Moe put it nicely…

    I see a lack of tact, which is his whole schtick, but other than rude rhetoric he is simply making a criticism of the way some people interpret the Bible.

    There are folks out their who use the Bible to justify violence and oppression of gays.

    Does this mean all Christians? No. Does this mean gays should get special privileges? No. Does this mean if we ignore it and “attack” the messenger it will all go away? No.

  266. Starve it of oxygen and it will eventually wind itself completely down.

  267. It seems to me, HF, that you are cherry picking examples of certain people who would misinterpret the Bible for their own ends, who would use it as a tactic and justification to control and harm others, and assigning their actions and intentions to the Bible itself, as if this were the true meaning and intent of the bible itself.

  268. Hi Jeff! Give us the stats o Tanner and Mom when you get time.

    Love to all.

  269. Sherman nailed it at the start of the thread. Savage is a known hater, and he was hired because the people running the event knew he was a hater, and knew he’d live up to his billing.

    As such, forget about him, he’s not worth it, and neither are his defenders. Hayterfeet indeed.

    The real target needs to be the people who organized the event. Why aren’t there names being listed? Why aren’t they being asked why they chose a guy who they either knew, or should have known was a proven hater? Why haven’t they apologized?

    Or do they approve oh his language? Are they anti-religious bigots too?

    Rush got nailed to the wall for calling a thirty year old professional political activist a slut. This guy went after high school kids.

    When are the people truly responsible going to be called to account for the abuse these kids suffered?

  270. Much of the Bible is parable, lists, geneology, does and don’ts and, apocryphal stories to condense great events for a people who were largely illiterate.

    Savage is trying to use 20th century interpretation of an ancient text, out of context, to justify his belief that roving bands of Christian yoots are hunting them some gays.

    This isn’t happening. Or if it does occasionally, it’s a one off like a school shooting and condemned by all.

    It’s as ridiculous as thinking that all white people are closet members of the Klan.

  271. It’s as ridiculous as thinking that all white people are closet members of the Klan.

    Southerners are dumb hicks, presumptively Klanners. Residents of small towns are narrow-minded xenophobes, presumptively Klanners. Christians are hypocrites and anti-everything (even dancing!), presumptively Klanners. Businessmen are cheating, soulless vermin, presumptively Klanners (unless they are in a Hollywood-approved business like making solar panels). And Connecticut WASPs are dull, sexually neurotic snobs who beat their wives and molest their daughters. Presumptively Klanners.

    link

  272. This guy went after high school kids.

    “went after” “attacked”

    if this Jenny tard is ever actually in real life “attacked” “bullied” or “gone after” she’s gonna be in for a rude fucking surprise

  273. Hey, Jeff. I’m impressed that you didn’t just type “Need Sleep” or “zuurzon b!n” a couple times.

  274. People often point out that they can’t help it — they can’t help with the anti-gay bullying, because it says right there in Leviticus, it says right there in Timothy, it says right there in Romans, that being gay is wrong.

    Who the fuck are these people? Links, please.

  275. That was just an epic threadjack by HappyFeet.

    I think he should listen to the Adam Carolla podcast on the Rutgers kid.

    What an odd time we live in, no? When a side-show fellow like Carolla is the clearest voice of reasoned sense in mass-media?

    Also, well, for those of you who asked yourselves: “Has Roddy ever been on a panel at a film festival in Western Ct. with Matthew Modine?”

    The answer is now, “Yes, I have.”

    http://www.newstimes.com/local/article/Viewers-say-they-learned-from-festival-films-3516764.php

    PS He’s the nicest fellow in the world, but rather epic heroically naive.

  276. Who the fuck are these people? Links, please.

    I have no idea Mr. bh it’s all very social sciencey as Mr. Froman pointed out. Also I think stipulating that anti-gay bullying is super-rampant isn’t a whole lot different than pathologizing being a young gay person.

    It’s all kinda confuzzling, really.

  277. pathologizing being a young gay person.

    Who is doing that?

