The Hockey Stick v Ice Core Data
The above is an animated version of graphs from Watt’s Up With That plus narration.
(h/t Little Miss Attila)
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December 13, 2009
The Long View [Darleen Click]
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Comment by Danger on 12/13 @ 3:50 pm #
Shame on you Darleen for bringing in perspective you are not fighting fair. Only emotion is allowed in this debate because THE SCIENCE IS SETTLED!!!!eleventy!!! And this ! is for Bob Reed (cause he is busy right now;)
Comment by McGehee on 12/13 @ 3:53 pm #
You denialists and your puny “facts” cannot hope to overturn TEH TRVTH.
Comment by cranky-d on 12/13 @ 4:18 pm #
Pay no attention to that glowing orb in the sky! It lies!
Comment by Joe on 12/13 @ 4:18 pm #
Charles Johnson is disgusted with your biases.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:50 pm #
I will pay all of you the same amount I currently pay Charles Johnson to support the Global Warming.
You will of course take the money if you are getting my drift…
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:51 pm #
You guys do get my drift, right?
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:53 pm #
I’m really trying to make a point without actually saying it out loud in pixels.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:53 pm #
Do I have to spell it out for you?
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:54 pm #
I do, don’t I…crap.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:55 pm #
Take. The. Money. Or. I. Will. Off. You.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:55 pm #
You still have no idea what I am saying.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:55 pm #
I’m going to Hot Air.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:57 pm #
I hate PW, and Godstein the money grubbing Jew too.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:57 pm #
And I meant to write Godstein.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:58 pm #
Reactionary quasi-intellectuals like darleen give me the willies.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 4:59 pm #
It was a lot of money that you missed out on, Jeff.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 5:00 pm #
I’m just sayin’…
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 5:00 pm #
Feh.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 5:03 pm #
Hey, call me, OK? When you get a chance, you know? I miss you, man…
Comment by Pablo on 12/13 @ 5:09 pm #
How much cash are we talking about, George?
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 5:14 pm #
Sorry about going off on you, Jeff.
I’m a little tense with the whole world-domination-carbon-credits-statism-Barack-manchurian thing going so far off the rails recently. I know I shouldn’t take it out on you.
BTW I tried that catch wrestling stuff you did on the video, and it was cool until Vlad Putin threw me, and it got real tense because my bodyguards were looking at his bodyguards, and nobody was talking, and the tension was like, whoa, and so I just grabbed one of my guys uzis and put a few right center-mass of one of those anarchist ‘tards that are always hanging around and stinkin’ up the joint, and once I did that everybody had a good laugh and the tension was eased. Dude, I’m serious about those anarchists, they don’t shower at all, it’s totally gross.
Anyhoo. They’re calling roll down in the illuminati chamber right now so I gotta bolt, but I mean it Jeff, call me. OK? International, and you can reverse the charges if you need to.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 5:17 pm #
Our agreement stands as written, Pablo. I still let you use your soul on weekends and holidays.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 5:36 pm #
Barack just called to tell me that Paul Samuelson died. Looks like I’m going to have to start balancing my own checkbook. Oh well, when it rains it pours.
Comment by Karen on 12/13 @ 5:52 pm #
Here is some inside information:
The above presentation was produced my Dr. Michael Ruane, a staunch religious conservative and Assistant professor of chemistry at U of Wisconsin Plattsville. He is a junior professor and not a climate scientist. Consider the source and the preconceived political leanings.
Here are some facts to consider:
The data shows we are in an exceptionally warm period and it has been warmer before. So what? This does not refute anthropogenic global warming. Many sources of warming or cooling can occur. Volcanic activity, large meteor impacts, etc…
The important thing to remember is that in this very stable time, humans have become cozy next to the sea and hundreds of millions of people live just above sea level. Could a volcanic event again drastically change the climate. Of course, and certainly it will happen again.
The point is, apart from any possible remedies (which is a separate issue), AGW is real and it wouldn’t take much to drastically change the earths climate as we know it.
For example, anyone here like to hike in the eastern mountains? Do you enjoy the huge diversity of forest species? Well, with a 4 degree C. temperature rise, the diverse forest in the Appalachian chain will cease to exist. Anyone who knows anything about forestry can tell you that in these mountains, even the small climate change we’ve experienced is obvious… trees are dying in huge numbers. The chestnuts and elms are virtually gone, the hemlocks and dogwoods are threatened, and the Fraser firs sugar maples, and red spruces may be about to follow. Not to mention, 100s of millions of American homes will inundated by rising seas.
Has it been warmer before? Hell yes, that proves nothing, means nothing, and has no bearing on our little slice of human history, the Holocene epoch.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:02 pm #
This having my own thread thing is really cool. It’s like a diary or something.
Check it out! What I did today, by George Soros:
Today started out awesome since I finally found those ZuZu pets that Joe Biden wanted for Christmas. I felt so stupid when I found out that he wanted them for himself! I swear I thought they were for one of his grandkids or something. Doh! I should have known that Mr. 88-IQ-heartbeat-away-from-the-presidency would want ten dollar electric hamsters.
Anyway, all the cool kids are all in Copenhagen planning the Socialist utopia even though those dorks down at East Anglia can’t seem to keep the KGB out of their hard drives, and so we…
Crap. Barack is calling for instructions again. I swear when they make that tool’s presidency into a movie they’ll have to call it The Manchurian Clinger.
