Mark Gisleson at Norwegianity:
When someone exposes you as a racist hater, the obvious response is to call the blogger who exposed you a racist.
Obvious, that is, if you’re a demagogic creep trying to perpetuate racist/homophobic bullshit.
Dennis Perrin, who posted an irresponsible, libelous accusation at Huffington Post that an LGF reader threatened to “track down his IP address and kill him,†has posted a typically insult-laden response to my challenge to prove his allegation: Dennis Perrin: Life Is A Beautiful, Precious Flower.
Long story short: he can’t prove it. He “doesn’t remember†his username, or in which thread the “threat†supposedly appeared. In other words, he made it all up.
Dennis Perrin is a liar.
How incredibly lame, Dennis. Now you should do the responsible thing and retract your article at Huffington Post. (I know you won’t.)
It’s been brought to my attention that Charles Johnson, the Mud King of the Widdle Gween Nerfball tribe, is upset with my contention that I received a death threat at his fine site many years ago. “Man up,†ChazJo growled, beating his chest as his followers grunted their approval. “Prove it, or retract it.â€Â
I’ve also received several emails from what I suspect are Nerfballers, daring me to do the same thing. So, in the interest of full clarity, and because I want to get back to some actual work, here’s the deal.
There was never a death threat made against “Dennis Perrin.†This is because “Dennis Perrin†didn’t use his real name when commenting at ChazJo’s joint. “Dennis Perrin†used a single, anonymous tag  a rare practice online, I’ll concede, but what the hell, you only live once. What that tag was I have no idea, since I posted there maybe five years ago, two computers and three hard drives in the past.
I knew very little about that site’s politics at the time, as I was relatively new to the Web, so I thought I could argue from a different perspective in good faith. Umm, right. My biggest mistake was insisting that the Palestinians are human, which is science fiction to Chazzy’s tribe. Several commenters told me to leave, and one said that if I didn’t, he’d track my IP address and “hunt†me down, encouraged by a few others. Now, whether this was possible or not, I don’t know, but as I said in my earlier post, I figured, f*ck it, and moved on.
Perrin’s accusation is even more ludicrous, because it’s impossible for an LGF commenter to find out another commenter’s IP address.
See, what Charles doesn’t get is that Dennis seems to remember that he kind of felt threatened with his life for innocently suggesting that Palestinians are humans with a handle that he can’t remember on a thread that he can’t remember and no, we’re not entitled to his devoting himself to track it down, we have to take his word for it.
Speaking of taking someone’s word, Gleen’s talking about the implosion of Col. Boylan in the face of his intense lawyerly and computerly skillz. It seems that the good Colonel can’t prove to Glenn’s satisfaction that it was not he who wrote offensive materials that Glenn received from what appears to be his very own IP address. The Thin Man sets the wayback machine:
Comment by The Thin Man on 10/31 @ 11:06 am # |Edit This
“…the more evident it becomes that he shares numerous viewpoints with the original e-mailer and, more importantly, expresses those viewpoints using the same unique and recognizable style of “English†used to write the disputed email.†___________________________________________“Greenwald only has a New York Times Best Selling Book on the Bush Administration and its abuses of power. And he has one of the most-read blogs on the Interent, after 9 months of blogging. And Senators read from his blog at Senate hearings and his posts lead to front-page news stories in major newspapers.
Why would anyone think what he has to say matters? It’s not like anyone listens to him. It’s not like he’s Ace, or Jeff Goldstein, or Patterico, or Sister Toldjah or Glenn Reynolds, or someone who really matters.
- Great advice, you super-important bloggers should only to each other and about each other. Don’t bother with anyone in the Left because if you ignore them, they’ll just go away.Posted by: Ellison on July 13, 2006 08:14 AMâ€ÂSorry I couldn’t resist going back and having another look……http://ace.mu.nu/archives/186941.php
Strangely, Ellers disappeared shortly after it was revealed that he was posting from the very same IP address as Glenn, and that he used language redolent of the man whose reputation he was defending from scurrilous detractors. Some suspect foul play: did Ellers know too much?
As important as what Ellers stated was the pattern that this demonstrates. A blogger is accused of sockpuppetry. Shortly thereafter, the sockpuppet disappears. Shortly after that, the blogger is hired by Salon. I think that in order to maintain its journalistic credibility, Salon needs to get to the bottom of this. Surely, we cannot expect typewriter-wielding Mil-monkeys to subscribe to the same high standards of ethics as do journalists.
UPDATE: Norwegianity guy still doesn’t understand that I am not the one who designated Glenn a racist.
Not that I think it’s true mind you, but you know damn well that the title of this post will be used as further “proof” that you, and by extension, Jeff, are bigots.
Hater.
John Cole, Greenwald’s ex-bitch, is mightily upset with you, Mr. Collins.
