Something I did not know: The Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP) which will disburse $350 billion, half of a planned $750 billion, мебелиwill itself cost $26.55 million smackeroonies to process. That’s rather pause-giving, even in these days of millions tossed around like taxicab tips, and the federal debt being measured in how many times the stack of dollars would reach to the moon and back. There are people and firms shoveling all this ”stimulus”, and they cost money, a good-sized lotto payout, to make the magic happen.
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So, I wonder how much the $26 million costs to unload?
Comment by Jeffersonian on 1/6 @ 12:51 pm #
I’m reminded of the title of one chapter in PJ O’Rourke’s “Parliament of Whores” – Our Government – What the Fuck Do They Do All Day and Why Does It Cost So Goddamn Much Money?”
I’m becoming convinced that the pirates in neckties in DC know what’s going on and are just grabbing for as much cash as they can before it all implodes.
Comment by cranky-d on 1/6 @ 12:59 pm #
Being the civic-minded guy I am, I will take care of getting rid of that money at no cost to the taxpayers.
Comment by Spies, Brigands, and Pirates on 1/6 @ 1:06 pm #
Are you thinking what I’m thinking, cranky?
‘Cause I’m imagining a fleet of Chinook helicopters flying over North Dakota.
Let’s see…payload of about 12,000 kg…dollar bills weigh approximately one gram each…$750 billion…
625 helicopter runs should do it, assuming we go with hundreds.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 1/6 @ 1:11 pm #
More depressing shit.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D95HPUGG0&show_article=1
O! just said trillion dollar deficits will last years. Get ready to pay for all this “change” out the ass.
Comment by Benedick on 1/6 @ 1:47 pm #
Pink, that’s about all you can do after taking the “change” in the ass in the first place.
Comment by Ric Locke on 1/6 @ 1:58 pm #
Actually, SBP, a new US Treasury note weighs/masses as close to precisely one gram as the machinery can be tuned to produce.
That’s incredibly useful. We don’t have notes in denominations larger than $100 because of the belief that drug dealers, terrorists, and others would find them easy to count and transport. But thanks to the uniformity of US money, nobody needs to count it. One kilogram of hundreds is exactly $100,000, ten kilos is a million, and so on. No problem.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by Lt. York on 1/6 @ 2:01 pm #
SBP: Are you referring to the money hole? Thought that was in NM.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JnX-D4kkPOQ
Comment by Spies, Brigands, and Pirates on 1/6 @ 2:09 pm #
Ric: it’ll also be useful when Barky’s hyperinflation sets in.
Just ask the Germans.
Maybe we can stamp tare weights on the shopping carts, so you can use them to bring your money to the store then go through an automated “checkin line” similar to a truck weigh station.
Comment by Kevin T. Keith on 1/6 @ 2:13 pm #
I presume that administering any amount of commercial financing takes some degree of effort and costs some amount of money. I presume also that the more money under management, the higher those costs will be.
Do note that, at a projected rate of $26.55 million for handling $350 billion in assets, this works out to a management fee of about 0.007% (that’s 7 thousandths of one percent). Given that the most efficient indexed market funds commonly have management fees of 1% – 5%, and “hard money” commercial lenders often charge at least 3% off the top in origination fees (“points”) plus high interest, the projected administrative cost for the financial bailout would appear to be astoundingly low.
As to how much it would cost to, in turn, administer that $26.55 million, that would be just under $800,000 at a typical market rate of 3% (plus interest, if this were a loan, of course). Or you could pay exactly $2,014.01 at the equivalent rate at which that fee is itself projected to be earned.
Deciding which of these is “overpriced” is left as an exercise for the reader.
Comment by MAJ (P) John on 1/6 @ 2:13 pm #
“So, I wonder how much the $26 million costs to unload?”
$.55 million, yes? Heh.
Comment by Spies, Brigands, and Pirates on 1/6 @ 2:14 pm #
Lt. York: that’s funny!
Comment by Bod on 1/6 @ 2:21 pm #
How much *can* it cost us for some guys to drive a few dozen tractor trailers to Wall Street, and unload a few hundred tons of waste paper with a pitchfork?
Comment by geoffb on 1/6 @ 2:25 pm #
So we will need calculus to figure this? And here I thought this was to be a “no math” blog.
Comment by Spies, Brigands, and Pirates on 1/6 @ 2:28 pm #
It sounds a lot like the classic Dot Com business plan:
1) Raise $100 million in venture capital.
2) Hire a guy to shovel the money into a furnace.
3) If you run out of money in six months, hire another guy.
I’m sure there are some unemployed executives from boo.com or the like who’d be happy to bring their expertise to the problem.