Gotta bolt! Sorry!
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/13 @ 6:04 pm #
but of course, this time it’s totally our fault. um…. yeah. AND WE CAN CONTROL THE WEATHER!!!
Comment by RIP Ford on 12/13 @ 6:04 pm #
Karen is punch-drunk on the Kool-Aid.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:06 pm #
Karen, I pay to to regurgitate that drivel on sites with a slightly less sophisticated readership. You won’t convince these yokels, so head to firedoglake for your orders.
Plus, you totally broke my train of thought on my diary entry.
You are fired, Karen. get you last check from the CRU and get out.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:08 pm #
And Karen? Tell that idiot Michael Mann to call me. This hockeystick thing is so over. We need to come up with a new sporting item, maybe a croquet mallet or something.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:10 pm #
And Karen? One more thing. I just wanted to say that last night was special for me too. And I’m sorry that I had to run before breakfast. Next time!
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:12 pm #
I do seem to have a burning sensation when I urinate though. I’m sure it’s nothing, honey. You wouldn’t know anything about that would you, Karen?
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:13 pm #
Karen?
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:13 pm #
Honey?
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:15 pm #
I forgot to leave the money on the dresser, didn’t I?
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:17 pm #
Fine. Don’t answer, Karen. There are plenty of other whores in the climate change business. Al Gore comes to mind…
Comment by cranky-d on 12/13 @ 6:19 pm #
The world is supposed to have a fixed climate forever, and fixed landmass forever, and fixed species forever, even though that has never happened in the past. Plus, it’s our fault that things are changing.
Comment by cranky-d on 12/13 @ 6:21 pm #
Does anyone else agree that AGW proponents are religious nuts who have an over-inflated opinion of humans? When you stop believing in G-d, you don’t believe in nothing, you believe in anything.
Comment by Plasmodium Pete on 12/13 @ 6:22 pm #
“The above presentation was produced my Dr. Michael Ruane, a staunch religious conservative and Assistant professor of chemistry at U of Wisconsin Plattsville. He is a junior professor and not a climate scientist. Consider the source and the preconceived political leanings.”
OK, let us consider – your hero Al Gore got a D in Rocks for Jocks, but you believe him ? The stupid is strong with you.
Comment by sdferr on 12/13 @ 6:26 pm #
What I’ve been wondering is what the structure under the tectonic plates is like, in particular, how come the “hot spots” like under the Hawaiian islands or Yellowstone are so persistent, though not to say permanent?
Comment by Mr. W on 12/13 @ 6:27 pm #
Kudos to Karen!
It’s heartwarming to see someone with the credibility that only an anonymous web post can confer take time out of her hectic hooking schedule to explain to us that we are a bunch of baby seal killers.
Comment by Mr. W on 12/13 @ 6:28 pm #
I’m just glad George left. He really creeps me out.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/13 @ 6:29 pm #
Dragons, sdferr.
Comment by George Soros on 12/13 @ 6:30 pm #
I know where you live, Mr. W.
Comment by Mr. W on 12/13 @ 6:39 pm #
That pro AGW post had the I’m-getting-paid-to-post-this vibe to it. Well constructed, but passionless in presentation. I’m thinking that maybe astro-turfing is not just for protests anymore.
Comment by McGehee on 12/13 @ 6:48 pm #
Do they live in the space between the four giant elephants? And are they related to the Great A’Tuin?
Comment by geoffb on 12/13 @ 6:49 pm #
Well with the 400,000 year graph we can see how the interglacial periods look compared to the glacial periods. All the AGW people are going to love that nice sheet of ice coming down from the Hudson Bay area. Just think of those carefree hikes then. Habitat, species, win-win for all.
Comment by Karen on 12/13 @ 6:50 pm #
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/13 @ 6:04 pm #
Has it been warmer before? Hell yes
but of course, this time it’s totally our fault. um…. yeah. AND WE CAN CONTROL THE WEATHER!!!
This is exactly an example of the herd mentality that has contributed to the lack of ability to separate the science from the politics.
Did you read what I wrote? Do you remember the par where I specifically stated:
“apart from any possible remedies (which is a separate issue), AGW is real and it wouldn’t take much to drastically change the earths climate as we know it.”
Problem: Conservatives can’t seem to distinguish the facts from the politics. The above comment shows how this person is bent on seeing this as a political issue of ‘cap and trade vs AGW.’ Well guess what, some people who are open minded don’t believe we can practically do anything at this point to alter the climate, but aren’t stupid enough to ignore the facts and see a liberal conspiracy behind every tree.
Thanks to maggie katzen for illustrating the conservative lock-step close minded position.
Comment by sdferr on 12/13 @ 6:53 pm #
Karen, are you William Yelverton, perhaps?
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/13 @ 6:54 pm #
Do you know what AGW means? GLOBAL WARMING IS CAUSED BY PEOPLE!!!! so, Karen, please tell us what caused the earth to be warmer before?
ps you’re the only one I see pushing politics.
Comment by dicentra on 12/13 @ 6:55 pm #
AGW is real and it wouldn’t take much to drastically change the earth’s climate as we know it.
It wouldn’t? Where is the data to support that?
The AGW alarmists claim that we’re headed for a “tipping point,” where the atmosphere will keep getting warmer and warmer and warmer, in an out-of-control positive-feedback loop that will turn us into a kind of Venus.
