… Now you don’t. Obama’s political machine wields the mighty eraser in getting embarrassing stuff to disappear down the old memory hole, least The One’s unscripted denial (at 3:14)
I, uh, had no contact with the governor, ah uh, or his office. Uh and so, we were not … I, I was, uh, not aware of what was, um, happening.
… taint his infallibility.
Nevermind, too, that Axelrod stated that Obama had met with sleazeball Blagojevich on November 23rd, now he, too, is claiming it didn’t happen.
Disappearing news stories, withdrawn statements, coupled with PE Obama’s increasingly muscular rhetoric about giant government projects and ‘climate change control’ … indeed, a 2008 revisiting of what some dissident Soviet wag once opined
The future is known, it is the past that is always changing.
(h/t dre)
Comment by Dan Collins on 12/11 @ 9:04 am #
Is that the way we’re referring to the words of Obama, now? Obama 3:14?
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 9:11 am #
Probably so Dan,
But I would suggest a more complete, almost star-date-like form; one that cites the date and time…
You know how O!s explanations and positions are; like the universe thay are constantly changing…
Like a running brook, you can never actually set foot in the same place, evah!
And with O!, you’ll get a different
LIEnuancein every answer…Kinda like toy prizes in cereal, no?
Best Wishes
Comment by Squid on 12/11 @ 9:15 am #
It is now! Just imagine the fun we’ll have coming up with names for the books in the King Barry Version. Think of the arguments between those who believe that the new era started Election Day versus those who believe it starts on Inauguration Day.
O!, the fun we’ll have!
Comment by cynn on 12/11 @ 9:18 am #
In the grand scheme of things, I couldn’t care less if Obama spoke with the crook. In fact, I would expect him to have some thoughts on his replacement. But this stumbling damage control really is hamfisted and unnecessary. It just looks bad.
Comment by Ron Burgundy on 12/11 @ 9:23 am #
Ah, but one that never changes, Darleen, is the imputation of bad motives onto other by partisan hacks. Thanks for demonstrating the eternal truth of such hackery with this post.
PS The second eternal truth is you defending your hackery by saying “someone else did it too!” I assume you can practice both in the next post?
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 9:26 am #
Huh?
Comment by happyfeet on 12/11 @ 9:26 am #
Baracky will just have to learn as he goes how to answer questions and stuff without lying I think cause that’s just part of a whole set of president skills Chicago street trash can’t be expected to know I don’t think. We’ll just have to be patient I guess.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 9:26 am #
Can you try to make some sense Ron?
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 9:29 am #
I wonder how this would be treated if you replace the names with George Bush, Karl Rove, and Jack Abrhamoff.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 9:32 am #
I think that was Ron attempting a version of “Sphincter says what?”
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 9:38 am #
Also, the sheer cognitive dissonance contained in Ron’s post could power a mid-sized class city.
Comment by DarthRove on 12/11 @ 9:39 am #
Is that the way we’re referring to the words of Obama, now? Obama 3:14?
When newspapers and websites start posting the words of The One in red letters, then you’ll know the Apocalypse is truly around the corner.
Comment by Pablo on 12/11 @ 9:40 am #
Exactly right, cynn. So why do it? Why is he lying about talking to Blago? Same reason he lied about Wright. And Ayers. And Rezko. I am not the Barack I knew.
Comment by geoffb on 12/11 @ 9:41 am #
Obamabots can now remove questions about topics they deem “inappropriate” from the Obama website. All the wonderfulness of Digg et al comes to Obama town.
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 9:42 am #
Well Ron,
Then perhaps you can explain why all of the questions regarding Blagojevich are mysteriously disappearing from the Hope-n-Change website..?
Probably just a coincidence, right? Surely the site administrators wouldn’t be arbitrarily deleting them, would they? I mean, we know all of those well intentioned supporters, like the ones who just happened to jam the telephone lines at WGN-and not the result of any action alert or any such impetus, wouldn’t be trying to hide any legitimate questions that folks might want to ask, would they?
Imputing bad motives..? No, no, no…
I’ll come right out and say they’re liars; this definately doesn’t conform to the narrative arc sold the country, the story of O!…
And as far as things going down the memory hole? There have been exponentially more examples of the practice by O!s campaign and his devotees in the media than I have ever seen in my lifetime; and we’re talking quite a few years, my friend…
Comment by Pablo on 12/11 @ 9:44 am #
Now why would she have to invoke the second eternal truth when you already did it in trying to sell the first? Obamadammit! Pay attention, Rod.
Comment by happyfeet on 12/11 @ 9:44 am #
Liars is right, Bob. When you owe your whole presidency to propaganda you just go with what you know I think.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 9:51 am #
Can someone be impeached before they are sworn in?
Comment by geoffb on 12/11 @ 9:52 am #
The Utopian ends are the motives on the Left and so always justify any and all means to that end.
Bad motives? They can never by definition have a bad motive. Evuh!
Comment by nawoods on 12/11 @ 9:54 am #
None of this really adds up. I mean, O! missed a golden opportunity here. If all was on the up and up, and he has nothing to hide, he should have said, “Yes, I met with the governor. He made proposals that I felt were unseemly, and that did not represent the type of change I want to bring to Washington. Once again, I asked him to nominate my preferred candidate, and assured him of my gratitude for doing so, and nothing more.” But, he lied instead. Why?
Comment by geoffb on 12/11 @ 9:55 am #
When in doubt, always go with what you perceive to be your strength.
Comment by nawoods on 12/11 @ 9:58 am #
And BTW, I know the answer to my question. Obama is a product of his environment. He’s been playing the same game Blago’s been playing, which is the same game Rahm’s been playing, and Daley and Wright and Ayers, etc…. Like Happyfeet says, he is a product of propaganda, and most certainly not the Obama we thought we knew. Deal with it, trolls.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 10:00 am #
Whoever first labeled him Barrack Milhouse Obama was brilliant.
Comment by Sticky B on 12/11 @ 10:07 am #
In about a year, every single article in the NYT or WaPo or any of the other unofficial organs of the WH will contain the following sentence, “was obtained from a source who wished to remain anonymous as he is not authorized to speak on behalf of the White House.” The only problem being that this will apply to the WH press secretary, as well as the chief of staff, and occasionally even the president himself. Whereas currently it only applies to VP Biden.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 10:07 am #
Why would someone keep a chief of staff that would “misspeak” about who you meet and who you talk to? I mean isn’t that their job to know and arrange those things? I guess in the new bizarro world the chief of staff’s job is to call himself a liar so the new President doesn’t be called one.
Comment by Tom Maguire on 12/11 @ 10:08 am #
I think the editorial policy at KHQA is comical if this is how they handle corrections, but… I think their original Nov 5 story was just wrong.
Blagojevich had a Nov press conference. In response to a question about whether he had discussed the Senate seat with Obama, he said:
“”I have not spoken to him and at the appropriate time we are going to certainly seek his sentiments, if he has any”.”
That is Blago 4:01, FWIW.
And the Times spent Nov 5 fawning over the most famous man in the world on the greatest day in history, yet failed to detect a meeting with the governor. Sure, a phone call or Blackberry might have escaped their fawning, but a live face-to-face?
Comment by Dan Collins on 12/11 @ 10:11 am #
Tom, this is from Gabriel Malor at Ace’s. He seems to think it’s dispositive.
Comment by Obstreperous Infidel on 12/11 @ 10:12 am #
“But, he lied instead. Why?”
It’s what he does. Politicians are liars. Especially pandering national stage politicians. But the biggest lie is this whole hopey/changey bullshit.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 10:14 am #
Tom it is pretty funny how everyone has to be a liar for this one guy to be right. Axlerod has to be a liar, newspapers have to be liars, whose next Rahm Emanuel?
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 10:16 am #
Sounds like the far right is jealous of Obama’s political skillz.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 10:17 am #
Mr. Pink, I’ve very willing to believe that Rahm Emmanuel is a liar.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 10:19 am #
‘Snip, I’d not shift from “HOPE and CHANGE” to “Try and stop us.” too quickly. I’d hate for Obama-trons to get whiplash.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 10:19 am #
I do not think anyone is jealous of his ability to lie and have the press eat it up like ice cream.
Comment by happyfeet on 12/11 @ 10:25 am #
oh. Mr. Maguire says a meeting was unlikely then it’s a lot unlikely there was a meeting but KHQA are still revealed to be maladroit dirty socialist propaganda swine I think and it’s the propaganda what’s gonna warp our little country into an unrecognizable third worldy oppressive backwater more than anything.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 10:28 am #
By the “far right” are you referring to the far removed?
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 10:32 am #
Thor see comment 27.
Comment by Sticky B on 12/11 @ 10:32 am #
Jealous is synonymous with nauseated? Must be a regional thing.
Comment by DarthRove on 12/11 @ 10:33 am #
A reading from Book of Obama
3:1 For The One spoke, and verily, all that He spake came to pass. Those with whom He had discourse in the past, knew not of what matter the discourse took.
2 Missals and privy tidings between His ambassadors and Lord Helmetlocks of Springfield vanished as like the dew.
3 But the Great Prosecutor, who had employed spies to catch out Lord Helmetlocks in foul trickery, did not heed the word of Obama. His recollection did not fade, nor did those of his minions.
4 Also, there were traitors in the land who sought to cast blame upon Obama, saying “Why dost He lie, and seek to deny that which all others say?”
5 And Obama smote the traitors saying, “Uhm, uh, Let me stop you there. We … I said I never had a meeting. And I didn’t. So let it be written, so let it be done.”
6 And the earth opened up and swallowed the traitors. Then the skies disgorged unicorns which shat flowers and rainbows.
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 10:35 am #
By “far right” I mean the Republicans who are already dedicating themselves to obstructing and hobbling Obama every chance they get instead of being patriotic and giving him a chance.
The extremest 10% right of America.
The crazys.
This Blagojevich thing looks like just the correct shiny toy to keep the far right busy while Obama fixes America.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 10:36 am #
It’s there, right there. During that brief encounter at the greet and shake line at the governor’s conference look close at that picture and you’ll see how Obama could’ve passed $1,000,000 in small unmarked bills to Blago in the cupped palm of his shaking hand. I’m serious. Something was in Obam’s hand, loook!
Comment by SarahW on 12/11 @ 10:38 am #
Then the skies disgorged unicorns which shat flowers and rainbows.
Oh. I thought that was Chomps and Mr. Pushkin not liking the new cat kibble.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 10:40 am #
I still had to pay for my gas yesterday.
Comment by Ric Locke on 12/11 @ 10:40 am #
Heh. What’s half infuriating, half hilarious in all of this is the (continued) behavior of the Press. Does anybody here know a Board of Director at, say, Tribune or NewsCorp?
I mean, the Press keeps telling us it lives on scandal. People don’t pay attention to boring details, they tell us. It’s gotta be juicy, and above all immediate. Inquiring Minds Want to Know…
And here we have what is undoubtedly the juiciest political scandal in three decades, maybe five. Corrupt politicians. Million-dollar payoffs. Fancy houses and hot cars and padded expense accounts. Ties to the Rich and Famous (already featured in their pages) and to popular, recently elected politicians. The only thing it needs is big-busted bimbos with low necklines and high heels, and I’m pretty sure those could be turned up with a bit of digging.
And they bury it. To the extent they report it at all, it’s in the very style they claim nobody pays attention to — blocks of gray print full of details and unpronounceable names.
Politicians are supposed to lie. It’s part of the job description. But one of the things journalists are supposed to do is catch them at it, and jeer not so much at the lying as the being foolish enough to get caught at it. Here’s the Press not only supporting the liars, but doing it in a way that tosses out what they claim is an absolutely necessary part of “news coverage”. Then they go to the Board of Director and whimper. “Craigslist is stealing our ad revenue,” they say. Nobody seems willing to point out that if they were doing their jobs as they themselves define them Craigslist would never have had much chance in the first place.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by SarahW on 12/11 @ 10:41 am #
If he’s lying about the meetingwith Blago, it must be because it’s tied to something dirty. If it weren’t he’d have told the truth.
