Seriously. Why? I mean, clearly the Republican primary voters of Delaware didn’t want him, and this was their election. So why do so many GOP cheerleaders wish Republican primary voters of Delaware would have been smart and savvy enough to vote for a guy those voters didn’t want representing them, casting their vote instead for a woman they believed would?
There is nothing “extreme” about the Tea Party message, and there’s nothing in that message that should put off “moderates.” O’Donnell did well with independents, despite having no support from her own party machinery. And yet because GOP establishment types were so quick to scoff and sniff and run away from O’Donnell or Angle (and, initially, Rubio), they lent credence to the idea that the Tea Party is “extreme,” and so obviously racist, fascist, nativist, populist, and anti-intellectual. Not to mention, longing to squeeze into tight black goth garb and couple with the Beast.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: if sold on its merits, classical liberalism — and the Tea Party’s message is essentially a classical liberal message — crosses party lines and appeals to anyone who believes in individual liberty, smaller government, equality of opportunity, and the rule of law. It is constitutionalism — legal conservatism / libertarianism — substantively alienated from the rudderless country club Republicanism of Lindsey Graham, or the vote-counting gamesmanship of Karl Rove, for whom winning temporary majorities and chairmanships is more important than governing from a coherent philosophical base.
We don’t need slicker candidates. We need committed candidates.
Standing back and letting the Dems and the GOP establishment — both inside the Beltway and in the blogosphere — hammer away at your party’s duly-selected candidates (or hammering at them yourself), then pointing to the failure of those candidates as proof of your own initial assertion of their deficiencies, is nothing more than a transparent begging of the question.
Or at the very least, it’s a big fat thumb on the scale of reckoning.
Me, I want us to take the Senate when it is truly us taking the Senate. Meaning, I want conservatism and classical liberalism promoted and defending by actual conservatives and classical liberals. I’m just “purist” that way I guess.
They wanted Senator Castle so that MSNBC would have someone to hold up a a “Smart” Republican. So they didn’t feel stupid for being a Republican.
But what it really comes down to is, if you are a conservative woman, stay out of politics… you stupid, crazy, bitch.
Seriously. Why? I mean, clearly the Republican primary voters of Delaware didn’t want him, and this was their election. So why do so many GOP cheerleaders wish the primary voters of Delaware would have been smart and savvy enough to vote for a guy they didn’t want representing them, casting their vote instead for a woman they believed would.
A question that I have also been asking. And it should be followed with “Who the devil gave you the authority to pick who is to be the nominee anyway?”
At most these guys are counselors-for-hire and loudmouths with broadcast privileges*. At the very least they are failed samples that should have been landfilled decades ago. And they were any good they should have been able to persuade the Delawarans that they were right.
They didn’t.
*As opposed to me who is a loudmouth with an internet connection.
Exit polls showed Castle would have lost to Coons as well, only by a smaller margin. Losing more slowly, indeed.
But Castle wouldn’t have been a woman.
True, Castle wouldn’t couple with the Beast. He’d just get the reach-around.
Hells yeah. Great post. This isn’t a team sport that’s diversionary. This is for real and it is for keeps. Some “conservatives” should understand this by now.
Mr. Allah is very concerned that Lympia might not wanna play with the other Team R senators anymore. This makes me think the whole deal with Castle might’ve been like how you go get a puppy so your dog isn’t lonely all day. She’s lonely for her own kind and her coat is dull.
Trust the primary voters. It is called Democracy–try it. Delaware even has a closed primary, so Democrats cannot easily do mischief in the GOP selection process. We all tend to have comments on other state’s races, but if Trent Lott or Karl Rove want a vote in the Delaware primaries, they need to become residents there and then register as a Republican.
A plurality of Republicans rejected Princess Lisa in Alaska, the silvered haired Umpa Lumpa in Florida, and Mike Castle in Delaware.
“Why would we want a Senator Castle?”
Because he might not run around yimmer-yammering about opposing the gay agenda like all of those hoochie jesustard xtiaists.
I can’t believe that after all this time, so many supposedly bright people still don’t get the point:
If the candidate shares my small-government, pro-liberty, free-market principles, then I mentally insert a (T) after his name and vote for him. I don’t care if the ballot has a (D) or an (R) or an (I) or an (L) or any other letter, because I’m not a member of any of those teams. Now, if the Rs or Ds or whomever decided to embrace my principles as a central part of their platform, I might start considering myself a part of that team. But until such time, I vote for whomever I feel deserves the (T) behind their names. And if no such person is on the ballot, then I write in Mike Rowe or Ron Gardenhire.
I wish these chuckleheads would figure out that IT ISN’T MY JOB to help their team win the big homecoming game. It really is starting to chafe.
We don’t need slicker candidates. We need committed candidates.
That needs to be engraved into the hand-tooled Corinthian leather covers of the forthcoming Protein Wisdom coffeetable retrospective.
BTW, if a smart guy like Norman Lear has trouble parsing all these knotty issues facing our country, what hope does a dumb hater like you have?
I had the same irritation listening to people bitch about the fact that Ken Buck beat Jane Norton in the primary.
Why would we want a Senator Castle?
Because, if you’re a conservative, that would beat Senator Coons all to Hell.
O’Donnell is a Fruit Loop. I wouldn’t trust her with my lunch money. Not everyone who is down with the Tea Party agenda is competent. Senator O’Donnell? How’s about running for County Council first? Why would I want to vote for a complete political neophyte for the Senate? Isn’t that how we wound up with President Harvard Unicorn?
Don’t believe the exit polls. Castle made the local Dems so nervous, Slow Joe Biden’s son decided not to run for his dad’s seat within 48 hours of Castle’s announcement of candidacy. Castle consistently polled with double-digit leads.
Bah. The Tea Party thumps its chest & proclaims its allegiance to principle above politics, and I get Senator Coons. Thanks a lot.
You “purists” with your silly “ideals.” YOU DON’T GET HOW D.C. WORKS!
We need to win the Senate so that we have the committee chairmanships and staff that come with the majority. That get’s us power, influence, and prestige. We reward friends and punish enemies. That get’s us respect. Then we gain the trust of the media by showing that we can be responsible governing partners by compromising with the Democrats. That gets us favorable media coverage. The media helps us get the moderates and independents that you need to win the White House. Getting the White House gives us the opportunity to show that we can be even MORE responsible, benign and fair by compromising with Democrats. That shows that we can be trusted to govern alone. That gets us the trust of the moderates and independents that we need to keep winning in order to keep the White House and the Congress.
After you guys grow up, learn how to cooperate, help us build and keep an unbreakable hold on the reins of government (well, at least for a couple of generations anyways), THEN AND ONLY THEN DO YOU GET WHAT YOU WANT!
Sure, we’re losing slowly. We may even lose altogether before that happens. But that’s the chance you’ll just have to take. You need to TRUST us.
Comment by Molyuk on 11/4 @ 2:27 pm #
Take your complaint to the Delaware Republican Party then, pal.
Unless you don’t think the primary voters are capable of choosing who their nominee should be.
Which is the entire point of primaries as opposed to annointing sessions.
No, it wouldn’t.
Aimed at Molyuk.
>>Because, if you’re a conservative, that would beat Senator Coons all to Hell.
How so?
Molyuk, you know what Coons stands for.
You know what O’Donnell stands for.
What does Castle stand for? Without checking which day of the week it is, and which “concerned citizens” group has made a sizeable donation to his coffers, and what favor he wants to vote your way, maybe?
Certainty is better than uncertainty.
A Coons you can ignore is much better than a Castle you have to buy off every! single! time! to have a chance that he’ll vote your way.
Maybe I’m reading too much into your comment Molyuk, but nobody made you vote for the Communist instead of the Fruit Loop.
Mikey NTH,
The State Party apparatus wanted nothing to do with her, because she’s a lunatic. They knew she would lose. Everyone in Delaware knew she would lose.
Some great complete political neophytes won this year. I find this a strange complaint from a conservative. Now, if you want to complain about a lack of real world experience, I’d say that’s fair game.
Towards the rest, maybe you should have worked harder in the primaries or found a candidate who could have at least defeated complete political neophyte Christine O’Donnell.
Why are you complaining, Molyuk? It seems to me that, from the content of your post, you’d rather have a Sen. Coons than a Sen. O’Donnell – this Tuesday you got what you wanted.
Maybe the state party apparatus should worry more about cultivating stronger candidates who also reflect the will of their primary voters than griping that their annointed Democrat fuck toy was rejected.
[Lympia’s] lonely for her own kind and her coat is dull.
Really? With Susan and Lindsey and Lisa and John in the kennel?
Everyone in Delaware knew she would lose.
Then it’s a good thing she lost. Personally, I HATE IT when self-fulfilling prophecies fail to happen.
Molyuk, you may blame the primary voters for picking a Froot Loop, but what they really did, in essence, was to thumb their noses at the squishy little fuck their so-called political “leadership” tried to foist on them. Your ire is better targeted at the brilliant minds who selected a candidate so crappy that voters revolted and chose a different crappy candidate instead.
This.
>>Molyuk, but nobody made you vote for the Communist instead of the Fruit Loop.