For this positive-feedback loop to kick in, they claim that the CO2 levels will get so high that heat cannot properly radiate out into space; rather, the heat will be reflected back to earth, which causes more CO2 outgassing from the ocean.
However, Richard Lindzen at MIT, who IS in climatology, has spent the last 20 years measuring exactly how much heat has been radiating back out into space and correlating that with the amount of CO2 that is accumulating. (link)
He discovered that over the past 20 years, despite the accumulation of CO2, the amount of heat radiated out into space has increased. Linearly.
Every single one of the AGW alarmists predicted exactly the opposite.
It also extremely difficult to convert a system that is dominated by negative-feedbacks (the climate) into one that is dominated by positive feedbacks.
Our atmosphere has contained up to 7 times more CO2 than it does now. A positive-feedback loop DID NOT OCCUR.
It turns out that increases in CO2 have a diminishing effect on warming. The most warming provided by CO2 happens with the initial amounts in the atmosphere (that happened billions of years ago). If you double the amount of CO2, you don’t double the amount of heat it retains. Not even close.
The Vostok ice core that you see referenced in the video (and in An Inconvenient Truth) shows that in the relationship betwen CO2 and warming, the warming happens FIRST, and the CO2 increases 800-1200 years later.
Furthermore, if CO2 were a primary driver of temps, a particular layer of the atmosphere should heat up, according to the AGW alarmists.
Actual measurements of that atmospheric layer show no heating. Their prediction was dead wrong.
The mechanism that AGW proponents claim will lead to catastrophe is not physically possible; ergo, all these attempts to declare CO2 a dangerous gas or to demand that we reduce CO2 emissions by 80% is the biggest mistake we could possibly make.
Has it been warmer before? Hell yes, that proves nothing, means nothing, and has no bearing on our little slice of human history, the Holocene epoch.
Why does it mean nothing? Your assertion without data indicates to me that you’re merely parroting what you’ve heard without looking into it.
Don’t be a fool, “Karen.” Question Authority, if you can.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/13 @ 6:56 pm #
and did I say anywhere that the Earth isn’t warming? no, but you’re going to tell me what I think (liberal conspiracy!!!)
Comment by No one you know on 12/13 @ 6:57 pm #
This does not refute anthropogenic global warming.
Funny, no where in this little screed is there proof of AGW.
Consider the source and the preconceived political leanings.
I do all the time, now. From you, algore, Hanson, Phil Jones, Michael Mann. You’d have to ask Al “the Earth’s core is millions of degrees” Gore why he spends roughly five times as much in electricity in his home than the average American. He doesn’t behave as though there is an AGW problem. You’d also have to ask Phil Jones why the original data temperature data was destroyed, or ask Hanson why he has refused repeatedly to honor FOIA requests for his data. I mean he only fucking works for the US taxpayer. I could go on, but it seems to me that Karen needs to ask why these people act in a way that obscures the issue. Or you know, pull 4 degree C out of your ass and pretend that the world is going to end.
Comment by Mr. Pot on 12/13 @ 7:00 pm #
Why, hello Ms. Kettle.
Comment by dicentra on 12/13 @ 7:05 pm #
Well guess what, some people who are open minded don’t believe we can practically do anything at this point to alter the climate, but aren’t stupid enough to ignore the facts and see a liberal conspiracy behind every tree.
Good for you.
The above presentation was produced by Dr. Michael Ruane, a staunch religious conservative and Assistant professor of chemistry at U of Wisconsin Plattsville. He is a junior professor and not a climate scientist. Consider the source and the preconceived political leanings.
Because the real conspiracies are conservative Jesus freaks who think Adam rode dinosaurs.
Got it.
Besides, it’s not a conspiracy, it’s a “bandwagon.” A very broad bandwagon that offers many things to many people:
• to the climate scientists — grant money, prestige, recognition
• to environmentalists — a confirmation of the truth of their religion: industrial man IS a blight on the earth! See? SEE?
• to the politicians — a manufactured crisis on which they can piggyback long-nurtured plans to consolidate power and micromanage economies
• to the public — a way to buy cheap grace by “going green,” which will absolve them from their eco-sins
There’s plenty of blame to go around, especially to the MSM, which failed yet again to investigate beyond the press releases.
The public is also to blame for not insisting on The TRVTH when skeptics have for years been turning up evidence of scientific malpractice.
Comment by RTO Trainer on 12/13 @ 7:07 pm #
Did you watch the linked video? Are you going to refute the data presented? If not, then how do you not come to the conclusion that your statement here, is BS on its face?
AGW is not real–the rise in temperatures globally predates any man-made CO2 production.
Show me a reason to not beleive the data shown, and I’ll reconsider your view.
Comment by No one you know on 12/13 @ 7:07 pm #
He is a junior professor and not a climate scientist
Hey, Phil Jones isn’t a climate scientist anymore, either. Can we disregard all his bullshit?
Comment by dicentra on 12/13 @ 7:08 pm #
That pro AGW post had the I’m-getting-paid-to-post-this vibe to it.
“Karen” has posted here before, Mr W. “She” has been slapped down before for being a tiresome pseudo-intellectual who cannot construct a coherent argument to save “her” life.