FRankly, I’m more concerned about Dan breaking the middle column of the blog with that under lining. ;-)
It’s a race, it’s a chase, hurry up and feed their face!
Who will win? No one knows! Feed the hungry hip-ip-pos!
Hungry hungry hippos! (open up and there it goes!)
Watch out, Dan — those little brown Norwegians are gonna drag you off to the re-education camps.
What’s the law on this? Can he just do this without backing it up? This can’t possibly be legal. This seems like a textbook case of libel.
Make the world a batter place,
punch a Gleenwald in the face.
;-)
If it turns out that Boylan really did send the messages, does that mean Salon will hire him?
John Cole, Greenwald’s ex-bitch, is mightily upset with you, Mr. Collins.
meh
All I have got for Perrin is … sir, you are a tool.
So someone exposed you as someone who hates racists?
Isn’t it funny that the Norwegian can’t get his tiny brain around the fact that it is Dr Shakti Butler of U. Delaware who is throwing around the racist slander. Maybe you’re being too subtle Dan.
I like how you ironically prove Textual Redolence theory by jumbling the blockquotes all together.
(This comment won’t make sense by the time I post it, will it? Not that that’s unusual.
Ooh the suspense! (Or what passes for it in John Barth’s stories!) …!)
“My biggest mistake was insisting that the Palestinians are human, which is science fiction to Chazzy’s tribe.”
I am absolutely certain that was the gist of his argument. Because THAT he can recall.
Having said that, at least Charles and his gang get credit for including science in their fiction. At HuffPo it’s more the “just fiction” angle on things apparently.
If Boylan sent those emails, what reason would he have to deny it? He did nothing other than speak TRUTH TO POWER !!!!!one!1! There is no reason for him to deny it. All he did was call out that whiny little
faggot.Barth?
You wouldn’t happen to be an ex-Hopkins fellow, would you psychologizer?
MARX!GILES GOATBOY!Please. No more Greenwald stuff, unless you want to do a rhetorical analysis of one of his posts, and point out the myriad flaws / fallacies of argument.
At least that would be substantive and doing a service.
Also, I’m a bit wearied of the repetitive “faggot” / “cockslapping” stuff that keeps showing up in the titles to posts.
Not that I much care about being taken seriously. It’s just that I don’t want to be dismissed out of hand, either.
They made me read a John Barth story. I think someone went to the beach. I can’t remember really, but I think I kind of liked him. They made me read him with Max Apple. Then they gave me a degree.
I like apples.
Sorry, Jeff. I’ll avoid the faggot/cockslapping in post titles thing in future.
That sounds neat if you read it with a British accent.
I’ll update my post to reflect that. My comments were in direct response to your headlines. No further reading seemed necessary, quite frankly.
This is only slightly OT, but I just finished carving our pumpkin with my 5 year old. When we were done, he said, “Dad, that pumpkin sure looks faggoty.”
So we went ahead and smashed it in the street before the teenage hoodwinks in our neighborhood got the opportunity later this evening.
Yes, seemed is a bitch.
I’ve never, ever seen a use of “quite frankly” that wasn’t as useless as male nipples. Methinks the fellow has been listening to Sean Hannity a bit too much.
M Gislesons promised update…
“UPDATE: The blogger in question has agreed to stop using homophobic post headlines, although that’s clearly well short of an apology for his tasteless sense of alleged humor.”
So the Norwegian isn’t big enough to admit HE jumped, wrongly to a conclusion about the original post – and obviously no word on the Thought Police/Dr Butler angle that was being discussed.
It’s who they are; it’s what they do.
I blame Dan for Gisleson’s lack of intellectual acuity. You sucked the smarts right out of him, Dan.
Not that there’s anything wrong with that.
It’s just that kind of talk that got GiGi humping your ankle in the first place. Nothing good can come from it, unless I act on my urge to buy you a beer with a whiskey chaser.
“If we run they have to chase us. It’s their way.â€Â
Jeff,
Remember “Count Cockula?” Give Dan a break, he enjoys pissing in Glenwald’s boot as much as anyone.
“Dennis Perrin, who posted an irresponsible, libelous accusation at Huffington Post that an LGF reader threatened to “track down his IP address and kill him,†has posted a typically insult-laden response to my challenge to prove his allegation: Dennis Perrin: Life Is A Beautiful, Precious Flower.”
Who has been libeled?
Obviously, the commenter who didn’t threaten him.
“Obviously, the commenter who didn’t threaten him.”
That person has not been damaged by any libel. No one knows who they are.
True. On the other hand, that person can point out that Dennis can’t recover the evidence of his purported crime.
Maybe we should encourage Dennis to “recover” some other memorires and we can get to the root of his compulsion to fantasize about right-wingers wanting to kill him.
I suspect it all Matt Groenings fault:
Dennis: Sideshow Bob tried to kill me on our honeymoon.
