This “compromise” deal, which amounts to a vote for a near immediate raising of the nation’s debt in exchange for the promise to shave a trifling sum off future deficit spending (to put it into perspective, Obama’s “one-time” stimulus money of $1.6 Trillion is now a permanent part of the budget baseline; this deal, each year, would “cut” a rounding error off that), does nothing credit agencies were demanding; and so when the credit downgrade comes and interest rates inevitably rise, the Dems and the President will blame the GOP, claiming that it was their reckless “cutting” that caused the stalled recovery, taking revenues away from the government — who would have distributed it back into the economy — and giving it to millionaires and billionaires for their yachts and corporate jets.
Most to blame will of course be the Tea Party hardliners, who held the nation hostage like the terrorists they are and then, by insisting on tying cuts to a debt ceiling raise, took money out of an already anemic economy, triggered a worsening employment picture.
Already the ground has been laid for such a rhetorical strategy: the progressives are pretending to hate this deal; the media on both the left and right have focused their attention on the Tea Party extremists who’ve been holding up “compromise” (that CC&B plan that they were for, and that got more votes in the House than the Boehner plan? Well, because Reid wouldn’t let it come to a vote in the Senate, it’s like it never existed. And because it never existed, the Tea Partiers, who have resisted the kind of weak deal that doesn’t do a thing to address the actual fiscal problems, are obstructionists who just won’t compromise!); and the fallout from having not addressed those problems will be tied to the right, who is seen as dragging the left kicking and screaming into making a deal that the Democrats will tether to any credit downgrade.
I don’t judge the efficacy of deals by how spendaholic socialists wail at it. I judge it by what it does and doesn’t accomplish. And because this deal does dick but give the GOP cover for not causing a “default” that they and the Tea Party “took us to the brink of” — which of course never would have happened in the first place, and was a false meme both sides used to rationalize more spending and “revenue” generation — it’s just more of same: the ruling class putting on a show, and then in the end voting for the status quo, leaving future generations to pay the bills and try to clean up the mess.
Time to put a hairy foot down.
It’s now easy to tell who is who. Me, I’m not into losing more slowly. Those on “our” side who consistently and reliably enable our destruction by counseling that we always and forever adopt the left’s constructs and play the part of the “compromiser” are the real problem these days. Which is to say, we know what progressivism is and what it wants; so what we need to do is root out all that shelters and enables it.
And if that’s sneered at as a “purity test,” and means I’m even further marginalized by the right, so be it. After all, being a Hobbit has its privileges, one of which is that I can live with myself.
Looks like we need some primaryin’, to start prying Establicans out of their chairs. Another 87 member freshman class anyone?
I’ll remind anyone who fears being called a hobbit (and what is it with lame Republicans fearing being called a fricking name?), hobbits SAVED middle earth. Not elves, not orcs, HOBBITS!
/dork
While I’d be plenty happy to see that, LTC John, that needs to be weighted toward the Senate. There’s a lot of fossils there that need to be retired to a museum.
I’d prefer to see not one single Democrat Senator returned to office. The disgrace they have all brought on themselves warrants everyone of them being thrown out of office for taking the people’s money in payment for a job they haven’t done. The Senate Democrats haven’t written a budget in over two years. A great dereliction of fiduciary on the part of a governing body is hard to imagine.
The Senate ought to return to regular order and decent behavior immediately (of course we know it won’t).
“Awake! Awake! Fear! Fire! Foes! Awake! Fire! Foes! Awake!”
/another dork
that should have been “a greater” etc.
‘Embarrassed’ Corporate Leaders Quiet on Debt-Ceiling Fight says Bloomberg propaganda bitch Mark Drajem
#1 and #3: exactly.
Frankly, I don’t feel too bad about this deal at all, in the sense that the Establicans acted about how I expected them to act. Yet the debate has been shifted decisively from “revenue enhancements” (sic) to spending cuts.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/politics/2011/07/gop-wins-when-fight-over-cuts-not-more-taxes
You can almost feel Kruggie’s sore sphincter in this NYT screed.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/01/opinion/to-escape-chaos-a-terrible-debt-deal.html?_r=2
This is the best evidence that the GOP won significant concessions, by the way. You don’t win when you think you’ve won; you win when the enemy thinks you won.