Comment by dicentra on 12/13 @ 7:11 pm #
Because if you have five dollars and “Karen” has five dollars, you have more money than…
Meh. Screw it.
Comment by dicentra on 12/13 @ 7:15 pm #
The presence of warming is not evidence of its cause.
Unless that warming is caused by random homogenization.
Comment by rain of lead on 12/13 @ 7:17 pm #
hey all
check out this bit of info about the melting icecaps
http://noconsensus.wordpress.com/2009/12/13/ghcn-antarctic-warming-eight-times-actual/
key bit
So as we can see, of all the stations available in the antarctic, GHCN has chosen to use a single station on the Antarctic Peninsula to represent an entire continent of the earth for the past 17 years (red circle). But it’s not just any station, it’s a special one. Rothera Point has the single highest trend of any of the adjusted station data.
Comment by SDN on 12/13 @ 7:20 pm #
Oh, BTW, Karen, can you explain why Mars is also warming? since there are no humans there? Or is it the Barsoomian Air Cars?
Comment by Darleen on 12/13 @ 7:25 pm #
“Karen” is using more than one proxy IP which have been used by “HT”
funny, also sockpuppeting an email of a real Karen.
Never underestimate what the lust for power will drive Leftcultists to do. Such as attacking the person who assembled the charts and not WHAT the charts say.
Comment by cranky-d on 12/13 @ 7:25 pm #
We’ve sent probes to Mars. They are busy emitting copious amounts of CO2 RIGHT NOW!!
Comment by newrouter on 12/13 @ 7:26 pm #
“But it’s not just any station, it’s a special one”
you mean the one next to the power plant exhaust
Comment by newrouter on 12/13 @ 7:29 pm #
yo peeps ease up on karen she’s just doing the algorerhythm
Comment by J."Trashman" Peden on 12/13 @ 8:08 pm #
The data shows we are in an exceptionally warm period and it has been warmer before. So what? This does not refute anthropogenic global warming.
Karen apparently hasn’t noticed that the elite Climate Scientists do think the previous Warming Periods refute AGW – you know the “unprecedented” warming, and all. That’s why they were so intent on erasing the MWP, unsuccessfully.
But I sympathize with Karen. I have no idea why the elite Climate Scientists chose that route, unless it’s that they must have realized that they really didn’t have anything else whasoever to “prove” AGW.
Karen, give it up. The elite Climate Scientists were never doing Science to begin with, something which has been known and easily demonstrated for years, without needing any help from the leaked CRU emails and files.
It’s over, except for the AGW thuggery of course.
Comment by Kresh on 12/13 @ 8:13 pm #
I thought the rhythm method was the one that got you into trouble.
Comment by J."Trashman" Peden on 12/13 @ 8:18 pm #
“But it’s not just any station, it’s a special one”
Well, not as special as the one Antarctic Penninsula station which has apparently been representing the whole fucking Continent for about 17[?] years. Yeah, it’s near an Airport, maybe even on the control tower? Probably not since no barbeque pit has been found.
see wattsupwiththat.com – most recent post
Comment by Karen on 12/13 @ 8:21 pm #
“Comment by maggie katzen on 12/13 @ 6:54 pm AGW
Do you know what AGW means? GLOBAL WARMING IS CAUSED BY PEOPLE!!!! so, Karen, please tell us what caused the earth to be warmer before?”
See, she still doesn’t get it. YES! Caused by people, just as it was caused by many things in the past as I stated. If a super volcano blows during human history, it’ll make AGW look tiny.
Comment by dicentra on 12/13 @ 6:55 pm
“in an out-of-control positive-feedback loop that will turn us into a kind of Venus.”
Pure hyperbole, strawman argument.
all these attempts to declare CO2 a dangerous gas or to demand that we reduce CO2 emissions by 80% is the biggest mistake we could possibly make.
Yes, polluting the atmosphere is good for the earth. :)
“Richard Lindzen at MIT, who IS in climatology, has spent the last 20 years measuring exactly how much heat has been radiating back out into space and correlating that with the amount of CO2 that is accumulating. “
Thankyou dicentra for quoting Richard Lindzen, a guy who states there is no strong link between smoking and lung cancer and whose research conclusions have been proven false.
Lindzen certainly is your lone wolf among climate scientists and we can see why.
Comment by Karen on 12/13 @ 8:23 pm #
Fixed link:
Lindzen’s Discarded Global Warming Arguments
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Richard_S._Lindzen#Lindzen.27s_Discarded_Global_Warming_Arguments
Comment by J."Trashman" Peden on 12/13 @ 8:27 pm #
oops, sorry crossed synapse. It’s my only one.
Comment by J."Trashman" Peden on 12/13 @ 8:29 pm #
It’s over, Karen. You have no idea what you are talking about.
Comment by SBP on 12/13 @ 8:39 pm #
Problem: Conservatives can’t seem to distinguish the facts from the politics.
No.
Problem #1: You have nothing to offer but ad hominem attacks.
Problem #2: You are not qualified to have an opinion on this subject, and neither is Al Gore.
Problem #3: People are starting to laugh at you.
Comment by newrouter on 12/13 @ 8:42 pm #
“If a super volcano blows during human history, it’ll make AGW look tiny. ”
like Krakatoa
Comment by DarthRove on 12/13 @ 8:43 pm #
4 out of 5 climate scientists agree: Karen is not a climate scientist but does chew Trident.