Comment by Bod on 1/6 @ 2:35 pm #
The difference is that unlike the dot-bomb debacle, we’re ALL funding a dubious business model, run by a batallion of USDA prime morons.
And even idiotic VC money had an exit strategy.
Comment by Spies, Brigands, and Pirates on 1/6 @ 2:42 pm #
Wasn’t there some fringe candidate who advocated minting a $1 trillion coin and using it to pay off the national debt?
Seems a shame to go to the trouble of making a die if you’re only going to use it once, no?
Comment by Bod on 1/6 @ 2:50 pm #
I *think* we’d need to use that die about 9 times to get the maximum benefit.
When I’ve been on the ale a bit, I wonder what the real downside would be of defaulting on all our international debt.
The domestic leftards seem to have no interest in engaging in any meaningful form of international commerce, other than pilgrimages to Havana, Hanoi and Caracas, and I’m sure they can figure out some form of deal whereby they pay for their trips by working in a “People’s Revolutionary Road Construction Project” for a month or so, so they can experience solidarity with their bretheren and sisteren.
Comment by B Moe on 1/6 @ 3:04 pm #
I presume that administering any amount of commercial financing takes some degree of effort and costs some amount of money. I presume also that the more money under management, the higher those costs will be.
Except they aren’t managing investments, they are giving money away.
Comment by Old Texas Turkey on 1/6 @ 3:10 pm #
The difference is that unlike the dot-bomb debacle, we’re ALL funding a dubious business model, run by a batallion of USDA prime morons.
And we just elected the summa cum laude’s of Moron U to take the reins.
Fun.
Comment by Bod on 1/6 @ 3:11 pm #
Good point, Moe.
The costs to the money manager in maintaining a level of oversight of those investments is huge. There will be NO subsequent meaningful oversight of this handout, and there’s been f*ck-all due diligence done in the first place.
THAT’S why the TARP team refuses to reveal any details about the terms of the deals made with the recipients of the funds.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 1/6 @ 3:22 pm #
Oh, come now. I’m sure there are dozens of journalists busily filing FOIA requests to pry forth those details.
Any minute now…
Comment by Obstreperous Infidel on 1/6 @ 3:22 pm #
“Except they aren’t managing investments, they are giving money away.”
Come on B Moe. K. Keith really worked hard on that comment. Facts like that are irrelevant. Plus, I’m pretty sure he’s just fishing for blog hits anyway.
Comment by The Sanity Inspector on 1/6 @ 3:23 pm #
They’re pitchforking our money out the back of a speeding train.
Comment by kelly on 1/6 @ 3:59 pm #
“There are people and firms shoveling all this ’stimulus’”
Is that what they’re calling horseshit these days?
Comment by dicentra on 1/6 @ 4:15 pm #
So. What are all you going to do when the country finally collapses into a post-apocalyptic thriller (minus the radiation-produced zombies, that is)?
Maybe we could all meet up at Jeff’s place and play strip Monopoly with the bills that used to be our 401Ks and life savings.
Comment by Spies, Brigands, and Pirates on 1/6 @ 4:17 pm #
I want one of those bitchin’ mohawk haircuts and a turbofan powered motorcycle.
Comment by Bod on 1/6 @ 4:20 pm #
Parsnip’ll be there, in a loincloth with a little wind-up musical box mechanism.
Comment by Mikey NTH on 1/6 @ 4:27 pm #
Doesn’t surprise me – in a departmental audit sense. An agency’s budget is ‘billed’ for what it does. If an agency is given an extra task to accomplish, that task will share the ‘billing’ with the other tasks – its portion of personnel costs, equipment, supplies, etc. For instance, a city garage will maintain and repair vehicles for the police department, fire department, highwat dept., parks dept., etc. and those departments will have the parts and supplies used for their vehicles attributed to them, and may even pick up the costs of the mechanics who worked on the vehicle in whole or part.
It seems odd, but if the city contracted the work out to private garages, they would receive the same bill for the services performed. Doing this can provide information on whether the city is getting a good deal by doing this in-house or not; what will need to be budgeted next year to provide this service, etc.
I am not an accountant, but that is what I recall being told was the reason when I worked out at Camp Dearborn.
Comment by bigbooner on 1/6 @ 4:38 pm #
Comment by Lt. York on 1/6 @ 2:01 pm #
SBP: Are you referring to the money hole?
I clicked on the link expecting to see something entirely different.
Comment by Log Cabin on 1/6 @ 4:57 pm #
Repeat after the MSM:
Republican debt = Mortgaging our childrens’ future.
Democrat debt = Badly needed economic stimulus.