Blue-Haired Lawyer: Who’s thinking of killing her right now?
[A majority of the court reluctantly puts up their hand.]
Blue-Haired Lawyer: Be honest…
[Everyone in court puts up their hand, including Patty. The man next to her gasps.]
Patty : Eh, he’s always leaving the toilet seat up.
“On the other hand, that person can point out that Dennis can’t recover the evidence of his purported crime.”
So there is who ChazJo needs to address.
No, I think Dennis needs to do a little digging and find it.
If Dennis spent some time hanging around, arguing in good faith, and learning the hard lesson that wingnuts are evil people, way back when he’d just begun hanging around in the blogosphere, certainly he should have a decent idea of what was going on at the time, more or less, that would allow him to home in on a post he’d commented on and . . . eureka! there’s his old handle!
“No, I think Dennis needs to do a little digging and find it.”
I’m so sure he “needs” to.
Plus, I’d like to put in my vote to keep up the “faggot” stuff. Its hilarious.
Hummph! And all this time I thought I was the token Norwegian around here. If anyone needs me I’ll be sharpening my axe..
If he’s not willing to do the digging, he ought to retract the accusation.
And it is hilarious, the way that people react to the use of a word, but seem to think that their actual mischaracterizations of people and events are justified.
Apropos of nothing, if you haven’t read Lost in the Funhouse you are cheating yourselves.
Fucking Norwegians.
Since the accusation is used to assert that Charles and his commentariat are all thugs, I don’t know that I would restrict it to the one person alleged to have threatened Dennis.
If Dennis genuinely believes he was threatened, he ought to remember enough details to identify the commenter he believes threatened him. If it happened but he doesn’t remember those details, he obviously didn’t take it seriously at the time and has only chosen to bring it up now for reasons not directly related to the event itself.
And of course, if he’s making it all up — IF he’s making it all up — then he’s a liar.
He’s not in a very good position with this, is what I’m getting at. He needs to substantiate his claim or retract it. Period.
That’s the one cynn – the funhouse is at the beach, no?
Or was it a metaphorical funhouse? I have it somewheres. Maybe I will take to work tomorrow.
At least he’s not a fucking Scandi. Or is he? I can never keep those goddamned Euros straight.
That way I can learn about the funhouse and also maybe New Girl will leave me alone.
Oh ferchrissakes! From our Euro barnacle’s post, recalling his past interaction with PW:
Being term limited out of office = crumbles into dust.
Sod off, Swampy.
“If it happened but he doesn’t remember those details, he obviously didn’t take it seriously at the time and has only chosen to bring it up now for reasons not directly related to the event itself.”
That person likely wasn’t serious about killing him. Thats what internet toughguy-ism is all about.
It’s not like Dennis is Pat Tillman or anything.
well, you know because the Dems in Congress are getting all their pet projects passed and… oh wait….
Apparently he’s still smarting over this, and doesn’t realize that Jeff and Dan are two entirely distinct human beings.
More laughers from this fellow include the occasional (possibly even frequent) chickenhawking, plus this gem:
I guess all those news stories about Israel completely pulling out of Gaza a couple of years ago were complete bunk, after all.
“Under what modern rules of warfare is the victor allowed to occupy the vanquished for as long as they like?”
They’re not rules, really. More like guidelines.
I had my suspicions.
And all that voting? Never happened, apparently.
I suppose he’s right about that. The likes of Arafat, Abbas and Meshaal aren’t getting it done.
Then why raise a stink about it?
So this Perrin guy has a sweet way with words doncha think? Or should I say dat DePer is one phat cat? Although he might deny it, I wouldn’t be surprised if everyone who’s ever had any dealings with this smarmy twit has wanted to track him down and pummell his smug little face. Why is he?
“Then why raise a stink about it?”
He wrote 2 sentences about it. Thats less than what he devotes to his escapades as a “real” classical conservative. He spends more time on his argument over George Will CV than on this. But ChazJo donna like it. So it gets the attention of michelle malkin’s stinky tofu.
Racist.
He made the accusation, andy. He’s the one that has to either put up or shut up.
“You are all thugs!”
“No we aren’t.”
“Your commenter threatened to hunt me down and kill me!”
“Who did? When did that happen?”
“I don’t remember when, and I forget who, and I can’t recall the thread…But you are all thugs!”
“You don’t have any proof, yet you are accusing me of this?”
“It’s seared, seared into my memory, I tell you!”
It’s the accuser who has to back up the accusation once it has been denied, and he hasn’t andy.
But Mikey! If the accuser just tosses it off as an aside and doesn’t make a big deal of it, then the accused should just ignore the accusation!
I mean, it’s not like accusations of thuggery against right-wingers have ever taken on a life of their own or anything, ever, is it?
There’s always death threats. Even little Grame Frost got death threats.