Which he undoubtedly did, unless we are to believe he pulled the lever for someone he believes is a lunatic, Fruit Loop, untrustworthy, incompetent political neophyte loser.
You got what YOU voted for, Molyuk – quit complaining.
I wish you damned plebes would just shut up and vote who we want you to vote for.
For Senator Castle and all his supporters.
Gott im Himmel, that Lear dude is clueless!
We call you our leaders and put you in a position to be just that. Why, then, do you seem to wish to follow our lead? We ache to be led, not polled.
“We ache to be led?” Fuck you, Norm. Boehner is not my leader, he’s the GOP leader. My leader, if I can be said to have one, is the nice lady with the gold ring that matches the one on my left hand. I send people to Congress to represent me, not to lead me.
Next time one of these Progressive assholes sniffs about “teh sheeplz,” remind me to steer him to Norman for an example of what they’re really talking about.
Castle was in favor of Cap and Trade. That was enough right there to keep him out. I would rather have a commie with a D brand on him than a commie with an R brand on him. That way the people have a clear choice, rather than a choice of the commie on the fast track to hell or the commie on the slow track to hell. Either way, you end up in hell.
The State Party apparatus wanted nothing to do with her, because she’s a lunatic. They knew she would lose. Everyone in Delaware knew she would lose.
Perhaps the state party aparatchiks should have done a better job in recruiting candidates – such as one that the primary voters would vote for.
Note the problem there buddy? The primary voters did not like what the party aparatchiks were serving and told them. Very clearly. You know – in a sort of democratic fashion, which is the way we do things. The aparatchiks failed miserably, didn’t they? They didn’t understand their own party base, and I’m supposed to think that is an endorsement of their judgment?
Try harder.
Why? At least when Coons votes for a progressive expansion of government, he wont give it the veneer of “bi-partisanship.”
That’s a good thing.
The Dem caucus is now mostly leftists. Clear lines are being drawn. I hope Graham is defeated in his next primary. And if that means the state goes Dem, I’m cool with that.
Karl Rove has language issues.
Obviously Norm has never heard the expression “I must follow where they go. I am their leader.”
Plus this way Mike Castle and Chris Christie will have all the time in the world to explore their budding bromance and see where it goes and they’ll never be haunted by what might have been.
For Senator Castle
It’s un-natural to love you.
The worst thing about you, hf, is that you’re incredibly tiresome sometimes. How about giving it a rest?
Now, Squid, you know the left loves them some Führersprinzip. Mao, Castro, Ortega, Chavez, those are the kind of leaders a people “ach[ing] to be led” want. And they get it. Leadership. Until it hurts.
Asking if people should have voted or would have made a better chance of winning with Castle is like asking the same thing about Lindsy Graham, who is going to be bounced with extreme prejudice when his time rolls around.
I will vote for a flawed outside 110% of the time from here on out, as I did with Rubio.
castles made of sand
fall into the sea
eventually
“The worst thing about you, hf, is that you’re incredibly tiresome sometimes. How about giving it a rest?”
I think it’s the unremitting passive-agressive howling for attention….but that’s just me.
i love happyfeet!
The Dem caucus is now mostly leftists.
If it stays that way long term, it will be even more of a problem than it already is. I think our goal should be to make a failed state like California or New York, safe for a Blue-Dog like Shuler (sp?). When Blue-Dogs comprise the left wing of the Democrat party, we’ll have won.
happyfeets like dennis the menace
he might hit a bunch of balls thru ur window
and cause u much pain, with all the repairing the windows and shit, but every once [alot] in awhile
he’ll hit s grand slam
and i’m not talking a Dennys breakfast
actually-every commentatortots on here is great
this is the best website because of u smarty funny
sarcastic commentators-tots-
please break many arms patting ur selfs on ur backs
You’re the greatest, pd.
buttons thank you I don’t know why people are so grumpy right after we won the Big Game
awww=thanks-i’m just glad that i’m allowed in the clubhouse
frankly i’m surprised jeff hasn’t banned me/ ace of spades banned me after one comment-whoo hoo!
When Blue-Dogs comprise the left wing of the Democrat party, we’ll have won.
No, no, no a thousand times no! We will never get to that point without the Pelosi’s et al in charge. We just got done knocking off a truckload of them anyway, as nobody really wants a Dem or Rep-lite that, in turn, votes with his majority party on any legislation of consequence, e.g. Mike Castle.
Molyuk: No resident of a State that’s been sending Joey Hairplugs to Washington since they were using velociraptors to pull the sled has any business calling anybody a “fruitloop”.
Regards,
Ric
“awww=thanks-i’m just glad that i’m allowed in the clubhouse
frankly i’m surprised jeff hasn’t banned me/ ace of spades banned me after one comment-whoo hoo!”
Srsly??…What’d you say?
There is more intelligence in a hypothetical nail fragment of christine 0’Donnel’s left little pinky that maybe she bit off than the entire fucking brain trust of Obama, coons, frank, pelosi, reid, and boxer and whoever the fuck you want to add to that list. I mean, man, wtf. And don’t get me started on summers, geithner and bernanke.
To attribute intelligence to these criminals and then attack christine ODonnell, Sharon Angle, Karen Handel, etc…well, you ain’t so fucking bright your self asshole.
some insane drivel..if u’ve read my plasterings u
know i have a tendency to go off on tangents
but thats ok-i’m not mad or anything
ECM: The thinking behind my remark was that the Blue-Dogs would comprise the left-wing because the Pelosis would be too far outside of the mainstream to be electable.
And we should want the Democrat party to be more mainstream (once we’re in a position to say what mainstream is). That will keep us from getting fat lazy and stupid.
It wasn’t slickness she lacked, but I won’t belabor the point. But yeah, I’m guilty this far: I probably would like a vote to repeal Ocare and a farging rino in office instead of a marxist. That would be something. If people had managed to contain themselves enough not to crow about her, maybe her negative coattails wouldn’t have destroyed what republican chances existed in DE or other candidates. Take a look at the damage wrought, probably related to her being pushed front and center – she wasn’t chosen for herself, she was chosen as a way to punish. SHe didn’t do the outlaw movement any favors.
You know how I know that? Cause I did it to myself. And really, my finger nail clippings are smarter than those shit heads. And I’m no super hero.
Why can’t we just send all our sick people to Maine?
RINOs do the outlaw movement even less favors.
i’m a tollbooth collecter in maine
and frankly i’m sick and tired of fishing out
lepers fingers from the change baskets
can’t we send them to idaho/
i dunno
alaska
Yes she did Mike. History will be kind to sharon angle,christine o’donnell, linda mcmahon (sorry I missed her first time) and karen handel who should be the governer of
georgia. They are real live heros.
stealing from myself: If Coons is a bearded Marxist, guys like Castle (and Graham and Rove) are the beards.
Enough.
leper colony jokes!
any one want to leave leper colony island just raise ur hand
She did from where I sit.
Watching the way the establishment GOPers and the sneering Dems went after her was instructive and clarifying. And classical liberals and legal conservatives are taking note.
Here’s the thing: It now looks like the GOP picked up nearly 700 seats in state assemblies, greatest gains ever in the modern era. And they did that BEFORE redistricting. This was a colossal win at the grass roots level. And people like O’Donnell — a political outsider, really — was part of creating the “enthusiasm gap” that allowed all this, well, hope and change.
I honestly don’t care if O’Donnell gets your snob glands pumping. She performed well in her debates, and she has set the stage for other newbies who want to take runs at the establishment, because the establishment simply doesn’t represent them. And they get tired of either holding their noses to pull the lever, or else staying home altogether.
I think you’d be hard pressed to find anyone “crowing” about O’Donnell. Arguing that a Fruit Loop was better on the issues than either a closeted statist or an out-n-proud Marxist, sure.
hey- how about a high five?mmm
a high four?mmm
a high three?
A literal Froot Loop, even.
I agree, donald. As Jeff said, Christine O’Donnell has paved the way for other anti-establishment candidates. Much like Barry Goldwater in 1964. And the furor going on today about how she, Angle, and Handel were treated is a sure sign that the days of country club dominance of the GOP are numbered. People will not forget, and in the coming years the likes of John Cornyn and Lindsey Graham will pay the price.
Trust us, you would have preferred us to Coons. Plus, we’re darned tasty!
The problem with hypotheticals is that reality is resistant to ‘but-for’ substitutions. Say Castle was nominated and even elected. He supports cap-n-trade and his ACU rating in non-election years averages under 30. The Dems can live with him in the Senate so they move the money and resources from keeping Coons alive to target Toomey in PA or Kirk in IL. So maybe the DE RIN .. I mean GOP gets a win but it becomes a wash in the Senate, and a loss for the GOP overall.
the good thing about O’Donnell is she’ll scare the Princess Lindseys of the world into voting and legislating like maybe they’re at least a little concerned about a primary challenge
other than that insert derogatory boilerplate here
“He supports cap-n-trade….”
BZZZZT!
Eat shit and fail…do not pass go.
@Ernst – I’d be happy with Blue dogs being the mainstream of the Democrat party. Bring back Scoop Jackson!
There aren’t any Blue Dogs left that I can see. The supposed Blue Dogs voted for ObamaCare, Cap and Trade, and Teh Stimulus.