Comment by SBP on 12/13 @ 8:44 pm #
So, how many semesters of diffy-q did you take, “Karen”?
Comment by SBP on 12/13 @ 8:45 pm #
Lindzen certainly is your lone wolf among climate scientists
That is a lie and you are a liar.
Other than that, great point!
Comment by newrouter on 12/13 @ 8:46 pm #
“a guy who states there is no strong link between smoking and lung cancer ”
do those studies control for radon
Comment by Karen on 12/13 @ 8:47 pm #
newrouter on 12/13 @ 8:42 pm #
“If a super volcano blows during human history, it’ll make AGW look tiny. ”
like Krakatoa
HAHA. Krakatoa was not a super volcano, yet it did have a minor affect on the climate.
Comment by Plasmodium Pete on 12/13 @ 8:47 pm #
“Yes, polluting the atmosphere is good for the earth.”
Karen, bless your heart, CO2 is not pollution. You may not know it, but every time you breathe you exhale CO2. Your pal Algore exhales lots and lots of it. Every time an animal exhales, they exhale CO2. Your friends the plants need it.
Next time you go outside, look in the sky – that is the blue stuff that is “up”. If there isn’t too much water vapor in the form of what we call “clouds”, you can see – but don’t look directly into it – a big shiny ball we call the “sun”. It is real, real hot. It makes the Earth hot.
Here is the scary part – things change. You apparently don’t know it, but all those plants and animals you like weren’t there millions of years ago, but other plants and animals were. They all died out. That is the way it is. Sorry.
Why don’t you tun your attention to something more likely than AGW – like anthropogenic continental drift ?
Comment by SBP on 12/13 @ 8:49 pm #
like anthropogenic continental drift ?
Good one, but don’t give them any ideas.
Comment by newrouter on 12/13 @ 8:50 pm #
“yet it did have a minor affect on the climate.”
wiki
Comment by Mr. W on 12/13 @ 8:54 pm #
The scary volcano is the Yellowstone caldera, newrouter. When it goes, it takes the entire GDP, and Al Gore, with it.
If someone was actually interested in the science of statistics, Iowahawk has done an exceptional breakdown of the statistical analysis behind both the accurate and ‘hockeystick’ methods of measuring the (sorry Karen) decline in global temps.
Comment by SBP on 12/13 @ 8:57 pm #
Good point, Mr. W.
Karen, please go read this and post a cogent refutation.
Otherwise, STFU.
Comment by Obstreperous Infidel on 12/13 @ 9:10 pm #
Hey, Karen I can absolutely guarantee that you’ll die before me should the polar caps melt. I’ll tell you what, when you do die, I’ll eat you for sustenance, except if you’re too waterlogged as I hate mushy food. I will however, skin you and dry out your hide and use it as a bath mat or parlor mat. Of course I will ONLY do this should you die of AGW…which is of course settled.
Comment by newrouter on 12/13 @ 9:12 pm #
“The scary volcano is the Yellowstone caldera, newrouter”
i’m sure it is. just pointing out how stupid karen’s assertion about the effects of krakatoa on the “global community”
Comment by Plasmodium Pete on 12/13 @ 9:16 pm #
“like anthropogenic continental drift ?
Good one, but don’t give them any ideas.”
You, Sir, are a denier. Unless you are a Ma’am, in which case you are still a denier. In either case, you are worse than a Holocaust denier.
All you have to do is look at some of the early maps of the “New” World – Florida was short and stubby, but the wight of Miami, Ft. Lauderdale, Tampa, St. Pete, etc. are dragging it into a long peninsula, and stretched the crust so thin that the weight of the trees and bunnies caused it to tear holes that turned into the Lake Okeechobee.
As every scienceotologist knows, correlation equals causation, and If We Don’t Act Now – say by relocating the entire population south of Orlando to Montana, Florida is going to go crashing into Cuba, which will cut off the Gulf Stream, and cause the rain in England to stop, and that will cause the cod to stop running so there will be no fish and chips, and the English will then be sad.
Comment by newrouter on 12/13 @ 9:20 pm #
agw = masons i’m quite certain
Comment by Adriane on 12/13 @ 9:30 pm #
Reunite Gondwanaland!!!
It’s for the Children and the Schindleria Praematurus…
Comment by FREE LAURASIA on 12/13 @ 9:50 pm #
You can reunite Gondwanaland all you want, but if you start dreaming of the glory of Greater Pangaea, we’re gonna get radical on your ass.
Comment by B Moe on 12/13 @ 10:09 pm #
It was 4 degrees warmer there this afternoon and they are still there.
Comment by Plasmodium Pete on 12/13 @ 10:17 pm #
“It was 4 degrees warmer there this afternoon and they are still there.”
Damnit – you are ruining my whole plan to have organic date palm and banana oases along the whole Appalachian Trail and sucker the Birkenstock crowd.
Comment by newrouter on 12/13 @ 10:18 pm #
“It was 4 degrees warmer there this afternoon and they are still there.”
darwin’s dead with agw crowd
Comment by Mr. W on 12/13 @ 10:20 pm #
“As every scientologist knows…” Heh. Good one. L. Ron Hubbard did say that the real dough was in starting a religion. Looks like the Church of East Anglia took him up on the suggestion.