Comment by Mikey NTH on 1/6 @ 6:00 pm #
The admin fees have everything to do with auditing, accounting, and budgeting, meya, and nothing at all to do with the wisdom of the task.
Comment by dre on 1/6 @ 8:10 pm #
Gird Your Pork Loins: Hairy Joe is here!
Comment by dre on 1/6 @ 8:12 pm #
“That’s a fraction of a percent in admin fees. Surely very little will go wrong with such small admin fees.”
The effin’ Fed. Gov. budget is one big admin fee. $700 toilets for everyone.
Comment by Bob Reed on 1/6 @ 8:34 pm #
How much extra cash is it going to cost to spend the trillion dollar deficits that the One os predicting we’ll have over the next few years-when he will be presiding over the budget?
But, I mean, loke log cabin noted:
Republican debt = Mortgaging our childrens’ future.
Democrat debt = Badly needed economic stimulus.
Mind Boggling…
Comment by Dan Collins on 1/6 @ 9:24 pm #
Ridiculous. My wife will spend that money for NOTHING.
Comment by meya on 1/6 @ 10:37 pm #
“The admin fees have everything to do with auditing, accounting, and budgeting, meya”
Yup.
Comment by donald on 1/6 @ 11:44 pm #
It’s gonna be awesome when all the mouth breathers realize that the “change” they can all believe in, will be nickels and dimes baby. Nickels and dimes.
Comment by donald on 1/6 @ 11:46 pm #
By the way, for all the cool rockers like Pablo, The fricking Long Ryders are playing Atlanta Friday and Saturday at a dump called The Earl. Only two shows in America, and they pick Atlanta…at The Earl. PBR for everybody! Righteous.
Comment by bmeuppls on 1/7 @ 2:08 am #
PBR? Ain’t nobody roun heah drinkin no PBR! Sweetwater Ale or bust!
OK. I remember the Long Riders but I must really be out of it cause I’ve never heard of the Earl… is that like the ’00s version of the 688 Club? Vomit stained sticky floors and all?
Comment by DoDoGuRu on 1/7 @ 4:44 am #
If we’re about to flush trillions down the crapper, why not just send everyone in America $10,000. At least they’d get a brief chance to spend it before the American Dollar goes the way of the Zimbabwean Dollar.
Comment by Salt Lick on 1/7 @ 5:17 am #
If we’re about to flush trillions down the crapper, why not just send everyone in America $10,000.
This is what I asked with regard to the mobile homes and other relief provided by the government after Katrina (which destroyed my father’s home). There are several scandals now brewing about who got the government contracts to provide this relief.
Oh…I think I just answered why the government won’t just send the money to individual citizens.
Comment by JHoward on 1/7 @ 5:48 am #
Heck, that’s more than I make in a year, Sanity. I propose all good Americans simply pay no attention to the mens behind the curtain. Keynesianism’ll all work out okay. The mens said so…this being a steadfast representative republic and all.
Comment by alppuccino on 1/7 @ 6:36 am #
Ric,
I am a huge fan, so it is with great humility and admiration that I tell you that your #6 comes as close to a Cliff Claven bar stool soliloquy as any comment I’ve ever read.
You may call me “Norm”.
Comment by donald on 1/7 @ 7:01 am #
The Earl is a “Resturaunt over on Moreland avenue, in the new East Atlanta hip area. It actually has smoking allowed, which is gonna suck cause I’ve gotten used to Non-smoking venues. The 688 was kinda like my home away from home. I saw so much great shit there. Jason and the Scorchers first Atlanta’s show, REM, The Dictators, The Georgia Satellites, and best of all, watching Iggy slice his chest up with a piece of broken glass…for the people you know.
Comment by MAJ (P) John on 1/7 @ 7:12 am #
dicentra,
If there will be no zombies, then I don’t want to be there :(
Comment by Salt Lick on 1/7 @ 7:25 am #
al — I never bonded with Cheers, so I had to google Cliff Calvin. For others similarly Cheers Challenged, interesting facts from Wiki:
The character was created for Ratzenberger, who had earlier auditioned for the Norm Peterson role. The producers let him know that he had impressed them, but that he didn’t really click as Norm. Ratzenberger responded by pointing out that what the ensemble didn’t have was a “bar know-it-all”.
On the Cheers 200th Anniversary Special, host John McLaughlin asked Ratzenberger about Cliff Clavin. Ratzenberger said that Cliff would describe himself as the “Winged nut that holds western civilization together.” However Ratzenberger said that he would describe Cliff simply as “A winged nut.”