Not very Blue Doggy of them.
JeffG makes a very good point about the nearly 700 new GOP local level exlectees and furthering the ground game; it is fantastic timing indeed when redistricting to accomodate the 2010 census results next year.
JeffG. Do you think that in addition to your ideological committment to classical liberalism there may also be a personal component to your anger at the establishment> An outgrowth of your blackballing perhaps. I’m not being critical, just asking; it matters not either way.
Just like the “electibility” of Angle, Buck, O’Donnell perhaps mattered less in the end than the down-ballott affects. With Senators like Mav, Grahamnesty, the Maine sisters, and yes, to an extent Scott Brown there were always going be challenges to the conservative agenda and an inability to count on blocking Obama appointments; because of notions regarding comity, bipartisanship, and compromise in the minds of some of the Senators I listed.
Outside of assisting in “vetting” state level candidates, the national GOP needs to stay out of the candidate selection process and base their planning on the local electorates instead of individual candidates. Let the people decide their own choice and then back that choice-no questions.
But let’s not forget that too long in the Senate turns everyone into left of center “moderates.” They all start to think that government is the solution to every problem, and they drive the government.
Because they told you she is.
(Because she threatened their gravy trains.)
And, really, the former senator holding that seat was the utterly idiotic, completely out-of-touch Biden. The supposedly lunatic O’Donnell would have been an improvement.
But because she’s a “lunatic” you’ve let yourself instead be represented by a perfectly “sane” adherent of Marxism.
What do you all have against Froot Loops? Sniff…My life’s work…
Regardless of Castle’s position on specific issues, there is still no way to prove that substituting him for O’Donnell would have lead directly to the outcome we saw on Nov 2 *plus a GOP victory in DE*. And that’s a principle that can be applied to any of the ‘but-for’ hypotheticals that people are throwing around – abandoning Whitman or Forina to support Miller or Angle would have lead to a win in AK or NV, for example.
From a tea party standpoint, O’Donnell’s race was enormously clarifying.
From all sides came anguished wails: “BUT SHE’S NOT ONE OF US!” We now have a pretty good idea who’s included in the “us” of those wails. Those are the enemy. Luring the enemy into providing target data is a good thing in the long run.
Regards,
Ric
Ah, that favorite phrase of leftists: “his people”. “Castro loves his people”, “Chavez is just thinking of his people”. Because people are possessions, right?
Of those who complain that voters should have held their noses and voted for Castle in the primary because it would have increased the likelihood of an (R) victory, how many think Castle was a petulant asshole for not immediately turning around and endorsing O’Donnell after the primary, so as to increase the likelihood of an (R) victory. Sauce for the goose, etc., it seems to me. It seems Castle himself refused to dispense precisely what he, and his supporters, expected from the primary voters.
“…how many think Castle was a petulant asshole for not immediately turning around and endorsing O’Donnell after the primary, so as to increase the likelihood of an (R) victory.”
I’m one, right here…Like Murkowski, Castle chose to try and harm the conservative agenda instead of endorse the winner; as they no doubt would have demanded had the roles been reversed.
Ace banned you? Really? Who does he think he is…ME?
So, let’s say Castle won the primary and then the general. SO FUCKING WHAT? Harry Reid would still be the majority leader. Not one damn thing would change. But…there would then be one more to “Reach across the aisle.”
The days of voting for someone simply because they have an R next to their name are over…Hopefully.
Sorry Mike, I was on the blackberry, I didn’t read well. Which is common.
Oh, and just to put the cherry on top: http://tinyurl.com/37fnlpn
(Via Dan Riehl & Frank J on Twitter)
“We can’t help you. You’re not one of us.”
Regards,
Ric
August 24 2010
September 14 2010
The first date was Meghan’s useless daddy’s primary in Arizona.
The second one was where Christy O teabagged Mike Castle in Delaware.
If those dates had been switched I think Hayworth might would have done substantially better cause of how people were so pissed about how shitty Team R behaved.
Thanks, Ric.
Yet another reason to scream at the GOP drones who call my house wanting my cash.-
Molyuk is one of those guys who enjoys losing more slowly because it gives him time to savor the losing.
If sentenced to hang by the neck until dead he’d rather strangle over the course of several minutes than get that last-minute phone call from the governor settingh him free.
must i remind u? i had a cat that i had/did color him
in blue food coloring- he was Blue- Blue the cat
so i think we shouldn’t be talking about blue dogs
but blue cats!
don’t u dare step on my blue suede shoes!
don’t u dare!
meow
happyfeet,
Mitch Daniels was just on Fox news. Good interview. I agreed wholeheartedly with everything he said and could easily see myself supporting him in word, cash, and ground effort. That said, I hope he can develop a more dynamic, forceful persona/presentation.
Then again, I’ve never seen him in campaign mode.
Pardon me, I left the adjectives, “sell-out” and “establishment GOP lovin” out before “Fox news”…
A thousand pardons :)
That last shit you posted is why I’m annoyed with you, hf. Please, just let it go.
Christie did what politicians do, endorse the chosen GOP candidate. I doubt he even looked at it that hard. When he starts governing like a progressive, bitch away. Otherwise, knock it off. It’s frelling tedious.
happyfeet,
Do me a favor and drop the Castle/Christie “bromance” narrative. Need I remind you that Daniels campaigned for McCain? So, you know, damnation by association be damned.
I’ve got to tell you, Squid, I ache for some leadership. But let me rephrase. I ache for competent management. We’re hiring people to run the joint. Good help, and good management, seems terribly difficult to find. I would love for us to hire somebody that isn’t a power drunk nitwit and instead does the fucking job and does it right. The big chair comes with tremendous power. Wouldn’t it be fantastic to find someone who understands how it was meant to be used and ain’t afraid to do it?
Mr. cranky that last post had nothing to do with Mr. Christie whatsoever.
Christy O for all her faults is not a fat man from Jersey.
Teh pure staunchiness, it buuuuuuurns!!!
That Lear dude does have his American organizational flow chart all fucked up. I am at the top, dude. You are too, even though you’re too dumb to know it. Learn it, know it, live it.
leper colony jokes..
leper says to priest
father- i want to kneel in front of the lord and thank him
priests says- yes.yes-thy will be done
but leper says to priest- father.. how can i kneel when
i don’t have a leg to stand on?
You’re right, hf. It was post 39 that mentioned him. Either way, it’s fucking annoying.
I think Mr. Daniels’ persona would contrast nicely with bumblefuck’s just the way he is.
Screw it. See you in two weeks, hf.
I’m sure there is that component. But that just intensifies the disgust. It didn’t create it.
why did the leper cross the street?
because a chicken picked up one of his fingers and scooted[libby] across the street and it was a ring finger with a sentimental ring on it from
grammy leper, so he had to cross the street-and find that damn chicken
he didn’t want to cross the street..no.. and really/ who do-but if a chicken steals ur ring finger finger
with a grammy ring on it
ya gotta go..ya just gotta
look both ways before crossing
i think of lepers as kind zombies
who don’t want to eat my brains
it’s comforting
I do not understand… Chris Christie’s recent enthusiastic endorsements of two prominent global warming whores – Mike Castle and Meg Whitman – they say a lot about him I think, and at that very least they suggest he would not agree with Mr. Jeff’s post very much at all.
When it comes to facing down the Team R establishment, Chris Christie knows what side he’s on, and it’s not yours.
how many lepers does it take to change a light-bulb?
a thousand
[burnt flesh stinks!]
That’s what I was suggesting JeffG,
that your own personal experience at the hands of the establishment made your disgust exponentially greater, but was not the source.
Everyone here knows you’ve been on the establishment GOP, for longer than this cycle, to get back to conservative principles.
and at *the* very least I mean
how can u play that game
‘tag-your it” with a leper?
cuz when they tag u they sometimes leave behind their hand on you and i dont think thats fair
fucking lepers/ cheaters!
leper colonies are always in some exotic
south pacific locale
wtf!-damn lepers should be housed in buffalo
or cleveland/ siberia/east st louis
really- a pacific island?
if i told u i’m losing my hair would u ship me off to some paradise?
guns, god, babies
So I guess that means Daniels agrees with McCain on ever issue? Based on the logic you are using to paint a RINO sign on Christie it would seem that way.
And what do you think Gov. Daniels would say if he were asked the proverbial “big tent GOP” question. In his Fox interview he stressed finding bi-partisan compromise solutions to the debt problem.
I like him happyfeet; I’d like to see him run in 2012 and push losers like Romney, Pawlenty, and Huck aside. But you should recognize that nobody is flawless, and you only insult people who like Christie, much like with Palin, when you broad-brush him as Rino-esque based on a single issue or episode. Base criticism on his actions and ideas, in government, not who he has stood with on the campaign trail.
As I mentioned before regarding Castle, I’m suspect Christie was sent to CA to campaign for Whitman becasue he had been successful in a deep blue state and that voters might find him more credible because of that, not necessarily because they were sympatico.
It seems Castle himself refused to dispense precisely what he, and his supporters, expected from the primary voters.
When are you rubes going to learn? PATRONAGE flows down, LOYALTY flows up.