  278. “but what I’m saying is that he “went there” to make the point that we have to deligitimize this rampant practice (what we have no actual examples of yet) where people use the bible to justify bullying gay people, …”

    Perhaps he could have stipulated that lack of proof.

    BTW in the video did you see any Bibles in the hands of those who walked out? Wouldn’t that be the badge of the Youth Alive conspirators?

    I think all kids (different or not) should feel safe when meeting the states requirement of attending school. I’m pretty sure it’s not just the gay kids being picked on. I’m sure a lot of the bullying happens at an age where the kids have no clue as to their sexual preferences.

    What Savage did was make the issue about him, and in doing so alienated a portion of the future thought leaders for the next generation.

    And that is a shame.

  279. That was just an epic threadjack by HappyFeet.

    it’s not a threadjack Mr. Roddy this would’ve been a dead and unloved thread except for maybe a dozen people saying man that Dan Savage sure is a mean old stupidhead good for those kids! Yawn.

    Instead we have had Fruitful Exchange of Ideas!

    Glad you could make it. The Rutgers thing – mostly I took from that the idea that you should be careful about taping people and then putting it on the internet. Cause of they may react in unexpected ways.

  280. Who is doing that?

    I think that is what Mr. Dan and the bully squads are doing. The whole it gets better thing sounds like they’re talking about a rash.

  281. Hey, Happy. Let me know the next time a Christer kills a homosexual. Maybe it’s time for you to focus on the Mohs:
    http://www.edgeboston.com/index.php?ch=news&sc=&sc2=news&sc3=&id=88729

  282. Wouldn’t that be the badge of the Youth Alive conspirators?

    not necessarily … cause you only have to do it for a month and these ones might have been advanced Youth Alivers

  283. Feets your schtick is sad, old, and tired.

    Yes, we get it, anyone who doesn’t meet your standards is not fully human, and you don’t see anything wrong with a bully verbally abusing a high school age girl in public so long as he didn’t actually beat her down to a bloody pulp. But, you are not important.

    What is important is the Journalism Education Association, and what they have to say about the goings on at that event, how they allowed their charges to be abused, who was responsible, and what they plan to do to make sure it never happens again.

  284. Nobody knew that they were the losers Mr. Dan was talking about until they stood up and confirmed it.

    Fucking Christer losers! Ha! Mr. Dan showed you!

  285. Mr. Red I will let you know the next time a Christer kills a homosexual but really in context we’re talking more about non-lethal bullyings. Caused in whole or part by the Bible.

    Theoretically.

  286. that anti-gay bullying is super-rampant

    does global warming cause anti-gay bullying? stoopid peeps want to know.

  287. That was just an epic threadjack by HappyFeet.

    To be fair, he is on topic. Don’t nobody say “Sarah Palin” though, k?

  288. Mr. D your condemnation of my schtick is not exactly fresh and new.

  289. From Roddy’s link:

    He [Modine] also argues that, unlike Joseph Stalin and Fidel Castro, Jesus was a true communist.

    Jesus Christ, that’s retarded.

  290. a bully verbally abusing a high school age girl in public

    now she was verbally abused? Sweet jesus she’s a delicate little flower.

  291. So, non-lethal bullying of gays by Christers is more of a problem than lethal killing of gays by Mohs. Got it.
    Sarah Palin.

  292. Sarah Palin and Jesus make the baby Dan Savage cry. Because they’re bullies.

  293. now she was verbally abused? Sweet jesus she’s a delicate little flower

    yo proggtard anita hill/power relationships.

  294. Sarah Palin is wholly irrelevant to this discussion and I mean that in the nicest way.

  295. he is on topic

    Christian bashing is not the topic, homo bashing is not the topic. The topic is a known hater being invited to give a speech on tolerance to high school kids and performing exactly as expected.

    As is hayterfeets. Which is no surprise either.

  296. Cool stuff, Roddy.
    Although when I clicked on the Roddy Boyd link in the article, the first thing my eyes settled on was “Roddy Boyd Sucks It Like He’s Paying The Rent”.
    And something about being a mop and bucket spooge boy in adult novelty stores.
    After reading that you are a financial expert and used to write for Fortune magazine.
    You have taken versatility to a whole new level.