Comment by datadave on 1/7 @ 8:02 am #
as the one sane person above noted it’s an very cheap management fee. You should check how your 401K’s are being billed. 3 percent or more. (Vanguard is a refreshing exception..)
I’ll take the Govt anytime over the outrageous fees ‘private equity’ charges.
Keep trumping your wingnut theories numbnuts and you’ll get laid-off soon.
Comment by alppuccino on 1/7 @ 8:03 am #
Thanks Salt Lick. Now Ric’s gonna trollhammer me.
Comment by B Moe on 1/7 @ 8:05 am #
I’ll take the Govt anytime over the outrageous fees ‘private equity’ charges.
Then why don’t you trust them with your taxes, thief?
Comment by donald on 1/7 @ 8:23 am #
We’ll leave aside for the time being that that’s the projected percentage. I think we all know how that works out in every single government program.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 1/7 @ 8:29 am #
My brother grew up with their bass player. I have no doubt that he’d been over to my house a time or dozen, but I had a hard time telling all of my brother’s furry musician friends apart.
Comment by Bod on 1/7 @ 8:29 am #
You should check how your 401K’s are being billed.
There’s a vast difference between me paying a fee for a service which I value, and paying a service charge to my own blackmailer as he empties my bank account.
Comment by Obstreperous Infidel on 1/7 @ 8:30 am #
Irony meters the world over were pegged beyond repair by DD’s comment on sanity. I see he disregarded your explanation too, B Moe. RIF.
Comment by Carin on 1/7 @ 8:34 am #
That DD is a RIOT!
Keep trumping your wingnut theories numbnuts and you’ll get laid-off soon.
Oh, is this payback? Are those road-repair and “green jobs” intended only for those who voted Dem?
Comment by Rob Crawford on 1/7 @ 8:39 am #
ITYM “retard”.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 1/7 @ 8:43 am #
Well, there won’t be anyone but Dems when they get done. Haven’t you heard? Two lost elections mean it’s over for anyone who isn’t part of the Hope and Change Express!
Comment by Slartibartfast on 1/7 @ 8:46 am #
Rebublikans is ekstinked!
Comment by Salt Lick on 1/7 @ 9:07 am #
“Here, here!” from everyone in hurricane country who received free chain saws and generators, $1000 month rent-stipends (continuing three years after Katrina) and had their wind-blown pastures manicured by government-paid contractors. Not to mention the millions now paid to park the empty, rusting, formaldehyde-ridden mobile homes in fields owned by poor farmers (snort).
And more government help and “cheap management fees” are on the way! Yes, we can!
Comment by Slartibartfast on 1/7 @ 9:20 am #
To be fair, it’d be hard for Obama to find a more inept director of FEMA (for example) than this guy. FEMA could in fact have screwed up a great deal less than it did, if Bush had appointed a directory with any ability at all.
Comment by Charybdis E. Scylla on 1/7 @ 9:35 am #
Management fee? As has been noted, there is no management involved.
How about billing us on a transaction fee basis instead? Say the average payout is $50 billion – that’s 15 transactions. ACH transfers are cheap, wires slightly more expensive and checks are the most expensive of all. The last time we calculated it, it cost our company about $75 to produce a paper check. But, if you work for a bloated, inefficient government agency (redundant, I know) it probably will cost 100 times that. So, worst case scenario: 15 * $7,500 = $112,500. That only leaves $26,437,500 to cover the remaining overhead allocation.
No fluff here. Nope. Seems perfectly reasonable.
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Comment by Charlie (Colorado) on 1/8 @ 11:46 am #
Oh, c’mon, Jeff. $350 billion is costing $26.5 million to process. That’s $350,000,000,000 costing $26,550,000. $26,550,000 / $350,000,000,000 is .000076 — 0.0076 percent. Seven one-thousandths of ONE PERCENT. How the fuck much did you expect it to cost? I suppose Paulson could write out checks by hand, but that number means there are about 200 people total being paid to watch that much money.
I mean, I know you’re an English major, but Jesus.
Comment by Sdferr on 1/8 @ 11:49 am #
Huh. I thought this post was initially done by the Sanity Inspector? When and how did JeffG’s name get appended to it?
Comment by Sdferr on 1/8 @ 12:00 pm #
Another take on the costs of stimulus spending from Arnold Kling, but viewed from the Human knowledge input side, rather than the simple money accounting:
Comment by B Moe on 1/8 @ 3:51 pm #
Why does the amount of the money have anything to do with how many people are doling it out? Are they pushing it around in wheelbarrows?
Comment by Sdferr on 1/8 @ 4:20 pm #
Are you just leg pulling B Moe? Or would this begin to answer the question?
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