Of course, no one has ever seen these death threats, and they apparently haven’t been reported to the FBI, but really! Death! Threats! Threats! Of! Death! Trust me!
And how many times have we seen something like “Drop dead” or even “I hope you die a slow, painful death” characterized as death threats?
Put up or shut up, Denny. You too, actus.
Oh, no, McGehee. Such accusations have never, ever exploded beyond all proportion or sense. Nope, never. Not on the web and certainly not in real life! We all know no one would run around repeating unfounded accusations that just happened to fit snugly into their little world-view.
He wrote 2 sentences about it.
Yes, but was it 16 words? Because if it was, then it clearly meets the current progressive threshold for complete unadulterated outrage.
Oh uff da, Mark. Do not make me ashamed of my Norwegian roots.
*It’s the accuser who has to back up the accusation once it has been denied, and he hasn’t andy.*
NOt necessarily. In the reality based community, you make an unfounded, unsubstantiated allegations against somebody and then when somebody points out the holes in your accusation/story/allegation and/or shows it to be untrue, you then attack that person, claiming the person pointing out the holes is one of the following :
a. a racist
b. a warmonger
c. a racist warmonger
d. a republican (or is that redundant?).
I mean, I wish to god I could run my legal practice that way – random accusations with no substantive facts taken as truth would net me a good pile of treasure.
“In the reality based community, you make an unfounded, unsubstantiated allegations against somebody and then when somebody points out the holes in your accusation/story/allegation and/or shows it to be untrue, you then attack that person”
Or you just ignore.
“I mean, I wish to god I could run my legal practice that way – random accusations with no substantive facts taken as truth would net me a good pile of treasure.”
Ergo, no libel claim.
Honestly, I don’t even know why you give Norvege and Glenn any bandwidth.
Engaging in ideological food fights with them proves nothing.
It’s not an ideological foodfight. It’s more like putting a banana in a glass jar and watching the monkey try to withdraw his hand with the banana.
All right, let me spell this out for andy:
NO ONE IS MAKING A STRICTLY LITERAL ACCUSATION OF LIBEL IN THE STRICT LEGAL SENSE
Grow up and participate honestly or follow your own advice:
“Or you just ignore.”
I prefer that later, I have to deal with enough pretentious fucking pricks in my day job.
“NO ONE IS MAKING A STRICTLY LITERAL ACCUSATION OF LIBEL IN THE STRICT LEGAL SENSE”
They’re just saying that someone has been libeled. Unfortunately, that clearly has not happened. Just based on common sense.
li·bel /ˈlaɪbəl/
1. Law.
a. defamation by written or printed words, pictures, or in any form other than by spoken words or gestures.
b. the act or crime of publishing it.
c. a formal written declaration or statement, as one containing the allegations of a plaintiff or the grounds of a charge.
2. anything that is defamatory or that maliciously or damagingly misrepresents.
–verb (used with object)
3. to publish a libel against.
4. to misrepresent damagingly.
5. to institute suit against by a libel, as in an admiralty court.
Notice that the first bolded portion specifies a legal definition, which as you so mindlessly obsess on is not appropriate here. Then notice the second, third and fourth bolded definitions, which aren’t strictly legal and are a fair representation of what Perrin did to the LGF website and it’s commenters.
andy reinforces my belief that rubbing a puppies nose in its own piss isn’t an effective housetraining method.
The strictly legal would be to talk about whether he was reckless or negligent or whatnot. T
The common sense? We’d notice that no-one has been damaged.
Except for the community of the blog, of course.
“Except for the community of the blog, of course.”
Common sense tells you that saying that one person issuing a non-memorable threat a long time ago damages a community? Ok.
Yes, fool: LYING does damage a community.
Not that you’d care.
“Yes, fool: LYING does damage a community.”
Fine. Common sense tells you that LYING that one person issued a non-memorable threat a long time ago damages a community?
There is no such thing as common sense, andy. You are living proof of that.
Common sense tells me that LETTING SOMEONE GET AWAY WITH LYING that one person issued a non-memorable threat a long time ago, damages a community — because as we know (and as Mikey and I lampooned above) if the lie is allowed to go unanswered it will take on a life of its own.
But to you that’s a feature, not a bug.
Well, maybe Andy’s got a point.
So, Andy. When did you stop fucking your grandma?
“because as we know (and as Mikey and I lampooned above) if the lie is allowed to go unanswered it will take on a life of its own.”
It does look like people have given it a life.
It does look like people…
not “people”, a person. His name is Dennis Perrin.
…have given it…
not “it”, a specific, but non-memorable, accusation, that Dennis managed to somehow remember anyway.
…a life.
In a memorably non-memorable way. Kind of a ghost of an accusation, only more common sensible.
If you don’t think it bears discussion, actus, why are you expending so much effort discussing it?
I repeat: to Andy, it’s a feature, not a bug.