Comment by SarahW on 12/11 @ 10:41 am #
An honest cat has a hairball now and then. A guilty cat hides it beneath the scatter-rug.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 10:41 am #
That’s not what they mean by “fix”. Think veterinary.
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 10:43 am #
Or he’s just yanking your chain, SarahW.
Think about it.
Every single thing he pulls off the web causes how many hours of wasted “work” and braying on far right blogs?
It’s perfect.
Like moths to a flame.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 10:44 am #
“Obama every chance they get instead of being patriotic and giving him a chance.”
You have to be shitting me.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 10:45 am #
Maybe you should go to a convention of people who bury news stories and give your speech about burying news stories.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 10:47 am #
Which, somehow, magically contains Larry Johnson and his fellow PUMAs.
With this much anti-fact floating around, I’d be afraid of total fact-annihilation, along with accompanying deadly gamma flux.
Comment by SarahW on 12/11 @ 10:47 am #
Tom, I’ll allow that the nov 5 meeting was misreported, but it doesn’t make sense overall for Blago to have had no discussion with O or his people, ever, at all.
Comment by SarahW on 12/11 @ 10:48 am #
My cat has no online privileges, Parsnip.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 10:49 am #
Yes O! floated to us down a river of feces from Chicago untouched and untainted to show us the way. Just like freakin Moses.
Comment by Pablo on 12/11 @ 10:52 am #
Ah, so the “far left” is about 40% and includes most Congressional Dems. See Bush, George W.
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 10:53 am #
I still had to pay for my gas yesterday.
Y’all didn’t really think Obama was going to help out you Red State dwellers did you, maggie?
Quite the opposite.
Looks like Georgia’s F-22 plant is going to be chopped first as a thank you for slowing down the Detroit bailout.
What’s next?
Probably all them Red State farm subsidies.
And I imagine Texas oil companies will have to paying for all the oil they’re pumping out of Federal land for free now.
Comment by Pablo on 12/11 @ 10:53 am #
Be patriotic and give the US a chance? Hell, nO!
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 10:55 am #
Comment by ginsocal on 12/11 @ 10:56 am #
Snip got his math wrong (not hard to do when you’re sharing one with six or seven other people). It’s the extremist 48% of America.
Comment by ginsocal on 12/11 @ 10:57 am #
Sharing one brain, that is. Shit.
Comment by Pablo on 12/11 @ 10:58 am #
I’m in the bluest of states and not only is gas not free, but I still have to go get it and actually pump it myself. This better change on Jan 22.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 10:58 am #
i>If he’s lying about the meetingwith Blago, it must be because it’s tied to something dirty. If it weren’t he’d have told the truth.
Again, look to Nixon. If he had just told the truth and not let his paranoia and guilt complex take over he would likely have finished his term, but his pathological dishonesty and a rabid press took him down over scandals that weren’t really that big a deal.
As Ric alluded to above, however, and as we have seen with the Edwards love child deal, the press doesn’t give a shit about Democrat scandals.
Comment by Ron Burgundy on 12/11 @ 11:00 am #
see….he HAS to be lying and so does Axlerod and Emmanuel and a TV station’s correction policies. According to the Bush defenders and Iraq war lovers, people on the other side cannot make mistakes…no THEY LIE!!!! OMG!! Just like Greenwald claims Bush knew there were no WMD, or Rumsfeld knew the intelligence was wrong. In allies, the hack sees failure; in enemies the hack sees lies. Welcome to hackery, Darleen.
And for the mindless Bob Reed, the readers of a Digg site vote up or down on questions, not the campaign staff or transition staff. The offical, paid Obama-ites have no control over what the unoffical, worshiping Obama-ites vote for OR are you new to “digging”? The results didn’t “disappear,” they were found quite easily by reporters looking to find them and ask why Obama supporters are more concerned with wars and recessions and not a crooked governor. please do try to read a story and not a headline.
There’s no more official “censorship” of those questions than Mr. Collins or Mrs. Click is guilty of when one of the half-wit commenters uses “trollhammer” to remove offending thoughts.
By the way, where is Spies? I’m still buzzing with his grand election prediction. With his powers of prescience, I bet his 401K full of Fannie Mae and Lehamn Brothers is doing fabulously well.
Lastly, Mr. Pink, if you cannot understand the commentary, then could you hide the ignorance? Or, has copulating with frozen seafood effected your brain?
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 11:00 am #
Sadly, they’re not. I bet they even believe what they’re saying, and don’t see the slightest contradiction between saying that and their behavior over the last 8 years.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 11:01 am #
I disagree. They care quite a bit.
It takes effort to ignore and bury stories like those two.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:03 am #
really, you guys should feel better about how Obama is always being misunderstood.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 11:05 am #
Just like Greenwald claims Bush knew there were no WMD, or Rumsfeld knew the intelligence was wrong. In allies, the hack sees failure; in enemies the hack sees lies. Welcome to hackery, Darleen.
Careful, fellows, this one is getting dangerously close to self-awareness.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 11:07 am #
Speaking of bad math:
National Result 52.9 45.7
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:09 am #
you’re missing some percentages, there thor. I’m guessing they didn’t vote for O!
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 11:11 am #
Now, now, Rob.
Let’s not forget the 90% approval rating Bush had (and squandered) after 9/11.
I guess you guys are the equivalent of the 10% who didn’t support Bush after 9/11?
The non-patriots?
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 11:14 am #
“see….he HAS to be lying and so does Axlerod and Emmanuel and a TV station’s correction policies.”
Well considering Axlerod is his chief of staff, whose job it is to know who and what O! is doing every day, yeah I think it is a safe bet to say that his original statements that went “unmisspoken” for about a month is the correct one. Here use a brain cell for a second. What changed in that month when everything was alright with the statement “O! talked to the Governor many times about his replacement”?
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 11:15 am #
Yes I see Karl Rove on TV every day just inventing conversations and meetings President Bush has. It happens every day I swear. Hey can someone pass a coke straw please mine just broke?
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 11:16 am #
“Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 10:35 am #
By “far right†I mean the Republicans who are already dedicating themselves to obstructing and hobbling Obama every chance they get instead of being patriotic and giving him a chance.”
George W. Bush
So go fuck yourself, chidiot.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 11:17 am #
“Something was in Obam’s hand, loook!”
Just a guess here, but I bet you dream about it being your cock, right thor?
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 11:20 am #
Ah, the politics of revenge.
Hope! CHANGE!
FREEEEEDOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMM!
Comment by happyfeet on 12/11 @ 11:22 am #
Poor Baracky is hobbled cause he has no experiences and he brings nothing but socialist community-organizey theory to a job that requires real-world knowledge and specific skills. Our new hires have a whole year usually before they are expected to fly solo and that’s just sort of marketing kind of stuff so there’s no telling how long it’ll be before Baracky gets his legs under him.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:23 am #
see? they were just having a staring contest
damn Obama’s photogenicness! WHY DID HE HAVE TO BE SO BEAUTIFUL?
Comment by Pablo on 12/11 @ 11:24 am #
Axelrod must have dreamed this:
So why did it take 3 weeks to correct?
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 11:26 am #
thorhoid’s good at math, just ask him. He’s got two, count them, two calculators, and he knows how to use all the function buttons!
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 11:26 am #
About the Lockheed plant, if it is true, then you’re are proud that your side is a bunch of vindictive losers?
BTW, if that’s the case, then “my” new state, Michigan, can go piss up a rope. I feel so hopey and changey already.
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 11:27 am #
Revenge, maybe,
But the F-22 was always a worthless pig of a plane, slart.
A Cold War dinosaur.
Comment by happyfeet on 12/11 @ 11:30 am #
F-22s are very effective at doing war stuff I think but with Baracky in charge I can see how we won’t be needing planes and guns and things. Not real big on national security issues, our Baracky, so unless foreign policy expert Mr. Joe Biden who is a very important and trusted advisor says hold up on canceling stuff I imagine it is what it is.
Comment by nawoods on 12/11 @ 11:31 am #
OT….Atlanta resident here. Where is this F-22 talk coming from? I haven’t seen anything about it, and I would assume that if this were true, there would be a shitstorm in the local media.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 11:31 am #
Yep, can’t wait to see prepared diplomacy in action.
Comment by DarthRove on 12/11 @ 11:33 am #
An F-22 would make a hella kewl playground item. Make sure the sharp edges have foam coating, put that chipped rubber stuff on the ground under it, and the deprived inner-city yoots could have a blast sliding off the wings and clambering around and stuff.
Oh yeah, make sure those nasty missiles are gone, too. Wouldn’t want THOSE to fall into the wrong hands.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 11:35 am #
I’m a former Atlanta resident, and having attended an Engineering school, I know several people who work for Lockheed-Martin. Also, a cursory Google search turns up nothing.
Then again, I’m not on the TownHouse (hall?) mailing list, so who knows what they may be planning at for the future.
I’m sure the factories can be converted into churning out strongly worded statements. Maybe all of Lockheed’s employees will dig Obama! ditches and hang dry-wall, in his new CCC.
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 11:36 am #
nawoods,
The knives are out for the F-22.
Here is just one story:
“The airplane is proving very expensive to operate and it’s complex to maintain,†said John Young, who heads the Pentagon’s acquisition arm. The cost of the plane’s maintenance “is too high,†he told reporters in the defense writers group on Thursday.
http://thehill.com/business–lobby/obama-pentagon-could-face-billions-in-bills-for-f-22-2008-11-20.html
There are many others.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 11:37 am #
You’re not worthy of licking Obama’s unwashed hand.
DO YOU SPEAK ENGLISH?
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 11:39 am #
Oh I guess a 2 hour conference call counts as “no contact” thesedays. HAhahahahahahahhahaha
http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/12/10/blagojevichs-big-conference-call-and-valerie-jarretts-clean-break/?mod=blog
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 11:40 am #
Think “green jobs”, like raindancing!
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 11:40 am #
%
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 11:42 am #
i>Air Chief Marshal Angus Houston, Chief of the Australian Defence Force, said in 2004 that the “F-22 will be the most outstanding fighter plane ever built.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/F-22_Raptor
Tuberhead is just jealous his prototype Assualt Stealth Shipping-container has been ignored thus far.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 11:42 am #
thorhoid, still slurpin’ up the Hussein man gravy, eh?
Comment by ginsocal on 12/11 @ 11:42 am #
Who/what is this “Ron Burgundy” douchebag?
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 11:43 am #
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 11:37 am #
BECAUSE OF THE PLAGIARISM!!!!!
The original quote, for those who missed it when I directed it at the the chidiot thor was
“You’re not good enough to lick the sand from my sons combat boots.”
So thor and originality don’t go hand in hand.
Oh, and he’s insane, also.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:43 am #
so, um, where’s the other 7%?
Comment by nawoods on 12/11 @ 11:44 am #
Parsnip,
Meh….That article seems like politics as usual with new weapons systems, at least for now. I’ll file it as “interesting, and worth watching”, but will wait to see the headlines that say “Lockheed Closing Cobb County Plant” before going much farther than that.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 11:44 am #
Or, like, pounding the snot out of redumblicans!
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:46 am #
cause, it still shows only about 52% for O!
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 11:47 am #
So tuberhead, how about you try to figure out the difference between “worthless pig of a plane” “and “may be too expensive to maintain.” I’ll bet you can if you really, really try.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 11:47 am #
“cause, it still shows only about 52% for O!”
OMG, A VERITABLE LANDSLIDE I TELL YA!
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 11:48 am #
“I’ll bet you can if you really, really try.”
I’ll take the under.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 11:48 am #
?