  297. some garlic

    by Sarah Palin on Monday, April 9, 2012 at 4:06am ·

    Happy Easter! Today Christians everywhere celebrate the risen Lord. In his sermon yesterday, Pope Benedict summed up the lessons of Easter quite simply: “Life is stronger than death. Good is stronger than evil. Love is stronger than hate. Truth is stronger than lies.”

    link

  298. Geez, nr. The Pope used to be a Nazi! I read it in Slate.

  299. Nice to know that hayterfeet does not consider calling people ‘pansies’ to be verbally abusive.

    I’m sure Savage meant it in the nicest way possible.

  300. Gee, I missed a whole thread of grieferfeet. I’m crushed.

    Why Jeff let him back in here is a Mystery. Of course, I never understood why Jeff put up with thor as long as he did either.

  301. I invoke the “get up and leave when someone is being a dickhead” rule. No more threadjack. G’night, feets.

  302. The Pope used to be a Nazi! I read it in Slate.

    the nazi failed then the commies failed now islamists are trying to take down west. civ. by teaming up.

  303. g’night Mr. Red I see the rest of you laters I have to go out to eat real quick

  304. OK no proof of conspiracy on Ms. Patterson’s part, the reaction very well could have been genuine.

    Thomas D is correct, the organizers should be held accountable, but their spokesperson pretty much said blah blah blah, fuck you, blah blah blah.. as was to be expected.

  305. Here is a useful page where one can click on column headers to see exactly how successful our cutting edge program of time-wasting nonsense has been.

  306. Roddy’s a good shit and an old timer. As “journalists” go, he’s a fucking saint.

  307. Hey, how ’bout that? Dan Savage, self-styled crusader against hate speech, seems to have incited a little hate speech of his own. Who could’ve seen that coming?

    How will Mr. Gun Down the ‘Christian Republican Fucktards’ live with the utter disappointment? He was salivating for a good ol’ fashioned massacre, but instead, Dan Savage wimped out during his anti-bullying speech and simply spewed slurs at a roomful of high school students who dared to disagree with him.

    link

  308. So much retardation, so little time.

  309. Hey, Lamont, my steak is tasting pretty good right now.

  310. Darleen, I apologize that I was rude on your thread. Good story about hypocritical leftists (yes, I repeat myself). Seems that a lot of oxygen got used up by a certain threadjacker.

  311. MC–I make a lot of enemies in doing what I have chosen to do in my career. That example you linked to is just one example, albeit one who has profound, if not structural, emotional issues.

    Pablo–In thanks. I hope you and your’s are well, safe and prosperous.

    Modine’s view was part Ghandi and part-bong hit theology. I started laughing at one point when some fan boy or girl asked him how he could change the world after watching the clip; the thing is, so did he. Apart from eating locally, he didn’t have much. He also appeared to get his own joke, which was odd, since he was asking everyone to take it seriously.

    Nothing, of course, that comes from Hollywood makes sense.

    Again though, I’d be happy to have him as a neighbor, loan him the mower, that sort of thing.

  312. To me he’ll always be Loudon Swain. Though I liked him in Birdy, as well.

    And in And The Band Played On.

    Gross Anatomy, if pressed.

  313. hey gay peeps: do you “believe” in darwinism?

  314. “science” no?

  315. science is awesome that’s where you have laser beams and molecules and mitochondria and stuff

  316. Christ, happyfeet, just have somebody pound you in the ass already.

  317. god you’re mean

  318. Minor point, Roddy. You make your living as a writer but you often use an apostrophe when writing a simple plural.

    That shit bugs me.

    We already have the horrid singular contraction applied to plural objects apparently being accepted as normal. Further destruction of the language is uncalled for.

    I’m taking it to the streets, with pitchfork and torch. This shall not stand.

  319. good lord, hubby & I take ourselves and the twins for some awesome Persian food and I come back to seeing grieferfeet still bleating how disappointed he is someone just didn’t smash the face of Jenny Patterson?