Happy was talking about eating cupcakes with a spoon, but did he get in a fight over some muffins?
http://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local_news/muffin_exchange_leads_to_assault_arrest_106575768.html
I don’t have any problem with your point of view Mr. Bob… but I don’t see why it bothers you that I have suspicions about the magnitude of Chris Christie’s staunch factor and that I think his endorsement of Mike Castle was a clue … I don’t demand that you agree at all not even a little, plus also I think he’s a great governor of New Jersey.
Long may he reign.
Obama was right about one thing, the good ordinairy people of the Tea Party have “enemies”. Among the most dangerous of these are the remaining RINOs(also known as self-serving elitist cowards). It is time to purge our patriotic ranks of these leeches. Mitch McConnel, Richard Lugar, et.al., must be defeated along with the democrats.
McConnell’s more of a putz than a RINO I think
Hey Molyuk what did you do to get O’donnel elected? You know so you would not suffer under Coons? Give money, phone bank Knock on doors? Or did you sit around a giggle about the witch shit like a good little party apparatchik? Yeah thats what I thought.
DA 50 grams more beets for you comrade.
No happyfeet, your suspicions don’t bother me one bit. Don’t misunderstand, I’m only pointing out that much like with your outspoken criticisms of Palin, that’s going to anger more than a few folks.
It’s easier to persuade folks if the discussion doesn’t start with you dismissing their fave out of hand.
To me, you can feel free to fire away. I only formed an equivalent statement with Daniels to perhaps raise your awareness of how the assertion you make can put folks off. Like I said, I personally am down with Mitch all the way!
“McConnell’s more of a putz than a RINO I think”
No question about this.
mitchie wants to be stupid with communists. good luck.
I dig Chris Christie too. I was disappointed by him supporting Castle (which he should have stayed out of) and speaking out on the wrong side of the Ground Zero mosque issue (which he probably should have stayed out of too, although at least that has some connection to New Jersey, given the Port Authority connection). But I still like the fact that he taking on the Teachers Unions in New Jersey.
you almost give me hope Mitch is still in the game
thank you
why are we looking for “bi-partisan compromise solutions” with thugs who ram things through on a straight party line vote?
fat guy should stick to his knitting. he knows how to do that.
also Chris Christie is dangerously close to becoming celebrified if you ask me, and he’s dangerously close to looking like he’s a willing partner in his own celebrification
but that’s just a me thing I’m just sharing it to reveal my biases
Rumor is that Pence is going to run for Governor. Will have a tough time living up to Mitch’s legacy.
– Why the hell should we compromise on anything?
maybe Pence can get to work on helping make Indiana a right to work state [PPT about how wonderful it would be if Indiana were a right to work state] … Mr. Daniels did give it a shot earlier but no luck
many interesting facts are include
I thought Pence was considering a Presidential run?
he should be stressing moving the ” overton window” to the right by asking why the f we need a dept of energy, education, agriculture et al. hey let’s talk about gutting gov’t programs that help the left!
how hard would it be to say “outside of the yellow sticker on the refrigerator at home depot what the f’s is the energy dept purpose?”
Well, a “bi-partisan compromise” of leaving the anti-trust exemption for labor intact while eliminating the Department of Education would be OK with me.
And I’d really like to eliminate that anti-trust exemption.
“what the f’s is the energy dept purpose?”
In it’s initial iteration, as the Atomic Energy Commission, then as the Nuclear Research Commission, they regulated nuclear power plants as well as administrating nuclear energy and weapons research. It transformed into the Department of Energy under Carter.
Our senate race up here in snowbilly land (Madcowski/Miller) was a real taste of things to come for the Republican Party on a national level-
We dumped her in the primaries; the long knives really came out to put her back in place- the Dems even tossed their own candidate under the bus to support her. There are a whole lot of pissed-off conservatives up here that will remain highly motivated to purge the RINOS from the Republican leadership.
“Well, a “bi-partisan compromise” of leaving the anti-trust exemption for labor intact while eliminating the Department of Education would be OK with me.”
I’d call that a fair compromise, Rob. A cost effective one too.
Seems to me that the best way for Congress to demonstrate that it’s serious about the debt problem would be to stop adding to it. Refusing to raise the debt ceiling would send that message.
Here‘s the segment Bob referenced (had to turn off adblock for the video to load myself).
I’m not sure that I’d characterize it as “he stressed finding bi-partisan compromise solutions to the debt problem”.
Happyfeet – Gov Daniels just got a huge majority in the House, and a supermajority in the Senate. There is likely going to be many good things happen in the next 2 years.
No problem, donald. I’m frequently on the BlackBerry myself, so I’ve done that as well.
yes they do that so well
bh,
I can’t listen for an hour or so to your clip, but I admit freely that I was paraphrasing. I believe that his points were something like:
-The debt is the most serious issue our nation faces; a national security issue
-We need to deal with the problem as we’ve dealt with issues of that magnitude, existential threats, in the past, by working together
-Everyone’s ideas should be considered.
It sounded to me like he was willing to compromise with the Democrats in the interest of solving the problem. I think he’s a pragmatist, and I don’t mean that in the pejorative sense that Jeff’s been using around here to ridicule the go-along, get-along, unprincipled types.
Rasputin is less resilient than that Alaskan apparatchik, you realize they were maybe 4 good members in the GOP party caucus up there, Parnell grabbed two as advisers, and they were forced to resign by some middling technicality, he still won by nearly 20 points, despite every publication from the Daily News, to the Seattle Post Intelligencer were opposed to him
That’s much closer to what I heard as well, Bob.
My take on that is that any politician who refers to the debt as an existential threat on par with past national security issues, isn’t advocating the “get favorable press” bipartisanship we all rightfully disdain. He’s actually framing our fiscal crisis in a manner that puts the progressives in a hard position with worried independents.
I’d follow that with two thoughts. Can anyone name the sponsors of Reagan’s ’86 tax cuts? And, can anyone name the 2012 GOP hopefuls who are advocating cutting all these departments? I want to be sure we treat them all equally if this is to be our measure of them.
Not much of it around, is there?
Of course, Reagan’s tax reform act of 1986 was sponsored by Democrats; Dick Gephardt and Bill Bradley…
I confess that I don’t even know who the actual 2012 hopefuls are yet, outside of some I’m biased against unless there’s some kind of extraordianry game changer; you know, Romney, Huck, Pawlenty. I suppose we’ll know soon, and you’re right, their willingness to discuss the issue seriously will be a measure of their leadership.
FWIW, I think Paul Ryan will make it easier for any serious candidate by broaching the subject loooong before the primaries seriously begin.
that’s very exciting JD… things are sorta opposite here in california
I’ll give you another one, if they’d been allowed to vote on it, many of the Democrats who lost their jobs on Tuesday would have voted to extend the Bush tax cuts. All of our people would have. It would have been bipartisan.
Should we not accept bipartisanship when it works in our favor? Because I’ll tell you what, the Democrats would find that to be a truly amusing position for us to take.
Another: support for the Second Amendment has become bipartisan ever since they realized it was killing them. Should we reject that as well?
Oh, and my first sentance in #147 was clumsy. I meant I can’t review your clip until after 2230, z-5. My wife and MIL are watching TV in the same room I’m typing in.
Did you think I sold Daniels short bh? Or abused his intent? I’m not being defensive, just curious.
No, I don’t think you did, Bob. I think the initial short paraphrase simply contained the word bipartisanship which people react to viscerally because of past negative experiences while the longer paraphrase was pretty close to how I’d put it.
I guess what I think I recognize in Daniels is a certain slyness. He knows he’s in politics. And when he talks about social issues I see him negating the progressives ability to get cheap votes. (Obama didn’t campaign on gay marriage or done anything on that front while in office, has he? Cheap votes. In that same vein, what was Daniel’s answer on Mexico City abortions? We don’t have the money.) And when he talks about the debt, I see him setting the progressives up to have to justify their spending habits. They LOSE when this is the issue. “Tax and spend liberal” is a death sentence when it can be successfully hung around someone’s neck. Has been for awhile.
Of course not. Actual bi-partisanship is always desireable, provided it’s in accordance with the Constitution. It’s especially helpful in tackling difficult problems that can be easily demagogued. But I also think there’s a Constitutional line to draw.
I would welcome Democrats joining the GOP to reform entitlements, cut spending, and develop a plan to pay off our national debt. That will be especially difficult considering the blue-dog wipeout that took place, to be sure.
Look, I’ll be candid. I recognize that part of the budget balancing process may involve freezing/cutting/ eliminating part, or all, of my Navy pension and the concomitant benefit. And I most likely will NEVER recieve any of the money I pay in FICA taxes on the income I make being self-employed. Others will end up making other sacrifices they may have counted on; student loans, means tested social security/medicare, etc…
But if that comes to pass, it better also be accompanied by serious welfare entitlement reforms as well as the elimination of unconstitutional agencies.
OT – Bob Reed, if you’re around they’re airing some good stuff on the Military Channel right now. Carrier-Fortress at Sea. Filmed in ’95. Not sure if that was when you were in or not, but you might like it anyway. No Skull&Crossbones though.
Oh, well there you are right there. Refresh is my friend!
Ah, the “bi-partisanship” TRIGGER-ALERT!11!1!