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 11:49 am #
Seriously explain this Thor??
http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/12/10/blagojevichs-big-conference-call-and-valerie-jarretts-clean-break/?mod=blog
2 hour conference call between this Governor and O!’s staff. Lying piece of garbage.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 11:49 am #
Electoral College 365 173
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:50 am #
thor, you were the one trying to argue that 100 minus 52 does not equal 48.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:50 am #
course I’ve only had 12 hours of accounting, so maybe I’m missing something.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 11:51 am #
thorhoid, the only thing you’re brave enough to pound the snot out of is your pud, if you actually possess one.
And FTR, I’m an independent, so you can stick the party affiliation BS.
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 11:52 am #
Maggie, John McCain only got 45.7% of the vote.
Accept it.
He did.
B Moe, there is no difference.
The money we wasted on the F-22 could have gone to, you know, systems we’re actually using in our current three wars.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 11:53 am #
Mr. Pink, I’m afraid if your skull fractured green M&Ms would spill out.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:54 am #
I know that, parsnip, but that wasn’t what was stated. go back and read for once.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:56 am #
if 52% vote for somebody, then that leaves 48% percent that didn’t vote for them.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 11:56 am #
Mossberg, don’t you know thor is an “independent” who reflexively takes any position counter to ones offered by anyone with an -R behind their names?
He’s the epitome of Churchill’s sentiment, in that if a Republican invaded Hell, thor would put in a favorable reference for Satan in the House of Commons.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 11:57 am #
they may have voted for lizard people, but not Obama.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 12:00 pm #
And yet, once again, we let a thread get totally de-railed by the trolls. When will we (I) learn?
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 12:02 pm #
maybe once we learn this new math where 52 plus 45 equal 100 and leases are free!
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 12:04 pm #
I’ve yet to read an independent thought from thorhoid regarding Hussein. Yet, he accuses Republicans of marching lock-step with every position that President Bush, John McCain, et al has taken, which, from my reading of this blog, has not been the case.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:06 pm #
Electoral College
1980
Regan 489
Carter 49
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 12:06 pm #
Waaah!!!!
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:07 pm #
Electoral College
1984
Regan 525
Mondale 13
Comment by Log Cabin on 12/11 @ 12:07 pm #
Drip, drip, drip.
Eerily like Watergate. Today’s lies and mistatements get explained and then a new one pops up. Look for unhinged lefties to begin singing that Blago is completely insane. That way, when he drops the dime on the empty suit elect, it can all be explained away.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 12:08 pm #
They started that yesterday.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:09 pm #
Electoral College
1988
Bush 426
Dukakis 111
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 12:09 pm #
oh hey! you found 1%! just a few more to go thor!
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 12:10 pm #
oops, 2% maths are hard.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:10 pm #
” Look for unhinged lefties to begin singing that Blago is completely insane.
They started that yesterday.”
How long have we known that thor is insane?
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 12:11 pm #
but so you’re not going to admit your error. fine.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 12:12 pm #
You would think thorhoid’s BA-II would have decimal capabilities! Guess not!!!
Comment by Log Cabin on 12/11 @ 12:13 pm #
Does anyone here see the fine hand of the Clintons in this mess? Or are they merely sitting back and laughing their asses off?
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 12:13 pm #
since you’re still struggling… here’s a hint….
“did not vote for Obama” does not equal “voted for McCain”
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 12:14 pm #
Unsurprisingly, parsnip doesn’t know shit about airplanes, either.
That’s been true for 23 years, parsnip. Check off another whole category of things that parsnip doesn’t understand at all.
Comment by Sdferr on 12/11 @ 12:16 pm #
Wouldn’t a vast font of public respect, a people’s admiration for probity, for transparency, a high, nay, even a pedestrian reputation for truth telling, for matter of fact honesty, come in handy in a case like this?
Too bad PeBHO didn’t think on developing these attributes over the course of two years of campaigning for the office rather than their polar opposites that he has done. Telling blithe falsehoods repeatedly for years, it turns out, does have a rather negative consequence to governance. Funny, that.
Comment by happyfeet on 12/11 @ 12:17 pm #
If that’s all Baracky could get by outspending a poor useless old depleted and slightly noxious John McCain by like five to one I’d say Baracky doesn’t have a lot to feel too cocky about. It was a more bigger victory than just disqualifying his opponent on a technicality Chicago street trash style but it’s clear his propagandist dirty socialist media like MSNBC and NPR and Newsweek and CBS and Time is what carried him over the line cause there’s a lot that people simply didn’t know about how trashy and skeezey Baracky and his woman are and now they’re finding out.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 12:21 pm #
You got your fannies tanned.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:22 pm #
Oh, and alpo>
The M1 tank was a pig, too.
Until, you know, it went to war.
So why don’t you just STFU about things you don’t know anything about?
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:24 pm #
Electoral College
1984
Regan 525
Mondale a big fat 13
You were saying, crazy person?
Comment by MAJ (P) John on 12/11 @ 12:24 pm #
C’mon y’all – yield to parsnips superior military knowledge. When he transitioned from the F-16 to the F-22, he often told us how the F-22 handled like a pig….remember?
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:25 pm #
Maj, that was a real pig he was “handling”.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:26 pm #
Oh, and Maj, if you weren’t around when I made the announcement, Matt the Marine is deployed to A-stan.
Comment by MAJ (P) John on 12/11 @ 12:27 pm #
Where, in country, if I may ask?
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 12:30 pm #
You got your fannies tanned.
So?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_1972
Comment by Salt Lick on 12/11 @ 12:30 pm #
…he should have said, “Yes, I met with the governor. He made proposals that I felt were unseemly…
There was one candidate in the last election who didn’t go along with corruption in government. In fact, she quit a $120,000 year cushy state job and turned in her boss, the state GOP chair, when she saw he was crooked. Then she went after her state’s corrupt governor.
Compare that with someone who’s flourished in the cesspool of Chicago politics — and never once challenged that system.
Comment by DarthRove on 12/11 @ 12:31 pm #
You got your fannies tanned.
Racist.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 12:34 pm #
I flew a fighter jet in Russia. It’s not really that much fun when the G’s make you slobber out or your nose.
Great fighter pilots those Russians.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 12:35 pm #
Ach. 22 years. Dang, I hate it when I’m off by a good four percent.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:36 pm #
“Comment by MAJ (P) John on 12/11 @ 12:27 pm #
Where, in country, if I may ask?”
Don’t know. He can’t say over the phone.
OPSEC.
Comment by Thor's Pooter on 12/11 @ 12:36 pm #
I did not have sex with that Louisville Slugger.
Alright, but I didn’t enjoy it, much.
Comment by MAJ (P) John on 12/11 @ 12:37 pm #
NO – OK, that gives me a pretty good idea…
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:43 pm #
“Comment by MAJ (P) John on 12/11 @ 12:37 pm #
NO – OK, that gives me a pretty good idea…”
Please, share, I figure he made a stop at Camp Bastion, because he said they had a British exchange there (he bought Jelly Babies), but now his address is down to the platoon level.
An FOB somewhere?
Comment by Speak English or Die on 12/11 @ 12:46 pm #
If that’s all Baracky could get by outspending a poor useless old depleted and slightly noxious John McCain by like five to one I’d say Baracky doesn’t have a lot to feel too cocky about.
Shorter happyfeet:
Like many in my branded herd, I hated McCain for years for being a traitor to the Movement. Despite this, I supported him during the campaign. Now I hate him again because he was a RINO loser all along.
Obviously the answer is to promote more “true conservative” candidates in states trending progressive.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 12:47 pm #
“Obviously the answer is to promote more “true conservative†candidates in states trending reactionary.”
TFTFY
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 12:49 pm #
Obviously the answer is to vote for a candidate who runs on the word “hope” while attending a racist church for 20 years.
Comment by happyfeet on 12/11 @ 12:50 pm #
Huh? I’m not a conservative movement person. I just think putting dirty socialist Chicago street trash in the White House is something stupid people do. But me I have no use for like Governor Palin anymore though I thank her for taking on an a lot thankless job and I wish her well. Bobby Jindal I like.
Comment by Roland THTG on 12/11 @ 12:51 pm #
Rule #1: Thou shalt not discuss troop deployments.
There is no rule number 2.
Thanks
Comment by Sdferr on 12/11 @ 12:59 pm #
Well yes, don’t discuss our troop deployments.
But how about theirs?
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 1:00 pm #
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aero_L-29_Delfin
The L-29 is a trainer jet so it’s a two-seater. It had amazingly simple controls and easy to read dashboard, but of course it’s a 60’s era jet that was mainly used to strafe the fuck out of tanks and enemy troops on the ground. I asked if it could break the sound barrier, they said no, as if that was a stupid question. My stick did have gun triggers, which of course I tapped at like a kid while we were flying, except when we flew by the nuclear reactor.
The pilot looked like something out of a movie, blond, movie star face, military build, jumpsuit. We spoke Russian through our radio helmets, me in the back cockpit, he in the front. As we went over the controls before takeoff, including his nyet-nyet-nyet-s while pointing at the bright red ejection seat trigger handle, he gave me some basic hand gesture instructions. Later, in-flight, I realized why. When all the blood drains from your brain, and your seated in the hand-on-thigh position, as previously instructed, and your slobbering uncontrollably, you are completely unable to speak these words – “please God stop before I throw up.”
No man off the street, I came to understand, will fare well against G-force versus the trained fighter pilot. How military pilots handle the G’s I have no idea, but they do, while smiling.
I could hardly climb down from the ladder when we were done. My legs were shot. The Russkiye pilot actually dropped out of his cockpit to the ground, bounced a couple of knee-bends with his arms extended, and then laughed as he helped me off the ladder.
Comment by Percy Dovetonsils on 12/11 @ 1:05 pm #
You know, all this talk about Blago and the O!Messiah, but have we ever discussed the wife, Patti “F*** the Cubs” Blagojevich?
Here I always thought Hillary Clinton was the modern-day Lady MacBeth, but this lil’ minx Patti may have outdone her. Grrrrrrrr.
Comment by Speak English or Die on 12/11 @ 1:06 pm #
But me I have no use for like Governor Palin anymore though I thank her for taking on an a lot thankless job and I wish her well. Bobby Jindal I like.
Interesting. I actually like Bobby Jindal.
It’s a shame that his somewhat bizarre religious beliefs will probably keep him in local politics for the foreseeable future.
Comment by happyfeet on 12/11 @ 1:08 pm #
Baracky voters are like those stupid NBC executive people what greenlit Bionic Woman and then they were a lot dazzled by the pilot cause it was pretty and so they spent kajillions of dollars on an order and they forgot to ask if the damn show had a story that was going anywhere. What Baracky and his woman will not do is demonstrate character development cause of their inherent limited range, being dirty socialist Chicago street trash and all, and there are a lot of questions Baracky voters should have asked but they didn’t and now boy is this a pickle we’re in.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:11 pm #
Yes being a Christian is now a negative in politics unless you are a Democrat. Thanks for the tip jackass.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 1:13 pm #
Maybe she’s a White Sox fan? I thought that’s what Obama was?
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 1:14 pm #
Obama’s a Christian? I thought he went to a church that had sermons with phrases like “garlic noses” and “ridin’ dirty”. Doesn’t seem very Christ-like to me.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 1:15 pm #
And so you’re probably asking yourself, if you can’t move your hands how do you make hand gestures? Well, over the radio the pilot tells you he’s going to do the this or that maneuver, which is like what he’d do if there was an Amerikansky chasing his ass over Nam, or something like that. He proceeds to do various turns and dives and only for a brief second between turns can you raise your hand with the signal. Feeling drunk wouldn’t be the right description, feeling like you’re groggily waking up would be more like it, add nauseousness.
There’s a mirror in his front cockpit that allows you to see his smiling face and he your drool covered face.
The pull outs adter steep dives were the worst. Those will make your eyes roll back in your head. Moving a finger is not an option. You just can’t.
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 1:15 pm #
“The offical, paid Obama-ites have no control over what the unoffical, worshiping Obama-ites vote for OR are you new to ‘digging’?”