  320. why would anyone smash her face I don’t understand there’s no reason to pat her on the head for being stupid and a liar but there’s also no reason to smash her face

  321. Persian food sounds very tasty though do you ever get those yogurt drinks? I like the mint one and I add salt and pepper I learned that from my friend Ali

    very tasty and healthy

  322. This idea offended the little christian bitch for some reason.

    Now that exemplar bit of speech, right there, comes from someone who was bullied for a significant percentage of his youthful existence; and for that bullying, blames Christians. Women who are also Christians, given that ‘bitch’ qualifier. She must’ve been quite stern; a nun, perhaps?

    Would a nice cupcake-offering serve as an apology? All the way from the Cross?

  323. if she wants to apologize that would be ok I think

  324. hah! cigarettes and cupcakes! reminders me of that rufus song

    he’s a gay homosexual is my understanding

  325. i never got to mixer up cigarettes and cupcakes… the cupcakes were a quitting-smoking thing … last month was three years, and now except for the occasional sweet potato one from Darlene at Passions Pastries I’m pretty much done with the whole cupcake thing…

    Darlene used to tour with Anita Baker you know – she’s a special lady

  326. I feel as though someone should have made me aware of this hot cupcake woman sooner.

  327. Since “science” has established definitively that homophobes are secretly gay I would assume that makes violence against homosexuals an entirely gay problem that heterosexuals have nothing whatsoever to do with.

    I dunno. It sounds weird but it’s totally science and stuff. What can you do? Research has shown that an urge to commit violence against homosexuals or discriminate against them proves that one is gay. I can’t see any other logical outcome. Only gay people can hate gay people.

    Unless science is just full of crap again like it was with “climate change” and ” oat products being good for your heart”…

    I guess maybe when science gets drunk on self righteous political narrative it might produce a tautology or false conclusion or two. But I’m not reality based enough to say for sure. That’s just my primitive, idiotic, layman’s neanderthal story that I made up from what little I know and some ignorant assumptions because I’m too dumb to be a scientist and think real thoughts.

  328. Hey even a stopped potato clock is right twice a day. Or should that be “potatoe” clock?

  329. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5D1vJJKFjm0

    A peace offering to those who have been harmed in my ‘false consciousness’ driven war on science.

    I would have made quiche but I can’t find the quiche setting on my microwave.

    And somehow I suspect that the automatic “defrost”, “popcorn”, “pizza”, “hot dog”, “soup”, and “lobster thermador au crevettes with a mornay sauce served in a provencale manner with shallots and aubergines garnished with truffle pate, brandy, and with a fried egg on top and SPAM” settings would do a very good job.

    It’s best not to fool around with automatic settings.

  330. that version of the shine on is not available from amazon mp3 downloads

  331. I would say this was OT but at this point I don’t think that is possible.

    Someone at the bar tonight brought up a good point. His Church doesn’t have a problem with gay marriage, so isn’t the government not allowing them to perform such marriages a violation of the First Amendment?

  332. that is a very good point indeed

    real people in the real world want to help people order their lives to where they can prosper… Team R wants to adhere to theory

  333. “Life is stronger than death. Good is stronger than evil. Love is stronger than hate. Truth is stronger than lies.”

    I agree with this but sadly I must observe that an ox is much stronger than a wolf.

    Yet a few wolves can pull and ox down and rip its legs apart and eat its steaming guts from its belly before its heart stops beating. Wolves will not wipe out the oxen but the wolves are often successful.

    So let this advice about good and evil encourage you to be steadfast but do not let it make you complacent, fearful, or lazy. Neither cosmic nature nor the supernature that caused it will allow you the freedom to abstain from perilous intervention. You must be willing to act for the good or the good can fail and harm be done to the whole world.

  334. either you are so high or I am

  335. nicely said though

  336. As a mild acrophobic I must conclude that my mild fear of heights proves that I am mildly high.

    I hope that’s not mildly indefensible.