That’s amusing actually, given that this blog is about intentionalism!
Did I hijack Mitch’s intent? Did I choose my phrase sloppily, so others may have misinterpreted my intent? Considering I don’t use terms like “bi-partisan” or “pragmatism” to ridicule or demean disingenuous actions, it’s an interesting conundrum.
Especially considering how JeffG has been employing them as terms of art in discussions here about phony behavior.
MY BRAIN HURTS!
Happyfeet – he also got an initiative passed, overwhelmingly, that caps property taxes at one percent of assessed value for homesteads. I suspect he will pursue an aggressive legislative agenda.
The problem is, even if we offer the left some of the things they SAY they want — an end to “corporate welfare”, for example — they’ll still demagogue everything WE want to cut. Hell, I wouldn’t be surprised if they don’t find a way to oppose even the things they say want. Watch for some of them declaring that corporate subsidies are important for American jobs…
that does way more to make home ownership attractive than the mortgage interest tax deduction I think
he still won by nearly 20 points, despite every publication from the Daily News, to the Seattle Post Intelligencer were opposed to him
Parnell is at best a “status quo” guy; he has the Alaska Public Employees vote locked up for a reason. Berkowitz is such a hardcore lib that there really wasn’t any choice.
We are battling an uphill fight in a state where more than 60% of the workforce is employed by state, local, or federal government.
The 4.125% interest rate i locked in today makes it rather attractive to.
that’s historic
Paul Krugman explains why the recession is lingering: We aren’t far enough in debt. Apologies if it’s already been flayed.
Truth be told, Bob, I don’t think we’ve been in disagreement with any of these comments and I definitely don’t think you hijacked anyone’s intent or the like.
I was actually responding to a certain gibberish generator without directly addressing him. 1) Certain words set him off and 2) he’s unable to place the same standards on Palin or Reagan that he so quickly applies to others.
Speaking of his actual policies and accomplishments is an odd approach, JD. We’re supposed to just freak out and call him a cocktail party Beltway monster.
Krugman is like a midget broken record. A demonic screeching midget with a horrific and ironic beard.
Thanks for the tip Big D.
But My wife and MIL are watching TV right now. I’ll have to remember to set up the DVR so I can get an airplane pron fix!
Hope all is ok with you and yours.
He is obviously a cocktail party beltway insider, bh. And he wants a truce.
link
I agree bh,
It would make conversation easier. But you know, while I was pissed that night, I forgive newrouter for his abuse, and have chosen instead to fuhgeddabowditt.
Some people view that as an inherent weakness of God-bothery types like me, but to me, it’s a strength; and part of “walking the walk” down the path in the direction that He leads me.
Whatevz anyway, life’s too short to let someone steal my joy over a trifling insult; especially when I only need to read the paper to get some real outrage goin’ !
“He is obviously a cocktail party beltway insider, bh. And he wants a truce.”
KRUGMAN!, wants a truce, for reals JD?
I’m kidding, I know that you were snarking.
html fail.
i like cocktail parties cuz thats the only time i can
wear a dress in public and an andy warhol/phyliss diller wig in public
and maybe..maybe..pull it off
oh-and the drinks, love me some cocktales!
Midgets, and Yelvertons, and Krugmans are bugfucknutz.
i wish i was in the armed services cuz i’d really like to write something on one of them bombs
but i ain’t so i cant so i wont
That would be a good idea for an online java app: writing on a bombshell, just like you can write on a church marquee or a gravestone or Einstein’s blackboard.
T.S.I. you may have hit on a moneymaker!
i dont know what i’d write..
probably some shakespeare
something wicked this way comes
wiley coyote finally figured it out
Americas got talent
ooh-i get a bobby orr!
I was just reading a hidden nugget in BarckyCare about the Sunshine provisions for pharmacy/biotech companies and doctors. barcky and his I’ll are fucking fuckers.
Comment by Bob Reed on 11/4 @ 6:13 pm #
Bob – it is a lot that. The immediate dismissal of some politician for some perceived sin with the dismissal being a wave of sexual slurs. That turns people off to any argument that could later be mustered as to why the politician is so bad or the sin so awful.
For someone supposedly involved with marketing and concerned about “optics” it is a major blind spot in my opinion.
JD we did something similar in michigan the first time we reformed the property taxes. The result was that assessed valuations started heading for the moon. The second time we added that assessments can’t rise faster than 5% or the rate of the CPI which ever is lower. Assessments then only jump (or fall) a lot when the property is sold. Homesteads only of course and extra assessments can be done through the vote.
Big “M” up there.
John Judis hits the same note.
Geoffb – I am pretty sure that has been done, or will be done, via legislation. The overall initiative thingie was almost a page long, so I knew what it did in general terms.
It’s never fun when you know the Germans are laughing at you.
Judis should have to rent oxygen, as he is wasted a valuable resource.
Something Wicked This Way Comes
I see that Willie the cat-banger is trolling Patterico, bleating the old tired “Bush lied, people died!” BS from 2006. What a fucking loser.
– Recap:
– The Dragon awoke, the Dragon spoke.
– 1/3 of the power is recovered. 2/3’s remain in enemy hands.
– 0% of the work to “un-transform” America has been done. 100% is yet to be done.
– Will the Dragon now retreat into its customary apolitical cave.
– Stay tuned sports fans.
Yeah, you know the lefties are massively butt-hurting when they have to revive the good-times Bush-bashing memes. They are so transparent.
Mike Castle is the very epitome of “middle of the road”: center-left on social issues, center-right on financial issues. He’s a RINO only if your tent is too small for moderates. He has a long record of boring competence in public service. He’s far from my dream candidate – he hates guns, for example – but he is well to the right of anyone Delaware Dems bandied as a possible candidate.
Christine O’Donnell is a social conservative. Until this election cycle, her platform has always stressed family values issues: creationism in schools, gays are icky, pro-life. That’s not why I oppose her so vehemently. I oppose her because her only qualification for the job is her willingness to use Tea Party rhetoric. She has no record of public service to evaluate. Her bio is not filled with achievement in any field whatsoever.
Chris Coons is New Castle County Executive. He’s from Stuff White People Like’s central casting. He was taking one for the team in this election, running against Castle when Beau Biden decided doing so wasn’t in his best interests.
Mike Castle would have beaten Chris Coons like a dog. Every poll said so. Sneer at bi-partisanship all you like: Delaware Democrats like Mike Castle. They forgive him the heresy of the R because of that long record of boring competence. Democrats vastly outnumber Republicans here.
Christine O’Donnell lost in 2008 to Joe Hairplugs by 30 points. This year, aided by Obama’s breathtaking incompetence and a D candidate who was supposed to be a sacrificial lamb, she cut that in half. Wow. From
my keyboard in Wilmington it looks as though the Tea Party let the Dems sweep the statewide elections by punting an easy win in the name of rhetoric.
None of you can name a single issue on which Coons is to Castle’s right, because there aren’t any. None of you can name a single poll in which O’Donnell led statewide – not this year, not in 2008, not in 2006 – because there aren’t any.
Molyuk, how is it to be a DuPont stooge?
I wish. They pay well, and they prefer early retirement packages to layoffs.
Molyuk,
I think she led in the primaries.
What part of ‘democracy’ exactly don’t you like?
“In remarks to reporters after meeting with his Cabinet at the White House on Wednesday, Obama urged lawmakers to avert an income tax increase that could take effect Jan 1, ratify a new arms-reduction treaty with Russia, provide unemployment aid to victims of the recession and extend expiring tax breaks for business.”
= Tax increase: Yes well, he still thinks its a bad idea to let business have any possible way to plan for the future, or even know the risks of doing business in his “transformed” America. But you know, he lost, so ge’ll willing to throw the rubes a few bones.
– Treaties with Russia: Yeah, now there’s an earth shakingly important bit of business. Axelrod must have scratched his head for hours trying to think of a 3rd issue for Bumbblefuckd “victory” speech.
– And extending the un-employment might hang onto a few voters, and you know, it worked so well in Holland, another “transformed” country, they repealed it after two years. They found that, in general when you provide long term unemployment benefits the majority stayed unemployed, but surprise surprise, they found jobs within a month after the dole ended if they knew for sure it was done. Which well may be the true “multiplier” effect in Socialist based countries.
– Meh. The Golden Erkel is still trying to act the king while dealing from an empty wagon.
The part where gadflies drink hemlock.
Time to get active locally and agitate for better representation then.
That’s just it, Bod. We had better representation. We had a former Governor, former U.S. Representative respected on both sides of the aisle. We had a squishy centrist who was as far to the right as the numerically dominating Democrats can tolerate. We threw that away so we could lose with a woman who only discovered fiscal-con rhetoric in her third bid for the office.
that was well said Mr. molyuk I just think Lympia and Princess Lindsey and Meghan’s useless daddy don’t need any more pals for their stupid douchey gangs of 4 or 9 or 12 or however many
Explain to me what’s center-right about Cap and
TradeTax?well said meaning 199
Someone willing to let the ultimate free speech gagging piece of offal, known as the DISCLOSE Act, and facilitate the hoax that is cap n trade, and that was his starting point
19 million voted in the GOP primary. 4 million more than voted in Dem primaries.