Comment by SBP on 12/13 @ 10:27 pm #
Well, with a 4 degree C. temperature rise, the diverse forest in the Appalachian chain will cease to exist.
1) Not even the most alarmed of alarmists are predicting a “4 degree C temperature rise”, you fucking dumbass.
2) No, it wouldn’t, you fucking dumbass. It’d just move farther north.
Comment by Wm T Sherman on 12/13 @ 10:31 pm #
The Tambora volcanic explosion of 1815 was four times the size of Krakatoa, killed twice as many people, ejected ash into the stratosphere that caused “the year without a summer,” and had been predicted years earlier by climate models (*rimshot*).
Comment by Adriane on 12/13 @ 10:33 pm #
http://www.ghostofaflea.com/archives/013278.html
Harlan Ellison & Robin Williams discussing L.Ron Hubbard …
courtesy of Adriane,
President of the Association for Lesser Pangaea
our motto …
“Have a nice day … on some other continent!”
Comment by Plasmodium Pete on 12/13 @ 10:37 pm #
““As every scientologist knows…” ”
No, no, not scientologist, scienceotologist. A scienceotolgist is a scientist who studies science, which makes them super scientists, unless they are in Hollywood where they might be scientologist scienceotologists, which means they know everything about everything and should never be questioned.
Comment by cranky-d on 12/13 @ 10:58 pm #
I thought Karen was a drive-by concern troll at first, but she is apparently on the payroll somewhere.
Thanks for entertaining people, Karen. It was a public service.
Comment by B Moe on 12/13 @ 10:59 pm #
The Sambucca explosion of 1988 was only about half the size of Krakatoa, scared twice as many people, ejected a cubic shit ton of Monte’s Pizza halfway down Fourth Avenue, and had been predicted a couple hours earlier by the bartender serving them to me.
Comment by Karen on 12/13 @ 11:40 pm #
The scandal that wasn’t.
Climategate: Science Not Faked, But Not Pretty
LONDON (AP) — E-mails stolen from climate scientists show they stonewalled skeptics and discussed hiding data — but the messages don’t support claims that the science of global warming was faked, according to an exhaustive review by The Associated Press.
The 1,073 e-mails examined by the AP show that scientists harbored private doubts, however slight and fleeting, even as they told the world they were certain about climate change. However, the exchanges don’t undercut the vast body of evidence showing the world is warming because of man-made greenhouse gas emissions.
http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/energy/2009/12/12/climategate-science-not-faked-but-not-pretty.html
Comment by B Moe on 12/13 @ 11:41 pm #
Peer reviewed by the AP. Gotta love that fucking Karma!
Comment by RIP Ford on 12/13 @ 11:43 pm #
Well, if the AP says so, it must be true!
Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/13 @ 11:43 pm #
nothing to see here…. move along….
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/13 @ 11:45 pm #
not if it doesn’t exist SBP. didn’t think of that, did you? The dead don’t walk.
(okay, I just wanted to use that line)
Comment by RIP Ford on 12/13 @ 11:48 pm #
AP’s Borenstein has is one broken record.
Comment by Darleen on 12/14 @ 12:00 am #
I wonder how many “reporters” AP assigned to those 1073 emails?
I mean, they devoted 11 “reporters” to Palin 235 page book …
Comment by J."Trashman" Peden on 12/14 @ 12:02 am #
Do you enjoy the huge diversity of forest species? Well, with a 4 degree C. temperature rise, the diverse forest in the Appalachian chain will cease to exist.
No, Briffa proved Global Warming only hits one tree on the Yamal Penninsula. So I think were pretty safe.
Comment by Mark A. Flacy on 12/14 @ 12:12 am #
Ah, the link to that AP article must be the new talking point.
There are issues with the underlying temperature data, nonetheless.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/14 @ 12:15 am #
what?! no, “Karen” thinks for itself.
*snerk*
Comment by Spiny Norman on 12/14 @ 12:36 am #
AGW cultists are like 14th century Swiss priests performing exorcisms to stop advancing glaciers at the beginning of the Little Ice Age (which of course, in the gospel of the AGW cult, never happened).
Comment by J."Trashman" Peden on 12/14 @ 12:42 am #
However, the exchanges don’t undercut the vast body of evidence showing the world is warming because of man-made greenhouse gas emissions.
That’s because the “vast body of evidence” was already undercut in one way or another. Didn’t need the leaked email and files for that, you moron – but I guess it’s a living if you can’t work at the grocery check out counter helping people out to their cars.
Comment by J."Trashman" Peden on 12/14 @ 12:44 am #
“I shall not rest until all glaciers are advancing!”
Comment by Spiny Norman on 12/14 @ 12:51 am #
One of the most telling emails in the leaked files, reposted for posterity:
Professor Keiller never received an answer, to no one’s surprise.
The point that “points 3 and 4 do not agree with the accepted science” brings up is that Mann, Jones, Briffa, et al, were making the shit up as they went… and raking in millions in government grants.
By destroying the raw data so no one else can see how much “value” has been “added” in the remaining data, denouncing and smearing anyone who might question their methods and conclusions, and corrupting the peer review process, these men have done science a great disservice.
Comment by Danger on 12/14 @ 1:13 am #
Hey didn’t I tell you people “THE SCIENCE IS SETTLED!!!!eleventy!!!” (and a ! for Bob;)
Perspective wasn’t enough for you emotionless zombies, now Dicentra is rubbing in facts and data and I’m pretty sure the rest of you are just making fun of poor Karen. It’s just not right so stop it. And don’t try to make me laugh cause it wont work…. I’m serious!