  337. I wonder sometimes when I am talking to my lefty friends how many real life rightwingers they actually know.

    I wonder sometimes on here how many real life gay folks some of y’all actually know.

  338. A Greek lesson the Greeks will steadfastly refuse to learn: Socialism makes for ruined lives.

  339. I’m a seriously committed acrophobic – I remember as a wee small yoot me dad took us to the very top as far up as you can go to the top of the capital rotunda – he’d been a page there back when he had hair – I don’t know if you can still get up there – my brother and sister scampered and danced about the top of the rotunda… me? Me I clung to a stunted pillar what should have been taller but the whole tier was constructed such that they *wanted* you to plummet over the midgety railings and so I sat and clung and my dad’s hand never left the top of my head so I knew I was ok but jeez it was scary

  340. oh. I think that’s opposed to be *capitol* rotunda when you’re talkin about the one in Austin

  341. ” I wonder sometimes on here how many real life gay folks some of y’all actually know.”

    Or authentic women, or authentic blacks, or whatever latest revolutionarily useful revised definitions have been approved for common usage. So long as the comforting revolutionary societal pressure of default suspicion blankets me and my every word I am happy. According to certain values of happy.

  342. oh do be glibber

  343. ” I see a lack of tact, which is his whole schtick, but other than rude rhetoric he is simply making a criticism of the way some people interpret the Bible.”

    Lenny Bruce’s schitck got stale pretty fast and the laughs faded down to mere claps and nods. Derivative comics like Mahr never noticed. What was briefly a form of novel, unbridled, disruptive iconoclasm, has dwindled to a formulaic kabuki. In other words that swearing shit is nearly as edgy as a sitcom Beatnik on Nick at Night. Dobie’s such a square Daddio. A real Herbert. Freeze dried! As in, just add water! Snap snap. The Man doesn’t HAVE to like this tune, ya dig? It bops!

  344. ” oh do be glibber”

    Taste the rainbow.

  345. I have no idea who this Lenny Bruce is except for I think REM made a mention of him somewheres post-cuyahoga?

    something about profane stand-up comedy?

  346. That’s great, it starts with an earthquake,
    Birds and snakes, an aeroplane
    Lenny Bruce is not afraid.

  347. We set you free, so you could chant with us without fear of repression. Come and chant with us, or we’ll smack you. You mustn’t waste your new freedom on anything but chanting with us. We set you free. You owe us. Don’t be ungrateful. Chant with us or we’ll smack you. You must use your new freedom to chant with us. That is why we freed you. That is why you are free.

    Round and round. Pretty soon it’s all you can hear and it almost seems real. More pods than people. More snatchers than bodies. Consensus shouts down reality and via your instinct for camouflage you learn to live the lie until it kills you.

    Tabula rasa is impossible except as an an enabling theory. But luckily for would be Utopia builders there is always the next best thing : tabula docti. You’d gladly wear shackles if they made you look smart and sexy. Everybody would. Everybody will. You can’t be free without those shackles. Put on your shackles and be free. Here are your shackles. Only those in bondage would reject them. Without them you are in danger. Without them you are a danger. Don’t you want to be safe? Don’t you want to be free?

    It’s a new and better way of thinking that goes all the way back to the mid 1800’s. And it always works except when people get it wrong or saboteurs wreck it. Once you’ve got your freedom shackles on it’s an easy old world of simple dialectic struggles and progress. Oh yes progress. Sweet progress.

    Dreams and rhetoric. To hope and change. To failure and show trials. Boots, and faces. Then collapse, darkness, migration, and a new crop of vikings. Oh wait, I meant a paradise. Whoops.