Sure Ron,
Just like they had no control over the same worshipping Obama-ites that attempted to electronically shout down anyone who dare speak any inconvenient truth about Obama’s past history or prior issue pronouncements during the general election; such as when Freddoso or Kurtz appeared on WGN…
Sure Ron, those “action alerts” were simply heads up notices…
I used to recieve them in my e-mail, along with donation solicitations, after sending in a couple of questions to his campaign during the primaries…
But you caught me alright, on the digg thing. I haven’t availed myself nor even investigated it’s use; rightly, I assumed it was similar to other ranking systems like yahoo buzz…
So verily you have exposed me…I don’t digg it…
But I assure you that I read many stories from a variety of sources, and don’t simply parrot headline inferences…
I leave that to my friends on the left…
Comment by Speak English or Die on 12/11 @ 1:17 pm #
He claimed to participate in an exorcism Mr. Pink.
That’s not quite the mainstream, is it?
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:18 pm #
You forgot how they also “preached” that the US government is run by evil rich white people who invent AIDS to kill blacks. I wonder if any of them voted for McCain? Probably not hence why O! and other people on the left have no problem with Wright.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 1:19 pm #
ha ha, but “God damn America!” “US of KKK”, “White man’s greed runs a world in need” is?
well, that explains a lot.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:19 pm #
Link please Speaky.
PS. Even if that is true which it may be, I would take an exorcism over sittin there while the preacher told my kids white people invented AIDS to kill them.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 1:20 pm #
I don’t ever want America to be at war with Russia. In a conventional air war they might…, well we’d lose some aircraft, I’ll leave it at that.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:20 pm #
Seems to me that the people jumping around and clapping when they hear “God Damn Amerikkka!!!!” serve a purpose. That purpose is electing more Democrats. Funny how that works huh??
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 1:23 pm #
So now they’re attacking Jindal? I thought the subject was Obama.
But here’s a clue for the idiots: there’s a difference between an exorcism and preaching hatred, paranoia, and racism.
Comment by DarthRove on 12/11 @ 1:25 pm #
I think the problem with the questions on Obama’s (quick genuflection) web page thinger wasn’t that Obamabots were voting the questions down, it was that some were flagging the questions as “inappropriate”, which just flat-out removes them. Kinda like what happened to LGF on Digg. The posts were way popular and Digged up a lot, but lefty Diggtards who didn’t like LGF used the “inappropriate” flag to get them taken down.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:26 pm #
The difference to them Rob is that the racism that is taught is against the “correct” people, ie. rich white evil Republicans.
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 1:27 pm #
“Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 11:27 am #
Revenge, maybe,
But the F-22 was always a worthless pig of a plane, slart.”
No offense meant parsnip, but you don’t know too much about military aircraft, do you..?
Not only is the F-22 technologically superior in terms of weapons systems and combat capabilities, but it also revolutionary in terms of aerodynamics, propulsion systems, materials, and observability…
Plus, it’s fuel usage is much better than existing systems, so it’s got the greenie-environmental thing going for it…
About the only folks unhappy with it are the accountants at the air force; it’s too expensive to buy the normal rack of units that they’re used to purchasing.
So you can applaud the political vindictiveness if you’s like, but don’t diminish the aircraft…
Don’t hate the playah…
Oh, and on cutting the agricultural subsidies; don’t hold your breath. The ethanol panacea lobby paid big bucks to help elect O!, so they got that goin’ for them…
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 1:27 pm #
I have no problem with crazed redumblicans who are troothers or who say white people invented AIDS to kill blacks. Those particular redumblican’s concerns simply have to be refuted with facts. Most will continue to live in underground bunkers and converse over short wave radios, but it’s a free country. Very few will actually go totally McViegh.
Comment by DarthRove on 12/11 @ 1:29 pm #
He claimed to participate in an exorcism Mr. Pink.
That’s not quite the mainstream, is it?
Why do you hate Bobby Jindal’s brown-skinned culture? His ways are different, perhaps even better and purer than ours. Certainly closer to nature and more in tune with The Earth. Why, he has brown skin! If you insist on being hateful and racist, the community might organize itself to keep out your narrowminded, mean-spirited, brown-hating ways.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 1:30 pm #
I wonder if Hillary Clinton will retain mediums to perform seances to determine US diplomatic policy?
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 1:30 pm #
“I have no problem with crazed redumblicans who are troothers or who say white people invented AIDS to kill blacks. Those particular redumblican’s concerns simply have to be refuted with facts. Most will continue to live in underground bunkers and converse over short wave radios, but it’s a free country. Very few will actually go totally McViegh.”
See? Nuttier than a fruitcake.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 1:31 pm #
Maybe time to recalibrate the dosage, thor.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 1:34 pm #
I’m liberal enough to openly accept the likes of you as a free member of our society, P’Brain. You can’t help the water on your brain or your Turrets.
Comment by Old Texas Turkey on 12/11 @ 1:35 pm #
Maggie – Thorasole/Gollum never admits his errors or ignorance. he just starts screeching something new. Ric pretty much slapped the taste out of Gollum’s mouth yesterday on the futility of government intervention. All Thor did was run back to his safety net of Larry Craig and Mark Foley.
Gollum does like his homo-eroticity like a pacifier.
Bob Bennet is another talking telephone pole. O!bots – own your scandal. Now you get to take the medicine of “the un-patriotic”. Swallow bitch.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 1:36 pm #
Throw in some strychnine.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 1:37 pm #
And you BMoe, you didn’t know all those hours applying contact cement in an unventilated room would have such a lasting effect. You still should be allowed to vote, IMHO.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 1:37 pm #
Iew.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:37 pm #
Hey thor no “redumlickan” said that. It was O!’s preacher of 20 years on youtube. you can google it if you want but I honestly think you are just acting like you do not know who said it. Keep on smoking that bong.
Comment by Old Texas Turkey on 12/11 @ 1:40 pm #
Ron Burgundy – apologies to Bob
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 1:40 pm #
That would explain the flying fantasies. thorhoid, you forgot to mention the shots of STOLICHNAYA you were doing on the climb…you know, for the authenticity!
Comment by Ric Locke on 12/11 @ 1:40 pm #
thor, there’s a specific exercise used to develop the muscles necessary to withstand G-forces. Pilots of high-performance aircraft learn it and practice it a lot, and it becomes something of a reflex when the situation warrants. The muscles in question force blood from the torso to the head and arms, and relieve much of the weakness that prevents you from exerting yourself (the G-suit does that for the legs).
What is the exercise, you ask?
Imagine yourself to be severely constipated, blocked for days, and you feel something move, so you go sit on the commode and squeeeeeeeeeeeeze. Red-faced and huffing, your sinuses feeling the strain of the increased blood pressure, you feel something move again, so once again you squeeeeeze. Twenty reps a day, ten in the morning, ten before bed at night, and learn the procedure and use it when G-forces slam you down. If you’re reasonably athletic, you can learn to move around at up to 4 Gs — the ability to do more is part of the screen for a high-performance airplane pilot.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 1:42 pm #
Oh, God.
So we’re supposed to defer to lunatic racist conspiracies if there’s the least basis to them?
Comment by Obstreperous Infidel on 12/11 @ 1:42 pm #
Wow, LOL…Thor is fucking wasted right now. I’m jealous.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:44 pm #
Also see fire not melting steel.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:45 pm #
Also see 10000 Jewish residents in NY calling in sick on 9-11. There is a basis I tell you!!!111!!!!
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 1:45 pm #
I know that Ric, but until you actually see how unaffected they seem from g-forces you won’t have a full appreciation of their talent, all I’m saying. I’m telling ya at any time the guy could have knocked me out while performing a maneuver he could do in his sleep, forgive the pun.
It’s weird.
Comment by Old Texas Turkey on 12/11 @ 1:46 pm #
Ric – i’ll be willing to bet a couple of kopeks that Thor – never once set foot in a Russkie jet much less one that took off from the ground.
The statement of Russia’s mad skillz at decimating the USN/USAF/USMC in a conventional dog fight based on being a snot covered wingman in his fantasy was the dead give away.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:46 pm #
Oh yes Rev. Wright also was a marine so those “God damn Amerikkka” sermons don’t mean anything. I have heard all these talking points before douchebag.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 1:50 pm #
Wow, I always thought Tuskegee was a botched double-blind treatment test. I had no idea it INVENTED syphilis, and then sent it into a wormhole through time. Now, that’s impressive.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 1:52 pm #
Ric, you may wish to keep your eyes open, but at one point you lose your ability to do that. Blood leaves your eyes, or something, but essentially you’re blind. The pilots can still perform precise maneuvers in that condition. They practice, as in years they practice until they don’t need a pulse to keep doing set patterns.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:52 pm #
Seriously these were all the talkin points that went out in the week where O! said “I can no more disown him than I can my racist white granny”. This was what was all said in that one special week where people were actually defending Wright. That got dropped after O! “disowned” him supposedly. Why rehash them now they only make you look like a f@ckin idiot.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 1:52 pm #
399 poor  and mostly illiterate  African American sharecroppers were studied to observe the natural progression of the disease if left untreated.
I mean, come on, while they were there they could have at least taught them to read.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 1:53 pm #
Walter Mitty Syndrome
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 1:54 pm #
and no one said otherwise, but it doesn’t follow that this is somehow a basis for the US making the AIDS virus to kill black people. also not sure where the homosexuals fit into that theory.
anyhoo, that kind of thinking opens the door on a whole lot of conspiracy. Like Obama being muslim.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:55 pm #
Which talking point is next in this line up? Oh yeah now I remember the one about how Rev. Wright has donated so much time to childrens charities and how he does so much in his community. That will be followed up by “oh he used to be a marine” and then by “well O! is the one running for President not Rev. Wright this is a distraction”. I have seen these plays before you guys are about as predictable as the Redskins offense.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 1:55 pm #
Pissed != believing every insane theory that comes your way.
Comment by geoffb on 12/11 @ 1:57 pm #
A song to sing to, Blago Remembers.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 1:59 pm #
Pissed=Spreading racism onto the next generation so they do not move out of poverty while blaming it on evil rich white people supposedly represented by the Republican party all of which greatly helps the Democrat party hold 97% of the AA vote every election.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 2:00 pm #
ohnoes, I feel the “bandaids don’t match the color of my skin” oppression meme about to be used! Which number was that again?
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 2:00 pm #
Missing the point of organized, systemic oppression.
It was THE MAN caused the syphilis epidemic, trying to keep the brothers down.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 2:00 pm #
So, that validates any crazy conspiracy theories in the present, mari?
Cause that’s a fun road to go down.
The executive branch did everything in it’s power to prevent FDR from being seen as a cripple. Ergo, considering that, it’s not crazy to think that Obama is a closet Muslim and a Weatherman sympathizer.
I’m just airing questions, as an excitable writer once put it.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 2:01 pm #
You’d only bet a few kopecks because that’s all most broke-ass redumblicans have left after eight long years of Bush-o-nomics.
Are you jealous? Does your anger build until you find yourself clenching your fists for no reason? Are you missing clumps of hair from various areas of your scalp. Have your molars and incisors become void of indentions from the all night grinding and gnashing? Have you found yourself staring at your twinkling Christmas tree wishing you could beat the shit out of it with a pitching wedge? Uncontrolled mumbling? Yes, ODS issues do have their unwanted effects.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 2:02 pm #
OPPRESSORS!!!
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:03 pm #
Mari use a braincell for a second. Could the reason O! used his public office in Illinois to give “grant” money to that church be that what Rev. Wright was “preaching” in it would pretty much preclude anyone attending who took it seriously from ever voting Republican? You know it probably would make it pretty easy to win elections when you are assured 97% of the votes of one segment of the population, a very large segment of the population in Chicago. Throw all that “Tuskegee” bullsh!t out the window and actually think for a second about who was gaining off what he was teaching and preaching every Sunday.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 2:03 pm #
Trig is actually Gov. Palin’s grandson in 5, 4, 3…
Comment by geoffb on 12/11 @ 2:03 pm #
By Democrats. That always gets left out somehow.