Not bad for a relatively small band of Tea Party hobbits. Now we just need the rest of Middle Class Earth to rally in 2012. Even the Ent-like elderly are starting to get that the Obamunists are going to cut their Medicare regardless.
Simply not true.
The best evidence of significant concessions would be, you know, any actual evidence of significant concessions.
Likewise, you don’t win when you think you’ve won and you don’t win when the enemy things you’ve won.
You win upon objectively winning.
Simply not true.
The best evidence of significant concessions would be, you know, any actual evidence of significant concessions.
Likewise, you don’t win when you think you’ve won and you don’t win when the enemy things you’ve won.
You win upon objectively winning.
All right then, we will need a much larger band of Tea Party Patriots. I honestly am surprised that the small band there was able to do as much as it did. Does that make me cynical or naive?
With this bill, as with others I suppose, the question “win what?” is still applicable. So defining the “win” goes a long way to creating a win, win or no on the bottom line. So long as the “win” is amorphous, so long the pretense can stand.
Absolutely.
All we’ve done is agree to drive off the cliff of financial Armageddon
at 45 mph instead of 65 mph.
This sucks.
That said, if you’d told me a year ago even this small step was possible, I’d have been pleasantly surprised.
This war will take many years and several election cycles to resolve.
At least we are engaged and fighting instead of just lying down and taking it.
What if you are your own enemy?
Freaky…
pvrwc, the question at hand is what to do next though, isn’t it? That is, pass this disastrous piece of legislation or refuse to pass it. Me, I’ve written ever representative I’ve got to tell them to vote it down; start over; do better; stop spending; cut spending. Do it now, as EmpLamDukO suggested yesterday. Take him at his word. And ram his words right back down his throat.
Freaky.
Indeed.
From happy’s link:
“They haven’t done nearly enough to sound the alarm,” said Jim Kessler, vice president for policy at Third Way, a Washington research group that describes itself as advocating “moderate policy” and has executives from Morgan Stanley (MS) and Goldman Sachs Group Inc. (GS) on its board.
I post this only as a public service, to remind you that Jim Kessler is one of Soros’ minions, and Third Way is a wholly-owned subsidiary of the Tides Foundation. Their senior staff are almost all from gun-control groups, progressive social advocacy shops, and Clinton administration veterans.
That such an organization can paint itself as “moderate” goes a long way toward explaining my earlier observation on changing political definitions.
“Moderate” is the new “progressive.” “Extremist” is the new “moderate.” I’d say it’s too late to reclaim the labels that the “No Labels” crowd has labeled us with. Better to embrace the new label, define it clearly to identify our principles, and encourage our neighbors to vote Extremist in 2012.
Once the adults are in charge, we can start educating people on what these terms historically meant, and show how they’ve been twisted. That is, of course, assuming we’re not already busy sifting through the debris of our former civilization.
link
What if you are your own enemy?
Here is the question: Are there more than a few Sarumans or Marshal Petains in our ranks? (pick your metaphor). Or is it just neville Chamberlains? Treason or cowardice?
I am trying to take a longer view. There will be blunders before successes. Dieppe before D-Day. Vietnam before the Reagan Doctrine.
Angle and O’Donnell before successful Tea Party Senators. Comedians who are “Not Ready For Prime Time” and are on SNL before they star in their own full length movies.
Why not view the Republican blunders as having been committed in the years 2001 – 2005 Curmudgeon, and therefore take them for having learned a lesson from those blunders? There’s no need to recommit them.
#3 – Indeed. My problem is living in IL, where we replaced O! (eventually) with a semi-RINO is that we have Dick Durbin welded into place.
IL has decided to test the fiscal collapse thingy a bit earlier than the Feds, with only CA as competetion. We’ll let you know how the whole thing works out…
#20, see #18. Perhaps that is the best analogy.