  348. firstest of all, let us note, together, that round n round is a ratt song and it is, yes, glorious… as these things go

    ok, secondest… I have to read this at least 5 times, no? … to do it justice and all…

    ok…

    twice…

    ok on the second pass the whole chanting and freedom thing gets a bit trite when you anticipate reading this 5 times

    ok ok ok

    this is just poetry – and nicely done! –

    but it’s not America

    meanwhile back in America we’re sending out a very calculatedly-annoyed and heavily-focus-grouped Mittolomew Q. Romneykins to bravely face an Osama-bagging yet faggy dirty socialist in battle royale!

    ok yeah I haven’t seen the hunger games yet so i don’t know how this ends

    (i did read the books so yeah i have some idea)

    (at some point someone pretends to commit suicide)

  349. Like it or not, accept it or not, it’s about 25% of America right now. How much of that is enthusiastic, how much is addled, and how much is merely intimidated into compliance remains to be seen.

    And with the squishing going on among the “please love me” opposition, it’s going to get bigger sooner rather than later. I’m sure a couple of chipper wakka wakka music references and a ho-ho dismissal will totally tame it though. Not that that’s grown trite or anything. No sir. You’re ever the gust of fresh air every time you do it. All that bitching going on is just love and respect and awe. Nobody else has a point or anything. Mustache’s on the paintings is always magically new when you do it and redo it, and then do it some more. Too bad nobody else is hip enough for your room. Or they’d get it. But back on track right? Teachable moments all around!

  350. Good morning all. Six AM, checked the sports scores, and hopped over here to see how this thread ended.
    Except it hasn’t.
    It’s good to have stamina.

  351. Heh. Ann Barnhard’t essay of the yesterday morning seems apropos…

    I get several emails per week, on average, from people telling me that I am either directly or partially responsible for their conversion or reversion to Catholicism. These emails are at once edifying and terrifying. Every one of those emails that I receive results in a prayer offered up that whatever parish the person or people end up in has a non-Marxist, non-homosexualist priest who actually believes in what the Church teaches and believes. One has to rely on prayer in this, because to rely on the odds is too terrible to think about.

    The Church is probably at the lowest point it has ever been in because Communists set about infiltrating the Church in the early 20th century, and knew that the fastest, easiest way to destroy the Church was to destroy the priesthood and ranks of nuns. Destroy the shepherds and the flock will scatter. The methodology and tactics were simple: specifically recruit homosexuals into the priesthood and ranks of women religious. This was accomplished beginning in the late 1950’s, with massive inertia gained in the 1960’s and forward, coincident with the Communist-driven “sexual revolution.” The effects and damage have been massive and undeniable. Within a span of 25 years, the image of the Catholic priest went from Bing Crosby as Father O’Malley and Spencer Tracy as Father Flanagan to the blanket assumption that every Catholic priest was a homosexual. In the 1980’s, it is safe to say that fully half, if not more, of the seminarians ordained to the priesthood were in fact active homosexuals. Seminaries turned into de facto bath houses. For more on this outrage, I recommend the book “Goodbye, Good Men” by Michael S. Rose.

    As a child, I was exposed to many “ex-nuns” who had “courageously” left the Sisters of Charity who were headquartered in the area, and lived as lesbians. These were the kind of women of whom my childish eyes could not immediately discern their gender, and the lesbian angle went over my head completely due to the innocence of youth. They were just strange, ugly, repulsive and somewhat frightening women to me. There is no better intuition than the intuition of a child.

    Oh, but we aren’t allowed to talk about things like that. We aren’t allowed to acknowledge the fact that women who go out of their way to look and act like men, aka “butch”, are in any way unattractive or even repulsive. We have been taught to suppress our attraction to beauty, and to embrace things that are intrinsically disordered, ugly and fundamentally repellant. Remember the 45 goals of Communism that I posted a while back? Let’s look at numbers 23 and 26:

    23. Control art critics and directors of art museums. “Our plan is to promote ugliness, repulsive, meaningless art.”

    26. Present homosexuality, degeneracy and promiscuity as “normal, natural and healthy.”

    Go read the rest before the link expires.

  352. Oh. And it’s a very good thing that this Kevin Jennings Dan Savage fellow didn’t cross paths with Ann Barnhardt. She strikes me as a “little christian bitch” who might not just walk away from an encounter with a rabid dog.