Comment by Sdferr on 12/11 @ 2:06 pm #
There are older Russian military jet planes sprinkled here and there in the United States in which, if you’re willing to pay the asking price, you can go for a ride. I haven’t done it myself but I have seen the planes in a number of places over the years, read accounts of such excursions and businesses. There’s no particular reason to disbelieve thor’s account of such an experience in Russia that I can see. In fact, it seems to have made quite an impression upon him and well it should have done, I think.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:06 pm #
Nah geoff that gets left out on purpose in favor of the “Republicans are the party of rich old white people” meme. It is so much easier to blame the correct groups for all the worlds problems you see.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 2:09 pm #
Missing the point of “it happened, that doesn’t mean you should be a moron now”.
My grandparents had their life savings largely wiped out during race riots in the 60s — they owned multiple apartment buildings, and many of them were burnt down. Would that excuse me believing blacks are going to burn down my house?
Comment by Old Texas Turkey on 12/11 @ 2:10 pm #
Hey if thor gets to make shit up, why can’t i make shit up about thor making shit up?
Comment by Ron Burgundy on 12/11 @ 2:11 pm #
Yeah, there are differences: one is passive listening and the other is active kookery, which leads to the second
one enables one to win a national election, the second allows one to be the Governor of Louisiana. With an exorcism on the resume, Jindal is unlikely to attract voters anywhere but churches and PW.
By the way, speaking of dosages, Rob might want to increase yours. Who is the “they” you fear so much, Rob. In this case, “they” is a bi-partisan group which includes everyone who read a newspaper in August. You could join us, Rob, and read a newspaper.
Lastly, Mr. Pink, did you read your own link above to the conference call. It says plenty of things about advisers and such from DC, which you want SO MUCH to be Obama people (and perhaps they were), but, since the Obama transition team and all its bigwigs are headquartered in Chicago, it seems weird they would fly to D.C. for this call.
All Obama said is “I had no contact with Governor [about the senate seat]. According to him, and we know he’s lying ’cause he’s “chicago street trash,” he will have the definitive summation on his people’s discussions within the next couple of days.
P.S. “happy”feet, could you define what is “Chicago street trash.” I’ve been there and most of the street people didn’t sound like they were educated at Columbia, Princeton, or Harvard Law. But, I’m sure you can explain what you mean by street people (living in Hyde Park, no less, with Justice Posner!).
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 2:11 pm #
Carbon 14 testing should be performed on the paper Obama’s birth certificate is printed on, in 4, 3, 2
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 2:14 pm #
…one enables one to win a national election…
Which is why Obama so openly embraced Rev. Wright and was so proud to admit to sitting through all those sermons.
Comment by SDN on 12/11 @ 2:14 pm #
What Ronnie Burgunboy will never admit is that there’s a pattern to O’s tech usage:
Neither he nor his staff is censoring the comments…. but they’ve set the site up to allow others to do so.
Neither he nor his staff asked for any illegal foreign contributions, or for contributions from obviously false donors….. they just disabled the standard controls and credit card checks to allow it to happen.
They didn’t have any ties to wacky characters with extreme ideas…. but the campaign website allowed anyone to set up a “blog” and put out the propaganda.
In each case, Obama and his staff were careful to leave no directly illegal / unethical fingerprints of their own….. but they sure made it easy for “supporters unknown” to do so through their IT systems.
Deniability — it’s not a bug, it’s a feature.
Oh, and ickle Ronniekins, don’t bother replying; I TrollHammered you early….
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:15 pm #
“Yeah, there are differences: one is passive listening and the other is active kookery, which leads to the second”
The active kookery is jumping around cheering dancing like a freakin idiot when you hear racist propaganda. You really believe O! was sitting there staring at the ceiling with a blank look on his face while the entire congregation applauded and stood? You are a f@cking tool if you believe that. Watch the videos the crowd gets up and freakin CHEERS when they hear “white people invented the AIDS virus to kill black south Africans” and “God damn Amerikkka”.
Obama’s kids CHEERED that crap, so did he and his wife. Or were they just not there every day there was a racist rant? What will you not believe if it helps you support this idiot?
Comment by Ron Burgundy on 12/11 @ 2:17 pm #
Sorry, Sdn, but I don’t talk to people who threaten to kill me.
Funny, how you find technology frightening. Digg wasn’t invented by obama’s folks.
Now go back outside and practice shooting at your targets of coloreds and hippies, you revanchist, reactionary, flaky jackass
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:18 pm #
“No more than the latest Rush broadcast validates any current right-wing conspiracy theories, of which there are many.
Michelle’s “Whitey†tape, Obama having to prove his nationality and so on.”
Hey Mari if you can give me a link where Rush says either of those are true I will rub your feet for an hour while gazing lovingly at the Obama victory plate.
Comment by Techie on 12/11 @ 2:18 pm #
But, you just talked to him…………
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 2:18 pm #
Ron Buggery’s back! Oh good, I enjoy reading industrial grade bs. Please go ahead!
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 2:20 pm #
Your ignorance and reliance on lefty talking points is showing. Limbaugh hates conspiracy theories. He makes fun of them quite often.
Those both originated with Hillary’s partisans, Mari. There are certainly Republicans who are still pursuing both of those idiocies, but they don’t get much respect.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:22 pm #
So this Mari chick defends one conspiracy theory, that helps defend O!, but then knocks others, which totally by coincidence she seems to think harm and originate with Republicans. Funny how that sh!t works huh?
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 2:22 pm #
<blockquote Digg wasn’t invented by obama’s folks.
and yet, they find it really useful. for OPENESS!!!
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 2:22 pm #
Oh, and Mari, the issue isn’t simply conspiracy theories and who buys into them — it’s why Obama was comfortable hanging around people who push conspiracy theories. And the intellectual dishonesty of the Obamatons who deny, deny, deny rather than admit that just maybe their Messiah isn’t perfect.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 2:22 pm #
Those both originated with Hillary’s partisans, Mari.
They also fall a little short of accusing the US Government of attempting biological genocide.
Comment by Dread Cthulhu on 12/11 @ 2:24 pm #
thoricka: “I don’t ever want America to be at war with Russia. In a conventional air war they might…, well we’d lose some aircraft, I’ll leave it at that.”
Even the Russians admit the technology deficit — why can’t you?
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 2:25 pm #
Because thor’s emotionally a six-year-old.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:25 pm #
Mari would you want your kids to hear that white people invented AIDS to kill them for their entire childhood every Sunday? Or do you prefer white folks greed runs a world in need? Those seem like great messages to pass on to your kids huh?
Comment by Ron Burgundy on 12/11 @ 2:26 pm #
Oh, pinkie, try to stay away from your disdain of Trinity church and focus on the participation in an EXORCISM by Reveren….errr, Governor Jindal.
The American people heard about the scary black man in the dashiki, Mr. pink, and they still voted for Obama. The McCain campaign heard about the exorcism and they “voted” for Pipeline-blessing Palin. Try to separate your fear and hatred of Obama’s ability to dodge bs issues, while noting Jindal cannot.
If Jindal is smart, in 2014-2015, he will “throw the exorcism under the bus” and happyfeet can be happy. Maybe after 8 years of hate and fear of Obama, Mr. pink, you can even stop being afraid of all the scary pastors.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:27 pm #
Why am I attempting to actually persuade you or even get you to answer a question? It is obvious you will believe, deny, or ignore anything as long as it helps you blindly support a political candidate. F@ck it why try?
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 2:28 pm #
Outside Moscow aero clubs keep their planes at small airports. The club that let me fly had 2 L-29s and various other collector aircraft. The clubs mostly make side money by allowing their planes to be used for basic flight instruction classes, so yeah, they tend to own a Cessna or two as well. Yes, they charged me money to cover the cost of fuel and for the pilot.
Get this, $250, hehe, that’s right, jealous bitches. All I paid was $250 because my Russkiye friend was a member of one of the aero clubs at that particular airport. He’d take his lessons in a Cessna and I’d have ‘em fire up a L-29. And yes, I charged mostly Aussies and Americans and Canadians up to $1000 for a L-29 ride, pocketing a nice profit, and getting thanked like I was a God. After awhile I didn’t have to meet the westerners at the airport, I’d just give my driver the customer’s address and after he shuttled ‘em out there the Russkiyes would collect my money for me. Nice people, I tell ya, never short changed me. Oh, and that pilot I used, he lived in a van. No really, he was so broke he lived in his car. $28 per flight was his official cut, plus whatever tips my customers tossed him.
Capitalism in the land of Lenin, skee bitches.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:28 pm #
“Obama’s ability to dodge bs issues”
You seriously think it is a BS issue to attend a racist church for 20 years and help funnel government funds to it?
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 2:29 pm #
Pissed != believing every insane theory that comes your way.
Coming from a wingnut, that’s actually quite humorous, Rob.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 2:29 pm #
is there a source for this other than your ass?
or was Jindal just so super sneaky about his true intentions?
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 2:29 pm #
No, it isn’t.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 2:30 pm #
Cause obviously thorhoid knows how American Military pilots are poorly trained compared to russian pilots. He rolls in his pigsty of bullshit!
Comment by Sdferr on 12/11 @ 2:30 pm #
I think F-15’s still have an unblemished record in air to air encounters, something like 105 – 0 or so, though admittedly often piloted by other than Americans (read Israelis) against non-Russian adversaries (read Syrians, Iraqis, whatever). Still, all in all, not bad.
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:30 pm #
“Show me where he denied them. That’s the new test, isn’t it?”
Obviously you are just here to rub sh!t all over the walls. Congrats I hope this is a fun diversion from your normal activities.
Comment by Rob Crawford on 12/11 @ 2:30 pm #
Fuck it.
The trolls win.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 2:30 pm #
Even the Russians admit the technology deficit  why can’t you?
Because thor’s emotionally a six-year old.
Nah,
The pilot looked like something out of a movie, blond, movie star face, military build, jumpsuit. We spoke Russian through our radio helmets, me in the back cockpit, he in the front.
How military pilots handle the G’s I have no idea, but they do, while smiling.
I could hardly climb down from the ladder when we were done. My legs were shot. The Russkiye pilot actually dropped out of his cockpit to the ground, bounced a couple of knee-bends with his arms extended, and then laughed as he helped me off the ladder.
He is just in love.
Comment by DarthRove on 12/11 @ 2:31 pm #
What’s so terrible about participating in an exorcism? Try it, you might like it.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 2:33 pm #
just like he knows teh maths. and who McCain’s campaign manager was.
Comment by Ron Burgundy on 12/11 @ 2:33 pm #
He does? Isd that why today he was discussing the Obama’s transition team’s work in the DOJ tipping off Obama to Fitzgerald’s investigation, so Obama could stop being dirty? Oh, he had the whole thing laid out….conversations between God-fearing Republicans and “Holder’s boys,” and Holder telling a surprised Obama.
1:40 EST today.
Rush hates conspiracy theories so much, he intimated on multiple days that Obama did NOT go to Hawaii to be with his grandmother; no, he went to “fix” his birth certificate. For a week afterward, Limbaugh would ask “Snerdly:” “How is Obama’s grandmother? Still fine, huh?”
No conspiracy there, Rob. It’s weird…it’s like you don’t actually listen very closely.*
Comment by DarthRove on 12/11 @ 2:33 pm #
Well, as long as you’re not the one GETTING the exorcism. That’s just creepy.
Comment by geoffb on 12/11 @ 2:34 pm #
Have to go with the N. O’Brain classic.
Do you speak English?
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:34 pm #
Link please Ron? If not shove it up your @ss.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 2:34 pm #
I’ve met few Russians who didn’t think it was Russia who defeated Hitler and would have done so without America nor are have I heard any real Russian in Russia voice and opinion contrary to their doing quite well against American aircraft and pilots.