Close to 700 state assembly seats. A complete and utter rebuke to Obama — and the Tea Party is directly responsible. O’Donnell was part of that.
If you wanted Castle so badly you should have made sure he won the primary. He didn’t. And that’s because he doesn’t represent conservatism or classical liberalism at all, and the primary voters knew it. If Castle is center right on fiscal issues, he wouldn’t make overtures about supporting what would amount to a tax on everything — beginning with the air and trickling down to anything that uses fuel — effectively raising energy costs, food cost, clothing costs, transportation costs, and on and on and on and on.
Coons can vote for that shit. And it’ll stick to him. If the voters of Delaware want a Marxist, they can have one. But they own it.
… who defeated YOUR favorite in the primaries. Maybe ‘bipartisan respect’ isn’t that popular. Maybe balls-to-the-wall, no-nonsense, take no fucking prisoners, differentiated product was what the grassroots wanted.
Anyway cry me a river. I live in CT, and look what happened here. These are the breaks. 2012’s not so far away. Time to get back in the saddle and fight harder.
bomb writings
[smiths/morrissey lyrics]
it’s the bomb,the bomb, the bomb that will bring us together
Exactly. Desiring “bi-partisan respect” is what gave us McCain in ’08 and the disaster of the last 4 years.
The reckoning is here. The only people left who like establishment Republicans are establishment Republicans. And the Dems, if it means helping establishment Republicans defeat a Tea Party candidate.
McConnell sees the writing on the wall. Cornyn and Princess Lindsey? Not so much.
But they soon will.
bomb scratchings 2
hows my ass taste?
Somewhere along the line they forgot that Judges are important, as is Obamacare, Castle didn’t deign to debate her, he just sent along proxies like Gainey, Tom Ross, et al
bomb thingy 3
please allow me to introduce myself, i’m a man of wealth and taste
Winston, if you keep insisting that the fashionably attired Mr. Castle hasn’t any clothes on, I’m going to have to question your sanity AGAIN!
Jeff, I don’t own it. I didn’t vote for Marxism, Bearded nor otherwise. I threw my vote away on the Libertarian, who has a better prima facie claim to the mantle of Classical Liberalism and no record whatsoever of saying idiotic things on national television.
I’m not pooping on the national results. I chose this thread to gripe in precisely because you’re making her out to be something she’s not. O’Donnell loves Friedrich Hayek the way a potential parolee loves Jesus. It may be genuine, but the timing is highly suspicious.
they seek him here,they seek him there,
his clothes are loud but never square
it will make him or break him so he’s got to buy the best
Cause he’s a dedicated follower of fashion
But just to put the whole deal in perspective (and this is from a libertarian constitutionalist, not a conservative republican) – a blue CT and DE in exchange for a red FL is a damn good deal when you consider how that changes the Electoral College for 2012.
I wanted gridlock this election, and the GOP overshot somewhat in the House. One more red Senate seat would have been preferable, but I’m not too dissatisfied how that’s turned out. But as was mentioned upthread, the real win was at the district level. Because those districts are the laboratories where the next generation of nationally recognized classical liberals are going to come from, if anywhere.
Good luck and congratulations to the winners like Rubio; I hope they don’t sell out, and don’t have to compromise too much.
But the people I’m betting on are the class of 2010 at the local level, and the last thing they need is to see is the GOP stabbing conservatives in the back because the Party Machine thinks its ‘common members’ are foolish dupes. The machine is there to serve its members, not the other way around.
The public disgust with Congress and its low approval rating is far less a function of politics than one of contempt for the body as a whole, and if the RNC doesn’t understand that they need to be pushed out of the way, to let the rank and file run the show.
And in conclusion, win or lose, O’Donnell’s name on that ticket served Classical Liberalism far, far better than Castle’s would have, whether he won or lost.
As I think Ric Locke said (again upthread), when your enemy draws a bead on your forehead, they reveal their existence, and position. Despite your discomfiture, the names and views of a large number of GOP personalities have been recorded, and we won’t forget them. I didn’t think much of O’Donnell as a candidate either, but she deserves more gratitude for her 2010 run than a politician like Castle does for his whole, miserable, feckless career.
I have to say that O’Donnell was absolutely appalling as a candidate. I know she espouses Tea Party beliefs but really, so what?
She had no life experience, no compelling backstory, nothing. I assuredly agree that the Dems and the press smelled weakness and blood and went after her in a revolting fashion. That Gawker article was surely a multi-generational low for the media. But she had no real candidate skills–on-her-feet wit, deprecating sense of humor, the ability to take a crummy situation and turn it around and not make it seem like you are doing it.
To which I say: So what?
It’s not about perfection. Maybe some 32 year old federal prosecutor in Delaware took a look and said, “I can do that.” ANd next time, she will.
It’d be nice to elect only classic liberals, but its not happening in the short-term. Let’s get as many in as the traffic will bear and work with the rest.
I didn’t make her something she’s not. Karl Rove did. Along with a number of others tried to turn her from the GOP primary winner in DE to a symbol of Tea Party fecklessness and “extremism” .
My stake in Christine O’Donnell’s candidacy began the moment the GOP party attacked her after she won that primary in DE. And given what’s happening to Joe Miller in Alaska and a number of other conservatives in similar straits who the GOP is studiously ignoring, I was right to take notice.
And I’m not the only one who has.
Joe Biden is appalling as a candidate. Ted Kennedy let a woman fucking drown.
In many instances where we didn’t elect conservatives or classical liberals, we forced the Dems who held on to move toward the center as a result of putting less-than-perfect classical liberals and conservatives up against them. That’s a good thing.
As for needing some compelling “life experience” narrative or backstory to run, I say that’s a media contrivance — and one we need to do away with. Barack Obama has made a career on his compelling backstory. But we’d be better off as a country had a fucking whitebread middle-class accountant from the suburbs — who was the class treasurer and once placed third in the Science Fair in Jr High — won the presidency.
Same here. I think prior to that I expressed disappointment that we weren’t able to pull in a better candidate than the two of them. The reason why the reaction mattered so much is because it’s simply impossible to pretend that those same people would have then gone out and trashed Castle so vigorously when it was actually his stated policy preferences that should be anathema.
They don’t respect their actual masters. They need to learn to.
I like all this talk of their being a definite primary challenge to Graham, btw.
talk of there being
See, Moby, there are examples of the Tea Party candidate being beaten, and immediately turning around, endorsing his opponent, and Tea Partiers working their asses off for said opponent. Not a single instance of the opposite comes to mind. You RINOs have the exact same idea of cooperation as the Copperheads do for bi-partisanship: it only means others do what you want. Well, fuck you in the ass with 20 inches of rhino horn. Don’t work that way no more.
You see, we view this in slightly different terms than you do: We’re taking this country back to it’s Constitutional roots. We’re not interested in keeping the termite riddled superstructure you and the Copperheads built. And we don’t have to be, because the geopolitical and economic winds are going to blow it away. We’ll just let nature take it’s course, and then rebuild what the Founders intended. And your choices will be limited to two: help or get out of the way. Try to interfere, and you can be blown away too.
I think we can all agree that it’s time to let our stoner teenage daughter who kneels for any semi-tumescent pud, and sucks it like it has the answers to the crossword puzzle in it, to get out of the house and go it on her own.
Her name – California. Isn’t it pretty? Yeah, it was either that or Cumpot.
Two great posts here Jeff. yes yes. Now off to read comments.
From my keyboard in Wilmington it looks as though the Tea Party let the Dems sweep the statewide elections by punting an easy win in the name of rhetoric.
Things look a tad different from my perch here in Michigan. Sorry it didn’t work out for you in Wilmington.
See, here’s the deal. The “movement” worked in many, many states.
But we’d be better off as a country had a fucking whitebread middle-class accountant from the suburbs — who was the class treasurer and once placed third in the Science Fair in Jr High — won the presidency.
Sounds like Mitt Romney. Although I am pretty sure he won the science fair.
Bottom line on O’Donnell and Miller, and a few others:
There was a Republican Party primary election, and a Republican candidate was selected. The heavyweights of the Republican Party immediately swung into action, bringing maximum force to bear against the Republican candidate.
By contrast, in South Carolina the Democratic primary election produced a candidate, and the Democratic Party establishment went dead silent. They didn’t support their embarrassing candidate beyond a few tokens, but they didn’t get on teevee and pontificate about how embarrassing he was, either.
You are welcome to bleat and shriek, wave your hands, and throw up colored smokes in attempt to divert attention, but that’s the issue right there. Beltway Republicans set out to destroy a Republican candidate because she wasn’t one of them. The rest of it is an attempt to change the subject.
There is one amusing and relevant side issue: O’Donnell lost by exactly the same margin as the other Republican candidate. What does that say about the power and influence of the Country Club Republicans?
Regards,
Ric
I would have preferred more choices than O’Donnell and Castle for the primaries (if I lived in Delaware and was voting on it), but once she was picked, she was the candidate. You roll with what you have. And Castle, he thought he was some prince entitled to the position and got all pissy about it when he was rejected by Delaware Republicans.