  353. Roddy Boyd; in catching up with the thread, I noticed your reply. I had just glanced at that hyperlink, and thought it to be some of the biting humor prevalent here at PW. Apparently, it was not a humorous experience for you. My comment was meant humorously, and not to cause you any insult. If I did, my sincerest apologies.
    Perhaps in the future, I should read all the way through for context and perspective, and learn more such as taking the time to read up on all things Roddy Boyd.
    Failing that, I should just STFU.
    Hope you enjoyed being on a panel. How did you manage to be in prolonged close contact with one of the planet Hollywood and come away with your sanity and no assault charges against you,heh?

  354. Ann Barnhardt is a savage goddamn patriot make no mistake!

    you can rest assured in the knowledge that America is loved and cared for, by savage goddamn patriot, Ann Barnhardt

    thus endeth the lesson

  355. Still at it and feeling feisty, eh Mr. Happyfeet?

  356. I feel as though someone should have made me aware of this hot cupcake woman sooner.

    Know more…NOW!

    His Church doesn’t have a problem with gay marriage, so isn’t the government not allowing them to perform such marriages a violation of the First Amendment?

    No, they can perform whatever ceremonies they want and call them whatever they want. They don’t have legal standing as marriages unless they’re marriages, which is to say they’re the union of a man and a woman. Lack of legal recognition is not a First Amendment issue. They can say and do whatever they want and there is no right to have things recognized they way you’d like them to be.

  357. Didn’t mean to rile you so much, ‘feets, as to use the Lord’s name in vain on a blessed Sunday morning.

    Here’s some nice Texas bluebonnets for your hurts.

  358. Oh. And it’s a very good thing that this Kevin Jennings Dan Savage fellow didn’t cross paths with Ann Barnhardt.

    I’d pay good money to see that.

  359. I’m a seriously committed “acrophobic”

    you misspelled “moron”.

    Other than that, meh.

  360. Thanks for that video link, Pablo. Now I know Jenny Cross is a fan of both Quail and gin; and that both she and Steve Martorano dislike Tanqueray. Bombay’s Sapphire is my top ginny choice too!

  361. I see a lot of references to Barnhardt here. I first saw her with her video on the koran, and the creative use of bacon as a bookmark for it.
    I drifted away from her site , as I thought she was at times too strident and over the top in making her points. It’s not that I disagreed with her or her points. Just as a critical analysis, I figured she would defeat her own purpose eventually.
    Perhaps I’ll take a stroll back over to her site and see what’s up.

  362. The incident with Onan involved the adding of interruptus to the coitus. While some have extended it to masturbation, it’s clearly not what happened, and is a reading past the text. I can see it, but strictly speaking that’s not choking the chicken. It’s a much better prooftext for (and has been used by non-Catholics like Martin Luther) arguing against birth control.

  363. ” I wonder sometimes on here how many real life gay folks some of y’all actually know.”

    You mean, like my youngest daughter’s godfather?

    But I’m sure you’ll find him inauthentic and suffering from false consciousness.

  364. I see hf is down with actual violence, the vandalism of the church in Oregon.

    Because bullying is worse, you see.

    Just a reminder of where Savage’s rhetoric leads:

    http://www.oregonlive.com/portland/index.ssf/2012/04/vandals_break_windows_at_south.html

  365. ” I wonder sometimes on here how many real life gay folks some of y’all actually know.”

    I know quite a few, some of which are in ‘the family’. None are the strident activists that are strident and off-putting.

    A small truth that crossed the Twitter a while back…

    “If a Republican is homosexual, he quietly leads his life.”
    “If a Democrat is homosexual, he demands legislated respect, & performs OUTRAGE!”

  366. I drifted away from her site , as I thought she was at times too strident and over the top in making her points.

    Small doses, my friend. But when one comes across a person posting ‘christian bitch’, then a nice big dose needs be delivered.

    (Did you see Ann Barnhartd’s American Thinker piece a couple days ago?)

  367. Here’s a reminder of what happens when secular types realize their dream of cleansing the public square of Christianity:

    http://www.gaypatriot.net/2008/06/05/gay-bashing-in-amsterdam-goes-unnoticed-in-us/

    In a way, I’m delighted that Savage is working with the administration–it’ll make for some interesting mailers in the fall.