This might shock you, but they’re proud people. Not proud-dumb like a moosey momma from Alaska, but, trust me, over a bottle of vodka they argue quite strongly of their military might, especially in their air power.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 2:36 pm #
He’ll need to remove his head to make room!
Comment by Mr. Pink on 12/11 @ 2:38 pm #
These people are like Detroit Lions fans that every year preach how their team is going to “turn it around”. They can do no wrong these lefty politicians, and the rightwing ones can do no right. Why ask them to engage on any level? This is like me as a Redskins fan trying to convince a Cowboys fan to switch allegiances. That is how they view this stuff. Not as issues or individuals, but as a group mindlessly supporting “their” team. Obama could go on stage and slit a puppies throat and they would probably be on here telling us the puppy had rabies.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 2:38 pm #
Let me see if I’ve got this straight, thor: you’re claiming that Russian pilots are just the tits after having one ride in a 45-year-old trainer?
This is not one of your better arguments, not that you’ve made any good ones. I mean, it sounds like fun and all, but there are TONS of great pilots over here, and I’d bet that they get more air time than their Soviet counterparts, and also more time in the trainer.
Don’t get me wrong: I have a lot of respect for military pilots. Your Russian pilot was probably very good. I just think it’s a mistake to make comparisons based on a single sample of one and zero of the other.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 2:38 pm #
If they think they could have defeated Hitler without the US, you right, they aren’t proud-dumb they are proud-stupidasfuckingthorposts.
Comment by daleyrocks on 12/11 @ 2:38 pm #
Let’s bring back Richard Pryor and the Ignited Negro College Fund. That’s always good for a few laughs. It’s better than talking about VD. Shit, the white man invented drugs to keep the bruthahs down. Ask Obama. He used them.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 2:39 pm #
This is going to sting a little bit, OK? Russia has really good fighter jets and fighter pilots, maybe only second to America’s, but sadly second wouldn’t go down easy against the first. Know what I’m saying, winky-winky, pshhhhhhhhh blam! American aircraft shot out of the sky by Russian pilot, ohnoessss! Wouldn’t be the first, sucka.
Comment by daleyrocks on 12/11 @ 2:41 pm #
“I’ve met few Russians who didn’t think it was Russia who defeated Hitler and would have done so without America”
I’ve met a few Russians who were even bigger jackasses than thor. Truly hard to believe!
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 2:43 pm #
Without Lend-Lease? I’m guessing that it would have been a piece of CAKE for the threadbare Soviet armed forces to have taken Germany without the 15,000 airplanes we gave them. Not to mention the 7000 tanks and 100,000-plus machine guns. Or the fifteen million pairs of combat boots.
I’m not sure we could have done it without the Soviets, but I don’t think they could have done it without us. Not without losing a LOT more people.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 2:44 pm #
nah, it’s been demonstrated that that is one large ass.
Comment by Thor's Keyboard on 12/11 @ 2:44 pm #
Do those black light things really show, uh…, stains?
Cuz, like that would be really embarrassing.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 2:48 pm #
…trust me, over a bottle of vodka they argue quite strongly of their military might, especially in their air power.
Goddamn, Mossberg are you even like a little tipsy, right now? How do expect to beat the russkies with these rational, sober discussions when they are fucking HAMMERED and arguing FORCEFULLY?
Do you really think superior air power is all it takes to defeat a drunken Russian arguing forcefully?
I can’t believe you guys trollhammer thor, you just can’t find entertainment like this anywhere.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 2:54 pm #
The Russians I’ve worked with in biotechnology(private investigators), and satellite modem technology(engineers), were not only intelligent, they were very considerate to subordinates and administrators.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 2:56 pm #
I took more than one ride in the L-29, but that’s beside the point. Russia has very poorly trained conscripts and they have some very well trained fighting men. See, they sort’a have mandatory enlistment still, and with the snot-nosed kids that are just doing time they sort’a abuse, or are nice to, depending if the kid has any money.
But those Russian soldiers and pilots who actually do like being in the military, they are – gulp – scary dedicated. It’s like they love to lift weights all day and live for killing people, sort’a like our special forces-types. See, I seen ‘em up close, and some of their aircraft too. I’m certain no educated American military officer is really. really burning for a engagement with Russia’s elite units. These things are commonly known, from what I could tell.
From speaking to our enlisted personnel who serve in Germany they have a proper amount of respect for their counterparts from all over Europe, especially they do those war game things.
Bottom line, there’s a ton of troglodyte Russian guys who buy little magazines with military pictures and naked ladies in ‘em. Those flatheads will sit you down and tell you how it is! Their planes, their bombs, their missiles, they really seem to enjoy that shit.
Comment by Roland THTG on 12/11 @ 3:02 pm #
I don’t ever want America to be at war with Russia. In a conventional air war they might…, well we’d lose some aircraft, I’ll leave it at that.
We lost aircraft in Iraq, what’s yer point?
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 3:02 pm #
I don’t trollhammer anyone, even arsenip. Most of my serious reading is technical and non-fiction, so I enjoy the break.
Comment by Roland THTG on 12/11 @ 3:04 pm #
But, them Ruskies really kicked the hell out of Georgia, huh?
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 3:05 pm #
We can’t defeat the Taliban either, but…watch out Russians!
A consolation match?
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 3:05 pm #
That’s because those Russians recognized you as a stupid hick. They, um, are mostly white people but as a sunstitute for racial divides they get into stompng down on lower socio-economic classes. They love their jokes about the kurkuhli. Matter of fact, they don’t get Sam Walton at all. If they get rich the last thing they’d do is let a wage slave get anywhere near ‘em. What’s the point in killing your business associates and becoming and oligarch if you don’t let everyone know how rich you are? It’s a culture thing.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 3:05 pm #
But, them Ruskies really kicked the hell out of Georgia, huh?
Yup, and routed the Afghanis in the eighties…oh wait!
Comment by Ric Locke on 12/11 @ 3:07 pm #
In an exchange between the American and Russian Air Forces, some American planes would be lost, there’s no doubt of that. The question we don’t have an answer to — and don’t want to get the answer to, because it would have to be by experience — is whether the “exchange rate” would leave the Americans or Russians in possession of the field. Russian military pilots get fewer flight hours and lots less simulator time than American ones, and their airplanes, while good, are of lower quality; but there are lots and lots and lots of them. Quantity has a quality all its own, said the famous person; that remains to be seen, said the cat when she s*t in the sugar bowl.
In a protracted conflict… if the Americans can keep their eyes on the ball, Americans win. The deficiency of all Russian armed forces is that for all practical purposes they don’t have an enlisted class; their military consists of officers and peasants. It is routine for American officers to declare an objective and basic strategy, then let the sergeants and corporals sort out the details; a Russian Lieutenant would have to do it all, right down to how many cartridges in the load-out. Also to a close approximation, they don’t fix things. They have so much of it that it’s easier to simply abandon a whole tank or airplane and grab another one. Repairs are done by shipping it back to the depot, or not at all. Attrition is not their friend.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 3:07 pm #
We can’t defeat the Taliban either…
What year is it in your world, tuberhead?
Comment by Roland THTG on 12/11 @ 3:07 pm #
Aw, crap thor. Russia lost 7 aircraft in Georgia.
Must have been some kind of crazy shit going on right there.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 3:09 pm #
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 3:15 pm #
It is a mystery, thor.
Predicting the outcome of imaginary wars is always fun, though.
Real war, not so much.
Comment by Salt Lick on 12/11 @ 3:17 pm #
Not to brag, but I rode in this Russian cockpit one time myself.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 3:17 pm #
Not so easy there, Ric. They have tanks they can fix and conscripts who can break down an engine in the tundra, which used to be one of our advantages.
In a land war against Russia on Russian soil, we’d lose miserably. They’d fuck us up, bad. They are, on average, a tougher breed, and in the tundra, no sir, it’s as if they have anti-freeze in their veins.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 3:19 pm #
They can recite Pushkin even when they’re teeth are chattering.
Comment by Salt Lick on 12/11 @ 3:19 pm #
Well, crap, the link goes to a Ukrainian bird, but I’m sure I pasted it correctly. My Russian bird was better.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 3:21 pm #
“Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 3:05 pm #
We can’t defeat the Taliban either,”
You don’t pay much attention to reality, do you?
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 3:24 pm #
I work with US pilots on a semi-regular basis; they live for that shit, too.
Haven’t been up in an F-16 or an F-15 yet, though. That’s for the guys working man/machine interface, and I’m not one of them. At this point, frankly, I’d settle for going up in an A-10. I’d go up in pretty much anything, provided they Gorrillaglue a supersized vomit bag to my face.
Fastest military aircraft I’ve been in is a Blackhawk, sad to say.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 3:25 pm #
Bush killed our economy, and in doing so killed our best military advantage. Too bad redneck redumblicans can’t figure that out as they sit on their wide assed cheering for GM to go out of business. 2 and 2 were always things they had trouble adding together.
Comment by Roland THTG on 12/11 @ 3:26 pm #
They have tanks ….
Yeah, I think they sold some of them to Saddam.
Didn’t work out very well, as I recall.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 3:26 pm #
BWAH HA HA Haaaaa. now if it had been 100 minus 52…
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 3:27 pm #
Here’s 50 Iraq civilians who died victorious today Moe:
http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jDkfRSckdpdVCKUMQlJVqDyLknEw
Bet they don’t share the far right’s vision of “reality” either.
Comment by Roland THTG on 12/11 @ 3:28 pm #
Wait, they have submarines!!!
Oh, nevermind.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 3:29 pm #
Almost certainly not. I mean, they’re dead. Dead people don’t have visions of any kind of reality.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 3:30 pm #
Well, I’ll be hornswaggled, you got me there, tuberhead. You are right, a terrorist attack in Kirkuk, Iraq can only mean one thing: the Taliban have recaptured Afghanistan!
Does Obama know about this?
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 3:32 pm #
and I was not aware that the proper vision could prevent explosions. huh.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 3:35 pm #
“Bush killed our economy, and in doing so killed our best military advantage.”
See? Crazy as a loon.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 3:37 pm #
So, terrorists wounding or killing 150 Iraqis just builds tons of support for the terrorists, right?
LOOK! OVER THERE! REALITY!
Oh, ya missed it.
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 3:42 pm #
Poor Republicans, they don’t even have phony victories to their credit after eight years in charge.
Unless they stay inside their cocoon, of course.
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 3:48 pm #
I was with NAVAIR for a few years; and I can tell you that they don’t call the school at Mirimar Top Gun for no reason. The Air Force has their equivalent as well at Red Flag…
I’m not simply polishing my flag pin when I say that these aviators are the best of the best…
In the interest of intellectual honesty though, I must admit that the Russians build some excellent fighter planes. What’s most fascinating is that for all their high end technology and combat ability, they are essentially designed to be worked on by a drunken 19 year old conscript with a ball-peen hammer and a pair of channel-locks! And, they are well designed to operate from less than ideal installations and off of crappy, gravel if necessary, runways.
Also, as much as some here may hate my next statement; thor is correct about their professional soldiers. They are a verrrrry serious, dedicated, and capable bunch. The yahoos that did the work in Georgia were mostly the conscripts, under command of the professionals. The reason they lost aircraft was because the US gave them shoulder fired SAMs. The reason they lost armoured vehicles was due to the inherant vulnerability of those units in urban settings or rough/woodsy terrain; as well as the brave Georgian soldiers willing to close and engage the armor…
Based on my experience I believe that the US would ultimately carry the day in a show-down with the Russian military. But as Ric astutely noted, it would be a very disturbing and bloody experience for both sides…
Let’s hope we never have to find out just how costly…
Besides, we need the Russians on our side; both against the Islamo-fascists and the Chinese…
/soapbox
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 3:50 pm #
“Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 3:42 pm #
Poor Republicans, they don’t even have phony victories to their credit after eight years in charge.”
LOOK! OVER THERE! REALITY!