Rather than whining about tea partiers, why isn’t Rove giving Castle shit for not supporting O’Donnell?
it” looks as though the Tea Party let the Dems sweep the statewide elections …”
Let? Let?! Blue Hen, Please.
Oh, SDN, I am not sure, but you seem a bit miffed? Heh. I think I am with you, maybe minus the 20 inch R(h)ino horn bit… :)
I thought you were speaking in Senator McCain’s voice.
Krauthammer’s warning is well taken.
From my keyboard in Georgia it looks as though you and your fellow Delawarians have been letting Demo9crats and RINOs do the nasty on you from behind because you can’t bear to be associated with those icky so-cons who provide the volunteer help that has been electing Republicans in most of the other 56 states.
[…] November 2010 in Topical Bottom line on O’Donnell and Miller, and a few […]
It’s much more important that Mike Castle loses than Christine O’Donnell wins. Put Castle in office and you’ll spend six years buying that statist slattern off so he’ll sustain a filibuster or vote for a clean bill. If there’s going to be fingerprints on lousy legislation, I want them to belong to a Democrat, not a Republican.
Ya know, I just can’t shake the suspicion that “bi-partisan” Castle would have found a reason to jump to the Democrats had he won and been the margin of Republican control.
It’s kind of obvious, isn’t Jeffersonian? And something Jeff has been talking about for a long time now. Have the democrats OWN this shit. Don’t give them any cover with canidates like Castle. None. Molyuk says that Castle is center-right on fiscal issues? Leaning towards Cap and Trade is a fiscally conservative notion? Really? No, actually it isn’t. It seems Molyuk may have a case of the happyfeets in regards to the overtly religious, however.
Just read Peggy Noonan’s piece in the WSJ.
She’s a smart one ain’t she!
I didn’t think much of O’Donnell as a candidate either, but she deserves more gratitude for her 2010 run than a politician like Castle does for his whole, miserable, feckless career.
Why is a squad such a cohesive group? Because everyone walks point at some time. O’Donnell took point, Castle never has.
…respected on both sides of the aisle.
I don’t mean to pile on, Molyuk, but I observe that you use this language to describe your preferred candidate, and it shows me that you’re not really getting the point of Jeff’s long-running narrative on this subject.
The fact that a candidate is well respected on both sides of the aisle is a negative, if you believe that both sides of the aisle are dominated by establishment politicians who work primarily to enrich and empower themselves, by means of extending and solidifying the power of the federal government. To those of us who’d like to dismantle this corrupt establishment, respect from its leaders is the very last thing we want to see.
Give me a candidate who is feared by both sides of the aisle. Give me a candidate that keeps those bastards up all night trying to figure out how to cut her down so that they can protect their phony-baloney jobs.
O’Donnell and the handful of other candidates who were defeated were insufficient not because they drew the ire of the establishment GOP, but because they weren’t able to overcome it. In the next election, we’re going to see even more backlash against the Beltway Bastards and their preferred pet candidates. With a bit of luck, the money and support will continue to shift away from the central committees, and instead will flow directly to our preferred candidates at the state and local levels.
I threw my vote away on the Libertarian
ah, you voted for Coons. Good show.
that never gets old
O’Donnell and the handful of other candidates who were defeated were insufficient not because they drew the ire of the establishment GOP, but because they weren’t able to overcome it. In the next election, we’re going to see even more backlash against the Beltway Bastards and their preferred pet candidates. With a bit of luck, the money and support will continue to shift away from the central committees, and instead will flow directly to our preferred candidates at the state and local levels.
Excellent point, Squid.
Careful guys, or we’ll end up being called Machiavellian or something.
http://www.constitution.org/mac/prince17.htm
Anyone here remember Dede Scozzafava? Anyone? Bueller? Moyluk – who did she endorse after losing her primary?
Bitch wasn’t aware enough to pull a Murcokeski
Darleen on 11/5 @ 9:28 am #
I threw my vote away on the Libertarian
ah, you voted for Coons. Good show.
Oh please. By that logic, everyone who voted for O’Donnell in the Repub primary voted for Coons, because she never had a prayer of winning the general. She’s run three times now, and been thoroughly whipped every time. Christine O’Donnell will never win a statewide general election in Delaware. Anybody who tells you otherwise knows nothing about my state nor its politics.
The reason this whole debate drives me nuts is because the Tea Party clearly did understand the “half a loaf is better than none” concept when Scott Brown ran in Massachusetts. Brown is exactly like Castle – a squishy centrist who’d be chastised as a RINO commie dog in the Heartland, but can win in a deep blue state precisely because he’s not too far to the right to scare away the centrist Dems.
So O’Donnell couldn’t win over Dems. All that says is that you live in a Democrat state. They voted in a socialist.
Were I you, I’d get to work teaching your electorate, not trying to find a candidate who can pander to it and still keep an R in front of the name — and then screw the rest of us once he makes it to a national seat.
But I’m a “purist” that way.
Squid, I grasp Jeff’s “Let the Dems own their failures” theme. In ordinary times, it would be a reasonable position. I disagree with it because elections have consequences. The U.S. is going through very rough times right now. Things will get even rougher when Social Security & Medicare go tits-up. If voting for a RINO who can win instead of an unelectable so-con will make things even .1% better, that’s what I’ll do.
The same people who pushed for Castle threw their money behind Crist and Fiorina, and didn’t provide ground support for Angle, or Buck, or Miller or O’Donnell.
You should be turning your ire on them — because had they any principles, we may have still lost in DE, but we could have won with conservatives in Nevada, Colorado, and Alaska.
That’s a net gain of two, even if you believe Castle would have won.
Ace’s campaign to destroy Christine O’Donnell continues. Pathetic.
I may have to write a long e-mail to John Cornyn. As one of his constituents, I will inform the numbnutz what I think of his work at the NRSC.
Which wasn’t worth crap in the cases that Jeff mentions in 254.
Ace is actually arguing that O’Donnell cost the GOP three seats — including the one here in Colorado, and Joe Miller’s in Alaska.
That’s ludicrous. The GOP in Alaska put out ads going after the Democrat, who had no chance of winning, knowing that some of the Dem support would go to Murkowski. They were actively trying to get Murkowski re-elected rather than get elected the Republican nominee. Here in Colorado, Bennet ran the dirtiest campaign imaginable, and the GOP’s disdain for others in the Tea Party gave the Dems cover to use the “extremist” line.
Ace, Allah, Patterico, Lindsey Graham, Trent Lott, Karl Rove, Carl Forti…
I hope they fail.
Jeff, teaching the electorate is the work of decades. The New Left didn’t march through the institutions over the weekend. It’s worth doing, but it won’t pay off any time soon.
Re: Angle and Miller, you’re absolutely right. They could have won, and I’d have voted for them if I lived in their states. My argument has been strictly about Castle/O’Donnell/Coons. Delaware politics is much more like Massachusetts’s than Nevada’s or Alaska’s. Angle or Miller would have fared marginally better here than O’Donnell did (since neither of them has ever discussed dabbling in witchcraft on tv nor claimed mice are being engineered with human brains), but that would just mean they’d lose by 8 or 9 points instead of 17.
It already paid off. The greatest change state assembies in the modern era. A huge gain in governorships. A retaking of the House — despite people’s distrust of Republicans.
Giving them more of what they distrust is not the answer.
Yeas, and that is insane. I can’t believe that he truly believes that. Then again, yes I can. “Be the wave?” More like “Be the Republican establishment’s bitch.”
Jeff:
OT, but what do you think of this magazine lifting a blogger’s article because the web is “public domain”?
If voting for a RINO who can win instead of an unelectable so-con will make things even .1% better, that’s what I’ll do.
Then the only thing you’re ever going to get is a RINO who can make things .1% better, or a socialist. We’ve been playing this game for decades, and doing things your way is what brought us to our current predicament.
No, I’ll continue to say “no thank you” to the go-along-to-get-along doormats, and insist on representatives who actually represent me. In my case, it means continuing to work for the defeat of Klobuchar, Smalley, and Betty McCollum (*hack, spit*), no matter how long it takes.
Yeah, LTC John, Mobyuk and his kind make me break out in hives. And the metaphor seemed appropriate.
The thing that really frosts me, like I said, is that there are numberless example, like Joe Hoffman, who lost, and then actively endorsed and worked for their primary opponents.
Then we have Mobyuk’s crowd, who:
Actively worked against O’Donnel and Angle and Joe Miller. Heck, the Copperheads didn’t even have to hire writers; just quote Rove.
Are even now refusing to help Renee Elmers in NC facing a recount with the kind of money that could put her over the top.
Gave Bucketloads of cash to the likes of Charlie “Man-Tan” Crist in the primary, when the national organizations should have stayed out of it.
I could go on, but why bother? RINOs and Copperheads both consider cooperation a one way street, and it just doesn’t work that way any more.
How about those bastards in Alaska, have rewritten the rulebook expressly for Murkowski, with the write in lists, rather expansive character, Angle, the state is virtually at Resident Evil Extinction stage, and they are voting for Reid. Rove aimed almost none of his fire at Lisa, the kind of thinking
that nearly got him indicted in that little Journolist brouhaha
#170 Bob Reed:
War Bird pron:
http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/video/spitfire-low-level/63ddd9fac3e6c8072e3663ddd9fac3e6c8072e36-289163118086?q=spitfire%20low%20pass&FORM=VIRE5
Nice Mikey, there are some cool clips at that link.