    And I’m certain Savage has gotten the word to limit his bile-spraying to Christians: (1) it’s safer, and (2) the admin will have nothing to do with criticism of Islam. Not when NASA is working hard at self-esteem raising for Muslims around the world.

  368. Pingback: Sorta Blogless Sunday Pinup » Pirate's Cove

  369. jdw; thanks for the link. I think she is 100% correct. Good article.

  370. I checked the pingback. Interesting site, this “Pirate’s Cove”. I bookmarked it.
    I enjoy a site that broadens my horizons and educates me now and then.
    My estimation of this site continues to grow. I hope that I can be a positive contributor here in the days ahead.

  371. Pingback: Reflections on Dan #ItGetsBitter Savage [Dan Collins] | protein wisdom

  372. Re: long threads.

    The “Palin says Obama ‘palling around’ with terrorists” thread presently reads as 1575 comments but a number of those who commented on it, such as thor, got banned and their comments deleted. It was larger.

  373. Well, geoffb, there is quite a long way to go for this thread to attain such numbers. But it is showing decent stamina.

  374. B Moe

    There are churches and mosques that have no problem conducting polygamous marriages, or arranged marriage ceremonies between children.

    Does State policy have to recognize them? No. And churches that do object to poly or same-sex marriage also cannot be forced by the state to perform them.

    There is state civil marriage (a public institution) and a religious ceremony.

  375. My friends what are Teh Ghey are fabulous.

  376. In my not-very-big neighborhood there is a house inhabited by two mature gay men what have been committed to one another for many years. It’s been at least a week since we all went over there and beat them half to death for being an abomination unto the Blessed Cooties of Jesus.

    Maybe longer.

  377. I sorta enjoyed thinking about the first amendment considerations of a church that wanted gay marriage but the “do you have gay friends” dealio made me think that maybe we’re not on particularly fertile ground for a discussion here.

  378. Pingback: Liberals Just Can’t Ever Seem to Get It Right | ZION'S TRUMPET

  379. Re: long threads.

    The “Palin says Obama ‘palling around’ with terrorists” thread presently reads as 1575 comments but a number of those who commented on it, such as thor, got banned and their comments deleted. It was larger.

    I tried to link up Darleen’s “The Rape of Liberty” thread last night, but the whole thing seems to have disappeared. I guess it was lost in the site collapse a couple of months ago.

  380. BTW, what ever happened to The Sanity Inspector?

  381. geoff, I went back and read the Sarah Palin thread. What a thing of beauty! I was lurking and not commenting back then, but I remember it well. Brought out all the trolls.
    I wonder if those trolls are as enthusiastic today, having now seen their plastic black savior for the socialist idealogue he is.
    I was pleased to see some of our long-time commenters back then, too.

  382. Speaking of Irony:

    Atheists are using a music video that celebrates the burning of churches and synagogues to promote an upcoming atheist-themed festival at Fort Bragg.

    “Rock Beyond Belief” is scheduled to be held on the parade field at Fort Bragg in March. The event was created in part as a response to a Billy Graham Evangelistic Association event that was held last year.

    Justin Griffith, who organized “Rock Beyond Belief,” said he was personally offended that a Christian evangelical event like “Rock the Fort” was held on the base.

    We felt it was entirely inappropriate for anyone to say your current religion is wrong,” Griffith told Fox News& Commentary. “We view all soldiers as already spiritually complete. Whatever their current religious preference is has no bearing on how fit they are as a soldier or anything related to military business.”

    Griffith confirmed the lineup includes atheist speakers, a rapper who raps about evolution and a “kiddy pool” where boys and girls will be able to scientifically walk on water.


    link

  383. “We felt it was entirely inappropriate for anyone to say your current religion is wrong,”

    The group is no stranger to strong lyrics. Another of their songs says, “F*** your God, F*** your faith in the end. There’s no religion.”

    Inappropriate…unless we’re doing it to you.

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