Well ok, ya got me HaHaHaHa Haaa HaHaHa!!!
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/14 @ 1:16 am #
Hey, Danger! any idea how long it takes mail to reach you?
Comment by Danger on 12/14 @ 1:46 am #
Hey Maggie,
Mail takes about 10 days. I will be on my mid-tour R&R from about 16 Dec to 4 January so I may not get something sent recently until I get back.
Comment by John Bradley on 12/14 @ 2:14 am #
“I shall not rest until all glaciers are advancing!”
Perhaps a ‘compassionate conservative’ could propose an expensive, intrusive “No Glacier Left Behind” program.
For the children… of the polar bears.
Comment by Adriane on 12/14 @ 2:37 am #
Cash For Cubes!
In an effort to stop global warming & create jobs!!!11!, the Obama administration pays selected Democrats in the Teamster Union to haul ice cubes from bicycle powered freezers in about-to-be-foreclosed homes to the Maldives, where it is packed around panting polar bears, sweating penguins, and an occasional spotted owl.
Comment by Akatsukami on 12/14 @ 3:30 am #
Say Karen, how come that AP journopig never mentions the corrupted data and corrupting computer code that the CRU whistleblower also exposed? Because he’s as ignorant as you, or because he’s mendacious as you?
Comment by Roland THTG on 12/14 @ 6:27 am #
Do you enjoy the huge diversity of forest species? Well, with a 4 degree C. temperature rise, the diverse forest in the Appalachian chain will cease to exist.
It’s happening people! WAKE UP!!!!!11
I was visiting the Painted Desert and saw the poor trees that were turned to stone! You just know there were bunnies and stuff living in those trees. Now, it’s all hot and shit.
Comment by Rusty on 12/14 @ 6:50 am #
If it’s true,karen, then why cook the books? Where is the data? Why won’t they share the data?
Comment by That Global Warmist Rag! on 12/14 @ 7:02 am #
“Say Karen, how come that AP journopig never mentions the corrupted data and corrupting computer code that the CRU whistleblower also exposed? Because he’s as ignorant as you, or because he’s mendacious as you?”
Maybe they read the economist:
http://www.economist.com/node/20026079/print
Comment by SDN on 12/14 @ 7:09 am #
I’m not making fun of Karen; pity is more like it.
Comment by Plasmodium Pete on 12/14 @ 7:26 am #
“Maybe they read the economist:”
They may have read The Economist, but it is a certainty that they didn’t bother to read the reply: http://wattsupwiththat.com/2009/12/12/sticky-for-smoking-gun-at-darwin-zero/.
“Do you enjoy the huge diversity of forest species? Well, with a 4 degree C. temperature rise, the diverse forest in the Appalachian chain will cease to exist.”
This is an endlessly fascinating bit that reveals the depths of stupidity and incuriosity of the AGW Cultists. The average July temperature at the southern end of the Appalachians is 6 degrees C hotter than the northern end, and the average in January about 15 degrees C hotter.
Despite that, the difference in flora and fauna between the two ends or anywhere in between is little different, discounting the armadillo and alligators at the base of the southern foothills. The big difference is the growing season which is obviously longer in the south, and which one would think the Cultists would enjoy, seeing as how our trees at the southern end are soaking up the CO2 of their own blowhard selves, and harboring their migratory fauna.
Roland, you should know that those stone trees were always that way. Nothing on the planet ever, ever, changes, though if it does it is bad and icky, and caused by some RethugliKKKan.
Comment by SBP on 12/14 @ 7:37 am #
Notice that “Karen” never bothers to debate or even respond to the points raised by others. “She” simply dumps her latest link and scurries off.
Comment by SBP on 12/14 @ 7:39 am #
TGWR, The Economist is not a scientific journal, and an editorial is not science.
But you knew that, didn’t you?
Of course you did.
Comment by SBP on 12/14 @ 7:43 am #
#124: No way, denier. The climate in Georgia is exactly the same as the one in Maine! The science is settled! An unsigned op-ed piece in a British newspaper told us so!
Comment by Mr. W on 12/14 @ 7:45 am #
Global Warming Inc. is an industry now. That is the terrible beauty of America, we commodify everything, even junk science. ‘Karen’ is on the clock in the AGW sweatshop and she has a lot of fake ‘concerned citizen’ posts to make at various sites. That is why she can’t stay to debate the finer points of fraudulent science with you.
I wonder who pays her for doing this? I mean aside from, obviously, you and me.
Comment by Pablo on 12/14 @ 7:50 am #
Darleen, that would be five.
Comment by Plasmodium Pete on 12/14 @ 7:59 am #
“#124: No way, denier. The climate in Georgia is exactly the same as the one in Maine! The science is settled! An unsigned op-ed piece in a British newspaper told us so!”
Curse you and your unassailable logic and Culty goodness ! I knew I should never tangle with someone who studied at the feet of Algore, the greatest intellect ever to flunk out of Divinity School !
Comment by Plasmodium Pete on 12/14 @ 8:02 am #
“Darleen, that would be five”
Yes, but that is five Professional Journalists, who went to Journalism School and everything, so they too are pretty much unassailable authorities on, gosh, everything.