Oh, ya missed it. Again.
Pay attention, asshole.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 3:50 pm #
Sadaam Hussein could not be reached for comment…
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 3:51 pm #
So by your reckoning, tuberhead, a terrorist attack proves sovereignty, is that correct? For how long afterwards, then? Because that would mean that AQ took control of this country on 9.11.01 and you can’t blame all this mess on George Bush, now, wouldn’t it? Hell, it may have actually been AQ that invaded Iraq and made us lose face with the world, those devious bastards.
Comment by Y-not on 12/11 @ 3:52 pm #
Why are you guys wasting your posts responding to Pastinaca sativa, none of whose posts are on topic? I thought the PW readers were a lot smarter than HA readers and knew how to deal with trolls. Ignore them.
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 3:54 pm #
I like to giggle to myself in my cubicle. :D
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 3:56 pm #
Same reason my cat likes to swat water bugs around in the laundry room, I suppose.
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 4:00 pm #
I think it’s cute the far right hasn’t quite accepted Obama’s victory yet and continues on like their guy won.
This time between election and power change reminds me of the phony war.
Elections matter – a phrase we’ll be hearing from the far right every single day after The One! takes over.
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 4:04 pm #
I think it’s cute the far right hasn’t quite accepted Obama’s victory yet and continues on like their guy won.
Dude, until someone else blows something else up over here, it is obvious AQ is still in charge. That is why Obama has been buddies with Ayers, huh?
Comment by maggie katzen on 12/11 @ 4:04 pm #
how so? oh and look! THE BUNNEHS HAVE ARRIVED!!!
Comment by Roland THTG on 12/11 @ 4:15 pm #
Elections matter – a phrase we’ll be hearing from the far right every single day after The One! takes over.
Exactly.
Even the hopey-changey dumbasses may begin to comprehend the meaning.
Comment by Cave Bear on 12/11 @ 4:18 pm #
Hate to break it to you, snippie, but we already won the damn war in Iraq. Saddam’s been hung, the rest of his Commie pals killed or run off, and all that’s left is the usual bloodletting, done by Muzzies to Muzzies. After all, it’s what they do best, even in the lameassed example you gave.
Yeah, it took a while. Of course, Bush said from the start that it would, but as usual you were not paying attention. WMDs? Well, even the UN said that left to his own devices he’d have had a chemical or biological WMD program up and running in a few months. And then there’s that couple hundred tons of weapons grade uranium that got shipped off to Canada from Iraq earlier this year. But never mind that; no doubt that was just Saddam’s paperweights. You know how Stalinists love to do things on a BIG scale.
But you and your buttfuck buddies like Hammer Bio and Bobby The Red just keep on with your little McChimpyBushitlerHALLIBURTONRoveCheney wet dreams. If nothing else, they are good for a chuckle now and then for those with more than one brain cell to rub together.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 4:33 pm #
I’m really not a war nerd or military hardware follower. That L-29 deal really just sort’a happened. I walked over to the jets and was bullshitting with the airport folk while my Russian friend was doing his flying lesson. They happened to be firing one of ‘em up sort’a just to work on the engine and the next thing I knew I’m the dude with the fly-a-Russian-jet business.
But what you said is 100% accurate. Those L-29’s and other older Russian aircraft are owned and flown by those local clubs because they are easily fixed and easy to fly.
Russia’s a good country even if it has a bloody history. It’s amazing that Russia and the U.S. haven’t become best buddies and divided up the world to suit our needs. And I’d say it’s a country whose ctizens have a much bigger hard-on for anything military versus America. Them people love planes that can fly fast and shit that blows up.
Comment by Rusty on 12/11 @ 4:36 pm #
“I don’t ever want America to be at war with Russia. In a conventional air war they might…, well we’d lose some aircraft, I’ll leave it at that.â€Â
thorazine has one backseat flight in a jet trainer and now he’s an expert on Russian air combat doctrine.
Everytime we’ve met the Russians in air combat we’ve come out ahead, even with marginally worse aircraft. Air dominance over all of korea in the korean war. Air dominance over VN.
Should a confrontation occur today I have no doubt the US pilots and aircraft will prove superior. The Russians simply do not have a modern fighter aircraft to put up against what we can present.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 4:39 pm #
They’re in denial, or maybe heartbroken, who can say for sure. They’re political insignificance has reduced to them to loud temperamental outbreaks for attention. I’m not that old but I don’t recall ever seeing grown ups act out publicly in such numbers.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 4:46 pm #
It’s OK, Rusty. There’s a bit of false pride in all of us. We can hold our own against Russian hockey players, but it’s pretty common knowledge they have a talent edge on us. Their fighter pilots might have that hours in the sky edge over us as well, and their snipers, I mean, have you heard the rumors? Yeah, their snipers are supposed to be pretty good, as in, well, really, really fuckin’ good.
Not that America isn’t better at everything!
Comment by B Moe on 12/11 @ 4:48 pm #
And have you ever seen their ice dancers? What the fuck do we have to stop one of those guys if he nuts up, man?
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 4:51 pm #
Cave Bear,
Bobby the Red? I hope you don’t mean me, friend. If so, you’ve gotten the wrong impression somehow…
I’m red, white, and blue, through and through…Neither an America hater nor baiter…
If you’re referring to my assessment of Russian harware and elite units, it’s always prudent to recognize a worthy adversary. And, as far as needing their help with the Islamo-fascists and the Chinese; It’s easier with them on our side as an ally than having them feed weapons system and intel to our enemies; just recognizing the realpolitik of the situation…
You don’t get to work at NAVAIR and in strategic systems by being a commie; not only won’t you pass the security clearance checks, but you will be woefully out of place in the outfits culture…
Best Wishes
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 4:57 pm #
I heard at the Moscow air show they fly backwards.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 5:08 pm #
Looking for a little rusky eSodomy asspilot hookup again, thorhoid!
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 5:10 pm #
Kind of poor timing to be discussing the skills of Marine pilots today, isn’t it?
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 5:14 pm #
Kind of poor timing to be discussing the skills of Marine pilots today, isn’t it?
Engine failure is murder! I blame George Bush!!!
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 5:24 pm #
Please keep your mind out of Larry Craig’s bunghole. This is a family web site.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 5:48 pm #
You keep bringing up his name, so it seems to be on your mind not mine!
Comment by Ric Locke on 12/11 @ 5:51 pm #
It is always a good idea to take a second or third look at things. Remember the ground penetrating radar that found old river channels in Egypt? Interesting. Of interest to historians, geographers, and geologists alike. Fun stuff with peaceful technology, yes? — but it also said to the Russians, “You can’t hide your missile silos.” (Note that we never tried to hide ours.)
Same with the “tail slide” (a.k.a. “flying backwards”). It’s a startling maneuver. Anybody who knows airplanes stood there open-mouthed the first time they saw it. I once had the opportunity to watch the guy who invented it practicing for an air show, for over an hour. It was still hard to believe, even after having seen it repeated several times. Stunning bit of aircraft theater.
But to military planners it was something quite different. A tail slide is done by pointing the airplane up until it stops flying, then (against all sense or reason) shutting the engines down to an idle and letting the airplane fall backward. Airplanes are not meant to fly backward, and if they continue to do so for very long bad things happen. The maneuver is suicide if the engines don’t spool up to full power afterward, allowing recovery from the maneuver — and the engines have to be powerful enough to bring the airplane up from negative speed to flying speed pretty damned quick.
Russian jet engines don’t last as long or work as well as American or British ones, and for a long time the control systems for them were a bit primitive by our standards. The tail slide was Russians crowing triumphantly: Hey, guys, our engines are better! Got noticed, too.
In my experience, Russians are more like Americans than any European is… and even more like the sort of American celebrated (somewhat wrongly) in things like Louis L’Amour novels. Among other things, Russians are endlessly inventive, especially when it comes to field expedients — my friend Heinrich described the rig they used to put a forty-ton telescope at the top of a crag in inaccessible terrain: Two T-80 tanks with the turrets off, and a double-ended gooseneck trailer suspended between them. The redneck toolkit (WD40 and duct tape; if it moves and shouldn’t, use duct tape; if it doesn’t move and should, use WD40) has its direct echo in that of the Steppe, which is (according to Ukrainians, not necessarily unbiased observers) a big hammer and nothing else. If it doesn’t work, bash it until it does, a philosophy applied equally to computer chips, jet airplanes, and earthmoving gear. It often works, too.
We’d get along fine if we got the chance. Too bad about the Governments.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 5:59 pm #
Somebody is responsible for the engines shutting down, Mossberg.
As always, ultimate responsibility is the pilot’s no matter which Marine’s fault it really was.
Comment by Ric Locke on 12/11 @ 6:04 pm #
Ah, yes, the Theme Song of the ATLA:
Don’t you want somebody to sue
Don’t you need somebody to sue
Wouldn’t you love somebody to sue
You gotta find somebody to sue
To sue…
Regards,
Ric
Comment by Dan Collins on 12/11 @ 6:06 pm #
Ric, will you please send me your email addy? vermontaigne-at-gmail.com
Comment by Spies, Brigands, and Pirates on 12/11 @ 6:09 pm #
B Moe: So by your reckoning, tuberhead, a terrorist attack proves sovereignty, is that correct?
By snippy’s “reasoning”, we don’t have sovereignty over Lower Manhattan or Oklahoma City.
Ric Locke: Remember the ground penetrating radar that found old river channels in Egypt?
The story of Iram/Ubar is also very interesting.
Comment by Mossberg500 on 12/11 @ 6:10 pm #
Wow, that’s some exceptional logic.
Comment by thorichka on 12/11 @ 6:17 pm #
Except for the whole banya scene, which pretty much boils down to sitting around naked and getting drunk with the guys while a plump village girl is kept on stand-by in case someone feels up for a blowjob, or two.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 6:18 pm #
The variety of idiocy in parsnip is legion.
Responses to others: the Su-27 isn’t the only airplane in the sky that can do the freaky shit. F-22 also does it just fine.
Bob Reed, it sounds to me as if you’re the real deal. I’ve always held that although we’ve had the edge, periodically, over Soviet air forces in terms of aircraft, crew and doctrine, we’re evenly enough matched that the F-22 was invented to be able to kill their best airplanes without being detected. It can’t do that now, but neither is their air force the same as it ever was.
I’m not an aircraft expert; I don’t hold any pilot training, but I do understand aerodynamics and avionics, and I (as I said) work on targeting systems for our pilots. Although our pilots do have some of the stereotypical swagger, they’re all business when it comes to the business of war. Those who aren’t tend to get dead.
I salute you. Anyone that can do what pilots do always has my respect. It should be obvious that for me, that respect extends to most of our opponents.
Comment by N. O'Brain on 12/11 @ 6:44 pm #
“#
Comment by parsnip on 12/11 @ 5:10 pm #
Kind of poor timing to be discussing the skills of Marine pilots today, isn’t it?”\
FOAD you loathsome toad.
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 6:48 pm #
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 6:18 pm #
Thanks for the good words…
CVW-8, VF-84; Fighting 84th, “Jolly Rogers”
Best Wishes
Comment by Ric Locke on 12/11 @ 7:54 pm #
Slart,
Lots of aircraft can do a tail slide. Not all of them have the engine power to recover from one. It is, after all, only a variant on a stall.
Bob, I believe it was VF84 driving F4s on board USS America in 1972-73. Probably not you, though, I reckon…
Regards,
Ric
Comment by Cave Bear on 12/11 @ 8:08 pm #
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 4:51 pm #
Cave Bear,
Bobby the Red? I hope you don’t mean me, friend. If so, you’ve gotten the wrong impression somehow…
Sorry. I was referring to that asswipe Ronny the Red. Got the first name mixed up; my apologies.
Last thing I would dream of doing is dissing a Naval Aviator. History has shown conclusively that you guys have balls that have not been counted yet, and that’s a fact.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 8:20 pm #
How long ago, Bob? Phantoms? Tomcats?