For the first time in many years we have stopped government’s remorseless advance.
BWAHAHAHAHAHA!
Either Iain really believes this, in which case he’s a raving delusional in need of some serious medication, or Iain just wants us to believe it, in which case he’s a raving lying asshole.
I suppose if I were a generous soul, I’d say he was just cheerleading and trying to keep morale up so that we can keep fighting and winning more “victories” in the future. But I’m not a generous soul, so fuck off, Iain.
And frankly Republican blunders committed in the years 2001 – 2005 were like pre-war appeasement. 2006-2008 was like the Blitzkrieg.
Here is the question: Are there more than a few Sarumans or Marshal Petains in our ranks?
Yes. Next question.
I can take the long view Curmudgeon, while at the same time ask myself “what is the right thing to do now?”. Asking that question, I arrive at the answer: vote this bill down. This bill is not right. It doesn’t do right.
Either Iain really believes this, in which case he’s a raving delusional in need of some serious medication, or Iain just wants us to believe it, in which case he’s a raving lying asshole.
I suppose if I were a generous soul, I’d say he was just cheerleading and trying to keep morale up so that we can keep fighting and winning more “victories” in the future. But I’m not a generous soul, so fuck off, Iain.
All right then, shall we just pass out the cyanide pills now?
Too much doom and gloom does not inspire Tea Party Patriots. Instead, it paralyzes.
Why is a desire to free the American economy from burdensome taxation and over-regulation in order that it can begin to function at more normal efficiencies doom and gloom?
Sorry, Curmudgeon — I didn’t mean to come off as hostile. But I think it’s obvious that there are a lot of guys in the GOP leadership, and their associated buddies in the “Gang of N” crowd, who are all too happy to “maintain a collegial relationship” with their Proggy counterparts, and to see the federal government thrive at the expense of the people it’s supposed to work for.
Maybe they believe they’re doing it for the greater good, but that just makes them sincere tyrants, which C.S. Lewis famously identified as being the most oppressive kind of tyrant. There’s more than a handful of them, and they’re disproportionately powerful due to their seniority. I pray that their voters retire them at the earliest opportunity.
Different things demoralize different people, Curmudgeon.
Personally, I find a constant flow of bullshit to be demoralizing. Sometimes the truth sucks but it can at least guide you in the right direction in the future.
If we call a non-win a win now, then why shouldn’t I assume that we’ll intentionally seek out future non-wins? I find that utterly demoralizing.
Looks like we need some primaryin’, to start prying Establicans out of their chairs. Another 87 member freshman class anyone?
That’s like pulling up bindweed and planting tame morning glory in its place. Guess what? The tame morning glory still twines around things like the devil, and the bindweed just springs back up from its massive root system and twines around THAT.
All the other plant life is still smothered out of existence, but at least we’ve got the pretty blue flowers to mix in with the white and pink ones.
I suppose this craptastic legislation is a Dunkirk rather than an El Alamein?
personally I’m kind of over the whole debt ceiling thing and I’m eager for 2012 and I hope to god the nominee isn’t a sillyhead and finding out why exactly do I have to subsidize your contraceptives
I’m curious
Too much doom and gloom does not inspire Tea Party Patriots. Instead, it paralyzes.
I would agree, Curmudgeon, but that doesn’t mean telling me pleasant lies to keep my feelings from getting hurt.
As a Tea Party guy, if I wanted to dust off the WWII metaphors, I’d go with “ObamaCare was our Pearl Harbor, and this budget fiasco is Corregidor. And on behalf of the Tea Party, I’d like to tell Congress: I shall return.” Then I’d redouble my efforts to make sure that the 2012 elections are Midway.
We’re fighting for our lives here. I don’t care how much the Establishment is whining about not liking this deal; the fact is that it’s another shit sandwich being shoved down our throats, and it’s another link forged in the chain that binds our grandchildren. Let’s not pretend that it’s a historic victory, when it’s really just business as usual, with a thin veneer of “change” pasted on for show.
Words mean things. We’ve lost enough words already; let’s not give away “victory” as well.