#266: You are welcome.
Imagine being the camera guy and trying to keep all focused and – what is that coming in – oh crap.
Molyuk, you’re an anti O’Donnell talking point list. You need to get a grip.
You really think Castle would have beaten Coons? Coons won by 15 points.
Don’t give me any crap about Castle being fiscally conservative. Castle supports Cap and Trade.
Cap and Trade is a trillion dollar scam that would have fleeced Americans that are already struggling.
Evidently, you just prefer your big government leftists to have an R in front of their name.
Castle was a vote against Obamacare, which will be an issue in 2011. Coons is a vote for Obamacare.
Castle was a vote against stimulus, too. Coons? For it.
Castle is actually an excellent vote half the time. That’s much better than Coons.
It’s really that simple. I don’t know why people want to relitigate this argument. O’donnell supporters were dead wrong and it nearly cost us the PA race too (no doubt about it). We put in power Coons, but I do not blame O’Donnell supporters for making a tactical gamble that sucked.
They were wrong, and I think that was forseeable, but I understand the desire to drive hard and take risks, hoping DE sees the light.
However, why want Castle? Over Coons? The only people who don’t strongly prefer Castle to Coons are morons or die hard progessives.
Castle would probably have beaten Coons. The polls appear to have been very accurate on this one. Coons won election after election in DE because he was a very good governor with a balanced budget and ability to run an ethical and business friendly state. People who see no merit in Castle are just afraid to say they were wrong, ever.
I know Castle sucked. But he was our only chance in DE.
Who is this “our” of which you speak?
And people who prefer that cap-and-trade not be described next election season as “bi-partisan.”
Coons is a socialist who raised taxes repeatedly. The people of Delaware voted for him after the Republicans of Delaware nominated Coons over Castle.
What you wanted isn’t what they wanted — and what they wanted is more important than what you wanted. That is, unless you are a moron or a die hard progressive.
It matters how you get there.
Long-time reader, first-time writer. (I think — I may have commented once before, but I can’t remember if I did or not.)
I understand and respect where you’re coming from, Jeff, though I do disagree in this particular instance. My problem with O’Donnell, and the reason I backed Castle,* had to do with the fact that O’Donnell was too easy to paint as a trivial person. In large part, that’s because she WAS a trivial person. My preference is to support the most conservative person of substance, and unfortunately, the Delaware GOP primary gave us a choice between a non-conservative candidate and a non-substantial candidate. Perfect storm. But, assuming my decision procedure is the right one, I feel comfortable with my evaluation that Mike Castle was by far the best candidate in the race. Of the three main candidates, including Coons, he was the ONLY one with any substance, and therefore (by default) the most conservative person of that type.
(* Not that my backing means much. I don’t live in Delaware.)
Admittedly, I have tended in the past to default to “establishment” GOP candidates at the beginning of the cycle, as they usually start out as the most conservative person I’ve heard of. But it’s not anything so strong as a preference; my mind can be changed as the race goes on. Think of them as placeholders, if you like…they’re there so I can start thinking of the race in post-primary terms as well, but they can be either permanently installed or summarily discarded based on more information. My mind was changed a lot this cycle, in fact. I went from “Crist, meh” to “Rubio, yeah!” A lot of people did, because Rubio was saying the right things and saying them with substance, whereas Crist — the very definition of an unprincipled hack — was doing neither. I listened to the case for Mike Lee in Utah, liked what I heard, and donated. Same with Joe Miller and Ken Buck. (Toomey I was already on board with…no decision necessary.) Indeed, I was warming to Ovide LaMontaigne by the end of the New Hampshire primary, and I’d really love to see him take a shot at Shaheen in a couple years. On the other hand, I started out supporting, and never wavered from, Rob Portman and Roy Blunt and Dino Rossi. They seemed to generally be saying the right things, and no one else emerged that I thought was better-suited…not to be elected, but to carry that banner forward.
Does that make me a squish? I don’t think so. I hope not. I don’t mind voting for candidates of principle in races I suspect or even know they’ll lose — if they have the right qualities. I don’t regret donating to Ken Buck. He may have lost, but I don’t care if we lose one every so often — he was the best candidate I could find, he stayed in the race to the end, and hopefully he or someone like him can take that seat further down the line. Nor do I regret giving to Sharron Angle. I didn’t prefer her in the primary. I wanted Tarkanian. Once that was over, though, I swallowed my feelings and supported her…and she turned out, after some initial stumbling, to be a better candidate than I thought she would be. I always thought she was fighting an uphill battle, even at the end. But she turned out okay in my book.
“We don’t need slicker candidates. We need committed candidates.”
In fact, we need both. We need serious candidates promoting a serious message. Packaging doesn’t matter nearly as much as what’s in the box, I agree, but it DOES start to matter the moment it starts to turn people off. For that reason, I did not, and do not, support Christine O’Donnell. I spent most of the cycle donating to and/or supporting non-establishment candidates because our primary concern should be the message. A frankly lousy candidate like O’Donnell, though, was a bridge too far. There’s no doubt that the lack of having the GOP establishment’s full support, especially their ground game, cost us two potentially winnable races in Colorado and Nevada, so those can be laid at their feet. But the Delaware race can’t be, at least not completely. It was the result of an awful set of candidates that either wouldn’t advance classical liberal principles (Castle) or weren’t serious (O’Donnell), or both (Coons). Castle, bad as he was on some issues, at least would have given me some of what I wanted, and he wouldn’t have made my side look like damn fools in the bargain.
Maybe you’re right that people like me shouldn’t have supported Castle, even tepidly. I can see and respect that. In that case, I guess I’m forced to withhold any support in races like those, because my agenda either won’t get implemented or will be made to look dumb. I mean, look at the debate. O’Donnell was dead-on RIGHT in her interpretation of the First Amendment, and yet even some of the people who KNEW that cringed because she just couldn’t put that point across. The occasional gaffe is one thing — almost anyone can bounce back from one of those — but she’d made too many mistakes and been ridiculed too often by that point for even a solid point to strike home. Respectfully, I think we do damage to the public perception of the principles we embrace when we put forward candidates like her.
Anyway, (long) rant closed. I hope you’ll take these comments as I have taken yours above — perhaps not convinced, but understanding as to why a sane, responsible, rational conservative adult might take the other perspective. I do admire your blog, I look forward to reading it every day, and I hope I’ll be welcomed back to the comments section.
Of course you are welcomed back.
I just happen to think you are wrong. I thought O’Donnell did very well in her debates — and it takes some substance to find yourself in a Senate race for the Biden seat such that the Dems are dumping a lot of money and resources into that race to both embarrass and defeat you.
Having ostensible conservatives from outside your state do it to you after the conservatives of your state nominated you is hardly the way you should be treated.
Castle was neither here nor there to me until he lost the primary and wouldn’t work for the candidate that did win. That is the defining moment, the one where the true self peeks through the mask. After that he is dead to me along with the others who showed everyone where their only interest laid.
How could anyone replacing Biden be anything but an improvement in the making us damn fools department. Or perhaps being damn fools is a Delaware feature like my State with our execrable idiot Stabenow. The Senate seems filled with people who excel at being themselves and making their supporters into damn fools. Must be a constitutional requirement.
Oh, yeah. I sent money to COD and she never made me feel like a fool, damned or not.
Demosthenes, my take on whether you are a squish will depend on your answer to this question: Once O’Donnell became the candidate, did you work for her? donate to her? point out how she was better than Coons? Or did you trash her every chance you got, and work for her opponent? If the latter, then, yes, you are a squish.
Perfectly reasonable to disagree and work for someone else during the primary; that’s what they’re for. Once the primary is done, then you work for your side’s nominee. To work for the other side, and then blame it on the candidate who worked for our values, like Mobyuk does? beneath contempt.
There was never a moment in that campaign where Odonnell failed to show a better grasp of issues, the constitution, and the citzenry.
You know what’s weird and kooky? Marxism. You know what’s weird and kooky?
Voting for Marxists. It’s Delaware’s fault and the republican HACKS. Fortunately Delaware is a northeatern shit hole and I’ll never go there or drop a penny there.
Really, what the fuck is wrong with these people?
Right, Donald, Castle wanted to strangle the Anbar Awakening, well he didn’t know what that was, because he accepted the ‘civil war’ template, which is sadder. Coons wants to give up on Afghanistan because it’s taken too long
And, for all of you harping against O’Donnell while touting the unknown of “Castle would have won” I ask you, “If Castle was so great and would have won, how did the so-called neophyte politically unserious O’Donnell beat Castle?” If Castle is that great, then why did Castle lose the primary? Castle being that much better than O’Donnell should have allowed Castle to win easily against O’Donnell. Somehow, in the primary, Castle was blindsided by O’Donnell. You Castle supporters continue to claim Castle as superior to O’Donnell, while ignoring that Castle managed to lose to a woman you Castle supporters claim is a loon.
If Castle is that easily taken by surprise, best Castle’s not in the Senate to begin with.
I’ll say it again with you donald: Seriously, what the fuck is wrong with these people?