Comment by Mark A. Flacy on 12/14 @ 9:33 am #
So who wrote the Economist article?
Comment by By Not The Economist on 12/14 @ 9:35 am #
“So who wrote the Economist article?”
Who writes any of their articles?
Comment by Mark A. Flacy on 12/14 @ 9:43 am #
An asshole like you? Just guessing.
Comment by Reading hte Economist Like Sarah Palin on 12/14 @ 9:46 am #
What was the last economist article with a byline you read?
Comment by SDN on 12/14 @ 9:51 am #
Of course, what Karen neglects to mention is that the reviewer the AP picked is in the e-mails wondering how he can help perpetuate the cover-up……
Comment by ZOMG asking questions! on 12/14 @ 9:58 am #
“Of course, what Karen neglects to mention is that the reviewer the AP picked is in the e-mails wondering how he can help perpetuate the cover-up……”
In that email he seems to be asking for their response. You know, like a reporter might do….
Comment by SBP on 12/14 @ 10:05 am #
And the Copenhagen environmental theatre puts off making any decision about this VITAL!!!!!! EMERGENCY!!!!! for six years.
Hint: that means you lose, Karen. Sorry.
Comment by SBP on 12/14 @ 10:07 am #
President Obama has offered to cut US emissions by 4 per cent on 1990 levels by 2020, subject to approval by the US Congress.
Translation: good luck with that.
Comment by SBP on 12/14 @ 10:10 am #
No shit.
So your point was?
Oh, right: you didn’t have one.
Comment by SBP on 12/14 @ 10:14 am #
If I were “Karen” or any of the other sock puppets, I think I’d get busy working on my next stealth collectivization scam, ’cause the wheels ain’t going to go back on this one.
Comment by SBP on 12/14 @ 10:21 am #
What was the last economist article with a byline you read?
Hush, SFAG.
Comment by Osbtreperous Infidel on 12/14 @ 10:33 am #
Karen, hop hop, old girl. I need to know your preference and tout de suite. As you are already intimately aware, the caps are melting, the caps are melting. The wife and I are redecorating and having a real human hide of someone who so pointlessly and senselessly died due to global warming (AGGhhhh!11eleventy!!!!1) serving as an accessory in the bathroom or parlor would be so avante garde. We’d be the new coastal elites.
Comment by EJ D on 12/14 @ 10:57 am #
I laugh at anyone who thinks this is anything more than a scam to get your cash, you ignorant tools.
Comment by SDN on 12/14 @ 11:13 am #
You didn’t read the link, ZOMG. Go away.
Comment by SBP on 12/14 @ 11:15 am #
It’s SFAG, SDN. I suggest simply pointing and laughing, and then moving on.
Comment by Noah Nehm on 12/14 @ 11:21 am #
If you press a Lefty about his belief that “Bush Lied, People Died”, he’ll say that Bush’s insistence that there were WMDs in Iraq despite the fact that there were some doubts within his cabinet was tantamount to a lie. In other words, the Left will insist that the Bush administration’s marketing of the war was a lie (and, in the Left’s fevered imagination, just a ploy for the Bushie’s to get rich on Iraqi oil).
Let’s go with that for a moment. If you read the CRU e-mails, it’s absolutely clear that within the CRU there was some very serious disagreements about what their data meant, and in fact, doubts about their conclusions with regard to AGW. And yet, publicly, they continued to insist that AGW was a settled scientific fact. What’s more, their clearly emphatic marketing of AGW clearly benefited them – by ensuring they’d continue to be on the receiving end of the AGW gravy train.
So (sticking with the gravy metaphor) isn’t sauce for the goose also sauce for the gander? Can we call the folks at the CRU liars now? It seems to me that the case against the CRU is much stronger than the case against the Bush administration ever was….
Comment by Neo on 12/14 @ 3:58 pm #
Comment by Squid on 12/14 @ 4:41 pm #
Uh huh. Here’s a hint, SFAG: he wasn’t asking for a quote for the story he was writing; he was asking for directions on how they wanted him to spin it. I base this assertion on the fact that the reporter in question has written a number of “flowery” global warming articles over the past few years, and has been criticized for his breathless prose and tendency toward exaggeration.
Your picture of Borenstein as an impartial journalist looking for reaction quotes doesn’t hold up in the face of evidence. So, on what do you base your assertion that this was the case? I’ve shown you mine; now show me yours.
Comment by B Moe on 12/15 @ 6:22 am #
That probably wouldn’t shock you a bit, huh?
Comment by Rusty on 12/15 @ 6:50 am #
And the Copenhagen environmental theatre puts off making any decision about this VITAL!!!!!! EMERGENCY!!!!! for six years.
That’s very zen of them, don’t you think?
Perhaps AGW is really an existential personal problem.
I will meditate on this. For the good of the planet. While surfing boobie porn.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/15 @ 7:11 am #
No, it refutes “unprecedented”. Do try and pay attention.
Comment by Rusty on 12/15 @ 4:13 pm #
I’m finding the coldest December in Danish(?) Denmarkian(?) history as the backdrop for an Anthropogenic Global Warming confrence more than a tad amusing. It is to chuckle.
Comment by McGehee on 12/15 @ 4:41 pm #
That’s what they get for inviting Algore, the new Snow Miser.