#31 – My freshman House rep is not acting very weed-like. Another large batch of his ilk would be most welcome.
Now, the Senate, that is pure crabgrass mixed with dandelions…
“Personally, I find a constant flow of bullshit to be demoralizing.”
Warning! Stay out of the insurance claims business!
I find the press coverage of all this less demoralizing than angrifying.
#33: That truly disgusted me. At a time when young women spend more on their monthly cell phone bills than on their contraception.
As I try to explain to the young skulls full of mush at my office when they complain about high health insurance premiums, imagine what car insurance would cost if oil changes *had* to be paid by your insurer.
Q: What do we insure against? A: Major financial catastrophe. NOT routine costs.
Man, if you thought the “Check Engine” light was annoying today, can you imagine what that thing would be like if Big Oilchange got $100 every time it lit?
If war analogies are absolutely necessary, then think of this deal as an A-10 friendly fire strike on misidentified armored forces. It’s shooting in the wrong direction.
Heh.
Is now a good time to suggest that maybe, just maybe, we’d be better off disbanding the Republican National Committee and running the GOP at the State level from here on out? I’m truly disgusted at how out of touch the Beltway crowd has gotten!
Odd. There are so very few people (outside of PW) noting how, as a nation, we have come to view a temporary slow-down in the velocity of spending as “A cut.”
It signifies something profound, I’ll warrant. I am not one to lionize older/previous generations, but it does speak to our contemporary inability to not only grasp rudimentary principles–all debt crises’ are spending crises’ first and foremost–but that doing something about it requires action. I suspect earlier leaders could at least grasp this issue. We have grown so comfortable with government spending and intermediation that we cannot, apparently, tolerate any reduction in it. Which is odd since any cuts in spending would likely reduce outlays to 2002-2003 levels, not quite a dark age of magical thinking.
We very much deserve the debt rating cut that should be coming.
Is now a good time to suggest that maybe, just maybe, we’d be better off disbanding the Republican National Committee and running the GOP at the State level from here on out?
Depends upon the state. I sure wouldn’t reccommend the California GOP, who were seduced by a chunky buffoon with an accent who proceeded to take the state right over the cliff.
I’m all for defunding the RNC. I would never give them money. I doubt they would disband on their own, though.
IL has decided to test the fiscal collapse thingy a bit earlier than the Feds, with only CA as competetion.
Race you to the cliff!
The best evidence of significant concessions would be, you know, any actual evidence of significant concessions.
Agreed. I can’t help but chalk this up as a win for Obama.
He kept talking about ‘shared sacrifice’ and nobody was willing to call bullshit. No one was willing to point out a SINGLE ONE of the myriad things that the Federal government needlessly pisses away money on. According to Obama, and everyone else who acquiesced to his rhetorical ploy, EVERYTHING in the budget is equally valid and necessary.
Disagree? Well then you’d need to explain why EVERYTHING is still in the budget.
The media kept everyone tied up in knots with all that ‘default’ scaremongering and we lost sight of the real target.
It is going to take a tremendous effort in 2012 and beyond to overcome this lost opportunity.
Don’t pass the bill and the opportunity isn’t lost yet ThomasD. Just begin again, starting with ObamaCare and move on from there.
“Warning! Stay out of the insurance claims business!”
Now you tell me.
It’s good to win, I guess, but a couple more of these victories and we shall be quite undone.
Sdferr, I’d like to believe that. Unfortunately it seems that the momentum is not in our favor. The passing of Boehner’s last bill was the signal for capitulation, and the ‘symbolic’ House vote against the ‘Reed Bill’ (even though nobody knew what was in it) was everyone saying “let’s get this over with.”
Our ‘leadership’ is simply too craven. There was no chance of a default. Hell, there is no real threat of a downgrade so long as a Democrat sits in the White House (expect that implicit threat to become very explicit within the next year.) None of them wanted to risk upsetting any of their special interests, and neither do the ratings agencies. It was ALL theatre.
Exactly right, Jeff. The Democrats are simply better at the long game (oh, were it only a game) than team R. And frankly, team R just ain’t that principled.