We try to support the Navy, but sometimes they have their own thing going on. Here’s what I’m spending most of my time on now and for the last eight years or so. USN F-18 doesn’t want us but we’re deployed on RCAF F-18s, as well as Harriers and miscellaneous fast- and slow-movers, right up to B-1 bombers if you can believe that.
Oh, also I do this, which USN does want.
Comment by gebrauchshund on 12/11 @ 8:29 pm #
“If it doesn’t work, bash it until it does, a philosophy applied equally to computer chips, jet airplanes, and earthmoving gear.”
Also applied to the peasant conscripts that make up the bulk of their armed forces, and part of what tends to give them a high tolerance for hardship. My experience was working with Russian police, but I concur that they are more like us than any other european group.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 8:31 pm #
Ah, my first linkee did not work. Let’s try this, instead.
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 8:31 pm #
Crud. http://www.lockheedmartin.com/products/Sniper/index.html
Comment by Ric Locke on 12/11 @ 8:42 pm #
Including the fact that they are not Europeans — but their upper (at least in their own minds) class would like to pretend they are, and apes European manners without the slightest inkling of what their basis is. The effect was just as much or more true of the Soviet nomenklatura as it was of the Tsarist nobility.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by gebrauchshund on 12/11 @ 8:46 pm #
Well, maybe things have changed since I was in school, but my recollection was that europe extended to the Ural mountains, and most of the guys I knew were from that end of the country.
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 8:49 pm #
Hey Ric,
Jolly Rogers drove F-4’s through ‘76 off of CV-42, USS F.D. Roosevelt, as part of CVW-6…Before my time, Bro…
CVW-8 got the Fighting 84 in 77, along with our shipmates from the “Black Aces”(VF-41). We operated off of CVN-71, USS T. Roosevelt, driving “Tomcats”.
CVW-8 had VF-74, Fighting 74, “Be-Devilers” in the days you mention though…And I’m sure they too were driving “Phantoms” in those days…
You seem pretty knowledgable about this stuff Ric. Are you a professional..?
Best Wishes
Comment by Ric Locke on 12/11 @ 8:58 pm #
“European” is a state of mind only tangentially related to geography, gebrauchshund.
Poles and Czechs are Europeans; Slovaks and Hungarians are borderline cases; Ukrainians and Romanians are not. Russians are not European in outlook or behavior.
To a close first approximation, the dividing line is how well the particular people were able to cope with the “Mongols”. This is not a matter of bravery or personal qualities in most cases — Western Europe was far from the center of the Khan’s territory, and was greatly shielded by, among others, Russians.
Russians and other Slavic peoples spent a century or so as what amounted to farm animals for the Great Khan. That divided them forever from Europe, but also produced the biggest single disconnect between Russians and Americans — no Russian has any concept of what “private property” is all about, because their only experience of it is either being property or observing the antics of the Tsarist nobility and the commissars. It cripples them economically.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 9:08 pm #
Cave Bear,
No foul no harm, friend; I just wanted to make things clear…
Slartibartfast,
It was long ago and far away, Bro, but not as far as the Phantom days!
VF-84 was disbanded in 1995, but drove Tomcats until that time. Our name, “Jolly Rogers”, and tail art were adopted afterward by VF-103…
Best Wishes
Comment by Slartibartfast on 12/11 @ 9:15 pm #
Awesome, Bob. I was sad to see the Tomcat get retired.
Comment by gebrauchshund on 12/11 @ 9:17 pm #
The Spanish spent a fairly long period under the thumb of the Moors, and while it had a strong and lasting influence it didn’t make them african or arab, nor reduce their quality of being “european”. The Russians I knew were from europe, as were generations of their ancestors, and considered themselves to be european. I don’t think I’m in any position to argue with them.
Comment by Ric Locke on 12/11 @ 9:33 pm #
Bob,
I was a photo interpreter (PT) 1970-1973, first with Wing headquarters, then with RVAH-6. We had A3J/RA-5C “Vigilante” aircraft. The one on display at the museum in Pensacola, serial number ending in 66, was from our squadron.
PTs were, according to my detailer, specifically chosen for dilettantism. We were expected to have a wide but fairly shallow knowledge pool, and I fitted the bill perfectly. My specific interests have always been aircraft, photography/imaging, and military tactics. I would probably be an asset to Slart, but I’m too old and couldn’t get a clearance any more. If he’s in Fort Worth I may have been in his office, but it would have been back when the building was used by Convair (“General Dynamics”).
After leaving the Navy I spent thirty years in and out of the field called photogrammetry, mapping using aerial photography and sensing. Most of that time was spent as a tech, installing and maintaining the equipment used. As part of that I did a good bit of traveling, not a real Road Warrior but in and out of various places. I’ve never been to the Middle East, and my only experience of the Far East is Hong Kong and Singapore during America’s deployment in ‘72-73, but I’ve seen most of Europe including Poland and Ukraine (but not, to my sorrow, the UK) and a good bit of South America.
Unfortunately the only things I remember about the cruise are bits and snatches. I know we had two squadrons of F-4 Phantom IIs, two of A-7s (I don’t remember which variant), one of E-6s, one of EA-6Bs, and one of E-2 “Hummers”, as well as the RA-5Cs. UNREP in the South Atlantic, with Missisauga alongside and one turbine can on either side of that, is engraved in my memory, but I barely remember the catapult fire. The only squadron designation I really remember is VMFA-333; that was before Marine aviation training was fully integrated with the Navy’s, and the pilots of “Trip Trey” were distinctly inferior to their squid counterparts, but what I really remember was that their berthing compartment was forward and up one ladder of my bunk, and when they went to chow in columns of droves the noise drove me mad.
So, I’m not a “professional” in the sense I think you mean, just an interested amateur.
Regards,
Ric
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 9:37 pm #
Slartibartfast,
The Super Hornet is a tits machine, from what I understand. But the JSF is going to be a pretty hot number when the Pax River, Edwards, and China Lake crews get the program fully up to speed…
Neither are as fast or as sexy looking as the Tomcat, but they’re both very maneuverable, have excellent range on internal fuel, posesses a stealthy radar signature, and good thrust-to-weight ratio…
But I too was sad to see the Tomcat go…
Best Wishes
Comment by Bob Reed on 12/11 @ 10:22 pm #
Hey Ric,
Time to recall the ancient history…
My ship did mostly Med cruises and the Persian gulf in the late 80’s through Mid 90’s…
Like yourself, I was young and the experiences intense. While I have some very detailed and distinct recollections, I’m not the kind of guy that likes to shine his own badge talkin’ about “glory days”…
By the time our squadron was disbanded in 1995, due to Billy Jeff’s budget cuts, my vision had begun to diminish. So I transferred to strategic weapons systems, using my engineering skills…
I’m sorry, but even now I’m not at liberty to say anything more specific about my time with that group…
But that was long ago and far away…These days I’m working on writing some textbooks, on Aeronautics and astronautics, at a level that motivated teens could understand; that and enjoying life with my lovely wife…
Best Wishes, Bro
Comment by Rusty on 12/12 @ 6:07 am #
#316
Nope. On all counts. You are again comparing apples to oranges.
Comment by thorichka on 12/12 @ 7:18 am #
That’s not true. C’mon Ric! Simplified to the extreme! I would say anyone in their early 30’s and younger in Russia knows nothing but capitalism, meaning they weren’t really aware of much as kids so from their formidable years and beyond it’s all been capitalism and private property there.
And another thing, private property and other basic tenants of our society, including petty capitalism, take no real time to figure out. They’re sort’a obvious givens that are timelessly known, moreover even the most Commie of Commies knows how to work a lemonade stand for a profit. It ain’t that hard.
I was asked to consult on problems at what was then the new currency exchange in Saint Petersburg when the ruble collapsed; I guess that was around 99 or 2000. SPB isn’t Moscow, anyone knowing much about Russia knows what I mean. So anyway, tucked away in a nondescript building and up a flight of stairs was the SPB currency exchange. Merchants from far away would come in with, literally, their pigs, chickens and assorted family members along with suitcases full of foreign currency – to exchange! With the exception of the warm Norman Rockwall/Anton Chekhov tone of the stragglers in the middle of the trading floor, there were identifiable trading pits all with large CRTs and projected rated quotes all driven off a network of Sun Sparc workstations. The head of the exchange explained all of the hardware including with international bodies, the U.N., Soros, Microsoft, Sun, donated how much $ and which equipment and how it was networked. I also reviewed the trading rules and by-laws of the exchange. This was all a days before the actual collapse, because things weren’t right leading up to the collapse and that’s why he wanted to talk to me. So the head dude calls me in his office, actually sending a driver for me with instructions to hurry. Something big had happened, I assumed. He closes his office door, informs me the Central Bank has unexpectedly closed and therefore they have no idea how to price their futures and currency contracts. I look at him and say the last thing he wanted to hear from a so-called expert, “how the fuck would I know what to do, the American Federal Reserve never just shut its doors. Neither myself nor any American I know back home on Wall Street would have the foggiest notion.” We shared a wotka and he lead me out, having to unlock the door, which had been locked so the mob outside wouldn’t stampede the place.
You must be thinking that I felt awfully bad. Not really, well, not long, at least. On the steps just outside of that shitty old building I was approached my many who wanted dollars. Luck of fate, I happened to have quite a few on me, as in like $300-$400 in walking money. Thus began bidding for my dollars in a scene reminiscent of a by-gone era under the old button tree where traders first met and exchanged stock certificates in New York. It was a painter who had sold many paintings and was flush with rubles but was off to Paris, I believe, and desperately needed some currency who outbid every other pig and chicken man. I fetched upwards of 70 rubles for my every dollar, where just the day before I would have only gotten around 40. Trading halted on the steps as I went back to my hotel room where, after a brief but over-priced phone call to home and to my bank, I went to the nearest ATM and pulled out $2000 American dollars. Liquidity returned to the market! I went back on the steps of the exchange! And now those once reluctant pig farmers had had a chance to pull on the locked door a little longer, had watched one Russian, at least, that painter, march merrily off with actual dollars. After some soul searching on my part and with their collective misery pressed upon my heart, thinking of these proud Pitreburgers who had once endured a savage siege by the Nazis, I lifted the price of dollar to a mere 85 rubles and left it there until my wad was spent. I could have gotten more, I know.
Then I proceeded to party like it was 1999, Ric. Beers were now the equivalent of 25-cents at my exchange rate, even at the finest place in town. Oh, and there are fine places there. I phoned home again, half-drunk, and purchased a good chunk of symbol TRF, the Russia fund, which was surprisingly still trading on the NY. It was cheap, yep, dropped from like $17 to $7.
When the Central Bank opened a few days later I was still in SPB, still partying. The exchange rate opened at about 42. I complained to the Grand Hotel about the price of my long distance calls to America, and they adjusted them downward knowing I had spent more at their bar than any patron there, and I tipped well! I felt comfortable enough with the reduced rate to phone home and sell most of my TRF and $12. My girl, the one assigned to me, to translate for me, to care for me, to arrange my city travel from place to place and paid for by the SPB currency exchange, was no top shelf beauty but utilitarian if one were thinking purely in terms of intercourse. She asked about the strange talk she had heard while I was on the phone to America. I informed her of my buy-low sell-higher mastery and the amount of my two-day profit in dollars. She proposed marriage. I think she was half serious. And that was rather sad. After deciding to extend my stay, and while refusing phone calls from the currency exchange gentleman, I made her wait outside while I engaged women much younger and prettier. She was entirely comfortable with her chair in the hallway, non nonplussed you might say, with that arrangement. Russian soul, oh the Russian soul the woman had, only too proud to be mother hen to a stumbling drunk capitalist whore of a man who shat golden eggs, and who tipped well!
Good times.
Comment by Rusty on 12/12 @ 2:09 pm #
#352
Ya might want to take the above someplace where somebody cares.