Some folks need to face a primary challenge, even if victory doesn’t seem like a sure thing.
Granted all ThomasD, because it’s good and true analysis.
However, all those people can still be charged with the responsibility to be thinking beings, and as such, capable of revising any previous position in light of changed circumstances or a better view. I won’t release them. They must think again.
there’s no lack of Rs in the senate what are ready to lock arms with the socialists if this deal falls through I think
it’s just sort of who they are – John Cornyn is the head of their electoral committee for crying out loud
At least we got a running joke out of the deal. Glad to see Jeff making good use of that.
Ryan’s view of the proper way to reduce the deficit, in a word, ObamaCare.
Depends upon the state. I sure wouldn’t reccommend the California GOP, who were seduced by a chunky buffoon with an accent who proceeded to take the state right over the cliff.
Well, it’s not like Republicans aren’t an endangered species in California to begin with. Would it really matter if the GOP withered up and died there?
I’m all for defunding the RNC. I would never give them money. I doubt they would disband on their own, though.
Yeah, I haven’t donated to the RNC in the past 10 years, because of how many times they’ve screwed real conservatives on the issues (amnesty, medicare part d, nclb, etc, etc.) — but is there any PROCEDURAL way the GOP state parties can disband it?
Ryan’s not looking well I hope he gets a vacation soon somewhere nice like when you win the showcase showdown
Well, it’s not like Republicans aren’t an endangered species in California to begin with. Would it really matter if the GOP withered up and died there?
As late as 1998, it still had life. Unfortunately, Pete Wilson, the last Republican who understood what was unfolding in this state, was disregarded by the Bushyrovies.
Ryan’s view of the proper way to reduce the deficit, in a word, ObamaCare.
And there is the problem. Would our Marxist Man-Child and his Commiecrat Cadres in the Senate stop everything if ObamunistCare was even grazed? Yes, of course.
And would the MF media fellate them and demonize us? Yes.
And how many Americans are still plugged into said media?
Plus ThomasD — and I don’t mean to abuse your words here — but I think if we stand back just a tiny bit we can see that the fact of the state of the momentum of politics today, such as it is, is entirely on the side of the Tea Party Americans, not only for the last two years but for the foreseeable future, if only on account of what folks refer to as the ruthlessness of the “math”, the mathematics of mounting interest costs as well as the mounting numbers of people added to the rolls of recipients of the Federal dollar. So in that spirit, it seems to me those in possession of that spiritual moment (such are the vagaries of the attempt to make politics analogically into a “natural science”) may as well keep it going.
Sdferr, you may use or abuse my words as seems fit. ;-)
Perspective is a great thing, just not in much abundance down in the trenches. I mean, from the vantage point of the broken gates of Rome circa 5th century A.D. the enlightenment could be thought of as sort of inevitable, so long as some remaining shred of classical thought was not lost, burned, or otherwise tossed into a privy.
Yes, the math is ruthless. So the responsible parties truly offer but one thing, economic ruin. Personally, I’d rather take it now, as I am still up for manual labor, rather than in ten or twenty years, when I will be less fit for anything productive. And if those responsible think they will be safely ensconced away from the fray, and immune to threat at that later date? Well I can play at ruthless too. I will not see my children subjected to debt bondage in order to prop up their gold plated dotage, and while they may think themselves beyond reach surely they know that it will not be possible to see all they hold dear kept so secure.
They really need to question their assumptions.
There are bullets to be bitten, as the US once advised the Japanese to do. So we should take our own advice and not waste the time forestalling a reckoning. Get out the pencils boys! We’ve got work to do.
And the better part of the “economic ruin” story is that once we square away our priorities, the following economic flowering will be a wonder to behold.
Public choice theory essentially says that’s the only solution.
[…] Left is already beginning to spin this whole thing in their favor, as Jeff Goldstein points out: This “compromise” deal, which amounts to a vote for a near immediate raising of the […]
if we make it to 11/12, we only have one more chance. If this Marxist idiot is elected again, we are toast.
And we may already be…